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stdinhmm, k3b 1.0.2 just came out, any chance of feisty packages (in -backports maybe)?01:01
Riddellstdin: if someone packages it and tests it01:08
stdinhmm, maybe I should learn how to make a proper .deb :p01:09
Riddellstart with the current, make a new .orig, copy across the debian directory, debuild to build01:27
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doc_hi there01:30
Riddellhi doc_01:33
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ScottKRiddell: I gave pitti a ping on the pinentry MIR.  Didn't get much in the way of a response.  I guess wait and see now...03:34
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ScottKnosrednaekim: The crowd in #kubuntu is generally less unruly.04:49
nosrednaekimScottK: heh... whoops.. wrong channel04:49
nosrednaekimvery ture04:49
ScottKAlso, the language police would tell it you were shocked by the number of people there, not the amount.04:50
nosrednaekimgrammer NAZI's...04:50
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ScottKDidn't mean to scare him off...04:51
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mhbpygi: I'd go for a discussion here11:02
mhbHobbsee: ^^11:02
mhbif you two don't mind, of course11:02
pygijust shoot11:02
mhbthe thing I argue about is the concept11:03
pygiof changing the regular dialog that k3b shows anyway? :P11:03
mhbwe don't have any pop-up about installing codecs in Kaffeine, because there is no upstream code that enables us to do it11:03
mhbthis one is also about installing codecs11:04
pygimhb, you could easily write a patch11:04
mhbpygi: why thank you :o) unfortunately, I can not, because I don't have neither time nor experience with kaffeine code to patch it11:05
mhbpygi: that's a side note11:05
pygimhb, I was referring to anyone, not you specifically :P11:06
mhbpygi: what I'd welcome is popping that dialog up only when a user requests encoding/decoding a proprietary encoded media11:06
pygiwell, I thought that's what we're having here? :PP11:07
mhbpygi: AFAIK, k3b pops-up the dialog on startup11:07
mhbpygi: at least it did for me11:07
pygiHobbsee, ? is that true?11:07
pygimhb, but still,the dialog clearly explains what you get and what your options are11:08
mhbI might be wrong, though11:08
Hobbseenot in my extremely limited k3b experience.11:08
mhbpygi: oh yes, it's on startup11:12
pygio well11:12
mhbpygi: I agree the current dialog is not very helpful11:12
mhbwhat I disagree with is that k3b is useless without the codec11:13
pygimhb, it's not useless11:13
pygithe dialog will be precise and show correct info, don't worry11:13
mhba pop-up on startup is a way to inform a user about a thing he necessarily needs to know before he starts using the app11:14
mhband this is not the case, IMHO11:14
pygithis is the upstream problem, not ours really. We'll just inform the user of choices.11:15
mhbwell, the distribution of proprietary codecs is more or less our problem11:15
pygiwell, we won't distribute those11:16
mhbI think the policy in Ubuntu is "offer installing them when the user needs them"11:16
pygiyes, I know11:16
mhband that's what we should stick to11:16
pygibut I have no idea how much patching would that require11:16
pygiupstream should be notified that it should move the dialog to a more appropriate place11:16
pygimail Trueg and tell him about the reasoning?11:16
mhbI probably will do that. He also might disagree with our policy and might want to keep his - "once a part of k3b is missing, report it to the user"11:17
pygitrue, but ...11:18
pygiit's really more sane to display the dialog when user requires the functionality11:18
pygimhb, please keep me informed11:18
mhbpygi: don't worry, I will11:18
Arbypygi: since we're on the subject, is that also true of the 'cdrecord will be run without root privileges' message at startup (i.e. it's an upstream thing)11:19
pygiArby, hm? wodim is ran without root privileges AFAIK11:19
pygiArby, what do you mean?11:20
Arbypygi: yes, but the message at startup imlies something needs to be done but doesn't say what11:20
Arbythat message11:20
pygiimage doesn't exist? :P11:20
Arbymissing /11:21
Arbyshould work now11:21
pygiyup, it works11:21
Arbybig red warning at first start up11:21
pygiah, k3b will always report that since joerg requires cdrecord to be run as root11:21
Arbyimplies I need to configure something but doesn't tell me anything about how11:22
mhbthe description should be changed11:22
pygiArby, file a bug11:22
mhbremove the SUSE references and add Ubuntu help11:22
Arbyas long I know it is a bug then I will11:22
pygiArby, but IMHO we shouldn't put suid or run wodim as root11:23
pygithat's part of why wodim is there anyway :P11:23
Arbypygi: I have no idea about the technical end11:23
pygiI do :)11:23
ArbyI'm just saying it's a bad message :)11:23
pygitrue, but we can't get a better one11:23
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pygior put "Solution: Just ignore it :P"11:23
Arbyfine for me, not so great for first time user :)11:24
Arbybut I agree it's hard to do much about it11:24
Arbyoh well, I'll file a bug11:25
mhbpygi: we can get a better message11:25
pygiArby, and what should I do with it?11:25
Arbypygi: I don't know, that's why I'm asking you, you were the one who said file a bug11:26
mhbArby: file a bug, post a link here. Suggest a better message in that bugreport.11:27
pygiArby, yea, but we can't do anything about it, and I've got no idea on what it should state11:27
pygimhb, but what would that "better message" be?11:27
mhbpygi: "it is highly recommended to run k3b with admin privileges. <some more info about why> To solve this, add your user to the appropriate group in the User Management tool in System Settings.11:29
mhbor if the solution is different, post a different solution. I don't get that message here, so I presumed a group is all it takes.11:30
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pygimhb, but it's not recommended :P11:30
ArbyI'm beginning to wish I'd never asked :)11:30
mhbpygi: it is "highly" recommended, that's what the first message said11:31
mhbArby: is that a bad solution? Or my bad English?11:31
pygimhb, well, the message is wrong :P11:31
pygi(at least for ubuntu)11:31
Arbymhb: nothing wrong with your english11:31
pygiwhere cdrkit people claim that wodim doesn't need to be ran with root privileges11:31
Arbyjust two people giving me different answers11:31
Arbyand now I don't know what the 'right' thing to do is11:32
mhbArby: both saying "file a bug", right? :o)11:33
pygimhb, I say no bug :P11:33
ArbyI rest my case :)11:33
pygihaha :)11:33
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ArbyI'm not the expert here, you two decide and tell me what you want :P11:34
mhbArby: okay, you and me think you should file a bug11:40
Arbybut it's going to land on pygi's to do list and he says no11:40
mhbArby: do that, it could get rejected but the information won't get lost11:40
Arbymhb: fair enough, will do11:41
mhbArby: more people are able to write patches of this "minitude" :o)11:41
pygimhb, it's not about writing the patch, that isn't the problem11:42
pygiwe're talking more technical discussion here :P11:42
mhbpygi: of course11:42
=== pygi should just remove cdrecord/wodim support from k3b :P
Arbypygi: if I file the bug is it going to come to you anyway?11:44
pygiArby, sure11:44
Arbyin which case lets miss out launchpad and you make the call.11:44
Arbypygi: what do you think is best?11:45
pygiwhat about this ... I go to lunch, and when I'm back we discuss? :P11:45
Arbyno bug ?11:45
Arbyfine with me :)11:45
pygigreat, thanks :P11:45
=== mhb is for bug, though
pygiyou learn about the reasons of cdrkit/wodim existance, and differences with wodim vs. cdrecord :)11:46
mhbpygi: could be we're the only ones who will be interested in it11:46
pygimhb, doesn't matter, two is two ... so it matters :)11:46
Arby ahem, 311:46
pygiok, ok, 3 :P11:46
pygibut who's the third?11:46
mhbpygi: it might matter in the future11:46
Arbyyou, mhb and me ?11:46
pygiyou can't count me :P11:47
Arbyoh OK it is 2 then :)11:47
mhbpygi: say somebody posts the same one, or a similar one11:47
pygimhb, lunch first pls? :) I'm late already :P11:47
Arbyanyway, food now, discussion later11:47
mhbokay, enjoy it!11:48
pygithanks, yay :)11:48
pygiperhaps I'll think better when I eat :P11:48
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=== Hobbsee points to http://community.livejournal.com/customers_suck/ for anyone interested - top 2 entries
Hobbseeno wonder i'm going insane...12:32
pygiHobbsee, :P12:37
pygimhb, Arby : back12:37
Arbyhi pygi, hope lunch was good :)12:38
pygikindof, always the same stuff :p12:38
Arbybeen thinking while you were away12:38
pygiand what? :)12:38
Arbyare you saying that wodim/cdrecord never needs to be run as root now?12:38
Arbyin which case the message would be pointless12:39
pygiwodim doesn't need to be run as root12:40
pygithat's correct12:40
ArbyOK, so in fact the message doesn't need to be there at all?12:40
pygi(I have no idea whetever wodim folks actually fixed that, or just forcefully removed the need for root)12:40
pygiArby, for ubuntu, that's the case, yes12:40
Arbybut not for upstream?12:41
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Arbyi.e. does wodim in debian need root?12:41
pygino, wodim doesn't need root anywhere12:41
Arbyright, so how hard would it be to patch k3b to suppress that message12:42
Arbyand are there any good reasons not to do that?12:42
pygino idea, shouldn't be too hard12:42
pygimhb, wake up ^_^12:42
pygiHobbsee, also ^_^12:42
Arbybecause the current message implies there is some critical action required12:43
Arbywhen in fact it seems to be totally redundant12:43
Arbylooks like just something that no-one got around to cleaning up yet12:44
pygiwell, usually folks don't clean up stuff like that12:44
pygiin reality nobody bothers about details12:45
Arbyhmm, honestly I find that sort of message disturbing as a user12:46
pygiI understand12:46
Arbyit implies that there is something wrong that I don't understand12:46
Arbywhich means I (wrongly) blame every subsequent problem on that thing12:46
Arbywhich means I don't report geuine issues because I assume it's something I've done wrong12:47
pygiI understand12:47
mhbpygi: back12:48
pygimhb, wb12:48
Arbyso the question remains, what, if anything, is the best thing to do?12:48
pygiI could remove the message, shouldn't be too big of a problem12:48
ArbyIMHO that would be best12:49
pygiArby, did you mail trueg?12:49
pygior was it mhb who said he'll do that :P12:49
Arbywasn't me12:49
mhbpygi: me12:49
mhbpygi: no, net yet12:50
Arbypygi: do you want me to file a bug or shall I leave it with you?12:50
pygiArby, file a bug pls, I can't track everything in my head, sorry12:51
pygiArby, assign it to me12:51
pygiand post a link here, I'll make Hobbsee milestone the bug12:51
Arbypygi: OK will do, biab12:51
pygiHobbsee, if we do a lot of k3b changes, we'd probably want to stop blacklist sync from debian12:52
Hobbseepygi: if you make changes, it automatically doesnt get synced.12:55
pygiHobbsee, right, it goes to that merge thingy :)12:56
=== Hobbsee inst really paying attention ton anything
pygiHobbsee, don't worry about it, you just sit back and relax12:56
Hobbseei should study12:56
pygisame, but heh12:56
pygiHobbsee, 4 exams yay :(01:02
Arbypygi: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/k3b/+bug/12196401:03
ubotuLaunchpad bug 121964 in k3b "Gutsy: k3b has misleading system config dialog" [Undecided,New] 01:03
Arby^^that OK for you01:03
Hobbseepygi: why milestone all these bugs, if you're just goign to go and work in a group on them?01:03
Hobbseeit's just a way of work control01:03
pygiHobbsee, then don't milestone, doesn't matter :P01:04
pygibug 12196401:04
pygiassigned to me01:04
ubotuLaunchpad bug 121964 in k3b "Gutsy: k3b has misleading system config dialog" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/12196401:05
Arbywell I hope I've assigned it to the right person01:05
Arbyor someone is going to be confused01:05
pygiI have assigned it :p01:06
pygiyou didn't assign it at all :P01:06
ArbyI went back and did it, must have crossed in the ether, nevermind :)01:06
pygioh well :P01:07
Arbypygi: thanks very much :)01:07
pygiArby, mhb : thank you :)01:07
pygifor gutsy you shall have it fixed01:08
Arbyright need to go squash more bugs to compensate for the new one :)01:08
Arby\o/ hooray01:08
pygihehe :)01:08
=== Arby hugs pygi
pygiArby, do squash k3b bugs pls01:08
pygi(test, and stuff :P)01:08
ArbyI'll try, I find it quite hard to understand01:08
Arbyhappy to test if you point me in the right direction01:09
pygik, sure :P01:09
pygiyou have gutsy or what? :P01:09
pygialmost all this bugs need a test of reproducability on gutsy:01:10
ArbyOK, here goes then :)01:11
=== Arby fetches coffee and blank CDs
pygiArby, you do have rw mediums, right? :P01:12
Arbyof course01:12
Arbya spindle full01:13
=== pygi has like 250 of those :P
pygimix of dvd+rw, dvd-rw and cd-rw01:13
Arbytestbox which has gutsy on doesn't have DVD writer unfortunately01:13
pygidoesn't matter01:14
pygiArby, some bugs don't even need burning, just rather seeying if k3b can find stuff01:16
pygilike in bug #4502601:16
ubotuLaunchpad bug 45026 in k3b "K3b dont find emovix-2 and normalize" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/4502601:16
Arbypygi: OK I'll get started then01:17
pygiArby, great01:19
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Arbypygi: how do I find out what the supported burn speed(s) of a CD writer are?02:10
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Arbypygi: also I think I found a new one in the process, bug 121980, sorry :)02:41
ubotuLaunchpad bug 121980 in k3b "Gutsy: k3b hangs at 'Verifying written data'" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/12198002:41
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pygiArby, a lot of the same bug reported02:44
Arbyreally, the others I looked at looked different02:45
Arbyin the sense that mine doesn't throw any error message02:45
Arbythe others do02:45
pygiright, but still the same problem :P02:45
Arbyif you say so, best find something to dupe it against then :)02:46
pyginah, don't worry02:46
pygijust test stuff =)02:46
mhbpygi: by the way, don't you want to write sebastian (of k3b) about the dialog?02:47
mhbpygi: you seem to be active with k3b02:47
pygimhb, I'm active with anything cd-recording wise =)02:48
=== Hobbsee closes eyes and waves the magic wand and hopes that that k3b bug about the restricted stuff gets fixed soon.
Arbypygi: following our earlier discussion bug 37423 can also be marked fixed?02:49
ubotuLaunchpad bug 37423 in k3b "says i do not have permission to use cdrecord" [Medium,Incomplete]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/3742302:49
Hobbseethe bug comments are getting painful02:49
pygiHobbsee, I saw hehe :)02:49
Arbypygi: since k3b does actually work when not root in gutsy02:50
pygiArby, yea, let's leave it open for a couple more days02:50
ArbyI'll leave a comment anyway02:50
pygiArby, kk, thanks02:50
pygiHobbsee, people are just ... well ...02:50
pygiyou know what I mean :)02:51
mhbpygi: twice as great02:51
pygimhb, you're free to mail tho :P02:51
pygiit'll take some time before he responds anyway :P02:51
Hobbseepygi: people are people.  i work in retail02:52
=== Hobbsee suggests just removing all the people.
pygiHobbsee, that can be arranged02:53
Arbythus fixing bug#1 in one go, since there'd only be linux devs left :D02:53
pygibut it will not be install auto-magically02:53
Hobbseepygi: *grin*02:53
HobbseeArby: *more grin*02:53
Arbyright need to pop out for a bit02:54
Arbymore k3b later02:54
pygik, great =)02:54
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pygiHobbsee, http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=2903841&posted=1#post290384103:16
Hobbseepygi: cool03:17
pygiHobbsee, it's not cool :P It means there are severe problems in earlier releases03:19
pygi(not that we didn't knew that tho :P)03:19
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pygiHobbsee, I see more bashing on you :-/03:21
Hobbseepygi: woo!03:22
Hobbseepygi: undupe them all, if that seems more sane, and let them sit03:22
pygiHobbsee, I won't do anything03:22
pygiand you should just sit and ignore the bashes as well03:22
pygiI can just comment, and will do so03:23
Hobbseepygi: seems like male egos out in full force03:27
pygiHobbsee, ;)03:27
HobbseeOMG but i reported the bug!!!!03:27
pygiHobbsee, which one? :P03:28
Hobbseethe ones who are whinging03:28
pygiI know you reported it :P03:28
pygiyou didn't knew that? :P03:28
Hobbseeno - the guys are saying that.  that was supposed to be quoted, sorry03:29
pygik :)03:30
pygiHobbsee, I won't use that patch btw03:31
pygiwe need another wording, and a different style03:31
Hobbseepygi: yeah, didnt think so03:32
pygiand ofcourse the mention of k-r-e03:32
mhbwhat bashing?03:34
pygibtw Hobbsee++ for being calm ^_^03:34
mhbpygi: ^^03:34
pygimhb, nothing important, me and Hobbsee decided it's better to file a new bug and make all other duplicates, and people are bashing :P03:35
marseillai_Hobbsee: would you have time to revu some packages?03:36
pygimarseillai_, fire away. What ya need checked?03:36
pygiHobbsee, btw. what exactly does k-r-e consists of?03:38
=== pygi looks it up
RiddellScottK: he'll be busy with release stuff this week, it'll be next week at the earliest I guess04:16
Hobbseehiya Riddell!04:16
HobbseeRiddell: we have a bug.  https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/12145604:17
ubotuLaunchpad bug 121456 in adept "Adept couldn't open APT database" [Critical,Confirmed] 04:17
Riddella but in kubuntu?  I don't believe it04:17
HobbseeRiddell: heeh04:18
HobbseeRiddell: a critical one, in fact, imo04:18
Riddellyes, I agree04:18
Riddellit needs mvo to look at it really04:18
mhbpoor mvo04:19
pygiRiddell, we closed 15 bugs in kubuntu in two days ... so I'd say yes, a bug in kubuntu :P04:20
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mhbI bother him enough with gdebi-kde and now this :o)04:22
pygimhb, that's a soc project04:22
mhbpygi: yes04:23
mhbpygi: not his, though04:23
pygiyou're that soc student or what? xd04:23
pygiLOL, I know :P04:23
mhbpygi: how do you know about that soc project?04:24
pygimhb, because I looked over all soc projects? xD04:24
mhbpygi: cool, just wondered04:24
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ScottKRiddell: I still have to talk to seb128 about pgp config stuff, so there's no great rush on pinentry just yet.  I'll see if I can get that done if he has a slack moment during the week.04:34
pygiHobbsee, http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=2904273#post290427304:55
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Arbypygi: quick look at bug 49783, any more info I can add for you?05:04
ubotuLaunchpad bug 49783 in k3b "cannot burn mixed cd" [Medium,Incomplete]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/4978305:04
=== pygi looks
pygiArby, that should be enough, thank you05:05
ArbyOK I'll change status then05:05
pygiyup, confirmed05:06
Arbypygi: do you want it assigned to you05:06
ScottKArby: Don't change it to Triaged05:06
pygiArby, nop, no assigning.05:06
pygijust change to confirmed05:06
pygiAfter we get series of those bugs, I'll contact trueg05:07
pygihe gotta fix those bug upstream05:07
ArbyOK I see, onwards then :)05:08
mhbpygi: ask him about that notification thing as well, please05:09
pygimhb, ah, ok05:10
mhbpygi: if it's possible to make it show in a more appropriate place05:10
mhbpygi: i.e. when a prop. codec is about to be used05:10
pygiI will, I will05:11
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pygiArby, thanks for closing bug06:03
Arbyalways a pleasure :)06:04
Arbypygi: I beleive bug 93754 could also be closed?06:05
ubotuLaunchpad bug 93754 in k3b "k3b reports problems with cdrecord" [Undecided,Incomplete]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/9375406:05
=== pygi looks
pygiArby, yup, close06:06
pygithere are number of same bugs as well reported06:06
Arbyand when you've looked there bug 88934 also looks good06:06
ubotuLaunchpad bug 88934 in k3b "k3b Crashes on "Extract and Encode Audio Tracks"" [Undecided,Incomplete]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/8893406:06
Arbyjust waiting for test to complete but looks fixed so far06:07
pygiI'll close the first one06:07
pygireport on bug 88934 when you're done06:08
ubotuLaunchpad bug 88934 in k3b "k3b Crashes on "Extract and Encode Audio Tracks"" [Undecided,Incomplete]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/8893406:08
Arbyif the test is successful am I good to close it?06:08
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Arbypygi: could you look at bug 103075 also, seems to be some sort of /dev problem but it's beyond my understanding?06:15
ubotuLaunchpad bug 103075 in k3b "Can't burn a cd" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/10307506:15
pygiArby, I choose to ignore that bug :p06:16
Arbyfair enough06:16
=== Arby looks the other way
pygino idea what's he talking about, and the bug is too big for me to read :P06:16
pygiArby, what happened with 88934 ?06:17
ArbyI wish I'd ripped a shorter CD :P06:18
Arbyjust this second successfully completed, closing :)06:18
pygiyay, great06:18
pygiArby, state that it's fixed, and resolve as fix released06:19
pygithat's like 20 bugs down in two days for k3b06:20
Arbytoday has been a good day :)06:20
ArbyI feel like I did some good today06:21
pygihehe :)06:21
Arbypygi: thanks for all your help06:21
pygiArby, no, thanks for your help =)06:21
Arbynot finished yet though06:21
pygiArby, would you like to learn how to package software? I'm willing to help ^_^06:21
Arbyat some point yes, but not today :)06:22
pygiofcourse not :p06:22
ArbyI'm beginning to feel a little dazed :)06:22
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Riddellanyone want to update k3b for new release?07:47
pygiRiddell, I do07:48
pygiRiddell, nobody should touch k3b except me :p07:48
Riddellpygi: you're the man then :)07:48
RiddellNightrose: story published07:48
Nightrosethx Riddell07:48
pygiRiddell, when do we need that?07:49
pygiRiddell, i.e. how urgent? :)07:50
Riddellpygi: no urgency from my side07:50
pygiRiddell, doki, just leave the task to me then :)07:50
Riddellalthough it would be another nice thing for tribe 2, so I guess tomorrow would be cool07:50
Riddellbut not vital07:51
pygiright, you'll get it then07:51
pygiRiddell, you'll get it tomorrow07:51
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Riddellryanakca: what for?07:52
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pygiRiddell, you're making me work ... evil you :p07:56
Arbypygi: you going to want that testing $later?07:57
pygiArby, explain?07:58
pygiah, sure07:58
pygithe dollar sign made me confused =)07:58
Arby$ == for some unspecified value of later than now :)07:59
Arbywell, poke me if you do07:59
pygihelp is always welcome ;)08:00
pygiRiddell, I need to write a couple of patches as well at the same time then08:01
pygiso it's a good time08:01
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nixternal3 kubuntu users, me and the twins of course, 1 ubuntu user, and 1 xubuntu user, pimping *buntu at Barcamp Chicago style08:11
nosrednaekimwhats this? where are you guys?08:15
nixternalBarcamp is an opensource event that happens in cities all over the US (I thought the world, maybe I am wrong)08:15
nixternaleveryone comes together for talks, camping out, partying, hacking, and then some08:16
nosrednaekimah.. ok08:17
Riddellnixternal: blog blog!08:19
nixternalworking on it now :)08:19
nosrednaekimso... made any kubuntu converts?08:19
nixternalactually, there are already quite a few Kubuntu users that I found08:20
nixternalmost were using Slackware and Debian up until Feisty, and have since switched to Kubuntu08:20
=== pygi thinks everyone should switch to some sane distro
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nosrednaekimwhy hide? are you saying that kubutnu isn't sane?08:21
nosrednaekimnixternal: cool08:22
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sebbarhi, I think maxima-share should be a dependency of maxima... should I file a bug about this or something?09:29
crimsuncrimsun@Box.pts/2.~ apt-cache show maxima|grep ^Rec09:32
crimsunRecommends: maxima-share, gv09:32
crimsuncrimsun@Box.pts/2.~ apt-cache show maxima-share|grep ^Dep09:32
crimsunDepends: maxima (>= 5.12.0-1ubuntu1)09:32
crimsundebian/control clearly is written correctly in those respects.09:32
crimsunyou must avoid introducing dependency loops.09:33
crimsunif you make maxima-share a Depends of maxima, you introduce a loop.09:33
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sebbarcrimsun: sorry I'm a bit of a noob user but you're saying that there's no way to avoid that a user installs maxima, chooses a function from the menu (which is included only in maxima-share) and gets an error message which gives him no clue that he has to install maxima-share in order to install that function?09:39
crimsunsebbar: aptitude and apt-get both honor Recommends by default09:40
crimsunit is Very Bad Packaging to introduce a Depends loop, as it does very bad things on {,dist-}upgrade09:40
sebbarcrimsun: but adept doesn't?09:41
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crimsunsebbar: if it doesn't, please file a bug against the adept source package.09:41
crimsunit is _not_ a bug in the maxima source package.09:41
sebbarcrimsun: I see thanks09:42
Arbysebbar: you are correct however, I just checked, adept doesn't honour recommends09:44
pygiArby is awake :-D09:45
Arbypygi: well it's only 8:45 :P09:46
pygiArby, PM, or AM? :P09:46
Arbypygi: PM09:46
pygiright, one hour ahead of you then09:46
pygiRiddell, around?09:46
pygiIf I get an update now (i.e. in an hour) could you upload?09:47
Arbysebbar: give us a link when you've filed the bug and I can confirm it09:47
pygiArby, I'll work on updating k3b soon09:47
Arbypygi: OK, I'm not going anywhere :)09:47
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sebbarArby: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/adept/+bug/122029 no clue if it's a decent bug report, it's my first one hehe09:57
ubotuLaunchpad bug 122029 in adept "adept doesn't honour recommends" [Undecided,New] 09:57
Arbysebbar: looking, we all start somewhere :)09:57
Arbysebbar: OK it needs a lot more detail, let me comment and then you'll see.09:59
sebbarok cool :)09:59
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Arbysebbar: how important is maxima-share to the functionality of maxima?10:07
sebbarArby: I only know that the function to simplify trigonometric expressions (which is quite basic I'd say) is in maxima-share10:10
crimsunmaxima is fairly useless without maxima-share10:10
ArbyOK so maxima would be fairly inhibited without it10:10
Arbyright so adept really needs to honour recommends10:11
Arbysebbar: have a look at bug 122029 now10:11
ubotuLaunchpad bug 122029 in adept "adept doesn't honour recommends" [Undecided,Incomplete]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/12202910:11
Arbyactually I should probably have set that to 'Confirmed'10:12
sebbargreat! one more thing I learned today10:14
Arbysebbar: for future reference https://help.ubuntu.com/community/ReportingBugs might be useful10:15
sebbarArby: I bookmarked that :)10:15
Arbymanchicken_ , Riddell: is it known that adept doesn't honour recommends and is there a reason for this?10:16
Arbyother than 'no-one implemented it yet' :)10:16
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pygiok, I'm seriously confused10:31
pygiwhy did StevenK uploaded new k3b package 7 hours ago o.O10:31
=== pygi looks up the changelog
pygiah, some transition stuff10:33
crimsunyes, libflac++610:33
pygiArby, you sure bug #45026 is still reproducable?10:35
ubotuLaunchpad bug 45026 in k3b "K3b dont find emovix-2 and normalize" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/4502610:35
pygithere seems to be a patch for that10:35
pygiArby, cdrecord suid stuff also seems patched already?10:37
Arbypygi: which bit, normalize or emovix?10:37
pygiArby, normalize10:37
Arbypygi: what's there is definitely what I saw.10:38
Arbynormalize isn't found unless you specify the search path10:38
pygiArby, the patch replaces normalize with normalize-audio10:38
pygiwhich is sane10:38
pygiand should fix the problem10:39
pygithere's also a patch for cdrecord & stuff10:39
Arbypygi: the comments following the patch say that you still need to make the symlink10:40
ArbyI'm confused10:41
pygiArby, no, no10:41
pygithe patch is already in a package10:41
pygisane one (not the one on the bug)10:41
Arbyhmm, give me 5 minutes to check this, it might be my bad10:42
pygiArby, it shouldn't display that cdrecord thing as well anymore10:44
Arbywhich one, the emovix thing?10:45
Arbypygi: which cdrecord thing, the emovix dependency?10:48
pygiArby, no, the splash arguing that cdrecord should be run as root10:49
Arbyoh that, well it was doing it this morning until I checked the box to hide it10:50
Arbyhaven't checked since, one thing at a time10:50
pygik, I'm looking ito solving normalize stuff10:54
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RiddellArby: yes, it probably just needs an updated dpkgthing.cc files11:00
Riddellpygi: pong11:00
ArbyRiddell: Ok thanks11:01
pygiRiddell, this k3b patches are full of weird stuff11:01
pygithey are mostly *not* working or something11:01
Arbypygi: I've added screenshots to bug 4502611:01
ubotuLaunchpad bug 45026 in k3b "K3b dont find emovix-2 and normalize" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/4502611:01
Arbyactually adding the search path within k3b doesn't work11:01
Arbylet me test the symlink method11:02
Arbypygi: hmm, symlinking isn't working either for me11:06
pygiArby, I think I got an idea how to fix it11:06
Arbyis there something odd here or is it me11:06
pygithere's something odd11:07
pygibut I think I got it11:07
Arbywell that's a relief :)11:07
mhbRiddell: ping11:12
pygiArby, emovix I wont look today tho11:13
Riddellhi mhb11:13
mhbhi Riddell11:13
Arbypygi: fair enough that seems more awkward11:13
mhbremember your code in su.cpp ?11:13
pygiArby, I'm looking into creating a couple patches anyway11:13
Riddellmhb: mm hmm11:14
mhbit's quite complicated, at least it's hard for me to understand11:14
Arbypygi: I'll check the the splash message as well if I can find how to turn it back on11:14
pygiArby, sure, thanks11:14
mhbI'd like to find out how you were able to find out when sudo reports an error message about a wrong password11:15
Arbypygi: cdrecord message does still display at k3b start up.11:16
mhbRiddell: I'm sure Tonio won't be happy about the stuff I say now, but kdesudo has a pretty bad backend, which works by counting that the descriptions won't change11:17
mhbcounting on the fact that11:17
pygiArby, I'll see what I can do11:17
pygibut meh, that means that patch is useless as well11:17
pygiand it shouldn't be11:17
Riddellmhb: description of what?11:17
Arbypygi: some funky patching going on?11:17
pygiArby, yes11:17
Arbyoh joy :)11:18
mhbRiddell: well, stuff like "Sorry, try again."11:18
mhbRiddell: the messages sudo states11:18
Riddellmhb: kdesu is indeed complex.  it also ultimately just parses the output of sudo (or su) and hopes it won't change too11:18
Riddellit's split between kdebase and kdelibs11:18
mhbRiddell: me and RadiantFire are creating a new backend for kdesu, called SudoProcess, which is something like a SuProcess, but with all the stub stuff out11:19
=== pygi has some problems with this k3b
mhbRiddell: and optimized for sudo11:19
Riddellmhb: to solve which problem?11:19
mhbRiddell: to solve the problem of having two tools for one task11:20
mhbRiddell: two frontends, etc.11:20
Riddellpygi: I've not touched k3b in a while, you may be better asking one of the more recent maintainers (or at least someone who isn't suffering from toothache and a swolen face)11:20
pygiRiddell, that would be tonio and sealne, both not here. It's all too messy as is right now11:21
=== pygi didn't knew that somebody made k3b such as-is
pygiRiddell, I can update to 1.0.2, and create new package for later if you agree?11:21
pygiOne which'll be easier to maintain11:21
pygiso you get what you wanted, and I get a way to provide you with a better k3b in the future11:22
Riddellmhb: which two frontends?11:23
mhbRiddell: kdesu, kdesudo11:23
Riddellpygi: later is fine11:23
Riddellmhb: the only problem with kdesu is that it starts sudo to check if it really needs a password, then it starts it again to enter the password11:24
gnomefreakdoesnt kdesudo link to kdesu as gtksu and gtksudo does?11:24
pygiRiddell, no, no .. you didn't understand. You'll get the 1.0.2 package as-is right now, and later I'll create a k3b package from scratch11:24
pygiwhich will be easier to maintain11:25
mhbRiddell: hmm11:25
Riddellmhb: since sudo remembers passwords for a given pty it never remembers the password for the first pty so on the first start it always things it needs a password11:25
pygiproblem is it will diverge from debian a lot, but ...11:25
Riddellmhb: best fix is just to fix it so it only starts sudo once (although it's non trivial as I remember, else I'd have done it ages ago)11:25
mhbRiddell: hmm11:26
Riddellpygi: oh, ok11:26
pygiRiddell, you tell me what do to, and if it's ok with you11:26
mhbRiddell: yeah, probably11:26
mhbRiddell: we can probably solve this11:26
gnomefreakgksudo and gksu sorry :(11:26
pygiRiddell, I should probably mail sealne and tonio before doing so or something?11:26
Riddellpygi: yeah, good idea11:26
pygik, then update will wait after all11:27
pygiRiddell, you know sealne's LP id perhaps?11:28
pygi(sorry for bothering too much, just wanna do the required work)11:28
Riddellpygi: dunno, he's kenny duffus in real life11:29
pygiRiddell, right, thanks11:30
pygiRiddell, mail sent11:42
pygiArby, a bit harder then we thought, he? :)11:43
Arbypygi: if it was easy it would be done already :)11:44
Arbytoday has been ... educational11:45
Arbybut worthwhile11:45
pygioh well, as long as we fix the stuff somewhere in the future11:46
pygiI want not only solution for now, but for the future as well11:46
Arbyk3b is still healthier than it was 48 hours ago :)11:46
Arbyat least we know what needs doing now :)11:47
pygicca. 20 bugs closed is impressive11:47
Arbyyou must have closed a lot yesterday11:47
ArbyI only actually closed 3 today11:47
pygiArby, yup, closed a lot :)11:58
Arbypygi: great work :) bugs--11:58
Arbyright, I'm off for the night11:59
Arbynext installment of Arby's adventures in kubuntu tomorrow12:00
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