[12:30] <Bassetts> are some of the repos down?
[12:31] <Fujitsu> Bassetts: Which in particular.y
[12:31] <Fujitsu> s/.y/?/
[12:31] <white> Fujitsu: good morning :)
[12:32] <Bassetts> let me see
[12:32] <Bassetts> http://security.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/feisty-security/main/binary-i386/Packages.gz: Sub-process gzip returned an error code (1)
[12:32] <Bassetts> http://gb.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/feisty/main/binary-i386/Packages.gz: Sub-process gzip returned an error code (1)
[12:32] <Bassetts> there
[12:35] <Bassetts> Fujitsu: are they down if i get that message?
[12:38] <Fujitsu> Oh, hi white. irssi is nicely not notifying me on pings any more.
[12:38] <Fujitsu> Bassetts: It could be a problem on your end, but I'll try it from here.
[12:39] <Bassetts> someone in #ubuntu said they have been having trouble getting packages
[12:39] <Fujitsu> Works fine for me, so most probably your end.
[12:40] <Bassetts> Fujitsu: what do I need to do?
[12:40] <Fujitsu> Bassetts: Check that there are no proxies between you and it that are doing stupid things, or perhaps try again later.
[12:41] <Bassetts> Fujitsu: I have not setup no proxies
[12:42] <Bassetts> Fujitsu: could it be a connection from one of my ISPs servers that is not getting a connection to the repo
[12:43] <Fujitsu> It's hard to say... Probably best to wait a couple of hours and try again.
[12:43] <Bassetts> it works in firefox
[12:44] <Bassetts> i can go to http://security.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/feisty-security/main/binary-i386/Packages.gz and it shows the file
[12:45] <Bassetts> Fujitsu: could I not download the Packages.gz files in firefox and put them wherever they should go?
[12:54] <Bassetts_> Fujitsu: I just realised, its a gzip error
[12:54] <Bassetts_> "sub-process gzip returned an error code (1)"
[12:55] <Bassetts_> a status of 1 in gzip means there was an error
[01:00] <Kmos> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5677
[01:00] <Kmos> i need someone to review this
[01:01] <Bassetts_> the Packages.gz seems to be broken on two repos
[01:01] <Bassetts_> http://gb.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/feisty/main/binary-i386/
[01:01] <Bassetts_> and http://security.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/feisty-security/main/binary-i386/
[01:01] <Kmos> Bassetts_: try another repo
[01:01] <Bassetts_> gzip: Desktop/Packages.gz: unexpected end of file
[01:02] <Kmos> ch.archive.ubuntu.com
[01:02] <Bassetts_> thanks
[01:03] <ajmitch> usually it's just a transparent proxy breaking the world, again
[01:03] <Bassetts_> I changed it to main server in synaptic and it all works fine
[01:03] <Bassetts_> ajmitch: ??
[01:03] <ajmitch> blame your ISP
[01:03] <Bassetts_> they seem to be sucking this month
[01:03] <Bassetts_> so for now am I ok using the main server?
[01:04] <Bassetts_> then trying the UK server later
[01:04] <ajmitch> should be
[01:04] <Bassetts_> thanks
[01:05] <Bassetts_> that delayed me a good 45 mins
[01:31] <pochu> Kmos: you appear here in a private! :) http://daniel.holba.ch/pics/pitti-virtual-desktop.png
[01:32] <Kmos> pochu: hehe.. nice :D
[01:32] <Kmos> that's a daily screenshot :P
[02:04] <blueyed> I've created a debdiff by using a simple patch, but the debdiff includes changes in config.sub und config.guess.
[02:04] <blueyed> Is that ok or should I manually remove them from the debdiff?
[02:10] <blueyed> If you know an answer to my question, please leave a comment at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/httptunnel/+bug/121458 - I'm off to bed.
[02:10] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 121458 in httptunnel "[patch]  fix broken --stdin-stdout option that writes to stdin" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
[02:13] <TheMuso> blueyed: I'll have a look at that, and update the package.
[02:13] <TheMuso> Is this for gutsy?
[02:13] <blueyed> yes, should be.
[02:13] <TheMuso> blueyed: Ok thanks.
[02:19] <TheMuso> blueyed: Do you know if this is reported in Debian?
[02:19] <TheMuso> I'll have a look in a bit.
[02:22] <TheMuso> Ok. There is a bug in Debian about it.
[02:23] <joejaxx> Good Evening All
[02:23] <TheMuso> Hey joejaxx.
[02:34] <crimsun> ScottK: will be in the metro area tomorrow evening/night.
[02:39] <crimsun> time to Debianise this puppy
[02:39] <StevenK> ... why?
[02:40] <crimsun> oh, I'm referring to packaging https://code.launchpad.net/~motu/asoundconf-ui/trunk
[02:41] <StevenK> Ah ha
[02:43] <joejaxx> crimsun: :)
[03:01] <leonel> ScottK:   http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=384190   
[03:11] <LaserJock> leonel: my goodness
[03:11] <leonel> LaserJock:  ??
[03:15] <LaserJock> leonel: that forum thread
[03:16] <ajmitch> LaserJock!
[03:16] <ajmitch> now that you're core dev, are you going to blog about being "Beyond MOTU" & your experiences? ;)
[03:17] <jsgotangco> heh
[03:21] <RAOF> If anyone on motumedia wants to check out bug #121476, I'd appreciate comments about the way I've done it.  Is this how you'd like such bugs to be filed/packaging changes to be made?
[03:21] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 121476 in mplayer "Use Compiz' "video" plugin when available" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/121476
[03:22] <ajmitch> jsgotangco: how's it going?
[03:23] <jsgotangco> ajmitch: not bad, just been busy sorting out last minute home details before i join the employed labour force again on monday
[03:23] <LaserJock> ajmitch: hehe
[03:24] <ajmitch> jsgotangco: oh great, where are you working next?
[03:25] <jsgotangco> ajmitch: a firm mostly involved with development of Maven
[03:26] <jsgotangco> heh
[03:26] <ajmitch> http://maven.apache.org/ ?
[03:26] <jsgotangco> maven.apache.org
[03:26] <jsgotangco> jetty as well
[03:26] <ajmitch> google wins
[03:27] <ajmitch> interesting
[03:27] <ajmitch> I hope it goes well for you
[03:27] <jsgotangco> sure do thanks
[03:29] <ajmitch> hm, looks to be about a 2-week delay on debian NEW at the moment
[03:29] <ajmitch> I guess I've got time to tidy & push packages
[03:31] <LaserJock> that's pretty good
[03:35] <jsgotangco> brb
[03:36] <ajmitch> it feels wrong now to check stuff out with cvs
[03:36] <LaserJock> "now"?
[03:37] <ajmitch> :P
[03:37] <ajmitch> I don't have to do it often
[03:37] <LaserJock> well, I replied to that ClamAV thread on the forums, I bet I get some good flames
[03:38] <ajmitch> yay
[03:39] <ajmitch> ah, you didn't mention that updating clamav to 0.90.x breaks about 15-20 related packages
[03:39] <LaserJock> I did say there were like 20 packages that depend on it
[03:39] <LaserJock> but you can certainly add that
[03:39] <LaserJock> ;-)
[03:39] <ajmitch> not in Big Bold Letters
[03:39] <ajmitch> someone foaming at the mouth could easily miss that
[03:40] <ajmitch> so what was decided at the last motu meeting about it?
[03:40] <ajmitch> since it was at about 1am here
[03:41] <LaserJock> looking at the meeting minutes it looks like it was decided to continue working on it on the mailing list
[03:42] <ajmitch> you weren't at the meeting either?
[03:42] <LaserJock> no
[03:43] <ajmitch> slack
[03:43] <ajmitch> what, were you sleeping or something?
[03:44] <LaserJock> working I imagine
[04:05] <tonyyarusso> err, slightly offtopic question for someone who's done kernel compiles:  Can I compile just a module that I need to add, not the whole kernel?
[04:05] <RAOF> You should be able to, yes.
[04:05] <RAOF> Module-assistant does, and that doesn't even need the kernel source, just the headers.
[04:06] <tonyyarusso> Hmm, I'll look into that.  Any howtos to get me started RAOF ?
[04:07] <RAOF> Not that I can think of, sorry.  Generally, you just build the module source, making sure your /usr/lib/modules/2.6.whatever/build symlink goes somewhere sane.
[04:08] <RAOF> Or are you trying to build a module included in the vanilla kernel source, that just hasn't been built for your current kernel?
[04:08] <tonyyarusso> RAOF: The latter.  It isn't included in Debian/Ubuntu b/c of licensing issues.
[04:09] <RAOF> Well, you could try changing the kernel config, going into the appropriate kernel source subdirectory, and "make"ing.
[04:09] <RAOF> Alternatively, if you've already built the kernel, you could try making it again without cleaning the already built stuff.
[04:10] <RAOF> But that could have wierd effects.  As could just building the appropriate subdirectory, I suppose :)
[04:10] <tonyyarusso> I'd like to stay as close to a standard, auto-upgradeable Ubuntu kernel if possible.
[04:10] <RAOF> Well, your module isn't going to be auto-upgradeable no matter what you do.
[04:11] <RAOF> So, I'd try my first suggestion.  Get the ubuntu kernel source, change the config, go to the appropriate subdirectory for your module, and make it.
[04:11] <tonyyarusso> Is it possible to have the _kernel_ upgrade on it's own, and just have to go fix the module manually, or will I be out of happy-apt-land altogether?
[04:12] <RAOF> Oh, the kernel will upgrade on its own.
[04:12] <RAOF> And break your module in the process, so you'll need to re-build it.
[04:12] <tonyyarusso> ah, that's fine
[04:14] <persia> StevenK: About cyrus21-imapd and libsnmp: While it builds without the library, I would rather either build a testcase that shows it really doesn't need it for identical behaviour, or hunt down why ./configure is testing for libsnmp, and how the MIBs are build and installed to perhaps fix the problem with the SNMP support.
[04:14] <mneptok> beep beep!
[04:15] <persia> One possibility (not yet confirmed) is that it would prefer to use mib2c or net-snmp-config to do things, or perhaps it just references the MIB configuration tables.  If it's not a functionality issue, I'd prefer to understand the problem and fix it, rather than going for the quick solution.
[04:15] <tonyyarusso> RAOF: this would be nice: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/automatic-module-assistant
[05:04] <LaserJock> hmm, so I just came back from a trip to Walmart
[05:04] <ajmitch> uh oh
[05:04] <LaserJock> and they had a big sign on the door saying they are now selling Dell's
[05:05] <LaserJock> sure enough, they had E521s
[05:05] <ajmitch> which are?
[05:05] <LaserJock> no Ubuntu though :/
[05:06] <ajmitch> that's expected
[05:06] <LaserJock> I know, but still ;-)
[05:08] <micahcowan> Walbuntu
[05:16] <ScottK> LaserJock: How do I get the big Ubuntu Developer red badge of courage on the forums?
[05:16] <LaserJock> ScottK: jdong hooked me up
[05:16] <LaserJock> ask a forum admin person
[05:16] <ScottK> LaserJock: thanks.
[05:18] <ajmitch> ScottK: you need to embark on an arduous quest, long & perilous
[05:19] <ScottK> ajmitch: Then I don't wanna do it.  I want it to be easy, quick, painless, and have a pony.
[05:23] <ScottK> jdong: Where are you...  How about hooking me up for Ubuntu Forums (forum user ID is kitterma) 
[05:24] <crimsun> I'm a peon, woo!
[05:25] <LaserJock> heh
[05:25] <LaserJock> now that I'm a core-dev I think I'll move on to becoming a peon
[05:26] <ScottK> Peon has less work associated with it.
[05:26] <crimsun> "5 Cups of Ubuntu"
[05:26] <crimsun> I rock
[05:26] <LaserJock> sweet
[05:27] <somerville32> I don't drink, sorry.
[05:27] <somerville32> I get IV infusions
[05:27] <crimsun> ugh, the UF has that obnoxious modal dialog
[05:28] <crimsun> "Are you sure you want to log out?"
[05:28] <ScottK> Of course.  UF are so wonderful why would you ever want to do that.
[05:28] <crimsun> why no, I intentionally accidentally clicked the hyperlink
[05:28] <ScottK> somerville32: Are they at least good IV infusions?
[05:29] <ScottK> crimsun: Of course.
[05:30] <somerville32> I don't want to be Judged but I hope Ubuntu infused with a minimum amount of much needed human nutrients is acceptable.
[05:30] <ScottK> somerville32: As long as caffeine qualifies as a much needed human nutrient, then I'm good.
[06:20] <nixternal> hiya Hobbsee 
[06:20] <LaserJock> nixternal: don't kick too hard, it might kick back
[06:20] <Hobbsee> hiya!
[06:20] <nixternal> I think it is kicking back
[06:21] <LaserJock> hi Hobbsee 
[06:21] <Hobbsee> heh.  the warning was too late!
[06:21] <Hobbsee> hiya LaserJock :)
[06:21] <nixternal> build baby build!!!
[06:22] <Hobbsee> it wont
[06:24] <ajmitch> hello Hobbsee 
[06:25] <Hobbsee> hi ajmitch 
[06:25] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: still causing trouble?
[06:25] <ajmitch> yes
[06:25] <ajmitch> always
[06:27] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: managed to get out of work yet?
[06:28] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: not yet...i havent actually been near there - only a floor higher than it
[06:29] <ajmitch> I'm sure you can avoid it somehow
[06:29] <ajmitch> got everything ready for gutsy release?
[06:30] <Hobbsee> nope
[06:30] <Hobbsee> not even tribe 2
[06:30] <jmg_> is there a kernel backports archive?
[06:30] <Hobbsee> and then went shopping :P
[06:31] <ajmitch> studying?
[06:31] <ajmitch> why?
[06:31] <ajmitch> aren't exams over there yet?
[06:31] <jmg_> it's exam time
[06:31] <joejaxx> jmg_: interesting
[06:32] <joejaxx> jmg_: i never thought about that
[06:32] <ajmitch> they've finished at uni here
[06:32] <joejaxx> jmg_: if there was a kernel backports archive
[06:32] <jmg> joejaxx: i need it
[06:32] <joejaxx> jmg: what are you on now?
[06:32] <StevenK> They're still on at my uni, but I didn't care since the two subjects I did don't require final exams.
[06:32] <jmg> joejaxx: feisty, but gutsy breaks my laptop
[06:32] <joejaxx> jmg: ah
[06:33] <ajmitch> ah, loldebian
[06:33] <ajmitch> http://loldebian.wordpress.com/2007/06/20/now-i-has-a-pony/
[06:34] <joejaxx> lol
[06:34] <StevenK> Oh yes, madduck
[06:34] <jmg> i need the gutsy kernel because of bug 117282
[06:34] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 117282 in linux-source-2.6.20 "2gb SD card not usable" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/117282
[06:34] <joejaxx> ajmitch: hahaha
[06:35] <jmg> but then i also need modules-restricted
[06:36] <ajmitch> libc6 dependency?
[06:36] <joejaxx> ajmitch: http://loldebian.wordpress.com/2007/06/01/i-is-sunning/
[06:37] <ajmitch> joejaxx: yes, I've seen them all
[06:37] <ajmitch> jmg: it'd be fairly trivial to install the kernel & rebuild linux-{restricted,ubuntu}-modules
[06:37] <jmg> http://loldebian.files.wordpress.com/2007/05/we_are_debian.png <- illegal use of genie logo
[06:38] <jmg> ajmitch: isnt restricted-modules build a black art?
[06:38] <ajmitch> no
[06:38] <ajmitch> it's as trivial as any package build
[06:39] <ajmitch> the black art is getting things built in order & updated with the right ABI versioning when it's bumped
[06:39] <jmg> hmm
[06:39] <ajmitch> which you won't have to worry about
[06:39] <StevenK> If something like Openoffice.org's package building could be called trivial.
[06:39] <jmg> can i just download the gutsy source and dpkg-buildpackage?
[06:40] <ajmitch> yes
[06:40] <jmg> ah
[06:40] <ajmitch> plus build-deps, etc
[06:40] <jmg> but i need to tell it not to build every kernel variant
[06:40] <jmg> obviously
[06:42] <jmg> does that just mean commenting the lines in control?
[06:44] <ajmitch> no, there's a gutsy-specific way of doing it
[06:44] <ajmitch> look on the wiki for details
[06:44] <ajmitch> the kernel packaging was redone for gutsy
[06:54] <ajmitch> nixternal: wasn't it kicking you earlier? :)
[06:55] <nixternal> yup, but I kicked back and fixed her. Now I can debdiff it and get it uploaded
[07:01] <LaserJock> blah
[07:02] <LaserJock> I knew LP was down and I still went there
[07:02] <Hobbsee> haha
[07:02] <Hobbsee> so did i, dont worry
[07:02] <LaserJock> it's become so central to my life
[07:02] <Hobbsee> that's scary
[07:03] <crimsun> admitting it is the first step to recovery.
[07:03] <LaserJock> I know, I know
[07:04] <crimsun> I, too, will be unplugged from the matrix soon.

[07:05] <crimsun> (which, interestingly enough, is a permutation of my first name...)
[07:05] <ajmitch> funny, the number of people that say (on forums, various 'news' sites like osnews) that kubuntu should be delayed for kde 4.0
[07:05] <jmg> haha
[07:05] <nixternal> ScottK: I have this patch, however LP is down for who knows how long
[07:05] <ajmitch> I suspect that they may have unrealistic expectations of kde4
[07:05] <nixternal> LaserJock: haha, I didn't, saw your comment, and then went ;p
[07:06] <StevenK> [14:38]  < mthaddon> Launchpad is going down in 15 mins for a code update.
[07:06] <StevenK>                     Estimated downtime is approx 30 mins
[07:06] <StevenK> nixternal: ^
[07:06] <jmg> lp should have a better down message.
[07:06] <jmg> like a lolcat.
[07:06] <StevenK> NO
[07:06] <nixternal> k, when it is back up, I will have a present waiting there for yoU :D
[07:06] <crimsun> nixternal: think of it as a weekly manager-enforced workrave.
[07:07] <ajmitch> hello Yagisan 
[07:07] <Hobbsee> hi Yagisan 
[07:07] <jmg> save vs. wands or die!
[07:07] <Yagisan> G'day ajmitch, Hobbsee 
[07:09] <Yagisan> ajmitch, Hobbsee, StevenK - what graphics chips are you guys using in your ubuntu boxes ?
[07:10] <crimsun> hey Yagisan, LTNS
[07:10] <jmg> salt and vinegar
[07:10] <nixternal> my favorite kind
[07:10] <Yagisan> crimsun, it is. everyyone wants all my free time
[07:10] <Hobbsee> Yagisan: 00:02.1 Display controller: Intel Corporation Mobile 945GM/GMS/940GML Express Integrated Graphics Controller (rev 03)
[07:11] <ajmitch> nVidia Corporation NV43 [GeForce 6600] 
[07:11] <ajmitch> and a 915GM in the laptop
[07:11] <Yagisan> nice chips I don't have in my database
[07:11] <nixternal> I am with Hobbsee on that one :) same here
[07:11] <ajmitch> i915 is *really* common
[07:11] <Yagisan> Hobbsee, ajmitch - could I trouble you to pm me the output from glxinfo -l
[07:12] <ajmitch> you may
[07:12] <Hobbsee> Yagisan: http://rafb.net/p/oARHgu31.html
[07:13] <jmg> free time?
[07:13] <Yagisan> thanks Hobbsee 
[07:13] <jmg> whats that?
[07:13] <Hobbsee> Yagisan: no problem
[07:13] <Yagisan> jmg, what I had when I could go to UDU - such a long time ago
[07:14] <Student> Aside from invalid fstab and menu.lst entries, is there anything else that could cause the "/bin/sh: can't access tty; job control turned off" boot error?
[07:16] <Yagisan> I got an interesting email from my isp
[07:16] <Yagisan> the claim I never paid their relocation fee
[07:16] <ajmitch> fun
[07:16] <Yagisan> no this is interesting, because every month without fail - they direct debit the monthly charge from my account
[07:17] <Yagisan> I checked - and the indeed did not debit the relocation fee
[07:18] <Yagisan> so I've sent them a reply - thank you for the free relocation - I assume you failure to debit is compensation for the inadequate service you have provided.
[07:18] <nxvl> when automount makes an icon on my desktop, what package opens when i click on Properties on the "right-click" menu?
[07:18] <nixternal> haha, nice
[07:19] <Yagisan> now I hope iinet or someone gets adsl2 here - because I really want to switch
[07:19] <StevenK> Don't switch to iinet.
[07:20] <crimsun> Student: well, sure.  I ran into it this morning with an older Breezy install where /dev/hda1 became /dev/hdb1 due to a race with USB mass storage.
[07:20] <Yagisan> StevenK, surely someone is better then TPG
[07:20] <crimsun> Student: however, this channel isn't appropriate for it; you likely want #ubuntu.
[07:20] <StevenK> Yagisan: I quite like Exetel.
[07:20] <nixternal> ScottK: bug 121398 is all yours :)
[07:20] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 121398 in python-scipy "Python-scipy 0.5.2-9ubuntu2 built without umfpack module" [Medium,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/121398
[07:21] <Yagisan> Hobbsee, ajmitch - intel has 8 texture units available for fixed function opengl ?! - 
[07:22] <ajmitch> Yagisan: no idea
[07:22] <ajmitch> I just use the laptop, I don't care what goes on inside
[07:22] <Student> crimsun, Heh, thanks, but they told me to look here, because no one over there knows how to fix it. I'v been going there for 2 days straight and I even posted on the forums - no one can figure it out. Sorry to have bothered you, not my intention, but I was desparate.
[07:23] <Yagisan> ajmitch, thats what your output says. I need to fix some bad design assumptions in my spec
[07:23] <ajmitch> lucky you
[07:23] <nixternal> application complete and sent!
[07:23] <ajmitch> what were you assuming?
[07:24] <Yagisan> ajmitch, 4
[07:24] <Yagisan> 4 max, and 2 average
[07:24] <ajmitch> interesting
[07:25] <ajmitch> how many in the nvidia chip?
[07:25] <Yagisan> 4 fixed function - 16 via shaders
[07:29] <Yagisan> now that is interesting. Intel opensource drivers have texture compression - ATI opensource drivers do not.
[07:29] <ajmitch> if you can trust the output from my laptop
[07:30] <Yagisan> ajmitch, Hobbsee's confirms it
[07:31] <ajmitch> ok
[08:10] <TheMuso> You gotta love electrical work being done.
[08:11] <Hobbsee> hehe
[08:14] <StevenK> TheMuso: How much longer are the renevations going on for?
[08:14] <TheMuso> StevenK: Another couple of weeks or so.
[08:15] <TheMuso> The worst is over however.
[08:16] <TheMuso> StevenK: We had power off for so long today because our power board was being stripped back and upgraded.
[08:16] <StevenK> Ah
[08:16] <StevenK> I find it amusing when electrians talk of "upgrading" a distribution board.
[08:17] <StevenK> That's not an upgrade, it's removing the old bit and putting something new in!
[08:17] <TheMuso> heh
[08:18] <TheMuso> Anyways, its all circuite brakers with safety switches now.
[08:19] <StevenK> There's five or six seperate circuits at my place, which surprised me when the electrian pointed it out.
[08:19] <TheMuso> There was also bodgy cabling on one of the power point circuites that needed replacing. Seems like one of the previous ownsers had work done, and lighting cable was used for a power point circuite.
[08:19] <StevenK> Hah, nice.
[08:19] <TheMuso> Oh yeah.
[08:20] <StevenK> We have a little bit of dodgy cabling at our place. The previous owner was 1) an electrical contractor, and 2) a big DIY kind of guy. Do the math. :-/
[08:20] <TheMuso> StevenK: Why did it surprise you?
[08:21] <StevenK> TheMuso: Given the age of the house, I was expecting one circuit for all of the powerpoints, and another for the lights.
[08:21] <StevenK> TheMuso: Instead, there's two each for powerpoints and lights, one for the air con, and I think another for the oven and stove.
[08:22] <ajmitch> StevenK: it could be worse
[08:22] <StevenK> ajmitch: Oh?
[08:23] <TheMuso> StevenK: Stoves always have their own circuites.
[08:23] <TheMuso> There is a good chance also that your aircon may use more than one phase
[08:23] <ajmitch> it could have been a really incompetent electrical contractor
[08:23] <StevenK> ajmitch: From all accounts, he was kind of.
[08:24] <StevenK> std::string operator()(const std::string &word) const;
[08:24] <StevenK> Damn my C++ knowledge.
[08:24] <StevenK> How do I call that?
[08:25] <jml> apprehensively
[08:25] <StevenK> Hah
[08:26] <StevenK> I'm guessing it's the same as __call__ for Python.
[08:26] <Fujitsu> It is.
[08:26] <StevenK> Neat.
[08:26] <Fujitsu> So whateverobject(some_string_reference)
[08:27] <StevenK> Patch hacked, we'll see if it builds now.
[08:27] <ajmitch> sigh, snow
[08:28] <jml> as if it snows
[08:28] <ajmitch> jml: cold in tasmania yet?
[08:28] <jml> freezing
[08:29] <jml> but only in the conversational, non-technical sense
[08:29] <ajmitch> now imagine dunedin...
[08:29] <jml> there's snow on Mt Wellington
[08:29] <jml> ajmitch: when I was visiting, the weather was about the same in Dunners as here.
[08:29] <ajmitch> I don't think it's snowing yet tonight, but it's meant to
[08:29] <StevenK> And what's bad about snow?
[08:29] <TheMuso> Its snowed on the mountains in the last few days.
[08:29] <ajmitch> StevenK: it's cold
[08:29] <TheMuso> Only localized, but yeah.
[08:29] <ajmitch> and I have to go outside in 15 minutes
[08:30] <StevenK> It's hit 5 degrees here over the last few nights.
[08:30] <ajmitch> wow
[08:30] <ajmitch> I didn't think it was possible
[08:30] <TheMuso> StevenK: It hasn't felt much more than that up her.
[08:30] <TheMuso> at times
[08:30] <ajmitch> I think we have have got up to 5 degrees here today
[08:30] <TheMuso> ajmitch: Oh its possible, where I used to live, we used to get 1-2 degrees.
[08:30] <ajmitch> it was about 3 degrees at 3pm
[08:31] <jml> government says it's 5 degrees now
[08:31] <jml> but that's probably what they want us to believe
[08:31] <highvoltage> jml: and you trust them!?
[08:31] <Fujitsu> It only got down to 7.9 degrees degrees overnight, but it was 0.1 when I left the house at 7am a week ago.
[08:32] <ajmitch> highvoltage: wouldn't you trust your government?
[08:32] <ajmitch> hint: they're probably reading what you type right now
[08:32] <StevenK> Fujitsu: Sigh. That gives me: error: 'pStemmer' cannot be used as a function
[08:33] <Fujitsu> StevenK: The method isn't static or anything strange like that?
[08:34] <StevenK> Fujitsu: It's const, but not static
[08:34] <highvoltage> ajmitch: no way!
[08:34] <highvoltage> ajmitch: I wouldn't be surprised if they did :)
[08:37] <StevenK> Fujitsu: Any ideas?
[08:39] <Fujitsu> StevenK: You are trying to execute an instance and not the class, right?
[08:40] <StevenK> I'm not certain.
[08:40] <Fujitsu> Can you pastebin the code that's failing?
[08:40] <StevenK> Not easily, it being 1,606 lines.
[08:40] <Fujitsu> Ah.
[08:41] <StevenK> It does: Xapian::Stem *pStemmer = NULL; and then pStemmer = new Xapian::Stem(...);
[08:41] <StevenK> So I'm guessing that I'm playing with an instance.
[08:42] <Fujitsu> And Xapian::Stem is the class that has operator()?
[08:42] <Fujitsu> If so, that should be working.
[08:43] <StevenK> Yes.
[08:44] <StevenK> pStemmer(term);
[08:44] <StevenK> And that's what I'm calling.
[08:51] <StevenK> Fujitsu: Can I point you at the package and my patch?
[08:53] <Fujitsu> StevenK: Sure.
[08:54] <Fujitsu> I might be a little laggy, due to preparing for the school formal tomorrow night.
[08:54] <StevenK> Oh, pish posh.
[08:55] <StevenK> Fujitsu: Do you have a date?
[08:55] <Hobbsee> Fujitsu: are you going to get pictures?
[08:55] <Hobbsee> dholbach: will be your date, i'm sure
[08:55] <StevenK> Heh
[08:55] <dholbach> good morning
[08:55] <dholbach> hey Hobbsee
[08:56] <dholbach> Hobbsee: what are you talking about?
[08:56] <Fujitsu> I wasn't going at all until 2 days ago. :(
[08:56] <StevenK> Splat!
[08:56] <Hobbsee> dholbach: Fujitsu's school formal.  he wants a date
[08:56] <Fujitsu> um, sure.
[08:56] <StevenK> Fujitsu: Oh, and then what happened?
[08:56] <dholbach> date for what?
[08:56] <Hobbsee> dholbach: he wants to go ballroom dancing, but cant without the date
[08:56] <Hobbsee> dholbach: formal / prom
[08:57] <Hobbsee> dholbach: maybe the term is a prom in germany?
[08:57] <dholbach> ahhhhhhhhhhhhhh ok
[08:57] <dholbach> where do I have to be when? :)
[08:57] <Fujitsu> StevenK: Some people decided that I had to go, and got quite a number of teachers/coordinators onto me.
[08:57] <StevenK> Twitch.
[08:57] <Hobbsee> heh
[08:57] <Hobbsee> formals are fun
[08:57] <qball> Hobbsee: !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[08:57] <Hobbsee> hiya qball!
[08:57] <Fujitsu> Noo, not fun! Evil!
[08:58] <LaserJock> morning dholbach 
[08:58] <dholbach> hey LaserJock
[08:58] <dholbach> how're you all doing?
[08:58] <LaserJock> Fujitsu: I got emails this morning that ubuntu-motu-science and ubuntu-motu-tex mailing lists have been created
[08:58] <dholbach> ubuntu-motu-tex?
[08:59] <LaserJock> I sent a reply saying that I don't think the TeX list should be -motu- since most of the packages we're interested in are in Main
[08:59] <dholbach> wouldn't ubuntu-tex have been good enough?
[08:59] <dholbach> ah ok
[08:59] <dholbach> :-)
[08:59] <LaserJock> I requested ubuntu-science and ubuntu-tex 2 months ago
[09:00] <Burgundavia> dholbach: is there a way to get a community member to work ont eh mailing list situation?
[09:00] <Burgundavia> especially given jono appears to have dropped off the face of the earth
[09:00] <Hobbsee> Burgundavia: which in partiuclar ML?
[09:00] <Burgundavia> Hobbsee: I have two people bugging me for mailng lists
[09:00] <Burgundavia> -emacs and the UMC people
[09:00] <dholbach> Burgundavia: I talked to him yesterday, he has not dropped off the face of the earth :)
[09:01] <Burgundavia> right
[09:01] <dholbach> Burgundavia: I don't know how community members could help with that
[09:01] <Burgundavia> right
[09:01] <Burgundavia> I know it is going to be moving to LP soonish
[09:02] <Fujitsu> LaserJock: Yay! Finally.
[09:02] <LaserJock> the whole thing?
[09:02] <Burgundavia> the mailing list interface, at least
[09:02] <StevenK> Yeah, but isn't isn't everything moving to LP "soonish"
[09:02] <Burgundavia> pretty much
[09:02] <LaserJock> I know they plan is to get mailman for teams soon
[09:02] <LaserJock> *the
[09:02] <Burgundavia> I am rather cynical about LP due dates
[09:02] <LaserJock> heah, they are getting better
[09:02] <dholbach> that's not really fair
[09:02] <Fujitsu> Burgundavia: I'm not so much any more, after they implemented the MOTU bug targetting stuff in just a couple of months.
[09:03] <LaserJock> Joey's got them working on milestones
[09:03] <LaserJock> and regular releases
[09:03] <Burgundavia> right
[09:03] <dholbach> and they're producing quality software
[09:03] <Fujitsu> It seems to be working a bit, too.
[09:03] <Burgundavia> there are good things happening
[09:03] <dholbach> I can't remember a LP crash in the last time
[09:03] <Burgundavia> ouch
[09:03] <Burgundavia> I guess my memory still stretches back to 04 and 05
[09:03] <LaserJock> I see all the bug work they do
[09:03] <LaserJock> Rosetta is still taking a lot of resources
[09:04] <Fujitsu> Every couple of months it'll go crazy for a few hours or over a weekend and be unusable.
[09:04] <Fujitsu> It is a *lot* better than it used to be, though.
[09:06] <somerville33> Hey dholbach
[09:07] <dholbach> hey somerville33
[09:08] <somerville33> Oh, I'm somerville32
[09:14] <LaserJock> hmm, is it an issue if I still have hdX and not sdX for hard drive partitions?
[09:14] <Fujitsu> LaserJock: No, not everything has transitioned to libata yet.
[09:16] <LaserJock> hmm, ok
[09:16] <LaserJock> does that depend on the brand/model of hard drive?
[09:16] <StevenK> No, of the IDE controller.
[09:18] <LaserJock> ah, makes sense
[09:18] <LaserJock> I wonder why mine hasn't, ah well
[09:18] <StevenK> My IDE controller had, but I've jumped to a SATA drive since.
[09:19] <LaserJock> I have an older IDE controller, I haven't "upgraded" to SATA ;-)
[09:21] <LaserJock> blah
[09:21] <LaserJock> I'm struggling to get my swap back
[09:21] <LaserJock> so I can hibernate this laptop
[09:21] <LaserJock> I stupidly let Fedora format my swap partition
[09:21] <LaserJock> that's what I get I suppose
[09:22] <LaserJock> anyway, good night all
[09:22] <StevenK> LaserJock: You can read the UUID off of it
[09:22] <LaserJock> I did
[09:22] <LaserJock> but it seems it didn't like it or something
[09:22] <LaserJock> I'll try a few more reboots tomorrow
[09:48] <somerville32> What was that application that I was recommended to run to generate more entropy?
[09:49] <StevenK> bonnie++
[09:49] <somerville32> thanks
[09:50] <somerville32> Hmm...
[09:50] <somerville32> How quickly should it automagically work?
[09:50] <somerville32> Oh
[09:50] <somerville32> Question answered.
[09:57] <dholbach> hum... is there any reason we should have a "pbuilder-etch create" section on PbuilderHowto?
[09:57] <dholbach> I mean, I'm happy for it to be somewhere, but I think it's more confusing than anything else to new users
[09:58] <RAOF> A sid one, maybe.  But etch?
[09:59] <dholbach> but still I think it's confusing
[09:59] <RAOF> Maybe a Sid one should be under "contributing to Debian" somewhere, but I agree that the etch one probably shouldn't be on PbuilderHowto
[10:04] <somerville32> Is MoM not running anymore?
[10:06] <somerville32> Oh, I was looking at multiverse
[10:31] <icf7> Slightly OT: How can I (re)define a make variable in a make rule?
[10:44] <BugMaN> hi all
[10:45] <BugMaN> someone can update this page: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/TODO with the "new status" because links on bitesize,packaging and more are break
[10:45] <Fujitsu> BugMaN: They shouldn't be broken; they're meant to redirect.
[10:46] <Fujitsu> Hm, right, they do break for some reason.
[10:47] <BugMaN> Fujitsu: the new status in lp
[10:47] <BugMaN> Fujitsu: the redirect must be change 
[10:47] <Fujitsu> I don't think so. My links automatically redirect to the new statuses.
[10:47] <Fujitsu> And that was mentioned in the spec or email.
[10:48] <BugMaN> Fujitsu: Launchpad give me this error : Unexpected form data
[10:49] <Fujitsu> I suspect something else has changed, but I have to leave now.
[10:49] <BugMaN> Fujitsu: don't worry daniel carry it
[10:55] <geser> dholbach: Hi. Is it ok to sync telepathy-mission-control 4.24 (or even 4.26) from Debian? (bug #120633)
[10:55] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 120633 in telepathy-mission-control "Sync telepathy-mission-control 4.24-1 from debian unstable" [Undecided,Incomplete]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/120633
[10:55] <dholbach> geser: yes
[10:57] <geser> thanks, will update the bug
[10:59] <dholbach> gracias
[10:59] <dholbach> can somebody help out updating the links on  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/TODO ?
[10:59] <dholbach> I changed some already - it's because of the LP status change that some don't work no more
[11:24] <RainCT> :o is this change explained somewhere?
[11:28] <LucidFox> Can Rosetta be used with Qt4 applications?
[11:29] <geser> check the mail archives for ubuntu-bugsquad or ubuntu-devel-discuss
[11:29] <geser> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-discuss/2007-June/001186.html
[11:29] <geser> has somebody an idea where I can download the multidistrotools?
[11:32] <RainCT> and when will Triaged, Won't Fix  and Todo be added?
[11:33] <LucidFox> Also, how is kdecopy different from normal qt4?
[11:35] <BugMaN> RainCT: just now, or not?
[11:35] <RainCT> no, I can't see them
[11:36] <BugMaN> RainCT: yes, i see
[11:43] <RainCT> geser: thanks
[11:53] <TheMuso> geser: Multi distro rules?
[11:56] <geser> TheMuso: see http://tiber.tauware.de/~lucas/versions/
[11:57] <TheMuso> geser: Thanks.
[11:58] <geser> but the pages aren't updated anymore
[11:58] <ajmitch> that should be easy to fix
[11:58] <ajmitch> it's just a cronjob on tiber
[11:59] <geser> lucas said it was stopped due to resource limits
[11:59] <ajmitch> aha
[11:59] <ajmitch> yes, cronjobs disabled
[11:59] <ajmitch> siretart: was it killing things?
[12:00] <siretart> ajmitch: we are having bandwith problems on tiber
[12:00] <ajmitch> ok
[12:00] <siretart> ajmitch: serverpronto is shaping us down becase we are causing more than 500g traffic/month
[12:00] <ajmitch> I'll stick it on aurora (imbrandon's box)
[12:01] <ajmitch> ah...
[12:01] <siretart> which sucks
[12:01] <ajmitch> I wonder if imbrandon would be open to us moving REVU onto there :)
[12:01] <siretart> doko: you asked me on tuesday to remind you about an python2.5 upload to unstable today :)
[12:02] <doko> siretart: you are wron
[12:02] <doko> g
[12:02] <doko> plus EWCHAN
[12:03] <siretart> oh, indeed. sorry
[12:12] <ajmitch> nixternal: diving in, I see
[12:47] <geser> lucas: are the multidistrotools somewhere available for download?
[12:48] <man-di> geser: in bzr
[12:48] <lucas> well, just copy the dir in tiber:~lucas
[12:48] <lucas> will be easier
[12:48] <lucas> I'm not sure of the updateness of bzr
[12:48] <lucas> or svn
[12:49] <lucas> (there's an svn too, on alioth, since the long term goal is to get this into debian as a generic tool to follow derivatives)
[12:49] <lucas> I could run that on people.d.o instead of tiber
[12:49] <lucas> siretart: any ETA on the end of the bw problems on tiber?
[12:52] <siretart> lucas: I'm still waiting on feedback from newz2000
[12:52] <lucas> ok
[12:52] <lucas> well, keep me updated. I don't mind moving that stuff to gluck
[12:53] <lucas> but it's generally harder to get packages installed on gluck if something is missing
[12:53] <siretart> lucas: I think if you can do it on gluck or alioth, better move it there, at least for now
[12:53] <siretart> TBH, I'd prefer to relocate revu to somewhere else than tiber
[12:54] <siretart> we still have problems with the machines regarding the kernel, and serverpronto seems to be not helpful at all with this regard
[12:55] <geser> man-di: the one mentioned at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MultiDistroTools? I tried it but the server doesn't respond
[12:55] <lucas> ok
[12:58] <geser> lucas: I found the source at http://tiber.tauware.de/~lucas/pkg/multidistrotools/ but the .dsc and the .orig.tar.gz give a Forbidden (the deb can be downloaded)
[01:03] <gnomefreak> can a revu admin remove adept from revu if it wasnt already removed by riddell (we had communication breakdown)
[01:07] <lucas> geser: don't use that.
[01:07] <lucas> geser: just copy the dir
[01:08] <geser> lucas: I don't have a login on tiber, and can't find any other version at http://tiber.tauware.de/~lucas/
[01:09] <lucas> so the best is probably to wait until the issues are sorted out
[01:09] <joejaxx> Good Evening All
[01:09] <lucas> or to bug siretart so that I can re-enable the crons :)
[01:09] <joejaxx> i mean Morning
[01:09] <geser> ok, will be patient then
[01:33] <Fujitsu> geser: The latest mdt is probably in ~laserjock
[01:36] <geser> Fujitsu: siretart pointed me already to his bzr repo of lucas' copy
[01:36] <geser> Fujitsu: do you know what was changed?
[01:39] <gnomefreak> jdong: are you around i would like to know if gnash is (by backports team able to be backported) i already have builds for it for feisty and seems to work good in feisty so far no issues that i know of.
[01:40] <lionel> gnomefreak: I have filled a backport request for feisty. Also tested here and it works well
[01:41] <gnomefreak> lionel: all i need is ok and ill send the sources for it
[01:47] <gnomefreak> lionel: what bug number is it you filed for gnash backport?
[01:47] <Fujitsu> geser: I'm not quite sure. It has been a while since I looked at lucas'
[01:47] <lionel> gnomefreak: you are allowed to upload backports ?
[01:47] <dholbach> gpocentek, ajmitch, crimsun: shall we auto-discard gutsy-changes-owner's mails?
[01:47] <dholbach> gpocentek, ajmitch, crimsun: also ftp.debian.org-whateveritis?
[01:48] <gnomefreak> lionel: no but i have them ready and can give them to someone that is allowed 
[01:48] <lionel> gnomefreak: some source change is needed ?
[01:48] <lionel> gnomefreak: Bug #120990
[01:49] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 120990 in feisty-backports "backport gnash 0.8.0~cvs20070611.1016-1ubuntu2" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/120990
[01:49] <gnomefreak> lionel: i believe there was some changes in control needed but i woul dhave to go back and look at it to be sure
[01:49] <lionel> When I tested I did not have to change control file
[01:51] <gnomefreak> lionel: give me a sec ill check
[01:52] <gnomefreak> your right it was changed for gutsy.
[01:55] <lionel> so if no changes are needed, backport is automatic (no manual upload I mean)
[02:02] <ajmitch> dholbach: sounds good
[02:08] <highvoltage> goodnight ajmitch 
[02:08] <zul_> toodles ajmitch 
[02:17] <gnomefreak> if running prevu in feisty does it automaticly grab from gutsy?
[02:19] <lionel> gnomefreak: you have to give prevu a .dsc
[02:19] <lionel> give prevu gutsy .dsc
[02:19] <gnomefreak> oh
[02:22] <gnomefreak> so i have to grab .dsc of the package i want to build with it?
[02:25] <xxxxx1> good morning all!
[02:26] <gnomefreak> where would i put the .dsc?
[02:28] <gnomefreak> would be nice if it stated that in instructions :(
[02:28] <ScottK> nixternal: Thanks.  I'm on it.
[02:30] <lionel> gnomefreak: in argument iirc
[02:31] <AnAnt> Hello, when is the next sync with Debian ?
[02:32] <AnAnt> and how do I request a sync for a certain package ?
[02:33] <lionel> gnomefreak: should be  DISTRO=feisty prevu http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/g/gnash/gnash_0.8.0~cvs20070611.1016-1ubuntu2.dsc
[02:33] <gnomefreak> AnAnt: normally file a bug report 
[02:34] <lionel> autosync should run again
[02:34] <gnomefreak> hmmm
[02:34] <gnomefreak> ill play with it later, thank you
[02:35] <lionel> gnomefreak: np :)
[03:01] <gnomefreak> lionel: is prevu known not to work?
[03:01] <lionel> hum... no
[03:01] <gnomefreak> lionel: i get usage info when i run it
[03:01] <gnomefreak> but nothing happens.
[03:02] <Fujitsu> gnomefreak: How are you running it?
[03:02] <lionel> gnomefreak: I personnaly don't use prevu as I have a stock of pbuilder :)
[03:02] <gnomefreak> DISTRO=feisty prevu http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/g/gnash gnash_0.8.0~cvs20070611.1016-1ubuntu2.dsc
[03:03] <Fujitsu> You probably have to have the source package locally.
[03:03] <gnomefreak> than hell i will stick with the way i normally build
[03:03] <gnomefreak> its easier
[03:03] <Fujitsu> How?
[03:04] <gnomefreak> dpkg-buildpackage
[03:04] <gnomefreak> its worked for me for a while i dont see what prevu does that is better than that
[03:13] <kane77> gcc is build dependency, I assume?
[03:13] <Fujitsu> No. You don't build-depend upon anything that is in build-essential.
[03:15] <kane77> I use script to show me all the packages a program depends on... and it showed gcc should I put it anywhere?
[03:16] <man-di> kane77: the package build-essential and its dependencies are assumed to be installed
[03:16] <TheMuso> Fujitsu: Sbuild is good if you aren't using NFS shares to share your Ubuntu work between several machines...
[03:16] <Fujitsu> TheMuso: What's wrong with that?
[03:16] <TheMuso> Fujitsu: Getting the NFS share mounted in the sbuild chroot thats all.
[03:17] <Fujitsu> My /home is on a LUKS partition and not in fstab. I just modify one of the things in /etc/schroot to mount it as well.
[03:18] <TheMuso> One of the scripts in setup you mean?
[03:18] <Fujitsu> /etc/schroot/setup.d/10mount
[03:18] <TheMuso> Ah right.
[03:18] <TheMuso> thought that was it.
[03:19] <TheMuso> anyways, I'm off to bed.
[03:19] <Fujitsu> Night.
[03:19] <TheMuso> Night.
[03:30] <jekil> someone can review please? http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5663
[03:31] <ScottK> jekil: Is tablelist uploaded already?
[03:31] <jekil> ScottK: is in NEW
[03:32] <ScottK> jekil: Then this package still needs to wait on that to get out of NEW and into the repos so we can build it.
[03:32] <ScottK> jekil: Your changes address my comments, so until I can build it, I don't have anything to add.
[03:33] <jekil> ScottK: thanks, and how much time need a package to be moved to NEW into repos?
[03:35] <ScottK> jekil: It varies depending on the backlog and how much other stuff the archive admins have to deal with.  You can see what's going on with NEW and where your package is in the queue here: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/gutsy/+queue
[03:35] <jekil> ScottK: thanks a lot :)
[03:42] <mok0> I've added GNU autotools to a package. Is it better to keep it in the source dir, so it goes in .diff.gz, or is it better to create a dpatch file? The first is easier for me, since I can edit the files.
[03:46] <ScottK> mok0: If you make a dpatch, you can edit the files using dpatch-edit-patch.
[03:46] <persia> mok0: I'd recommend putting it in a patch, just to keep the package clean.  It's a little harder to edit, but it makes it easier to maintain the patch as new revisions, etc. are released.
[03:46] <mok0> persia: ok, thanks!
[03:47] <mok0> persia: I didn't know about dpatch-edit-patch, I'll try it out!
[03:47] <persia> mok0: ScottK deserves the credit for that: his keyboard is faster :)
[03:48] <mok0> Heh, I didn
[03:48] <mok0> 't see that
[03:48] <ScottK> nixternal: Uploaded with some very minor adjustment.  Thanks.
[03:49] <mok0> Ooops it's my Cherry compact keyboard :)
[03:49] <nixternal> no problem....glad I could help
[03:49] <mok0> ScottK: thx :)
[03:50] <mok0> ScottK: ... and thanks for reviewing my packages.
[03:50] <ScottK> mok0: No, thank you for contributing.  We'll have you a MOTU in no time.
[03:51] <mok0> ScottK: My ambition is to contribute to the science edition of Ubuntu.
[03:51] <mok0> There's quite a lot of free software especially for bioinformatics
[03:51] <DarkSun88> Hi all
[03:51] <jekil> a virtual package needs copyright file? if yes is the copyright of tha packaging right?
[03:51] <ScottK> mok0: Have you joined the Science team yet?
[03:52] <mok0> Errr. I think so, but you have to be approved.
[03:52] <mok0> I am still in the queue for that.
[03:54] <ScottK> OK.  Dunno, just wanted to make sure you knew about it.
[03:54] <Nafallo> damnit!
[03:55] <Nafallo> just accidently send apt-cache show gnash to a channel.
[03:55] <Nafallo> sent even
[03:55] <mok0> ScottK: But I haven't figured out what the launchpad teams actually _do_ and how they work.
[03:55] <ScottK> mok0: It depends on the team.  Generally ones like the science team are bug contacts for related packages.
[03:56] <mok0> ScottK: I think it would be good to discuss what a science edition should contain, and how it should be organized.
[03:57] <ScottK> mok0: Laserjock is the person to talk to.
[03:58] <mok0> ScottK: I'll strike up a conversation with him when I meet him
[03:59] <ScottK> Fujitsu: New python-scipy version is uploaded that actually builds with the current python-numpy.  Next question is, of course, does it work ...
[04:21] <mok0> dpatch-edit-patch is COOL!
[04:23] <ScottK> mok0: Welcome to a real packaging system.
[04:24] <mok0> ScottK: ;-)
[04:25] <mok0> Btw, what does ~ mean in package names?
[04:25] <StevenK> It's a version seperator, that sorts lowest
[04:44] <bmm> Hi everybody. I'm being told to remove the dependency on build in the install target in debian/rules. However, dh_make put it there from the beginnig
[04:44] <bmm> Why is this still wrong and should I really remove this??
[04:45] <bmm> (the package is ccbuild http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5572 )
[04:47] <somerville32> Does anyone know who ivoks is?
[04:48] <Nafallo> yes
[04:49] <bmm> persia: if you have time, could you reconsider advocating ccbuild http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5572 ? Thanks!
[04:49] <persia> bmm: You can safely ignore that.  In cases where build-stamp is not used, having dual rule dependencies can call a rule twice (and indeed "build" is called twice), but as build only depends on build-stamp, which should exist after the first build, there's not much waste, and nothing is likely to go wrong.
[04:49] <somerville32> Nafallo: Who is it?
[04:49] <bmm> persia: thanks!
[04:50] <Nafallo> Ante Karamati
[04:50] <Nafallo> somerville32: ^
[04:50] <somerville32> Nafallo: Male? Female?
[04:50] <Nafallo> Male
[04:50] <Nafallo> how come?
[04:50] <persia> bmm: If you ever have a debian/rules with build in .PHONY and actual commands in build:, these commands will be run twice, which may lead to unexpected results.
[04:51] <somerville32> Nafallo: I wanted to know his gender so that I can refer to him with the proper pronoun 
[04:51] <somerville32> Nafallo: Do you know if he is around often?
[04:51] <bmm> persia: ah, good to know.
[04:51] <somerville32> I'm working on wifi-radar and he has made quite a few superfluous ubuntu-specific changes and I was wondering if he ever passed it upstream
[04:51] <Nafallo> hehe. usually daily
[04:51] <Nafallo> ah :-)
[04:52] <somerville32> Like... a lot of changes. lol
[04:53] <Hobbsee> StevenK: will tell you about wifi-radar, iirc
[04:53] <StevenK> Hobbsee: Hrm?
[04:54] <Hobbsee> StevenK: werent you fixing lots of bugs in it before?
[04:54] <StevenK> Not that I remember.
[04:54] <StevenK> I get hit in the head a lot...
[04:55] <somerville32> It is mostly ivoks and a bit of doko in the changelogs
[04:55] <somerville32> But it appears that a lot of bugs were fixed by just patching the package instead of passing the patches upstream
[04:58] <somerville32> For example, ivoks changed it so that it uses gtk.gdk.threads* instead of gtk.threads*
[04:58] <somerville32> Modified the GUI to change how some text is displayed in a label
[04:58] <persia> bmm: Commented, but not advocated.  My apologies for missing the issue previously.
[04:59] <bmm> persia: NP, better to know it then having a broken upload
[04:59] <somerville32> Why would he move the config file from /etc/wifi-radar/ to /etc/ ?
[05:00] <persia> bmm: It might work as it is, but the buildd behaviour is best understood with the entrails of small animals, so it's best to be extra careful.
[05:00] <bmm> persia: hehe. See the problem with the cp now, stupid when you look at it
[05:02] <bmm> persia: as I'm uploading it again, I could just as wel fix the dependency thing in the debian/rules
[05:03] <bmm> It won't break anything as far as I can see, and it might bring in another advocate
[05:03] <bmm> persia: would you be ok with that?
[05:05] <persia> bmm: Your call.  I don't think it needs to be fixed, but Jrmie does.  You might want to seek a third opinion, from someone more familiar with the internals of the package build scripts.  The presence or absence of that dependency will not affect my opinion of the package.
[05:06] <bmm> Any MOTU: I'm looking for somebody with a strong opinion on build script internals and the templates of dh_make.
[05:06] <StevenK> Just ask your question.
[05:07] <bmm> In http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5572 the comment by jcorbier@ubuntu.com is telling me to remove a dependency in the debian/rules line
[05:08] <bmm> This dependency was placed there by dh_make and doesn't brake anything. Should I honor the request and remove it or leave it there?
[05:10] <PhinnFort> where can I get automake 1.6?
[05:10] <PhinnFort> it doesn't seem to be available in the reps anymore
[05:11] <Hobbsee> PhinnFort: you cant
[05:11] <PhinnFort> meeeh
[05:11] <persia> PhinnFort: Would any of automake1.4, automake1.7, aitomake1.8m automake1.9, or automake1.10 work for you?  There's an effort to reduce the number of versions shipped.
[05:11] <Hobbsee> iirc
[05:11] <mok0> bmm: Obey your MOTU you must
[05:11] <Hobbsee> mok0: they both are MOTU's.
[05:11] <PhinnFort> persia: I guess I could work around it...
[05:11] <mok0> Ooops
[05:12] <Hobbsee> :P
[05:13] <persia> PhinnFort: That would be preferred.  If you really need it for a private project, you can get it from https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/automake1.6/1.6.3-12, but packages built against this will not be accepted into Ubuntu at this time.
[05:13] <PhinnFort> oh, ok
[05:13] <PhinnFort> it's kcam, btw, rather old app
[05:13] <bmm> mok0: I'm looking for the democratically chosen decision now. I've got a "don't care" and "do it", no others yet.
[05:13] <PhinnFort> guess I have to hack on it a bit anyways
[05:14] <mok0> dh_make is pretty crappy IMHO
[05:14] <bmm> mok0: so you would advocate a package where the dependency was removed?
[05:14] <mok0> yes
[05:15] <somerville32> What should I do if debian and ubuntu have a similar patch but they do the opposite thing? lol
[05:15] <bmm> ok :-D
[05:15] <mok0> but I'm not a motu :-)
[05:16] <bmm> I don't care anymore, I need some kind of decision here :-D
[05:16] <persia> somerville32: In general, preserve the Ubuntu behaviour, unless there is a clear testcase why the Debian behaviour is better and more suited to an Ubuntu installation, in which case this should be documented in the changelog (and you should check to make sure you aren't reopening any bugs).
[05:16] <Hobbsee> then again, our patches can be old
[05:16] <Hobbsee> so it depends on waht it is, etc
[05:17] <persia> Right.  I should amend that from "a clear testcase" to "a good reason".
[05:18] <somerville32> It looks like the debian package is based off the ubuntu package with a few twists and now I'm  trying to make that ubuntu package be based off the debian package. wonderful.
[05:18] <somerville32> *the
[05:19] <PhinnFort> heh. it wanted automake 1.6 OR NEWER;)
[05:20] <somerville32> If we've divided a patch into two and the debian patch is still in one file, should I just go back to the one file to reduce the delta?
[05:20] <persia> PhinnFort: one of 1.9 or 1.10 is probably the best choice, so that the package doesn't need another update soon.
[05:20] <PhinnFort> ok
[05:20] <shawarma> somerville32: Why did we split it in the first place?
[05:20] <PhinnFort> but now it wants autoconf 2.52, 2.53 or 2.54
[05:20] <somerville32> shawarma: The only guess I can make is to make it more logical?
[05:21] <shawarma> somerville32: It *possible* I guess, but unlikely.
[05:21] <somerville32> brb
[05:21] <shawarma> somerville32: If that truly is the reason, whoever did it should be introduced to Hobbsee's stick.
[05:21] <persia> Were the two Ubuntu patches by the same author?
[05:22] <somerville32> Yes and the original patch was too
[05:22] <somerville32> (I believe)
[05:23] <shawarma> Er.. Debian had one big patch... Some Ubuntu person split it up.. right?
[05:23] <persia> shawarma: I'm not sure about that.  If Ubuntu packages something first (with two patches), and the Debian maintainer merges them (even though they touch different files), who needs poking?
[05:23] <shawarma> persia: Oh, we did it first?
[05:23] <somerville32> We packaged wifi-radar first
[05:23] <shawarma> persia: I though the ubuntu delta was just "split this big patch into two".
[05:23] <somerville32> The ubuntu package is not based off of debian's package.
[05:23] <shawarma> Now *that* would be crack.
[05:23] <somerville32> shawarma: I think that debian took our package.
[05:24] <persia> shawarma: I totally agree with that :)
[05:24] <shawarma> somerville32: Alright then. Just keep theirs.
[05:24] <somerville32> As in debian's?
[05:24] <shawarma> somerville32: Yup. Less work for us.
[05:24] <somerville32> Can I drop the the gui patch too?
[05:24] <shawarma> somerville32: That's just a general rule, though. There could of course be good reasons to keep it, but I havne't looked at the package.
[05:25] <somerville32> -               self.current_network.set_text( "Connected to %s ip(%s)" % ( current_ssid, current_ip ) )
[05:25] <somerville32> +               self.current_network.set_text( "Connected to %s (IP address: %s)" % ( current_ssid, current_ip ) )
[05:25] <shawarma> somerville32: Does the changelog contain a bug reference that explains why that patch was introduced?
[05:26] <shawarma> somerville32: It looks sort of pointless.
[05:26] <persia> somerville32: You might want to hunt bugs for that.  If there was an "unclear language" bug, it makes sense to keep that delta.  If not, it doesn't.
[05:26] <somerville32> bug #97447
[05:26] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 97447 in wifi-radar "Formatting error in GUI" [Low,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/97447
[05:27] <Toadstool> g'morning!
[05:27] <persia> somerville32: In that case, keep the delta (to keep the bug closed).
[05:27] <shawarma> Alright then. Keep it, and make a clear note of it in the changelog (ie: Make sure the bug number is there)
[05:28] <somerville32> I'll pass it upstream so that we can remove it later
[05:29] <persia> Toadstool: Hi.  bmm was asking about the install: build dependency for ccbuild.  I don't see why it's bad, as build only depends on build-stamp (which can't be called twice because the build-stamp file exists the second time.  Do you strongly feel dh_make is wrong in this case?
[05:29] <somerville32> doko: Hey
[05:30] <Toadstool> persia: well, if you take a look at the buildlog in a pbuilder, it is called twice
[05:30] <Toadstool> lemme double check
[05:31] <persia> Toadstool: Right.  build is called twice, but it doesn't actually do anything the second time.  Now I want to check again :)
[05:33] <bmm> persia Toadstool: I've uploaded a version with the build dependency removed. As you both don't seem to be against removing it, and the build still worked, I decided to remove it.
[05:34] <ScottK> nixternal: python-scipy built on all archs.  Thanks again.
[05:34] <bmm> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5685
[05:34] <nixternal> woohoo!
[05:35] <Toadstool> bmm: awesome.  I just wanna make sure it doesn't break anything in some weird build corner case though.  persia's fault :)
[05:36] <ScottK> mok0: Your next upload (for btk-core) will just replace it, so there's no real need to nuke.  You've commented it doesn't need reviewing, so that's enough.
[05:36] <persia> It builds for me, but I don't know that there isn't some tool out there that expects debian/rules install to do the right thing.
[05:36] <mok0> ScottK: ok
[05:40] <Toadstool> hmm even if I remove the dependency on build in install, build is called twice wtf
[05:40] <persia> Toadstool: On review, I'm going to agree with you on this.  I'm really not sure why it doesn't block, but it appears to that both config.status and build-stamp are ignored (perhaps as out-of-date) for the second build call (but make all is not fooled, so it doesn't cause an issue).  Now I have another thing I don't like about dh_make to add to the list.
[05:41] <bmm> Toadstool: even with the new upload? http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5685
[05:43] <mok0> This is probably a dumb question, but it seems packaging practices have changed. Instead of having debian/ in a diff, why not just have it in a tarball?
[05:44] <Toadstool> bmm: yup
[05:44] <ScottK> mok0: It's usually stored as diff.gz in the archives, so it is.
[05:45] <persia> mok0: it's easier to apply a diff with patch, and there once wasn't dpatch-edit-patch or cdbs-edit-patch.  Now, it's too much trouble to change all the tools and retrain the four or five thoulsand people familiar with the old system.
[05:45] <mok0> True
[05:45] <bmm> Toadstool: weird, and it's going above my head at tismoment
[05:45] <Toadstool> i'm quite confused too, actually
[05:46] <mok0> But it seems there is an effort to separate the pristine sources from the packaging
[05:46] <mok0> ... which is one thing I like about rpm
[05:47] <ScottK> mok0: Yes.  Upstream stuff goes in orig.tar.gz and packaging stuff goes in /debian.
[05:48] <ScottK> mok0: In fact most packaging repositories don't even keep the upstream stuff in their revision control system.  See the svn for Debian Python Modules Team as an example: http://python-modules.alioth.debian.org/
[05:50] <mok0> wow
[05:54] <ScottK> Good afternoon stratus.  Ironic you should show up now.  I mentioned DPMT svn as an example not 5 minutes ago.
[05:54] <persia> The double build even occurs when building only for a single arch (and not calling binary-indep:).  Perhaps it's supposed to do that for some reason, although it seems new to me.
[05:55] <Toadstool> I've never seen that before
[05:57] <mok0> What to do if the upstream source comes in two packages?
[05:57] <mok0> I mean two tar.gz's
[05:58] <Sikon> mok0> can you build a separate deb package out of each one?
[05:58] <persia> mok0: Generate two source packages.  Generally, one is safely -data.
[05:59] <Sikon> on an unrelated note, what does "dfsg" in version numbers stand for, and what is it there for?
[05:59] <mok0> I have a situation where the tarball contains patches and extra files to put onto another program
[06:00] <ScottK> Sikon: Debian Free Software Guidelines - It means the source was repacked to remove stuff that wasn't dfsg Free.
[06:03] <persia> mok0: Are they the same upstream?  If not, perhaps you could extract the patches into debian/patches, and credit the patchers in the dpatch comments and in debian/copyright.
[06:03] <mok0> persia: no, different developers
[06:04] <mok0> persia: but I think that's the way to go
[06:15] <Sikon> what's better if I want to continue an abandoned SourceForge project - to file an APT request or to fork it under a different name?
[06:16] <Sikon> (there was only one developer, who apparently disappeared completely in 2003)
[06:16] <ScottK> If it's since 2003, I'd say just fork it unless you are aware of a significant user base.
[06:19] <shawarma> Sikon: Which projecT?
[06:19] <Sikon> KInk
[06:20] <Sikon> granted, not much of a project - though I did port it to Qt4 and libinklevel 0.7 and eliminate the kdelibs dependency
[06:21] <stratus> ScottK: re
[06:21] <stratus> ScottK: somebody just unplugged my ac, I've no battery so go figure. :/
[06:28] <ScottK> stratus: Lovely.  How's debconf?
[06:29] <stratus> ScottK: cool, superb, hmm I'm really tired now and looking forward to finish some stuff in time to publish, pack my gear and go back home.
[06:29] <stratus> ScottK: there's so much cool stuff going on
[06:30] <ScottK> mok0: stratus is one of the founders of the Debian Python Modules Team.  He's also the guy that arm-twisted ^h ^h ^h ^h ^h inspired me to write https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ContributingToDebian/PythonModulesTeam
[06:30] <ScottK> stratus: Sounds great.  Enjoy.
[06:31] <stratus> I've founded a lot of other stuff, but linux magazine also only pointed out DPMT. I don't know why. :-P
[06:31] <Nafallo> hmm
[06:31] <Nafallo> debmirror is imbrandon, right? :-)
[06:32] <bmm> Any MOTU: ccbuild is looking for it's second advocate http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5685 or comments ;-)
[06:40] <slytherin> The latest gstreamer bad plugin package in gutsy is missing many new plugins. Should I file a bug for it?
[06:41] <Sikon> my opinion is, if you think there's a bug, file a bug - they'll sort it out
[06:41] <Nafallo> slytherin: that or speak to slomo :-)
[06:41] <slytherin> Nafallo: Yes, I came here looking for him.
[06:42] <slytherin> Nafallo: Looks like a small change is needed to .install file.
[06:42] <Nafallo> oh my. he's offline again then :-P
[07:00] <Nafallo> ehrm. bzr-builddeb borked?
[07:03] <LaserJock> ok MOTU and Hopefuls, I need your help
[07:03] <ScottK> Heya LaserJock, what's up?
[07:04] <LaserJock> I need bugs in Launchpad that affect our work
[07:05] <LaserJock> we have https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad-project/+bugs?field.tag=motu
[07:05] <LaserJock> but I'd like to add some more bugs
[07:06] <LaserJock> I've also got an older list at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JordanMantha/Launchpad
[07:06] <Nafallo> LaserJock: just for the sake of it, or because they actually exist? :-)
[07:07] <LaserJock> because they actually exist
[07:08] <LaserJock> I want to know if something about Launchpad is blocking your work
[07:08] <LaserJock> or making it more difficult
[07:08] <Nafallo> indeed. not that I'm aware of.
[07:08] <Nafallo> except bzr should be smarter ;-)
[07:09] <Nafallo> but already talked to ddaa about that :-9
[07:09] <Nafallo> :-)
[07:09] <geser> LaserJock: it's just wishlist but I'd like to see bug #92960 fixed (it's already on your wiki page under misc)
[07:09] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 92960 in soyuz ""Show builds" for source packages has a bad default" [Wishlist,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/92960
[07:09] <LaserJock> Nafallo: yes, I agree
[07:09] <LaserJock> I wonder if there is a bug for that
[07:09] <Nafallo> no idea :-)
[07:11] <Nafallo> if I have an ubuntubranch for all devs and then publish a specific branch for a bugfix it should use the first branch as a repo IMO. not upload everything again :-)
[07:11] <LaserJock> geser: got it
[07:11] <Nafallo> it doesn't even use repos for several branches of the same thing if you have team owned by the same user :-P
[07:12] <Nafallo> AFAIK
[07:12] <LaserJock> Nafallo: if you find a bug or file one for that I'll have a look. :-)
[07:13] <Nafallo> I think I spoke to ddaa on IRC last time I got annoyed :-)
[07:13] <LaserJock> Nafallo: bug #108386
[07:13] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 108386 in launchpad-bazaar "Use high-performance smart server for hosting bzr branches" [High,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/108386
[07:14] <pochu> LaserJock: Bug #75391
[07:14] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 75391 in malone "+packagebugs doesn't list packages for teams" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/75391
[07:15] <ScottK> LaserJock: Can we put NOT restricting setting In Progress and TODO to -dev members on that list?
[07:15] <Nafallo> LaserJock: doesn't entirely solve it I'd guess, but it's a start :-)
[07:15] <LaserJock> pochu: oh, that is a good one
[07:15] <pochu> Sure it is :)
[07:16] <LaserJock> ScottK: hehe, I'd rather not. That's more of a "make sure MOTU is kept in the loop better on those sorts of changes" than a bug
[07:16] <leonel> can I work  on  bug  115687
[07:16] <leonel> can I work  on  bug #115687
[07:16] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 115687 in sun-java6 "java6 update1 is released, please update" [Low,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/115687
[07:19] <pochu> LaserJock: bug 116309 seems trivial, but would be a good improve.
[07:19] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 116309 in soyuz "LP: #nnnn should be linked to the bug report." [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/116309
[07:21] <LaserJock> what do you guys think about bug #32405 ?
[07:21] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 32405 in soyuz "Would be nice to have UI indication of upload status." [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/32405
[07:22] <pochu> LaserJock: looks interesting.
[07:23] <LaserJock> that should allow REVU contributors to see the status of their uploaded packages better
[07:24] <pochu> LaserJock: also bug 113963
[07:24] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 113963 in malone "the packagebugs columns should open the corresponding bugs list" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/113963
[07:24] <ScottK> LaserJock: Don't forget Bug #82745.  It's still out that AFAIK.
[07:24] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 82745 in malone "Not all tagged bugs show up in when querying by tag" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/82745
[07:25] <geser> LaserJock: do you know if bugs which are tracked for several ubuntu versions (e.g. security bugs) get shown in the normal bug list if the Ubuntu task gets closed?
[07:25] <keescook> geser: frustratingly, they are not in the normal bug list, afaict.
[07:26] <ScottK> LaserJock: About the status thing, I think it's better to talk about it now when it's not yet deployed than to wait and have another big mailing list flail followed by bugs that get wontfixed and some of us annoyed.
[07:26] <LaserJock> ScottK: I agree
[07:27] <LaserJock> geser: what do you mean by normal bug list?
[07:28] <ScottK> LaserJock: I've got an unrelated issue for you with your motu-science hat on ...  We now (for the first time) have a python-scipy that builds with the current python-numpy.  I can tell you it builds, but not if it actually works.  Now would be a good time for some of you sciency types to test it...  It might be a good topic for your shiny new mailing list.
[07:28] <geser> LaserJock: the "generic" buglist e.g. https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xchat/+bugs
[07:30] <LaserJock> ScottK: ah, thanks.
[07:31] <LaserJock> geser: so if the main task gets closed, even if other tasks are open, it doesn't show up?
[07:31] <geser> only at the bugs list for the distro
[07:31] <LaserJock> for example, the main task is "Fix Released" but there is a Feisty or Edgy task that is still "Confirmed"
[07:32] <geser> I've an old example: bug #58564
[07:32] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 58564 in php4-yaz "php4-yaz won't install (broken dependency)" [Medium,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/58564
[07:32] <LaserJock> ah
[07:33] <pochu> LaserJock: right, though they will show up on bugs.lp.net/ubuntu/feisty and bugs.lp.net/ubuntu/feisty/+source/<package>
[07:33] <geser> it only appears on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/dapper/+source/php4-yaz/ but not on https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/php4-yaz/+bugs
[07:33] <pochu> of course change feisty with <release>
[07:33] <leonel> keescook:  can the   bug #115687 be raised  as security update ?
[07:33] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 115687 in sun-java6 "java6 update1 is released, please update" [Low,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/115687
[07:34] <LaserJock> geser: is there a bug report for that?
[07:34] <geser> LaserJock: will look
[07:34] <slytherin> Does anyone have any plan for packaging 'fop' from apache's xmlgraphics project?
[07:35] <ScottK> slytherin: Look for a needs-packaging bug on LP.
[07:35] <slytherin> ScottK: Ok.
[07:36] <ScottK> If you decide to work on it slytherin, then file one that says so so no one else starts...
[07:36] <keescook> leonel: sure, mark it as such and attach any CVEs you can find for it.
[07:36] <slytherin> ScottK: I am very new to packaging and I don't know what is usually policy for java bsed apps.
[07:37] <LaserJock> slytherin: I don't think fop is able to make it into the repos
[07:37] <leonel> keescook: and ... that update how can be done  ?  it' depends  from the jdk distros    or  is there a team working on that package ?
[07:37] <LaserJock> slytherin: it *might* be able to go into Multiverse. You should check to make sure Ubuntu is free to distribute it
[07:37] <slytherin> LaserJock: Why, is there any problem with it's licensing?
[07:37] <leonel> keescook: there's a lock in  importance   
[07:38] <keescook> leonel: I have no idea.  perhaps ask doko?
[07:38] <leonel> keescook:  ok
[07:38] <leonel> doko: ping 
[07:38] <LaserJock> slytherin: yes
[07:39] <slytherin> LaserJock: :-(
[07:39] <doko> ubuntu usually follows debian policy for java packages
[07:40] <slytherin> LaserJock: I have no idea about why fop should be in multiverse. Anyway, I will file a bug. Let's see if anyone picks up.
[07:41] <LaserJock> slytherin: it isn't Free in the Debian sense
[07:41] <slytherin> LaserJock: Please give me particular reason. I am not very familiar with Debian's definition of Free.
[07:44] <LaserJock> slytherin: I don't remember the particulars
[07:44] <slytherin> LaserJock: Ok.
[07:44] <LaserJock> slytherin: http://www.debian.org/social_contract#guidelines
[07:49] <leonel> and how can we get  the sun-java fixed ?
[07:49] <leonel> what can I do ?
[07:49] <slytherin> leonel: What do you mean by fixed?
[07:51] <leonel> slytherin: get http://download.java.net/dlj/binaries/jdk-6u1-dlj-linux-i586.sh   packaged for ubuntu 
[07:52] <Nafallo> hmm
[07:52] <Nafallo> my routing to aurora is kind of strange :-)
[07:52] <leonel> slytherin:  it fixes  bug #115687 
[07:52] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 115687 in sun-java6 "java6 update1 is released, please update" [Low,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/115687
[07:52] <aquo> hi
[07:52] <Nafallo>  8:  195.54.125.173  asymm 14 173.338ms 
[07:52] <Nafallo> 1684234849:  195.54.123.49   asymm 13 -184817.-421ms 
[07:52] <Nafallo> 10:  195.54.125.190  asymm 11 213.238ms 
[07:52] <Nafallo> :-P
[07:52] <aquo> is there some documentation on remastering ubuntu install media?
[07:53] <slytherin> leonel: I don't think it will make to fiesty. Is that affecting your work?
[07:54] <leonel> not my work  
[07:54] <leonel> slytherin: my   net surfing   since I have the javaplugin enabled
[07:54] <ScottK> Once it's in Gutsy it might be possible to get it in feisty-backports
[07:54] <leonel> slytherin:  and  many  users  out there
[07:55] <slytherin> leonel: The reason I asked, what fix do you think in the new release is essential for standard users?
[07:56] <aquo> if you don't have any clue for me, maybe can you give me contact information to somebody who is responsible for mastering install media ...
[07:56] <aquo> does anybody know where i can find the xubuntu seeds for germinate?
[07:56] <LaserJock> aquo: you can find info on remastering on the wiki
[07:57] <aquo> LaserJock: where?
[07:57] <LaserJock> aquo: and the seeds are at launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/+branches
[07:57] <leonel> slytherin: http://sunsolve.sun.com/search/document.do?assetkey=1-26-102934-1
[07:58] <aquo> LaserJock: that are just the seeds for ubuntu
[07:58] <LaserJock> aquo: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LiveCDCustomization and https://help.ubuntu.com/community/InstallCDCustomization
[07:58] <LaserJock> aquo: no
[07:58] <LaserJock> aquo: that has seeds for all the official derivs
[07:58] <aquo> ah, nice
[07:58] <aquo> that is what i searched fo.
[07:58] <slytherin> leonel: Then mark that bug as 'security vulnerability' bug
[08:02] <cbx33> any people wanting to discuss vcsfrenzy we're meeintg now in #vcsfrenzy
[08:02] <slytherin> leonel: I added the CVE link to that bug
[08:07] <jussi01> evening all
[08:07] <leonel> slytherin:  great !   do you think   we can get the new  java 6 ?
[08:07] <leonel> slytherin: or  what can I do  to get it done ?
[08:08] <slytherin> leonel: I am not a motu, just another user. Al you can do is wait.
[08:10] <leonel> slytherin:  :(
[08:11] <leonel> ScottK: do you have a buildable clamav  0.90.3  package  for  dapper 
[08:12] <jussi01> lol
[08:15] <ScottK> leonel: I haven't built one, but it's not hard.
[08:15] <ScottK> There are only two changed you need to make in debian/control.
[08:15] <Nafallo> aurora down?
[08:16] <leonel> ScottK: so  replace  the source and edit  deban/control  from the  88.2 ?
[08:16] <ScottK> leonel: No.
[08:16] <ScottK> I'll tell you the change, just need a second to look it up.
[08:17] <leonel> ScottK: not urgent !
[08:17] <leonel> ScottK:  i mean  not need to be now  just  i'd like  to have  a buildable  a newer clamav for dapper  and  keep the latest  there 
[08:19] <ScottK> leonel: You need to change the build-dep for dpkg-dev to match the version in Dapper and change the dep in one of the binary packages from {binary:Version} to {source:Version} (or something very close to that) and it should work.  I did it with 0.90.1.
[08:19] <slytherin> slomo: ping
[08:29] <bmm> zakame: If you get back online, I've uploaded a new version of an earlier advocation by you, adapting for the comments given. See http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5685 if you have some spare time. Thanks!
[08:31] <leonel> ScottK:  I had problems  with clamav-test  package
[08:31] <leonel> ScottK: thank you 
[09:07] <tsmithe> hi; could i ask for some reviews?
[09:08] <tsmithe> in fact, hang on...
[09:13] <mshima> ScootK: man page is needed for grandr?
[09:14] <mshima> ScootK: There is no command parameter
[09:17] <ScottK> mshima: Yes for the man page.
[09:18] <ScottK> mshima: Even if the man page is just a stub that points you to where the real information is, it's still required by policy.
[09:19] <mshima> ScootK: Ok
[09:19] <ScottK> mshima: ScottK, not ScootK.  Tab completion is your friend.
[09:20] <mshima> ScottK: thks
[09:32] <geser> mshima: are you aware of the Debian ITP for grandr? http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2007/06/msg01044.html
[09:35] <geser> and there is a applet for the gnome panel which is also called grandr (but luckily is installed in /usr/lib/gnome-panel/)
[09:37] <mshima> geser: Didn't know
[09:38] <mshima> geser: This means Ubuntu will wait for debian package?
[09:39] <geser> not necessarily, you can still package it
[09:39] <mshima> ok
[09:40] <geser> but it's better to work with Debian on it to not duplicate work
[09:41] <ScottK> Since we are past Debian import freeze for Gutsy, there's no harm in finishing the package here for Gutsy and then working with the Debian packager to get into Debian.  You just synch over the Ubuntu package for Gutsy +1
[09:42] <mshima> great
[09:43] <mshima> how dh_installman works?
[09:44] <Kmos> mshima: man dh_installman
[09:44] <ScottK> in debian/rules a line that says dh_installman [filename_with_path_in_the_package] 
[09:46] <geser> ScottK: we still can sync packages from Debian but is has to be requested by a bug
[09:46] <geser> new packages can be synced till end of august
[09:46] <ScottK> geser: Yes.  That's true.  He could do it either way.
[09:46] <somerville32> Whats the command to filter patches?
[09:47] <ScottK> It certainly wouldn't hurt to e-mail the person that filed the ITP and discuss it.
[09:48] <geser> the ITP was done by David Nusinow, part (or even head) of the Debian X.org Team
[09:51] <ScottK> Well that's a good argument for letting him do it if his schedule supports Gutsy.  Lenny's got a long run to go so he may not be on our timeline.
[10:06] <ScottK> Apparently we've been defying Microsoft again: http://news.digitaltrends.com/news/story/13317/ubuntu_defies_microsoft although the story appears to be poorly researched in some aspects (read the comments), so who knows.
[10:10] <mshima> Uploading
[10:10] <mshima> no lintian warnings :)
[10:13] <ScottK> mshima: For the .deb too?
[10:14] <mshima> ScottK: Didn't try
[10:14] <ScottK> mshima: Do that.  That's where the last batch I commented on came from.
[10:14] <mshima> ScottK: Ok
[10:20] <mshima> ScottK: 1 more
[10:21] <mshima> ScottK: done
[10:21] <ScottK> Make sure the new package builds and check the .deb again...
[10:23] <mshima> built ok, installed ok, trying at pbuilder now
[10:24] <mshima> built successfully at pbuilder
[10:24] <tsmithe> does a new package to ubuntu have to have a changelog with only one entry? ubuntu studio's art packages have more than one as they've been around for a while, in a separate repository
[10:25] <tsmithe> i'm currently looking at getting them reviewed and uploaded
[10:27] <mshima> ScottK: lintian (source and binary) ok, pbuilder ok.. anything else?
[10:28] <ScottK> mshima: Probably not.  I don't have time to look at it again now, however.
[10:29] <mshima> ScottK: no problem
[10:29] <ScottK> tsmithe: Not sure if they HAVE to, but that's generally how it's done.
[10:29] <tsmithe> ok. i'd rather not mangle them, really
[10:38] <ScottK> tsmithe: From an Ubuntu perspective, the packages are new, so it's really irrelevant.  If you want to preserve the history, put it on a web site somewhere.
[10:38] <tsmithe> hmm ok
[10:38] <tsmithe> they are going to be native as well, so i guess i will
[10:40] <ScottK> mshima: Took a look at the diff.  From your man page.. "+grandr \- program to do something" - A little too generic I think.  Additionally, it's probably worth at least mentioning how to start the program (even if it's click on the buttin in $SECTION of the menu).
[10:48] <mshima> I have changed that
[10:48] <mshima> ought
[10:50] <mshima> one minute
[10:51] <mok0> Heh! I have a clean slate now. Seven packages in REVU, revised and ready for another round of reviewing.
[10:52] <mshima> ScottK: don't have a .desktop for now
[10:52] <ScottK> mshima: How does one start the program then?
[10:53] <mshima> terminal :) I will create a .desktop
[10:53] <ScottK> mshima: However one starts it ought to be in the man page.
[11:01] <mshima> ScottK: should I put this in the Description?
[11:01] <ScottK> No, in the man page.
[11:02] <mshima> In the description in the man page
[11:02] <mshima> ?
[11:02] <ScottK> Oh.  
[11:02] <ScottK> I'd add a section for it.
[11:03] <ScottK> mok0: Congratulations on getting your first package into Ubuntu.
[11:06] <mok0> ScottK: yay!
[11:06] <mok0> Time for a beer :-)
[11:07] <Toadstool> :-)
[11:07] <poningru> beer?
[11:07] <poningru> where?
[11:13] <LaserJock> Burgundavia: fine, I'm here
[11:13] <Burgundavia> LaserJock: right, that bug
[11:14] <Burgundavia> https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/809
[11:14] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 809 in launchpad "Easy way to request packages" [Wishlist,Confirmed]  
[11:14] <ajmitch> LaserJock!
[11:14] <LaserJock> hi ajmitch 
[11:14] <Burgundavia> I would just close it, if that workflow works for the MOTU
[11:14] <LaserJock> bah
[11:14] <LaserJock> Burgundavia: I think it does
[11:15] <mshima> ScottK: uploaded
[11:15] <ajmitch> LaserJock: it's ok,  by the time I care enough to get back to ubuntu, my -dev & -core-dev membership will have expired :)
[11:15] <LaserJock> Burgundavia: we've replaced that big scary wiki page with https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/Candidates
[11:21] <Burgundavia> closed bug and marked spec as obsolete
[11:22] <Spec> yeah, i am obsolete.
[11:24] <LaserJock> Burgundavia: coolio
[11:25] <Burgundavia> Spec: you chose the nick :)
[11:36] <Toadstool> wow, Hobbsee and LaserJock core devs? congrats'!
[11:36] <bashelier> doko: around?
[11:36] <Toadstool> bashelier: if it is about gcc, I think there is an #ubuntu-toolchain chan
[11:37] <bashelier> Toadstool: ok thanks :)
[11:41] <xxxxx1> bye all!
[11:45] <somerville32> Toadstool!! :)
[11:46] <Spec> Burgundavia: years and years ago, when i was 13 and didn't know about linux ^.^
[11:47] <Fujitsu> You didn't know about Linux when you were 13? Aw...
[11:47] <qball> did linux exist then?
[11:48] <ScottK> It certainly didn't exist when I was 13.
[11:48] <ScottK> When I was 13, I think there were S100 bus 8080 computers available, but certinaly no Linux.
[11:49] <ScottK> And I had to walk to school through the snow up hill, both ways... ;-)
[11:49] <qball> ScottK: up hill both coming and going to school?
[11:50] <Fujitsu> qball: Yes, the topology biased itself against people walking. Those were the days!
[11:51] <mok0> ScottK: Why didn't you walk in the opposite direction? 
[12:01] <Toadstool> hey somerville32 
[12:01] <somerville32> How are you?
[12:02] <Toadstool> quite good, you?
[12:06] <jrib> anyone willing to be the second reviewer of http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5639 ?  Thanks in advance
[12:06] <somerville32> I'm doing alright :)
[12:11] <nixternal> MOTU: bug 121640 needs an upload please...thanks
[12:11] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 121640 in ksensors "Please merge Ksensors (0.7.3-14) from Debian(main)" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/121640