[12:36] <jordi> hey ajmitch 
[12:36] <ajmitch> hi jordi 
[12:39] <MrKeuner> hi, isn't launchpad free software?
[12:47] <Odd_Bloke> MrKeuner: It is not.
[12:47] <Odd_Bloke> How long should I expect to wait for a bzr branch import to take place?
[12:48] <pochu> MrKeuner: not yet, but it'll be.
[12:48] <pochu> (See the faq)
[12:49] <MrKeuner> pochu: I found it very strange for a project like Ubuntu to have a proprietary license 
[12:49] <MrKeuner> nice to hear that it will be free
[12:49] <MrKeuner> Are the translations I make using launchpad shared with the actual projects themselves?
[12:50] <pochu> MrKeuner: Ubuntu is free. Launchpad isn't.
[12:50] <pochu> They aren't the same thing.
[12:51] <MrKeuner> pochu: I am aware of the difference but still it does not make sense. Shouldn't Ubuntu project be promoting free software?
[12:51] <pochu> MrKeuner: Regarding the translations, I thint it depends. You can translate for Ubuntu. In that case, the translations are used by Ubuntu (though they can reused by upstream). You can also translate for some upstream projects, such us listen, wordpress... In that case, the translations are used by them.
[12:52] <pochu> MrKeuner: There is a good reason why Launchpad isn't free software yet ;)
[12:52] <MrKeuner> pochu: and that's in faq? :)
[12:54] <MrKeuner> Well, I love Ubuntu. But my love for free software is bigger. I cannot see any reason for closing source.
[12:54] <gnomefreak> MrKeuner: yes it is in the faq :)
[12:54] <MrKeuner> or making it non-free
[12:55] <gnomefreak> not all of it is closed
[12:55] <pochu> MrKeuner: Is Launchpad open source? Will it be? in https://launchpad.net/faq
[12:57] <pochu> MrKeuner: Also, look at the question "<popey_> QUESTION: What are you doing to counter the claims that launchpad is evil because it is closed source?" at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/openweekfeisty/askmark2
[12:59] <MrKeuner> So, the reason is that developers cannot make money if the source code is released?
[12:59] <MrKeuner> Did I get it right?
[12:59] <pochu> You didn't :)
[01:00] <MrKeuner> help :)
[01:00] <pochu> if we released it, and 10 people set up their own instances, then the work required to keep track of everything LP keeps track of would go up by 10x
[01:00] <MrKeuner> pochu: what does that mean
[01:01] <pochu> MrKeuner: Launchpad aims to be a centralised bug-tracker, translation interface, buildd...
[01:01] <pochu> So if Ubuntu, Debian, Gentoo, and Upstream uses it (for example). If there's a bug in Ubuntu, you can click "Also affects" and click Debian.
[01:02] <pochu> Then if it affects upstream, click also affects usptream, and the author will have a bug report there.
[01:02] <pochu> It's about sharing information.
[01:02] <MrKeuner> But isn't it possible to not to let third party instances connect to your system?
[01:02] <pochu> But if they release Launchpad, everybody will be able to set it up.
[01:05] <pochu> MrKeuner: look at this, for example: https://help.launchpad.net/FeatureHighlights/MultiProjectBugs
[01:11] <MrKeuner> pochu: I am not sure I got your point. I guess I am a hard learner
[01:11] <MrKeuner> pochu: can't you just not let my instance to use your services?
[01:11] <pochu> MrKeuner: Hmm, but we want you to use Launchpad!
[01:12] <pochu> It's the other way. We don't want you to use your own launchpad (such as launchpad.mydomain.com)
[01:12] <MrKeuner> I will use my instance. And my community will use my instance. But my instance and Canonical instances will be seperate
[01:12] <MrKeuner> pochu: why is that?
[01:12] <pochu> But that's what they want to avoid ^ :)
[01:13] <pochu> MrKeuner: because then the main purpose for Launchpad won't be possible. Which is to share 'knowledge'
[01:13] <MrKeuner> pochu: same is for Wikipedia? 
[01:13] <pochu> e.g. click a button and a bug report affects you too. If you're not using LP, that's not possible for you.
[01:14] <MrKeuner> pochu: but they share their source code and allow seperate instances
[01:14] <pochu> Hmm, I don't know how wikipedia works.
[01:14] <pochu> But they don't share the database, which is the important thing.
[01:14] <MrKeuner> They don't
[01:14] <pochu> The bug reports, the users...
[01:14] <MrKeuner> I do not need them, I need the source code
[01:14] <pochu> But we _do_ want to share it ;)
[01:14] <MrKeuner> and the right to modify it
[01:15] <pochu> You'll have it sooner or later.
[01:15] <pochu> Not yet though.
[01:15] <MrKeuner> pochu: what is wrong with my having the source code of Launchpad, I still cannot get
[01:15] <MrKeuner> but it is OK if you are bored with me :)
[01:16] <pochu> MrKeuner: The problem isn't that you have the code, or that you modify the code, or that you help improve the code. That's OK.
[01:17] <pochu> The problem is that if the code is open sourced, then everybody will set up his own launchpad (as they do with bugzilla).
[01:17] <pochu> And that's not OK.
[01:17] <pochu> I hope you understand it :)
[01:17] <MrKeuner> I would like to distribute it and to run it too. I need all four basic freedoms :)
[01:17] <MrKeuner> No but that's OK. Thanks for your help
[01:18] <pochu> MrKeuner: you are welcome to use it at launchpad.net :)
[01:21] <MrKeuner> pochu: I have translations and bug reports.
[01:21] <MrKeuner> pochu: But did not know that it was not free software
[01:22] <MrKeuner> pochu: did not expect that at all. Still find it strange for a project lik Ubuntu to promote non-free software
[01:22] <MrKeuner> implicitly I mean
[01:22] <crimsun> no, usability for humans seems foremost for Ubuntu.
[01:23] <crimsun> cf. Firefox
[01:23] <crimsun> if Ubuntu's primary stance were Freedom, we'd use ice* instead.
[01:25] <kiko> crimsun, sure makes me feel lucky to be a human :)
[01:26] <crimsun> MrKeuner: I'm afraid I've misunderstood your statement.
[01:26] <pochu> hi kiko :)
[01:27] <MrKeuner> I was trying to stress that Ubuntu project is fed with free software
[01:28] <MrKeuner> If we do not promote free software we cannot go far with non-free software
[01:29] <crimsun> well, I certainly don't claim to understand or even have a inkling regarding the Launchpad plan, but I do know that my resources certainly aren't free, and Free software only carries as far as one finds the opportunity cost in favor of Freedom.
[01:29] <crimsun> anyhow, apologies for the off-topic-ness.
[01:31] <ubotu> New bug: #118867 in launchpad "Don't generate an OOPS for Rosetta's translations unavailable page" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118867
[01:31] <cypherbios> MrKeuner: Launchpad is not Ubuntu-specific
[01:31] <MrKeuner> cypherbios: OK but same people are behinf LP and Ubuntu projects am i wrong?
[01:32] <cypherbios> are different things
[01:32] <crimsun> different projects, different developers
[01:33] <cypherbios> that's right
[01:33] <cypherbios> they have the opportunity to choose what licence they want to offer their software, as you have your right to choose yours (if you have one)
[01:34] <MrKeuner> So creators of LP do not believe in free software but creators of Ubuntu does?
[01:34] <kiko> hey!
[01:35] <ubotu> New bug: #118870 in soyuz "$sourcepackage/+changelog only shows one entry per distrorelease pocket" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118870
[01:36] <ubotu> New bug: #118869 in launchpad "Split out OffsiteFormPostError from "All Exceptions" section of OOPS log" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118869
[01:36] <cypherbios> MrKeuner: LP is a project, and I'm pretty sure they will free the code when they think it's ready or should do that
[01:37] <MrKeuner> I am sure about that too, just trying to see the reasons why they think it is not ready yet
[04:30] <mpt_> Gooooooooooooooooood afternoon Launchpadders!
[04:50] <ubotu> New bug: #118891 in malone "Duplicate bugs still visible in CVE listing" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118891
[05:20] <ubotu> New bug: #118896 in launchpad-answers "+unsupported URL is incompatible with language selector" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118896
[07:36] <LongPointyStick> morning mpt!
[07:46] <slofgren> anyone here that can help login issues
[07:46] <slofgren> I can login to https://launchpad.net but not https://wiki.ubuntu.com
[07:47] <slofgren> Iuse the same email and pass but it does not work
[07:48] <slofgren> I have tried resetting my password on https://launchpad.net/+forgottenpassword
[07:48] <slofgren> that site is direct to by https://wiki.ubuntu.com
[07:53] <slofgren> Hi stub 
[08:10] <ubotu> New bug: #118909 in launchpad "I'm a person, not a brand, and I don't have a logo" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118909
[09:13] <slofgren> anyone here?
[09:13] <slofgren> hehe
[09:14] <carlos> morning
[09:15] <Hobbsee> hi carlos 
[09:40] <ubotu> New bug: #118915 in malone "IntegrityError trying to approve a bug nomination" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118915
[11:01] <ubotu> New bug: #118923 in malone "hwdb-gui is not asking whether hibernation and suspend work" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118923
[12:00] <ubotu> New bug: #118929 in soyuz ""Page not found" error clicking on version number in per version source package page" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118929
[02:20] <cprov> morning folks .
[02:22] <Hobbsee> morning cprov 
[03:53] <statik> me
[03:54] <salgado> thanks for the reminder statik!
[03:55] <bac> y'all are a little eager today
[03:55] <barry> too much coffee i guess
[04:00] <salgado> welcome to this week's non-au reviewer meeting
[04:00] <bac> n
[04:00] <salgado> who's here?
[04:00] <barry> me
[04:00] <bac> me
[04:00] <ubotu> New bug: #118954 in soyuz "Component table needs description column" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118954
[04:00] <statik> me
[04:01] <salgado> BjornT and flacoste are on sprints and send apologies 
[04:01] <salgado> == Agenda ==
[04:01] <salgado>  * Roll call
[04:01] <salgado>  * Next meeting
[04:01] <salgado>  * Queue status.
[04:01] <salgado> next meeting, same time next week. any objections?
[04:02] <salgado> I take that as a no
[04:02] <salgado> the queue is starting to get huge, with big branches
[04:03] <barry> yeah, i saw the general queue this morning.  whoa
[04:04] <statik> I let my reviews stack up, but I will be clearing them today (just sent one)
[04:04] <salgado> does any reviewers have sprints scheduled for the next week?
[04:04] <barry> not me
[04:04] <bac> no
[04:04] <salgado> I think we'll need to do a coordinated effort next week, otherwise most of the fixes won't be ready for 1.1.6
[04:04] <salgado> (I'm assuming all branches there are for 1.1.6 stuff)
[04:05] <statik> no sprint next week
[04:05] <barry> salgado: i wonder if we shouldn't add a bit of metadata to the branch description on PendingReviews which says what release the branch is targeted for?
[04:06] <barry> unless it's unlikely we'll see branches that aren't specifically for the next release (whatever that happens to be)
[04:06] <salgado> yeah, I think that's a good idea
[04:06] <barry> something like: "LP release: 1.1.x"
[04:07] <salgado> or target release
[04:07] <salgado> or something like that
[04:07] <barry> salgado: that's better, yep
[04:07] <salgado> again, if nobody objects I'll change the wikipage and email launchpad@
[04:07] <barry> +1
[04:08] <barry> the rationale is that it lets reviewers prioritize their reviews as the release nears
[04:08] <salgado> right
[04:09] <salgado> so, any other business from anybody?
[04:09] <barry> couple of things...
[04:09] <barry> how have pre-impl phone calls been going? 
[04:10] <salgado> I had one with flacoste
[04:10] <barry> has anybody done them?  have your branch submitters done them?
[04:10] <bac> all of my submitters have done them
[04:10] <salgado> I don't have many of them because I have kiko on the next room here, so I usually go chat with him
[04:10] <statik> haven't done any or gotten any, two of my branches claim to have done them
[04:11] <barry> salgado: you should call kiko on the phone :)
[04:11] <barry> kidding
[04:11] <barry> have they been phone calls or irc?  how have the phone calls gone (as far as you know)?
[04:11] <barry> any positive or negative feedback about them?
[04:11] <salgado> the only phone call I had with flacoste went pretty good, I thought
[04:12] <statik> I've gotten no feedback. I expect that preimpl calls will be useful for me
[04:13] <barry> okay, cool.  second question:
[04:13] <bac> i did one with steve before the requirement and it went very well
[04:13] <barry> bac: excellent.  steve is a great person to review with
[04:14] <barry> second question: how long should we leave a needs-reply branch in our queue?  is it our responsibility to bug the submitter to DO SOMETHING with their branch?
[04:14] <bac> barry: my understanding, from what is on the wiki, is the branch owner is responsible for moving the review, and pushing it along when it gets stalled.
[04:15] <salgado> in general I don't worry about them, but that's not nice from the submitters because we invested effort to review it and then they forgot about that work
[04:15] <barry> i'm happy to leave needs-reply and merge_* branches in my queue.  makes it look like i have more branches to deal with than i actually do <wink>
[04:15] <bac> barry: but a nudge wouldn't hurt
[04:15] <salgado> meaning we may have to review it all again later
[04:15] <barry> salgado: good point
[04:16] <barry> bac: i think i'll start nudging politely :)
[04:16] <barry> ok, done.
[04:17] <salgado> I guess that's it then
[04:17] <salgado> thanks everybody for coming
[04:17] <bac> thanks salgado 
[04:17] <barry> thanks salgado, cheers
[04:21] <ubotu> New bug: #118957 in launchpad-answers ""Unsupported" report should show the question language" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118957
[04:30] <ubotu> New bug: #118958 in soyuz "Prevent commercial component from being probed on mirrors" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118958
[05:10] <ubotu> New bug: #118962 in soyuz "Prevent the new commercial component from updating Ubuntu archive" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118962
[06:41] <ubotu> New bug: #118976 in launchpad "Source IP of site visitors not currently reported in Launchpad logs" [Critical,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118976
[07:33] <oly-> could someone point me at a tutorial, or help me with setting up a bazaar branch on launchpad ?
[07:52] <oly-> scratch that think i have got my code uploaded, was using wrong username :p
[08:08] <Rinchen> matsubara, fyi 118991
[08:08] <Rinchen> I tagged it as fif
[08:11] <ubotu> New bug: #118991 in launchpad "Misleading wording on Milestone Overview" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118991
[08:16] <matsubara> Rinchen: thanks. confirmed
[09:05] <oly-> could someone help me upload my code to bazaar, i ran the push command the branch got created but it gets displayed as empty 
[09:06] <tsmithe> oly-, i doubt they can "upload" it for you
[09:06] <oly-> why would this be, bzr status lists my files, so not sure why it says empty 
[09:06] <tsmithe> but they can check it out :P
[09:06] <oly-> do not want it uploaded for me, want to know what i am doing wrong 
[09:06] <oly-> probably me :p
[09:07] <oly-> i did a bzr init, then a bzr add then tryed the push 
[09:07] <tsmithe> well, i think it looks like you did everything right
[09:07] <tsmithe> ah
[09:07] <tsmithe> did you commit?
[09:07] <oly-> i did try but that just opens up a list of my files in nano
[09:08] <tsmithe> that usually suggests a conflict that needs resolving
[09:08] <radix> oly-: wait, "bzr status" lists your fileS?
[09:08] <oly-> yep, guessing thats locally though 
[09:08] <radix> oly-: "bzr status" should only show changes that *aren't* in the branch
[09:08] <radix> right
[09:08] <radix> do you need to 'bzr add' some files?
[09:09] <oly-> i did bzr add, i read that adds all files and forlders
[09:09] <radix> yep
[09:09] <radix> oly-: then you need to 'bzr commit'  to get it saved to your branch
[09:09] <tsmithe> -m "comment"
[09:09] <radix> oly-: then you need to 'bzr push <URL>' to upload it
[09:10] <oly-> yeah, but bzr commit just opens nano, is that supposed to happen ?
[09:10] <radix> oly-: yes, you're supposed to type in a description of the changes you made
[09:10] <radix> oly-: then save it and quit the editor
[09:10] <ubotu> New bug: #118998 in launchpad "Launchpad's Bug Report Page has badly formatted aspects" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118998
[09:10] <radix> oly-: or, as tsmithe points out, you can type 'bzr commit -m "description"' to specify the description on the command line
[09:10] <radix> I often type lengthy commit messages, so I prefer to use the editor :-)
[09:11] <oly-> okay will try that 
[09:12] <oly-> actually, if i submit a file by accident can i remove all traces of it ?
[09:12] <oly-> i think the commit worked this time it said committed revision 1
[09:42] <oly-> does this fetch phase, on a push take a while ?
[09:42] <oly-> the progress bar does not seem to move,
[09:49] <jelmer> oly-: yeah, it can take a while if used over a dumb transport (sftp, for example)
[09:49] <oly-> yeah using it over sftp, it stuck on phase 1/4 and the bar is not moving
[09:50] <oly-> if i did it right its only 12mb, if i did it wrong it 90mb :p
[09:50] <oly-> but i am starting to think its crashed
[09:51] <oly-> will leave it a bit longer and see
[10:06] <oly-> it mved a nnotch any faster way todo this, or why does it take so long 
[10:11] <exarkun> oly-: Do you have 12 million 1 byte files?
[10:12] <oly-> nope, they will all be in the k regions 
[10:13] <oly-> it does not really tell you what its doing, if its uploading speed and howfar through would be useful to know
[10:14] <oly-> at least then i would know if its a slow connection, but usually the connection here is fast ie would take a minute or two to transfer 12 mb
[10:17] <oly-> actually doing bzr rm file does that stop files uploading, or does it just stop future versions uploading ?
[10:17] <oly-> because that could explain it,
[10:17] <oly-> if it does not stop the upload
[11:17] <jam-laptop> mthaddon: https://answers.launchpad.net/bzr/+question/7363 has spam again
[11:17] <jam-laptop> I thought you blocked that user
[11:18] <mthaddon> I did, will do it again... just in the middle of something then I'll get to it
[11:18] <jam-laptop> np
[11:21] <ubotu> New bug: #119011 in launchpad "no way to vote for bugs" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/119011
[11:46] <mthaddon> jam-laptop: user disabled (again?) and comment deleted
[11:52] <oly-> i managed to upload my code onto launch pad, but i made 3 identical copies, how would i go about removing 2 ?
[11:54] <mthaddon> oly- if you let me know which ones you want deleted I can take care of that for you
[11:55] <oly-> well there all identical so any of the 2, i commited 3 times locally not realising that meant 3 uploads :P
[11:56] <mthaddon> what's the project?
[11:56] <oly-> im a n00b to bazaar as i am sure you can guess
[11:56] <oly-> https://code.launchpad.net/~oly/usm/development
[11:57] <mthaddon> oly- those aren't separate uploads, they're showing the recent revisions - every time you commit to your branch, that's a revision, and launchpad will track it
[11:57] <oly-> is there a way to clear the project completely by the way ?
[11:57] <oly-> oh okay, silly me :p
[11:58] <mthaddon> I can mark the project inactive if you want me to
[11:59] <oly-> na just thinking once i have finished getting the hang of bazaar be nice to clear it and use it properly
[11:59] <mthaddon> gotcha