=== Starting logfile irclogs/ubuntu-mobile.log
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=== Topic for #ubuntu-mobile: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileAndEmbedded
=== Topic (#ubuntu-mobile): set by mdz at Mon May 14 14:24:09 2007
happycubenokia 770's @ woot for $129.9507:14
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pwnguinis the nokia internet tablet an intended target of ubuntu-mobile?07:26
pwnguincuz there's 770s on sale for 125 at the moment07:30
happycubenot at first go07:34
happycubeit'd have to be arm based and they'd have to get past all the non-open bits07:34
pwnguinis this not targetting the ARM platform?07:36
happycubenot at first07:37
pwnguin"at first"07:37
happycubei'm not sure07:38
pwnguineverything i read screams, nokia tablets07:38
pwnguinexcept for Intel's "new low power intel chipset"07:39
happycubeit's that07:39
pwnguinif i were conspiratorial, id imagine canonical was hired to develop a platform for a new nokia (or intel) tablet07:40
happycubeoh we know that already ;)  intel is sponsoring it07:41
pwnguinx86 low power07:42
pwnguini guess it doesn't matter much07:43
pwnguini already have an x86 toshiba tablet07:43
pwnguinits a little strange, reading the open mailing list of a secret project07:48
happycubeit's not a secret ;)07:59
happycubeintel's detailed plans for MID's and <=2w 45nm pentium-m's07:59
happycubesecret would be if AMD was planning something, which they can't/won't07:59
happycube(for one thing it'd mean an ATI video chip... i'm suuuure shuttleworth would go along with bundling fglrx)07:59
pwnguinthey could open the drivers ;)08:03
pwnguinor improve the existing ones08:04
pwnguinradeon isnt that bad08:04
pwnguinso really this is targetting a replacement for UPMC platform08:05
pwnguinmakes sense08:06
pwnguinmakes software cheaper for hardware makers, puts pressure on microsoft, and generally sells more chips for intel 08:06
happycuber500 *just* got an alpha 2d driver this last week - from reverse engineering08:07
happycubenvidia at least works on the free 2d drivers08:07
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pwnguinit's also so poorly commented they're the only ones who really can08:10
pwnguin(this hasn't stopeed me from trying)08:10
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Mithrandirhiya agoliveira 02:02
Mithrandiragoliveira: do you have a script or something to get the hildon desktop up and running?  I'm still trying to make head and tails of the last two weeks. :-)02:03
agoliveiraMithrandir: Hi.02:03
agoliveiraagoliveira: Yes, hold on.02:03
agoliveiraMithrandir: Check this out: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileAndEmbedded/HildonDesktopManualProcedure02:04
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Mithrandirdo you really need a chroot for it?02:05
agoliveiraMithrandir: Some things might not be necessary like editing /etc/hildon-desktop/desktop.conf as I did that in the package already.02:06
agoliveiraMithrandir: You can also use Gutsy itself.02:06
mdzMithrandir,agoliveira: ahve you noticed this?02:08
mdzFailed to fetch http://repository.maemo.org/dists/bora/free/source/Sources.gz  401 Unauthorized02:08
mdzFailed to fetch http://repository.maemo.org/dists/bora/non-free/source/Sources.gz  401 Unauthorized02:08
mdzFailed to fetch http://repository.maemo.org/dists/bora/extras/source/Sources.gz  401 Unauthorized02:08
Mithrandirmdz: seems to work from here02:08
agoliveiramdz: No, where did you get it?02:08
agoliveiramdz: Works here.02:08
mdzI'm at millbank02:09
Mithrandiragoliveira: also, do we have a sample hildon app that can be used for testing if stuff display well?02:09
agoliveiraagoliveira: Nothing specific AFAIK.02:10
agoliveiraMithrandir: Nothing specific AFAIK.02:10
agoliveiraMithrandir: But usually running standard gnome applications works.02:11
ian_brasilIt might be nice for the docs to create/implement/test one standard app the whole way through development02:25
ian_brasilmaemo follows this approach somewhat02:25
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Mithrandirian_brasil: yes, I think that would be sane02:51
Mithrandirmdz: do you have sdk-default-icons in bzr?03:14
mdzMithrandir: no, because there was no upstream to import yet (and the nokia guys said they were going to add it there)03:15
mdz(very soon)03:15
mdzit may be in svn by now03:16
mdztommi or moises should be able to say03:16
Mithrandirmdz: there are also some file conflicts between it and hicolor-icon-theme ?03:22
agoliveiraMithrandir: How did you see that? I don't remember having those conflics on my notebook that I'm using for testing.03:29
Mithrandirconflicts over usr/share/icons/hicolor/index.theme03:31
tko_MDK said he'd work something out this week. however I'm not sure it'll take care of the conflict03:34
Mithrandirit seems to me like you're kinda trying to be a hicolor theme, but not really?03:34
tko_like we didn't really get debian packaging, we didn't really get hicolor icon theme either03:36
tko_though in a way our icons are just add-ons and regenerating icon cache should fix it, but then our packaging was done such a way that it included the cache... *sigh*03:36
tko_actually that should be getting fixed and you shouldn't get conflicts03:37
Mithrandirhm, the theme cache is just one bit of this.03:39
mdzMithrandir: I thought I fixed that by changing it to use dh_iconcache rather than shipping the index.theme03:42
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mdzbut I was in a great hurry and may have botched it03:42
mdzMithrandir: at any rate, things are moving toward using chroots for development, where this should be a non-issue03:42
amitkrobr: could you ask jacob_laptop to subscribe to kernel-team@lists.ubuntu.com. I reworked his poulsbo patches and posted them there. He should probably check the archives for some comments03:45
agoliveiraI second that. It's much safer that way.03:46
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agoliveiraMithrandir: Did you give a try on Rusty's project builder?06:08
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ian_brasili have a base gutsy chroot installed...the process to get a Hildon Desktop is now  apt-get install hildon-desktop right??07:10
agoliveiraian_brasil: apt-get install ubuntu-mobile will bring also some required packages like themes07:12
ian_brasilok i try that...thx07:13
agoliveiraian_brasil: In case something fails, check out this document here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileAndEmbedded/HildonDesktopManualProcedure and report back what happened, ok?07:13
ian_brasili will do07:14
matt_capt-get install ubuntu-mobile and the preperation/running scripts worked for me the other day07:14
matt_cinstalling ubuntu-mobile a few days ago broke the application menu but I think that's been fixed (I haven't tried again recently)07:18
ian_brasildo i need to change my gutsy sources.list to install ubuntu-mobile07:31
matt_cian_brasil: it should be in the standard sources for gutsy07:33
ian_brasilMmm..i get could not find package07:34
ian_brasili have deb http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu gutsy main in my sources.list07:35
agoliveiramatt_c: Yes, the broken menus have being fixed, I don't know if reached the repositories yet.07:37
agoliveiraian_brasil: That's strange, do you have the universe rep enabled?07:40
ian_brasili must be doing something wrong as apt-cache search hildon-desktop returns nothing as well07:40
ian_brasilno i only have that 1 line in my source.list07:40
agoliveiraian_brasil: You need to add universe session to it.07:41
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matt_cahh sorry, adding universe has become so second nature that I forget that I've done it sometimes07:43
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ian_brasilits ok...i am writing this up so just wanted to cross the t's and dot the i's basically...it works ok now07:52
ian_brasilit bugged out installing ubuntu-mobile07:58
ian_brasilErrors were encountered while processing:07:58
ian_brasil dbus07:58
ian_brasil dbus-x1107:58
ian_brasil libgnomevfs2-007:58
ian_brasil libhildonwm007:58
ian_brasil libhildondesktop007:58
ian_brasil libhildon-thumbnail007:58
ian_brasil libhildonmime007:58
ian_brasil libhildonfm207:58
ian_brasil libgnome2-007:58
ian_brasil libbonoboui2-007:58
ian_brasil libgnomeui-007:59
ian_brasil libgtkhtml3.14-1907:59
ian_brasil libhildonhelp007:59
ian_brasil hildon-desktop07:59
ian_brasil ubuntu-mobile07:59
ian_brasilE: Sub-process /usr/bin/dpkg returned an error code (1)07:59
ian_brasilthe dpkg.log shows lines like:08:04
ian_brasil2007-06-25 17:52:33 status half-installed libhildonmime0 1.9.5-1ubuntu108:04
ian_brasil2007-06-25 17:52:33 status unpacked libhildonmime0 1.9.5-1ubuntu108:04
ian_brasil2007-06-25 17:52:33 status unpacked libhildonmime0 1.9.5-1ubuntu108:04
ian_brasil2007-06-25 17:52:33 install hildon-fm-l10n-engb <none> 3.0-sardine1ubuntu108:04
ian_brasil2007-06-25 17:52:33 status half-installed hildon-fm-l10n-engb 3.0-sardine1ubuntu108:04
agoliveiraian_brasil: Is there any message saying like "trying to overwrite /usr/share/icons/hicolor/index.theme"...?08:07
ian_brasilhold on08:07
ian_brasilno...just that half-installed lines08:09
ian_brasili dunno if this helps but i installed nano to start with which complained about locales and defaults08:10
agoliveiraI mean, above the line "Errors were encountered while processing:"08:10
ian_brasilno it was just the sub-process returned an error code08:11
agoliveiraAh, ok. I just saw something....08:11
agoliveirahold on08:11
ian_brasilyou want the whole dpkg error?08:13
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agoliveiraian_brasil: Are you trying to install it on a gutsy machine?08:14
ian_brasilon a feisty machine with a gutsy chroot08:14
agoliveiraian_brasil: Hmmm... in my Gutsy machine worked like a charm... can you send me the logs by email? It's easier for me to read. adilson@ubuntu.com08:16
ian_brasilon their way08:16
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rustydoes anyone know amit's normal working hours?08:18
rustyor.. amit, are you listening?08:18
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agoliveirarusty: Hi Rusty. IIRC, Amit is UTC +3 so it's a bit late over there now.08:22
rustyok, thanks... i just didn't know if he was they kind of guy who hacks all night and sleeps all day08:22
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agoliveiraian_brasil: I think I know what happened. The dbus postinstall failed and that broke the sequence. I'll check it out because it was working.08:34
amitkrusty: hi :)  My usual working hours are 0900-1700 UTC.08:36
rustyhey amit... i was going to introduce you to ToddBrandt who is working on the power stuff08:37
amitkhi ToddBrandt08:38
agoliveirakwwii: Ken, do you know where the icons at this page came from? They are quite familiar but I can't remember where I saw... http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS8166710404.html08:40
amitkrusty, ToddBrandt: I will be catching up with Kylem on the UME kernel configs (hopefully tomorrow). Are there any power related 'items' that need special attention?08:41
kwwiiasac: 08:41
kwwiiagoliveira: I think that they are from a stock gnome installation08:41
rustyamitk, i don't think so... ToddBrandt would be talking more about the user space side of things08:41
rustyamitk, other then using a tickless configuration08:42
kwwiiagoliveira: looks like some tango icons mixed with some app icons08:42
amitkrusty: tickless - ofcourse. I am assuming HPET-support will come automatically. Anything in terms of user-space power policies?08:43
agoliveirakwwii: Ah... fine. It's just that they looked familar, no big deal. Thanks.08:43
rustyamitk, the user-space power policies is exactly what ToddBrandt is working on... which is why i wanted to get him connected to you08:43
kwwiiagoliveira: no problem08:44
amitkrusty: great. I guess I will run into him soon enough. If there is already some documents, you can send them to amit_at_ubuntu_dot_com08:46
rustyamitk, actually, i was having ToddBrandt start creating a blueprint and dumping all of his current design work into that blueprint08:47
rustyamitk, is that the right thing to do?08:48
amitkrusty: that would indeed be the best thing to do. He and I can then work on getting the blueprints in shape and break them into smaller components if needed.08:49
rustyamitk, cool... i think he might have stepped out for lunch just before you started talking on IRC, but before that i was pointing him to launchpad.net and he was starting to create a new project so he could fill out a new blueprint.  We didn't know if there was a different place he should be adding the content, but worse case he would just move it when we found out the right spec08:51
amitkrusty: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/power-management-in-ubuntu is where I dumped my current list of ideas worth pursuing08:54
amitkrusty: I think ToddBrandt should create a new one, subscribe me to it and then we could discuss how to best separate out kerne/userspace stuff.08:55
rustyamitk, ToddBrandt see the above when you get back to you computer :->08:56
amitkrusty: I am done for today. I will catch you tomorrow once I have had some time discussing details of the UME sprint08:57
rustyamitk, ok, see you l8r08:58
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agoliveiraian_brasil: I'm installing a chroot from scratch to see what's happening as the one I had is working fine.09:47
ian_brasilok...let me know09:48
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ian_brasilagoliveira: looks like the first dpkg error relates to dbus: Setting up dbus (1.0.2-5ubuntu1) ...10:27
ian_brasilinvoke-rc.d: initscript dbus, action "start" failed.10:27
agoliveiraian_brasil: Exactly and it seens to be afecting upstream as well. I'm cheking it out.10:28
agoliveiraian_brasil: dbus 1.0.2-5 has indeed a bug making it bombs when no services are active. I'm checking out how to solve this.10:38
ian_brasilcool...how did you find this out?10:39
rustyian_brasil, agoliveira are you guys trying to get a fresh chroot working?10:43
rustyif so... you need proc mounted to install dbus10:43
rustyin general, you really need /proc, /sys, and it's a good idea to have /tmp bind mounted for a bunch of different things10:44
agoliveirarusty: Yes but  /proc /sys are mounted10:44
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agoliveira/tmp too btw10:44
ian_brasili added to /etc/fstab10:45
rustyunless an update has been made to dbus since yesterday, i can install dbus in a chroot with no problems10:45
agoliveirarusty: What's your dbus version?10:46
agoliveiraI mean, the package10:46
rustylet me see...10:46
rusty 1.0.2-5ubuntu110:47
agoliveiraGee... same here. Weird.10:48
rustyi might be doing another step10:48
agoliveiraThe funny thing is that I had one chroot working fine.10:48
agoliveiraWhich one?10:48
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rustysearch for "def mount" to see my function for mounting a chroot10:53
rustythe only thing else i see special is i copy over the resolv.conf and hosts files10:54
rustyi can't image dbus needing a network10:54
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ian_brasilin maemo bora scratchbox there were problems with resolv.conf and hosts file...maybe it is this? 10:57
agoliveiraI got it.10:58
agoliveiraI'm not 100% sure about this but, if I understood it correctly, there is indeed a bug that prevents dbus from start if there is no processes running already. I you're binding the chroot proc with /proc, it works.11:00
agoliveiraSo: sudo mount --bind /proc gutsy/proc/ solved the problem.11:01
agoliveiraOr at least masked it if is there really a bug ;)11:02
rustyagoliveira, i thought you said that you already mounted proc?11:02
agoliveirarusty: Sorry, I wasn't clear. Inside the chroot proc was shown as mounted I didn't do it manualy.11:04
ian_brasilthat works for me too11:06
agoliveirarusty: But, of course, it was empty. I didn't realized that. I'll add to the TODO to mount /proc and /sys.11:06
rustyand add /tmp or else attempts to run an app with a Xephyr window will fail11:09
rustynot to mention the network config files, or else apps that need a network will not know how to resolve addresses11:10
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agoliveira/tmp is there already but I didn't have to do anything regarding the network files but add the universe repository to /etc/apt/sources.conf11:13
agoliveiraI got to go now but I'll see if I can check this again later today yet.11:15
ian_brasili still need to comment out the StatusBar on /etc/hildon-desktop/desktop.conf 11:18
agoliveiraagoliveira: I alreayd fixed that but didn't check if the update reached the repository.11:21
ian_brasilno problem11:22
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robrBenC, did our poulsbo/menlow patches make it into your kernel?12:29
BenCrobr: not this upload, but amitk will get them in tomorrow and build you guys a kernel to try out12:30
BenCshould have another kernel upload in a week12:30
robrBenC, ok. we'll test it then when it's available12:30

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