=== Subhuman [n=jack@host86-143-235-27.range86-143.btcentralplus.com] has joined #ubuntu-motu [12:16] how can I create a sid pbuilder? [12:16] I keep on getting this error: [12:16] E: Failed getting release file http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/sid/Release [12:16] pbuilder: debootstrap failed [12:17] well, use a Debian repo server instead of Ubuntu one [12:17] minghua: http://pastebin.ca/609490 === Burgundavia [n=corey@ubuntu/member/burgundavia] has joined #ubuntu-motu [12:18] hey Burgundavia [12:18] hey ryanakca [12:20] ryanakca: No idea, I don't play with pbuilder often. [12:21] ryanakca: you may need some command line option for pbuilder when creating. === cypher1 [n=cypher1@c-69-249-127-102.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-motu === Bassetts [n=Bassetts@unaffiliated/bassetts] has joined #ubuntu-motu [12:46] Night. === persia [n=persia@ubuntu/member/persia] has joined #ubuntu-motu [12:55] Hey persia. [12:55] MOrning TheMuso [12:55] Hi persia, TheMuso. [12:55] Morning Fujitsu. [12:56] Hey Fujitsu. Great wording on the beryl bug :) === stgraber [n=stgraber@ubuntu/member/stgraber] has joined #ubuntu-motu [12:56] good morning persia, Fujitsu, TheMuso [12:57] Hi jussi01. [12:57] persia: Heh, thanks. [01:00] minghua: okies, thanks === TheMuso is going to try and clear some outstanding merges today. [01:04] Is Soyuz still being entirely useless today? [01:04] (ie. not adding any builds?) === persia requests that REVU uploaders 1) Not upload to REVU for a simple revision bump, and 2) Include a comment for uploads when they are related to an upgrade bug (with the bug URL), rather than being an entirely new package. [01:07] persia: It'll never work. === jml [n=jml@ppp121-44-211-82.lns1.hba1.internode.on.net] has joined #ubuntu-motu [01:09] Fujitsu: Why not? Perhaps if I ask enough, someone will learn. It's just really frustrating to find that half of a transition was uploaded because a reviewer didn't understand what was explained in a bug, perhaps requiring the work be entirely redone (or instead, introducing broken packages). [01:10] I don't think we should use REVU for updating packages already in the archive either. [01:11] TheMuso: I like it for new upstream versions, as the debdiff is typically fairly ugly, especially when the package doesn't use a patch system. [01:11] TheMuso: then what would a new guy do to contribute/have his 'update'/'fix' reviewed? [01:12] ryanakca: For most cases, attaching a debdiff to a bug would be preferred. [01:12] persia: hmm... ok [01:12] persia: Yeah, makes sense if you don't have webspace to upload the package to./ [01:12] Guess I am a little lucky in that regard. [01:12] persia: if that's the case, maybe stick it in the MOTU documentation? [01:13] TheMuso: I also like the confirmation that the uploader is in the keyring. Sometimes I see random pointers to webspace, and am less comfortable unless I know the person personally. [01:13] ryanakca: See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing [01:13] persia: Again, good point. [01:14] Thats what I have always done with new upstream packages that need sponsoring, and all of my sponsors haven't seemed to have a problem with that. [01:14] TheMuso: I'm guessing that your sponsors tend to be people who know you reasonably well. For new contributors, I think REVU is easier for new upstreams than personal webspace. === reggaemanu__ [n=manu@ARennes-257-1-157-25.w86-214.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #ubuntu-motu [01:16] persia: Fair call. === ..[topic/#ubuntu-motu:persia] : Ubuntu Masters of the Universe: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | Want to get involved with the MOTUs? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | It's REVU Day! If you've a package on REVU, please call for reviews. If you're a reviewer, please review as many as you can. === doko_ [n=doko@dslb-088-073-080-127.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #ubuntu-motu [01:17] Ok then, merges can wait till tomorrow. :p === TheMuso will just finish the few he has started. [01:19] TheMuso: If you're hunting features, no reason to switch :) [01:19] hmm... for a plain text editor (simillar to nano), is it worth creating a aoeui-doc package? [01:20] Nafallo: you need to try alsa-kernel hg. [01:21] crimsun: BTW, I am happy to take care of your merges if you don't want them. [01:21] And or don't have time for them. [01:21] TheMuso: feel free. [01:22] crimsun: will do when I get the laptop. Dell says I will have it 20th :-) [01:22] crimsun: you might want to suggest it to the reporter so I know if I will have sound with Tribe 3 ;-) [01:23] ryanakca: It depends on the relative size of the /usr/share in the binary partition. If there's a lot of documentation, it's nice to split the package. If it's small, it might be better to include it in the binary package. [01:23] s/partition/package/ [01:24] persia: hmm... well, upstream created a massive .m4 file, that splits into two manpages, and creates equivalent .txt and .html files. [01:25] Nafallo: that's not under my control. Linus must merge the fix for 2.6.22 final to ensure it, and he hasn't as of two minutes ago. [01:25] ryanakca: My general rule of thumb is that if more than 25% is in /usr/share, it's best to have a -common or -doc package (depending on what makes that 25%). The size of the source doesn't matter, just the size of the results. [01:26] persia: ok [01:26] crimsun: ouch :-/. we won't have the fix if Linus doesn't sync then? [01:26] It's REVU day again? :-) [01:26] minghua: Yep :) [01:29] Nafallo: we'll have it either way. [01:29] I'm just not going to push it to the kernel team unless it _doesn'T_ make it into 2.6.22. [01:30] ah :-) [01:30] okidoki [01:30] would be nice if it worked with a tribe ;-) [01:31] is it possible to do multibinary packages with cdbs? [01:31] certainly. [01:32] ryanakca: Yes. Just add multiple stanzas to debian/control, and include the relevant binary-package.install, etc. [01:32] gnight [01:32] hmmm... like this: https://perso.duckcorp.org/duck/cdbs-doc/cdbs-doc.xhtml#id2529601 ? [01:32] night Nafallo [01:33] ryanakca: Yes, although typically one doesn't need quite so much in debian/rules :) [01:34] persia: okies, thanks :) [01:34] persia: Did you or geser have any luck with ardour and working out why its dying? [01:34] On the builds that is. [01:35] TheMuso: I'm waiting for a permissions adjustment. Last I heard, geser was hunting a build log. [01:35] Ah ok. === Fujitsu hopes the build queuer turns back on today. [01:36] Fujitsu: They're off? [01:37] Fujitsu: I don't expect it until your evening: the relevant people seem to believe in weekends :) [01:37] TheMuso: Yeah, I think cjwatson killed it with cron.daily last night. There have been no builds created since. [01:37] ah ok [01:39] TheMuso: would you like to take over owneship of ubuntu-audio? [01:39] ownership, even [01:39] :( [01:39] crimsun: I don't mind. [01:40] crimsun: If you'd rather someone else take care of it, I am happy to. [01:41] done. I've deactivated myself in addition. [01:41] Ok. [01:43] Uploaders: If you upload something from REVU, please archive the REVU entry. === Fujitsu tries to interpret shirish's last attempt at killing off -devel-discuss [01:44] persia: ok. Looks like the author just ln -nf /usr/bin/aoeui /usr/bin/asdfg , and then the app figures out if it's running it QWERTY or Dvorak. Does that still require me to create the package asdfg? [01:45] (source creates the text editor aoeui (original, dvorak version) and then asdfg (the new, qwerty equivalent) [01:45] ryanakca: Not at all. A package may provide multiple binaries: just check to make sure there are no conflicts beforehand. The only reason to provide two packages is if there was a conflict of some sort, and users would only want one of aoeui or asdfg. [01:46] persia: ok, so what would I call the package? aoeui, or asdfg? [01:46] ryanakca: Try to use the upstream name: we want to support branding [01:46] (notice that the names are the first 5 characters from the left on the home row, on both layouts) [01:47] ryanakca: Sure, but in this case, the upstream website is probably called aoeui, and asdfg is just an alternate binary for those with a different keyboard layout. [01:48] upstream calls the tarball aoeui, but on the webpage, it lists it as two seperate, but equivalent programs. But, asdfg depends on aoeui. I suppose I call it aoeui, and put in the control description that it provides the editor for both layouts? [01:50] ryanakca: Right. The tarball name is a good hint :) === bassett [n=Bassetts@5ac2dd08.bb.sky.com] has joined #ubuntu-motu [01:51] ummm... do I want to install aoeui.1 and asdfg.1 if it creates aoeui.1.gz and asdfg.1.gz as well? [01:54] ryanakca: If the package creates both, you probably want to install both (every binary needs a manpage). If there were only one, making sure it had info for both, and linking them would be sufficient. === Vorian_ [n=Steve@ubuntu/member/Vorian] has joined #ubuntu-motu [01:54] persia: I think he means gzipped vs. non-gzipped. [01:56] persia: what Fujitsu said [01:56] persia: how will 'man' know if it wants the gzipped version or the non gzipped one? === PriceChild [n=pricechi@ubuntu/member/pricechild] has joined #ubuntu-motu [01:57] Does anybody here know of a way to make sbuild default to (a) using the gutsy chroot, and (b) building arch-all? [01:58] Hmmm.. I don't have an opinion on that (and am not finding anything from a quick perusal of `man dh_installman`. I seem to have only compressed manpages on my system. [01:58] Fujitsu: for (b), -A helps, but I don't know how to set the default. [01:59] persia: Yep, I've been building with `-A -d gutsy' for ever, but was wondering if there was some default set somewhere. === Fujitsu checks the code. [02:00] Fujitsu: I'm not finding good docs, but I'm guessing that doing something with ~/.sbuildrc ought to be the right solution. [02:00] Arch all by default would be nice, I must admit. [02:00] persia: ok, well, I think man will try to take the compressed one by default, and a couple more kilobytes won't hurt anybody... [02:00] c [02:00] ugh [02:03] Found it: $main::distribution defaults to "unstable". This can be adjusted locally, or perhaps we want a new default? === jsgotangco [n=jsg123@ubuntu/member/jsgotangco] has joined #ubuntu-motu [02:05] Ah, and $main::build_arch_all=1. [02:05] That's not in $conf::, though. [02:05] It'd be nice if it was overrideable. === RAOF [n=chris@123-243-65-41.tpgi.com.au] has joined #ubuntu-motu [02:07] I think policy requires man pages to be gzipped. [02:07] And it's definitely not good to ship _both_ compressed and uncompressed man pages. === micahcowan [n=micah@ubuntu/member/micahcowan] has joined #ubuntu-motu === Yann_Dinendal [n=Yann@dyn-91-168-207-237.ppp.tiscali.fr] has joined #ubuntu-motu === zul_ [n=chuck@mail.edgewater.ca] has joined #ubuntu-motu === zul [n=chuck@ubuntu/member/zul] has joined #ubuntu-motu [02:16] micahcowan: ok [02:16] micahcowan: oops sorry, [02:16] :) === Toadstool [n=jcorbier@cl-266.bru-01.be.sixxs.net] has joined #ubuntu-motu [02:17] minghua: ok. hmm... I'll try to figure it out, thanks :) [02:18] hey [02:19] Hi zul. === finalbeta [n=gggggggg@d54C6865D.access.telenet.be] has joined #ubuntu-motu === IanC26 [n=IanC26@2002:908b:a594:4:216:6fff:fe39:ff6e] has joined #ubuntu-motu === hjmf [n=hjmf@150.Red-83-44-175.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #ubuntu-motu [02:53] hmm.. how would one set up a dput server (receiving end)... google doesn't show much... I've tried sshfs, but all I get are permission denied style errors from moving the .dsc.asc to .dsc, and the .diff.gz.TA023a to .diff.gz === alex-weej [n=alex@82.23.188.238] has joined #ubuntu-motu [02:54] (I have a pbuild server, and I have my desktop (where I make the source package), and I'm trying to figure out how to transfer without having to scp it all) [02:55] Man, that's a cool idea! I can't help, but please make sure you post how to get that working :) [02:56] RAOF: I'll stick it on planet :) [02:59] ryanakca: You could set up an rsync job on the pbuild server that grabs from a directory every few minutes (not that cp is many less characters than scp, but perhaps less authentication) [03:00] persia: authentication is set up with ssh keys... sftp... hmm... === minghua [n=minghua@ubuntu/member/minghua] has joined #ubuntu-motu [03:05] persia: how does REVU have it set up? [03:06] ryanakca: REVU has an anonymous-acceptable FTP server, and a cronjob that runs some scripts to process the uploads. Note that it doesn't actually build them: so the contents of the scripts are probably not useful for your purposes. [03:06] http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/29172/ is the revu script [03:07] persia: hmm.. anonymous-acceptable FTP doesn't seem to be what I want... [03:08] ryanakca: Perhaps. You could just delete anything that didn't match your criteria every few minutes. [03:08] ryanakca: The files just have to get into a directory somewhere. It doesn't matter how. === Arrogance [n=aks@ottawa-hs-64-26-148-25.d-ip.magma.ca] has joined #ubuntu-motu === persia looks to see if dput accepts sftp... [03:09] It does scp [03:10] hmm.. [03:10] would it be possible to somehow tweak sshfs? [03:10] ryanakca: Why sshfs? [03:10] I have deb/ on my server, and I've mounted it with sshfs on my desktop... [03:11] ryanakca: Why would you need to tweak it? Also, you might like configuring dput to use scp, so it does all the tricky bits for you. [03:11] Fujitsu: I have a tab in console open with a connection to the server. If sshfs works, I make the changes on my desktop, sign it (I only have my GPG key on my desktop), and then I switch to the server tab, and run pbuilder on it === cynics [n=cynics@211.94.35.200] has joined #ubuntu-motu [03:12] persia: because of permission crazyness [03:13] persia: ls -lash . shows it as owned by 'ryan', but I can't edit it... running chown on it all :) hmm. [03:13] ryanakca: You want more automation: use dput to scp the files, and have the server autobuild anything received, and put it in a repo (eith apt-ftparchive). Put the repo source and binary lines in your sources.list. === ryanakca nods [03:16] ryanakca: For extra points, autocopy the build logs to a webserver and mail yourself a link. [03:16] persia: hehe :) === anibal [n=anibal@debian/developer/anibal] has joined #ubuntu-motu [03:17] persia: for even more points, have it grep the diff file for '(num)ubuntu(num)', to see if it should use gutsy pbuilder or sid pbuilder :) [03:18] ryanakca: Better to use the target distribution in the changelog. [03:18] *nod* === ryanakca wonders if he should write it for /bin/sh or '/usr/bin/env python' [03:20] ryanakca: The latter isn't meant to be used. /usr/bin/python is correct by policy. === ryanakca scratches head [03:21] Fujitsu: so, you shouldn't use env in any case for any python app, no matter the distribution? [03:22] ryanakca: It's forbidden by Debian policy, probably for a good reason. [03:22] hmm. [03:28] It's forbidden because env(1) looks up the PATH, and /usr/local/bin trumps /usr/bin. [03:29] Hi StevenK. [03:29] I guess that would do it. === Fujitsu kicks soyuz a bit. [03:29] And having a dependancy on some python module doesn't mean the random /usr/local/bin/python will know about it. === StevenK waves to Fujitsu. === StevenK joins Fujitsu. [03:30] I have three uploads, soon to be four that have no builds. [03:30] I think the build queuer is mourning the murdered cron.daily process. [03:30] Seems like it. [03:31] It always has to happen on weekends, doesn't it? [03:37] Sometimes public holidays [03:38] I think public holidays are usually exempted because they differ from country to country... [03:44] Is new year celebrated widely enough to be considered "everywhere"? [03:44] I think so. [03:57] minghua: if you speaking of the gregorian calendar, pretty much yes === iterion [n=chatzill@208.252.1.99] has joined #ubuntu-motu [03:58] Hi Burgundavia. [03:58] hello Fujitsu === minghua wonders why one of Fujitsu's sync bugmail ended up in spam folder. [04:04] minghua: For I am spammy. [04:04] Which one was it? [04:05] The pymol one. Probably because of the URL in the changelog. [04:05] Ah. [04:24] Geez. It's disturbing when the rain outside can drown out the music that's playing. [04:25] StevenK: We haven't had rain for 24 hours or so, and nothing really heavy for a couple of weeks. [04:26] It hasn't rained for a few weeks, this is first drenching of July. [04:26] Heh. [04:27] It has been raining a fair bit daily for the past 3 or 4 weeks. [04:27] Of course it has, it's Melbourne! [04:27] True. === StevenK gets sick of libflac, and does some bug triage [04:28] Bug triage is pretty much all I do. [04:30] Hrm. Fast moving storm system. We got a 15 minute drenching, and now nothing. [04:31] StevenK: heh [04:31] Twas raining this morning, and did so overnight, but nothing since about 8 or so. === StevenK ponders grabbing some lunch now the rain has buggered off. === RAOF 's stomach rumbles at StevenK's musings === Fujitsu 's does too. === StevenK chuckles evilly. === Fujitsu curses StevenK === Fujitsu triages bugs then trolls on the forum === RAOF foils StevenK's schemes by actually getting lunch! [04:39] RAOF: A good idea. === zul [n=chuck@CPE0006258ec6c1-CM000a73655d0e.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #ubuntu-motu === hjmf [n=hjmf@150.Red-83-44-175.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #ubuntu-motu [04:43] I would get lunch, but I can't decide what to get. [04:45] pizza :p [04:45] Unhealthy. [04:46] Pfft, like I care about healthy-ness. [04:46] TheMuso: :p === cypherbios [n=cypher@ubuntu/member/cypherbios] has joined #ubuntu-motu [04:50] persia: In regards to bug 84451, I'm not sure you can get source and binaries kicked out of released versions of Ubuntu [04:51] Launchpad bug 84451 in linuxsampler "Linuxsampler is unfree, and this is reported incorrectly" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/84451 [04:51] "unfree" makes me chuckle, though. :-) [04:51] StevenK: sourceforge page says GPL [04:53] I don't think it's possible to modify RELEASE. === jmg checks out the bug [04:53] (after it is released, that is) [04:53] the actual README in the upstream distribution says "This software is distributed under the GNU General Public License (see COPYING file), and may not be used in commercial applications without asking the authors for permission." [04:53] Gah. [04:53] Quoted from the bug. [04:53] So it's GPLed, but not. [04:54] Right. [04:54] bogus [04:54] is there a real licensevname fornthat sort of license setup? [04:54] Sure. "Crackful" [04:55] StevenK: Not strong enough. [04:55] excluding the fact that they are calling it gpl [04:55] Fujitsu: :-P [04:55] there is a creative commons license that covers their need [04:57] jmg: There is also a cluebat that probably covers their needs. [04:58] Okay, so they re-license it correctly, it still means it get booted, or punted to multiverse. But this still means it can't get fixed for released releases. [04:58] StevenK: Right. We're stuffed. [04:58] Debian has the same issue. [05:00] Debian's released pockets aren't absolutely frozen, are they? [05:00] There's no etch-updates, for example. [05:00] Debian can just completely remove undistributable software from release IIRC. [05:00] There hasn't been a case of an Ubuntu release pocket being modified, and it'd need some manual hackery if it were to be allowed. [05:00] I don't think it kills it from everything. [05:01] Yay. [05:01] Fujitsu: Sure there has, but it's ... special. dapper -> dapper.0, and then dapper.1 [05:01] Wasn't that just a respin of ISOs including dapper-{updates,security}? [05:02] Hrm. Maybe. I thought it also updated the release itself. [05:02] No. [05:02] Check the modified dates in dists/dapper === StevenK shrugs. Okay. [05:03] So, I guess we need to talk to archive people. [05:03] I think we need to subscribe ubuntu-archive to the bug, and ask for input. If they say no, we have to deal. === Fujitsu loves licensing issues. [05:06] Does somebody want to reject the Breezy tasks and accept the other two? [05:06] *task [05:07] Done. === thekorn [n=thekorn@a89-182-6-43.net-htp.de] has joined #ubuntu-motu [05:11] hmm.. any python guru feel like helping me debug my upload-to-remote-host-and-pbuild-the-dsc script? [05:11] ryanakca: I'm not much of a guru, but pastebin and I'll have a look. [05:13] http://pastebin.ca/609846 [05:13] It seems Debian doesn't ship linuxsampler at all. [05:13] you'll need python-deb822 [05:13] It was removed pre-Dapper. [05:13] And only existed for 6 months. === Fujitsu wonders why it wasn't removed during Dapper. [05:15] Does that mean we don't track Debian's removal? [05:15] Regarding linuxsampler: there's been lots of discussion upstream, but some members of the upstream team are sure that the current terms are 1) legal, 2) correct, and 3) what they want. Contrast the code with qsampler (which isn't so useful for us). [05:15] minghua: Only manually. [05:16] Fujitsu: it's based on http://orebokech.com/tmp/dscp and my irssi + libnotify script [05:16] minghua: We do now, but I'm not sure about pre-Soyuz. [05:16] ryanakca: I'm semi-lunching now, but almost done. [05:17] Fujitsu, persia: Is it done automatically with soyuz now? [05:17] Fujitsu: We do? How? Separately, how did we have so many orphans last time I checked? [05:17] persia: They do process Debian removals every so often. Anything !main isn't touched automatically, AFAIK. [05:18] (Debian main, not Ubuntu main) [05:18] Fujitsu: Ah. That makes sense. There are a couple main-only scripts, and that would match my experience. === Fujitsu wishes this was documented somewhere. [05:18] Fujitsu: Are you sure? Ubuntu main makes sense, Debian main doesn't. === persia looks at laptop-mode, exim, etc. === Fujitsu looks at the empty removals list on http://people.ubuntu.org.au/~fujitsu/motuscience/versions/#removedfromA [05:19] Fujitsu: I requested removals for everything crufty last week :) [05:19] I haven't seen any removals requested recently, and that list had some packages on it earlier. [05:20] Fujitsu: Some of the archive admins act without bugs as well, but I think it's still manual. [05:20] It's all secret, so I doubt we'll find out why that got missed, or what we have to do to prevent it. === persia recommends checking mdt every once in a while, especially between UVF and release === Fujitsu hacked rudimentary Debian removal support into mdt a few months back. === tru_`z24 [n=truz_`24@74-129-166-232.dhcp.insightbb.com] has joined #ubuntu-motu [05:23] persia: I managed to get cjwatson to process a sync sans bug yesterday. [05:23] StevenK: sync sans? [05:23] For sans, read 'without' [05:23] without :) === Fujitsu saw Mithrandir say the previous day they wanted the trail. [05:24] StevenK: Are build-deps on libcurl4-gnutls-dev OK nowadays? [05:24] StevenK: Right. I've had a few admins do that, but Mithrandir was noisy last time I made a request via IRC. [05:24] persia: I think it was a case of asking the right person at the right time [05:25] Fujitsu: uploading it with rsync works, it's just the pbuilder part. [05:25] StevenK: You mean, when nobody eise is watching? :) [05:25] ryanakca: Just finishing up lunch now, I'll look in a sec. [05:25] Fujitsu: Yes. libcurl4-gnutls-dev has been NBS good and hard, so it should pull in libcurl3 correctly. === ryanakca nods [05:25] persia: Something like that. :-) === Fujitsu syncs centericq. [05:26] ryanakca: Don't you need to sudo pbuilder? [05:26] persia: I think it was a little of special case, since I did the upload to Debian as well. [05:27] StevenK: Perhaps. My previous cases fell both into ones where I made a change in Debian, and ones where I had nothing to do with it. [05:28] RAOF: not if you have it setup as the wiki once showed [05:28] RAOF: hmm... where was it. [05:28] ryanakca: What error are you getting? [05:29] Fujitsu: none, pbuilder just doesn't start [05:29] Fujitsu: and I think I know why. I can't havi it start from my end, because pbuilder runs as root... it just hangs at the sudo prompt [05:29] pbuilder might also want a controlling tty. [05:29] StevenK: hmm.. [05:29] NOPASSWD may be your friend. === ryanakca scratches head [05:30] sbuild might also be your friend. [05:30] Or easier, add yourself to the sudo group. [05:30] (Which does the same thing as NOPASSWD, but doesn't involve learning RPN. :-) === Fujitsu grumbles. [05:31] Fujitsu: Hrm? [05:31] I don't like random never-before-heard-of people confirming bugs with no comment. [05:31] Ah === StevenK glances out the window. Sun?! What the? It was storming here about an hour ago. === StevenK runs off to get ... something for lunch. [05:33] Got any idea what you're getting? [05:34] Fujitsu: hmm. I guess I can set up a cron job to check /home/ryan/incomming every 2 minutes for a new .dsc... [05:34] (it didn't work with me as part of the sudo group) [05:35] Still hanging at the sudo prompt? === mohammad [n=mohammad@CPE001346f4a717-CM0011aea585d0.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #ubuntu-motu === minghua wonders if soyuz can implement "non ubuntu-dev member can change bug status, but must have a change description of at least 200 bytes." :-P [05:37] tonyyarusso ALL=(ALL) NOPASSWD:/usr/sbin/pbuilder,/usr/sbin/pdebuild [05:37] persia: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5922 has some license issues would you please kindly review it? === tonyyarusso pokes head in [05:37] oh yeah [05:38] Argh. ryanakca, ^^^ is something like what you want in sudoers [05:38] tonyyarusso: Sorry for summoning you accidentally :) [05:38] 'tis okay :) [05:38] mohammad: Sure, but why me? [05:39] StottK once reviewed it and told me that you know more about license issues and I have to ask you [05:39] mohammad: Also, how is that related to http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5923 ? [05:40] persia: [05:40] persia: yes [05:40] mohammad: Ah. That makes sense. Just in case you can't find a person, you might do as well next time with something like "Could someone please review URL ?, The last reviewer reported some license issues, and I'm stuck". [05:41] persia: OK sure :) === ryanakca nods [05:41] persia: thanks [05:41] RAOF: thanks [05:41] ryanakca: works? [05:42] RAOF: no, but it's a start :) [05:42] RAOF: I'll poke it again in the morning, I'll probably then better then === ryanakca --> bed [05:49] mohammad: Ummm.. This one's hard. Just for starters, is it possible to copyright the text of the Quran? Does upstream have attribution for the translations (I can't find them)? === Vorian [n=Steve@ubuntu/member/Vorian] has joined #ubuntu-motu [05:51] persia: I think one can copyright the arrangement if not the actual words (as one can do for databases for example). [05:51] Isn't Quran old enough for its copyright to expire in any part of the world? [05:51] minghua: That's what I thought. [05:51] persia: I suggested mohammad talk to you because I wasn't sure about some of the licenses that are combined in the package. [05:51] then what license do you suggest? [05:52] persia: ^ [05:52] ScottK: Depends on the jurisdiction. I'm most familiar with copyright in the US and Japan, and in both cases, one can copyright an assembly only if there is at least some original content (usually a foreword), and others may reuse the non-copyrighted material as they see fit. [05:52] Right. [05:52] It looked like a package that needed your touch. [05:54] mohammad: I'm fairly sure that the Quran itself is public domain, and does not require a license. The translations & transliterations may carry copyright: I'd suggest the authors contribute to PubDom to support promulgation. The application (and translated strings for the application) does well under a normal software license. I'm hunting now for some published opinions regarding Apache, Eclipse, and GPL. [05:55] Sounds a really complicated licensing situation... [05:55] It is. That's why I thought of persia. He seems to revel in this stuff. [05:56] minghua: It's not that different than the sword packages, really. === minghua takes note to stay away from sword packages as well. :-P [05:59] If any contributor familiar with ext2 wants an easy bug to turn into a sync request, bug 124839 is a good target (needs a bit of testing and a description cleanup). [05:59] Launchpad bug 124839 in e2fsprogs "Request Freeze Exception for E2fsprogs 1.40.1" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/124839 === man-di_ [n=mkoch@dyndsl-080-228-198-117.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has joined #ubuntu-motu === Fujitsu wonders which freeze? === StevenK appears. [06:00] StevenK: What've you found to ingest? [06:00] Pizza [06:00] Aw :( [06:00] Boring. === persia thought pizza was unhealthy [06:00] Fujitsu: DebianImportFreeze [06:00] Feel free to come up here and cook me something more interesting, then. :-P [06:00] persia: You say that like it's a bad thing. [06:01] ScottK: See the backlog [06:01] persia: Ah. I don't really know why it's called a freeze. [06:01] StevenK: it's a bit of a swim :) [06:01] Spoken like a true father of small children. === therealnanotube [n=nanotube@unaffiliated/therealnanotube] has joined #ubuntu-motu [06:01] persia: I was talking to Fujitsu. :-) [06:01] could someone please tell me about ubuntu package versioning conventions. e.g, if i have something with Version: "4.19-1ubuntu2.1", i understand that 4.19 is the actual software version, but what's the 1ubuntu2.1 stand for? [06:01] i want to package my software into an ubuntu deb, and i want to know how the versioning stuff goes... [06:01] i hope this is a good place to ask... :) [06:02] in fact, i was told on ubuntu-devel that this is the right place. :) [06:02] 1 is the Debian version, 2 is the Ubuntu version, and the .1 means a security or bugfix update post-release. [06:02] therealnanotube: This is a good place to ask, but we're really busy with off topic banter at the moment. [06:02] heh [06:02] so, if it doesn't have a debian version... is it a 0ubuntu1? [06:02] Right [06:02] correct [06:03] cool. :) thanks for the help. :) [06:03] That's about as good as "how am I supposed to hallucinate with all these swirling colours around." [06:03] in case anyone is curious, i'm planning on putting ubuntuzilla (http://pykeylogger.sourceforge.net/wiki/index.php/Ubuntuzilla) into a .deb for ease of use. === StevenK sighs. The potato gems are warmer than the pizza, and the gems are only lukewarm at best. [06:04] Argh, please, no. [06:07] mohammad: I've just checked with sword, and they typically use separate packages for text and software. The text is PubDoc (e.g. http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/changelogs/pool/universe/s/sword-text-tagalog/sword-text-tagalog_1.1-0ubuntu1/copyright), whereas the software is something else (e.g. http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/changelogs/pool/universe/g/gnomesword/gnomesword_2.2.3-1build1/copyright). [06:07] s/PubDoc/PubDom/ [06:07] ok, thanks everyone, i'm off to try to build my first .deb :) [06:07] therealnanotube: it would be a Very Good Idea to at least run the idea past asac, who maintains the Mozilla components. === DarkMageZ [n=richard@ppp59-167-174-104.lns4.syd6.internode.on.net] has joined #ubuntu-motu [06:08] crimsun: hm, well, at this point, i wasn't even planning on getting it included in universe or anything... though i suppose talking with someone who knows what he's doing is never a bad idea. :) [06:08] To get a new package from Debian at this point (it just made it out of Debian NEW), I just file a sync bug, right? === RAOF wonderes idly about helping package the new granparadiso upstream [06:08] therealnanotube: not to mention you will likely want to check the ubuntu-mozillateam's resources (IRC channel, mailing list, etc.) [06:09] ScottK: Right. It helps the admins make a decision id you can point at a cool new feature or something in the bug report. [06:09] persia: Does a package which is under pubdoman license go to universe repository? [06:09] Archive admins shouldn't contest syncs at this point just because there's no really good reason. [06:09] crimsun: well, all ubuntuzilla really does is install the mozilla-builds of ff, tb, and sm, without touching the repositories versions. so it's really kind of unrelated to the mozillateam. but again, probably wouldn't hurt to talk with them anyway. :) [06:10] Right. Someone wanted evolution-python and I rejected their needs-packaging bug because it was in Debian NEW already. [06:10] Thanks. [06:10] mohammad: Yes, but public domain doesn't need a license as it's not copyrighted. [06:10] I think that depends on whether the sync is a new upstream release or just new Debian revision. [06:10] It's a new package [06:10] Oooh. That means that conduit should be packaged soon :) [06:11] minghua: We've not passed UVF or NPFU, so that's irrelevant. [06:11] minghua: Not yet - that doesn't matter until UVF. At this point, it just needs someone to say it's good. [06:11] therealnanotube: the distinction that you seem to be missing is that if users file bugs on the firefox package using Launchpad but are in fact using non-Ubuntu packages, that's something very touchy. You _definitely_ want to coordinate with the ubuntu-mozillateam in that regard. [06:11] RAOF: Right. That's what someone said they wanted it for. [06:11] Fujitsu: Does NPFU == FF? [06:11] So I guess it is ok if I do not break software and Quran text to 2 separate packages ScottK Am I right? [06:11] persia: It was renamed from FF mid-Feisty. [06:11] Fujitsu, persia: Okay. I stand corrected. [06:12] ScottK: Well, there's a nice ITP for conduit on WNPP :) [06:12] crimsun: aha, i see. thanks for pointing that out, then. :) [06:12] mohammad: If it's public domain, yes. [06:12] crimsun: i suppose their irc channel is ubuntu-mozillateam ? [06:13] therealnanotube: IIRC, yes. [06:13] crimsun: cool. thanks for your helpful tips. :) [06:13] np. [06:13] mohammad: You still need to figure out about mixing GPL, Apache, and Ecplise licensed stuff in the same package. I hope persia will have a recommendation for you. [06:14] mohammad: It's OK to have one package: it just needs lots more documentation. Also, having separate packages may be interesting if anyone else wanted to implement a different Quran study tool (say for GNOME or KDE, rather than Jana). [06:14] s/Jana/Java [06:15] ScottK: I know that zekr has permission from the authors of some of the translations to use their translation in package zekr [06:15] "Free for non commercial use only. makarem.zip and kuliev.zip are authorized translations by the authors." [06:15] Ouch. [06:15] ok, that is non-free [06:15] mohammad: Ah. That's not a free license (discriminates by field of endeavour). That would have to be multiverse. [06:15] Unfortunately free for non-commercial use doesn't really qualify as free under the Ubuntu rules. [06:15] Muahahaha. That's a brillant quote. "all of you that believe in telekinetics, raise my hand!" [06:15] ScottK: Um, unfortunately? [06:15] ScottK: If zekr uses them, would you please let me know whether zekr will go to universe or multiverse? [06:15] StevenK: Heh. [06:16] mohammad: If it can't run without them, it'll be in multiverse. [06:16] Fujitsu: Unfortunately for getting his package in Universe. [06:16] mohammad: With that text, it needs to be multiverse. I'd still recommend a package split: zekr could be free software with different translations, and the original text is surely free. [06:17] ScottK: Ah, I guess so. [06:17] persia: OK I think I it is better to split it then. [06:18] mohammad: Also, someone might want to talk to the authors of the translations. I seem to remember some directive about teaching from the Quran to all, and "for non-commercial use only" seems to be in a different spirit. [06:19] hey Burgundavia long time no see [06:20] hey jsgotangco === Fujitsu ponders trying to hack a comment field into debcheck. === ScottK ponders going to bed. [06:24] ScottK: Which timezone are you in? [06:25] he's EDT (same as me; we're about 20 minutes from each other) [06:25] -0400 [06:26] crimsun: where are you headed that you will not have easy internet access? [06:26] persia: yes I think the spirit is as you said and some people do not agree to set a non-free license for the Quran Translations, but what we do? :) I think those translations are publishing in some countries and we have to ask for the authors' permissions. [06:26] Burgundavia: I'll be posted internationally. [06:26]