[12:25] <geser> StevenK: about gnome-chemistry-utils and gchempaint (rdepends of libgoffice-0-3 (NBS)): I'll mail the Debian maintainers if updated packages are planned in the near future
[12:25] <azeem> they are
[12:27] <azeem> geser: well, I think Debian is waiting for libgoffice-0-3
[12:30] <LaserJock> well, 0.3 is the unstable version
[12:30] <LaserJock> hopefully 0.4 will be in unstable soon
[12:32] <azeem> yeah, ok
[12:32] <azeem> geser: what's the problem with g-c-u in Ubuntu anyway?
[12:35] <LaserJock> geser: it's old and we have goffice 0.4
[12:35] <LaserJock> g-c-u 0.8 need goffice 0.4
[12:36] <azeem> did 0.4 get released as a stable version upstream?
[12:36] <LaserJock> yes
[12:37] <azeem> ok
[12:40] <LaserJock> really Ubuntu should lead the packaging for g-c-u
[12:40] <LaserJock> because we tend to take goffice from Debian experimental
[12:42] <azeem> I think it also needs a newer openbabel
[12:42] <LaserJock> yes
[12:42] <LaserJock> 2.1
[12:44] <azeem> one option would be to upload it to exprerimental as soon as 2.1 is released
[12:44] <LaserJock> it's odd to me that goffice has been in experimental for over a year
[12:44] <LaserJock> there aren't really a lot of packages that depend on it
[12:45] <azeem> because it was an unstable release series I guess
[12:46] <LaserJock> I suppose
[12:46] <azeem> goffice (0.4.0-1) experimental; urgency=low
[12:46] <LaserJock> but 0.4 has been out for about 2 months now
[12:46] <azeem> * New upstream development release.
[12:46] <azeem> that's odd, yes
[12:46] <azeem> I'm gonna ask jbrefort about it when I see him next
[12:47] <LaserJock> azeem: I talk to him most every day
[12:48] <azeem> heh
[12:48] <LaserJock> hmm, the Debian maintainer maintains 64 packages it seems
[12:48] <LaserJock> I wonder if he just doesn't have time to work on goffice
[03:04] <LaserJock> StevenK: so what are you doing now with libcurl?
[03:07] <StevenK> LaserJock: Plotting flaming death for the Debian release team and the Debian maintainer.
[03:08] <LaserJock> sweet
[03:08] <LaserJock> so did you end up reverting your transition?
[03:09] <StevenK> The transitional libcurl4 packages got killed again, and I've just finished the second lot of sixty rebuilds
[03:09] <LaserJock> so we are going to go to libcurl4 ?
[03:09] <StevenK> Nope, we are heading back to libcurl3
[03:10] <LaserJock> so we tried to go to libcurl4 but it didn't work so well so we're going back to libcurl3?
[03:10] <ajmitch> SONAME screwups
[03:10] <StevenK> Debian went to libcurl4, found a complete path of pain, and went back to libcurl3.
[03:10] <LaserJock> there's a forum thread so I thought I'd give a response if I figure out what's going on
[03:11] <LaserJock> StevenK: unless you want to write it? ;-)
[03:11] <StevenK> We went to libcurl4, did a bunch of rebuilds, and then pitti and I decided the bitter pill needed to swallowed at some point, so we first tried to provide libcurl4 packages, which didn't work, and so went back to libcurl3 and a complete bunch of rebuilds.
[03:12] <StevenK> LaserJock: I'm not eloquent enough. :-)
[03:12] <LaserJock> and I am?
[03:12] <LaserJock> somebody might as well do it
[03:13] <StevenK> LaserJock: You're probably more eloquent than I am. :-)
[03:13] <ajmitch> of course, he's a doc writer
[03:15] <StevenK> Good point.
[03:15] <LaserJock> ajmitch: and that means what exactly? :-)
[03:15] <LaserJock> I'm dumb enough to get suckered into writing
[03:17] <LaserJock> StevenK: is that because libcurl4 was supposed to be compatible with libcurl3?
[03:20] <StevenK> LaserJock: Supposed to be
[03:24] <StevenK> LaserJock: The problem is because Debian includes a patch that versions the symbols, so they aren't really compatible ...
[03:24] <LaserJock> umm ... darn
[03:26] <StevenK> LaserJock: As you can tell, it's a little complicated anyway.
[03:27] <LaserJock> mhm
[03:27] <LaserJock> well I just made a post
[03:28] <LaserJock> as the thread started 1hr ago and already has like 5-6 posts
[03:30] <StevenK> LaserJock: Link me?
[03:30] <LaserJock> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=492502
[03:31] <StevenK> Thanks
[03:34] <LaserJock> please feel free to correct/add to my post
[03:34] <StevenK> Hrm. I might have to duke it out with amarok, too.
[03:34] <StevenK> That would require signing up to the forums. :-)
[03:35] <LaserJock> really? I thought you had an account there
[03:36] <StevenK> If I do, it's news to me.
[03:36] <LaserJock> maybe it was ScottK 
[04:47] <ScottK> What was maybe me?
[04:48] <ScottK> Now that I've read the scrollback.
[04:52] <LaserJock> sorry, my bad
[04:53] <LaserJock> wahoo, first "real" upload to Main
[04:59] <shirish> StevenK: are you there buddy?
[05:01] <shirish> StevenK: ok just so you know whenever u come back openoffice also needs rebuilding for the libcurl thing
[05:29] <LaserJock> morning Hobbsee 
[05:29] <LaserJock> or afternoon
[05:29] <LaserJock> or whatever it is there
[05:31] <Hobbsee> hey LaserJock!
[05:31] <Hobbsee> meh.  i just got up, so it's morning
[05:33] <ajmitch> a nice definition of morning
[05:33] <Hobbsee> yep
[05:33] <ajmitch> very flexible
[05:33] <LaserJock> hmm, it seems like app-install-data got turned into app-install-data-ubuntu
[05:34] <Hobbsee> it's morning in europe
[05:35] <LaserJock> very early morning
[05:40] <LaserJock> Hobbsee: how's life?
[05:40] <Hobbsee> LaserJock: life?  it's going OK.  i'm waiting, whcih is sucking a bit :)
[05:42] <ajmitch> waiting for exam results?
[05:42] <Hobbsee> that too
[06:17] <fabbione> morning
[06:17] <Hobbsee> hiya mpt, fabbione 
[06:17] <fabbione> StevenK: ping?
[06:17] <StevenK> fabbione: Pong
[06:18] <fabbione> StevenK: i just noticed the big rebuild of death for libcurl. Are you going to take care of main too? at least git-core needs love
[06:18] <fabbione> StevenK: or do you need people to sponsor to main?
[06:18] <Hobbsee> fabbione: he's a core dev
[06:18] <fabbione> ok
[06:18] <StevenK> Thanks for noticing. :-P
[06:19] <fabbione> Hobbsee: sorry i can't remember everybody :)
[06:19] <StevenK> fabbione: git-core should be fixed.
[06:19] <fabbione> StevenK: ok
[06:19] <Hobbsee> fabbione: you need a better memory.
[06:19] <fabbione> Hobbsee: i need to be 10 years younger :)
[06:19] <StevenK> Heh
[06:20] <mpt> hi Hobbsee 
[06:20] <Hobbsee> fabbione: good luck finding that time machine.
[06:44] <fabbione> hmm StevenK I guess we also need an OOo rebuild...
[06:45] <StevenK> fabbione: Correct. But pitti told me not to touch it, which I plan on following to the letter. :-)
[06:45] <fabbione> ehehhe
[06:45] <ajmitch> let calc handle it?
[06:45] <StevenK> Suits me.
[06:46] <fabbione> all good :)
[06:56] <StevenK> fabbione: Are you a big bad buildd person?
[06:57] <fabbione> StevenK: no sorry, i have no access to the buildd
[06:57] <StevenK> fabbione: It's fine, I can wait.
[08:24] <Hobbsee> morning pitti!
[08:25] <StevenK> pitti: I missed a bunch of rebuilds - 21, which I've done.
[08:25] <StevenK> pitti: The total is 62, with 3 FTBFS on all archs, and 3 FTBFS on ia64 only.
[08:26] <StevenK> pitti: The 3 FTBFS on all archives can be fixed with a give-back. The three are bibletime, cduce and gnomesword.
[08:26] <StevenK> s/archives/archs/
[08:27] <pitti> Good morning
[08:28] <pitti> StevenK: I'll give them back, thank you!
[08:28] <StevenK> pitti: Thank you. :-)
[08:34] <pitti> hi Hobbsee!
[08:38] <StevenK> pitti: I think that this publisher run should polish off the rest of them. Now I can look at other stuff, like apache 1
[08:47] <pitti> StevenK: you are tireless, aren't you? :) *MUST* *CLEAN* *ARCHIVE*
[08:48] <Hobbsee> pitti: s/tireless/insane/ i suspect
[08:48] <StevenK> Both?
[08:48] <Hobbsee> pitti: you should make him an archive admin next, so he can cue his own stuff :P
[08:48] <StevenK> pitti: Hey, if it helps you and Hobbsee in your jobs, and cuts down on the number of bugs, I'm all for it.
[08:48] <Hobbsee> StevenK: you could help me in my job by going to work for me tonight.
[08:49] <StevenK> Hah
[08:49] <LaserJock> umm, stupid bash question, can I have a variable in a variable name?
[08:49] <StevenK> I think so.
[08:50] <Treenaks> ${$WHATVER} ?
[08:50] <Treenaks> no.. that doesn't work
[08:50] <StevenK> Doesn't for me, either.
[08:50] <StevenK> LaserJock: You can in Perl...
[08:50] <Treenaks> eval?
[08:51] <StevenK> That works
[08:51] <StevenK> foo="blah" ; eval lala${foo}="foo" ; echo $lalablah
[08:52] <minghua> You can, I just forgot the grammar.
[08:55] <LaserJock> blah
[08:55] <LaserJock> I should just do this in python
[08:56] <minghua> $ A=B; B=foo; echo ${!A}
[08:56] <minghua> foo
[08:57] <StevenK> That smells like a bash-ism
[08:58] <StevenK> It is, too
[08:58] <minghua> Yes, definitely bashism.
[08:58] <mikmorg> Is there any way to do something like: dpkg --install --recursive --pending pool/*.deb ?
[08:59] <mikmorg> Ie. I want to install given a path, only the files marked for installation
[09:28] <dholbach> good morning
[09:31] <dholbach> hey pitti
[09:31] <pitti> hey dholbach 
[09:40] <pygi> good morning folks
[09:41] <mdke> morning all
[09:46] <pygi> hey mdke 
[09:48] <pitti> StevenK: so, the give-backs mostly worked, except for some ia64 stuff
[09:48] <pitti> StevenK: looking forward to this noon's NBS output :)
[09:57] <Tonio_> pitti: there is a little problem with libcurl-gnutls, it has been reverted, but I think version 0ubuntu3 should be removed (the deb files) from the repos, since libcurl4-gnutls is still there, so wants to be installed, and conflicts with latest version
[09:58] <Tonio_> pitti: looks like the "real" package is prior to the virtual one and thus that blocks the all openoffice installation..... a bit annoying :)
[10:00] <pitti> Tonio_: ah, right; I just asked doko_ about a new OO.o, but we should wait for Chris
[10:00] <Tonio_> oki
[10:01] <dholbach> hey seb128
[10:01] <Tonio_> pitti: to be honnest I don't know if the problem is due to libgnutls or openoffice.... looks like OOo should be rebuild with libcurl3-gnutls, but I may be wrong...
[10:01] <seb128> hi dholbach
[10:01] <Tonio_> dholbach: we'll be able to make a point on kdebluetooth in about 3 weeks, time for upstream to heavilly fix bugs and us to prepare a nice package
[10:01] <Tonio_> hey seb128
[10:01] <seb128> hi Tonio_
[10:02] <dholbach> Tonio_: rock and roll - that's good news
[10:02] <siretart> asac: do you use a VCS for network-manager?
[10:04] <Fujitsu> Tonio_: OOo needs to be rebuilt; all other packages depending on libcurl4{,-gnutls} except apt have been already.
[10:04] <pitti> Tonio_: it should, right, and the 4 stuff needs to be removed
[10:04] <pitti> siretart: yes
[10:05] <pitti> siretart: https://code.launchpad.net/network-manager
[10:05] <siretart> ah, excellent
[10:05] <siretart> thanks
[10:27] <pitti> yay, apport-failed-retrace tags work now, as well as removing the CoreDump.gz for successful retraces
[10:30] <YokoZar> Is there an Ubuntu.com jabber server?
[10:32] <Fujitsu> YokoZar: I don't believe so, but it is particularly not suitable for this channel.
[10:32] <YokoZar> Fujitsu: I meant for developers and people with @ubuntu.com email addresses
[10:33] <pitti> shawarma: ah, langpack bootstrap on PPA is finally done; the buildd is unDoSed again now :)
[10:33] <Fujitsu> pitti: That took a while.
[10:33] <pitti> erk, yeah
[10:33] <pitti> in the old days I built the entire batch of 300 packages in 10 minutes or so
[10:33] <Fujitsu> But now we have some reasonable translations
[10:33] <Fujitsu> *?
[10:34] <pitti> Fujitsu: the packages itself didn't change a lot, but with PPA I don't need to have nasty hacks for maintaining an archive for myself and care about domination and multiple releases and such
[10:34] <pitti> Fujitsu: and it's easier to just sync/copy the packages from the PPA to archive.u.c.
[10:35] <Fujitsu> pitti: Is PPA working OK?
[10:35] <shawarma> pitti: Yes, I used it last night, too. It's alright, I just thought it was going to be like that every day. I'm calmer now. :)
[10:35] <mdz> morning all
[10:36] <Fujitsu> Hi mdz.
[10:37] <pitti> Fujitsu: apart from buildd shortage, yes
[10:37] <pitti> shawarma: no, I only build new daily packages when there are actually some changes; those are usually 10 languages or so
[10:38] <Fujitsu> Still just the two?
[10:38] <Fujitsu> Oh, and one won't have been doing anything, because it's amd64?
[10:38] <pitti> shawarma: I enable the cronjobs on rookery again now, let's see whether it's sustainable
[10:38] <pitti> Fujitsu: right
[10:39] <pitti> Fujitsu: is it useful for you? cool
[10:42] <mikmorg> Could anyone help me out - I can't remember the command that tricks 'uname -r'
[10:43] <pitti> mikmorg: sounds like an #ubuntu question; but 'tricks'?
[10:43] <mikmorg> pitti: yea, sorry.. actually probably more like ##linux.. but there is a standard way to make it return a false value if I remember right.
[10:49] <pitti> seb128: ah, nice: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=apport-failed-retrace
[10:49] <pitti> seb128: CoreDump.gz removal for successful retraces works now, too
[10:49] <seb128> pitti: rock on!
[10:50] <seb128> pitti: good job ;)
[10:51] <cjwatson> mikmorg: you could do it with an LD_PRELOAD wrapper for uname(2); a standard way doesn't spring to mind
[10:52] <seb128> pitti: the compiz one is "CoreDump" is not a core dump: File format not recognized"
[10:53] <seb128> pitti: I'm wondering where the coredump is screwed, the non debug backtrace looks ok, so it means it was working on the user machine
[10:54] <Fujitsu> pitti: Why am I seeing a lot of bugs tagged apport-crash that are several days old?
[10:55] <pitti> seb128: I have a lot of cases where /lib/tls/i686/cmov/lib*-2.6.so cannot be identified
[10:55] <pitti> seb128: that might account for a good deal
[10:55] <pitti> Fujitsu: because that tag is a permanent one; it denotes the ProblemType: (crash, package, kernel, etc.)
[10:56] <Fujitsu> pitti: Ahh, but they were also not retraced.
[10:56] <pitti> seb128: also, some parsing bugs: "its package compiz-fusion-plugins-main,universe is not available" or "but its package libs is not available" :)
[10:56] <pitti> Fujitsu: please give me the numbers, I'll look in the logs
[10:56] <Fujitsu> pitti: I don't know any offhand, but I'll find some in a sec.
[10:58] <Fujitsu> Bug #123870
[10:58] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 123870 in listen "[gutsy]  listen.py crashed on exit (SIGSEGV in PyThreadState_New())" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/123870
[10:58] <Fujitsu> pitti: ^^
[11:04] <pitti> Fujitsu: ah, broken core dump: struct.error: unpack requires a string argument of length 4
[11:04] <siretart> is anyone using mwolson's emacs22 packages here yet?
[11:05] <seb128> siretart: "mwolson"?
[11:05] <siretart> pitti: would emacs22 need a MIR?
[11:05] <pitti> Fujitsu: since it's the gzip wrapping that is damaged, and not just the compressed core dump itself, I suspect that something went wrong during upload or so
[11:05] <siretart> seb128: Michael Olson <mwolson@gnu.org>, discussed the last days on ubuntu-motu@
[11:05] <pitti> siretart: no, I don't need one; however, I *do* want only one emacs in the archive :)
[11:06] <siretart> pitti: its rather a new upstream (in a new source package)
[11:06] <pitti> siretart: well, s/archive/main/ at least
[11:06] <siretart> I see
[11:06] <Fujitsu> pitti: I guess that would do it.
[11:07] <pitti> Fujitsu: I updated the bug and removed the core dump attachment
[11:07] <Fujitsu> pitti: So I aw.
[11:07] <Fujitsu> *saw
[11:07] <dholbach> can somebody give back gnome-terminal on amd64 and sparc?
[11:08] <pitti> dholbach: doing
[11:08] <dholbach> thanks pitti
[11:09] <Nafallo> running update-initramfs multiple times in one run is going to be fixed in gutsy, right? :-)
[11:10] <pitti> sabdfl: good morning Mark
[11:10] <Nafallo> ...and morning * :-)
[11:15] <cjwatson> Nafallo: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/dpkg-triggers
[11:15] <cjwatson> targeted, but as ever not certain
[11:16] <Nafallo> cjwatson: thanks. I'll subscribe if I'm not already :-)
[11:17] <crimsun> is cprov the one to ask about alsa-driver source uploads silently going the way of /dev/null, possibly due to a rather extensive LP: #foo entries?
[11:18] <crimsun> (on the order of 25 bugs)
[11:21] <cjwatson> crimsun: I looked into it briefly, and it's certainly well beyond a humble archive admin to sort out
[11:21] <cjwatson> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/8312458/fSl6HTFlQliJLUZlM1vUKk7DaiY.txt
[11:21] <pitti> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/8312459/6qiBYhYEVQ0X5VDjVgz0H9EEer9.txt, too
[11:22] <pitti> crimsun: something between carlos (Rosetta import) and cprov, I think
[11:22] <crimsun> ok, thanks.
[11:24] <carlos> pitti: hmm, I don't think it's related with me
[11:25] <pitti> carlos: right, entirely a permission problem
[11:25] <pitti> it just seems to happen during translation tarball import
[11:26] <carlos> pitti: hmm, that backtrace is about sending the notification email
[11:27] <carlos> pitti: where do you see it related with translation uploads?
[11:28] <pitti> SELECT pluralforms, code, uuid, direction, visible, pluralexpression, nativename, englishname FROM Language ...
[11:29] <pitti> carlos: but that's just where it dies with a permission error on anguage
[11:29] <pitti> language
[11:29] <carlos> that doesn't mean it's a translation upload problem
[11:29] <carlos> it looks more related with answers tracker
[11:30] <carlos> it also uses language table
[11:30] <carlos> Translations is not the only user for that information anymore
[11:30] <Sp4rKy> dholbach: around ?
[11:30] <Sp4rKy> dholbach: you commented bug #124145
[11:30] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 124145 in libtunepimp "Please merge libtunepimp (main) from Debian unstable (main) " [Undecided,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/124145
[11:31] <Sp4rKy> the depends was remove in the last debian update
[11:31] <ogra> woah ...
[11:31] <ogra> did anyone here ever try to run gnome in 8bit graphics mode ? 
[11:31] <Sp4rKy> dholbach: (appears in libtunepimp_0.5.3-4.patch )
[11:31] <seb128> ogra: no, does it crash?
[11:31] <ogra> seb128, yeh, like mad
[11:32] <Sp4rKy> dholbach: anyway, no doc about this change, so i'm not sure it has to be added ...
[11:32] <ogra> panel restarts in an endless loop
[11:32] <seb128> ogra: there is a known cairo bug
[11:32] <ogra> ah
[11:32] <seb128> looks like it's not trivial to fix
[11:32] <ogra> well, not that i'd expect any users to run gnome in 8bit
[11:32] <ogra> :)
[11:32] <seb128> ogra: https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4945
[11:33] <ubotu> Freedesktop bug 4945 in general "Cairo doesn't support 8-bit pseudocolor visuals" [Critical,New]  
[11:33] <coNP> actually why not (esp. with vnc)?
[11:34] <seb128> coNP: let's say it's not a standard usecase
[11:34] <ogra> wow, seems there are some concerned actualy
[11:34] <mjr> vnc can color-convert from higher bpps to 8bpp for transit
[11:34] <mjr> anyway, it's not so long that my SO used a 8bpp SparcStation as an X term...
[11:42] <dholbach> Sp4rKy: it was added in 0.5.3-3 - "fix depdendencies to be binNMU safe"
[11:45] <Sp4rKy> yep
[11:45] <Sp4rKy> but i don't know why it was removed 
[11:45] <dholbach> it's removed in your debdiff
[11:45] <Sp4rKy> yes
[11:45] <Sp4rKy> and it was removed in the debian update
[11:45] <dholbach> yeah, you didn't merge it into your patch
[11:46] <Sp4rKy> i didn't merge it because it was explicitly removed in the debian update
[11:47] <Sp4rKy> http://paste.dunnewind.net/8
[11:47] <dholbach> oh ok
[11:47] <Sp4rKy> line 17/18
[11:47] <dholbach> now I see it too
[11:48] <Sp4rKy> :)
[11:48] <dholbach> excusez-moi :)
[11:48] <Sp4rKy> ^^
[11:48] <Sp4rKy> np
[11:48] <Sp4rKy> so i don't need to add it ?
[11:48] <dholbach> no, let me review it again
[11:48] <dholbach> if it's good, I'll upload it
[11:48] <Sp4rKy> ok
[11:48] <Sp4rKy> np
[12:10] <pitti> keescook: btw, it seems I can remove the ptrace hack from apport's _read_maps() again? IIRC you said that ptracing is not necessary any more?
[12:13] <keescook> pitti: yes, that's correct.
[01:59] <StevenK> Oh, damn.
[02:00] <persia> StevenK: There's a sync that might help (I've just been drafting the bug)
[02:01] <StevenK> persia: For what?
[02:01] <persia> StevenK: nexuiz / curl
[02:02] <StevenK> Cool. I'll ignore uploading it, and pitti/someone else can sync it.
[02:02] <pitti> StevenK: tell me once you confirmed it
[02:02] <persia> StevenK: No promises that Debian was perfect - testing is on my immediate TODO :)
[02:03] <Fujitsu> StevenK: What went wrong with it?
[02:05] <StevenK> Fujitsu: I fixed nexuiz, and not nexuiz-server.
[02:06] <Fujitsu> Ah.
[02:06] <StevenK> So now the sync can.
[02:24] <pitti> crimsun: still here?
[02:25] <pitti> crimsun: cprov evaluated the error; you can either unlink the answer tracker item from the bug report and upload again, or wait a bit longer (should still happen today) for the real fix
[02:27] <Mithrandir> is it possible to remove an offer of mentorship from another person?
[02:29] <persia> Well.  That was exciting.  nexuiz 2.3-2 compiled against updated libcurl, installed successfully, and overheated my graphics card during testing.
[02:29] <persia> pitti: Do you want a sync bug for nexuiz, or is here good enough?
[02:29] <pitti> persia: are you a MOTU?
[02:30] <persia> pitti: Yes.
[02:30] <persia> pitti: https://launchpad.net/~persia/+participation
[02:30] <pitti> persia: good enough for me then
[02:30] <persia> pitti: Thanks.
[02:30] <Mithrandir> we usually want bugs so we have a trail
[02:31] <pitti> persia: just use requestsync; I'll get to it later then
[02:31] <persia> pitti: OK.  Thanks.
[02:35] <StevenK> pitti: I wish checkrdepends could cope with multiple packages at once. I'd rather not have it download every Packages.gz file for gutsy it can lay its hands on 24 times.
[02:36] <pitti> StevenK: true :) at some point this needs a more elaborate rewrite, also to get better output formatting
[02:36] <pitti> like sorting all the arches to one line and such
[02:40] <Mithrandir> pitti: it's called a web proxy, isn't it?
[02:40] <Mithrandir> s/pitti/SK/
[02:40] <StevenK> I haven't trusted squid in quite some time.
[02:41] <persia> StevenK: oops worked fairly well last time I was playing with proxies...
[02:42] <Mithrandir> iz Hobbsee
[02:42] <Hobbsee> Mithrandir: it iz!  R U Scared YET???
[02:43] <Mithrandir> Hobbsee: should I be? ;-)
[02:44] <Hobbsee> oh dear.  Splatted Mithrandir.
[02:44] <Mithrandir> Hobbsee: good thing I just moved out of the way then.
[02:44] <Hobbsee> Mithrandir: it fell where you moved.  you're out of luck.
[02:44] <Hobbsee> it was big enough that it'd fall on you wherever you moved to.
[03:04] <StevenK> pitti: Should I file bugs about Apache modules that Build-Depend on apache-dev, but not apache2-* and have no rdepends, or just tell you here?
[03:12] <mdz> something is enabling laptop mode on my laptop in gutsy, when I switch to battery power
[03:12] <mdz> causing bug 12483 to rear its ugly head again
[03:12] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 12483 in linux-source-2.6.15 "laptop-mode/IDE-APM hang on various laptops" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/12483
[03:12] <Hobbsee> damn these people with nicks the same length, and the same colour on my client.
[03:12] <mdz> amitk: are you familiar with that bug?
[03:13] <mdz> it would save a lot of headache and learning which new power management component is responsible, if laptop mode just worked
[03:13] <amitk> mdz: not yet. I can have a look tomorrow at the earliest
[03:14] <mdz> amitk: do you happen to know which package is responsible for activating laptop-mode?  this used to be done by acpi-support, but no longer
[03:15] <amitk> mdz: no I don't
[03:15] <kylem> mdz, laptop-mode-tools: /etc/init.d/laptop-mode
[03:15] <kylem> /etc/init.d/laptop-mode stop
[03:16] <mdz> kylem: thanks
[03:16] <mdz> does laptop mode actually work properly on some laptops?
[03:16] <kylem> yeah. it works fine on mine.
[03:17] <pygi> hey folks
[03:17] <Hobbsee> hiya pygi.  how's burning* going?
[03:17] <pygi> Hobbsee, well, good, but I am more worried about my exams right now ^_^
[03:18] <Hobbsee> pygi: when do they finish?
[03:18] <pygi> Hobbsee, I had last written one yesterday ... if I pass, then it's oral one in the Monday, and that's it for now
[03:18] <pygi> but it still leaves me with too much exams ... I was playing too much :p
[03:18] <Hobbsee> pygi: heh
[03:19] <Hobbsee> pygi: exams suck.  so does waiting for results.  but that sucks less than the exams :P
[03:19] <pygi> Hobbsee, hehe :)
[03:19] <Hobbsee> pygi: sounds cool :)
[03:19] <Hobbsee> pygi: oral for what?  language or something?
[03:19] <pygi> Hobbsee, no, that exam is "Organization"
[03:20] <pygi> well, from that class
[03:20] <Hobbsee> pygi: erk
[03:20] <pygi> Hobbsee, for language exams I was forbidden to attend class one month and a half before end of it, and got A's :p
[03:20] <pygi> so no exams for me there ^_^
[03:20] <Hobbsee> pygi: a class on organization.  that's...interesting...seeing as anyhting you learned in that class would probably be negated by the time you spent being in that class
[03:20] <Hobbsee> haha
[03:21] <pygi> Hobbsee, just you laugh ^_^
[03:22] <Hobbsee> pygi: so do i.  german will be useful if/when i move there.
[03:22] <Hobbsee> or somewhere german-speaking.
[03:22] <pygi> Hobbsee, ehm, you're moving?
[03:22] <pitti> StevenK: removal bugs would be nice, for record keeping
[03:23] <Hobbsee> pygi: sometime, yeah.  after uni, i expect
[03:23] <pygi> Hobbsee, o well :)
[03:23] <Hobbsee> pygi: australia's so far away from everythin gelse, etc
[03:24] <pygi> Hobbsee, ah
[03:24] <pygi> Hobbsee, a place is as far from everything else as you make it
[03:24] <Hobbsee> heh
[03:25] <pygi> Hobbsee, but I do understand you
[03:27] <ijuz__> Hobbsee: i would not move to europe anymore, because it sucks
[03:27] <Hobbsee> ijuz__: why?
[03:30] <ijuz__> Hobbsee: politics are turning the EU into a state that would make Hitler and Mielke happy, i'm all negative
[03:30] <Mithrandir> ijuz__: Europe != EU.
[03:31] <ijuz__> well, .no and .ch is still there, but not much else
[03:31] <pygi> ijuz__, Croatia is in Europe, and that's != EU as well :)
[03:31] <Hobbsee> meh, politics
[03:34] <thom> we're way, way off topic :-)
[03:35] <pygi> thom, it's all fine tho ^_^
[03:36] <ijuz__> yes, well, not really soon, the EU will have laws that will bring you in prison when you write free software  >:->
[03:37] <Hobbsee> thom: it's no war.
[03:37] <Hobbsee> :P
[03:43] <wasabi> somebody needs to clearly define a difference between files in ~ which shoudl be shared between machines and ones that shouldn't.
[03:51] <maswan> wasabi: "files in ~ should be shared between machines.", seems resonable, no?
[03:52] <wasabi> Seems reasonable to me... but it implicitly implies files in ~ should be SHAREABLE between machines.
[03:52] <wasabi> Which is not the case all the time.
[03:53] <Hobbsee> hi calc 
[03:53] <pitti> hi calc
[03:53] <pitti> calc: do you plan a new OO.o upload soon? it's currently uninstallable due to the libcurl mess (it needs to be rebuilt against libcurl3)
[03:54] <maswan> Yes, but this should be considered a bug, IMHO. Sharing the entire ~ is rather common if you have more than a couple of computers. Say at a workplace/university/similar.
[03:54] <wasabi> Wonder how Beagle should handle that.
[03:54] <wasabi> Since it's indexes are in ~
[03:54] <calc> pitti: ah yea i will try to get that done asap
[03:55] <calc> pitti: i can't run gutsy on my boxes due to several issues but i can build it in a chroot
[03:55] <maswan> wasabi: name indexes after fqdn?
[03:55] <calc> pitti: i just updated gutsy last night on my desktop and now it causes my machine to oops in the middle of apt-get dist-upgrade
[03:55] <mynameisdeleted> winehq.org's wine crashes on my latest gutsy upgrade, and so does crossover office
[03:55] <StevenK> pitti: Oh, can you ask mvo about an apt upload. I'm happy to do a rebuild update for it if he is.
[03:55] <mynameisdeleted> both with the same error
[03:55] <pitti> calc: we recently promoted lp-solve and usfparse to main, so that OO.o can use those external build deps instead of using the internal copies
[03:56] <calc> pitti: and either wpa or ifupdown is broken on my laptop
[03:56] <mynameisdeleted> and both in ld-linux
[03:56] <pitti> calc: crash> oh, oops
[03:56] <wasabi> maswan, I think my personal preference would be for indexes to not be in ~.
[03:56] <Hobbsee> mynameisdeleted: please see the /topic
[03:56] <wasabi> maswan, We're talking about huge files, which don't have much performance when network mounted.
[03:56] <pitti> StevenK: yep, he's on vac; a mere rebuild won't hurt, though
[03:56] <maswan> wasabi: that would be the sensible solution, yes
[03:56] <StevenK> pitti: Shall I do it, then?
[03:56] <calc> pitti: not sure what causes it but it does it every time i run the command
[03:56] <Hobbsee> StevenK: i have an apt udpate anyway...
[03:56] <wasabi> But then where should they go?
[03:56] <Hobbsee> but i want to test it out first :)
[03:56] <cjwatson> wasabi: I agree with maswan, I think non-shareable files in ~ are a bug
[03:56] <pitti> StevenK: even if we should lose the changelog due to version control not seeing your upload, it doesn't matter much
[03:57] <persia> wasabi: How about ~ indicies in ~, and machine indices in /usr/lib/beagle (/usr/lib to force local machine for shred /usr/share)
[03:57] <pitti> calc: with the feisty kernel, too?
[03:57] <cjwatson> wasabi: /var/lib/beagle/$USER?
[03:57] <persia> s/shred/shared/
[03:57] <cjwatson> or /var/spool or /var/cache or whatever
[03:57] <cjwatson> definitely not /usr
[03:57] <wasabi> All of those sound fine.
[03:57] <StevenK> pitti: Right, I'll do it when I get up so I can keep an eye on it.
[03:57] <wasabi> Now convince the beagle guys. ;
[03:57] <calc> pitti: haven't attempted using the feisty kernel on my desktop since it was working fine with the same kernel before doing the update last night
[03:57] <cjwatson> wasabi: surely changing paths is standard distro integration work
[03:57] <pitti> calc: ah, it was just a daily update, not one from Feisty? hmm
[03:57] <calc> pitti: i am going to try blasting the box and reloading feisty on it later today and make sure it is ok
[03:58] <wasabi> Maybe.
[03:58] <calc> pitti: yea a daily gutsy update caused the oops afaict
[03:58] <maswan> cjwatson: splitting the indexing for ~ and rest of system might be an upstreams request though
[03:58] <calc> pitti: of course blasting a production machine takes a while :\
[03:58] <pitti> calc: you can check /var/log/dpkg.log to see which packages have been upgraded
[03:58] <pitti> calc: and revert some which might be the culprit
[03:58] <calc> pitti: it was quite a few i hadn't updated in a week or two
[03:58] <pitti> calc: oh, erk; maybe install tribe-2 again instead of gutsy
[03:59] <pitti> Hobbsee: topic diff?
[03:59] <Hobbsee> pitti: adding gutsy support location
[03:59] <coNP> pitti: #ubuntu+1 
[03:59] <calc> pitti: if it works, i tried tribe-2 installer on my laptop last night and it couldn't get past partman
[03:59] <calc> pitti: kept hanging up trying to set the partitions
[03:59] <pitti> calc: ah, manual parittioner?
[04:00] <calc> pitti: i partitioned it already was just using partman during the install process to mark which was swap and / and it hung during that
[04:00] <ScottK> pitti: Thanks for the notify-python sync.  I've been working my way through the packages owned by Debian Python Modules Team to see what I can do to make them syncable and notify-python was next on my list.
[04:01] <pitti> ScottK: I just filed a bug, I didn't sync it yet
[04:01] <cjwatson> calc: do you think you could preserve it in a state where that happens so that we can dissect it at the sprint?
[04:01] <cjwatson> calc: part of the problem is that neither evand nor I can reproduce it locally
[04:01] <shirish> pitti: could you look up https://bugs.beta.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/apport/+bug/124206
[04:01] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 124206 in apport "apport 0.88 while uploading shows errors" [Undecided,New]  
[04:01] <calc> cjwatson: wrt the partman or something else?
[04:01] <cjwatson> calc: partman
[04:01] <ScottK> pitti: Understand.  You've already saved me the trouble of writing the bug and the trouble of determining if it's syncable.
[04:01] <calc> cjwatson: i was able to reproduce it after reboot so it may still be reproducible at sprint
[04:02] <evand> cjwatson: I was able to reproduce it last night
[04:02] <evand> I think
[04:02] <evand> bug 122645
[04:02] <calc> cjwatson: needed to get one of my machines back online so i ended up reinstalling feisty for the time being
[04:02] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 122645 in ubiquity "manual partitioning hangs indefinitely" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/122645
[04:02] <cjwatson> evand: ooh, good
[04:02] <calc> cjwatson: i also have an issue with wpa/ifupdown one of them not working properly even for open APs on gutsy
[04:03] <calc> cjwatson: i can get an ip address if i run dhclient eth directly but not if using network manager or ifupdown
[04:03] <cjwatson> calc: that I can't help with, but maybe asac or somebody else will be able to
[04:03] <calc> cjwatson: haven't been able to track it down to what exactly causes it due to not being able to install gutsy on my laptop yet, heh
[04:03] <cjwatson> live CD?
[04:04] <pitti> shirish: will loko in a bit
[04:04] <calc> cjwatson: yea
[04:04] <calc> cjwatson: from what i recall it happened on the installed version also
[04:04] <calc> cjwatson: also happens on amd64 gutsy as well from what i recall
[04:04] <cjwatson> oh, I meant that a live CD might be enough to track it down
[04:04] <calc> oh ok yea
[04:04] <calc> it shows up on the live cd definitely
[04:04] <shirish> pitti: thanx, I have sent you a pm also, i'll hang here for a while, if you need more info. either pm me or here itself, either is good :)
[04:05] <cjwatson> assuming you have enough memory (or set up swap) you can build and install packages on the running live CD, which is usually enough
[04:05] <asac> siretart: sorry ... i currently really don't use much of network-manager ... currently trying to change that
[04:06] <Hobbsee> shirish: that's already reported, i think
[04:07] <shirish> Hobbsee: ok cool Hobbsee please mark it duplicate it then, so I can subscribe to the original
[04:07] <Hobbsee> shirish: btw - people tend to be busy, and he's likely subscribed to all apport bugs, so bringing up $yourpetbug isnt going to get so far
[04:07] <Hobbsee> shirish: it's filed under synaptic, i think.  it was in -bugs yesterday or so.  look it up.
[04:07] <shirish> Hobbsee: oh, synaptic? ok 
[04:07] <pitti> shirish: what Hobbsee said, I'm subscribed to apport bugs and regularly look at them anyway
[04:08] <Hobbsee> shirish: unless i shoved it to apport
[04:08] <shirish> pitti: I'm sure of it, I was unsure whether it was a genuine bug or was it something I was doing wrong, Hobbsee just confirmed it :)
[04:09] <Hobbsee> shirish: if it is, or is not, you'll find out when he happens to go thru the new apport bugs
[04:09] <ogra> BenC, hey ...
[04:09] <BenC> ogra: yo
[04:09] <Hobbsee> like i say, bringing it up in here, when he's usually busy with something else, isnt going to make him drop the something else, and go and fix $yourpetbug.
[04:09] <ogra> BenC, would it be possible to ship the oss headers in the linux-headers package again, they somehow vanished recently
[04:10] <Hobbsee> shirish: nor care, particularly much.  particularly teh more you do it.
[04:10] <shirish> Hobbsee: true. 
[04:11] <calc> BenC: i was able to determine it is not the ipw3945 driver in gutsy at fault
[04:11] <pitti> evand: oh, something just occured to me
[04:11] <calc> BenC: not sure if you saw my discussion with crimsun about it last night
[04:11] <evand> ok
[04:11] <pitti> evand: it's gksu vs. sudo, right? Recently I changed sudo to print more detailled password prompts
[04:11] <evand> Yes, running with sudo works, but gksu does not.
[04:12] <pitti> evand: that did not break kdesu nor sudo in any way that I tested it with, and it's rather unlikely that it causes ubiquity to hang, but it's worth mentioning at least
[04:12] <pitti> evand: so maybe it's worth trying the tribe-1 version of sudo
[04:12] <evand> hrmm, I'll keep that in mind, thanks
[04:12] <pitti> evand: it would be really curious if that would fix it, but can't hurt to check :) 
[04:12] <evand> indeed
[04:12] <cjwatson> I'm sceptical about that as a cause too
[04:13] <cjwatson> after all it only runs gksu/sudo right at the start
[04:13] <pitti> at most something like 'gksu checks for output, sees something different, and does not export an important variable" or so
[04:13] <Hobbsee> i wonder if it happened for kdesu...
[04:13] <cjwatson> pitti: I suppose that's possible
[04:13] <Hobbsee> stgraber: ping?
[04:13] <stgraber> Hobbsee: pong
[04:15] <Hobbsee> stgraber: at the bottom of the iso testing page, hwo hard would it be to have a link to "previous snapshot releases", where you could go back to tribe 1, 2, or whatever, done chronologically down the page (collapsable, i guess), and view the test results from them.  currently, it's either not possible, or i havent figured out how to see the old tests and results.
[04:16] <stgraber> Hobbsee: oh, looks like our archive page isn't public ... strange it should be
[04:16] <Hobbsee> stgraber: ah
[04:16] <Hobbsee> stgraber: i didnt see it even hwen logged in, though
[04:16] <Hobbsee> stgraber: it's quite possible that i could have missed it - i'm terrible at finding things right in front of me...but i would have thought i'd find something like that
[04:18] <calc> anyone know of any packages that would have caused my oops in apt-get dist-upgrade that were uploaded to gutsy in the past ~ 2 weeks
[04:18] <stgraber> Hobbsee: no, it seems that the link is only shown for site admins, I just added to my todolist for Monday, you can still use : https://isotesting.stgraber.org/isotesting/archive/ (but you'll see some weird thing like the checkboxes :))
[04:18] <calc> i can try tracking it down myself but just wondered if anyone had run across the issue already?
[04:18] <Hobbsee> stgraber: okay, cool, thanks :)
[04:20] <BenC> rough update...xchat-gnome started locking up, and then wont start again afterwards...firefox session restore is broken
[04:20] <BenC> wonder what else I can find :)
[04:21] <calc> BenC: have you seen the lovely oops during apt-get dist-upgrade?
[04:21] <BenC> calc: I ran dist-upgrade, didn't see an oops
[04:21] <calc> BenC: i saw that last night after not upgrading gutsy for a while
[04:22] <calc> BenC: ah too bad ;)
[04:22] <BenC> calc: so you were probably running a kernel older than -7?
[04:22] <Hobbsee> pitti: evand no one seemed to report that on the kde side, so it may be specific to gksudo.  or maybe no one found it.  not sure.
[04:22] <calc> was running -6 yea, i think i rebooted into -7 and the same thing happened
[04:22] <persia> BenC: Regarding firefox session restore, try removing .mozilla/firefox/(session)/extensions/extensions.rdf and .mozilla/firefox/(session)/extensions/staged-xpis
[04:22] <calc> BenC: anything wrong with -6 that would cause that?
[04:22] <evand> hrm
[04:23] <BenC> calc: very possible..if it happens with -7, please save and report
[04:23] <BenC> persia: thanks
[04:23] <calc> BenC: ok
[04:23] <Hobbsee> evand: i'll try it here now
[04:23] <Lure> siretart: whay did you add gnome depends back to network-manager?
[04:23] <Hobbsee> evand: at least, a tribe 2
[04:23] <evand> thanks Hobbsee 
[04:24] <Lure> siretart: this will not make Riddell happy (and will make kubuntu cd oversized)
[04:24] <Hobbsee> Lure: yay, 2 people not happy on that basis :P
[04:26] <Hobbsee> evand: find me some more ram, kthxbye.
[04:26] <Hobbsee> :)
[04:34] <Hobbsee> evand: i've got this strange feeling that ubiquity-kdeui doesnt use either sudo or kdesu on the live cd, but it's allowed to run as root, without requiring a password
[04:34] <Hobbsee> evand: it neither mentions kdesu or sudo in it's desktop file
[04:34] <BenC> that mystery is solved, sort of...xchat-gnome blocks on read from the esd socket
[04:34] <BenC> kill esd and things go back to normal
[04:35] <pitti> right, I wanted to demote that to deskop recommends a long time ago, too
[04:35] <pitti> no need to kill ubuntu-desktop just for removing insanity
[04:36] <Hobbsee> evand: it doesnt have X-KDE-SubstituteUID=true either...doesnt even have that line - which something like adept_manager does.
[04:38] <Hobbsee> evand: i lie.  it's calling with kdesu --nonewdcop
[04:38] <evand> Hobbsee: it's done by ubiquity itself
[04:38] <Hobbsee> right, yeah
[04:40] <Hobbsee> evand: i cant reproduce it on kde in virtualbox
[04:40] <evand> hrm, ok
[04:40] <evand> thanks
[04:40] <Hobbsee> didnt try proper hardware, of course
[04:44] <pitti> hm, I need to do an experiment for a new apport change, but I need someone who is *not* an ubuntu-core-dev for this
[04:44] <geser> what do you want tested?
[04:45] <pitti> one is enough, I guess, thanks for the interest :)
[04:46] <pitti> please install apport-cli as a guinea pig package and add an 'assert False' to /usr/bin/apport-cli, right after "if __name__ == '__main__':" (at the bottom)
[04:46] <siretart> Lure: I agree that the gnome-dependency is unfortunate. however breaking 3 reverse dependencies (the vpn plugins) isn't nice as well
[04:46] <pitti> i. e. that's a package where I'm comfortable with dealing with some bug spam and which is easy to control
[04:47] <Lure> siretart: but breaking kubuntu is not an option ether
[04:47] <siretart> Lure: perhaps we can split the nm-vpn-properties application to an own binary package. 
[04:47] <siretart> asac: how do you think about it?
[04:48] <Lure> siretart: yep, but I think that vpn-properties is supposed to move to n-m-applet in future, that is why it was moved there as a patch 
[04:48] <siretart> Lure: please don't imply I wanted to break kubuntu
[04:48] <Lure> by Tonio_ if I recall correctly
[04:48] <Lure> siretart: I did not want to imply that, sorry for that
[04:48] <siretart> Tonio_: around?
[04:48] <Tonio_> siretart: yep
[04:49] <Lure> pitti: do you recall this discussion about vpn-properties being moved to -applet
[04:49] <pitti> Lure: vaguely
[04:49] <siretart> Tonio_: I had the impression that nm-vpn-properties has been moved from -applet to network-manager
[04:49] <Tonio_> siretart: we discussed with mbiebl and decided to do that way
[04:49] <Lure> Tonio_: you discussed it with mbiebl or n-m upstream?
[04:49] <siretart> Tonio_: I didn't find any traces of that there, so I reenabled it in the network-manager source package
[04:49] <geser> pitti: done, what's next?
[04:49] <Tonio_> Lure: mbiebl
[04:50] <Tonio_> siretart: let me check
[04:50] <pitti> geser: http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/tmp/python-apport_0.89_all.deb -> can you please gdebi that?
[04:50] <siretart> Tonio_: why did nm-vpn-properties get dropped then in gutsy from -applet?
[04:50] <Lure> siretart: it may have been dropped by recent rework by asac
[04:50] <Tonio_> siretart: it wasn't in my package afaicr
[04:51] <pitti> shirish: http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/tmp/python-apport_0.89_all.deb -> can you please gdebi that?
[04:51] <Tonio_> but it has been reworked a lot to fix patches issues which I couldn't handle
[04:51] <Tonio_> siretart: I need to investigate, gimme a moment
[04:51] <shirish> pitti: ok will do
[04:52] <siretart> Lure: it has been missing for more than one week. I was too annoyed about the broken openvpn package so I looked at the source packages and just fixed it
[04:52] <pitti> shirish, geser: with the new python-apport, please call 'apport-cli' and report the crash as usual
[04:52] <siretart> Lure: it seems to me that there should be a more visible hint in the source package where nm-vpn-properties is supposed to be
[04:53] <Lure> siretart: problem is that upstream has left vpn-properties in wrong tar
[04:53] <Hobbsee> Lure: Tonio_ any idea why knetworkmanager doesnt seem to autoconnect on startup, and hasnt for the past few weeks now?
[04:53] <Tonio_> Lure: exactly
[04:53] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: known bug, waiting for a fix :)
[04:53] <siretart> Lure: I assume you are in contact with upstream to fix that?
[04:53] <Lure> siretart: mbiebl talked with them and this is supposed to be addressed in next upstream release
[04:53] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: right.  guess you cant shove them along?
[04:54] <Tonio_> siretart: to make it simple, the point was that the vpn-prpperties is still in the n-m tarball, not the applet
[04:54] <siretart> Tonio_: I got that. I reenabled it in network-manager because of lack of better knowledge
[04:54] <eagles0513875> jw is anyone else have the problem where after they login on a broadband connection they connection doesnt automatically start 
[04:54] <eagles0513875> once u log in
[04:54] <eagles0513875> im on the 64bit version of gutsy
[04:54] <Hobbsee> eagles0513875: ...
[04:54] <Tonio_> siretart: the problem is that due to shlibsdeps, this was giving gnome dependancies on the n-m package
[04:54] <Hobbsee> eagles0513875: #ubuntu+1 for a start, and i just answered you.
[04:54] <Tonio_> which is not good for kubuntu
[04:55] <Hobbsee> eagles0513875: and the fact that you've just come in and disturbed a whole lot of other conversations, too.
[04:55] <Tonio_> so we dedided to install it in a hidden directory, then tell to shlibsdeps to ignore it, and patch n-m-applet, so that you could use it while the applet is installed
[04:55] <eagles0513875> sry i will leave channel
[04:55] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: sounds...crackful
[04:55] <Hobbsee> slightly
[04:55] <Lure> Hobbsee: good observation ;-)
[04:56] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: no other way if we don't want n-m to ship with 30 megs of gnome deps
[04:56] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: tru ethat
[04:57] <Tonio_> siretart: the change probably was lost by esac I guess
[04:57] <siretart> Tonio_: as said, I got that
[04:57] <Tonio_> siretart: then n-m-applet pointed to a place where vpn-properties was missing....
[04:57] <siretart> Tonio_: yes
[04:57] <siretart> I know
[04:58] <Tonio_> siretart: so what is the problem ? I mmust say I don't get you now ;)
[04:58] <siretart> Tonio_: I don't really care where vpn-properties actually is. I just don't want the package to be left broken around just because nobody cares
[04:58] <siretart> Tonio_: see my recent network-manager uploads from today morning
[04:58] <Tonio_> siretart: that I understand
[04:59] <Tonio_> siretart: well I id the package, but I don't use it myself, hard for me to be sure new uploads still work
[04:59] <Tonio_> siretart: do you still hide it from shlibsdeps ?
[05:00] <siretart> Tonio_: the network-manager package currently depends on libglib
[05:01] <Tonio_> hum....
[05:01] <Tonio_> siretart: isn't that possible to simply switch back to what I did first upload ? it worked afair
[05:02] <siretart> Tonio_: you mean to drop nm-vpn-properties again? sorry, I don't want to break packages on purpose
[05:02] <Tonio_> siretart: no, no, no
[05:03] <Tonio_> siretart: install in not in /usr/bin, then patch the applet, and tell dh_shlibsdeps to ignore it
[05:03] <Tonio_> siretart: it was working on the initial upload
[05:04] <crimsun> pitti: ok, thanks.
[05:04] <siretart> Tonio_: that part got dropped somehow. Feel free to reintroduce it (as long as nm-vpn-properties doesn't get dropped again ;)
[05:05] <Tonio_> siretart: sure
[05:05] <Tonio_> siretart: will do that toonight
[05:06] <Tonio_> siretart: I'll email asac on that point for further maintance of the package
[05:06] <pitti> geser: nevermind any more, I have the test results; please make sure to "apt-get install python-apport/gutsy" and purge apport-cli (or restore it); thank you
[05:09] <shirish> siretart: I have pmmed you something, please take a look at it as & when you can. 
[05:13] <slomo> hi pitti :)
[05:14] <Hobbsee> hi slomo 
[05:14] <slomo> hi Hobbsee 
[05:15] <asac> Tonio_: pong
[05:15] <asac> Tonio_: sorry ... still fighting with some wifi setup stuff here ... so unreponsive
[05:16] <asac> siretart: did you commit your changes to bzr?
[05:16] <Lure> Tonio_: [17:15]  <asac> Tonio_: sorry ... still fighting with some wifi setup stuff here ... so unreponsive
[05:16] <shirish> asac: who is responsible for network-manager stuff?
[05:16] <pitti> asac: run!
[05:17] <asac> yeah ... i already have the feeling
[05:17] <Lure> asac: siretart's changes are in bzr
[05:17] <asac> and her dropped more than just adding vpn?
[05:17] <pitti> Master dholbach? can you please check whether you got bug mail for #124219?
[05:17] <Lure> asac: we need old hack from Tonio_ for vpn-properties in order not to pull in gnome depends for kubuntu
[05:18] <Lure> vpn-properties is supposed to move to -applet in next release to fix this long term
[05:18] <asac> Lure: can we please make a list of changes needed ... and don't do stuff in a hurry
[05:18] <dholbach> bug 124219
[05:18] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 124219 in apport "apport-cli crashed with  IndentationError in CLIUserInterface()()" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/124219
[05:19] <Lure> asac: Tonio_ said that he will write e-mail to you
[05:19] <pitti> dholbach: it's a test bug for checking LP behaviour of email notifications
[05:19] <asac> Tonio_: ping
[05:19] <pitti> dholbach: I just need to know whether anyone from ubuntu-core-dev got bug mail about this
[05:19] <siretart> asac: sure!
[05:19] <dholbach> pitti: no, didn't get it yet
[05:19] <asac> Lure: siretart Tonio_ ... feel free to change things ... but please bring up a private bzr branch and tell me to pull and release changes in future :)
[05:19] <pitti> dholbach: well, you shouldn't :)
[05:19] <dholbach> I thought so ;-)
[05:19] <dholbach> great
[05:20] <pitti> dholbach: ubuntu-core-dev is sub'ed to that bug through ubuntu-crashes-main
[05:20] <dholbach> right
[05:20] <pitti> dholbach: so it seems that the "black hole" team contact address fro u-crashes-main does its job
[05:20] <asac> Lure: siretart Tonio_  ... at least we can discuss stuff before they get pushed... otherwise we will always end up playing ping pong with network-manager
[05:20] <pitti> dholbach: cool, thanks! https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CrashReporting, there you go!
[05:22] <Tonio__> asac: I agree, and btw the changes I've done for the vpn-properties should have been documented in the package
[05:22] <asac> Tonio__: so is documentation missing now ... or is all fine now ... let me pull latest branch
[05:23] <Tonio__> asac: the only thing to be done is re-add the changes I've done for the vpn-properties part
[05:23] <Tonio__> asac: are you there toonight (means 2~3 hours) ?
[05:23] <Tonio__> asac: i'm at work yet, no way to do that atm
[05:28] <asac> i will be here at development meeting
[05:28] <asac> tomorrow i am here as well
[05:28] <pitti> asac: so, we'll have our discussion tomorrow?
[05:28] <asac> pitti: maybe we can do it in a few minuts ... depends if i get this wifi working here :)
[05:29] <asac> pitti: haha ... i have problems with encryption
[05:29] <asac> pitti: normal works
[05:29] <asac> pitti: but i want more :/
[05:30] <asac> pitti: can i do the testcase for our infamous bug without enc?
[05:30] <pitti> asac: you don't need wifi for that
[05:30] <pitti> asac: simple eth is enough
[05:30] <pitti> asac: in fact it's much easier, since you can unplug/replug
[05:30] <pitti> the lack of a cable makes this a bit harder for wifi :)
[05:31] <asac> pitti: ah ... so eth1 and eth0 ?
[05:31] <asac> pitti: or do i just need one ?
[05:31] <pitti> asac: either is fine
[06:11] <shawarma> testing.... bug 12345
[06:11] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 12345 in isdnutils "isdn does not work, fritz avm (pnp?)" [Medium,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/12345
[06:21] <ogra> BenC, did you get my question from before ? (i think your xchat crashed)
[06:35] <BenC> ogra: no, I didn't see it
[06:36] <ogra> BenC, would it be possible to ship the oss headers in the linux-headers package again, they somehow vanished recently
[06:36] <BenC> ogra: in gutsy?
[06:36] <ogra> yep
[06:36] <ogra> i have one thin client with a sis7019 soundchip
[06:37] <ogra> for these things exist no alsa drivers
[06:37] <BenC> ogra: Can you file a bug so I or someone else can look into it?
[06:37] <ogra> i have one oss driver here that works but i need to pull the oss headers out of te linux-source package 
[06:37] <ogra> indeed
[06:37] <ogra> so it wasnt on purpose ?
[06:38] <BenC> ogra: Not by me, but maybe something upstream did
[06:38] <ogra> well, its in the source tarball
[06:38] <ogra> just doesnt get packaged into the headers package
[08:53] <EvanCarroll> can someone confirm a defualt ubuntu install only has that which is listed as a dependency in ubuntu-standard and ubuntu-desktop ?
[09:04] <Keybuk> EvanCarroll: no
[09:04] <Keybuk> EvanCarroll: it also has kernels, boot loaders, etc. as appropriate for your architecture
[09:05] <Kmos> Keybuk: can you look at bug 46657
[09:05] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 46657 in kdenetwork "Kopete gives error when you're on your own contact list" [Medium,Incomplete]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/46657
[09:29] <pitti> StevenK: what about asterisk? It's the last reverse dependency (apart from nexuiz-server, which you wanted to get synced)
[09:30] <pitti> StevenK: oh, and gambas-gb-net-curl and apt, of course
[09:32] <geser> pitti: he uploaded gambas 1.0.18-1build1 already
[09:33] <geser> or didn't the upload fix it?
[09:33] <pitti> geser: ah, then NBS is just out of date, I guess
[09:33] <pitti> hm, FTBFS on sparc and powerpc
[09:34] <pitti> ah, that needs a P-a-s change
[09:47] <Keybuk> Kmos: ?  I don't think I'm a good person to look at that bug
[09:55] <asac> pitti: if you ask someone about p-a-s change ... can you remind them about flashplugin-nonfree on amd64 as well :)
[09:55] <asac> ?
[09:55] <pitti> asac: it needs to be added there?
[09:58] <asac> amd64 ... yes
[09:59] <asac> i pinged elmo infinity and send mail .. no answer so far
[09:59] <pitti> asac: mail sent, you are in CC
[10:17] <cjwatson> EvanCarroll: it's also possible for it to have random other hardware-appropriate packages, e.g. mouseemu on Macs - and you forgot about ubuntu-minimal
[10:31] <dholbach> pitti: which mail address would you set for ubuntu-main-sponsors then?
[10:31] <pitti> dholbach: hm, we cannot recycle ubuntu-bugs@
[10:31] <pitti> it needs a new one, so we'll probably need another 'black hole' address
[10:32] <dholbach> but people who are in the team and want to have bug mails about that as they're used to?
[10:32] <dholbach> I didn't want to change the workflow for people who use the teams arleady
[10:32] <dholbach> that's why I founded the new team
[10:32] <mjg59> pitti: Hm. Looks like your laptop-mode upload reintroduced the acpi event scripts (sorry for not catching that)
[10:33] <pitti> dholbach: that's why I think we should mail the team members; we need to do that in either case
[10:34] <pitti> mjg59: uh; as I said, I could not test it, I just reviewed the merge and it looked reasonable; sorry for that
[10:34] <dholbach> pitti: I think that an announce of the new team and workflow will be just fine ;-)
[10:34] <mjg59> Ah, sorry, I thought you'd looked over it rather than just pointing me at the MoM
[10:34] <mjg59> My fault :(
[10:34] <mjg59> (Though, like I said, we should drop it - it does insanity)
[10:35] <pitti> mjg59: I did look over the patch, but since I did not exactly know what it actually does, I didn't notice that this script is a problem
[10:35] <mjg59> It handles policy inside laptop-mode
[10:36] <pitti> dholbach: right, I'm fine with mailing the old members and point out the new team, but it still feels wrong to me; your call, though
[10:37] <dholbach> pitti: I think it only makes sense to re-use ubuntu-main-sponsors and ubuntu-universe-sponsors, if we mail each and every of the team members, explaining the workflow and get a mailing list for the *-main-* team
[10:37] <geser> pitti: could you please give-back commons-io?
[10:37] <pitti> dholbach: right; but as I said, we need to mail them all anyway
[10:38] <dholbach> ok, fine with me... ... ... although it will take a while until we get that mailing list
[10:38] <pitti> geser: kicked
[10:39] <geser> pitti: thanks
[10:48] <Kmos> evand: bug 47238
[10:48] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 47238 in ubiquity "Bugs with time settings during installation" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/47238
[10:49] <tormod> mjg59: what laptop-mode are you talking about? laptop-mode-tools 1.34-1ubuntu1 ?
[10:50] <mjg59> Yess
[10:51] <evand> thanks Kmos 
[10:55] <tormod> mjg59: I guess I am at fault, since I did the merge. But there was not mentioned in older changelogs that some events scripts were left out. Anyway, what do you think of https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/laptop-mode-tools/+bug/80980/comments/6 ?
[10:55] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 80980 in laptop-mode-tools "power management on ipw2200 and ipw3945" [Undecided,New]  
[10:56] <mjg59> This is why I want to reimplemtn it
[10:57] <cjwatson> Kmos: at least part of that bug appears to be wrong; see my comment
[10:57] <mjg59> We have something that manages policy in respones to acpi events - acpid
[10:58] <mjg59> laptop-mode-tools should control laptop-mode and nothing else
[10:58] <tormod> mjg59: do you agree with Bart, so we can do it (more like) the upstream way?
[10:59] <mjg59> tormod: No
[11:00] <tormod> mjg59: I hope you can discuss it with Bart, so we get sanity in both Ubuntu and Debian.
[11:00] <Kmos> cjwatson: ok
[11:00] <mjg59> tormod: As I said, laptop-mode-tools is the wrong place to manage policy
[11:01] <fabbione> how did system-config-cluster landed on the livecd?
[11:02] <pitti> fabbione: ??
[11:02] <pitti> fabbione: it's not in the seeds
[11:02] <pitti> and no reverse dependency of anything
[11:02] <fabbione> pitti: see the bug
[11:03] <fabbione> pitti: he might have installed it manually but i doubt
[11:03] <pitti> fabbione: well, you can install it in the live system
[11:04] <fabbione> pitti: do you have an amd64 where you can try to reproduce it? (not now.. sometime tomorrow would be fine)
[11:04] <pitti> fabbione: yes, I have
[11:04] <pitti> (my main workstation)
[11:04] <fabbione> pitti: if you have time.. would you mind ?
[11:05] <pitti> and vmware
[11:05] <fabbione> i will test i386
[11:05] <pitti> fabbione: no, that's fine; I keep the browser tab open to remind me tomorrow
[11:05] <fabbione> but tomorrow is fine
[11:05] <fabbione> thanks
[11:05] <pitti> fabbione: but the traceback is quite clear?
[11:05] <tormod> mjg59: I found your changelog note "Don't ship acpi scripts (we handle that ourselves)" from 2005... Maybe that should go in a separate patch file instead of all the handpatching.
[11:06] <fabbione> pitti: yes, but it starts on i386 normal installation here
[11:06] <pitti> fabbione: I saw quite a number of similar bugs on restricted-manager and such
[11:06] <pitti> fabbione: either we have a  pretty nasty bug in python-central, or he ran it during an upgrade or so
[11:06] <pitti> fabbione: I'll try it out tomorrow
[11:07] <fabbione> pitti: thanks
[11:07] <Kmos> doko: dpkg has a new version on debian
[11:08] <fabbione> pitti: from the menu i can't start it at all.. i think the helper should invoke gsudo or something.. and it doesn't.. from console it works fine..
[11:08] <fabbione> pitti: anyway.. tomorrow.. thanks man
[11:08] <pitti> fabbione: sleep well
[11:08] <fabbione> you too
[11:08] <cjwatson> Kmos: you realise that will be extremely common now we're past Debian import freeze?
[11:09] <cjwatson> from then to upstream version freeze, new syncs/merges can happen freely but generally only when there's some interesting reason to do so, rather than just "because it's there"
[11:10] <Kmos> cjwatson: hmm.. i think it's the time to do some merges/syncs
[11:10] <Kmos> because there are a lot to do
[11:10] <cjwatson> please re-read what I said
[11:10] <cjwatson> we are not aiming to get merges/syncs down at this point just for the sake of it
[11:10] <Kmos> yeah
[11:10] <Kmos> only for important things
[11:11] <cjwatson> right, and important changes rather than important packages
[11:11] <Kmos> things = bugs
[11:11] <Kmos> I think it'll only freeze for tribe-4
[11:11] <cjwatson> the relevant freezes are scheduled and visible on GutsyReleaseSchedule
[11:12] <cjwatson> they aren't necessarily synced to milestone releases
[11:12] <Kmos> ok :)
[11:12] <Kmos> sorry