[11:30] <xivulon> Hi all
[11:30] <xivulon> I am wubi author
[11:31] <xivulon> I'd like to include edubuntu in our final version
[11:31] <xivulon> I have a couple of questions
[11:31] <xivulon> 1 is this desirable to you?
[11:31] <xivulon> 2 is there an alternate-iso version of edubuntu (I assume the server one) and can I install the desktop with that?
[11:35] <ogra> yes
[11:35] <ogra> (2)
[11:35] <ogra> and yes to 1 as well indeed :)
[11:35] <ogra> the server CD has a workstation install mode, you can select it from the cD bootmenu
[11:36] <ogra> but note that many edu apps n the server CD moved to the server-addon CD
[11:36] <xivulon> is that an alternate-iso style installer
[11:36] <ogra> yes
[11:37] <xivulon> is the kernel the same used in the ubuntu alternate iso (2.6.20-15-generic)?
[11:37] <xivulon> will the desktop be spoiled by the lack of the additional packages?
[11:37] <xivulon> do you have a dvd iso (alternate) which supports all packages?
[11:38] <xivulon> Is it enough to install edubuntu-desktop from the alternate iso to take care of "everything"?
[11:38] <xivulon> apologies for all the questions
[11:39] <ogra> the desktop looks like usual, but things like gcompris and kdeedu are not installed by defult
[11:39] <ogra> we have a dvd as well indeed
[11:39] <ogra> and use the same kernel
[11:39] <ogra> (under the hood edubuntu and ubuntu are identical apart from the ltsp stuff)
[11:40] <ogra> the major differnce in the desktop is the app selection and artwork
[11:40] <xivulon> does the dvd work like an alternate iso (debian-installer)?
[11:40] <ogra> both ...
[11:40] <ogra> it has both isos on it and all options of both in the bootmenu
[11:40] <xivulon> That I guess might be the best shot for inclusion
[11:41] <RichEd> hi ogra & xivulon ... excuse my ignorance, what's wubi ?
[11:41] <xivulon> http://wubi-installer.org
[11:41] <ogra> http://wubi-installer.org/
[11:42] <RichEd> thanks :) also reading the wikipedia article
[11:42] <xivulon> I'am ago, by the way
[11:43] <xivulon> Ok I'll try to bundle edubuntu in the coming days, then I'll pop here to ask some volunteers to test it
[11:44] <xivulon> What would be 5 to 10 good mirrors to use?
[11:45] <xivulon> I see http://www.edubuntu.org/Download, but I'd rather have a short list, we cannot select by country at the moment
[11:55] <RichEd> ogra: http://www.schoollibraryjournal.com/article/CA6456392.html
[11:55] <RichEd> great review I helped out with ... request via the marketing team
[11:55] <RichEd> trying to get it on the fridge as well
[11:56] <ogra> cool !!!
[12:01] <RichEd> and another one due out soon from the Technology in Higher Education ... also US ...
[12:15] <RichEd> ogra: read the first two posts here : http://coloco.ubuntu-rocks.org/
[12:21] <ogra> woah
[12:21] <ogra> impressing
[12:24] <RichEd> some good stuff there ...
[12:24] <RichEd> * what they presented
[12:24] <RichEd> * how they presented
[12:24] <RichEd> * the HP server (nice relationship opportunity)
[12:24] <RichEd> * the local support offering
[12:27] <edistar> hello
[12:33] <RichEd> hello edistar
[01:01] <edistar> ogra: are you there?
[01:03] <edistar> how do I get the source for the student-control-panel?
[01:09] <gnomefreak> edistar: apt-get source student-control-panel
[01:11] <edistar> gnomefreak: and where will that source be then? sry, I'm still a beginner..
[01:11] <edistar> and I'd like to download it somewhere from the net, cause I need to program on a different pc..
[01:12] <gnomefreak> edistar: whatever dir you are in in terminal
[01:12] <edistar> ah, not bad..
[01:13] <gnomefreak> edistar: normally i make a dir named after what source i pull cd into it and than apt-get source
[01:13] <edistar> okey:)
[01:13] <edistar> gnomefreak: do you think the student-control-panel is complex?
[01:13] <gnomefreak> edistar: i havent looked at it but what do you plan to do with it?
[01:14] <edistar> gnomefreak: fix a few bugs..
[01:14] <edistar> gnomefreak: I have never contributed.. so I need to start somewhere..  I guess
[01:14] <gnomefreak> edistar: depending on bugs it could be very easy or the biggest pain in hte butt you have ever seen
[01:14] <gnomefreak> s/hte/the
[01:14] <edistar> gnomefreak: at least it's python
[01:15] <gnomefreak> edistar: example ive been working on firefox3.0 for 3 days now because upstream screwed some things up
[01:15] <gnomefreak> edistar: normally very simple changes
[01:16] <edistar> gnomefreak: what is firefox 3 looking like? will it bring major improvements?
[01:17] <gnomefreak> edistar: yes it shoudl when final and that is one reason its taking so long that and libcario
[01:17] <edistar> okey
[01:18] <edistar> gnomefreak: good luck ;)
[01:18] <gnomefreak> ty you too
[01:18] <edistar> gnomefreak: what is the version control system in ubuntu again?
[01:19] <gnomefreak> edistar: for new packages or just bug fixes?
[01:19] <gnomefreak> there is a wiki on it (just dont know it)
[01:20] <gnomefreak> edistar: if just bug fixes you should beable to bump the # after ubuntu example 1.1.1-0ubuntu1 would be 1.1.1-0ubuntu2 after you fix it
[01:20] <edistar> gnomefreak: okey
[01:20] <gnomefreak> edistar: you might want to hang out in #ubuntu-motu they can answer almost any question you have
[01:20] <edistar> gnomefreak: bazaar?
[01:21] <gnomefreak> i use bzr
[01:21] <gnomefreak> same thing for the most part afaik
[01:22] <edistar> gnomefreak: I'll give it a try
[01:55] <edistar> is there a xen domain image for edubuntu? modified?
[02:02] <kim0> I'd like to use something like edubuntu, except for College education (so stuff like tuxpaint is not really useful, rather C compilers & such needed)
[02:02] <kim0> is there any ready made packages ?
[02:03] <edistar> kim0: just install the packages?
[02:03] <kim0> u mena ltsp packages ?
[02:03] <edistar> or do you mean ready-bundled?
[02:04] <kim0> yeah kinda
[02:04] <edistar> kim0: there are no specific college bundles afaik :(
[02:04] <kim0> I need the remote control features and such
[02:04] <kim0> yeah ok
[02:04] <kim0> would be a nice idea though
[02:04] <kim0> :)
[03:02] <edistar> is edubuntu very active actually?
[03:13] <RichEd> edistar: it depends on the time of day ... we have many more people in UTC evenings ... work commitments
[03:17] <edistar> RichEd: okey :) I mean with programming etc..
[03:49] <andrew____> What package do I need to install on top of ubuntu server to get ltsp functionality?
[03:49] <RichEd> andrew LTSP :)
[03:50] <RichEd> let me dig out the wiki link
[03:50] <andrew____> I've seen some others, like ltsp-server-standalone
[03:52] <ogra> andrew____, https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSPQuickInstall
[03:53] <andrew____> thank ogra
[03:53] <RichEd> ogra: thanks ...
[03:54] <andrew____> If you have the time, I'm putting together a mixed thin client/ thick client network that should have roughly 45 thin clients...I'm trying to get some 2nd and 3rd opinions on server requirements...
[03:55] <andrew____> So far I'm gathering that lots of RAM is Key (~8GB) and a fast processor and network cards wouldn't hurt
[03:56] <ogra> how many thin, how many thinck ones ?
[03:56] <ogra> *thick
[03:56] <andrew____> 45 thin, 20 thick
[03:56] <andrew____> But i want to be able to scale up...
[03:56] <ogra> you dont need any ressources for the thick ones on the server ..
[03:56] <ogra> they will only need ram/cpu for booting
[03:57] <ogra> fir the thin clients a good average is to say you need 128M per client on the server
[03:57] <ogra> to run the server alond you should have 256M
[03:58] <ogra> so 256+(128*<number_of_clients> = needed ram
[03:58] <ogra> whoops lost a bracket
[03:58] <Neko> 6GB for 40 clients? that's a lot....
[03:58] <ogra> well, gnme is a big desktop
[03:58] <ogra> *gnome
[03:59] <ogra> kde needs about 150M
[03:59] <ogra> xfce will be happy with less
[03:59] <andrew____> How much does processor speed matter on the server?
[03:59] <ogra> but if you use firefox and openoffice the desktop suddenly doesnt matter anymore :)
[03:59] <Neko> doesn't the server share libraries when it's sharing to thin clients? surely it's 128MB for the first client then unique data added on top per client, not 128MB total?
[04:00] <ogra> Neko, well, its a rcommendation, you can try with less :)
[04:00] <Neko> ogra, btw I'll be bugging you about LTSP in the next weeks I just got off the phone with Malcolm and Richard
[04:00] <ogra> i like to be on the safe side with my recommendations ;)
[04:00] <Neko> not today though :|
[04:01] <ogra> andrew____, totally depends on the usage
[04:01] <Neko> just some fair warning :)
[04:01] <RichEd> hi Neko/matt ... good to see you here :)
[04:01] <Neko> hi :)_
[04:01] <RichEd> also, you may consider joining the edubuntu-devel list ... lists.ubuntu.com
[04:02] <andrew____> right. So let's say a whole class of students want to use Kig, a graphic geometry program...at the same time
[04:02] <ogra> Neko, nice, feel free to bug me :)
[04:02] <Neko> my allergies are playing me havoc and I didn't sleep at all last night (was kicking Gentoo to the ground all night) so I'll catch up with this tomorrow. Hopefully Johan will have found time to tell me exactly WHAT he did with Ubuntu.. :)
[04:03] <Neko> I don't know if he used LTSP at all, even, and he doesn't have an XGI card since he's an early adopter, so.. lots of things to think about while trying not to scratch my arms off
[04:04] <Neko> just joined edubuntu-devel anyhway
[04:05] <RichEd> ogra: edulinux meeting again ... please pop into the channel ... you don't have to participate unless called by name
[04:05] <ogra> pop
[04:09] <andrew____> Are there any recopmmended case studies where I can look at successful network hardware config to run LTSP?...I'm finding the guessing game to be pretty dicouraging from the standpoint of spending a school's budget.  I need some more certainty about hardware spec.
[04:41] <RichEd> andrew____: we've got a programme running at Canonical to certify hardware under Ubuntu / Edubuntu. The LTSP side is an area we are busy tackling.
[04:42] <RichEd> It also needs the OEMs to come to the party as well.
[04:43] <RichEd> If you give us an idea of the components you are looking for, we can possibly check for past experience. Mailing edubuntu-devel may be a good option to explore for comment.
[04:43] <RichEd> Also ask in #ltsp ... sbalneav and jammcq
[05:13] <flubber> Can anybody help me get hal running for the ubuntu hardware database.
[05:30] <jonfhancock> moquist!
[05:46] <andreas_> Hi, annyone here?
[05:47] <andreas_> I have a 10 year old son, is it best to let him have Ubuntu or Edubuntu?
[05:47] <ogra> let him try both liveCDs ?
[05:47] <ogra> so he can decide what he likes best :)
[05:48] <andreas_> But is Edubuntu best for kids, he has only used computers for word and RuneScape
[05:48] <ogra> it has a lot of educational games etc ... so yes its suited very well for him
[06:14] <tamachan> I just installed a Feisty test server, but
[06:14] <tamachan> I get TFTP open timeout error
[06:14] <tamachan> How can I fix it?
[06:15] <ogra> does the server have two network cards ?
[06:15] <tamachan> Only one
[06:15] <ogra> do you have another dhcp server in your network ?
[06:16] <tamachan> I disabled the router:s dhcp server
[06:16] <tamachan> router's
[06:16] <ogra> is the one on the server running ?
[06:16] <tamachan> How do I know?
[06:17] <ogra> open a terminal: ps ax|grep dhcp
[06:17] <ogra> shoudl return a line with /usr/sbin/dhcpd3
[06:18] <tamachan> I think it is.  I get 5148 ? Ss 0:00 /usr/sbin/dhcp3 ....
[06:18] <ogra> ok
[06:18] <tamachan> -q eth0 -pf /var/run/dhcp ...
[06:18] <ogra> yup, looks ok
[06:18] <ogra> tats an edubuntu server ?
[06:19] <ogra> with the out of the box ltsp install ?
[06:19] <tamachan> yes, edubuntu feisty fawn 7.04
[06:19] <ogra> ok
[06:19] <tamachan> yes
[06:19] <ogra> can you paste the /etc/ltsp/dhcdp.conf file and the output of the command ifconfig -a to a pastebin ? http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/ for example
[06:20] <ogra> err
[06:20] <ogra> /etc/ltsp/dhcp.conf
[06:20] <tamachan> ok wait
[06:22] <tamachan> Ok, here it is: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/28647/
[06:25] <ogra> well, ok, thats the default file
[06:26] <tamachan> I confirmed that the dhcp server is dissabled on the router
[06:26] <ogra> what about the ifconfig -a output ?
[06:28] <tamachan> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/28649/
[06:28] <tamachan> thats the ifconfig -a
[06:28] <ogra> looks fine as well
[06:29] <ogra> so what exactly do you see on your screen if you try to boot a client ?
[06:29] <tamachan> I start new client now
[06:31] <tamachan> I see CLIENT MAC ADDR: ... GUID:... CLIENT IP: 192.168.0.250 MASK 255.255.255.0 DHCP IP: 192.168.0.254 GATEWAY IP: 192.168.0.1
[06:31] <tamachan> PXE-E32; TFTP Open timeout
[06:31] <ogra> hmm
[06:31] <tamachan> TFTP....
[06:32] <ogra> do you have a /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386 dir ?
[06:32] <ogra> and is a kernel in there (vmlinuz)
[06:32] <tamachan> let me check
[06:33] <tamachan> Yes, I have ..../i386 dir
[06:34] <tamachan> there is vmlinuz -> vmlinuz-2.6.20-15-I386
[06:34] <tamachan>  vmlinuz -> vmlinuz-2.6.20-15-386
[06:36] <ogra> ok
[06:36] <ogra> so the file it wants to download exists
[06:36] <tamachan> I have an idea.  I'll reboot.  I think machine might have two different kernels.  Maybe I chose wrong one.
[06:37] <tamachan> I will be back soon, thanks for help
[06:38] <tamachan> Is it supposed to be kernel 2.6.20-15-386? or 2.6.20-16-386?
[06:39] <ogra> the default one is -15 but if you had network during install -16 might be the security update
[06:40] <tamachan> I think I chose -16.  Would that be problem?
[06:40] <ogra> no
[06:40] <tamachan> ok
[06:40] <ogra> the tftp server shouldnt care
[06:40] <tamachan> ok
[06:40] <ogra> can you do: grep tftp /etc/inetd.conf
[06:40] <tamachan> ok wait
[06:40] <ogra> and paste the output here
[06:40] <ogra> (should be only one line)
[06:41] <tamachan> tftp           dgram   udp     wait    root  /usr/sbin/in.tftpd /usr/sbin/in.tftpd -s /var/lib/tftpboot
[06:41] <ogra> hmm, thats fine as well
[06:42] <ogra> all bits and pieces are in place, i wonder why it doesnt work
[06:42] <ogra> chek if inetd runs: ps ax|grep inetd
[06:42] <tamachan> me too
[06:42] <ogra> should return /usr/sbin/inetd
[06:43] <tamachan> yes it does
[06:44] <ogra> chek if you get any messages and errors in your daemon logfile run: tail -f /var/log/daemon.log
[06:44] <ogra> then boot a client and watch the messages in the terminal you run that command in
[06:44] <ogra> (you can exit the tail command with ctrl-c)
[06:45] <tamachan> ok i am doing now
[06:48] <tamachan> No errors after client reboot and TFTP open timeout: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/28658/
[06:48] <ogra> thats extremly strange
[06:48] <ogra> especially since you get proper dhcp handling it seems
[06:49] <tamachan> Maybe I should reinstall? from scratch?
[06:49] <ogra> do you have a managed switch or some other hardware that could cause packets not being transmitted between the two ?
[06:50] <tamachan> this is a test server running on same switch as client
[06:50] <ogra> right, but is this a managed switch ?
[06:50] <tamachan> switch is connected to router and router to internet
[06:51] <tamachan> I don't think so
[06:51] <ogra> hmm
[06:51] <tamachan> it is a simple 8 port logitec switch
[06:51] <ogra> that shouldnt have any effect ...
[06:57] <tamachan> ogra, thank you for help
[06:58] <tamachan> what do you think I should do? Reinstall?
[07:43] <LaserJock> ogra: edubuntu-docs made it
[09:06] <Baby> i have a 1st draft of the debtag categories to rate games for children, anyone out there who might be interested and can give some feedback and comments on them?
[11:11] <andrew____> In the market for thin clients to run LTSP...does it matter what embedded OS they ship with (for LTSP purposes)?