[03:08] <darkmatter> nothlit, ok... I need your opinion on the mockup for the text entries (first mockup for glory, yay!). not that it was done really quick, so the contrast of light/shadow is off, but its approximate enough to get the general idea
[03:08] <darkmatter> http://www.flickr.com/photos/92826085@N00/520599323/
[11:02] <darkmatter> hiya klepas
[11:09] <darkmatter> klepas, just a mockup, but working on/improving the actual pixmaps for the text-entries in roughly this style  http://www.flickr.com/photo_zoom.gne?id=520599323&size=o
[11:09] <darkmatter> whatcha think?
[11:12] <kwwii> darkmatter: looks nice (although you didn't ask me)
[11:13] <klepas> beats the current one :)
[11:13] <klepas> i'm still using MorningGlory
[11:13] <kwwii> darkmatter: I assume you
[11:13] <klepas> (when is that release coming?)
[11:13] <kwwii> erm....I assume that you will put this in Gutsy?
[11:15] <klepas> i hope so :)
[11:15] <darkmatter> hopefully
[11:15] <darkmatter> working on it
[11:15] <klepas> darkmatter: in one of your screenshots i see a gnome menu in the middle of the screen (as if it were a xfce menu)
[11:15] <klepas> how did you do that?
[11:16] <klepas> http://www.flickr.com/photo_zoom.gne?id=502007263&size=o
[11:16] <darkmatter> klepas, kwwii just trying to squash a few bugs atm... the majorityof the theme should be done by next week.. as in usable but not finl as far as tweaks go
[11:17] <darkmatter> klepas, ctrl+F1
[11:18] <klepas> doesn't work for me?
[11:18] <klepas> maybe because of beryl?
[11:19] <kwwii> darkmatter: killer, let me know if you need any help with packaging, etc.
[11:19] <darkmatter> maybe.. check the beryl setting
[11:19] <darkmatter> in the default gnome and in compiz ctrl+f1 pops up the main menu
[11:19] <darkmatter> kwwii, nice
[11:20] <darkmatter> I'll keep you at the top of the list :)
[11:20] <kwwii> ;-)
[11:21] <darkmatter> kwwii, I think once I up the contrast on the shadows a bit the text-entries should be killer
[11:22] <darkmatter> then I can extend the "ouline this!!" motif across the rest of the shadows n widgets in general
[11:22] <darkmatter> feels more natural, lends a bit of dimension where before things seemed flat
[11:23] <darkmatter> plus its a little bit closer to photorealistic (and if I wasnt stuck drawing with a boulder it would be photorealistic)
[11:23] <darkmatter> damn mouse
[11:23] <kwwii> darkmatter: yeah, the line could be a bit darker probably at least
[11:26] <darkmatter> kwwii, of course its just a mockup (I claned it up... the damn pixmap engine repeats the shadows (since entries like that are actually two entries)
[11:26] <darkmatter> so just gimped the bugger
[11:26] <kwwii> ;-)
[11:26] <darkmatter> to see what it'd look like one it goes to code
[11:26] <darkmatter> roughly
[11:26] <kwwii> that is the best way to start, especially with pixmap based stuff
[11:26] <darkmatter> yup
[11:28] <darkmatter> kwwii, basically, once the general feel is ironed out (almost there), I want to put it in engine form with all the bells n whistles.. full custom widget support for the panels (including bg gradients, etc).. and subtle yet lovely animations throughout
[11:29] <kwwii> sounds sweet
[11:29] <darkmatter> like.. say a pulsating glowy line inside the text entry for focus... just an underline of the text
[11:29] <darkmatter> stuff like that
[11:29] <darkmatter> glow on the buttons
[11:29] <kwwii> although I am pretty busy with artwork atm, please don't hesitate to ask for anything
[11:30] <darkmatter> nothing to dramatic
[11:30] <kwwii> how are those done?
[11:30] <darkmatter> kk
[11:30] <kwwii> the animations, I mean
[11:30] <kwwii> are they hard coded or a series of bitmaps or a transition from one bitmap to another?
[11:30] <darkmatter> kwwii, I'll need to look at the code again.. kinda studying another engine that does them
[11:31] <kwwii> cool
[11:31] <darkmatter> but I know with most its just a stepped translucency (not pixmap... just shade
[11:32] <darkmatter> though I may use a pixmap or two in engine once I get a good start on the code
[11:33] <kwwii> right
[11:33] <kwwii> have you ever coded anything like this before?
[11:34] <kwwii> my first widget-theme was in gtk but that was about 8 years ago
[11:34] <darkmatter> not in a while, and not gtk or cairo.. I mean.. I've worked with gtk.. just not engines
[11:35] <kwwii> right, same as me - only I haven't done it in a long time :-)
[11:35] <darkmatter> cairo is a must because of all the pretty drawing code
[11:35] <kwwii> yeah, when we worked on clearLooks I realized how nifty it is
[11:36] <darkmatter> I can play around with general api and ui drawing well enough.. but an engine is a bit different
[11:36] <kwwii> have you made a wiki page for this yet?
[11:36] <darkmatter> meh.. it'll come in time
[11:37] <kwwii> yeah, might be better to wait until you have something in hand
[11:37] <darkmatter> nope.. just a bzr branch.. but hasnt been updated since I formatted and installed feisty
[11:37] <kwwii> I'm hoping that we can get a few community based themes and such in Gutsy
[11:37] <kwwii> in fact, I was kinda told by the boss to make sure it happens ;-)
[11:37] <darkmatter> I just want to finish the basics of this thing for next week, then I can start a wiki page
[11:38] <kwwii> right, making a wiki page too early will only lead to confusing discussion
[11:40] <darkmatter> the idea is to really define a set of style guidelines.. basically redefine the ui themewise (nothing solid exists in that area yet). reduce visual cacophony to a minimum (one reason I'm not partial to clearlooks etc are the bold oulines, you want widgets distinct.. but not distracting)
[11:41] <darkmatter> also would *love* to push a real move for consistency in gnome
[11:41] <kwwii> I think that the bold outlines just make it look old and it leads the eye too much
[11:41] <darkmatter> ala the way widgets are used
[11:41] <kwwii> hehe, good luck on that
[11:41] <kwwii> beleive me that kde has the same problems
[11:42] <kwwii> it seems that oss developers love to use widgets in ways they were never intended
[11:42] <darkmatter> kwwii, I said I'd *love* too.. never said there was a chance in hell it'd fly though
[11:42] <darkmatter> kwwii, yup
[11:42] <kwwii> ;-)
[11:44] <darkmatter> look at things like nautilus even... for all its "HIGiness", ots still crap... graphically inconsistent.. I mean.. at least use frames around the bloody sidepane/main if ya get the picture
[11:45] <darkmatter> just such small little tweaks/patches
[11:45] <darkmatter> but thing that users notice from the get-go
[11:45] <kwwii> definitely
[11:46] <andreasn> darkmatter: ah, like in thunar?
[11:46] <darkmatter> andreasn, yeah.. kinda
[11:47] <darkmatter> make the window non-flat
[11:47] <andreasn> thunars widgets look great
[11:47] <darkmatter> helps distinguish things visually
[11:47] <andreasn> should be pretty easy to fix probably, nautilus use glade, right?
[11:48] <darkmatter> I believe so
[11:48] <darkmatter> havent looked at the beasts code
[11:49] <darkmatter> kwwii, another crazyassed dream is to get devs to actually document the custom widgets n classes etc that an app uses
[11:50] <darkmatter> like that'll ever happen... -_-
[11:50] <kwwii> lol, good luck
[11:50] <darkmatter> thats what really makes theming a pita
[11:51] <darkmatter> its pretty much a matter of experimenting till something finally works
[11:52] <kwwii> yeah, that has been my experience
[11:52] <darkmatter> I have a 3000ish line gtkrc template already.. and it grows bigger every day
[11:52] <darkmatter> scary
[11:52] <kwwii> the hardest thing is accepting that you are limited by all this stuff - makes the artwork side of it no-fun at all
[11:53] <darkmatter> yah
[11:54] <kwwii> well, time for lunch....bbl
[11:55] <darkmatter> kwwii, like how I would love to do a seperate skin for the nautilus pathbar with breadcrumb style buttons... problem is.. though you can custom apply a skin to it.. it goes on the main toolbar too
[11:55] <darkmatter> bummer
[11:55] <kwwii> ouch, yeah...that sucks
[11:56] <darkmatter> it would de-fatten nautilus nicely
[11:56] <darkmatter> anyway... go get yer lunch
[11:57] <kwwii> thanks :-) see you in a bit