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pygihey mdz_ 12:14
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LordLimecatis there a known bug whereby if ubuntu crashes, theres a chance syslog will have a line filled with "^@" on it, causing gnome-system-log to crash?12:36
LordLimecatits happened twice, and removing the offendign line (thru nano, since gedit is also unable to read the file) seems to fix the issue12:37
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LordLimecatif its of any help, its writing 1745 or 1746 bytes worth of 0x0s to the following logs: /var/log/messages    /var/log/syslog     /var/log/kern.log01:00
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mdzLordLimecat: I have never seen such behaviour; it could be caused by filesystem corruption01:07
LordLimecatyea, well, its possibly because upon returning to comp (both times) it wasnt responding, so i tried alt+sysrq+x, no response....01:07
LordLimecatso i did alt+sysrq+b01:07
LordLimecat.,....and rebooted01:07
elmoit's fairly common on a system crash, unless you use data=journal01:08
elmoand if you use xfs, it's basically a given01:08
LordLimecatbut the exact same thing, same data written, same quantity01:08
LordLimecat1745 bytes worth of 0s01:08
LordLimecatcant be random01:08
LordLimecat...can it?01:08
elmo(it == the 0x0's in files that are open and being written to at time of crash)01:08
LordLimecatwell, there was data written RIGHT before system went down, after the 0s--01:09
LordLimecatnoting that a reboot was requested01:09
mjg59Which filesystem do you use?01:09
LordLimecati MAY have changed its writeback01:09
LordLimecathow do i check quickly01:09
mjg59Eh. Data is certainly not guaranteed to be there if you don't reboot cleanly01:09
mjg59Before doing sysrq+b, do sysrq+s01:10
LordLimecatcouldnt :( couldnt get to terminal01:10
LordLimecatoh, i generally do that01:10
LordLimecat...but didnt this time01:10
LordLimecatis there a way to...like..bump it to init 1 with a system call?01:10
kylemthe problem is likely that the oops output you see is being written01:10
LordLimecatso this isnt really a bug?01:11
kylemand since it's the same oops, will always be the same length...01:11
kylemit's a bug that gnome-system-log is crashing.01:11
LordLimecatlol, yea, it was a PITA to track it down01:11
LordLimecatluckily, gedit also refuses to open the files01:11
LordLimecatmakes it easy to find01:11
LordLimecat...is it a bad idea to make a script that finds and removes 1745 0s from those 3  logs?01:12
LordLimecatcould that cause any damage?01:12
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thullyhi - I'm a MacBook user and wondered who I would get in contact with about getting some of the bugs relating to it fixed in Gutsy...03:00
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jmlthully: your best starting place is searching Launchpad's Ubuntu section for the specific bugs you've encountered.03:01
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thullyI've looked at the bugs, and responded, and heard nothing in months03:03
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thullyOne bug is 92635 (MacBook doesn't sleep) - I've got a temporary kernel fix,  and it seems like something could be done for Gutsy03:18
superm1BenC, ping03:23
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thullydoes anyone know how I can get in touch with the Ubuntu kernel/laptop team about getting the issues with macBooks - many of which I know the issue and have some ideas about solutions - fixed in Gutsy04:33
thullythe bugs have all been reported long ago04:33
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mneptokthully: LP is the mechanism by whcih such things are done04:43
thullyI haven't managed to get any response via that channel...04:49
mneptokbug #?04:50
persiathully: If you have a solution, try attaching a patch against the ubuntu git repository to the bug, and adding the patch tag.04:50
thullywell, the solution is kind of hackish at this point 04:51
thully92635 is the bug # - me and some others have used the mentioned workaround patch to get suspend on first-generation MacBooks04:52
thullyFor some reason, 1g MacBooks are funky with their suspend...04:52
thullyI also was going to comment on - but I can't find the bug # off hand, though it has been reported - the absolutely craptastic state of the appletouch driver04:54
mneptokthat's not a bug, though04:55
mneptokthat's a feature request04:55
thullyit is a bug, as it is SO craptastic that you can't change the mouse pointer acceleration - something you can do even with dumb old usbhid04:55
mneptokupstream has acknowledged this as a bug?04:57
thullyI haven't contacted upstream - all I know is that appletouch as shipped w/ Feisty doesn't let you change pointer acceleration04:57
thullyright now, I'm actually running in VMware as I got sick of the issues - figure I may download gutsy and install on the bare metal tonight to check on these issues04:58
mneptokdoes it have the cntrols to do so, but just doesn't do it?04:58
thullyyes - if you go into GNOME's mouse control panel - or Xorg.conf - and change the acceleration, nothing happens04:59
mneptokare you on the Macbook now?05:08
thullyyes - I don't have a raw install right now, though, as I just got it back from repairs and it was wiped by Apple05:16
thullyI could install Feisty now, or I could get a Gutsy ISO (would have to be later - am on satellite with strict bandwidth caps) and try that05:17
thullyBTW, just reported the trackpad issue - 11996405:18
mneptoksudo rmmod appletouch && sudo modprobe appletouch05:26
mneptokthat may clear up some Appletouch woes. try it next time you're in Ubuntu.05:27
thullyI could try the Feisty live CD in a few minutes if that would help...05:28
mneptokup to you. i'm not a maintainer for any of that stuff. ;)05:29
mneptokjust something to try.05:30
mneptokand if you narrow it to the kernel module, you're making progress.05:30
thullyOK - I figure I can find out some from the Feisty live CD - I'll get the Gutsy one if it seems I may be able to learn more that way05:31
johanbrthully: It's possible you'll have more luck in #ubuntu-kernel .05:33
thullyOK - wondered if there was a "kernel" channel...05:33
thullyAlso, on a (somewhat-unrelated) note, is VMware considered a supported configuration for running/testing Ubuntu in general?  I'm using it ATM because my hardware works better and I can switch OSes fast (still use OS X a lot - I like both OSes)05:35
thullyobviously not for testing issues w/ MacBook hardware (like the aforementioned appletouch issues) but just in general05:36
johanbrthully: I don't know. My guess is that it would depend on the sort of bug you encounter. For higher-level bugs I'd think it'd be okay, but as you say not for kernel/hardware things.05:41
thullywell, it does seem like kernel/hardware issues would be valid - though my hardware would basically be a VMware VM instead of the actual machine I'm running on05:42
mneptokthully: the kernel speaks to hardware. VMWare is not hardware.05:45
mneptokthully: an abstraction layer between the kernel and metal is nothing but a DIStraction layer when reporting bugs.05:45
johanbrRight. My guess would be that the kernel developers might just say "vmware is closed source, we have no way of knowing which bugs the virtualization introduces". If you really want to know, you should ask them, though.05:46
mneptokVMWare cannot keep accurate time. even with ntpd installed.05:46
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mneptoklet that inform your thinking about VMWare's relationship to hardware.05:47
johanbrIf you really want to view vmware as hardware, it's not on the list of supported architectures, in any case.05:47
mneptokVMWare *is* hardware when it comes to its interactions with the kernel.05:48
thullyI see, I knew that would come up.  05:48
mneptok(gross oversimplification, but the sentiment is valid)05:48
thullyI wouldn't be filing many kernel bugs in any case - most of them I'd test would be bare metal bugs (like appletouch)05:48
mneptokthully: VMWare can't keep its clock straight. you want to report issues with input device timings?05:49
mneptokthully: Appletouch is hardware. the kernel talks to hardware. VMWare stands between the kernel and hardware ....05:49
thullyappletouch isn't in vmware - those were two totally separate issues05:50
thullysorry for confusing everyone05:51
thullyI just meant in general if I were to use VMware at some point and file bugs - not using vmware to test macbook hardware bugs05:52
mneptokeh, if everyone apologised every time i didn't understand coherent English, IRC would be nothing but "sorry, mnep"05:52
mneptokjust be sure to mention VMWare's place in the recipe when appropriate. :)05:52
thullyI realized that it was pretty much like its own hardware05:53
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thullyOK - thanks - figure I'll reboot onto bare metal Ubuntu and try some things with appletouch05:58
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thullyfor those of you who were on when I was discussing my appletouch problem - I've discovered that an rmmod and modprobe of the module fixes the issue until X is restarted06:32
thullyafter X is restarted, you have to do it again if you want proper acceleration06:33
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fabbionemorning guys06:38
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pygimorning fabbione 06:42
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=== StevenK waves to fabbione
fabbionehi pygi 06:51
fabbioneStevenK: you got mail06:51
StevenKfabbione: I'm not not so sure that tig and lyx are too blame.06:51
fabbionenope.. they are not06:51
fabbioneyou will have to ask sysadmin help here to see what's happening in the buildds06:51
fabbioneand unfortunately i can't help you there06:52
=== StevenK nods.
StevenKI saw this problem a few days ago, with all buildds doing the same thing, spinning with no logs and not changing state. I'm suspecting a LP bug.06:52
fabbioneoh well just ask for rescheduling06:53
fabbioneit might have been the congestion thingy on LP06:53
fabbioneanyway you know they build06:53
StevenKOkay, so bug $BUILDD_PERSON for a requeue of lyx and tig on sparc. That's fine.06:54
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Hobbseemorning all!07:00
pygiheya Hobbsee :)07:03
=== desrt is desperately trying to get from manchester to nijmegen without spending a fortune
Hobbseegood luck with that.  walk? swim?07:04
desrti wanted to take the train, but that's just ridiculous.07:05
desrtand i'll have some luggage.... so swimming is probably a bad idea.07:05
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Hobbseepygi: mpt is probably better to eat.07:14
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pygiHobbsee, but no!07:14
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Hobbseepygi: why no?07:15
pygino idea, just because =)07:15
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=== Hobbsee has very little body fat, therefore would nto roast up well
pygiyour point? :P07:16
Hobbseeunless you're into bones, of course.07:16
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pygiI'll be back07:17
pygimath exam07:17
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Hobbseepygi: have fun.  make up lots of rubbish07:18
mptHobbsee, are you calling me fat?07:19
Hobbseempt: no, i'm calling you bigger than me.07:19
Hobbseempt: which, seeing as racarr was the only one smaller than me, isnt hard.07:19
Hobbsee(at UDS)07:19
Hobbseethere's a difference.07:19
fabbioneon the node.. it's not difficult to be bigger than Hobbsee :)))07:25
fabbionethe problem is if you are more thin than she is... you might consider a doctor appointment ;)07:25
StevenKOr a career as a supermodel.07:26
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HobbseeStevenK: i'm not pretty enough to do that :P07:26
mptI wasn't at UDS, but I'm pretty small07:27
fabbionempt: still slightly larger than Hobbsee :)07:27
fabbionempt: i met both of you...07:28
mptWe shall find out for sure at the next UDS :-)07:28
fabbionempt: you could probably handle my weight on you...07:28
fabbioneshe would crack :P07:28
Hobbseempt: not in boston07:28
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mptfabbione, not a chance07:28
Hobbseempt: i'm thin enough that a person like seveas could easily break my wrist, if he tried hard enough07:28
fabbionempt: i lost since last we met :)07:28
mptFatherhood is hard work?07:29
fabbionempt: and another bunch of reasons07:29
fabbionempt: remember i haven't been feeling very well recently.. so that adds up07:29
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shawarmaI'm looking at the squid merge. Apart from the stuff that's mentioned in the last changelog, the patch that MoM has created also contains a bunch of translation releated stuff. Now, since the last patch (the one between our previous version and the debian version on which it's based) did not contain any of that stuff, I don't quite get where it came from? It may just be because I have absolutely no idea how all our translation stuff is handled.08:40
Hobbseeshawarma: i believe that launchpad automaticlaly updates the translations on build, or something.  it's thru launchpad, regardless.08:41
shawarmaHobbsee: But that does not interfere with source packages in any way, I suppose?08:42
Hobbseei'm not sure08:42
shawarmaI don't see how it could since they're signed and all that.08:42
Burgundaviashawarma: talk to pitti, he set up the language pack stuff08:42
shawarmaBurgundavia: Right.08:43
shawarmaBurgundavia: How's it going? New job yet?08:45
Burgundavianot yet08:46
shawarmaBurgundavia: On purpose?08:46
Burgundaviasadly, not08:46
Burgundaviaalthough quitting was very much "on purpose"08:46
shawarmaYes, my keen jedi senses told me that, too.08:47
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xipietotec_are there any plans in ubuntu+x releases to use suspend2?08:54
Hobbseexipietotec_: not unless it gets into the main kernel, iirc.08:54
Hobbseecheck what the mailing lists say on it (ubuntu-devel, ubuntu-devel-discuss) - the archives are tehre08:54
xipietotec_ah, gotcha. duh, that makes sense. </me hopes it gets in...because I'm not really looking at running a patched kernel, pfft>08:55
Burgundaviaxipietotec_: it is the kind of thing that needs to get upstream, unless it provided such amazing functionality as to require the huge delta09:02
xipietotec_Well, evidently it works *better* than normal hibernate09:03
Burgundaviagiven how much laptop support has been a priority for Ubuntu and the fact that it isn't in basically means it ain't comin' until upstream gets it09:04
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dholbachgood morning09:06
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Burgundaviahey dholbach09:07
dholbachhiya Burgundavia09:07
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pygihey folks09:18
Hobbseehiya pygi, how was maths?09:18
pygiHobbsee, easy, but I won't pass sadly09:19
pygiI blame my complete of interest in the subject09:19
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pygiHobbsee, want to upload a debdiff so I don't have to bug mvo when he's around? ;)09:19
Hobbseeawww.  it's useful to pass09:19
pygiit is ofcourse completely acceptable and working :)09:19
Hobbseeand a debdiff for what?09:19
pygino kidding :P09:20
pygibrasero package09:20
Hobbseeoh ick.09:20
=== Hobbsee should go study
pygiHobbsee, then go ^_^09:21
pygiand pass things, unlike me :)09:21
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dholbachhey mvo09:23
mvohey dholbach09:23
Hobbseehiya mvo 09:23
Hobbseeooh, if mvo is here, i can ask him about my plans for dput.09:24
StevenKYou have plans for dput?09:24
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mvohey Hobbsee!09:24
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HobbseeStevenK: i know, i saw :)09:24
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=== mvo wonders what kind of plans
Hobbseemvo: it seems that no ubuntu system, including upload.ubuntu.com and revu, allow you to use dcut09:25
Hobbseemvo: so siretart and myself are thinking of putting in a message saying that "this does not apply to ubuntu systems" or something09:25
StevenKThat's do-able.09:26
Hobbseethat's what i thought09:26
Hobbseesome o fit's in bzr too, not the latest version though.  no idea why.09:26
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shawarmaHobbsee: No ubuntu system allows you to use dput? Um... WhaT?09:35
StevenKshawarma: Not dput, *dcut*09:35
Hobbseeshawarma: dcut.09:36
=== Hobbsee checks that she wrote dcut.
Hobbseeoh yes, i did.09:36
shawarmaStevenK: Ah, I just saw the "dput*" thing, and didn't notice it wasnt' Hobbsee saying it. :)09:36
=== Hobbsee blames pygi
Hobbseeshawarma: i'm not *usually* an idiot.09:36
pygiHobbsee, what did I do this time?!?!09:36
Hobbseeshawarma: so i wont usually say stupid stuff like that09:36
shawarmaHobbsee: I *was* kind of puzzled.09:37
pygiHobbsee, nop, your fault09:37
Hobbseeshawarma: then again, i did ask "is a package still in the new queue" without just looking it up.09:38
shawarmaHobbsee: That's not stupid. That's just lazy, which is entirely different and entirely alright.09:38
Hobbseeshawarma: what's stupid about it is that i didnt even think of it.09:39
Hobbseegetting the rejected mail was a red herring, so confused me :P09:39
Hobbsee(and the powers that be say "we gave her core because...?")09:40
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pygihey giskard :009:45
giskardhello pygi  :)09:45
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pygigiskard, how is it going?09:46
giskardbad, in 10 days i have my final school exam09:47
pygimeh, I just had math exam09:48
pygiwas bad :p09:48
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KeybukI am absolutely delighted with my discovery that there is such a thing as the "International Standard Atmosphere"09:54
Hobbseethe what?09:55
cjwatsonshawarma: merge-o-matic does some translation merging with specialised tools, which is nice if you actually changed the translations but an interference if you didn't; if those diffs are pointless, ditch them09:55
Hobbseehaha, cool09:55
seb128hey Keybuk09:56
cjwatsonmneptok: we use VMware fairly extensively internally for testing, so on a practical level it's a good idea for us to accept at least some number of bugs about it09:56
shawarmacjwatson: Cool. Thanks.09:56
seb128Keybuk: so you gave compiz to mvo? ;)09:56
Keybukheh, was just /msg'ing you about that :p09:56
KeybukHobbsee: it's to do with how plane altimeters work09:56
Hobbseeyeah, i wikipedia'd.09:56
cjwatsonHobbsee: in an ideal world, a reject would always be accompanied by a mail09:57
cjwatsonan explanatory one rather than the LP standard "kthxbye" one09:57
Hobbseecjwatson: indeed.09:58
Hobbseecjwatson: but it makes enough sense, as is.  unless you screw it up originally09:58
cjwatsonHobbsee: unfortunately, there's a long-standing bug in soyuz noting that the reject interface doesn't let us give a reason, so it relies on the rejecting archive admin remembering to fish out all the e-mail addresses and send mails by hand09:58
cjwatsonwhich, in the case of bulk things like de-duplication, is less likely09:58
Hobbseecjwatson: ahhh, okay.  fair enough09:58
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tepsipakkikeyutils is in universe, is that why krb5 doesn't build?10:08
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Hobbseetepsipakki: yes10:09
tepsipakkiHobbsee: okay, I'll file a MIR10:09
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siretartHobbsee: I'd have no problems with removing that message completely10:29
=== Hobbsee nods
siretartHobbsee: because the set of people who would be using an ubuntu dput to upload to debian normally would know about dcut, I think10:29
siretartHobbsee: but changing it is fine to me as well10:30
Hobbseeright....that's a point10:30
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Hobbseesiretart: um, about REVU - what's the "official" way to get something out of the rejected queue?10:30
Hobbseei've just been moving the changes file up a directory, but i've got no idea what's supposed to happen10:30
dholbachKeybuk: "Ow! You broke my nose!" - very funny :)10:30
crimsunI'll reprocess it10:30
Hobbseesiretart: seems to work, at least some of the time.10:31
siretartHobbsee: the script who processes the incoming directory is /srv/revu1-production/scripts/process_uploads.sh. it is run from revu1's crontab every 5 minutes10:32
Hobbseesiretart: right10:32
Keybukdholbach: I wasn't going to even start on the fact that using 1024 multiples for disk or storage devices is wrong anyway, and disks are measured in thousands, millions & billions of bytes10:33
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Hobbseesiretart: persia probably wants/needs access to resync the keyring, etc, too - he's diong a lot of reviewing.10:33
Hobbseesiretart: i dont think you and him have actually been around at the same time, though10:33
dholbachKeybuk: seems like a good move as the topic is quite suitable for flame wars10:34
Keybukit's cold today <g>10:34
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dholbachKeybuk: my dog love you for that, if it was true10:35
cjwatsonKeybuk: you'd get on well with the partman author10:35
Keybukcjwatson: heh10:36
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cjwatsonthere's a special note in the ubiquity partman frontend that has to say "this is measured in 1000000, not 1048576" or words to that effect10:36
Keybukit's true, disk manufactures do actually use 1000 byte multiple, not 102410:36
cjwatsonexcept sometimes they use a mix10:36
cjwatson1024000 and that sort of thing10:37
Keybukheh, yeah, sometimes they like to use thousands and millions of 1024 bytes10:37
Keybukpersonally I think that kilo, mega, giga are the only way forward10:37
HobbseeKeybuk: and rid the world of crappy imperial measurements, and timezones, while you're at it, please.10:37
Keybukbecause they by saying "this drive has a capacity of 100GB (100 billion bytes)", you're guaranteeing the minimum number of bytes it is likely to have :p10:37
Keybuktrying to be more specific is just guess-work10:38
hungerKeybuk: KB is defined as 1000Byte (MB as 1000KB, and so forth).10:39
hungerKeybuk: No guesswork required.10:39
hungerKeybuk: 1024Bytes are a KiB.10:39
cjwatsonthat's a retcon though10:40
hungerThere actually is a international standard about that stuff...10:41
cjwatsonit is unarguably not what KB has always meant, and thus guesswork is required.10:41
Keybukhunger: there's an international standard cup of tea, that doesn't mean you can't drink coffee10:41
hungerKeybuk: Of course not. But then you as the distribution guys need to fix it;-)10:41
Keybukyeah, I think we should put this to the technical board ...10:42
KeybukI vote for "use KB and MB and GB everywhere, and eradicate all uses of KiB, MiB and GiB because they cause confusion"10:42
mptbecause we have nothing better to do?10:42
hungerKeybuk: Yes, rage against the standards!10:42
Keybukhunger: stupid standards, yes10:43
Keybukjust because someone wrote a "standard", doesn't mean it's right10:43
hungerKeybuk: Well, it tries to end the confusion you complained about. Just sticking to "we always did it that way" will not do it.10:43
Keybukespecially when the person wrote a standard didn't reference the current practice10:44
cjwatsonthe "KiB" standard has caused more confusion than the prior practice did10:44
Keybukthat's like "I have a better idea how to do this, if I write a standard, then people will obey me!  muahahaha!"10:44
Keybuka bit like the IRC standard, actually10:44
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hungerWell, do whatever you want. You'll do so anyway;-)10:45
Keybukhunger: in general, I've found that places that refer to things as KiB are using the wrong unit anyway10:45
Keybukworst offenders using it to refer to disk space, or bandwidth, etc.10:45
hungerKeybuk: I have not made that experience yet.10:46
Keybukthe primary advantage to KB is that, in the worst case, it slightly under-estimates10:46
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Keybukhunger: the main place I see it is in ifconfig10:46
hungerKeybuk: Diskspace is traditionally in MB/GB... which started the whole mess.10:46
Keybukto measure bandwidth10:46
Keybukwhich is so utterly bogus, it's funny10:46
Keybukbandwidth should be measured in thousands, millions, etc. of bytes10:46
Burgundaviawhat shocks me is just how much effort people have put into this whole thing10:47
Burgundaviathere are huge threads on both ubuntu and debian-devel10:47
hungerKeybuk: Why is it bogus? If it is the proper unit for the thing they measure it is fine.10:47
Keybukhunger: that's the point, it isn;t10:47
seb128Burgundavia: "huge"? you don't read debian-devel often, do you? ;)10:47
Burgundaviaseb128: right, moderately large :)10:47
Burgundaviahuge would be an Ubuntu flamewar10:47
Burgundaviaanti-ubuntu, that is10:48
hungerKeybuk: Yes. I don't care how it is measured, as long as the proper unit of measurement is given.10:48
Keybukhunger: and in this case, the wrong unit of measurement is given10:48
Keybukhunger: which is the case with every instance of Ki I've ever seen10:48
hungerKeybuk: So far I had no trouble with that. All Ki I noticed so far (and that does *not* include ifconfig;-) seemed to be properly 1024 based.10:49
Keybukhunger: inappropriately 1024 basde10:49
Keybukhunger: ie. using multiples of 1024 for things that should be multiples of 100010:49
hungerKeybuk: This discussion is a bit like using inches or centimeters.10:50
Keybukexactly ;)  let's standardise on centimetres!10:50
Keybuk(and spell it right :p)10:50
hungerKeybuk: As long as the proper unit is attached I do not really care. I just don't like the KiB on 1000 based values (never encountered those) or KB being based on 1024 (happens a lot).10:51
Keybukit shouldn't be KiB anyway10:51
Keybukit should by kiB10:51
hungerKeybuk: right.10:52
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Keybukwe could solve this with Unicode!10:52
hungerActually I usually do not even care wether 1000 or 1024 is the base... as long as enough free space is available to store my stuff;-)10:53
Keybukhunger: right, in which case you should always use 1000 as the base, because then in the worst case you have more space than quoted10:53
=== hunger sighs. Unicode rocks.
Keybukusing 1024 or 1024000 means you could have less space than quoted10:53
ubotuSeveas has a popular 3rd party repository for several packages. More info (and mirrors) on http://wiki.ubuntu.com/SeveasPackages10:54
hungerOnly ignorant US citizens speak up against unicode;-)10:55
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shawarmahunger: You'd be surprised..10:56
KeybukI never said anything bad about Univode10:56
Keybukuh, code10:56
shawarmahunger: I know a handful of {free,open}bsd people who absolutely refuse to use anything but iso-8859-*10:56
Keybukshawarma: well, they use BSD, they're already swimming against the tides of inevitability ;)10:57
hungershawarma: ignarant bastards... "I do not need more than 256letters, why should anybody else?"10:57
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shawarmahunger: It's a *very* frustrating discussion. I've had it with them many times now. Their argument always goes something like "Whaaaa! I once saw one of my 's that didn't look right because someone used utf-8.. Whaaa!"11:00
hungershawarma: I can imagine:-(11:00
tepsipakkithen there are applications that don't work with utf.. like Tectia ssh-client for windows11:02
tepsipakkiwhich is maybe the biggest obstacle for utf adoption here11:03
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mjrThere's putty...11:04
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tepsipakkimjr: true, it works11:05
pittiGood morning11:05
Hobbseecopy/pasting is just weird in it, though11:05
Hobbseehiya pitti!11:05
hungertepsipakki: Yes, let's head back to stoneage... at least everything worked back then.11:05
tepsipakkinow, it has to be decided do we change tectia to putty&winscp and modify all the documentation there is11:05
cjwatsoncopy/pasting in putty is X normal11:05
=== pitti hugs Hobbsee
tepsipakkihunger: rather, stay there :)11:06
=== Hobbsee hugs pitti :)
cjwatsonthere's a configuration option to switch it to a more Windows-ish behaviour if you prefer that11:06
Hobbseecjwatson: ahhh.  i must find that.  actually, i tihnk i did, one day11:06
tepsipakkicjwatson: yep11:06
fabbionemvo: ping?11:06
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tepsipakkitectia will be fixed early next year, but it's too late if we are to adopt nfsv411:07
tepsipakkianyway, offtopic :)11:07
tepsipakkimvo: I just confirmed the app-install-data install failure bug11:08
mvohello fabbione11:08
mvotepsipakki: what bugnumber?11:08
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fabbionemvo: hey dude..11:08
fabbionemvo: Accepted redhat-cluster-suite 2.20070503-0ubuntu3 (source)11:08
fabbionemvo:    * Kill libccs-dev binary package. Nothing B-D on it anymore and it will be11:08
fabbione     killed upstream too at somepoint.11:08
tepsipakkimvo: a sec, didn't subscribe to it :P11:08
fabbionemvo: have fun :)11:08
fabbionemvo: just give it time to build and you should be good11:09
tepsipakkimvo: bug 11874011:09
ubotuLaunchpad bug 118740 in app-install-data-ubuntu "app-install-data :  Can't import AppInstall.CoreMenu, aborting" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/11874011:09
mvofabbione: cool! my upstream change the name for libccs as well :) 11:09
fabbionemvo: perfect...11:09
mvotepsipakki: you get a postinst failure ?11:10
mvotepsipakki: can you please put the exact error output from dpkg into the bugreport11:10
tepsipakkimvo: that's all I see (netboot)11:11
tepsipakkithe same message, that is11:11
tepsipakkimvo: um, actually the package apparently installs fine, but pkgsel fails11:12
mvotepsipakki: so this happens when you try to install a fresh gutsy? ok, I will try to reproduce11:14
cjwatsonwhy would pkgsel be involved in an upgrade?11:14
tepsipakkicjwatson: this was a fresh install11:14
cjwatsonyou said "During the upgrade process" in the bug report11:14
tepsipakkibut the original reporter had an upgrade11:14
cjwatsonok, sounds like your problem is different then11:14
cjwatsoncan you put the syslog somewhere I can see it?11:14
tepsipakkicjwatson: yes, a sec11:15
tepsipakkiah, found it11:17
tepsipakkia traceback from app-install-data11:17
tepsipakkibut the syslog is here: http://users.tkk.fi/~tjaalton/dpkg/syslog11:18
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cjwatsonapp-install-data probably needs to Depends: gnome-app-install if it uses python modules from there11:18
tepsipakkiyep, "No module named xdg.DesktopEntry"11:18
cjwatsonwhich of course means a circular dependency so that's tricky11:18
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mvotepsipakki: I wonder how that triggers a failure to install, the postinst should run fine and g-a-i works even when the data is not cached, this is really just a optimization11:41
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cjwatsontepsipakki: http://users.tkk.fi/~tjaalton/dpkg/syslog is 40311:44
tepsipakkitry now11:46
cjwatsonok, definitely mvo's problem :)11:47
cjwatsonmvo: there's no try/except around import xdg.DesktopEntry11:47
pittiheno: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBugDay/20070613 says that the lists were generated by bughelper; are we supposed to add some bite-sized bugs there manually or will that be clobbered?11:48
cjwatsonif you just want to ignore all errors from update-app-install, maybe just put || true after it in the postinst?11:48
henopitti: if they are generated by bughelper I'm sure they are still manually pasted in, so I don't think anything will be clobbered11:49
henopitti: yo might want to use a separate heading or something11:50
henoI'll coordinate more with Brian when he wakes up11:50
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Hobbseepitti: did you have plans to give some love to https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ia32-libs/ ? it's broken in various areas, including updates, and you appear to be the last uploader11:51
pittiHobbsee: oh, right; siretart wanted to send me his patch11:51
siretartpitti: oh, I didn't? damn11:51
mvocjwatson: indeed, that one if for me 11:52
siretartpitti: but I can explain it it you, might be more easy than the patch itself: I moved the commented out packages in the list and added the packages from ia32-libs-sdl11:52
Hobbseepitti: siretart ditto https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ia32-libs-gtk11:53
Hobbsee(more file conflicts)11:53
Hobbseeit's been left unfixed for a month or so - presumably us mere mortals dont know how this stuff is supposed to work. 11:53
siretartyes, we should merge them all in one package11:53
Hobbseesiretart: that'd be cool.  various stuff is failing to build due to this lot, etc.11:55
Hobbseeso fixing is good, if youv'e got the wish & required skills11:56
pittiHobbsee: 'k, I have them open in ffox tabs now (my short-term todo list)11:57
Hobbseepitti: woo :)11:57
pittiheno: btw, the third column on the hug day wiki page says 'hugger', but is supposed to be used by the one working on the bug; shoulnd't that be 'huggee' then? :)11:59
pittiI wonder what would happen if I marked an ia32-libs bug (324 MB orig.tar.gz) as 'bitesize'12:00
Hobbseeyou'd get shot.12:00
Hobbseepitti: the original tarball isnt seriously that big, is it?12:00
Keybukwasabi, iwj: so today I learned that fsync() doesn't actually have to sync ...12:00
Keybukint fsync (int fd) { return 0; } is a valid implementation according to POSIX12:01
pittiHobbsee: sure it is12:01
henopitti: yes, probably. sounds a bit like a brand of underwear though :)12:04
Hobbseepitti: twitch.12:04
pitti-rw-r--r-- 1 pitti warthogs 324361425 2007-05-22 17:05 ia32-libs_1.19ubuntu1.tar.gz12:04
pittiHobbsee: after all, it's much like a complete debootstrap including sources12:04
pittiand tons of desktop libs, too12:04
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Hobbseepitti: true that12:05
ograpitti, ltsp seems to be done o sparc as well now :)12:05
pittiogra: ah, cool12:05
pittiogra: NEWed (assuming that you'll clean up the lintian bits somewhat)12:05
ograwilldo ...12:05
ograbtw, the debconf template is for a question asked in the preinst on debian it seems 12:05
ograi'll ping them to fix it12:05
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glatzormvo: bryyce: hello, I just pushed some unittests for displayconfig12:16
mvoglatzor: cool, that is great news!12:16
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iwjKeybuk: fsync> Nice.12:27
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pygiZdra, wake up ^_^12:35
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siretartpygi: do you manage your changes to libisofs and libburn in a bzr branch?12:37
pygisiretart, nop, but I could if I'd register ssh keys with LP :)12:38
pygi(I know you're interested in bzr-builddeb, yes)12:38
pygiI could commit changes if we really have to keep that bzr branch12:42
=== pygi is not used to that, but could do it if necessary
siretartoh, I'm rather curious, if you are not comfortable with it, I'd be interested in knowing why12:42
siretartfor all fans of patch systems, please have a look at http://wiki.tauware.de/misc:vcs-packaging212:42
siretartpitti: I've seen that ecryptfs is in source NEW for quite some time now. Do you happen to know if there's a problem with the package?12:42
pittisiretart: no, there's just a lack of people doing source NEW :/12:42
pygisiretart, it's not that I'm not comfortable, it's just the time it would take me for it to become routine task would better be spent fixing other things :)12:42
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pittisiretart: tomorrow it's seb128's day, friday is mine; I'll coordinate with Seb to get to it eventually12:43
siretartpygi: oh, sure12:43
pygisiretart, mvo has one debdiff for me to upload, and then brasero will be in pretty good shape12:43
pygineed to find a fix for ppc & sparc build fail, but that's low priority right now12:43
siretartpitti: its just because it is a package of xxxxx1, which I'm mentoring. he was asking me yesterday about it12:43
mjg59Keybuk: ?12:43
mjg59Keybuk: "The fsync() function shall request that all data for the open file descriptor named by fildes is to be transferred to the storage device associated with the file described by fildes. The nature of the transfer is implementation-defined. The fsync() function shall not return until the system has completed that action or until an error is detected."12:44
cjwatsonmjg59: read the rationale too12:44
cjwatson"If _POSIX_SYNCHRONIZED_IO is not defined, the wording relies heavily on the conformance document to tell the user what can be expected from the system. It is explicitly intended that a null implementation is permitted."12:44
cjwatson(I don't know whether we define _POSIX_SYNCHRONIZED_IO)12:44
pygisiretart, did you manage to think up of a sane solution for cdrecord/wodim/cdrskin whatever mess?12:44
pygiI mean how will we solve it12:45
pygi(update-alternatives, or just link wodim/cdrecord against cdrskin (the solution which I prefer))12:45
mjg59cjwatson: That seems to effectively state that the null implementation would only be valid in the case where there's no way to guarantee persistant storage anyway12:45
mjg59(Or where write() is synchronous)12:46
cjwatson"file system is on a network" is a not-wholly-unreasonable case where that is true12:46
cjwatsonand where locking is interesting12:47
Keybukmjg59: Mac OS X is the interesting case here; it's fsync doesn't12:48
mjg59cjwatson: Well, _POSIX_SYNCHRONIZED_IO is defined on Linux, so it's not an issue for us12:50
mjg59So (assuming we conform...) it can't be an issue for any of the network filesystems supported on Linux :)12:50
mjg59Keybuk: It looks like MacOS fsync() transfers it to the storage device, but doesn't ensure that it's hit the platters12:52
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ograpitti, are you sure you NEWed the ltsp stuff ? there is still no trace ... 01:23
=== ogra needs the ltsp-client-core package in the archive to go on with his work
pittiogra: yes, but I NEWed it at 12:04, so it missed the 12:03 cron.daily by one minute01:24
pittiogra: it should be published right now (check in about 10 minutes)01:24
ograah, k 01:24
ograi thought they run in 30min frequency01:24
pittino, it's still too slow for that01:24
ograsorry for being pushy01:24
Hobbseemvo: got any qualms about me fixing some of the bugs in ubuntu-restricted-manager?  01:29
pittiHobbsee: you mean restricted-manager? or ubuntu-restricted-extras?01:30
Hobbseesorry, extras01:30
pittiHobbsee: I would have been glad about r-m bug fixes from you :)01:30
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Hobbseepitti: haha, good luck with that01:31
Hobbseepitti: but there's talk of a kubuntu version01:31
pittiyes, I discussed it with Riddell on UDS01:31
pittiAFAIR there's a SoC project?01:31
Riddellpitti: yes01:32
Riddellif he gets gdebi done in time01:32
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Keybuksiretart: that's cool01:39
Keybuksomeone should write a plugin to do that for bzr ;)01:39
Keybuklifeless: ^ :p01:39
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=== nougad hugs all
Hobbseepitti: wow.  i underestimated the amount of gstreamer0.10 plugins there were here.01:42
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Hobbseeoh impressive.  and adding all of -bad* and -ugly* still wouldnt catch them all01:43
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pittisiretart: re ia32-libs-gtk merge> so everything else except for the fetch-and-build list can be dropped? like the file shuffling in debian/rules?01:48
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pittisiretart: or the separation of -dev bits01:49
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pittisiretart: oh, hmm, -gtk is still in Debian02:09
racarrmvo__: Ping02:10
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mvo__racarr: hello! 02:27
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Hobbseemvo: ping02:38
racarrmvo: Did you see what I posted on the compiz bug you asked about yesterday?02:38
racarrNevermind, just saw your PM02:38
mvoracarr: yes, thanks again for the help!02:39
mvohello Hobbsee02:39
Hobbseemvo: i warn you now, i'm doing nasty things to a package of yours.02:40
mvoHobbsee: you did already, no? I just got a changes mail02:40
Hobbseemvo: okay, *more* nasty things than that :)02:40
Hobbseemvo: "so, uh, why would we be distribuitng a separate kubuntu-restricted-extras source for this, when it's almost hte same?"02:41
mvoHobbsee: hm, kubuntu-r-e would need the xine extra codecs?02:42
Hobbseemvo: yes02:43
Hobbseemvo: it's got them02:43
Hobbseethat package got renamed, etc.02:43
pittimvo: (note that Hobbsee questions the existence of a separate *source*; separate binaries are fine and necessary)02:43
mvopitti: aha, thanks. I was confused for a moment02:44
pittiHobbsee: so, tell me if/when I should kill the source again; I won't NEW the binaries for nwo02:44
mvoI had no idea there was a seperate kubuntu-r-e package so unifring them into the same source sounds like a good plan02:44
pittinow, too02:44
Hobbseepitti: please go ahead and kill the source.02:44
Hobbseepitti: i'm getting help with some bash-foo, and then i'll upload02:45
Hobbseeof k-r-e02:45
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Hobbseemvo: there wasnt, until a copule of days ago02:45
pittiHobbsee: *flush*02:45
pittiHobbsee: I wonder whether this was the shortest lifetime of a source package *ever*02:46
Hobbseehaha, sorry02:46
=== Hobbsee hugs pitti again
mvopitti: I can think of one ..02:47
wasabiKeybuk: Makes me wonder what the real chances of having transations in our file systmes in the next few years are.02:48
pittimvo: which?02:48
Hobbseepitti: at least it was small, and didnt require you to check licencing :P02:50
mvopitti: ccs-settings, hasen't seen the light of the archive at all02:51
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pittimvo: it's in NEW; I thought you wanted to disambiguate the name?02:52
seb128pitti: I'm rejecting it02:53
pittimvo: oh, I mean 'in the archive'02:53
pittimvo: now the '<mvo> pitti: I can think of one ..' becomes clear; I thought you refered to reasons to keep k-r-e as separate source :)02:53
mvopitti: sorry, misunderstanding02:54
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henohow well do we support USB microphones generally?03:01
heno(they tend to be better for voice recognition use)03:01
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Treenaksheno: USB soundcards tend to work OK03:03
Treenaks(and most USB headsets are USB soundcards)03:04
Treenaks(at least, the ones I've seen)03:04
henoTreenaks: great, thanks!03:04
pittiheno: not sure in general, but my logitech USB headset "just works"03:04
Treenakspitti: USB Audio is a "standard" profile, lots of devices support it (unlike, say, video/webcams, where every device has its own vendor-specific interface)03:05
broonieThere's a well-defined and generally well implemented generic USB audio class.03:05
henopitti: ok, as long as we have a few types we can recommend we are in good shape03:05
Treenakswe use them for VoIP stuff here at work03:06
Treenaksthe Logitechs03:06
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pittisiretart: ok, I have the package merged; I want to sort out the gnutls13 FTBFS first, otherwise we cannot update to gutsy debs03:11
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indravenihi al03:11
indravenihi all03:11
indravenicould someone please let me know, where is the coding or designing of ubutnu shutdown/logout image is present03:11
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indraveniis it i gnome-human-themes03:18
cjwatsonindraveni: usplash-theme-ubuntu03:19
cjwatsonshutdown != logout, BTW; those are two separate themes03:19
siretartpitti: great! ok03:20
indravenicjwatson, the image which is appeared when we click on system -> Quit03:20
indravenicjwatson, is that the one done in usplash-theme-ubuntu?03:20
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indravenicjwatson, I want to know, where the gui part of the image which is appeared when we click on System -> quit03:22
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pittidoko: can I remind you about the zope3 merge? it's still assigned to me, but we traded it03:23
cjwatsonindraveni: oh, ok, no, I think that's in gnome-session03:24
indravenicjwatson, oh03:24
indravenicjwatson, is the desining of the image is done in C language?03:29
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indravenicjwatson, what does this uue file mean?03:32
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cjwatsonindraveni: language> no idea03:41
cjwatsonindraveni: uue sounds like something that's been run through uuencode; you can use uudecode to reverse that03:41
seb128indraveni: what image?03:42
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seb128there is no image when you click there, it's a dialog with button and fading around it03:42
indraveniseb128, yes a dialog window which has, shutdown, logout, hibernate and other options with respective icons in it03:43
seb128that's an application dialog, not a image03:43
Hobbseepitti: yay, uploaded :)03:43
indraveniseb128, how is the desining of that is done in ubuntu? in debian we dont have any such dislog window 03:43
=== mvo hugs Hobbsee
=== Hobbsee hugs mvo :D
indraveniseb128, how that dialog is invoked, what is the desktop file responsible for this System -> Quit03:44
seb128indraveni: it's debian/patches/11_session_dialog.patch and there has been discussion in the Debian gnome-pkg team but no consensus to use it03:45
seb128indraveni: it's the logout dialog, it's coded and not used a desktop03:45
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seb128indraveni: what are you trying to do?03:46
indraveniseb128, I am tring to create a debian based distro on my own03:46
indraveniseb128, and I am seeing that the debian shutdown and logout images are not very good to see 03:46
indraveniseb128, where as ubutnu has a good look and feel for this03:46
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seb128maybe base it on Ubuntu if you like the desktop changes there ;)03:46
indraveniseb128, I am trying to do a similar kind of images for my distro03:47
seb128have a look to the patch I mentioned then03:47
indraveniseb128, ha, that will be next option, initially I want to learn how the things have been changed from debian to ubutnu03:47
seb128good luck then03:48
seb128brb, restarting to try some change03:48
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shawarmaI'm looking at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/sysklogd/+bug/19889 which looks like a strong candidate for an SRU. However, as well documented the issue *and* the fix seems to be, it feels funny to file an SRU without properly testing it first, but I don't have the hardware to do that.. Does anyone have a Dapper machine with a few GB (or GiB or whatever) space in /var/log that they would consider testing this on?03:51
ubotuLaunchpad bug 19889 in sysklogd "sysklogd: Large file support is broken in dapper" [High,Confirmed]  03:51
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shawarmaHmm.. tough room.03:58
Keybukshawarma: actually, it's neither 2GB or 2GiB03:58
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Keybukthe maximum size of the file is 2^9-1 :p03:58
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shawarmaKeybuk: 511 bytes? wow03:59
Keybukuh, 2^31-1 :p03:59
shawarmaKeybuk: Well, yes, so I need 2 GiB in order to make sure it's not just because I *actually* have run out of space. :)03:59
elmoshawarma: I have an in use package that I know fixes the problem04:00
shawarmaelmo: Just with the shell bits added?04:00
shawarmaelmo: I'll just refer to you then, shall I?04:00
Keybukdebdiff showdown? :p04:00
elmoshawarma: yes, let me just find the source for  package I'm using04:01
elmooh right, that'd be the 'HATEYOUALL' directory on ronne04:01
Hobbsee...that exists?04:01
Hobbseethat's pure awesomeness.04:02
KeybukI think that's unfair04:02
KeybukHATECHMJ would be better04:02
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shawarmaelmo: http://www.linux2go.dk/19889.diff <-- the proposed patch.04:02
elmoshawarma: ronne:~james/HATEYOUALL - give it 5-10 minutes for your account to propagate04:02
shawarmaAlright, then.04:02
StevenKHe's a sysadmin, he's *supposed* to hate everyone.04:02
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HobbseeKeybuk: what's CHMJ?04:03
lousygarua/joing #ubuntu-bugs04:03
KeybukHobbsee: who-touched-it-alst04:03
Keybuklast too04:03
seb128Hobbsee: bug #119842, could you describe the Ubuntu changes and why they can be dropped?04:05
ubotuLaunchpad bug 119842 in shntool "Please sync shntool (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/11984204:05
Hobbseeseb128: mumble mumble thought i did...04:05
=== Hobbsee looks
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seb128k, that's what I was wondering04:07
Hobbseei know it's close to off - thought it went off a copule of days ago04:07
persiaAutosync is one more week, right?04:07
Hobbsee(btw, what was the result on getting the universe autosync to run later?)04:07
cjwatsonwe discuss this every release04:08
seb128persia: schedule is on the wiki ;)04:08
pittiuntil June 21st04:08
cjwatsonevery release the answer is the same: it's risky because Debian don't honour our main/universe separation when making complicated changes04:08
persiaseb128: Just checking validity :)04:08
Hobbseecjwatson: apologies, i'm not sure i ever saw that discussion - or at least the outcome04:08
Hobbseeoh right, that, yes.04:08
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pitti   * Added myself to Uploaders, as i'm maintaining the Kubuntu side04:13
pittiHobbsee: ^ nevermind about Uploaders: in Ubuntu04:13
Hobbseepitti: i know.  i just wanted to be there.  *shrugs*04:13
Hobbseeand apparently one cant have multiple maintainers.04:14
=== persia recommends teams
Hobbseefigured that they might figure to ask me for the kubuntu side, seeing as it has the kubuntu address in there and all, isntead of going to mvo for all of it.04:14
pittiHobbsee: right, as a hint about whom to contact that's fine04:15
asacif i am in debian Uploader for a package that is ment to go into main, should I use my address as Maintainer or Ubuntu Core Developers <ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com> ?04:16
asacs/if i am in/if i am a/04:17
Hobbseeasac: i believe the answer is "whichever"04:17
Hobbseeasac: as it was only to stop annoying the debian developers who were getting ubuntu bugs04:18
Hobbseebut clearly you wont be annoyued, as you're also the ubuntu maintainer04:18
geserseb128: could you run the script that fetches NEW source packages from Debian on your next archive day? it would be good if we get claws-mail as we already have claws-mail-extra-plugins but are missing the main package04:21
pittiBenC, keescook: did you see the latest response in bug 117314 wrt. 'nvidia'? did the recent -security upload change the ABI unnoticed?04:22
ubotuLaunchpad bug 117314 in linux-source-2.6.20 "latest kernel(2.6.20-16.28) update gives boot problems" [Critical,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/11731404:22
seb128geser: hum, will try04:24
asacgeser: you did the xulrunner python2.5 patch at some point, right?04:24
BenCpitti: sounds less like a ABI change, and more like a failure somehow for nvidia.ko to be linked04:24
BenCpitti: considering the guy could not boot the first -16 kernel because of the device name changes, it's more likely that something just didn't complete in his update (depmod maybe?)04:25
geserasac: no, that was \sh, I only merged xulrunner04:25
asacgeser: we have to do it differently ... it might cause access of uninitialised memory04:26
BenCpitti: also, we had quite a few people complain about nvidia breaking, mainly because they had their own locally compiled version04:26
=== Hobbsee is sure she requested a sync of claws-mail, geser
pittiHobbsee: IIRC I rejected it because we'll auto-import it anyway04:27
Hobbseepitti: and you removed it from the blacklist, too?04:27
Hobbseei believe someone mentioned that it was on there04:27
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pittiHobbsee: I did04:28
seb128BenC: somebody I know complained to me this morning that the linux update broke his nvidia and he said he only used restricted-manager to install the driver04:28
Hobbseecool.  i thought so.  just i would have expected it to be synced by now, in which case geser wouldnt be asking.  whether it actually *has* or not, i've not checked.04:28
BenCseb128: If running "sudo /etc/init.d/linux-restricted-modules-common" fixes it, then it's something in the install scripts04:29
seb128BenC: I'll ask him later when he'll be around and let you know04:29
pittiseb128: see above bug (117314)04:29
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seb128pitti: yeah, I added that a piece of information because BenC was saying breakage are mainly due to compiled versions04:30
geserasac: if you have a better patch for the FTBFS let's use it04:30
asacgeser: no ... wanted to help developing it :) ... haven't looked into it in detail so far :)04:31
asacgeser: its on my TODO list though :)04:31
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dokopitti: thanks for the reminder, but still waiting for the package in debian NEW to be synced04:40
pittidoko: oh, we can sync zope3 from Debian's NEW?04:41
dokopitti: try it, I'm not an archive admin ;-P04:41
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pittidoko: can == we can ditch the ubuntu changes, not how to technically do it04:42
seb128BenC, pittiit looks like the linux security update also reintroduced bug #10976204:42
ubotuLaunchpad bug 109762 in linux-source-2.6.20 "resume from suspend to Ram only works once - I/O error the second time (Samsung X20 and IBM T40p - feisty)" [Wishlist,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/10976204:42
dokopitti: yes, the changes can be dropped with 3.3.1-304:43
pittidoko: cool04:45
pittidoko: unfortunately Debian's NEW queue doesn't provide the packages in it04:46
pittidoko: if you can put the .dsc and diff.gz somewhere, we can manually sync it04:48
dokopitti: well, we should not do that ...04:48
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shawarmaIf someone with stronger perl-fu than me could take a peek at (and possibly upload the patch) https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lintian/+bug/120040 it would be much appreciated.04:51
ubotuLaunchpad bug 120040 in lintian "Should not accept debian distros for ubuntu packages and vice versa" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  04:51
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BenCseb128: lesser of two evils...the revert of that allowed people to actually boot :)04:54
seb128BenC: ah, k04:55
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seb128BenC: thank you for the information ;)04:55
asachow can i find-out if gstreamer0.10-plugins-base is currently shipped on CD (e.g. without downloading an iso)?04:58
Hobbseeasac: check if it's in the seeds04:58
cjwatsonasac: (http://wiki.ubuntu.com/SeedManagement)04:58
Hobbseeasac: and apt-cache show ubuntu-desktop | grep gstreamer0.10-plugins-base will also tell you, as a starting point04:59
cjwatsonthe seeds aren't dependency-expanded, though, so it may be easier to check the .list/.manifest files on http://releases.ubuntu.com/04:59
asaccjwatson: cool thanks a lot ... looking at .list files is a nice trick05:00
pittithekorn: I created a Bug.mark_duplicate() function (branched off 'main'); will this disrupt your work on the api.changes.gsoc branch in any way?05:02
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thekornpitti: no, i don't think so05:04
pittithekorn: ok, thanks; I'll finish and test it and put it into my own branch on LP, and then ask dholbach to merge to main05:04
seb128can anybody confirm bug #11952805:05
ubotuLaunchpad bug 119528 in laptop-mode "Please remove laptop-mode from the Ubuntu archives" [Wishlist,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/11952805:05
seb128that looks correct to me but I would like an another opinion just to be sure ;)05:06
thekornpitti: ok, cool; other question: How are you testing your code in launchpad? did you open bugs for testing or is there a kind of sandbox?05:06
=== persia is all for 119528, but my confirmation doesn't mean anything :)
pittithekorn: I usually just test them on the live LP on an old test bug of mine05:07
pittithekorn: but if you want to do large-scale or even automated testing (yummy), then https://dogfood.launchpad.net/ might be better05:08
seb128persia: heh ;)05:08
desrtseb128; why are there no internation airports in the north of france?05:09
seb128desrt: because France is not big enough to justify it? ;)05:10
thekornpitti: ok, thanks, will have a look at it05:10
desrtseb128; there are tonnes in the south05:10
johanbrEverybody wants to go to the Riviera. :)05:10
persiaseb128: You might also be interested in bug 6676, which was a previous attempt to do the same thing.05:10
ubotuLaunchpad bug 6676 in laptop-mode "Laptop-mode should be replace by laptop-mode-tools" [Wishlist,Rejected]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/667605:10
seb128persia: ok05:11
desrtseb128; how far are you from lens?05:11
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seb128desrt: ~400km05:12
desrtholy crap05:12
desrtfarther than i'd have guessed :)05:12
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desrti'm trying very hard to visit vimy05:13
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seb128desrt: going to enjoy Europe again? ;)05:15
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desrtif possible05:15
desrtbut it's looking pretty impossible right now05:15
desrti plan to fly into manchester before guadec and take the train (8) to birmingham and then back to manchester to leave.  looks cheapest.05:19
desrtbut... instead of taking a train from manchester to birmingham i was thinking maybe a flight to paris then various trains to work my way north to nijmegen and eventually leave via schiphol05:19
pbnHi there... when I got a bug number, how can I find out to what release of ubuntu it applies ?05:19
pbnFor instance bug 665505:19
ubotuLaunchpad bug 6655 in rgl "rgl: merge new debian version" [Medium,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/665505:19
pbnFor instance bug 3665505:19
ubotuLaunchpad bug 36655 in kdenetwork "pppd dies on connection" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/3665505:19
desrtKubuntu Flight 5 == before dapper05:19
desrtbut it's still open so it probably affects dapper, edgy, feisty, gutsy...05:19
pbndesrt: thank you05:22
pbndesrt: well I just installed kubuntu 6.06 on my neighbour's computer, and it's two days I see pppd crash just after kppp has completed the connection05:22
pittidholbach: would you mind merging (or just pulling) my p-lp-bugs branch to fix bug 119874? (I attached the branch there)05:23
pbnI guess this might be another case of a bug in Ubuntu 6.06 that the ubuntu teams will not fix :(05:23
ubotuLaunchpad bug 119874 in python-launchpad-bugs "please support marking a bug as duplicate" [Wishlist,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/11987405:23
pittidholbach: NB that the package version number in my branch is not yet suitable for upload05:23
dholbachpitti: yep, will do05:24
pittidholbach: *hug*, thanks05:24
pbnIs there some way to tell kppp to start pppd with strace ?05:25
pbnI'd like to do that 05:25
pbnafter that I guess I'll file a bug report with that information05:25
desrtno... but you can attach strace after the fact,  using -p05:25
desrtand if it's the same bug, just attach the information rather than filing a new one05:25
desrthave you tried using feisty?05:26
pbndesrt: well no... 05:26
desrtthat should be your first stop :)05:26
pbndesrt: sorry but I suppose this is gonna be again the very same debate05:26
=== desrt isn't really interested in a debate :)
pbnI already had the same kind of problem with kvpnc05:27
pbnA bug which is "as huge as a barn"05:27
pbnbug number 7795005:27
pbnbug 7795005:28
ubotuLaunchpad bug 77950 in kvpnc "kvpnc crashes with SIGSEGV when trying to import a Cisco .pcf file" [Undecided,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/7795005:28
pbnI opened that bug in january 200705:28
pbnon ubuntu 6.0605:28
pbnthe bug is supposedly fixed in edgy and feisty05:29
pbnbut not in 6.06 LTS05:29
pbnNow I guess it's gonna be the same thing again05:29
pbnThat you folks won't fix it in 6.06 LTS and just say "Use feisty"05:29
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pbnsorry to tell you that but LTS means Long Term Support, not No Support, sorry05:29
pbnI'm using 6.06 LTS for "average users" in a corporate environment, or some "newcomers" who have never had a computer05:30
pbnI can't just go to eeach of these machines every six months to do apt-get dist-upgrade and pray that nothing breaks05:30
pbnThat's why I'm installing 6.06 LTS for those people 05:30
seb128StevenK: is something in main using python-qt4-dbus or should it go to universe?05:31
pbnIn my case I'm using Debian GNU/Linux, but I will not bring Debian in the debate...05:31
seb128pbn: dapper is supported, we can't fix every single bug there though05:31
seb128pbn: Debian stable doesn't do that neither nor any other distro05:32
pbnseb128: well the solution to that kind of problem was to switch *my* machines to Debian05:32
pbnseb128: sorry but Debian DOES fix bugs in the stable release05:32
seb128we do too05:32
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seb128we can't fix every bug though05:33
seb128there is lot of bugs and limited manpower, stable updates takes quite some ressources for regressing testing, etc05:33
pitti(Debian does much fewer bug fixes to stables than we do, FWIW)05:33
pbnseb128: yes, I understand it can be difficult to fix every single bug, especially in "old" releases like 6.0605:33
seb128bug #77950 you pointed has no duplicate and few comments and almost no subscriber05:34
ubotuLaunchpad bug 77950 in kvpnc "kvpnc crashes with SIGSEGV when trying to import a Cisco .pcf file" [Undecided,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/7795005:34
pbnseb128: but I find it counter-productive to have release 6.06 LTS which is supposed to have LTS .... and when there's a bug in 6.06 LTS, the only solution is to upgrade to 7.0.x !05:34
seb128doesn't look something that needs to be fixed to stable05:34
pbnwell right now I'm adding comments to 3665505:35
seb128not to mention it's an universe package05:35
pbnuhhh did someone say something about how to run pppd with strace from kppp ?05:35
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pbnseb128: which one is an universe package ? kpvnc or kppp ?05:35
pittipbn: another option is to just use one or two backports on dapper05:35
seb128the other one has 2 duplicates and few comments, doesn't look like something blocker many users neither05:36
seb128pbn: kpvnc05:36
Hobbseepbn: did you ever find the particular patches that fixed the issue?05:36
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pbnseb128: well I found a workaround to the kvpnc issue05:36
pbnHobbsee: alas, no05:36
Hobbseei seem to remember that was the outcome last time05:36
dholbachpitti: http://daniel.holba.ch/temp/pylpbugs.error05:36
pbnHobbsee: for kvpnc, I tried looking into whte source of Debian packages05:36
pittipbn: and yet another option, if you want to drive a stable release update for this bug, you are most welcome to :)05:37
pbnHobbsee: but the version of kvpnc in Debian is much too new compared to the one in 6.0605:37
Hobbseetbh, i wouldnt mind just backporting the entire source package.05:37
Hobbseepbn: exactly05:37
Hobbseewhich is why no one's done the work.05:37
pbnpitti: yes, it's always good if the person reporting the bug can fix it :)05:37
pittidholbach: oh, that's a Python 2.5ism, sorry05:37
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Hobbseepbn: LTS or no, unless someone does the work, it will not happen.05:37
Hobbseeseb128: StevenK has gone to bed, FYI05:38
pittidholbach: let me fix this quickly05:38
pbnHobbsee: I know...05:38
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pbnSo there might be a backport of kppp for 6.06 somewhere ?05:38
Hobbseeif someone requests one, and it actually builds.05:38
seb128Hobbsee: do you know if the package is required to main? otherwise I'll direct it to universe, we can still change that later if required ...05:38
Hobbseehang on, are you talking kppp or kvpnc?05:38
pbnHobbsee: kppp, sorry05:38
Hobbseeseb128: i'm not positive, but it looks like a kde4-necessary thing05:39
Hobbseeseb128: so main eventually, if not now05:39
=== Hobbsee isnt familiar with the kppp bug
seb128Hobbsee: I'll direct it to universe, if anything starts depending on it we will promote it then05:39
seb128otherwise it'll be on the "demote list"05:40
Hobbseeseb128: cool.  it'll be with the whole "promote kde4 to main" which is a later thing.05:40
iwjgcc-4.1 -fno-stack-protector [... 2000 characters more of command line] 05:40
iwjcollect2: ld returned 1 exit status05:40
iwjAnd that's it.05:40
Hobbseepbn: bug #?05:40
pbnHobbsee: I'd be happy to find a backport of kppp ( bug 36655 ) :)05:41
ubotuLaunchpad bug 36655 in kdenetwork "pppd dies on connection" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/3665505:41
pittidholbach: pushed05:41
=== Hobbsee looks
dholbachpitti: rock05:41
Hobbseeanyone found a solution to it yet?05:41
Riddellpbn: what do you have in /etc/ppp/peers/kppp-options ?05:41
pittidholbach: the ternary operator is such a nice thing :)05:41
iwj[pid  5017]  write(2, " ", 1)            = -1 ENOSPC (No space left on device)05:41
iwjAnd there's me trying to do disk-full debugging ...05:41
pittiiwj: with hacked preload lib wrapping write(2) or so? :)05:42
cjwatsonooh, looks like openssh upstream now puts non-standard port numbers in known_hosts05:42
tepsipakkiare packages allowed to install stuff in /home?05:42
iwjpitti: No, this is while I'm trying to build the lib wrapping write ...05:42
pittitepsipakki: absolutely not05:42
persiatepsipakki: No.05:42
pbnRiddell: don't know, it's my neighbours computer... is that information important ?05:42
iwjAs in, my disk randomly filled up so I can't build my disk full debugger.05:42
iwjAnd I find a bug in the linker where it doesn't say why.05:43
tepsipakkiok, kubuntu-default-settings is buggy, then05:43
pittiiwj: heh; nice cycle05:43
cjwatsoniwj: I think that's *some* kind of result05:43
pbnRiddell: /etc/ppp/options is untouched for sure, that I have checked05:43
Riddellpbn: it should have "noauth", if it has "#noauth" then it won't work.  not sure which dapper had05:47
tepsipakkiit creates a symlink /home/.directory -> /etc/kubuntu-default-settings/directory-home05:47
tepsipakkiand this in feisty05:47
cjwatsontepsipakki: some systems have /home NFS-mounted and that will break on such systems05:47
tepsipakkicjwatson: you don't say ;)05:47
Hobbseetepsipakki: i believe that's in edgy too :S05:47
pbnRiddell: hmmm thanks I'll check that. You said in /etc/ppp/peers/kppp-options there must be noauth and sure not #noauth05:47
tepsipakkiHobbsee: could be, we didn't use edgy05:47
cjwatsontepsipakki: I thought you'd probably know that ;)05:47
Hobbseeit was supposed to be gone on feisty05:47
RiddellHobbsee: it's the / one we got rid of, /home is there for a nice icon05:47
HobbseeRiddell: ahhh....right.  i thought they were both there for the same thing05:47
tepsipakkicjwatson: yeah, well.. usually /home is not used here, but the math department has used it so that's why it has gone unnoticed until now05:47
cjwatson * These macros demonstrate the property of C whereby it can be05:47
cjwatson * portable or it can be elegant but rarely both.05:47
dholbachpitti: rock on05:47
pittidholbach: works now? (it builds here)05:47
tepsipakkiRiddell: so, shouldn't this be fixed with an update?05:47
pittidholbach: danke sehr05:47
pittidholbach: I'll close the bug once I see the -changes mail05:47
Riddelltepsipakki: if we can find a suitable "fix"05:47
cjwatsonefforts to munge /home like that should be done in the postinst with a version guard and || true05:47
cjwatsonRiddell: ^--05:47
tepsipakkiit is in the postinst05:48
tepsipakkibut /home is a normal directory during install05:48
Riddellcjwatson: it is actually05:48
tepsipakkiso I'm not sure there is a way to go around that05:48
RiddellI'm sure I consulted on this when adding it to the package, although I can't remember who with now05:49
pbnokay folks when I'll have time tomorrow or later I'll go check my neighbour's computer and try that trick Riddell told me ... thank you, Riddell :)05:50
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cjwatsonRiddell: ok ...05:51
superm1_any archive admins about?  it appears that libpostproc0d is no longer in the archive, but several apps (vlc-nox & transcode come to mind) depended on it.  It appears to be superseeded by libpostproc1d.  Should a bug just be filed across any app that comes up like that to rebuild it?05:52
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pygihow do I kick upstream's ass if they play with endians too much? :P05:52
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persiasuperm1: Yep, and a -build1 uploaded.  It's nice to have all the relevant packages as separate tasks in a single bug.05:53
superm1_persia, any easy way to find all the ones that need a rebuild?  apt-cache rdepends isn't handling it05:55
seb128superm1_: use grep-dctrl05:55
superm1_k thx seb128 05:55
seb128dholbach: is there some recipes for that on the wiki?05:55
dholbachseb128: unfortunately not05:56
persiaseb128: They disappeared in the UDS WIki cleanup.05:56
seb128dholbach: I'll write one if nobody does it first then ;)05:56
pbnalso, where should I search for a possible backport of a "working" kppp for Ubuntu 6.06 ?05:56
dholbachseb128, persia: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment?action=fullsearch&context=180&value=grep-dctrl&fullsearch=Text05:56
dholbachthat's all I can find05:56
dholbachseb128: that's very nice of you05:57
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pittisuperm1_, persia: apt-cache unmet perhaps?05:57
pygiseb128  is alive, seb128 is alive :)05:57
seb128hey pygi05:57
pygihey seb128 ^_^05:57
pygihow are you doing?05:57
seb128pbn: maybe open a bug on https://launchpad.net/dapper-backports05:58
seb128pygi: good, thanks, catching up with everything which happened while I was on holidays ;)05:58
superm1_persia, who should i subscribe after I make the bug? u-u-s?05:58
persiadholbach: Thanks.05:58
pygiseb128, ok, I uploaded new libisofs, libburn, and brasero packages05:59
persiasuperm1: U-U-S should only be subscribed once there are debdiffs for each package.  I'll get an example in a moment.05:59
superm1_just a debdiff bumping the version number with a build1 applied to the end?06:00
pygiseb128, ^_^06:00
pygiseb128, now brasero actually works =)06:00
seb128ah, nice06:00
pygiwith libburn & libisofs even :)06:01
seb128I'll try that then ;)06:01
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pyginewest versions of both ofcourse06:01
gesersuperm1: yes (if there is no ubuntuX already), but please check if it builds06:02
pygigotta bug upstream to fix src/scsi tho as I can't build on ppc & sparc because of that, and patching would be big probably06:02
superm1_geser, ok thanks06:02
Keybukseb128: we patched gnome-system-tools to avoid using GiB? :p06:02
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superm1_geser if there is already an ubuntuX, should it be ubuntuXbuild1 still then?06:02
seb128Keybuk: gnome-system-monitor you mean? yes06:03
gesersuperm1: ubuntu(X+1)06:03
Keybukwonder if I can get away with patching ifconfig? :p06:03
Keybukseb128: does it divide by 1024 or 1000? :p06:03
seb128Keybuk: 102406:04
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ion_The ugliest thing is that the Finnish locales use Mt, which is of course totally wrong. Its just something Windows and Finnish computer magazines have been using for years, so many think its a correct way to put it, as if standard units were somehow translatable.06:07
Hobbseesigh.  why do people *always* end up attacking launchpad when the admins arent around to deal with it?06:09
KeybukHobbsee: verbally or physically? :p06:10
HobbseeKeybuk: er, physically06:10
KeybukHobbsee: WFM?06:10
HobbseeKeybuk: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/11946706:10
ubotuLaunchpad bug 119467 in kubuntu-meta "make non-essential packages Recommends and not Depends" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  06:10
=== Hobbsee thought her inbox was on crack, for a minute there - it even came up with a spamassassin rating.
thullyhi - I've identified an issue with the MacBook trackpad on feisty and gutsy tribe 1 - you can't change pointer acceleration *at all*06:11
Keybukthully: please use launchpad.net to file a bug06:11
thullyhowever, doing rmmod appletouch and modprobe appletouch fixes it until the next time you restart X06:11
persiathully: DId you comment on the relevant bug after the last time this was discussed?06:12
thullyI did that - wondering if anyone may have a clue where this issue is...06:12
cjwatsonthully: (FWIW, you asked about whether there was a team concentrating on MacBook issues; I think that MacBooks are sufficiently mainstream now and well enough supported by stuff like the installer that they don't urgently need a separate team)06:12
Keybukthully: those people are more likely to respond to your bug report than answer questions here, this is not a support channel06:13
persiathully: Wait then.  Someone will look at it as soon as they have time.06:13
thullyI just came here to confirm that doing an rmmod and modprobe of the appletouch module resolves the problem until X is restarted06:14
thullywhich would seem to narrow things down a bit06:15
pygiseb128, let me know if you got any troubles ^_^ I've fixed that libisofs error you reported06:15
Keybukthully: please add that information to the bug report06:15
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thullyOK - is there anything else that may help to test in order to narrow down the issue?06:16
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thullyI realize this is not a support channel - I actually wanted to help get this resolved (though diving TOO deep into the kernel source may be above me)06:17
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bryyceglatzor, excellent, I'll check them out06:18
seb128pygi: k, will do06:18
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thullyin general I'd just like to find a way to help fix these issues besides just filing the report - I can do a lot of experimenting here06:21
persiathully: Also note that in the bug report - the developers may contact you to help test.06:22
thullythanks - I figure I'll load up the gutsy tribe 1 iso I just downloaded and try a few things...06:23
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mneptokcjwatson: understood (re: VMWare). my concern is kernel/module questions as filtered through VMWare.06:24
thullyI'm not using VMware to test this one...06:25
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thullythat was talking about general use - as I had resorted to VMware to AVOID issues like the aforementioned appletouch issue06:27
keescookpitti: have others confirmed nvidia breakage with the kernel update?06:29
pittikeescook: someone seb128 talked to apparently06:29
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seb128keescook: somebody I know mentioned it this morning, I'm not sure if he had to reboot a new kernel because the new was not booting though06:30
seb128keescook: would it work in this case, or did the ABI or something changed which means the new restricted module would not work with the previous linux?06:31
keescookseb128: afaiu, the ABI was bumped with 16.28 (two updates ago).  current update is 16.29 and didn't bump the ABI06:31
seb128I'll ask for details and let you know06:35
keescookI tested it with fglrx and it was okay -- I didn't have a feisty nvidia machine.06:35
seb128he has an nvidia06:35
seb128and the bug happened this week while I was on holiday, dunno when06:35
seb128he told me he had to switch to nv to have xorg working again after the linux update06:35
mjg59bryyce: Any objection to me uploading libpciaccess?06:35
bryycemjg59: not offhand - what's it for?06:36
mjg59bryyce: Not at liberty to say yet :)06:37
jdongcan I get a core-dev sponsor for bug 110881?06:37
ubotuLaunchpad bug 110881 in ktorrent "[SRU]  Citical bug cherrypicks from SVN" [Undecided,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/11088106:37
jdongu-m-s has been subscribed for almost two weeks to no avail06:37
bryycemjg59: is that a new package or does it go by a different name in launchpad?06:37
mjg59New package06:37
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mjg59X is moving towards using it rather than hand-rolled PCI access06:38
mjg59Since it has an API that doesn't suck06:38
bryycemjg59: cool, sounds good to me.  Thanks for letting me know about it :-)06:39
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tepsipakkimjg59: you'll grab it from master?06:40
mjg59tepsipakki: Yeah06:40
mjg59tepsipakki: ABI is supposed to be pretty much stable now06:40
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tepsipakkimjg59: ok, good06:41
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seb128keescook: I've asked him, -15 didn't boot and -16 doesn't work with nvidia, restricted-manager says there is no driver for the card06:50
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=== pitti yays at Bug.delete_attachment(self, title_re, all=False), which is the last thing he needs from python-launchpad-bugs to implement the apport stuff
pittidholbach: ^ I might require your pull/upload service again06:50
keescookseb128: if he went from -15.27 to -16.29 he'll need to update l-r-m too.06:50
dholbachpitti: rock and roll06:51
dholbachpitti: looking in a bit06:51
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pittidholbach: sorry, originally I thought it was too complicated and thus already asked you for the previous upload06:51
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dholbachpitti: no problem06:51
dholbachis any work being done to get the new network-manager in? :)06:52
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dholbachpitti: did you push already?06:54
pittidholbach: pushed now06:55
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pittiyay, that paves the way for mass-deleting CoreDump.gz attachments06:56
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dholbachpitti: got it06:57
giskarddholbach, how much new?07:00
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dholbachhey giskard - how's it going?07:04
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giskarddholbach, bad, in 1 week i will start exams07:07
dholbachgiskard: oh man - I wish you all the best with those!07:07
giskardand i don't know something 07:07
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giskardops wrong paste but maybe you can understand what is this07:07
dholbachlooks like you have a bunch of things to do :)07:07
Hobbseeerk.  dont mention exams.07:08
dholbachpitti: uploaded07:08
dholbachpitti: thanks a lot07:08
pittidholbach: thanks to you07:09
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seb128keescook: no, he went from 15.27 to 16.28 which didn't boot, kept using -15 then until the updates some days ago07:11
seb128keescook: the new 16.29 boots fine again for him07:11
seb128but then there is no nvidia working07:11
seb128so it's using 16.29 with nv now07:12
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pittiyay stables :(07:12
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cjwatsonpitti: interesting - what's the security on delete_attachment?07:13
seb128pitti: I've just read the changelog quickly, I'm surprised by the number of changes going to security updates07:13
pitticjwatson: no idea really07:13
pittiseb128: so was I07:13
keescookseb128: I'm upgrading an nvidia feisty machine I found.07:13
cjwatsonseb128: see distro-team@ ..07:14
pbndo you people know if there is  a non-broken pppd and/or kppp for 6.06 on this site: http://be.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/dapper-backports/07:15
pbnI cannot add that line to sources.list and apt-get upgrade because obviously the machine cannot connect to the Internet ...07:15
pittipbn: neither ppp nor kppp have been put into any backports07:16
pbnpitti: ouch, then it's a pain 07:16
pittipbn: it's easy to create one once it gets tested07:17
pbnpitti: easy ? ah ?07:17
pittipbn: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BackportRequestProcess07:17
Hobbseekppp is in main07:19
Hobbseethere's a reason why noauth is usually commented though, in debian.README.07:19
Hobbseeor was last i checked07:19
ubotuLaunchpad bug 120054 in dapper-backports "kppp: pppd crashes with return value 1 when called by kppp" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  07:20
pbnwith that bug 120054 ... will someone make a backport of kppp to 6.06 ?07:21
ubotuLaunchpad bug 120054 in dapper-backports "kppp: pppd crashes with return value 1 when called by kppp" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/12005407:21
pittipbn: now you need to test whether the gutsy, feisty, and/or edgy version fixes the bug, and confirm that the package works on dapper07:21
Hobbseeit's fixed in gutsy07:22
pittipbn: and write the test results into those bugs07:22
Hobbseeat least the noauth part is07:22
Hobbseetouching /etc/resolv.conf is trivial, also07:22
pittipbn: after that's done, siretart or jdong will need to approve the backport (test it themselves)07:22
Hobbseepitti: if it's just uncommenting noauth, that's a SRU candidate07:22
pbnyes but... if I install the gutsy or feisty version of kppp on 6.06 ... won't stuff break ? You know, different versions of many packages ?07:22
Hobbseeno need to backport entire kde for it.07:22
pittiHobbsee: right07:23
Hobbseebut there's a reason it's not done by default07:23
Hobbseeor didnt used to be07:23
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pittipbn: you need to build the source package on dapper, not install the feisty deb07:23
Hobbseei looked at this bug ages and ages ago07:23
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pbnpitti: ah. and where do I get the sources ? apt-get source ?07:23
pittipbn: apt-get source works if you have deb-src lines for feisty07:23
pittipbn: otherwise you just download it from archive.ubuntu.com (orig.tar.gz, diff.gz, and dsc)07:24
pbnpitti: ... from a machine which does not have an internet connection ?07:24
Hobbseeah, here it is07:24
pittipbn: tricky :)07:24
Hobbseepitti: pbn http://rafb.net/p/MXHXgT95.html07:24
Hobbseefor "security reasons"07:25
pbnHobbsee: thank you07:25
pbnHobbsee: ok so the "quick fix" is to uncomment noauth in /etc/ppp/kppp-options ?07:26
keescookpitti, seb128: I'm not able to reproduce the nvidia problems locally.  -16.29 + nvidia binary driver works fine for me.07:26
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Hobbseewell, seems to be07:26
Hobbseeread the entire readme for more info07:26
jdongHobbsee: how are you feeling to sponsor a ktorrent SRU today? :)07:27
Hobbseejdong: er...i'm not?07:27
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henoWhere can I find a list of packages that have been removed completely from the archive?07:28
Hobbseeheno: http://people.ubuntu.com/~ubuntu-archive/removals.txt07:28
Hobbsee(yay, i knew the answer to something) 07:28
henoHobbsee: thanks!07:28
Hobbseeno problem07:29
pygiHobbsee, meh, stop that :p07:29
Hobbseepygi: stop what?  *looks around innocently*07:29
=== cjwatson fixes the rmadison backend to work with multiple packages
Hobbseermadison's...seriously cool.07:32
Hobbseecant decide whiihc i prefer -that, or madison-lite07:32
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JanCI think it might be a good idea to put a warning in fstab in gutsy, that tells people to use UUID or LABEL, and not device names...07:52
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pbnyou mean gutsy will no longer support device names ?07:57
slomo_pitti: anything we can do about gs? :)07:59
HobbseeJanC: i hope grub2 handles UUIDS and such then07:59
pittislomo_: no idea really; I forwarded the mail to Till07:59
geserpbn: they are still used in the background but it's not guaranteed that they stay stable across reboots08:00
slomo_pitti: interesting that it built fine locally for me... let me retry with a clean source tree :)08:00
pittislomo_: ugh, indeed08:02
pittislomo_: it attempted to build three times today08:02
pitti(on the buildd)08:02
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slomo_pitti: i saw it :) i got a mail for each try :P08:03
dokopitti: the ia32-libs merge sounds like a pain ... any reason that you did merge the gtk bits?08:05
pittidoko: some people asked for it, and having it in one package is much easier to maintain and keep in sync08:06
pittidoko: the most painful part was to compare the horribly old rules from -sdl and -gtk against the current rules from ia32-libs08:06
dokopitti: then why not kde as well?08:07
pittidoko: OMG, there's yet another one?08:07
pittidoko: yeah, we can merge that as well08:07
dokoyes, and then the source really gets a bit unmanagable ...08:07
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dokoand you have to update the resulting source more often08:08
dokoI don't like it08:08
pittidoko: -kde is not even in Debian, so it is like -sdl08:08
dokoanyway, leaving now ...08:08
pittidoko: as if we had updated -kde and -gtk that often... once or twice per release should be enough, though (in any case)08:08
slomo_pitti: still builds with everything up to date :)08:09
pittislomo_: weird08:09
slomo_pitti: does gs require some fonts or whatever that might be missing in the buildds chroots but not on my system?08:10
pittianyway, dinner, bbl08:10
pittislomo_: does it work in a pbuilder?08:10
slomo_no idea yet08:10
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shawarmaI still need a core-dev with perl skills to check out https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lintian/+bug/12004008:20
ubotuLaunchpad bug 120040 in lintian "Should not accept debian distros for ubuntu packages and vice versa" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  08:20
gesershawarma: I'm no core-dev but I looked at the patch08:23
shawarmageser: Alright. I'm ready for the shouting. Let me have it. :)08:24
geserif I'm not mistaken you broke some valid Debian distributions08:24
shawarmaEntirely possible. Which?08:24
cjwatsonshawarma: yeah, it's not quite right, although the Perl is fine08:25
elmoyou realise there are a bunch of packages in debian with ubuntu in the version string right?08:25
shawarmaAlright then. Well, my Debian-fu is not very strong either :)08:25
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cjwatsonshawarma: -proposed-updates shouldn't be allowed for Ubuntu (just -proposed and the rest), but -proposed-updates, -updates, -backports, -security are fine for Debian08:25
shawarmaelmo: No, I didn't.08:25
gesershawarma: stable-proposed-updates08:26
cjwatsonelmo: this is just Ubuntu's lintian though. (There is a bug somewhere about having it have two modes)08:26
shawarmacjwatson: I just closed that one, actually.08:26
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cjwatsonshawarma: haven't looked at your closing message, but I sort of think that should stay open08:26
shawarmacjwatson: It suggested to do that in order to remove nmu warnings for Ubuntu packages, but that was fixed in some other way.08:26
cjwatsonit would be nice to get it properly merged upstream08:26
shawarmaelmo: I remember someone (in Debian) felt really offended that he had an package in his Debian system with "ubuntu" in the version string. I just assumed they "took care of it" after that.08:27
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shawarmaelmo: I can't find any in unstable main..08:31
elmoshawarma: I looked at rejecting the packages in dak, but there was too many examples already in the archive, and it seemed pointlessly harsh, esp. since Debian started treating Ubuntu as the upstream for some packages08:31
elmoshawarma: update-manager08:31
shawarmaelmo: Yes. I'm an idiot.08:31
shawarmaelmo: That seems to be the only one, though. At least in main.08:31
iwjHah!  It built!08:31
shawarmaelmo: Anyhow, do you have any good ideas on how to detect it otherwise?08:31
iwjFinally, after only fourteen zillion hours!08:32
shawarmaiwj: What did?08:32
iwjMy glibc hack for disk full testing logging.08:32
iwjWho knows whether it'll actually work.08:32
elmoshawarma: it's the only one now, there use to be more08:33
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elmoshawarma: I'm not sure there is a 'better' way to detect it - I don't have any solutions and also don't care what you end up doing to ubuntu's lintian - just pointing out it may be a problem08:33
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ograshawarma, ltsp 08:34
shawarmaogra: No.08:34
shawarmaogra: It contains "debian", though.08:35
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gesershawarma: what about doing something similar to dpkg-buildpackage? it checks with lsb_release if it runs on Debian and Ubuntu (can be overwritten with a commandline option)08:35
ograoh, right, its the other way round tere08:35
shawarmageser: The trouble is that there a many DD's that run Ubuntu. I want to acommodate their needs as well..08:35
shawarmageser: automatically, that is.08:35
shawarmageser: I thought this was sufficient, but once again, I'm back at square one. 08:36
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gesershawarma: don't forget that Ubuntu has also packages which are specific to Ubuntu and doesn't have a ubuntu in the version08:38
shawarmacjwatson: My closing message just reads "it was fixed in version blah". The changelog of said version says (among other things) "checks/nmu: Don't set nmu flag if version has "ubuntu"".08:40
shawarmageser: Really? Like what?08:41
cjwatsonshawarma: I think the version check is perfectly good, TBH08:41
cjwatsonshawarma: (random example) ubiquity08:41
=== shawarma lets out a deep sigh
shawarmacjwatson: Ok.08:41
cjwatsonlintian doesn't have to be utterly perfect here ...08:42
shawarmacjwatson: Well, it's not like a warning from lintian makes anything fail..08:42
shawarmaOk, so the ubuntu distro-regex is fine, agreed?08:42
shawarmathen I'll just use whatever's in Debian's lintian for the debian checks.08:43
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cjwatsonshawarma: it's not ideal, but I think it'll be an improveent08:45
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shawarmacjwatson: Indeed. I've just uploaded a new patch to the bug report http://launchpadlibrarian.net/8068335/split_ubuntu_debian.diff08:50
slomo_pitti: fails in pbuilder :) so it's a build dependency08:50
slomo_pitti: damn08:51
pittislomo_: weird, only on i386?08:51
slomo_pitti: the doc package is arch all08:51
pittislomo_: ah, -doc package08:51
gesershawarma: more examples: ubuntu-calendar-*, ubuntu-{desktop,standard}08:51
shawarmacjwatson: It looks weird, because it's the previous ubuntu version mixed the ubuntu and debian checks, and I'm now splitting them entirely again.08:51
shawarmageser: Yes, and the kernel packages..08:51
slomo_pitti: any idea what it could be? i don't feel like testing every single of my packages that i have installed :)08:51
pittislomo_: still, unless it's some really exotic font, shouldn't gs itself depend on fonts?08:52
cjwatsonshawarma: still looks wrong; -updates and -security should be allowed for Debian08:52
cjwatsonshawarma: hmm, not -updates apparently, sorry08:52
cjwatsonDebian's lintian has:08:52
cjwatson                       or ($data->{distribution} =~ /\w+-proposed-updates/)08:52
cjwatson                       or ($data->{distribution} =~ /\w+-security/))08:52
cjwatsonshawarma: so I'm on crack and you can ignore me :)08:53
shawarmacjwatson: Feel like uploading it?08:53
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cjwatsonsure, give me a minute08:53
shawarmaSuper. Thanks!08:53
slomo_pitti: probably :) and i don't think it's exotic... at least it worked with older gs :)08:54
gesershawarma: there is no -proposed-updates in Ubuntu, only -proposed or -updates08:54
pittislomo_: that should be fixed in gs itself then; if you find out the package, please file a bug against ghostscript and milestone it08:55
shawarmacjwatson: Did you upload it yet?08:55
carlosRiddell: hi, around?08:55
Riddellhi carlos 08:55
slomo_pitti: is something frozen or why can't i just upload the fix? :)08:56
carlosRiddell: I wonder whether there is any problem with digikam translations08:56
carlosRiddell: we got .pot updates for Gutsy but no translation updates08:56
pittislomo_: oh, sure you can :)08:56
carlosfor Feisty, I think I had to do a manual upload08:56
cjwatsonshawarma: not yet?08:56
cjwatsonshawarma: fixing in place08:57
carlosRiddell: forget that08:57
carloswe got them and we imported them too08:57
cjwatson+                   if ( $data->{distribution} !~ /^(gutsy|feisty|edgy|dapper|breezy|hoary|warty)(-(proposed|updates|backports|security))?$/ ) {08:57
slomo_pitti: hah! gsfonts could be it... it's only recommended now :) let's test08:58
pitticjwatson: is that for something like dpkg-source, or vim?08:58
cjwatsonpitti: lintian08:58
Riddellcarlos: all sorted?08:58
cjwatsonshawarma: uploaded now with that change08:58
pitticjwatson: ah, ok; for vim I'd like to have UNRELEASED, too08:58
cjwatsonvim already does AFAIK08:59
shawarmacjwatson: excellent. thanks.08:59
carlosRiddell: not exactly, Jannick Kuhr says that we have old translations for it08:59
carlosRiddell: and I thought we didn't import any .po file for gutsy08:59
pitticjwatson: UNRELEASED always appears in inverted red in vim, so I guess not08:59
cjwatsonlooks like I am wrong08:59
pitti(but *shrug*, not a biggie at all)08:59
carlosRiddell: but I just checked our logs and found that we indeed imported the files for Gutsy08:59
pitticjwatson: let's just call that a feature then :)09:00
shawarmapitti: Do we really not want it highlighted that way?09:00
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shawarmapitti: Exactly. I'd rather consider it a feature, actually.09:00
carlosRiddell: so maybe we imported old files. Is that possible? that we didn't take latest KDE version for the source code in Gutsy?09:00
pittishawarma: it could be ... green!09:00
slomo_pitti: if it is gsfonts shall i really depend on it in gs? :)09:01
cjwatsonpitti: I sort of like it that way. It helps me to remember to un-UNRELEASED it09:02
pittislomo_: in earlier days, gs-common pulled it in, so I guess that the lack of a direct depends is just an inadvertent side effect09:02
slomo_pitti: ok... if it is gsfonts' fault i'll readd it :)09:03
pittislomo_: thanks muchly09:03
pittislomo_: I'll give back gstreamer tomorrow morning when the new gs is in the archive09:03
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slomo_pitti: thanks09:04
shawarmapitti: *g* Yes, it could.09:05
cjwatsoniwj: did you ever get anywhere with getting debug output for http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=393704 ?09:07
ubotuDebian bug 393704 in openssh-client "interactive client dies on ill-timed SIGWINCH" [Normal,Open]  09:08
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slomo_pitti: yep, works :)09:13
pittislomo_: awesome09:14
slomo_pitti: i love it when guessing works that good ;)09:15
Riddellcarlos: digikam source package seems to contain all the .po files09:15
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Riddellcarlos: 0.9.2 was only uploaded at the end of may09:15
Lurecarlos: digikamimageplugins were merged into digikam with 0.9.2 - this means that also translations are now in single file09:16
slomo_pitti: uploaded :) maybe you can give back gstreamer later today already? :) or are you going to bed soon?09:16
Lurecarlos: digikamimageplugins (0.9.1) was recently removed from archive09:16
carlosRiddell: yeah, my question is just whether it's up to date or not09:17
pittislomo_: binaries will need 2 hours 15 minutes to get into the archive09:17
carlosLure: oh, thanks for telling me it that way I don't approve the missing .pot files09:17
slomo_pitti: ok, then tomorrow :)09:17
pittislomo_: at that time I'm probably already asleep, but you can also ask infinity 09:17
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Lurecarlos: for refence (if needed): http://mail.kde.org/pipermail/digikam-devel/2007-March/011383.html09:21
carlosLure: well, the complain was more related to out dated .po files based on the .pot file that we have imported09:22
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Riddellpitti: is there a way to fix https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kde-i18n-nds/+bug/5458109:33
ubotuLaunchpad bug 54581 in kde-i18n-nds "missing language-pack-kde-nds for kde-i18n-nds_4:3.5.4-0ubuntu1" [Undecided,Confirmed]  09:33
Riddelllanguage-support-nds needs creating, or the recommends removing09:33
pittiRiddell: hm, it's a valid locale, I wonder why it doesn't exist yet09:34
pittiRiddell: please assign it to me and milestone it for tribe-2, I'll have a look later09:34
pittiRiddell: only reason that I can see is that there are no po files for that package09:35
pittiso it doesn't get created09:35
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tepsipakkimjg59: does xf86-video-avivo use libpciaccess? :)09:47
mjg59tepsipakki: No comment :)09:49
tepsipakkimjg59: hey, it was announced already :)09:50
mjg59Oh, so it was09:52
mjg59Heh. In that case, yes09:52
mjg59It's in NEW09:52
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mjg59Unaccelerated right now09:56
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agoliveiraIs someone there who can give me hand with d-bus? We're trying to figure out a problem here at Montain View.09:57
seb128agoliveira: you have better chances to get a reply if you actually ask your question09:58
agoliveiraseb128: Sorry, I forgot to send the question itself but I think I got it.10:01
pygisiretart, I'm back when you're around :)10:02
tepsipakkimjg59: can't find it from the queue..10:04
mjg59tepsipakki: Hm.10:05
cjwatsonmjg59: you forgot -sa10:06
mjg59Probably noobed that with pciaccess as well10:06
mjg59I'll fix later10:06
cjwatsonlooks like it mailed Matthew Garrett <mjg59@codon.org.uk> about it10:06
mjg59Yeah, got the mail10:07
cjwatsonyes, same problem with libpciaccess10:07
mjg59Ok. I suck :)10:07
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tepsipakkimjg59: I could push the packaging to git.d.o10:14
tepsipakkibryyce: did you read the announcement on xorg@l.fd.o? :)10:15
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bryyceno (dealing with a raid failure this morning) which one?10:16
bryyceah, the r500 announcement10:16
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bryycetepsipakkii, very cool :-)10:19
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=== pitti bounces
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=== desrt directs pitti's energy to power the builders
pittiseb128: apport-retrace just closed its very first bug as duplicate automatically10:36
pittidesrt: bah, I want to get this finished10:36
seb128pitti: waouh ;)10:36
seb128pitti: which one?10:36
pittiseb128: just a test bug, nothing interesting yet10:37
=== seb128 hugs pitti
pittiseb128: gutsy doesn't give us crashes, so I have to file my own :)10:37
=== mneptok closes the duplicate pitti hug from yesterday
pittiand the dup detection will only automatically work for newly filed crashes10:38
pittimneptok: :(10:38
pbnheh duplicate hugs10:38
pbnnot bugs, hugs10:38
seb128pitti: rock on ;)10:38
mneptokpitti: the LTS hug from last June still gets critical updates10:38
=== pitti ponders how to interpret mneptok's last comment
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mneptokyou and me both.10:40
=== mneptok hugs pitti slighlty differently than the way seb128 hugged pitti
mneptoknot a dupe!10:40
=== pitti huggs mneptok
mneptok2 g's! not a dupe!10:41
pygiseb128, are you around?10:43
seb128pygi: sort of, going to stop the computer soon, why?10:45
pygiseb128, just wanted to discuss one tiny thing10:46
seb128sure ;)10:46
pygiseb128, I think we should open iso files with nautilus-cd-burner by default instead of file-roller10:46
pygiimho it's completely weird and unexpected behaviour10:46
seb128good idea10:46
xhakercrimsun, you there?10:46
pygiseb128, what exactly do we need to patch to do that?10:47
seb128pygi: need to change the defaults.list, I've just uploaded a new desktop-file-utils with the change10:52
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gnomefreakis Ubuntu Installer an automatic accept/decline for NEW packages?10:56
crimsunxhaker: yes10:56
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xhakerati sb450 regression from feisty 15 -> 1610:57
crimsunxhaker: I need your alsa-info.sh url/output10:57
pygiseb128, ok, thank you :)10:58
seb128pygi: you're welcome10:58
xhakerwill do crimsun.. 10:58
pygiseb128, imho much better now, and sorry for bugging ;)10:58
crimsunxhaker: this belongs in #ubuntu, or open a query, please10:58
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seb128pygi: no problem, thank you for pointing it, it's better this way indeed :)10:59
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pygiseb128, ^_^11:00
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mikmorgdoes anyone know where i can find the Casper project source?11:04
pittimikmorg: 'apt-cache show-src casper' claims Vcs-Bzr: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/casper/trunk11:04
mikmorgpitti: Thanks a million :)11:05
pittiwhich should really be https://code.launchpad.net/casper/trunk nowadays11:05
mikmorgseems there is an issue with my driver update deb not loading11:06
mikmorgfrom the wiki, i assume the loader is part of casper itself, not ubiquity11:06
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mikmorgdoes ubiquity lay on top of casper, or vice versa?11:43
mikmorgi'm very confused by some of the things i'm seeing :/11:43
evandmikmorg: casper sets up the environment for ubiquity11:44
mikmorgevand: ok, that helps. thanks.11:44
superm1_evand, jetsradiem had been talking to you about a possible merge up of mythbuntu ubiquity changes if we cleaned them up to be more modular.  I havent spoken to him in a few days, what eventually came of that?11:45
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evandsuperm1_: Ubiquity isn't really set up for accepting such merges (that is, items that are not going to be the default), but I told him I'd look over the mythbuntu code11:47
superm1_evand, Well my thought was having a third UI for us available, mythbuntu-ui that was a child based upon gtk-ui so as to not break things.  if the main ubiquity start script received something like ubiquity --mythbuntu then we could be started, otherwise follow as normal11:48
superm1_and then we could use our own glade file and still be able to source all normal functions that are part of gtk-ui and still get all the partitioning changes that are going in11:49
superm1_and override as necessary for our things11:49
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evandhrmm, you still have the problem of keeping things in sync, but that might be easier now that everything is built off of BaseFrontend.12:01
evandcjwatson: thoughts?12:01
evanderm, ignore most of what I just said.  I wasn't thinking.  It's still an interesting idea though.12:02
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superm1_evand, there are a few items that would still need to be sorted out if we did it that way (install.py has a few changes specific to us)12:04
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superm1_I'm a bit new to inheritance in python, but if its like C, I would imagine that the derived class would be able to override the base class functions (and hence override things like say a run() function that would normally be in gtkui.py.  things wouldn't be too bad to keep in sync then I dont think)12:05
pittisuperm1_: sure, you can override methods in Python classes12:06
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evandsuperm1_: take a look at frontend/base.py in Ubiquity for a rough idea.12:07
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mikmorgok, after reading source for a while.. i'm officially stumped with my driver update deb12:09
superm1_evand, ah then this would be a functional way for us to do things that are overridden in gtk-ui.py.  If we followed the same methodology with overriding the Install class in install.py, this could be feasible12:09
superm1_evand, have you looked over the types of changes that we have yet in a debdiff or no?12:10
evandsuperm1_: I glanced over the code briefly.  I'll take a much more thorough look tomorrow, though.12:11
mikmorgi have a disk with /ubuntu-drivers/2.6.20/tg3_i386.deb which i need to use with Feisty. If I insert the disk when told, and enter the live environment, and type dpkg -i /var/cache/driver-updates/tg3_i386.deb, it installs perfectly. However, casper is not installing it automatically as it is supposed to..12:11
superm1_evand, i'll make a clean debdiff ( I just merged to your 1.5.3 release yesterday12:12
mikmorgIs anyone familiar enough with casper to help me with this issue?12:12
superm1_i'll give you a link in a few minutes 12:12
evandsuperm1_: thanks12:12

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