[12:55] <jjesse> evening
[12:56] <nosrednaekim> hello.
[01:05] <Riddell> hmm, no tonio with kaffeine
[01:22] <nosrednaekim> Riddell: you do work on guidance power manager, right?
[07:50] <Hobbsee> did the kdesudo dialog ever get uploaded?
[07:57] <fdoving> i've hacked a littlebit on that.
[07:57] <fdoving> but i need to go to work. bye. :)
[07:57] <Hobbsee> cya
[09:17] <Jucato> (at the same time)
[09:18] <nixternal> that would be like one giant bear hug
[09:18] <Jucato> ;)
[09:19] <Jucato> sleep first, build later :)
[09:20] <nixternal> !hobbsee
[09:20] <ubotu> I phear the stick so shhhhh
[09:20] <nixternal> haha
[09:20] <Jucato> lol
[09:21] <Hobbsee> hahaha
[09:25] <nixternal> !jucato
[09:25] <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about jucato - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
[09:25] <Jucato> :)
[09:25] <nixternal> Hobbsee: I think he needs one :)
[09:25] <Jucato> good bot :)
[09:25] <nixternal> !nixternal
[09:25] <ubotu> Oh no!  The pointy-clicky Vista lover has arrived!
[09:25] <Jucato> lol!
[09:25] <nixternal> gah
[09:26] <Jucato> I'm not that known amongst the wider -devel population to warrant one :)
[09:26] <nixternal> that's it, I am switching to Xandros!
[09:26] <Jucato> hahaha
[09:26] <Jucato> same thing :P
[09:26] <nixternal> Jucato: known as much as I am
[09:26] <nixternal> haha right
[09:26] <nixternal> I just got done reading the Xandros forums
[09:26] <Jucato> heheh
[09:26] <nixternal> all 15 of their users quit
[09:27] <Jucato> is Xandros that desperate for publicity or whatever?
[09:27] <nixternal> don't know..but that wouldn't warrant bedding with Microsoft
[09:27] <nixternal> one of the Xandros users said Ubuntu is next to strike a deal, and the only distro that would never cave is Debian
[09:27] <Jucato> yeah right :)
[09:30] <nixternal> someone said it best..Microsoft realizes that Vista isn't doing well and that Linux is taking off..so this is the way they fix the problem
[09:31] <Jucato> yeah, "dig a deeper hole" always fixes problems :)
[09:31] <nixternal> hehe
[09:31] <nixternal> alright...package didn't work...sleep time
[09:31] <nixternal> g'nite
[09:31] <Jucato> g'night!
[09:32] <Jucato> hm.. you sleep at this hour, while Admiral_Chicago eats...
[09:51] <yveslu> hi
[09:51] <yveslu> http://dot.kde.org/1172617283/1172768274/1172773687/1172776025/
[09:51] <yveslu> any plan to turn this feature on for gusty? it should greatly improve kdes startup speed
[09:51] <Hobbsee> yveslu: neat!
[09:52] <yveslu> yes :)
[09:52] <yveslu> sorry for spamming ;)
[09:52] <Hobbsee> depends when the binutils is released, i guess
[09:53] <yveslu> as Fedora 7 is out, I guess they are already, or in the process of...
[09:54] <Hobbsee> yveslu: main is frozen for tribe 1 now.  maybe after that
[09:55] <yveslu> ok... let's hope for it :-)
[09:57] <Hobbsee> upstream is saying it's causing bugs
[09:57] <Hobbsee> on the ML
[10:01] <yveslu> oh
[10:01] <yveslu> got a link?
[10:02] <Hobbsee> yveslu: third comment.  http://lists.kde.org/?l=kde-optimize&m=115867874021537&w=3 and continuing the thread
[10:03] <yveslu> yes I have read about that. but it's a different thing than Thiago wrote about
[10:03] <yveslu> he wrote about the -reduce-relocations configure option of Qt... I have never seen any comment about so far
[10:03] <Hobbsee> oh wait
[10:03] <Hobbsee> right, yeha
[10:04] <Hobbsee> looks interesting - both of them
[10:05] <yveslu> yes
[10:07] <yveslu> also, I'm not sure whether it's a Qt4-only-thing
[10:09] <yveslu> got to go... have a nice day
[10:15] <Tonio_> hey ;)
[10:15] <Tonio_> Riddell: kaffeine commited
[10:15] <Tonio_> Riddell: sorry for beeing late on that point, but as it only builds since yesterday, and I still don't have internet at home :'(
[10:16] <Tonio_> Riddell: btw you can ping pitti to approve
[10:16] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: main is frozen now - what's the change?
[10:16] <Jucato> hah! exercising -core powers :)
[10:16] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: kaffeine plugin doesn't crash konqueror
[10:16] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: okay.  have you uploaded it yet?
[10:16] <Tonio_> 5 weeks without internet at home.......
[10:16] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: and is there anything else that we should have fixed pre-tribe1?
[10:17] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: nope, but Riddell asked me to upload
[10:17] <Tonio_> so did I
[10:17] <Tonio_> french providers technically are good, but the services are really really really bad reguarding to the customers
[10:17] <Hobbsee> ahhh
[10:20] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: ah right, it's already uploaded.  asking
[11:31] <Hobbsee> hi Lure!
[11:31] <Hobbsee> Lure: test failed
[11:33] <Jucato> Lure: thanks for the comment btw :)
[11:46] <Riddell> anyone on gutsy able to confirm the new kdebase and system settings last night fixed kcontol and ss?
[11:47] <Hobbsee> Riddell: it loads now
[11:48] <Riddell> which?
[11:52] <Hobbsee> Riddell: system settings.  and kcontrol, for the most part
[11:52] <Riddell> most part?
[11:53] <hunger> What was broken?
[11:53] <Hobbsee> Riddell: seems to be some kdesudo breakage in kcontrol/system settings, though, whenever you hit hte administrator mode button
[11:53] <Hobbsee> not sure if that's happening with kdesu too - i think it was, prior to that patch
[11:54] <hunger> Switching to admin mode works for me.
[11:55] <Riddell> Hobbsee: in gutsy?
[11:57] <Riddell> hunger rather ^^
[11:58] <hunger> Riddell: Yeap.
[11:58] <hunger> Riddell: Last update was about 30min ago.
[11:59] <Riddell> ok, groovy, I'll see what happens on the CDs for kdesu then
[11:59] <Riddell> maybe kdesudo will fix this one day
[11:59] <hunger> Does that switch to admin thingy work for users not allowed to do sudo? Just curious.
[12:01] <Riddell> no
[12:01] <Riddell> certainly better not anyway
[12:04] <hunger> Riddell: It could fall back to su:-)
[12:04] <hunger> Well, probably too much work anyway...
[12:47] <Riddell> Hobbsee: have you played with seeds yet?
[12:48] <Riddell> mhb: able to point Dominic Liche towards how to help with testing?
[12:48] <Riddell> (on kubuntu-devel list)
[12:51] <Riddell> Hobbsee: if you want to try it out you can add dolphin and remove kmplayer from desktop
[01:15] <Hobbsee> Riddell: no i havent, yes i want to, and damn my connection *sucks*
[01:17] <Riddell> Hobbsee: bzr checkout sftp://jr@bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/ubuntu-seeds/kubuntu.gutsy
[01:17] <Hobbsee> thanks
[01:17] <Riddell> emacs desktop; bzr diff; bzr commit
[01:17] <Hobbsee> will look in a min - want to check out kaffeine first
[01:17] <Riddell> other seeds listed on https://code.launchpad.net/ubuntu-seeds/
[01:18] <Riddell> also (inside the kubuntu.gutsy directory) bzr merge sftp://jr@bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/ubuntu-seeds/ubuntu.gutsy
[01:19] <Riddell> fix any problems; bzr resolve foo (where foo is any file that had a conflict); bzr diff (to check it's all good); bzr commit
[01:20] <Hobbsee> right
[01:41] <LongPointyStick> Riddell: my connection is terrible tonight
[01:41] <LongPointyStick> you may need to do this, if i cant get the checkout
[01:41] <LongPointyStick> if i stop responding on irc, i've been d/c'd again
[01:45] <nosrednaekim> Lure: hello
[01:45] <Hobbsee> ooh yay, it downloaded
[01:46] <Hobbsee> Riddell: did you happen to commit that already?
[01:46] <Riddell> Hobbsee: nope
[01:47] <Riddell> well, you can use bzr log and see :)
[01:47] <Hobbsee> Riddell: there's no kmplayer in the desktop seed, only kmplayer-konq-plugins
[01:47] <Riddell> yeah, that's the one we don't need any more
[01:47] <Hobbsee> ah right
[01:59] <Riddell> if we wanted to keep it in main we could put it in supported, but there's no reason to keep it in main
[01:59] <LongPointyStick> aaaa
[02:09] <Hobbsee> Riddell: okay...done the merge, attemtping to commit again
[02:18] <Hobbsee> right, committed.
[02:22] <Hobbsee> Riddell: seeds pushed.
[02:23] <hunger> The new guidance-backends conflicts with the old kde-guidance on some files (e.g. /usr/share/apps/guidance/vesamodes).
[02:45] <Hobbsee> mmm...bugger.
[02:45] <n8k99> really?
[03:09] <Riddell> ScottK: best not to troll
[03:10] <ScottK> Riddell: Didn't troll.  Told the honest truth.  I started with Xandros and moved to Kubuntu and have been happy.
[03:11] <ScottK> Actually, messages was wrong, it was just one.
[03:36] <Hobbsee> hiya Jucato!
[03:37] <Jucato> hi Hobbsee! :)
[03:39] <Hobbsee> :(
[03:39] <Jucato> oooh! that feels better :)
[03:43] <Hobbsee> that new volume dialog box rocks, btw
[03:43] <Jucato> kmilo? kewl
[03:43] <Jucato> er... kool
[03:47] <Hobbsee> yep
[03:51] <apachelogger> is autoremoving old kernels planed for gutsy?
[03:52] <Jucato> is that advisable? I mean unless it leaves at least one other kernel
[03:52] <Hobbsee> you'd only need one old one
[03:53] <Jucato> so that autoremover would leave that old one?
[03:53] <apachelogger> yup
[03:53] <apachelogger> though
[03:53] <apachelogger> maybe just do a check
[03:54] <apachelogger> for example check at 3rd boot after upgrade whether old kernel has been booted at least once, if not just remove it
[03:54] <apachelogger> so if one notices strange behaviour with new kernel there is 3 boots time to try with old one
[03:56] <apachelogger> Hobbsee: in revu mood?
[03:56] <Hobbsee> apachelogger: hmm...not particularly, sorry, my connection is crap tonight
[03:56] <Hobbsee> means downloading anything, even to remote debsign, will be very painful
[03:56] <apachelogger> ok :)
[03:57] <Hobbsee> that's what mtr is telling me, anyway
[03:58] <apachelogger> doesn't sound very funny :|
[03:59] <Hobbsee> not overly.   i'm ssh'd into a friend's machine, so any time it drops, it doesnt take forever to reconnect to irc
[03:59] <apachelogger> :)
[04:01] <Hobbsee> also helpful for when i pull the cable
[04:01] <Hobbsee> fortunatley, $friend's machine is abotu 20km away, so the latency, even on a crap day, isnt too bad.
[04:06] <Lure> Riddell: I suspect this is known: trying to overwrite `/usr/share/python-support/kde-guidance/.version', which is also in package kde-guidance-powermanager
[04:06] <Hobbsee> Lure: someone's mentioned it earlier, but no ones' fixed it yet
[04:06] <Hobbsee> 22:24 < hunger> The new guidance-backends conflicts with the old kde-guidance on some files (e.g. /usr/share/apps/guidance/vesamodes).
[04:06] <Hobbsee> maybe there are 2, then.
[04:08] <Riddell> Lure: nnarg
[04:08] <Lure> Hobbsee: this is probably caused by recent change of Riddell to split out guidance backend
[04:08] <Lure> Riddell: full log: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/24240/
[04:15] <Riddell> Hobbsee: if your connection too broken to update kubuntu-meta still?
[04:15] <Hobbsee> Riddell: already uploaded, and accepted
[04:16] <Hobbsee> Riddell: i've renamed it "the spiderweb" though
[04:17] <Riddell> oh, there it is on gutsy-changes, groovy
[04:17] <Hobbsee> :)
[04:32] <nosrednaekim> Lure: your idea sounds good for guidance powermanager.
[04:34] <mhb> Riddell: will do
[04:38] <mhb> Riddell: oh, Lure was a few minutes faster ... thanks Lure
[04:41] <Riddell> Lure: it's python-central being strange.  I don't understand why it does this now but didn't do it before when we already had two packages from the guidance source package
[05:05] <Hobbsee> wow.  my kubuntu devel logs go back to breezy, in december 05
[05:05] <Hobbsee> no wonder kate dies a little when trying to open them
[05:05] <hunger> Hobbsee: Wow... you must be *old* ;-)
[05:05] <Hobbsee> hunger: *grin*
[05:06] <Hobbsee> i'm not that old
[05:06] <Hobbsee> hunger: i've been using linux for a bit under 2 years
[05:06] <hunger> Hobbsee: I'd be surprised if you were older than me.
[05:06] <Hobbsee> actually, that wouldnt ahve been the earliest time i was in kubuntu-devel, either.
[05:07] <Hobbsee> that's just when i finished school, so actually looked to do some serious dev stuff on kubuntu
[05:08] <Hobbsee> hunger: how old are you?
[05:09] <hunger> Hobbsee: 32.
[05:09] <Hobbsee> hunger: heh.  you win the record for being older, then
[05:11] <hunger> Hobbsee: Yes, saw that comming...
[05:13] <Hobbsee> heh
[05:14] <Hobbsee> hah.  my #kubuntu log is 19mb
[05:14] <Hobbsee> #ubuntu is 48.7mb
[05:20] <hunger> Hobbsee: And you did something with your young live.... being a kubuntu dev and all... I just wasted my youth on strange (and nowadays dead) projects:-)
[05:20] <Hobbsee> hunger: heh.  my uni is suffering a lot, though
[05:21] <hunger> Hobbsee: So was mine:-) But then you learn lots of stuff here... I profited more from my project stuff than the uni stuff.
[05:21] <Hobbsee> unfortunately, this stuff doesnt correspond so much to my uni stuff
[05:21] <hunger> You are not doing CS?
[05:22] <Hobbsee> nope
[05:22] <Hobbsee> bachelor of technology in optoelectronics
[05:23] <hunger> Hobbsee: I see your problem then...
[05:23] <hunger> Is that electronic in glasses? like MP3 players and stuff ;-)
[05:24] <Hobbsee> lights, lasers, fibre optic cables, etc
[05:26] <hunger> Hobbsee: I see: stuff to attach to a computer only... nothing interesting ;-)
[05:26] <Hobbsee> hehe
[05:26] <Hobbsee> oh it's interesting
[05:26] <Hobbsee> but so's the stuff i'm doing for kubuntu, especially the release stuff.
[05:26] <Hobbsee> so i've got no idea what will happen.
[05:33] <hunger> Hobbsee: I'm sure everything will work out.
[05:33] <Hobbsee> yeah.  i hope so :)
[05:33] <Hobbsee> okay, i know a few of the things that *could* happen, but i dont know which will win.
[05:56] <ScottK> Riddell: I think yazpp will be in good shape after the next upload.  It's close now.
[05:59] <Riddell> ScottK: asimon is here if you need to poke him :)
[06:01] <asimon> ScottK: I'll upload a fixed version later, thanks for your review.
[06:03] <apacheLAGger> anyone ever saw a properly made tarball from kdevelop?
[06:04] <mhb> is the kubuntu website available in bzr? I forgot...
[06:05] <Riddell> yes
[06:05] <Riddell> https://code.launchpad.net/kubuntu-website/
[06:06] <mhb> oh, just found it
[06:06] <Riddell> my main branch
[06:06] <ScottK> asimon: You're welcome.  Thanks for contributing.
[06:07] <mhb> why isn't the kubuntu-website (or a branch of it) available for Kubuntu members to hack?
[06:10] <mhb> Riddell: I think kubuntu members are a reliable sort, and the kubuntu website is along with k-d-s more-or-less the stuff we do, so I see no reason in preventing ourselves from commiting to it
[06:11] <Hobbsee> who can get to it now?
[06:12] <Riddell> mhb: well it is, branch away and I'll merge when it's good
[06:12] <Riddell> mhb: but we should get the whole kubuntu-website spec thing moving
[06:14] <mhb> Riddell: I agree, that's why I suggested that
[06:14] <ScottK> asimon: I'm good.  I'm on my way out the door.  I'll leave an advocating comment later today if someone else doesn't get it first.
[06:15] <mhb> Riddell: having a branch all members can commit to may speed up the innovation flow, even if the page becomes a bit unstable at first
[06:17] <mhb> kwwii, nixternal: you two seem to have branches for kubuntu website. I'm thinking perhaps a single branch we all (members and other interested people) could commit to would be nice. What do you think?
[06:18] <nixternal> that is up to the big man :) don't know why I would have 2 branches...should be just one
[06:18] <nixternal> but then again, I am a bzr dummy
[06:24] <mhb> Riddell: in order to get things moving, I'd suggest a shared branch for the ~kubuntu-website team. Kubuntu Members should be a part of that team so they can hack on it. (I hope indirect teams have access to the code.)
[06:24] <mhb> Riddell: do you know what that team is for? It currently has only Matthew Nuzum listed.
[06:25] <Riddell> mhb: which team?
[06:25] <nixternal> mhb: only Canonical employees can have access to the "official" one
[06:25] <Riddell> mhb: shared branch doesn't change anything much since it still needs to be merged in manually by me (only person with access to the server)
[06:26] <mhb> Riddell: true
[06:26] <nixternal> the possibilities with cdbs are endless
[06:27] <mhb> Riddell: but I still think that if we open up the code this way, we will get more code
[06:27] <Hobbsee> ooh, this debate again?
[06:28] <mhb> no, not this one
[06:28] <mhb> the other one :o)
[06:28] <nixternal> haha
[06:28] <nixternal> nice comeback there mhb :)
[06:28] <nixternal> but you need to remeber one thing mhb...
[06:28] <nixternal> !hobbsee
[06:28] <ubotu> I phear the stick so shhhhh
[06:29] <mhb> Hobbsee: okay, I'll put it in a different way
[06:29] <Hobbsee> differnt topic, same subject.
[06:29] <Hobbsee> fun stuff
[06:30] <Hobbsee> mhb: what i've learned about this is that if you can do it in a way that's not going to hurt canonical, they'll probably say yes.
[06:30] <mhb> current situation: 1 jr (you can say stable) branch, 4 other branches for individuals
[06:30] <Hobbsee> but you might have to push a bit.
[06:30] <Hobbsee> i dunno how you apply that to a website, though
[06:30] <mhb> better solution: 1 jr branch, 1 trunk branch
[06:31] <nixternal> I will agree that is a better solution instead of having a bunch of personal branches
[06:31] <mhb> people have access to the trunk branch, but not the server itself
[06:31] <mhb> once the code is well and approved, jr branch merges and jr publishes it on the website
[06:31] <nixternal> just give access to ~kubuntu-members like with k-d-s
[06:33] <mhb> Hobbsee: I'm just talking about the code, not the site admin rights
[06:33] <Hobbsee> mhb: true that.  i was talking in the general case
[06:34] <Hobbsee> mhb: oh, the other thing i've learned is that canonical may well want input from the community, but may not be asking for it.
[06:34] <Hobbsee> dunno if any of that's relevant - but it may help in this, or future tsuff.
[06:34] <nixternal> Hobbsee: another thing I learned, is that Canonical will do secret things w/o community cooperation, release it, and then want that cooperation ;)
[06:35] <nixternal> and those secret things are to community projects
[06:35] <Hobbsee> nixternal: in some cases, yeah
[06:35] <nixternal> DaSkreech: you can have mine :)
[06:36] <DaSkreech> I think as far as I'll go is a user :)
[06:37] <nixternal> !nixternal
[06:37] <ubotu> Oh no!  The pointy-clicky Vista lover has arrived!
[06:37] <nixternal> that has Hobbsee's name written all over it
[06:37] <Hobbsee> hehe
[06:37] <Jucato> !-nixternal
[06:37] <ubotu> nixternal has no aliases - added by Hobbsee on 2007-05-31 09:32:53
[06:37] <Jucato> :D
[06:37] <nixternal> anything with "pointy" in it, well that is Hobbsee's fault
[06:37] <nixternal> ahhh
[06:37] <Hobbsee> hah
[06:37] <nixternal> Jucato: you just snitched!
[06:37] <DaSkreech> !hobbsee
[06:37] <ubotu> I phear the stick so shhhhh
[06:37] <nixternal> hahaha
[06:38] <Jucato> !-hobbsee
[06:38] <ubotu> hobbsee has no aliases - added by ompaul on 2007-05-10 14:42:04
[06:38] <Hobbsee> ooh, ompaul hey?
[06:38] <Jucato> heh :)
[06:38] <nixternal> thanks Jucato for teaching me how to find out who did what
[06:38] <Jucato> heheh let's all thank Seveas for that :D
[06:39] <DaSkreech> yeah seveas is great :)
[06:39] <mhb> Riddell: is your branch the best for branching off or is one of kwwii's better?
[06:40] <mhb> Riddell: for the "unstable" kubuntu website branch
[06:40] <Riddell> mhb: my main one is the one that's in use, the rest are merged or dead
[06:40] <mhb> okay, great
[06:40] <Riddell> mhb: main is actually a mirror of the branch at http://kubuntu.org
[06:40] <Riddell> you can also just branch directly from there
[06:41] <mhb> Riddell: Format <RepositoryFormat6> for http://kubuntu.org/.bzr/ is deprecated - please use 'bzr upgrade' to get better performance
[06:42] <mhb> Riddell: you might know that
[06:42] <Riddell> the server is still on breezy
[06:45] <mhb> Riddell: is is okay to upgrade the branch?
[06:45] <mhb> Riddell: won't you have trouble merging it later?
[06:47] <Riddell> mhb: not sure actually
[06:47] <Riddell> I'd recommend not upgrading incase it does cause problems
[06:47] <mhb> Riddell: okay
[06:53] <nixternal> oh Hobbsee, you have everyone and their mother doing the !nixternal thing :)
[06:53] <Hobbsee> nixternal: *grin*
[06:53] <Hobbsee> surely not...
[06:53] <nixternal> hahaha, the chicagoans are going nuts with it
[06:55] <DaSkreech> Riddell: Do you have a IRL contact for Mez?
[07:10] <mhb> Riddell: pushed, https://code.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-members/kubuntu-website/trunk
[07:10] <mhb> Riddell: I'll just add the Experimental label and some necessary information
[07:24] <mhb> Riddell: one more thing - I remember a page which was set up for the experiments on kubuntu.org artwork. Does that server/page still exist? Can we tweak it so that it updates from the "trunk" bzr branch?
[07:24] <Hobbsee> night all
[07:24] <mhb> Hobbsee: nighty night
[07:25] <DaSkreech> Night Hobbsee
[07:25] <Hobbsee> :(
[07:25] <Hobbsee> * :)
[07:27] <Riddell> DaSkreech: whois thekatapult.org.uk has a postal address
[07:27] <DaSkreech> Riddell: thanks
[07:27] <Riddell> mhb: I don't remember such a page
[07:28] <mhb> no? hmm... ryanakca, do you remember?
[07:29] <mhb> how open do we want to be about creating a new look for kubuntu.org?
[07:30] <mhb> I remember people posting e-mails with suggestions for k.org
[07:31] <mhb> hmm, that question is probably for kwwii, as he is the artwork superman
[07:32] <Riddell> he already has a possible design
[07:33] <Riddell> trying to remember where it is
[07:34] <DaSkreech> Looks like Fedora 8 will ship with KDE4
[07:36] <apokryphos> like most others I think they'll end up having to wait and see how things are closer to the time
[07:37] <DaSkreech> yeah theyship like 5 days after the proposed debut of KDE4
[07:39] <apachelogger> lol
[07:39] <apachelogger> makes ultimate sense to me :P
[07:39] <apachelogger> AFK
[07:39] <nosrednaekim> yeah.... KDE4 is going to be released a couple days after gutsy. What are you going to use?
[07:40] <Riddell> kde 3 with 4 available
[07:40] <Tm_T> KDE3 until release and then as usual, kubuntu.org repository, is my guess
[07:40] <nosrednaekim> ah.. ok. makes sense.
[07:41] <Tm_T> Riddell: was there still any idea about kde4 enabled iso ?
[07:41] <Riddell> Tm_T: sure, we'll do that when 4.0 is out
[07:41] <Tm_T> lovely
[07:42] <nosrednaekim> cool. from what i've seen, kubuntu is one of the top distros for quickly delivering kde4. (only gentoo being faster)
[07:43] <Tm_T> gentoo is faster?
[07:43] <Tm_T> ah right, they got stuff available before release, those cheaters
[07:43] <nosrednaekim> quicker at getting the releases since its sourcebased
[07:43] <Tm_T> doesn't matter
[07:43] <DaSkreech> Unless of course that's LTS :)
[07:44] <Tm_T> DaSkreech: looks like it
[07:44] <DaSkreech> then it's futrther
[07:44] <nosrednaekim> wow.. really? that long?
[07:44] <DaSkreech> nosrednaekim: note by default
[07:44] <nosrednaekim> why,because guidance has to be remade?
[07:44] <DaSkreech> having it as an option will come earlier
[07:45] <DaSkreech> maybe having two ISOs one with KDE4 and one with KDEOld
[07:45] <DaSkreech> With KDEold being the blessed one :)
[07:45] <DaSkreech> KDE4 is really young. Most apps won't make the jump
[07:45] <nosrednaekim> right.
[07:45] <Tm_T> nosrednaekim: KDE release sources are distributed before release to packagers IIRC so if Gentoo wait release, they are no faster than other distros
[07:46] <nosrednaekim> Tm_T: ok.
[07:47] <nosrednaekim> I'm just curious, is there a kdevelop for KDE4 that will run in KDE3?
[07:49] <nixternal> nosrednaekim: you use kdevelop3, but you set it to use kde4 source directories and qt4
[07:50] <nixternal> http://techbase.kde.org/Getting_Started/Set_up_KDE_4_for_development#KDevelop
[07:50] <nosrednaekim> nixternal: ah ok.. thanks.
[07:50] <nixternal> note that this tutorial requires you have have kde4 built according to the kde4 guidelines
[07:51] <nosrednaekim> nixternal: I have the kubuntu package. is that good enough?
[07:51] <nixternal> unfortunately it isn't
[07:51] <nixternal> http://techbase.kde.org/Getting_Started/Build/KDE4
[07:51] <nixternal> that is how you want to build out kde4 for development
[07:52] <nosrednaekim> nixternal: well... i'm glad a have a dual core processor then :-D
[07:52] <nixternal> hehe, it isn't to bad, just open up konsole and let it go
[07:52] <nixternal> it isn't super intensive..I was able to compile and build accordingly
[07:53] <nosrednaekim> I'm tempted to say "if you can do it......" lol, but I don't know.;)
[07:54] <nixternal> it isn't all that difficult actually...you just need to read the directions thoroughly
[07:55] <nosrednaekim> ok.
[07:55] <nixternal> my only thing, is the .bashrc example source they show that you need to add to your new kde-devel user, the cmakekde section should add the -GKdevelop to the cmake line, that way there when you get kdevelop setup, you don't have to rebuild everything
[07:55] <nosrednaekim> i'll try. thanks.
[07:56] <nosrednaekim> ok. thanks for the tip.
[08:19] <hunger> The user listing in kdm looks really ugly. How can I get rid of it again?
[08:20] <nixternal> how did you get the user listing?
[08:20] <nixternal> heh, I guess if you knew the answer to that, then you would be able to get rid of it I guess :)
[08:21] <Riddell> it was in today's update
[08:21] <nixternal> ahhhhh
[08:21] <hunger> nixternal: Today's update...
[08:21] <nixternal> shows you that I have yet turned on the gutsy box
[08:23] <Riddell> nixternal: are you going to do a tribe 1 page?
[08:24] <nixternal> Riddell: funny you should ask :) people from Ubuntu and Xubuntu just asked me the same, and how to do it
[08:24] <nixternal> I am working locally, as to avoide the /. and digg junk for the moment
[08:24] <nixternal> they seem to enjoy making it hard for me to edit the wiki pages when they post their stories
[08:24] <Riddell> doesn't Ubuntu know how to do it?
[08:25] <nixternal> well the marketing crowd does it, and they cut the worst non-default looking screenshots known to man
[08:25] <nixternal> then again, I think they dislike the Kubuntu pages looking better :)
[08:26] <Riddell> hunger: there's no easy way to turn it off, it's part of the theme.  if we keep the user list we should probably have a second theme available without it
[08:27] <nixternal> that makes sense
[08:27] <nixternal> Riddell: OK, now that you brought up the release page, what do you want to see highlighted for tribe 1?
[08:28] <DaSkreech> nixternal: they seem to complain anytime that kubuntu comes out looking good
[08:28] <nixternal> I have noticed..but hey, what can we say, we have a group of people who make kubuntu always look good :)
[08:28] <hunger> Riddell: It looks *really* ugly with lots of users.
[08:30] <DaSkreech> hunger: Maybe it can auto detect a threshhold and move to somethign else ?
[08:32] <rbrunhuber> Is there a list of version which should be included in gutsy? Like Kernel 2.6.22 and xorg 7.3?
[08:33] <nixternal> jeesh, todays update is a pita
[08:33] <nixternal> -f installs, --configure -a, dist-upgrade, -f install, and so on
[08:34] <hunger> rbrunhuber: Dunno.
[08:34] <nixternal> guidance doesn't update it seems
[08:34] <hunger> nixternal: Worked fine for me... apart from guidance and a couple of other things:-)
[08:35] <nixternal> ya, guidance is the one giving me problems
[08:39] <Riddell> new guidance is still compiling on i386
[08:41] <yuriy> is there a good tutorial somewhere for using pyqt4 with designer?
[08:42] <Riddell> use designer same as normal, load the .ui as done by software-properties-kde for example
[08:42] <Riddell> no compiling necessary
[08:43] <yuriy> hmm oh that helps, i was looking for an example
[08:44] <Riddell> you need to create a widget then load the .ui file onto it (same in qt 4 for c++, a bit different from qt 3 style)
[08:46] <yuriy> do i still need to do that if the .ui is a main window?
[08:47] <nixternal> you need to convert the .ui file
[08:47] <nixternal> pyuic4 foo.ui > foo.py
[08:48] <yuriy> i do? i thought that happens at run time, as Riddell just said
[08:48] <Riddell> nixternal: naw, that's the old way to do it
[08:48] <nixternal> ahh, thanks
[08:48] <Riddell> you can if you want, but I don't see an advantage over just loading
[08:48] <nixternal> well that rocks then, I don't have to do that anymore..woohoo
[08:48] <yuriy> hehe
[08:49] <Riddell> yuriy: yes, even if it's a main window.  software-properties has a widget which is an overloaded QWidget and in the constructor it loads the ui file into itself
[08:49] <yuriy> ok
[08:49] <Riddell> which does seem a bit more complex than qt 3's way that just gives you the object, but I'm sure they have a good reason
[08:50] <yuriy> now to figure out how to run this thing.. seems to be put together a little funny. i think i better try and ask again
[09:07] <yuriy> for that matter, how do i run software-properties, from the source?
[09:08] <yuriy> nvm, figured it out
[09:08] <DaSkreech> hunger: what should it do with only one user?
[09:11] <hunger> DaSkreech: Either autologin for the lazy person or a normal non-information-leaky no-userlist login dialog for the security paranoid guy.
[09:12] <DaSkreech> Riddell: What's the idea behind the install?
[09:12] <DaSkreech> Riddell: as few questions as possible?
[09:13] <Riddell> DaSkreech: which install?
[09:14] <DaSkreech> Riddell: a (K)ubuntu install
[09:14] <DaSkreech> is there a reason that the desktop install doesn't pose any questions?
[09:15] <Riddell> it does ask questions
[09:15] <DaSkreech> or I guess is there a way to start it and configure something outside of the partitons?
[09:15] <DaSkreech> Well user name and such
[09:17] <Riddell> settings up the user account is the last step
[09:17] <DaSkreech> Would it be ok to put a selection on that step for a userlist or not?
[09:17] <DaSkreech> hunger: at that point I think that the user should make the choice :)
[09:17] <Riddell> jings no
[09:18] <yuriy> i don't think that's needed in the installation, but the option in the login manager kcm should work
[09:18] <hunger> DaSkreech: Yeap. But the user-list thingy is definitly what the user does not want...
[09:19] <DaSkreech> hunger: what your user does not want :)
[09:19] <hunger> DaSkreech: A userlist containing one user... it is OK if you are not interested in security and have a couple of users only.
[09:20] <DaSkreech> hunger: that may be what some people are interested in
[09:20] <DaSkreech> A computer for their children
[09:20] <DaSkreech> for example
[09:20] <hunger> DaSkreech: Yes, it is great for a family. But it sucks for a bigger environment and a single user workspace.
[09:21] <DaSkreech> hunger: no arguments there :)
[09:21] <hunger> DaSkreech: basically such a list only works well with 2-5 users or so.
[09:21] <hunger> DaSkreech: It sucks as soon as you need to scroll...
[09:30] <DaSkreech> People with a small family
[09:31] <hunger> DaSkreech: The idea of sharing a computer... close to sharing a toothbrush...
[09:34] <yuriy> ugh he used tabs. this is going to be fun.
[09:35] <Riddell> yuriy: who does?
[09:37] <yuriy> Riddell: pete savage
[09:37] <DaSkreech> hunger: Ha ha :)
[09:38] <DaSkreech> hunger: I shiver at the thought of getting a computer for each person :)
[09:40] <hunger> DaSkreech: sharing a computer is unhygenic... just think of those dirty keyboards.
[09:51] <yuriy> so i18n isn't available without kde? have to do this translate_widget thing?
[09:57] <yuriy> and the main window ends up being a QWidget?
[10:07] <DaSkreech> hunger: think of buying a computer for each person!
[10:07] <DaSkreech> that's a good reason not to have children
[10:07] <hunger> DaSkreech: These computers tend to accumulate here...
[10:08] <hunger> DaSkreech: I had the first real crisis with my wife when I tried to put up the 12th pc in the living room.
[10:09] <DaSkreech> ha ha :)
[10:13] <DaSkreech> I think you may need a Computer/Electronics Anon group
[10:14] <hunger> DaSkreech: well, I am pretty clean nowadays. Only have my laptop left.
[10:15] <hunger> DaSkreech: ... the servers and the other boxes now officially belong to my wife.
[10:15] <DaSkreech> the bonfire worked?
[10:15] <DaSkreech> oh ok :)
[10:16] <hunger> DaSkreech: we gave lots of boxes away to friends and family. We only kept a couple of boxes and we now have a cellar.
[10:22] <fdoving> yuriy: you can use tr() with qt.
[10:52] <Lure_> Riddell: new guidance is still not good: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/24311/
[11:15] <Riddell> Lure_: works for me
[11:16] <Riddell> probably because I didn't have the old version installed
[11:16] <Lure_> Riddell: will remove old version now
[11:16] <Riddell> I'll put in a replaces
[11:17] <Lure_> Riddell: ype, it works now
[11:21] <Lure_> Riddell: /usr/bin/guidance-power-manager: 2: /usr/share/python-support/guidance-power-manager/guidance-power-manager.py: not found
[11:21] <Lure_> Riddell: if I start from command line :-(
[11:22] <Lure_> Riddell: system settings modeles work properly
[11:23] <Lure_> Riddell: new path is /usr/share/python-support/kde-guidance-powermanager/guidance-power-manager.py
[11:23] <xRaich[o] 2x> is there a package for the kde3 api in kubuntu?
[11:23] <lucky_lucas> xRaich[o] 2x: do you mean kde3 dev-packages ?
[11:25] <xRaich[o] 2x> i don't really know what to install am quite new to debian based systems. but kdevelop assistant is complaining that there are no files to show
[11:25] <lucky_lucas> ok
[11:27] <xRaich[o] 2x> that's what i am searching for : /usr/share/doc/kde/HTML/en/kdelibs-apidocs
[11:28] <lucky_lucas> xRaich[o] 2x: http://women.kde.org/articles/tutorials.php
[11:28] <lucky_lucas> this a good point to start
[11:29] <xRaich[o] 2x> ah ok so no package ;) ok that helps a lot
[11:30] <lucky_lucas> in fact kdelib-apidocs is a documentaion api and kdevelop complains of missing kde developement files
[11:30] <lucky_lucas> isn't is ?
[11:30] <xRaich[o] 2x> yep it's complaining
[11:31] <Riddell> Lure_: ok, let me fix
[11:31] <nixternal> wo0t...gutsy exceptions in vmware
[11:32] <lucky_lucas> xRaich[o] 2x: you may want to apt-get install some of the dev packages ?
[11:33] <xRaich[o] 2x> lucky_lucas: already did that but the files in question were not in them
[11:34] <lucky_lucas> ok so following the tuto will surely help you to figure out what you're mmissing
[11:34] <nixternal> anyone else have icons on the desktop for gutsy after a daily install?
[11:35] <Riddell> nixternal: what are you testing?
[11:35] <nixternal> I just installed the current daily alternate cd
[11:38] <Arby> nixternal: do you mean the home, system and trash icons?
[11:38] <Riddell> nixternal: please report on https://isotesting.stgraber.org/isotesting/iso/Kubuntu
[11:38] <Arby> I see those
[11:38] <nixternal> Arby: yes
[11:38] <nixternal> Riddell: will do
[11:39] <Arby> are they not supposed to be there?
[11:39] <Riddell> Arby: we shouldn't have any icons on the desktop (except install for live CD)
[11:39] <Arby> ah, well we do I didn't realise it was a bug
[11:39] <Arby> nixternal: if you file it I can confirm
[11:42] <ryanakca> mhb: the address for the test site?
[11:43] <ryanakca> oh, he isn't there
[11:44] <ryanakca> Riddell: d'you know if mhb was looking for the address to it? (I'm guessing, based on the conversation earlier)
[11:46] <nixternal> Arby: do you get a different KDM theme as well?
[11:46] <Arby> KDM == login screen?
[11:46] <Arby> if yes, then yes I do
[11:47] <Arby> I assumed it was deliberate
[11:47] <Riddell> what do you get?
[11:48] <Arby> I have list of users each with an icon on the left and the the login and password boxes on the right
[11:48] <Arby> sorry can't describe it better than that
[11:48] <Riddell> and kubuntu theme?
[11:49] <DaSkreech> Riddell: did you give an answer on the userlist question?
[11:49] <Arby> default (I think, currently in the middle of another install test)
[11:49] <Riddell> DaSkreech: what was the question?
[11:50] <Arby> nixternal: what kubuntu theme do you get?
[11:50] <DaSkreech> Would it be acceptable for the user to select between a userlist KDM or a plain one on the screen where they input the username?
[11:50] <nixternal> I am not ruling out vmware being the issue..I get some default kdm block theme
[11:50] <nixternal> I gotta go...I am late
[11:50] <nixternal> later
[11:51] <Arby> vmware seems less likely, I get this on real hardware
[11:52] <Arby> Riddell: can I get a screenshot on the kdm screen? and how?
[11:52] <Riddell> DaSkreech: sure, of course, if we do keep the user list theme (which isn't certain) we'll include one without the list too
[11:52] <Riddell> Arby: no easy way that I know of
[11:52] <Riddell> I've spent hours trying to screenshot kdm
[11:53] <Riddell> nixternal: what kdm theme do you get?
[11:53] <DaSkreech> Riddell: ok. methinks that's the easiest way.  Might need some sort of preview though :(
[11:53] <Arby> OK I won't spend more hours then
[11:53] <Arby> [22:50]  <nixternal> I am not ruling out vmware being the issue..I get some default kdm block theme
[11:53] <Arby> [22:50]  <nixternal> I gotta go...I am late
[11:53] <Arby> Riddell: ^^
[11:53] <Riddell> DaSkreech: the kdm theme module has a preview
[11:53] <Arby> he's gone I think
[11:53] <DaSkreech> Of course it's just to integrate it in the install script
[11:54] <Arby> when this install finishes I'll check it out and file a bug
[11:58] <Lure_> Riddell: I still have some default kde theme for kdm (after todays updates)
[11:59] <Lure_> Riddell: but this is upgrade from feisty and not clean install from daily cd
[11:59] <Lure_> Riddell: and thanks for fixing syssettings crash and lost+found icons
[12:00] <Arby> rebooting now, lets see what we get :)
[12:02] <Arby> Riddell: kubuntu theme is the default as I thought
[12:02] <Arby> but with extra icons
[12:04] <Riddell> Arby: groovy
[12:06] <Arby> Riddell: so should I file it as a bug against kdm?
[12:10] <Arby> Riddell: also, should knetwork-manager appear in the systray automatically at login?
[12:11] <Arby> (because it doesn't)