[02:52] <macogw> are the things that you're working on putting ubuntu on smart phones or just for internet?
[08:12] <bspencer> Bo-ster
[08:12] <Bo> Hi, bob
[08:13] <bspencer> hey
[08:13] <Bo> johnV said I can find you here
[08:13] <Bo> : )
[08:13] <Bo> the hildon-control-panel build successfully now :)
[08:13] <Bo> thanks to johnV's help
[08:14] <bspencer> good to hear
[08:14] <bspencer> w/ osso-af-settings change?
[08:14] <Bo> yes
[08:14] <bspencer> is hildon-libs-base for control panel or hildon-desktop?
[08:14] <bspencer> because I can build hildon-desktop on my system and I don't have hildon-libs-base
[08:14] <Bo> we just have to start from a clean repo
[08:14] <bspencer> I think that tko said hildon-lib-base was outdated and no longer needed.
[08:15] <Bo> for control panel
[08:15] <bspencer> ok
[08:15] <bspencer> so control panel needs osso-af-settings and hildon-base-libs
[08:15] <Bo> absolutely :_
[08:15] <bspencer> and this is from the recent "refactoring" code Nokia pointed us at, right?
[08:15] <Bo> yes
[08:15] <bspencer> ok.  got it
[08:16] <Bo> I'm working on the clock thing
[08:16] <Bo> one little question
[08:16] <bspencer> yes
[08:16] <Bo> how do I config the length of my applet
[08:16] <Bo> seems that it's too short
[08:17] <bspencer> set the preferred size
[08:17] <HappyCamp-John> Who let Bo on here? ;)
[08:17] <Bo> ha, hi, JohnV
[08:17] <bspencer> gtk_widget_set_size_request (btn, 52, 52);
[08:18] <bspencer> just make it wider.
[08:18] <Bo> I see, doesn't see any change though
[08:18] <Bo> I didn't already 
[08:18] <bspencer> the problem with the top marquee is that it uses a GtkHBox, so all the controls just get packed to the left
[08:18] <HappyCamp-John> Hi Bo!
[08:18] <Bo> I'll try 
[08:18] <bspencer> hm... I tried this a few days ago and it seemed to work
[08:19] <Bo> maybe some other mistake :)
[08:19] <Bo> I can fix it, hah
[08:19] <Bo> :)
[08:19] <bspencer> i need to figure out how to make a plugin stretch to fill the max horiz space.
[08:19] <bspencer> I'm sure there is a way , but I don't know it off the top of my head.
[08:19] <bspencer> just make it fixed for now and we'll adjust it later.
[08:20] <Bo> OK
[08:23] <Mithrandir> morning
[08:24] <bspencer> Mithrandir, morning, or...not for another 30mins
[08:24] <Mithrandir> IRC greeting time.  Always morning. :-)
[08:25] <bspencer> checking out for the night
[08:25] <bspencer> Bo, anything else?
[08:26] <bspencer> Bo -- can you see if horaceli needs anything?
[08:26] <Mithrandir> Bo: what source package is hildon-libs-base built from?
[08:27] <Mithrandir> https://stage.maemo.org/svn/maemo/projects/haf/trunk/hildon-base-lib/ ?
[08:27] <bspencer> I think we got it from https://stage.maemo.org/svn/maemo/projects/haf/trunk/hildon-base-lib/
[08:27] <bspencer> yes.
[08:27] <Mithrandir> somehow that doesn't look too alive.
[08:28] <Mithrandir> last entry in the changelog is in october 2006
[08:28] <bspencer> I think there must be a lingering dependency inside the control panel code
[08:28] <bspencer> we just need to ferret it out
[08:28] <Mithrandir> if it's something we need, I'll be happy to get it into the repo, but I'm just a tad sceptical until some of the maemo guys tell me otherwise.
[08:29] <bspencer> yep
[08:29] <Bo> yes
[08:29] <Bo> from https://stage.maemo.org/svn/maemo/projects/haf/trunk/hildon-base-lib/
[08:29] <bspencer> let's get tko or other Nokia guys to suggest a solution
[08:30] <Mithrandir> tko_: ^^ ; could you give us a hint as to whether hildon-base-lib is used or not?
[08:32] <bspencer> I'm going to sleep.  Take care.
[08:33] <Mithrandir> see you around
[08:34] <Bo> bye , Bob,
[08:34] <Bo> nice sleep :)
[10:30] <tko_> Mithrandir, it's not. the functionality is available in gnomevfs and inotify
[10:30] <Mithrandir> ok, thanks.
[03:24] <Mithrandir> agoliveira_BRB: so, I'm looking at matchbox-window-manager, and tbh, I'd rather just port the few fixes we want than use the maemo one.
[03:27] <tko_> it's that bad? :-] 
[03:29] <Mithrandir> no, not really, but easy merging with Debian is something we care about.
[03:30] <Mithrandir> so it's actually more that it doesn't gain us anything significant to go with the maemo one.
[03:33] <agoliveira> Mithrandir: I agree with you but we need something fast for testing and Matt asked me to import this one in a different branch so I did it.
[03:36] <agoliveira> BTW, IIRC maemo's version is upstream + patches so it shouldn't be hard to sync anyway.
[03:37] <Mithrandir> the packaging seems to be based on an old debian snapshot
[03:39] <agoliveira> The packaging maybe but the code itself comes from a very new matchbox WM.
[03:40] <agoliveira> We can just revamp the packaging...
[03:41] <Mithrandir> the complete size of the diff is about 2.5kloc; it's not a big deal to fix.
[03:42] <Mithrandir> and most of that again is theme stuff
[03:46] <agoliveira> Mithrandir: Yes, that's true. Well, if you think so, it's the same to me.
[03:46] <Mithrandir> hm, we should probably get upstream's SVN imported
[03:47] <Mithrandir> any chance you could get it imported?  http://svn.o-hand.com/repos/matchbox/trunk/matchbox-window-manager
[03:47] <agoliveira> I still don't get power to do it. I can just prepare and ask.
[03:48] <agoliveira> But we already have it on main so what do you suggest?
[03:49] <Mithrandir> well, upstream's repo is the one listed above; I suggest we get that imported, branch into ~ubuntu-mobile and work on getting a good package there.
[03:51] <agoliveira> I understood that, I mean we already have a matchbox WM in the gutsy repository. Are you talking about replace it?
[03:51] <Mithrandir> oh, yes, or just update it with the patches we want
[03:52] <agoliveira> Ah, fine. I just tought that was exactly to not mess with the current package that Matt asked to import that one in a different branch.
[03:53] <agoliveira> that one = maemo's
[04:09] <Mithrandir> now, let's see if this thingabob builds.
[04:12] <agoliveira> Mithrandir: Are you talking about which one?
[04:12] <Mithrandir> matchbox-wm
[04:13] <agoliveira> Ok, so I think we should sync here :) Have you imported from svn and are building it or just building the one from maemo that I imported before?
[04:14] <Mithrandir> no. :-)
[04:14] <Mithrandir> I've taken the delta between maemo's svn version and the one already in the archive and blatted most of the delta onto the latter.
[04:15] <agoliveira> Got it.
[04:16] <Mithrandir> I'd like to get an import of upstream svn so we can look at what the delta there is and get it down.
[04:21] <agoliveira> Fine. I'll arrange that on LP.
[04:23] <agoliveira> Done. Just need to poke someone to import it.
[04:24] <Mithrandir> thanks a lot
[04:24] <agoliveira> (Less than 2.5 minutes - I'm getting good at this ;) )
[04:24] <Mithrandir> yup, you are. :-)
[04:24] <agoliveira> https://launchpad.net/matchbox-window-manager
[04:24] <Mithrandir> this compiled for me now, so I'll just upload it and hope it doesn't break too much
[04:24] <agoliveira> Cool
[04:24] <Mithrandir> my brain is about to melt so I'll go do something else for a bit
[04:26] <agoliveira> I know what is like :) I'm going lunch in a few minutes.
[04:27] <agoliveira> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HQgF0pRkjMc
[04:28] <Mithrandir> there, uploaded.
[04:28] <Mithrandir> go wild testing it when it's built?
[04:29] <agoliveira> Sure. I'll try it out as soon as it gets there.
[04:29] <Mithrandir> cheers
[04:50] <TeTeT> will Ubuntu Mobile support the Menlow platform? on the wiki most seem to be for McCaslin. 
[05:12] <Mithrandir> TeTeT: yes
[07:25] <rusty> has anyone noticed that attempting to install "hal" in a chroot will now fail in the postinst script while attempting to start hal?
[07:26] <rusty> looks like something that happened over night
[07:56] <agoliveira> New matchbox window manager seens to be running ok. I've being playing with it a bit now with no crashes.
[07:59] <agoliveira> Mithrandir: Looks like your changes didn't break anything very basic. Let's see if the other guys find anything.
[07:59] <agoliveira> By "very basic" I mean anything so obvious that a can crash right away ;)
[07:59] <agoliveira> a/a/I
[08:00] <agoliveira> Geez... I think I need a coffee
[08:04] <agoliveira> rusty, bobux: New matchbox-window-manager is on the repository. Give it a shot if you dare ;)
[08:04] <rusty> what package version is that?
[08:10] <agoliveira> Version: 1.2-1ubuntu1
[08:11] <agoliveira> This is our matchbox wm with Maemo patches applied.
[08:42] <agoliveira> rusty: I would like to talk about the startup script when you have some time.
[08:43] <rusty> i can talk now... worse case there will be some delay when somebody ask me a question in the phone meeting i am in
[08:44] <rusty> crap... now i see why installing hal inside a chroot is breaking
[08:45] <agoliveira> rusty: Don't need to be now, I can wait a bit.
[08:45] <rusty> agoliveira, lets go ahead and chat
[08:46] <agoliveira> Fine. To me. So, what do you have in mind?
[08:46] <rusty> well... i think we need a mininalized display manager
[08:47] <rusty> where at the very least, we start with an upstart script that reads a config to find the default user, and then starts X and then starts a bunch of session scripts
[08:47] <agoliveira> As a mean to login? Multiple users?
[08:48] <rusty> eventually, this would provide the ability to have multi-user login
[08:48] <rusty> right now i have a helloworld upstart script that runs startx as root
[08:48] <rusty> and then have /root/.xinitrc that startsup hildon
[08:49] <agoliveira> If you think multi user is necessary (and I tend to agree), I would go for the minimal-gdm from start.
[08:49] <rusty> this is a bit of a hack, but works
[08:49] <rusty> what all does a minimal-gdm pull in?
[08:49] <agoliveira> BTW, minimal-gdm is a way of speak :) I don't actually know if there is one :)
[08:50] <agoliveira> I'll have to check if there is such a beast.
[08:50] <rusty> ok
[08:50] <agoliveira> But if there is, it will make things easier for us.
[08:50] <rusty> so then... what all does gdm bring in?
[08:52] <agoliveira> Well, from start, things like remote logins we don't need I guess.
[08:52] <rusty> yea
[08:52] <agoliveira> perhaps we could try XDM
[08:52] <rusty> i was thinking more long term
[08:53] <agoliveira> Hmmm...
[08:53] <rusty> hell, we can just have an upstart script and configure xinitrc
[08:53] <rusty> that is, configure xinitrc to startup hildon-desktop and all it's deps
[08:53] <agoliveira> I think we need to round up what we need and choose something based on this but, for starts, I don't think that we need to put our expectations very high or we might get in trouble with lots of libs, dependencies, etc
[08:54] <rusty> is there a mdm?  as in mobile desktop manager?
[08:54] <agoliveira> What about xdm? It's simple but flexible enough I guess.
[08:54] <agoliveira> Dunno
[08:55] <agoliveira> Give some time to reseach a bit
[08:55] <rusty> it's just if we created something real quick, where for starters it's a simple upstart script, then we could add a new package called something like mdm
[08:58] <agoliveira> Let's compromize then, give me today to research the subject and if I didn'y come out with something we do our way, is that ok?
[08:59] <rusty> ok
[09:00] <agoliveira> Deal
[09:48] <Mithrandir> use gdm with autologin?
[09:48] <Mithrandir> rusty: have you had any progress on the project-builder front, doing stuff as non-root?
[09:48] <Mithrandir> or would you like me to plunge into it?
[10:18] <agoliveira> Mithrandir: we are talking about having something lighter than gdm but with more or less the same main features.
[10:19] <Mithrandir> agoliveira: but why?
[10:19] <agoliveira> Mithrandir: Why what? No use gdm or use something similar? :)
[10:19] <Mithrandir> why not use gdm
[10:19] <Mithrandir> ?
[10:20] <agoliveira> It is an option but if we are thinking about reduce resurces, I want to check lighter alternatives.
[10:20] <agoliveira> reduce dependencies, etc
[10:21] <agoliveira> I did not eliminate the idea of using gdm, just want to be sure it's the best way.
[10:22] <Mithrandir> I think we should use gdm if we want to have multiuser support (something I'm not convinced we really want) or just an upstart script or similar if not.
[10:23] <agoliveira> I think that at least for webpads, multiuser is good as it's not a very personal device, it's expensive and, as such, tend to be shared.
[10:26] <Mithrandir> depends on where in the world you are, I guess.. I consider a laptop (which is even more expensive) a personal device which I don't share with anybody.
[10:28] <agoliveira> Mithrandir: Well, I don't share mine either but I do share my n770 with my wife (not now, I got her a Palm TX :) ) so, anyway, there's aways the option to autologin.
[10:29] <Mithrandir> yeah
[10:30] <agoliveira> Anyway, so far I didn't see much difference between using XDM or GDM, for instance. GDM is bigger, of course, but we do have space and GDM integrates better, looks nicer. So, I'm between use GDM or nothing, just a startup script.
[11:31] <rusty> Mithrandir, i still need to do the changes to project-builder