[12:16] <manchicken> Tonio_: What's that?
[12:16] <Tonio_> manchicken: not all packages, some do, as kdebase for example
[12:16] <Tonio_> manchicken: no aware of that ????????,
[12:16] <manchicken> Tonio_: Does adept?
[12:16] <Arby> seemingly not
[12:16] <manchicken> Yeah.  I'm thinking not, too.
[12:16] <Arby> at least I can't find it
[12:16] <manchicken> You could build from source.
[12:16] <Tonio_> manchicken: here is the plan, kdesu sucks as hell, and I found a very old and pretty nice code for sudo/kde
[12:17] <Tonio_> didn't work but I got it to work with a modern sudo
[12:17] <mhb> Riddell: you said the only fault of kdesu is that it's running sudo multiple times
[12:17] <Tonio_> manchicken: the point is that to get it to replace kdesu perfectly, we need to implement all the command line options kdesu as
[12:17] <Tonio_> manchicken: one of them is still missing, the --nonewdcop one
[12:17] <mhb> Tonio_: ^^ shouldn't we fix kdesu then, instead of supporting this new app?
[12:17] <Arby> manchicken: in which case that's a job for another day :)
[12:17] <manchicken> Arby: `apt-get source adept` and then edit the debian/rules file to add --enable-debug=full where you see "DEB_CONFIGURE_EXTRA_FLAGS += --enable-adept" and then you just type debuild and BAM, it'll either yell at you for dependencies or it'll build.
[12:17] <Tonio_> manchicken: kdesudo currently fixes about all the issues we have with kdesu, which means a lot of problems
[12:18] <Tonio_> mhb: fixing kdesu will be too long in my opinion
[12:18] <Tonio_> mhb: supporting a new app and then try to merge the changes with kdesu might be better no ?
[12:18] <Arby> manchicken: cheers, I'll give it a go, but not right now :)
[12:18] <mhb> RadiantFire: poke
[12:18] <Arby> tis late here :)
[12:19] <Tonio_> mhb: unless I'm wrong and just having a sudo class for kdesu would be easier.....
[12:19] <manchicken> Arby: Righto.  Just make sure you have libtagcoll-dev and libapt-front-dev installed and you should be good to go.
[12:19] <RadiantFire> mhb: jab
[12:19] <RadiantFire> mhb: shell account is working for the moment
[12:19] <Tonio_> mhb: not to give you pressure, but I really would like to have that fixed for gutsy
[12:19] <manchicken> Arby: The dpkg-checkbuilddeps script should help.
[12:19] <mhb> me too
[12:19] <mhb> RadiantFire: read up
[12:19] <Tonio_> mhb: we had to use gksu on kde for the french parliament, as kdesu is unable to understand specific sudoers config for example.....
[12:19] <Arby> manchicken: I don't know what that is
[12:20] <RadiantFire> ah, yes
[12:20] <manchicken> Arby: It's just a command-line utility.
[12:20] <Tonio_> no way to get a NOPASSWD thiing to work for example
[12:20] <mhb> RadiantFire: the thing is, Riddell (who wrote the kdesu support for sudo) said that the only fault of kdesu is that it runs sudo multiple times.
[12:20] <Tonio_> manchicken: talking about that, should we get adept-batch to work with kio-apt ? :) shouldn't be hard to implement, and pretty fun hehe :)
[12:20] <Arby> manchicken: OK, I'll find it.
[12:20] <RadiantFire> i don't suppose they fixed any of these problems in kde4 and we could look at backporting something
[12:21] <mhb> Tonio_: the truth is, I'm not one on how many problems there are with kdesu
[12:21] <manchicken> Arby: It's in the dpkg-dev package.
[12:21] <Tonio_> mhb: more than this, kdesu doesn't do any kind of sudo thing
[12:21] <mhb> Tonio_: Riddell says it's just one, you say there are many
[12:21] <Tonio_> mhb: it just takes your password and checks if sudo has a problem with it
[12:21] <manchicken> Tonio_: Right now I'm getting proxying to work with the developer changelog.
[12:21] <Riddell> manchicken, Arby: all packages have debug package in the debug package repository
[12:21] <manchicken> I'm knee deep in debugger.
[12:21] <Riddell> although I don't know where that is
[12:21] <manchicken> Riddell: A lot of help you are :)
[12:22] <Tonio_> mhb: try to tweek the sudoers file to allow only one command to one user, with the NOPASSWD thing, that'll fail, ask for passwd everytime
[12:22] <Tonio_> mhb: kdesudo works perfectly with this, as it directly asks sudo before prompting for the passwd
[12:22] <Riddell> mhb, Tonio_: oh yes, kdesu uses kdesu_stub so sudoers isn't respected as you would expect, that is also an issue
[12:22] <Tonio_> Riddell: exactly, which sucks as hell........
[12:22] <RadiantFire> kdesu_stub is evil I have found
[12:23] <Arby> Riddell: do you mean pittis repository?
[12:23] <manchicken> You'd think that kdevelop would have more support for Qt types instead of giving me addresses to look for all over the place.
[12:23] <RadiantFire> i don't understand why exactly it exists, surely there must be an easier way of manipulating X cookies
[12:23] <Arby> as in deb http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/ddebs gutsy main universe
[12:23] <Riddell> Arby: that looks like it
[12:23] <Tonio_> Riddell: kdesudo works perfectly with sudo and deals with any kind of sudoers file, I tested this deeply, the only thing is that it fails to be used to go admin mode in kcontrol for example, due to missing command line option
[12:23] <Arby> Riddell: thanks
[12:23] <Tonio_> Riddell: if we had this, we can get ridd of kdesu once and for all
[12:24] <Tonio_> Riddell: and then try to get the code merge as a clas in kdesu, for kde4 I guess
[12:24] <Tonio_> mhb: btw I wouldn't see any problem having 2 separate apps, as there are 2 separate commands in the shell to go admin :)
[12:25] <Tonio_> mhb: makes sense to have a GUI based client for each method
[12:25] <mhb> the client is basically the same
[12:25] <mhb> so I'd like to see just one client
[12:25] <Tonio_> mhb: that's what I consider the second step :)
[12:25] <mhb> Tonio_: yeah, I know
[12:26] <Tonio_> mhb: no reason to get the code merge for kde3, that's too late, but we should get it merged for kde4
[12:26] <mhb> Tonio_: also, kdesudo is heavily dependent on replies from sudo
[12:26] <Tonio_> mhb: true
[12:26] <RadiantFire> that sort of makes sense
[12:26] <RadiantFire> sudo has a somewhat different messaging structure than sud
[12:26] <mhb> Tonio_: and i18n might arrive into sudo soon
[12:26] <RadiantFire> er, su
[12:26] <Tonio_> mhb: well not that much as I force sudo output as much as I can
[12:27] <Tonio_> mhb: for example the password asking message is forced, so that ubuntu default changes on that point won't affect kdesudo
[12:27] <RadiantFire> stupid question, would it not be easier to write a suid app that can understand the sudoers file instead of relying on sudo as a long term goal
[12:27] <Tonio_> mhb: don't know if you saw that in the code
[12:27] <mhb> Tonio_: I did
[12:27] <mhb> Tonio_: you cannot force the error messages, though
[12:27] <Tonio_> mhb: nope, that's true
[12:28] <Tonio_> mhb: but honenstly, error messages didn't change the last 4 years :)
[12:28] <Tonio_> mhb: I didn't changes them on the 4 year old code
[12:28] <mhb> Tonio_: no, but we also need to make sure the messages are in english
[12:28] <Tonio_> mhb: not a big deal if we have to upgrade them every 3 years right ? :)
[12:29] <mhb> Tonio_: because if sudo spoke French, kdesudo would go crazy :o)
[12:29] <Tonio_> mhb: they are english btw
[12:29] <RadiantFire> that must be annoying for the french admins
[12:29] <Tonio_> mhb: sudo isn't localized afaik
[12:30] <Tonio_> mhb: well we can discuss about what's better to do, but I would like kdesudo to go like hurd :)
[12:30] <mhb> http://www.gratisoft.us/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=244
[12:30] <Tonio_> mhb: I'd say let's finish it and then make the right thing on the second step :)
[12:30] <ubotu> www.gratisoft.us bug 244 in Sudo "Sudo lacks i18n/translations" [Enhancement,Assigned] 
[12:31] <Tonio_> mhb: don't agree on that point ?
[12:31] <mhb> Tonio_: well, I don't know :o)
[12:31] <mhb> Tonio_: if the last step (implementing the dcop call) would be easy I'd go for that
[12:32] <Tonio_> mhb: one we have something that works, we'll have month to get something nicelly done for kde4
[12:32] <Tonio_> mhb: we don't have more than a month from now to get it is gutsy
[12:32] <manchicken> Time for some print and pray debugging.
[12:32] <Tonio_> mhb: let's ask manchicken's opinion :)
[12:32] <manchicken> Tonio_: That might be dangerous.
[12:32] <Tonio_> manchicken: why so ? ;)
[12:33] <manchicken> This is one of those "be careful what you wish for, you just might get it" moments.
[12:33] <Tonio_> manchicken: hehe :)
[12:34] <Tonio_> mhb: I think that if we can get all the good coders on that last point, we can get it to work quickly
[12:34] <Tonio_> AKA, not me of course :)
[12:35] <mhb> Tonio_: perhaps, yes
[12:35] <manchicken> I'm a hacker, but I don't know if the word "good" enters into it.
[12:35] <mhb> Tonio_: I won't be doing it tonight, though :o) it's too late for me
[12:37] <manchicken> mhb: What's your $TZ?
[12:37] <Tonio_> mhb hehe no pb, sleep well ;)
[12:37] <mhb> Tonio_: I'll check the KDE4 code of kdesu now, then sleep
[12:37] <mhb> manchicken: Riddell+1 or so :o)
[12:37] <manchicken> Righto.
[12:38] <manchicken> MOFAKA!  It works.
[12:38] <manchicken> Kinda.
[12:39] <mhb> Tonio_: you know what's pretty stupid?
[12:40] <mhb> Tonio_: that the last step is about dcop
[12:40] <mhb> Tonio_: which is pretty much obsolete by now
[12:40] <mhb> Tonio_: kdesu4 doesn't have any such command line option
[12:40] <manchicken> My dog is pretty stupid.
[12:40] <manchicken> Ooh ooh oooh oooh oooooh.  I think I may get a 2-for-1 deal on this bug.
[12:44] <manchicken> Sweet.
[12:44] <manchicken> Score one for print & pray debugging.
[12:45] <Tonio_> mhb: :/
[12:45] <Tonio_> mhb: yeah, pretty much stupid doing this just for kde3..... but that needs to be done :) hehe
[12:51] <mhb> Riddell: you might know that, but they dropped support for sudo out of kdesu4
[12:51] <mhb> Riddell: or perhaps I'm wrong, errr
[12:51] <mhb> Riddell: sorry for the last bit
[12:51] <mhb> more reading, then telling
[01:14] <manchicken> Booya.
[01:14] <manchicken> Two bugs.  Fixed.
[01:16] <manchicken> Only one patch though.
[01:18] <mhb> manchicken: what about adept-kde4?
[01:18] <mhb> manchicken: is anyone working on that?
[01:19] <manchicken> mhb: What?  You mean you weren't?!  Damnit, I thought you were.  heh
[01:19] <manchicken> I think mornfall is still cranking away at it, and I think Riddell has been playing with it some, too.  Don't know.  when I tried to build it at UDS, I got it to compile, but run it did not.
[01:20] <manchicken> Bug #119089 is fixed, as well as bug #85056.
[01:20] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 119089 in adept "Unable to fetch the Developer Changelog" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/119089
[01:20] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 85056 in adept "adept_updater try's to fetch changelog from other package" [Low,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/85056
[01:20] <manchicken> the patch is on the bug report for 119089.
[01:20] <manchicken> I'm gonna go eat spicy food now.  Later.
[01:21] <Riddell> manchicken|away: mornfall isn't doing anything, but says he has some time this summer for a qt 4 port and UI improvements
[01:42] <dewey> gutsy-gibbon 2 would not boot for me?
[01:46] <Riddell> check the CD is valid
[01:47] <jjesse> evening
[01:55] <ryanakca> Riddell: Also, maybe change 'Kubuntu 7.10 amd64' to something more descriptive so as to know that it isn't the official release (maybe append 'Tribe 1', or 'Daily Build')...
[01:58] <Riddell> not my choice that
[01:58] <Riddell> you'd need to file a bug
[02:00] <ryanakca> ok, will do :)
[02:07] <dewey> Riddell: the md5sum was fine?
[02:08] <Riddell> was the CD verification fine?
[02:08] <dewey> Riddell: how do that?
[02:08] <Riddell> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/CDIntegrityCheck
[03:26] <jjesse> using gutsy tribe-2 installed in vmware i get a lot of text in console login mode and it becomes hard to type due to the messages scrolling
[03:29] <jjesse> i noticed when i booted from the live cd of tribe 2 i had the option for dolphin as the file manager but don't see that in my updated today gutsy install
[05:43] <manchicken> mhb: I figured out how to detect the lock for the easy resolution.
[05:43] <manchicken> mhb: I'm wondering if it's really necessary to have a python script for that though to be honest with you.
[06:35] <manchicken> mhb: I think I may have gotten a fix for the dpkg locked bug...
[06:54] <nixternal> where does the useragent string get stored on a system?
[06:54] <nixternal> it seems that with Gutsy, the Kubuntu useragent string is just detected as Linux now, and not Kubuntu anymore
[06:55] <manchicken> That's an interesting question.
[06:55] <manchicken> I'm guessing that's in kubuntu-defaults or something.
[07:38] <nixternal> hiya Hobbsee
[07:38] <nixternal> Hobbsee: where is the location of the file that contains the Kubuntu user agent string? It is there (somewhere) in Feisty, but doesn't seem to either work or it isn't installed with Feisty
[07:39] <Hobbsee> nixternal: /etc/lsb_release ?
[07:39] <nixternal> nope, becuase on Kubuntu boxes that reports Ubuntu
[07:40] <nixternal> I have a script on my website that sniffs user agent strings, and it used to pick up Kubuntu until I upgraded to Gutsy
[07:40] <Hobbsee> i'm not sure
[07:40] <Hobbsee> have you tried grep -R'ing for the string, from / or something?
[07:40] <nixternal> man, for like ever :)
[08:13] <Hobbsee> manchicken: er....
[08:13] <Hobbsee> manchicken: you didnt happen to add kubuntumembers as a bug contact of adept, did you?
[08:13] <Hobbsee> hiya Nightrose
[08:13] <Nightrose> heya Hobbsee
[11:14] <mhb> manchicken: yes, it is
[11:14] <mhb> manchicken: or a C++ app, I have no preference on that
[11:17] <mhb> manchicken: the idea is, to have the fix possible in the kubuntu as a whole
[11:17] <mhb> manchicken: adept's not the only tool in Kubuntu handling packages, you know
[11:17] <mhb> manchicken: so it would be rather silly to do several fixes for the same bug
[11:19] <LongPointyStick> this restricted manager is cool!
[11:19] <mhb> which one?
[11:20] <mhb> i.e. you mean the *real* restricted-manager?
[11:20] <LongPointyStick> yes
[11:24] <mhb> LongPointyStick: good :o)
[11:24] <Tonio_> hi people ;)
[11:24] <Tonio_> how cool it is to be connected at home hehe :)
[11:28] <LongPointyStick> yay, Tonio_!
[11:30] <Tonio_> hey Hobbsee :)
[11:31] <Tonio_> connected at home, with wireless and wpa
[11:31] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: I was about to forget that sensation......... 2 month without internet at home :'(
[11:31] <Tonio_> was a bit rude
[11:31] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: erk :(
[11:33] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: that'done finished now, so let's back to the work !
[11:33] <Hobbsee> hehe :)
[11:33] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: i'm testing out a ubuntu cd at the moment
[11:33] <Tonio_> k3b packaging is really a peace of shit.....
[11:34] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: cool :) I'm repackaging k3b
[11:35] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: with pygi?
[11:35] <Hobbsee> heh, i've heard
[11:35] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: nope, I'm doing the initial packaging alone
[11:35] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: he'll improve this
[11:35] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: my goal is just to have the current package building with cdbs and patches correctly applied
[11:36] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: they actually don't, so we miss all the ubuntu changes to it
[11:36] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: btw a modern app, based on kde, with a pure debhelper packaging is really stupid
[11:36] <Tonio_> kde.mk/cdbs does a so good job....
[11:37] <hunger> Tonio_: The problem is that you need to know that as a packager. All my attempts to use cdbs failed horribly because I could not figure out how to do things.
[11:47] <Tonio_> hunger: not talking about you, the problem is the basic debian packaging
[11:48] <Tonio_> hunger: the debian k3b package should be based on cdbs
[11:48] <Tonio_> hunger: that was not for you, don't mind :) hehe :)
[11:49] <Tonio_> hunger: I'm I the kind of guy that insults the work done by other people in the crew ? I don't think so ^^
[11:50] <hunger> Tonio_: I hadn't assumed you were trying to assign tasks to me. I just said that I know many people (incl. me) that consider themselves to be too stupid for cdbs:-)
[11:50] <Tonio_> hunger: cdbs is for stupid people !
[11:51] <Tonio_> hunger: I learned to package with cdbs, and learned debhelper later
[11:51] <Tonio_> hungerno need to now what you do ith cdbs, just load the good .mk files and that's it for a basic package :)
[11:51] <hunger> Tonio_: Really? I find debhelper much simpler as it does not hide so much from me. Way easier to figure out how to do things.
[11:51] <Tonio_> hunger: that's why I use cdbs, because it is for me, aka stupid people :)
[11:52] <hunger> Tonio_: cdbs is great... as long as everything is straight forward... but what ever is?
[11:53] <Tonio_> hunger: true
[11:53] <Tonio_> hunger: talking aout the packaging, why removing the iso and cue mimetypes ?
[11:53] <Tonio_> do they conflict with another package ?
[11:54] <Tonio_> hunger: okay I'll investigate ;)
[12:02] <mhb> Riddell: what about us  and desktop-effects? was something planned?
[12:21] <nosrednaekim> hey, I think I found a bug in the installer
[12:22] <nosrednaekim> when you try to cancle the downloading of package lists, it crashes
[12:22] <Hobbsee> mhb: mvo's looking into a compiz-kde package
[12:22] <Hobbsee> mhb: it's actually quite nice.  or would be, if it didnt have large bugs in it
[12:23] <mhb> Hobbsee: but it's surely more stable than kwin_composite :o)
[12:24] <Hobbsee> erm,....
[12:24] <Hobbsee> not sure on that one
[12:24] <Hobbsee> i dont like how this occasionally seems to eat windows, and how it's sometimes impossible to seelct windows with the mouse
[12:26] <nosrednaekim> Konqueror can't start the cooky manager
[01:26] <Riddell> mhb: I'd like to see a kde desktop package which just works, but all a bit vauge really
[01:26] <Riddell> mhb: note I'm at akademy from now until the end of next week so unreliable computer time
[01:26] <Hobbsee> hiya Riddell
[01:27] <Riddell> hi Hobbsee
[01:32] <Tonio_> Hobbsee, would you like to see other major kde apps like k3b going to bzr ?
[01:33] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: yes please
[01:33] <Tonio_> Hobbsee needs to register a new branch I guess right ?
[01:33] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: they all need get-orig-source lines too
[01:33] <Riddell> note that amarok is in bzr upstream, we should branch that and do it properly (merges etc)
[01:33] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: i think you can just upload the new branch, and it auto-registers
[01:33] <Tonio_> Hobbsee I'm not familiar with bzr and the branch creation process, can you brief me a bit about it
[01:33] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: wiki.ubuntu.com/Bzr
[01:33] <Hobbsee> is a fairly good primer on it
[01:34] <Tonio_> Hobbsee the point is that bzr is slow as hell.........
[01:34] <xerosis_> Hobbsee: any chance of adept in bzr?
[01:35] <Tonio_> Hobbsee initial download of kdepim/debian is 3 times longuer that downloading the all source package...
[01:35] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: it's getting faster.  and usually only the original checkout is slow
[01:35] <Hobbsee> true.  bzr update is much faster
[01:35] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: what i like about it is that i dont have to find 10 bugs to fix or whatever, to make it worth an upload
[01:35] <Tonio_> Hobbsee the point is that we won't have local things waiting for upload
[01:35] <Hobbsee> i can fix a few, commit, and then a few more a few days later.  and maybe someone else have put in a copule of fixes.  which is then less stuff to build, and download
[01:36] <Tonio_> we can upload something that is not over and upload the package later, true
[01:36] <Hobbsee> i'm not understanding you
[01:38] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: is it a bad thing not having local things waiting for upload?
[01:38] <Hobbsee> it's very annoying, if anyone else wants access to it, to test it out
[01:39] <Tonio_> Hobbsee one question, why don't we have one project with several branches in it ?
[01:40] <Tonio_> Hobbsee each package is there one project..... doesn't make sense
[01:40] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: mainlyb ecause most of those sections of kde were already registered, so the "upstream" lists of bugs are already there.
[01:40] <Hobbsee> i couldnt see the point of having 3 separate kdebase's, for eg.
[01:40] <Tonio_> Hobbsee that'll be hard to maintain with hundreds of package in my opinion
[01:41] <Hobbsee> and because i didnt think of it.
[01:41] <Tonio_> I would have done a kubuntu-desktop project with all packages in main in the form of a branch
[01:41] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: you're welcome to change it, to something more sane.
[01:41] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: that's probably fairly easy to do, too.
[01:41] <Tonio_> Hobbsee second step probably :)
[01:41] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: that's precisely why i requested for comments about what we should do.
[01:42] <Tonio_> Hobbsee just that I don't see how to create a new branch without the website....
[01:42] <Tonio_> Hobbsee I have read the wiki, but I can't find it
[01:42] <Tonio_> I have done it once, for kdesudo, but I can't remember how.... :(
[01:42] <Hobbsee> use push sftp://tonio_@bazarr........
[01:42] <Hobbsee> the command is listed in that guide
[01:43] <Tonio_> hum, indeed
[01:43] <Tonio_> just that I have to create the project before, which annoys me a lot :)
[01:44] <Tonio_> I wanted to add all my package in it, but register 40 projects would be very annoying ;)
[01:44] <Tonio_> Hobbsee okay here is a proposal, let's meet toonight here if you can and let's think of the best solution how to structure this, are you okay ?
[01:44] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: sure.  if i'm on irc, then that's fine
[01:44] <Tonio_> Hobbsee great
[01:45] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: can you define how many hours away "tonight" is?
[01:45] <mikkael> i just installed "kde-tweak" from gutsy repos. there is no menu-entry and i cant find it in kcontrol. thats the homepage. http://kde-apps.org/content/show.php?content=51170&forumpage=2
[01:45] <mikkael> should i file a bug ?
[01:45] <Tonio_> Hobbsee, don't get me wrong, I agree with you on the bzr approach, I'm just unsure the way we structured this is adapted to heavy usage
[01:45] <Tonio_> Hobbsee as you know, I maintain a LOT of applications :)
[01:45] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: true that.  i more did that as a way to try it out
[01:46] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: and i've already got some of those changes listed in those bzr branches
[01:46] <Tonio_> Hobbsee of course, a first attempt is always good, but requires a second step :)
[01:46] <Hobbsee> no questoin there
[01:46] <Tonio_> Hobbsee look at the kde-extras branch on alioth
[01:47] <Tonio_> Hobbsee one project, one branch per app
[01:47] <Hobbsee> fair enough
[01:47] <Tonio_> and one global branch for those like me who are working on potentially every package
[01:47] <Tonio_> Hobbsee that's the good way to do
[01:47] <Hobbsee> right
[01:48] <Tonio_> Hobbsee also what would be nice is a script that apt-get source the package, bzr exports and builds the new source package
[01:48] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: indeed.  was hoping you'd write one
[01:48] <Tonio_> Hobbsee doing this manually is a bit annoying, and that's pretty easy to basically script
[01:48] <Tonio_> Hobbsee that'll be the third step I guess :)
[01:49] <Tonio_> Hobbsee this is basically what we've done for the french parliament, but that was using svn
[01:50] <Hobbsee> :)
[01:50] <Tonio_> Riddell: ping ?
[01:51] <Tonio_> Riddell: I'm about to try to build kdepim with opensync support, that'll generate more files I have to put in a package
[01:51] <Tonio_> Riddell: where would you put the dh_install --list-missing thing in a cdbs based packaging ?
[01:52] <Tonio_> hum, looks like utils.mk does the trick
[02:40] <mhb> good afternoon
[02:46] <Tonio_> yop mhb :)
[02:48] <Tonio_> Riddell: fyi I'm changing a few things to the kdepim packaging, since once again, as we synced with debian, the desktop files for the kontact component are back in the kontact package, which is not good
[02:49] <mhb> hi Tonio_
[02:49] <xerosis_> mhb: what's hello in czech?
[02:49] <mhb> RadiantFire: around?
[02:49] <RadiantFire> for not long
[02:49] <RadiantFire> I have to go to work in 5 mins
[02:49] <RadiantFire> sorry, connection cut out on me again yesterday
[02:49] <Tonio_> Riddell: the result is that "news" is back in the components list of kontact on the left bar, even if the .so files are not installed.... that's unfair.... I'll try to get debian doing this properly for less maintainance in the future :)
[02:50] <RadiantFire> so whats up mhb?
[02:50] <Tonio_> Riddell: I also discovered kitchensync.install file is missing, so the package is therefore empty, which is due to the fact that the multisync support has been removed, but the package dpesn't build-depends on opensync
[02:50] <mhb> RadiantFire: have you played with kde4 kdesu?
[02:51] <Tonio_> Riddell: conclusion : kdepim packaging is BAD ;)
[02:51] <RadiantFire> hmm... I have not
[02:51] <RadiantFire> does it function differently?
[02:51] <Tonio_> mhb: I thought about that nonewdcop thing
[02:52] <Tonio_> mhb: if implementing this is very long and complicated, that's really a problem, since then we'll have to do it for one release only....
[02:52] <Tonio_> mhb: correction : 2 versions, as gutsy + 1 will use kde3 in the first place
[02:52] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: have you done the opensync MIR yet?
[02:52] <Hobbsee> or has someone?
[02:52] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: no I'm just testing this atm
[02:52] <RadiantFire> oh, thats sad
[02:53] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: if it works or not
[02:53] <Hobbsee> that's what's blocking kdepim, and why kitchensync stuff is not installed.
[02:53] <RadiantFire> mhb: I must be off to work, I wll look at kdesu4 this evening or this weekend sometime
[02:53] <Hobbsee> there was going to be a new versoin of opensync, which is what lure was waiting on
[02:53] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: hum, they don't want too many libs in main, I know that, but well in 2007, mobile syncing support is important, btw
[02:54] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: does the builddep need to be in universe ?
[02:54] <Tonio_> s/universe/main ?
[02:54] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: to build a main package?  yes.
[02:54] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: what is the problem in building with opensync support and keep kitchensync-opensync in universe ?
[02:54] <Hobbsee> well, on the buildds
[02:54] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: that's pret stupid imho
[02:54] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: if kitchensync-opensync is in kdepim, or split?
[02:54] <Tonio_> that's why we are castrating a lot of packages of their functionalities
[02:55] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: the code is in kdepim now
[02:55] <Hobbsee> i realise that
[02:55] <Hobbsee> you need all the build deps to be in main, to build a main package
[02:55] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: but there is no package concerning this, so I have to build and then fix the packaging, but we need opensync in main for this
[02:55] <Hobbsee> exactly...
[02:55] <Tonio_> *shit*
[02:56] <mhb> Hobbsee: will there be a meeting?
[02:56] <mhb> Hobbsee: I mean - you proposed one
[02:56] <Hobbsee> this was also discussed around the time of the merging kde 3.5.7, although i guess Tonio_ wanst here
[02:56] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: opensync supports syncml, which multisync doesn't
[02:56] <Hobbsee> mhb: yes.  wednesday 1400 UTC i think
[02:56] <Tonio_> and syncml is the new standard protocol for mobile device synchronization
[02:56] <mhb> Hobbsee: please make some buzz about it, so others are aware of that
[02:56] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: simply this :)
[02:56] <Hobbsee> mhb: of course
[02:57] <Hobbsee> mhb: i'm in at work tomorrow - i'm hoping to grab the roster then, as i dont think it was done on thursday
[02:57] <Hobbsee> no point scheduling a meeting, and fidnign i cant be there
[02:57] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: fair enough.  so it needs a MIR, which has always been planned, and lure was wanting to wait for the non-broken release of opensync.
[02:57] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: is the current one broken ?
[02:58] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: even if it's to early to get that in main now, packaging needs fixing for this :)
[02:58] <Tonio_> let's anticipate
[02:58] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: i believe, from when i merged it, that the files for the kontact componets are there because otherwise they're installed from two places at once.  and so dpkg errors out.
[02:59] <Hobbsee> so it wasnt just a screwup, as you didnt do the packaging.
[02:59] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: nope, this is just a stupid packaging, I already fixed it twice
[02:59] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: you can apt-file search , there is no dupe on that point
[02:59] <Tonio_> just that the kontact knode desktop file should be installed with knode, not kontact
[02:59] <Hobbsee> it wasnt fixed when i first found it, so i've got no idea what your "fixing" involved.
[02:59] <Tonio_> that doesn't make sense
[03:00] <Hobbsee> indeed.  but the entire directory that the knode desktop file is in *gets installed by kontact*
[03:00] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: the fixing is simply to rewrite the .install files, installing each desktop file with the package it depends on to work
[03:00] <Hobbsee> and seeing as knode depends on kontact anyway...
[03:00] <Tonio_> each desktop file uses a different part and lib
[03:00] <Hobbsee> this is true
[03:00] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: but kontact doesn't depend on knode :)
[03:01] <Hobbsee> so you need to specify each desktop file explicitly, and not the entire directory
[03:01] <Tonio_> so installing kontact results a knode component in the left menu that fails to launch because knode isn't installed
[03:01] <Tonio_> here is the problem
[03:01] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: exactly
[03:01] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: only by recommends, yes.
[03:01] <Hobbsee> which are instaleld by default
[03:01] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: knode is installed on a default installation now ?
[03:02] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: that's impossible, knode is in universe
[03:02] <Hobbsee> still, you cant fix the package to install opensync until you do a MIR, or find someone else to, else whatever you upload will sit in depwait
[03:02] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: I can fix the package, put it in an experimental branch of bzr, and wait for the mir ;)
[03:02] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: remember bzr ? :) ^^
[03:03] <Hobbsee> all i seem to be getting out of this is you saying that your way is right, the way it's been done previously is wrong, and that you think everyone else is crap
[03:03] <Hobbsee> hopefully, i'm wrong.
[03:03] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: the opensync/kdepim packaging will have to be done some day, I just want to anticipate
[03:03] <Hobbsee> this is true.  but doing things in a logical order is well, logical.
[03:03] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: hu ????????
[03:04] <Hobbsee> as in, the MIR first, packaging later
[03:04] <Hobbsee> seeing as the MIR will take forever, and the packaging is quick
[03:04] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: am I the kind of guy that considers others people job is crap ?
[03:04] <Hobbsee> you're saying so above.
[03:04] <Tonio_> where ?
[03:04] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: the kdepim packaging has issues in it, for a very long time
[03:04] <Hobbsee> conclusion : kdepim packaging is BAD ;)
[03:05] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: there is a smiley -> AKA joking
[03:05] <Hobbsee> maybe
[03:05] <Hobbsee> but coming in and saying it's screwed up, and then demonstrating that you've forgotten about main/universe deps..is hardly...well, it's arrogant to say the least.  *shrugs*
[03:05] <Edulix> hi!
[03:05] <Hobbsee> hiya
[03:06] <Tonio_> there are several problems, as for example kitchensync.install is missing, but the package isn't commented in control
[03:06] <Edulix> will gutsy come with user selection in kdm? point and click
[03:06] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: that results an empty package, which is not good too
[03:06] <Edulix> (I mean, by default)
[03:06] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: it was commented in control, last i checked
[03:07] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: oh.  yes, this one might be a bit insane, as i had a lot of trouble with brandon's machien at that point
[03:07] <Edulix> I dn't understand why that's not done by default, it's very useful if you don't remember your username exactly, it's a good ui
[03:07] <Hobbsee> Edulix: it already does,
[03:07] <Edulix> Hobbsee: really? :P
[03:07] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: the .install files and the opensync part are different problems
[03:07] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: it's a quirk of not having root there - i couldnt actually do anythign with teh working directory after leaving the pbuilder.
[03:07] <Edulix> Hobbsee: please explain
[03:07] <Hobbsee> so couldnt rebuild the source
[03:08] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: I said I wanted to fix the packaging issues, and I wanted to experimentally try the opensync part -> means testing locally
[03:08] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: good luck to you
[03:08] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: so the main/universe build-deps is at that point not an issue
[03:08] <Edulix> Hobbsee: is the user shown a list of ..ermm..users? wit nice icons and that :P
[03:08] <gnomefreak> Hobbsee: you have java with konq right?
[03:09] <Edulix> Hobbsee: something like http://kde-look.org/content/preview.php?preview=1&id=60890&file1=60890-1.png&file2=&file3=&name=Bela+KDM+theme
[03:09] <Edulix> but with kubuntu logo hehe
[03:10] <Edulix> time to have dinner, bye!
[03:11] <Hobbsee> Edulix: that's already there, if you install kubuntu-default-settings
[03:12] <Hobbsee> gnomefreak: i have no idaea
[03:13] <gnomefreak> the more i look into this the weirder it gets
[03:20] <jjesse> morning
[03:23] <Tonio_> okay, missunderstanding problem is resolved
[03:24] <Hobbsee> hehe :)
[03:24] <Tonio_> and so to make it clear in front of the world :
[03:25] <Tonio_> [kidding]  kdepim's packaging is BAD (but not to much) ^_^ ( ho yes, I'm joking ) [/kidding] 
[03:26] <Hobbsee> and hopefully that it's not all hobbsee's fault.
[03:26] <Tonio_> I'll try to unsure my futures "jokes" will appear as it here :)
[03:26] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: as I said, what I'm tired of is the issues I have to merge some little changes that correct a few issues with debian
[03:26] <Hobbsee> fair enough
[03:29] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: so the debian packaging includes opensync by default ?
[03:29] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: dont remember, sorry
[03:29] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: I'll have a look
[03:29] <Tonio_> thanks
[03:42] <manchicken> mhb: What other program needs a dpkg --configure -a fix?
[03:43] <mhb> manchicken: gdebi-kde
[03:43] <manchicken> mhb: Because what I've been looking at doing here is pretty simple.  I don't know why we need a separate program to do this.
[03:44] <mhb> hmm, because creating two wheels when we only need one is a bad practice
[03:44] <manchicken> But we're not.
[03:44] <manchicken> Here's what I'm doing.
[03:46] <manchicken> Adept already had code for detecting a database locked situation.  So I'm just changing the dialog from an info alert to a yes/no/cancel warning.  Cancel closes adept, no carries on in read-only mode, and yes issues a shell escape to dpkg --configure -a.  If the dpkg --configure -a fails, then we give an info warning and exit.
[03:46] <manchicken> Oh, and I'm closing the database before the shell escape and reopening it afterwards.
[03:46] <mhb> if it had the code, why had it never use it?
[03:46] <mhb> used
[03:46] <manchicken> It had the alert, but it never tried to fix anything.
[03:47] <manchicken> It's just that the error message it gave you was so useless that it didn't look like it was giving you a smart alert.
[03:47] <mhb> okay, here's my comments
[03:48] <mhb> what could we gain by hardcoding the "dpkg --configure -a" hook into this?
[03:48] <mhb> we'd gain speed
[03:48] <mhb> but do we need it?
[03:48] <manchicken> It's not about gaining speed.
[03:48] <manchicken> It's about simplicity for me.
[03:48] <mhb> manchicken: consider this:
[03:49] <mhb> manchicken: there are many more people with Kubuntu who can hack python code than those who can hack adept
[03:49] <manchicken> does it really make sense to go to another program for one dialog and one shell escape?
[03:49] <mhb> manchicken: so what happens if there's going to be a similar scenario like this one?
[03:49] <manchicken> If adept were in python.... well people think it's slow now :)
[03:50] <manchicken> I know you already came up with a python solution, and that's my fault for not doing this research when you needed it.
[03:50] <ScottK> Riddell: Does kdesdk-scripts need to have it's own copy of licensecheck when it's in devscripts?
[03:50] <manchicken> But I don't really think that expanding adepts range of languages used is worth over-complicating this solution.
[03:51] <mhb> manchicken: no, you get me wrong
[03:51] <Riddell> ScottK: no idea, sorry, busy
[03:51] <ScottK> OK.  Thanks.
[03:51] <mhb> manchicken: I'm for launching an external command that (if all goes well) returns just a number
[03:51] <ScottK> Hobbsee: How about you?  Does kdesdk-scripts need to have it's own copy of licensecheck when it's in devscripts?
[03:52] <Hobbsee> i have no idea
[03:52] <ScottK> Any suggestions on who I should ask?
[03:52] <mhb> manchicken: but launching a specific command is a very inflexible way to solve this
[03:52] <manchicken> mhb: Not if it is the solution.
[03:52] <Hobbsee> um, no
[03:52] <ScottK> Deleting the kde specific one would be the shortest path forward.
[03:53] <ScottK> OK.
[03:53] <manchicken> mhb: There is no other way that I know of to solve that problem.
[03:53] <mhb> manchicken: in this case
[03:53] <manchicken> If there was you would be completely right.
[03:53] <mhb> manchicken: what about other cases?
[03:53] <manchicken> But this is a specific problem, so I'm apprehensive to justify over-engineering for general cases.
[03:53] <mhb> manchicken: the wrapper python script adds flexibility to the problem-solving
[03:53] <mhb> manchicken: what if it suddenly changes to "dpkg --configure -b" ?
[03:53] <mhb> :o)
[03:53] <manchicken> Yeah, but how s the python script any more flexible then the C+ soution?
[03:53] <manchicken> solution*
[03:54] <mhb> manchicken: it's easy to hack on
[03:54] <manchicken> mhb: Then it's a named constant, so we just modify one line in the code and recompile.
[03:54] <manchicken> mhb: C++ isn't particularly difficult to hack.
[03:54] <mhb> manchicken: adept is
[03:54] <manchicken> mhb: Hell, I've been doing so.
[03:54] <manchicken> mhb: Not really.  It just takes a little more time to follow.
[03:54] <mhb> manchicken: I'm doing that, too
[03:55] <manchicken> Anybody who's ever worked with legacy code will look at adept and feel right at home.
[03:56] <fdoving> without too much background info, i don't think a separate app is the way to go with this issue.
[03:56] <mhb> okay then, I'm overvoted without too much background info :o)
[03:56] <fdoving> there might even be situations when you actually use some other program, that locks the db, i can't understand what that separate program could do, besides 'dpkg --configure -a'
[03:57] <manchicken> mhb: I know you worked to get this other solution in there, and I'm really sorry I didn't get the research to you in time for you not to have done that, but I really don't know if it's necessary here.
[03:57] <mhb> fdoving: show the error message that "dpkg --configure -a" reported, for example.
[03:58] <mhb> fdoving: but this particular command is not very verbose, I have to admit
[03:58] <manchicken> But that's really easy to do in the C++, too.
[03:58] <manchicken> It's probably only 5 or 6 lines.
[03:59] <fdoving> could probably make it 2 too, with some kdialog magic. :)
[03:59] <mhb> fdoving: oh please no pop-ups :o)
[04:00] <fdoving> mhb: you want popups for errors :)
[04:00] <manchicken> fdoving: Well, I'd have to connect a slot to the signal that gives you stderr and stdout output :)
[04:01] <manchicken> Because there's no way I'd do a dpkg --configure -a for this without having it as an asynchronous call :)
[04:02] <fdoving> ok, 5-6 it is, you can connect on one line you know, one loooong :)
[04:02] <manchicken> fdoving: Yes, but then I would be less of a man.
[04:02] <manchicken> :)
[04:03] <fdoving> and you can also use one-char names for everything :)
[04:03] <mhb> manchicken: okay, suit yourself. The only reason why I'd hate you for this is that I'm going to have to maintain exact the same code in Python for gdebi-kde.
[04:04] <manchicken> mhb: Is gdebi-kde in python?
[04:04] <mhb> manchicken: but of course, I'm faster in python, so I can go for a konsole kpart and nice "Show Details" button :D
[04:05] <mhb> manchicken: correct.
[04:05] <manchicken> mhb: That's cool.  I'm going to show a "please wait" screen and post all of the output to stdout.
[04:05] <manchicken> :)
[04:05] <manchicken> mhb: Then it makes more sense to do it this way in python :)
[04:06] <manchicken> Ooh, I thought of another reason to do this in C++ :)
[04:07] <manchicken> Have you ever built adept from source?  The #1 annoyance with that is too many dependencies.  Adept has far to many dependencies.  Doing this in python would add three more: the script itself, python, and the qt bindings for python.
[04:11] <manchicken> mhb: Besides... how could you hate me?  I'm manchicken.  Everybody loves chicken.
[04:11] <mhb> manchicken: of course :o) the only thing I hate is waste of (my) time .o)
[04:12] <mhb> manchicken: so if you want to create and maintain a solution within adept, be my guest
[04:12] <manchicken> mhb: And I hate you wasting time, too... especially whenit's my fault :)
[04:12] <mhb> manchicken: it wasn't that much time, and pty practice is always handy
[04:17] <manchicken> mhb: I really am sorry :)
[04:17] <mhb> also, every feature/bug-fix is a five-liner, but if it was that simple, we'd be correcting 100 bugs a day.
[04:18] <manchicken> mhb: I got close to that yesterday.
[04:18] <manchicken> I fixed 3.
[04:18] <manchicken> ;)
[04:24] <mhb> manchicken: is it possible to configure the default state of the expanders in "manager" ?
[04:25] <manchicken> mhb: Of course it's possible.
[04:25] <manchicken> We need to make it so that it remembers previous states though I think.
[04:25] <mhb> manchicken: yes, that's what I meant
[04:25] <manchicken> I think by default, if a user has never seen adept before, everything should be open.
[04:25] <mhb> manchicken: make it so that it's configurable through a config file
[04:25] <manchicken> I think there's a wishlist about that.
[04:25] <manchicken> But I still haven't even touched the adept task that I brought to the table for feisty.
[04:25] <manchicken> heh
[04:25] <manchicken> err, gutsy
[04:26] <mhb> manchicken: I'd actually let the "tags" stuff closed by default
[04:26] <mhb> it takes so much space
[04:26] <mhb> and I haven't *ever* used it
[04:26] <Tonio_> I don't like the "gutsy" name
[04:26] <Tonio_> unfortable to write this one on a french keyboard
[04:26] <Tonio_> feisty was much easier :)
[04:27] <mhb> Tonio_: you don't use qwerty in France?
[04:28] <manchicken> Tonio_: Well I can send you a US keyboad if you want ;)
[04:28] <Hobbsee> heh
[04:29] <xerosis_> mhb: judging by my girlfriend's typing who's just started working in france, i don't think they do ;)
[04:29] <Tonio_> mhb: nope :)
[04:29] <Tonio_> manchicken: hehe
[04:29] <Tonio_> mhb: french keyboard is azerty
[04:30] <Tonio_> so I have a mac variant of the azerty keyboard
[04:30] <Tonio_> a bit messy I must say :)
[04:30] <xerosis_> Tonio_: is there any justification for azerty?
[04:31] <xerosis_> i suppose all the french questons words use q...
[04:31] <fdoving> Tonio_: hi, can you have a look at this: https://wiki.kubuntu.org/MainInclusionReportKioUmountWrapper - and register/submit it ?
[04:31] <fdoving> Tonio_: i need to run, thanks in advance.
[04:31] <Tonio_> xerosis_: probably the response is : "NOT doing the same way than the fucking english !!"
[04:32] <Tonio_> xerosis_: french are stupid you know :)
[04:32] <xerosis_> Tonio_: no comment ;)
[04:32] <Tonio_> xerosis_: but seriously, the real reason is probably the accents
[04:32] <Tonio_> xerosis_: the french azerty is better for us since we have extended letters :    
[04:32] <xerosis_> Tonio_: makes sense
[04:32] <Tonio_> so the standard qwerty was limited
[04:33] <mhb> manchicken: also, it would be very cool if the tag filter expanding caused the side bar to hide/show
[04:33] <Tonio_> xerosis_: btw would could have done an extended version of qwerty, I don't understand the reson to change a<>q w<>z  putting M nearby L and no N etc.......
[04:33] <mhb> manchicken: that's a real one-liner
[04:34] <Tonio_> manchicken: doing the katapult thing
[04:34] <manchicken> mhb: Heh
[04:34] <manchicken> Tonio_: Merci :)
[04:35] <Tonio_> manchicken: mais de rien mon cher :)
[04:35] <manchicken> Tonio_: I still have a hard time believing that anybody is really capable of writing SQL that bad.
[04:36] <Tonio_> manchicken: talking about the katapult code ?
[04:37] <Tonio_> manchicken: katapult is not an app I know :) I didn't even knew it used sqllite as a backend
[04:39] <manchicken> Yes.
[04:39] <manchicken> It doesn't use sqlite, it uses whatever database settings it pulls from amarok.
[04:39] <manchicken> So theoretically it is supposed to support every dbms that amarok does.
[04:40] <manchicken> But all of the SQL is non-compliant and very MySQL specific.
[04:40] <manchicken> Hopefully I fixed enough of it to get things working.
[04:40] <manchicken> That program could be so much faster.
[04:40] <Tonio_> manchicken: what is that horrible in the sql part ?
[04:40] <Tonio_> I'm looking at it and well, it doesn't look that ugly :)
[04:41] <Tonio_> manchicken: are you talking about the long "LEFT JOIN" thing ?
[04:41] <Tonio_> that could be better I agree, but this is not that ugly.....
[04:41] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: come out, another arrogant guy !!!
[04:42] <Tonio_> manchicken: we should make a team :)
[04:42] <manchicken> No, I'm talking about the double-quotes and the WHERE 1 AND bit.
[04:42] <Tonio_> the "Kubuntu Arrogant Contributors" team :)
[04:42] <Tonio_> manchicken: just kiddin', read upper you'll understand :)
[04:42] <manchicken> Tonio_: Not arrogant.  Just grouchy :)
[04:42] <Tonio_> hehe
[04:42] <Tonio_> manchicken: just developper I guess :)
[04:42] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: heh.
[04:43] <manchicken> Nice.
[04:43] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: french jokes..... sorry for this :)
[04:43] <Hobbsee> :)
[04:43] <Hobbsee> it's okay
[04:43] <Tonio_> manchicken: indeed, the WHERE 1 is ugly
[04:43] <Tonio_> same for double quotes
[04:44] <Tonio_> manchicken: katapult is a launchpad project
[04:45] <Tonio_> manchicken: did you try to get the patch merged ? Riddell should have the upload rights I think
[04:48] <Riddell> he did, I didn't have time yet
[04:48] <manchicken> Tonio_: I just put the patches up :)
[04:48] <Riddell> and won't for a while, go ahead and upload, branch from my bzr archive if you want and put on in kubuntu-members
[04:50] <Tonio_> Riddell: we'll do that together with Hobbsee probably :)
[04:50] <Tonio_> Riddell: I'd like to put lots of things on bzr, but well no time to create 40 projects :)
[04:50] <Hobbsee> hooray, i get to be involved!
[04:50] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: hehe
[04:57] <xerosis_> Tonio_: if you stick a list of project on a wiki I'm sure I could help create a few
[04:59] <Tonio_> xerosis_: the kubuntu-desktop could be a project, and each package a branch of it, imho
[04:59] <Tonio_> xerosis_: no ?
[04:59] <xerosis_> Tonio_: you probably know better than me
[05:00] <mhb> Tonio_: depends on whether the LP folks allow this
[05:00] <Tonio_> mhb: true
[05:01] <Tonio_> mhb: but to my ears that sounds more logic I guess
[05:01] <mhb> manchicken: by the way, is there a way to get the whole adept into qt designer?
[05:01] <mhb> manchicken: so I can find out how the widgets are called
[05:02] <Tonio_> manchicken: stupid question but how do you apply that patch ? :)
[05:02] <Tonio_> manchicken: this is not a diff ;)
[05:02] <Tonio_> manchicken: emacs specific thing ?
[05:02] <manchicken> mhb: Not gonna happen :)
[05:03] <manchicken> Tonio_: Is it < and > or is it - and + ?
[05:03] <Tonio_> manchicken: yep ;)
[05:03] <manchicken> I'm too inconsistent on my patches, I'm trying to get it.
[05:03] <Tonio_> it is < >
[05:03] <manchicken> Tonio_: Okay, so < is a - and > is a +
[05:03] <Tonio_> manchicken: no problem I reapplyed it
[05:04] <manchicken> mhb: Many of those widgets are dynamically generated.
[05:04] <manchicken> mhb: The big list view that you see isn't actually using separate rows for each package.
[05:06] <Tonio_> manchicken: I'm just unsure where the last line you had is supposed to go :)
[05:06] <Tonio_> before or after the }
[05:09] <manchicken> mhb: Instead it's subclassing the list view widget and binding to all of the methods like text and pixmap and such.
[05:09] <manchicken> Ah.
[05:10] <Tonio_> manchicken: any idea ?
[05:10] <manchicken> Could you paste the line?
[05:13] <Tonio_> manchicken: sure
[05:14] <Tonio_> manchicken: http://paste.tonio.homelinux.org/124
[05:14] <Tonio_> manchicken: http://paste.tonio.homelinux.org/125
[05:14] <mhb> manchicken: yeah, adept was designed with simplicity and code beauty in mind, I see :o)
[05:15] <Tonio_> manchicken: dunno which is os the good as I don't really understand what does the code do ;)
[05:15] <manchicken> mhb: That was a performance decision.
[05:15] <mhb> manchicken: yeah, must have been
[05:15] <manchicken> Tonio_: Fair enough :)
[05:16] <manchicken> mhb: Can you imagine how much more memory it would take to load a separate object for each and every different package?
[05:16] <mhb> manchicken: there isn't any docs that can tell me "oh, you're looking for a way to hide the sidebar? But of course, the sidebar is called SideBarWidget...
[05:16] <nixternal> mornin'
[05:16] <manchicken> mhb: No, but the code is pretty easy to figure out if you just follow it.
[05:16] <manchicken> It takes time though, I won't lie.
[05:18] <mhb> manchicken: yeah, but the documentation is the thing that lowers the input time in such scenarios when the code is more complex than usual
[05:18] <manchicken> Yeah.
[05:19] <manchicken> Most of the time the solutions a little complex.
[05:19] <Tonio_> manchicken: so which one is the good one ?
[05:19] <manchicken> Tonio_: I'm trying to load your pages still :)
[05:19] <Tonio_> lol
[05:19] <manchicken> 125
[05:20] <manchicken> Because the for loop is generating a list of clauses, and the sqlQuery.append() bit with the clauses.join() call takes those clauses and makes them int a long string of (clause AND clause AND clause)
[05:21] <manchicken> And unfortunately, I'm going to have to do some hacking for bill paying purposes, too.  heh
[05:54] <nixternal> http://livestream.fsf.org:8800
[05:54] <nixternal> GPLv3 announcement in 5 minutes!
[05:57] <manchicken> Ooh, amarok looks different on gutsy.  Very nice.
[05:57] <manchicken> I haven't even looked at it yet.
[05:58] <xerosis_> what happened to kvncviewer?
[05:58] <xerosis_> ignore me...
[05:59] <Riddell> those FSF and GPL3 logos look like devilish
[06:03] <manchicken> RMS time.
[06:03] <manchicken> And some lag.
[06:04] <manchicken> Oh, did their audio just drop out?
[06:05] <Riddell> works for me but keeps skipping
[06:06] <nixternal> ya, keeps buffering in kaffeine
[06:08] <Tonio_> Riddell: is there a way to force a universe app to be included in the translations pack ?
[06:09] <Tonio_> Riddell: looks like kerry is used by a lot of people, and the translation is very poor by default
[06:09] <Tonio_> Riddell: would be interesting to have it in the packs imho
[06:17] <nixternal> yay mako!
[06:22] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: what of kdebase do you think is causing this?  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kdebase/+bug/66827
[06:22] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 66827 in kdebase "[site-issue]  konqueror doesnt handle frames correctly. eg http://forum.ship-of-fools.com/" [Medium,Confirmed] 
[06:22] <Hobbsee> it's one of our patches
[06:23] <manchicken> So do we get new versions of GNU Emacs and such now?
[06:23] <Hobbsee> (and that's a heck of a lot of patches to be carrying)
[06:24] <manchicken> You know this is why we haven't gotten new versions of GNU stuff for a while.  heh
[06:24] <nixternal> libk3b update isn't installing..but that could be due to the repos not have the updated version yet
[06:24] <nixternal> libk3b-dev that is
[06:25] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: still that old bug ;)
[06:25] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: indeed.
[06:26] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: a friend of mine is asking when we're going to get a fix
[06:26] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: I already searched, I couldn't find the cause, as we don't have any patch on khtml
[06:26] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: it doesnt exist on debian, though.  nor upstream kde
[06:26] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: btw the bug is basically due to bad html
[06:26] <Hobbsee> tru ethat
[06:26] <Hobbsee> but everywehere else seems to cope
[06:26] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: I have done several tests, and the real cause is that the frame definition is bad, and you have frames in frames etc........
[06:26] <Hobbsee> yeah
[06:26] <Hobbsee> tur
[06:26] <Hobbsee> *True
[06:27] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: but why does it only fail in ubuntu, dunno
[06:27] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: could be in kdelibs btw, not obviously kdebase
[06:29] <manchicken> mhb: My thing works, it's just got a couple tiny bugs.
[06:29] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: only the gmail spoof, the kwallet simplify, flash installer, and ajax encoding
[06:29] <manchicken> And I have to figure out how to present the wait screen to the user better.
[06:29] <manchicken> But it's unlocking the database.
[06:29] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: yep, bu none of these seems to be the cause
[06:30] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: if you have 2 weeks to spend on this, I'd say : build without the patches, and readd them
[06:30] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: then go with decotomy
[06:30] <Tonio_> the problem is that kdebase/libs are to heavy to proceed that way, that's the point :)
[06:30] <Hobbsee> true that
[06:30] <Tonio_> that's why I didn't do it
[06:30] <Tonio_> is decotomy correct in english ?
[06:31] <Hobbsee> nope
[06:31] <Hobbsee> no idea what that is
[06:31] <nixternal> Tonio_: dichotomy
[06:32] <Tonio_> nixternal: thanks
[06:32] <nixternal> no problemo
[06:32] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: means get in the middle
[06:32] <Tonio_> add 20 patches -> problem
[06:33] <Hobbsee> oh right
[06:33] <nixternal> in the middle, split, cutting in 2, division, bisected...ummmm
[06:33] <Hobbsee> i believe you want "going by trial and error"
[06:33] <Tonio_> remove 10 patches -> if problem resolved -> readd 5 patches etc......
[06:33] <Hobbsee> which is effectively binary sorting, yes.
[06:33] <Tonio_> take in the middle until you get the one :)
[06:33] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: yep that's it
[06:33] <Hobbsee> :)
[06:33] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: the term for the mathematical concept of this is dechotomy
[06:33] <nixternal> which is odd, you would think it would be a bichotomy really...but hey, the english language is great at destroying true words
[06:34] <Tonio_> dichotomy, sorry
[06:34] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: ah, fair enough
[06:34] <Hobbsee> tha't ssounding slightly familiar
[06:34] <Tonio_> nixternal: true that
[06:35] <nixternal> I have a Philosophy professor from Romania, and she makes it easier to understand because she will translate her native latin tongue nicely
[06:35] <nixternal> she always tells us how for people that have been speaking english their entire life, they destroy it, and that it is easier for someone who is learning it to pick it up correctly
[06:37] <mhb> it'd be great to have tools for stuff like this one
[06:37] <mhb> actually it's a two-part task
[06:38] <mhb> one tool checks for the mistake and the other handles the patching/unpatching
[06:40] <manchicken> Riddell: Should I be editing the changelog in my patches?
[06:43] <Tonio_> Riddell: I'll probably fix kds to get .deb associated to gdebi by default instead of ark
[06:43] <manchicken> I'll tell you, as tricky as the adept code is, for what it's doing and how much data it is processing, adept is one fast and convenient program.
[06:43] <Riddell> manchicken: onnly if you're sending .debdiffs
[06:43] <Riddell> Tonio_: ok
[06:44] <manchicken> Riddell: Ah.  I'm not doing that.
[06:46] <mhb> Tonio_: of course
[08:02] <Tonio_> manchicken: pign ?
[08:03] <Tonio_> or mhb maybe ?
[08:11] <mhb> ever ready
[08:18] <mhb> Tonio_: what's up?
[08:30] <manchicken> Tonio_: Wuddup?
[08:34] <Tonio_> manchicken, mhb:there a couple of bugs in kerry that I would like to fix, but I don't understand the issue
[08:34] <Tonio_> everything valid in the code, but it fails
[08:35] <Tonio_> I'd like to print out some variable to understand what's going on, but that generaly fails
[08:35] <Tonio_> just gimme 5 minutes and I show you the problem
[08:37] <manchicken> kerry?  The search thing?
[08:38] <mhb> manchicken: no, the presidential candidate :o)
[08:38] <manchicken> mhb: Oh, there's a lot of bugs in that fella.
[08:38] <manchicken> mhb: One of them ate his "courage"
[08:48] <DaSkreech> I'm back if anyone pinged me
[08:48] <DaSkreech>  My history is gone
[08:49] <DaSkreech> manchicken: His tasty tasty courage?
[08:56] <manchicken> DaSkreech: No, his not so tasty courage.
[09:01] <manchicken> DaSkreech: I don't remember that one.... :S
[09:01] <DaSkreech> When Fry and bender joined the army before they got sent off when war were declared
[09:01] <DaSkreech> :)
[09:04] <Tonio_> manchicken, mhb: http://paste.tonio.homelinux.org/126
[09:05] <DaSkreech> You haev a paste.tonio? :D That's great
[09:05] <Tonio_> manchicken, mhb: what i added there is just the "isRegisteredApplication" thing, seems correct to me
[09:06] <Tonio_> manchicken: , mhb: ftbfs, here is the build issue..... I must say I don't understand : http://paste.tonio.homelinux.org/127
[09:06] <Tonio_> DaSkreech: yep :) pretty usefull
[09:06] <Tonio_> manchicken: hope you can help on that point
[09:07] <mhb> Tonio_: change the QString to QCString
[09:07] <manchicken> Ah, yeah.
[09:07] <manchicken> that C makes a big difference :)
[09:07] <Tonio_> mhb: oups
[09:07] <Tonio_> what is the difference ?
[09:08] <Tonio_> well I didn't write the initial QString thing, best would be to convert the variable but how to ?
[09:09] <Tonio_> would a QCString toto = name; do the job ?
[09:09] <manchicken> Tonio_: A QCString is a C-string.
[09:09] <manchicken> like a null-terminated string.
[09:09] <mhb> http://doc.trolltech.com/3.3/qcstring.html
[09:10] <Tonio_> manchicken: okay so now how to convert the qstring to qcstring ?
[09:10] <manchicken> Tonio_: qstring_ptr->utf8()
[09:10] <mhb> damn, you beat me
[09:11] <manchicken> mhb: I are teh 1337.
[09:11] <manchicken> Tonio_: so in your call to that dcop method do...     if (kapp->dcopClient()->isApplicationRegistered(name.utf8())) {
[09:11] <mhb> yeah, if the question was about Prolog, I'd have the upper hand now :o)
[09:12] <manchicken> heh
[09:12] <manchicken> I love my Qt :)
[09:14] <Tonio_> manchicken: according to the qt doc, that should work too, right ?
[09:14] <Tonio_> QCString appname = QCString(name);
[09:14] <Tonio_> if name is a QString, of course
[09:15] <mhb> Tonio_: AFAICR, no
[09:16] <Tonio_> mhb: hum, that's exactly how it's written in the doc.... strange
[09:17] <manchicken> Tonio_: Sure.
[09:17] <Tonio_> manchicken: means that should work ?
[09:18] <manchicken> What's interesting is that you can assign a QCString to a QString, but not the other way around.  You have to process the QString to make it a QCString.
[09:18] <manchicken> Tonio_: Yup.
[09:18] <manchicken> err, Tonio_No, you can't do that.
[09:18] <manchicken> You can't convert a QCString to a QString like that.  You have to call the utf8() method.
[09:18] <manchicken> At least that's what I read of that.
[09:19] <mhb> heh, who's leet now?
[09:19] <mhb> :o)
[09:20] <mhb> Tonio_: I don't see any constructor like that in the docs. I might be wrong, though.
[09:21] <manchicken> mhb: I gave a much better explanation.
[09:21] <Tonio_> manchicken: testing :)
[09:21] <manchicken> mhb: :P
[09:23] <mhb> manchicken: http://kubuntu.pastebin.ca/596003
[09:26] <mhb> manchicken: get it?
[09:26] <manchicken> mhb: What is that?  Scheme?
[09:27] <manchicken> erlang?
[09:27] <mhb> manchicken: prolog, like I said :o)
[09:27] <manchicken> Ah.
[09:27] <manchicken> Never touched prolog :)
[09:27] <manchicken> I've gotta run and rescue my sister from the side of the road.
[09:27] <nixternal> screw touching it, I don't ever think I have heard of it
[09:27] <manchicken> She's got a flat and no donut.
[09:28] <manchicken> Later y'all.
[09:28] <nixternal> I hate donuts, the spare ones that is
[10:15] <DaSkreech> mhb: sebas made some commits to the plasmoid if you wanna test
[10:17] <mhb> DaSkreech: will do, give me a minute
[10:39] <nixternal> man, Dove chocolates are the bestest
[10:55] <mhb> DaSkreech: still can't convince it to reload properly
[10:56] <DaSkreech> :-) ok
[10:56] <mhb> DaSkreech: when I close it and put a new one, the correct status is set
[10:56] <ScottK> nixternal: Got a minute for a pm...
[10:56] <nixternal> sure