/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2007/06/06/#launchpad.txt

jordihey ajmitch 12:36
ajmitchhi jordi 12:36
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MrKeunerhi, isn't launchpad free software?12:39
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Odd_BlokeMrKeuner: It is not.12:47
Odd_BlokeHow long should I expect to wait for a bzr branch import to take place?12:47
pochuMrKeuner: not yet, but it'll be.12:48
pochu(See the faq)12:48
MrKeunerpochu: I found it very strange for a project like Ubuntu to have a proprietary license 12:49
MrKeunernice to hear that it will be free12:49
MrKeunerAre the translations I make using launchpad shared with the actual projects themselves?12:49
pochuMrKeuner: Ubuntu is free. Launchpad isn't.12:50
pochuThey aren't the same thing.12:50
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MrKeunerpochu: I am aware of the difference but still it does not make sense. Shouldn't Ubuntu project be promoting free software?12:51
pochuMrKeuner: Regarding the translations, I thint it depends. You can translate for Ubuntu. In that case, the translations are used by Ubuntu (though they can reused by upstream). You can also translate for some upstream projects, such us listen, wordpress... In that case, the translations are used by them.12:51
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pochuMrKeuner: There is a good reason why Launchpad isn't free software yet ;)12:52
MrKeunerpochu: and that's in faq? :)12:52
MrKeunerWell, I love Ubuntu. But my love for free software is bigger. I cannot see any reason for closing source.12:54
gnomefreakMrKeuner: yes it is in the faq :)12:54
MrKeuneror making it non-free12:54
gnomefreaknot all of it is closed12:55
pochuMrKeuner: Is Launchpad open source? Will it be? in https://launchpad.net/faq12:55
pochuMrKeuner: Also, look at the question "<popey_> QUESTION: What are you doing to counter the claims that launchpad is evil because it is closed source?" at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/openweekfeisty/askmark212:57
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MrKeunerSo, the reason is that developers cannot make money if the source code is released?12:59
MrKeunerDid I get it right?12:59
pochuYou didn't :)12:59
MrKeunerhelp :)01:00
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pochuif we released it, and 10 people set up their own instances, then the work required to keep track of everything LP keeps track of would go up by 10x01:00
MrKeunerpochu: what does that mean01:00
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pochuMrKeuner: Launchpad aims to be a centralised bug-tracker, translation interface, buildd...01:01
pochuSo if Ubuntu, Debian, Gentoo, and Upstream uses it (for example). If there's a bug in Ubuntu, you can click "Also affects" and click Debian.01:01
pochuThen if it affects upstream, click also affects usptream, and the author will have a bug report there.01:02
pochuIt's about sharing information.01:02
MrKeunerBut isn't it possible to not to let third party instances connect to your system?01:02
pochuBut if they release Launchpad, everybody will be able to set it up.01:02
pochuMrKeuner: look at this, for example: https://help.launchpad.net/FeatureHighlights/MultiProjectBugs01:05
MrKeunerpochu: I am not sure I got your point. I guess I am a hard learner01:11
MrKeunerpochu: can't you just not let my instance to use your services?01:11
pochuMrKeuner: Hmm, but we want you to use Launchpad!01:11
pochuIt's the other way. We don't want you to use your own launchpad (such as launchpad.mydomain.com)01:12
MrKeunerI will use my instance. And my community will use my instance. But my instance and Canonical instances will be seperate01:12
MrKeunerpochu: why is that?01:12
pochuBut that's what they want to avoid ^ :)01:12
pochuMrKeuner: because then the main purpose for Launchpad won't be possible. Which is to share 'knowledge'01:13
MrKeunerpochu: same is for Wikipedia? 01:13
pochue.g. click a button and a bug report affects you too. If you're not using LP, that's not possible for you.01:13
MrKeunerpochu: but they share their source code and allow seperate instances01:14
pochuHmm, I don't know how wikipedia works.01:14
pochuBut they don't share the database, which is the important thing.01:14
MrKeunerThey don't01:14
pochuThe bug reports, the users...01:14
MrKeunerI do not need them, I need the source code01:14
pochuBut we _do_ want to share it ;)01:14
MrKeunerand the right to modify it01:14
pochuYou'll have it sooner or later.01:15
pochuNot yet though.01:15
MrKeunerpochu: what is wrong with my having the source code of Launchpad, I still cannot get01:15
MrKeunerbut it is OK if you are bored with me :)01:15
pochuMrKeuner: The problem isn't that you have the code, or that you modify the code, or that you help improve the code. That's OK.01:16
pochuThe problem is that if the code is open sourced, then everybody will set up his own launchpad (as they do with bugzilla).01:17
pochuAnd that's not OK.01:17
pochuI hope you understand it :)01:17
MrKeunerI would like to distribute it and to run it too. I need all four basic freedoms :)01:17
MrKeunerNo but that's OK. Thanks for your help01:17
pochuMrKeuner: you are welcome to use it at launchpad.net :)01:18
MrKeunerpochu: I have translations and bug reports.01:21
MrKeunerpochu: But did not know that it was not free software01:21
MrKeunerpochu: did not expect that at all. Still find it strange for a project lik Ubuntu to promote non-free software01:22
MrKeunerimplicitly I mean01:22
crimsunno, usability for humans seems foremost for Ubuntu.01:22
crimsuncf. Firefox01:23
crimsunif Ubuntu's primary stance were Freedom, we'd use ice* instead.01:23
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kikocrimsun, sure makes me feel lucky to be a human :)01:25
crimsunMrKeuner: I'm afraid I've misunderstood your statement.01:26
pochuhi kiko :)01:26
MrKeunerI was trying to stress that Ubuntu project is fed with free software01:27
MrKeunerIf we do not promote free software we cannot go far with non-free software01:28
crimsunwell, I certainly don't claim to understand or even have a inkling regarding the Launchpad plan, but I do know that my resources certainly aren't free, and Free software only carries as far as one finds the opportunity cost in favor of Freedom.01:29
crimsunanyhow, apologies for the off-topic-ness.01:29
ubotuNew bug: #118867 in launchpad "Don't generate an OOPS for Rosetta's translations unavailable page" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/11886701:31
cypherbiosMrKeuner: Launchpad is not Ubuntu-specific01:31
MrKeunercypherbios: OK but same people are behinf LP and Ubuntu projects am i wrong?01:31
cypherbiosare different things01:32
crimsundifferent projects, different developers01:32
cypherbiosthat's right01:33
cypherbiosthey have the opportunity to choose what licence they want to offer their software, as you have your right to choose yours (if you have one)01:33
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MrKeunerSo creators of LP do not believe in free software but creators of Ubuntu does?01:34
kikohey!01:34
ubotuNew bug: #118870 in soyuz "$sourcepackage/+changelog only shows one entry per distrorelease pocket" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/11887001:35
ubotuNew bug: #118869 in launchpad "Split out OffsiteFormPostError from "All Exceptions" section of OOPS log" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/11886901:36
cypherbiosMrKeuner: LP is a project, and I'm pretty sure they will free the code when they think it's ready or should do that01:36
MrKeunerI am sure about that too, just trying to see the reasons why they think it is not ready yet01:37
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=== ..[topic/#launchpad:Rinchen] : Launchpad https://launchpad.net/ | Next developer meeting: Thu 7 June 2007, 1400UTC (wiki:MeetingAgenda) | launchpad-users@lists.canonical.com (wiki:MailingLists) | Launchpad help: https://help.launchpad.net | Channel logs: http://tinyurl.com/72w39
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mpt_Gooooooooooooooooood afternoon Launchpadders!04:30
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ubotuNew bug: #118891 in malone "Duplicate bugs still visible in CVE listing" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/11889104:50
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ubotuNew bug: #118896 in launchpad-answers "+unsupported URL is incompatible with language selector" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/11889605:20
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LongPointyStickmorning mpt!07:36
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slofgrenanyone here that can help login issues07:46
slofgrenI can login to https://launchpad.net but not https://wiki.ubuntu.com07:46
slofgrenIuse the same email and pass but it does not work07:47
slofgrenI have tried resetting my password on https://launchpad.net/+forgottenpassword07:48
slofgrenthat site is direct to by https://wiki.ubuntu.com07:48
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slofgrenHi stub 07:53
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ubotuNew bug: #118909 in launchpad "I'm a person, not a brand, and I don't have a logo" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/11890908:10
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slofgrenanyone here?09:13
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slofgrenhehe09:13
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carlosmorning09:14
Hobbseehi carlos 09:15
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ubotuNew bug: #118915 in malone "IntegrityError trying to approve a bug nomination" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/11891509:40
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ubotuNew bug: #118923 in malone "hwdb-gui is not asking whether hibernation and suspend work" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/11892311:01
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ubotuNew bug: #118929 in soyuz ""Page not found" error clicking on version number in per version source package page" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/11892912:00
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cprovmorning folks .02:20
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Hobbseemorning cprov 02:22
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statikme03:53
salgadothanks for the reminder statik!03:54
bacy'all are a little eager today03:55
barrytoo much coffee i guess03:55
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salgadowelcome to this week's non-au reviewer meeting04:00
bacn04:00
salgadowho's here?04:00
barryme04:00
bacme04:00
ubotuNew bug: #118954 in soyuz "Component table needs description column" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/11895404:00
statikme04:00
salgadoBjornT and flacoste are on sprints and send apologies 04:01
salgado== Agenda ==04:01
salgado * Roll call04:01
salgado * Next meeting04:01
salgado * Queue status.04:01
salgadonext meeting, same time next week. any objections?04:01
salgadoI take that as a no04:02
salgadothe queue is starting to get huge, with big branches04:02
barryyeah, i saw the general queue this morning.  whoa04:03
statikI let my reviews stack up, but I will be clearing them today (just sent one)04:04
salgadodoes any reviewers have sprints scheduled for the next week?04:04
barrynot me04:04
bacno04:04
salgadoI think we'll need to do a coordinated effort next week, otherwise most of the fixes won't be ready for 1.1.604:04
salgado(I'm assuming all branches there are for 1.1.6 stuff)04:04
statikno sprint next week04:05
barrysalgado: i wonder if we shouldn't add a bit of metadata to the branch description on PendingReviews which says what release the branch is targeted for?04:05
barryunless it's unlikely we'll see branches that aren't specifically for the next release (whatever that happens to be)04:06
salgadoyeah, I think that's a good idea04:06
barrysomething like: "LP release: 1.1.x"04:06
salgadoor target release04:07
salgadoor something like that04:07
barrysalgado: that's better, yep04:07
salgadoagain, if nobody objects I'll change the wikipage and email launchpad@04:07
barry+104:07
barrythe rationale is that it lets reviewers prioritize their reviews as the release nears04:08
salgadoright04:08
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salgadoso, any other business from anybody?04:09
barrycouple of things...04:09
barryhow have pre-impl phone calls been going? 04:09
salgadoI had one with flacoste04:10
barryhas anybody done them?  have your branch submitters done them?04:10
bacall of my submitters have done them04:10
salgadoI don't have many of them because I have kiko on the next room here, so I usually go chat with him04:10
statikhaven't done any or gotten any, two of my branches claim to have done them04:10
barrysalgado: you should call kiko on the phone :)04:11
barrykidding04:11
barryhave they been phone calls or irc?  how have the phone calls gone (as far as you know)?04:11
barryany positive or negative feedback about them?04:11
salgadothe only phone call I had with flacoste went pretty good, I thought04:11
statikI've gotten no feedback. I expect that preimpl calls will be useful for me04:12
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barryokay, cool.  second question:04:13
baci did one with steve before the requirement and it went very well04:13
barrybac: excellent.  steve is a great person to review with04:13
barrysecond question: how long should we leave a needs-reply branch in our queue?  is it our responsibility to bug the submitter to DO SOMETHING with their branch?04:14
bacbarry: my understanding, from what is on the wiki, is the branch owner is responsible for moving the review, and pushing it along when it gets stalled.04:14
salgadoin general I don't worry about them, but that's not nice from the submitters because we invested effort to review it and then they forgot about that work04:15
barryi'm happy to leave needs-reply and merge_* branches in my queue.  makes it look like i have more branches to deal with than i actually do <wink>04:15
bacbarry: but a nudge wouldn't hurt04:15
salgadomeaning we may have to review it all again later04:15
barrysalgado: good point04:15
barrybac: i think i'll start nudging politely :)04:16
barryok, done.04:16
salgadoI guess that's it then04:17
salgadothanks everybody for coming04:17
bacthanks salgado 04:17
barrythanks salgado, cheers04:17
ubotuNew bug: #118957 in launchpad-answers ""Unsupported" report should show the question language" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/11895704:21
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ubotuNew bug: #118958 in soyuz "Prevent commercial component from being probed on mirrors" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/11895804:30
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ubotuNew bug: #118962 in soyuz "Prevent the new commercial component from updating Ubuntu archive" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/11896205:10
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ubotuNew bug: #118976 in launchpad "Source IP of site visitors not currently reported in Launchpad logs" [Critical,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/11897606:41
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oly-could someone point me at a tutorial, or help me with setting up a bazaar branch on launchpad ?07:33
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oly-scratch that think i have got my code uploaded, was using wrong username :p07:52
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Rinchenmatsubara, fyi 11899108:08
RinchenI tagged it as fif08:08
ubotuNew bug: #118991 in launchpad "Misleading wording on Milestone Overview" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/11899108:11
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matsubaraRinchen: thanks. confirmed08:16
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oly-could someone help me upload my code to bazaar, i ran the push command the branch got created but it gets displayed as empty 09:05
tsmitheoly-, i doubt they can "upload" it for you09:06
oly-why would this be, bzr status lists my files, so not sure why it says empty 09:06
tsmithebut they can check it out :P09:06
oly-do not want it uploaded for me, want to know what i am doing wrong 09:06
oly-probably me :p09:06
oly-i did a bzr init, then a bzr add then tryed the push 09:07
tsmithewell, i think it looks like you did everything right09:07
tsmitheah09:07
tsmithedid you commit?09:07
oly-i did try but that just opens up a list of my files in nano09:07
tsmithethat usually suggests a conflict that needs resolving09:08
radixoly-: wait, "bzr status" lists your fileS?09:08
oly-yep, guessing thats locally though 09:08
radixoly-: "bzr status" should only show changes that *aren't* in the branch09:08
radixright09:08
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radixdo you need to 'bzr add' some files?09:08
oly-i did bzr add, i read that adds all files and forlders09:09
radixyep09:09
radixoly-: then you need to 'bzr commit'  to get it saved to your branch09:09
tsmithe-m "comment"09:09
radixoly-: then you need to 'bzr push <URL>' to upload it09:09
oly-yeah, but bzr commit just opens nano, is that supposed to happen ?09:10
radixoly-: yes, you're supposed to type in a description of the changes you made09:10
radixoly-: then save it and quit the editor09:10
ubotuNew bug: #118998 in launchpad "Launchpad's Bug Report Page has badly formatted aspects" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/11899809:10
radixoly-: or, as tsmithe points out, you can type 'bzr commit -m "description"' to specify the description on the command line09:10
radixI often type lengthy commit messages, so I prefer to use the editor :-)09:10
oly-okay will try that 09:11
oly-actually, if i submit a file by accident can i remove all traces of it ?09:12
oly-i think the commit worked this time it said committed revision 109:12
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oly-does this fetch phase, on a push take a while ?09:42
oly-the progress bar does not seem to move,09:42
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jelmeroly-: yeah, it can take a while if used over a dumb transport (sftp, for example)09:49
oly-yeah using it over sftp, it stuck on phase 1/4 and the bar is not moving09:49
oly-if i did it right its only 12mb, if i did it wrong it 90mb :p09:50
oly-but i am starting to think its crashed09:50
oly-will leave it a bit longer and see09:51
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oly-it mved a nnotch any faster way todo this, or why does it take so long 10:06
exarkunoly-: Do you have 12 million 1 byte files?10:11
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oly-nope, they will all be in the k regions 10:12
oly-it does not really tell you what its doing, if its uploading speed and howfar through would be useful to know10:13
oly-at least then i would know if its a slow connection, but usually the connection here is fast ie would take a minute or two to transfer 12 mb10:14
oly-actually doing bzr rm file does that stop files uploading, or does it just stop future versions uploading ?10:17
oly-because that could explain it,10:17
oly-if it does not stop the upload10:17
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jam-laptopmthaddon: https://answers.launchpad.net/bzr/+question/7363 has spam again11:17
jam-laptopI thought you blocked that user11:17
mthaddonI did, will do it again... just in the middle of something then I'll get to it11:18
jam-laptopnp11:18
ubotuNew bug: #119011 in launchpad "no way to vote for bugs" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/11901111:21
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mthaddonjam-laptop: user disabled (again?) and comment deleted11:46
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oly-i managed to upload my code onto launch pad, but i made 3 identical copies, how would i go about removing 2 ?11:52
mthaddonoly- if you let me know which ones you want deleted I can take care of that for you11:54
oly-well there all identical so any of the 2, i commited 3 times locally not realising that meant 3 uploads :P11:55
mthaddonwhat's the project?11:56
oly-im a n00b to bazaar as i am sure you can guess11:56
oly-https://code.launchpad.net/~oly/usm/development11:56
mthaddonoly- those aren't separate uploads, they're showing the recent revisions - every time you commit to your branch, that's a revision, and launchpad will track it11:57
oly-is there a way to clear the project completely by the way ?11:57
oly-oh okay, silly me :p11:57
mthaddonI can mark the project inactive if you want me to11:58
oly-na just thinking once i have finished getting the hang of bazaar be nice to clear it and use it properly11:59
mthaddongotcha11:59
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