[12:18] <Megaqwerty> Okay, when trying to build a package with dpkg-buildpackage -S -rfakeroot , I get "gpg: [stdin] : clearsign failed: secret key not available" I do have a secret key, and I have already exported GPGKEY=39A34D3B (which is my key id)
[12:18] <Megaqwerty> any idea as to what I need to do to resolve this?
[12:40] <persia> I'm slow, but it's one of 1) GPG-agent not working due to missing variables, 2) incorrect email in key, 3) incorrect email in changelog, 4) incorrect email in DEBEMAIL, or 5) incorrect GPG configuration.  Perhaps the IRC log will be helpful to someone.
[12:55] <Megaqwerty> anyone?
[12:55] <persia> Megaqwerty: Sorry: I answered whist you were away.
[12:56] <Megaqwerty> ah, what was the answer?
[12:56] <persia> Megaqwerty: First, are you building source in feisty or gutsy?  If feisty, you may need to set some variables to get your gpg-agent to work.
[12:56] <Megaqwerty> feisty
[12:56] <crimsun> 18:40 < persia> I'm slow, but it's one of 1) GPG-agent not working due to missing variables, 2) incorrect email in key, 3) incorrect email in changelog, 4) incorrect email in DEBEMAIL, or 5) incorrect GPG configuration.  Perhaps the IRC log will be helpful to someone.
[12:57] <persia> Megaqwerty: OK.  That's probably it then.  Are you using seahorse, or gpg-agent as a GPG Agent?
[12:57] <gnomefreak> i dont think its gpg-agent
[12:57] <gnomefreak> nor seahorse
[12:57] <Megaqwerty> indeed
[12:57] <Megaqwerty> gnomefreak: is correct, I know not of either
[12:57] <gnomefreak> i have both both work fine feisty and gutsy
[12:57] <persia> gnomefreak: Really?  Do you have anything special in ~/.devscripts in feisty?
[12:57] <gnomefreak> i would make sure changelog is correct as set in your DEBEMAIL in ~/.bashrc
[12:58] <gnomefreak> persia: no nothing i changed
[12:58] <persia> Megaqwerty: OK.  Next, make sure that you have DEBEMAIL set, that it matches the last changelog entry, and that it matches one of the emails on your key.
[12:58] <gnomefreak> didnt even know that was created
[12:58] <Megaqwerty> sorry about that
[12:58] <persia> Megaqwerty: OK.  Next, make sure that you have DEBEMAIL set, that it matches the last changelog entry, and that it matches one of the emails on your key.
[12:59] <Megaqwerty> so... export DEBEMAIL=myemail in the end of .bashrc?
[12:59] <persia> Megaqwerty: That could work, but for troubleshooting, try just running export DEBEMAIL=<your email> in the terminal first.  If it works, adding it to .bashrc makes sense.
[01:00] <gnomefreak> assuming your not using bzr bd
[01:00] <gnomefreak> export GPGKEY=keyid would be helpful as well if its not already there
[01:01] <persia> gnomefreak: Already done :)
[01:01] <gnomefreak> i have 6 exports in ~/.bashrc and just going through them to make sure you have them :)
[01:02] <gnomefreak> 1 is ther eby default
[01:02] <gnomefreak> you better have 1;)
[01:02] <gnomefreak> export HISTCONTROL=ignoredups
[01:02] <Megaqwerty> I have exported the correct key
[01:02] <persia> gnomefreak: mine's commented out :)
[01:02] <gnomefreak> persia: ah
[01:03] <gnomefreak> im gonna assume no since i have 2 lines
[01:03] <Megaqwerty> well...that didn't work
[01:03] <Megaqwerty> (DEBEMAIL)
[01:04] <Megaqwerty> it is the same email in the changelog, and my gpg key
[01:04] <gnomefreak> persia: maybe you had added an email to your key?
[01:04] <crimsun> pastebin the uids from your key and the complete top changelog entry.
[01:04] <persia> Megaqwerty: Hmmm..  Could you try setting DEBEMAIL to be "Name in changelog <email>"?
[01:05] <gnomefreak> hint dont put anything in that setting but email
[01:05] <Megaqwerty> Ah, man I hate to go when I'm getting so much support, but I have to...I'll be back later, hopefully I'll get as much help as I am having now then.
[01:05] <Megaqwerty> bye.
[01:05] <persia> Megaqwerty: Good luck.
[01:05] <gnomefreak> i thought persia was having issues
[01:06] <persia> gnomefreak: Nope - things work great for me: I blame Mr. Kowalik :)
[01:11] <Megaqwerty> okay, so I forgot I have another hour :-\
[01:12] <Megaqwerty> So, I had just tried exporting DEBEMAIL and GPGKEY variables to no avail.
[01:13] <Megaqwerty> persia, gnomefreak, you guys still here?
[01:13] <crimsun> 19:04 < crimsun> pastebin the uids from your key and the complete top changelog entry.
[01:13] <persia> Megaqwerty: Great.  Does it work with the expanded DEBEMAIL setting?  If not, could you please put the last changelog entry and the uuids from your key in a changelog entry for examination?
[01:14] <Megaqwerty> persia: expanded? Oh, add my full name and <email> to the variable?
[01:14] <persia> Megaqwerty: Right.
[01:14] <minghua> Probably a DEBFULLNAME thing.
[01:15] <minghua> (and comments in GPG key id)
[01:15] <Megaqwerty> minghua: oh, I should declare DEBFULLNAME? 
[01:15] <persia> minghua: likely.  I always force that in DEBEMAIL, but that's just me.
[01:15] <minghua> Hello crimsun and persia BTW. :-)
[01:16] <Megaqwerty> nope, I'll just pastebin the requested info.
[01:16] <minghua> Megaqwerty: as crimsun said, paste your changelog entry and key uid in pastebin so that people can look.
[01:16] <crimsun> hello minghua 
[01:16] <persia> minghua: Good evening
[01:17] <EliasAmaral> In my computer /etc/init.d/rcS do not seem to be executed in initialization (it isn't in /etc/rc*.d), does anyone know why?
[01:17] <minghua> Megaqwerty: The point is to make the changelog entry and your gpg key id match, there are multiple ways to achieve it, DEBFULLNAME is one of them.
[01:17] <EliasAmaral> I executed stat /etc/rc*.d/*|grep init.d/rcS , it returns nothing
[01:18] <minghua> persia: Yeah, it always bother me that dpatch doesn't want to read DEBFULLNAME, maybe I should force it in DEBEMAIL, too.
[01:18] <EliasAmaral> (In contrast, stat /etc/rc*.d/*|grep init.d/urandom returns the correct links for urandom)
[01:18] <persia> EliasAmaral: You likely want a support channel.  I'd suggest checking in #ubuntu or #ubuntu+1 (depending on which release you use)
[01:18] <Megaqwerty> http://megaqwerty.pastebin.ca/619703
[01:19] <persia> minghua: Yep.  That was one of my motivations.
[01:19] <EliasAmaral> persia, you are right, sorry. i am asking here because apparently #ubuntu is so hight-traffic that nobody could see my question
[01:19] <persia> Megaqwerty: "(Repository Key" is missing in your changelog, or spuriously added to your key.
[01:20] <Megaqwerty> persia: what is the syntax for such?
[01:20] <persia> Umm...  " (Repository Key) "
[01:20] <Megaqwerty> Well...I mean, could you give me an example entry
[01:20] <minghua> Megaqwerty: As persia said.  Add "(Repository Key)" after your name in changelog can work around it.
[01:21] <Megaqwerty> okay
[01:21] <persia> Megaqwerty: You just need to make sure the name in the changelog (from DEBEMAIL when using dch) exactly matches the entire name in the gpg key.
[01:21] <Megaqwerty> I didn't realize you meant the comment
[01:21] <minghua> Megaqwerty: if you want dch/debchange to automatically generate a correct changelog entry for you, you need to adjust some other things.
[01:22] <EliasAmaral> There are a documentation about the inicialization of Ubuntu? I am reading http://qref.sourceforge.net/Debian/reference/ch-system.en.html and it says /etc/init.d/rcS must be executed
[01:25] <Megaqwerty> that did it, thanks
[01:25] <persia> Megaqwerty: Great.
[01:25] <Megaqwerty> minghua: how would I get dh_make to automatically do that for me?
[01:25] <Megaqwerty> minghua: or is that something I'll just have to change myself every time?
[01:25] <minghua> Megaqwerty: Not sure.  I personally object using dh_make, and don't know much about it.
[01:26] <Megaqwerty> minghua: haha okay.
[01:26] <minghua> Megaqwerty: for generate changelog entries after you've already done the initial packaging, you should use dch command.
[01:26] <minghua> Megaqwerty: dh_make doesn't help you after the initial packaging anyway (AFAIK).
[01:27] <Megaqwerty> minghua: no, I don't believe it does.
[01:29] <crimsun> EliasAmaral: lsb_release -r
[01:29] <EliasAmaral> crimsun, Release:        7.04
[01:29] <crimsun> EliasAmaral: ok, so $EDITOR /etc/event.d/rcS
[01:30] <EliasAmaral> ok
[01:30] <crimsun> Hint: read the upstart documentation.
[01:30] <EliasAmaral> ah. /etc/event.d is the config directory of upstart?
[01:31] <minghua> Yeah, and stop following everything on Debian Reference if you are using Ubuntu.
[01:32] <crimsun> it's absolutely useful if not absolutely relevant ;)
[01:32] <EliasAmaral> minghua, yeah, but.. i always installed / removed things in ubuntu initialization using the old initialization system. i don't know how to operate upstart (and never needed before today)
[01:34] <minghua> Hmm, I didn't know upstart has such compatibility with the init system on Debian.
[01:34] <EliasAmaral> update-rc.d and invoke-rc.d still works (ok, now you said that i am not sure..)
[01:35] <minghua> Which release did upstart become default?  Feisty?
[01:35] <Nafallo> edgy
[01:37] <crimsun> EliasAmaral: update-rc.d has nothing to do with it.  They manage sysvinit-style scripts.  Currently upstart provides sysvinit compatibility.
[01:37] <EliasAmaral> But sysvinit-style scripts doesn't form the init system on Debian?
[01:38] <crimsun> AFAIK they still do, but I don't pretend to follow current *init* dev in Debian.
[01:40] <minghua> I think sysvinit is still the default in unstable right now, but there are talks to change the init system.
[01:40] <minghua> Debian is usually slow on such kind of changes.
[01:42] <crimsun> right, I see http://wiki.debian.org/MetaInit, etc., from https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2007-June/023910.html
[01:48] <Jazzva> Hello... Do I need to provide the whole license (if it differs from GPL) in the debian/copyright, or just some part? This license in particular: http://www.statistica.unimib.it/utenti/dellavedova/software/artistic2.html
[01:50] <Jazzva> I see there is Artistic License in /usr/share/common-licenses, but this one is Clarified Artistic License :unsure:...
[01:51] <geser> Jazzva: the complete license text should be included in debian/copyright
[01:52] <persia> Jazzva: The easiest way to check is to run diff between the license included in the source and the license included in /usr/share/common-licenses.  If there are any differences, you need to put it all in debian/copyright.
[01:52] <Jazzva> geser, persia: Ok, thanks :).
[01:53] <Nafallo> CBL :-)
[04:17] <Fujitsu> Hi jdong.
[04:25] <jdong> hi Fujitsu 
[04:25] <jdong> long time no talk :)
[04:26] <jdong> how's life been around here?
[04:27] <Fujitsu> I've been rather busy with year 12 and work and various other things, so not as much Ubuntu time lately :(
[04:28] <jdong> ah
[04:29] <jdong> likewise; I've been pretty occupied with other stuff recently too
[04:29] <jdong> though my schedule is starting to return to normal again
[04:29] <jdong> not to mention I've started to Use The Dark Side (tm) more as I've been on the road...
[04:30] <Fujitsu> Noooooo.
[04:30] <jdong> lol
[04:30] <jdong> it's still *nix though ;-)
[04:30] <Fujitsu> OS X?
[04:30] <jdong> I will attempt a dual boot setup tomorrow for curiousity's sake, but initial research appears pretty iffy.
[04:31] <jdong> yeah, black macbook
[04:31] <Fujitsu> Ah.
[04:31] <jdong> it's an alright operating system
[04:31] <Fujitsu> So I've heard.
[04:31] <jdong> the one thing I really appreciate is how well suspend/resume works
[04:31] <jdong> quite literally it's done resuming before I can get the lid back up.
[04:31] <Fujitsu> They can manage that fairly well with their incredibly restricted hardware.
[04:31] <Fujitsu> Wow.
[04:31] <jdong> yeah, and I have resumed/suspended in excess of 50 times once, before rebooting for an update
[04:32] <jdong> sadly Ubuntu can't do that yet on any of my systems :(
[04:32] <jdong> but yeah, their full control over their hardware platform definitely makes this easy for them 
[04:33] <jdong> but on a trip when my main usecase is mapping software, the macbook is a clear winner...
[04:33] <Fujitsu> On the latest kernel my laptop has no problems, but it still takes a few seconds. On older kernels there would occasionally be issues like the LCD not turning on, PS/2 stuff being missing, etc.
[04:33] <jdong> i.e. open up every 30 minutes to look at map for 5 minutes
[04:33] <jdong> ah, that's very cool
[04:33] <jdong> my Ubuntu lappie has an ATI GPU, which is a major PITA for suspend
[04:33] <Fujitsu> Ah, I'm all Intel.
[04:33] <jdong> it has like a 90% success rate, but when it fails it hardlocks on resume :(
[04:34] <jdong> which tends to make me not trust suspend at all
[04:34] <jdong> I really want to give Ubuntu a shot on this macbook
[04:34] <jdong> just haven't found the time yet to deal with the install procedure
[04:35] <jdong> and also, OS X on this thing is Just Work (tm)ing , so I don't have terribly great motivation to change things radically
[04:36] <jdong> I want to get MOTU-ship before summer ends though
[04:36] <jdong> if that's the only thing I accomplish this summer...
[04:45] <TheMuso> StevenK: lol
[05:01] <TheMuso> Oh man. Managed to get myself shaped.
[05:02] <Hobbsee> oh dear
[05:02] <TheMuso> Well at least Ubuntu mirrors from my ISP are quota free, and hense at full speed.
[05:04] <Hobbsee> TheMuso: how big an allowance do you have?
[05:04] <TheMuso> Hobbsee: 20GB
[05:04] <TheMuso> Dropping to 10GB next month.
[05:04] <Hobbsee> sheesh
[05:05] <Hobbsee> and you managed to run thru that...
[05:05] <TheMuso> Unfortunately its not me who pays the biggest slice of the bill atm.
[05:05] <TheMuso> Twas CD images mostly. Gobuntu, and updating all other CD iages.
[05:05] <TheMuso> images even
[05:05] <Hobbsee> ahhh
[05:05] <Hobbsee> using rsync?
[05:05] <TheMuso> Yes.
[05:06] <Hobbsee> wow
[05:06] <TheMuso> But rsync doesn't magically make grabbing extra cds like the gobuntu cd, or the serveraddon cd for edubuntu smaller in download.
[05:06] <Fujitsu> TheMuso: Wouldn't most of gobuntu be the same as ubuntu?
[05:06] <TheMuso> Not to mention getting those cds for both i386 and powerpc.
[05:07] <TheMuso> Fujitsu: Yeah probably, I didn't think of that at the time however.
[05:07] <Fujitsu> Heheh.
[05:07] <Hobbsee> TheMuso: oh, true
[05:07] <Hobbsee> also, my ISP will tend to mirror the released cds, i fasked
[05:08] <TheMuso> Well thats alright for release CDs...
[05:08] <TheMuso> but dailies are another story.
[05:08] <Hobbsee> (and tribes)
[05:08] <Hobbsee> true
[05:08] <TheMuso> DOn't know if they will yet.
[05:08] <Hobbsee> no point in trying teh dailies yet anyway
[05:08] <TheMuso> I also requested they host the ports releases.
[05:09] <TheMuso> But its good to keep up.
[05:09] <Fujitsu> Hobbsee: Who are you with?
[05:10] <Hobbsee> Fujitsu: hellstra
[05:10] <TheMuso> At least the alternate CDs are usable.
[05:10] <Hobbsee> TheMuso: not if they're not acutally building properly
[05:10] <TheMuso> true.
[05:10] <Fujitsu> Hobbsee: Haha.
[05:11] <TheMuso> It would be nice to have a system to construct live CDs, like what jigdo does for alternates.
[05:15] <Fujitsu> You'd have to rebuild the squashfs locally.
[05:17] <xchat> Any MOTUs here willing to give some advice on modifications to a package on REVU?
[05:17] <TheMuso> Fujitsu: Yeah I know
[05:43] <TheMuso> Heya RAOF.
[05:43] <RAOF> Heya TheMuso 
[05:58] <StevenK> TheMuso: Whyfor laughing at me?
[05:58] <TheMuso> StevenK: Re-uploading those packages for the transition.
[05:58] <StevenK> Yeah, well.
[05:59] <Hobbsee> it's for the karma boost
[06:00] <StevenK> Uploads are still karma-less, aren't they?
[06:00] <StevenK> Fujitsu: Keep talking, I'm reloading.
[06:00] <Fujitsu> StevenK: Correct.
[06:01] <Fujitsu> Why?
[06:01] <Fujitsu> What has it done now,?
[06:01] <StevenK> Surely stuff that I uploaded at 12:10 should have published by now
[06:01] <Fujitsu> No...
[06:01] <Fujitsu> It'll be published in about 3 minutes, and head the mirrors by about 20 to.
[06:01] <Fujitsu> *head to
[06:01] <StevenK> But it should have hit the 1:05 publisher run?
[06:01] <Hobbsee> StevenK: i believe there's a spec on more karma for uploads :P
[06:02] <Fujitsu> StevenK: Sssh, quiet you.
[06:02] <StevenK> Hobbsee: And there has been for quite some time.
[06:02] <Hobbsee> needs shoving
[06:02] <Fujitsu> It's high priority, I think, but...
[06:03] <Fujitsu> Last action on it was "cprov 2006/06/22: issues clarified, back to 'review'"
[06:03] <Fujitsu> Isn't the encouraging?
[06:04] <Hobbsee> heh
[06:04] <Hobbsee> probably with the karma review?
[06:04] <Hobbsee> then again, i'd prefer him doing the ppa stuff than karma
[06:05] <Fujitsu> StevenK: It was published about a minute ago now.
[06:05] <Fujitsu> It seems the 0303Z publisher didn't do much.
[06:06] <StevenK> I was hoping they'd publish and build while I was lunching. That didn't happen.
[06:06] <Fujitsu> Soyuz is very reliable.
[06:06] <Fujitsu> I wonder if you'll have the luxury of having the buildmaster queue some builds for you this round?
[06:08] <StevenK> Hopefully.
[06:08] <Fujitsu> If cron.daily stuffs up the buildmaster often seems to sit around doing nothing for a while.
[06:09] <StevenK> That could be IPC screwing up.
[06:09] <Fujitsu> Possibly.
[06:09] <StevenK> (I'm guessing)
[06:09] <Fujitsu> I don't recall how they interact.
[06:15] <Fujitsu> Hah, bug #54946
[06:15] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 54946 in soyuz "buildd handling lives in ivory tower of perfect networks" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/54946
[06:15] <StevenK> Muahaha
[06:16] <Hobbsee> hahahahaha nice
[06:16] <ScottK> Good $TIME_OF_DAY all.
[06:16] <Fujitsu> Hi ScottK.
[06:17] <ScottK> 13 year old fell down the stairs and sprained her foot.
[06:17] <ScottK> Crutches for her now.
[06:17] <Fujitsu> Fun fun.
[06:17] <StevenK> Neat.
[06:17] <TheMuso> heh
[06:17] <StevenK> ScottK: How many stairs?
[06:18] <ScottK> She leaves for a two week camp tomorrow, so I wanted to be sure we knew what it was before she left.
[06:18] <TheMuso> ouch
[06:18] <StevenK> Last time I fell down the stairs, I put my foot through a window.
[06:18] <StevenK> (I was about eight)
[06:18] <TheMuso> ouch
[06:18] <ScottK> StevenK: Not sure.  It's a full flight.  Dunno where she was when she lost it.
[06:18] <StevenK> ScottK: She's okay aside from the sprain?
[06:18] <ScottK> Yeah.
[06:19] <StevenK> Sprained, and shaken, not stirred?
[06:19] <ScottK> She handled it remarkable well.  Very mature and controlled.  Didn't freak out at all.
[06:19] <ScottK> Yeah.
[06:19] <StevenK> Camp, with crutches. Fun.
[06:20] <ScottK> Yep.  Maybe she'll learn something about running on the stairs....
[06:20] <TheMuso> haha
[06:20] <Fujitsu> Heheh.
[06:20] <StevenK> Heh, maybe.
[06:20] <ScottK> Also, it's math/science camp.  It's more like going to University than camp.
[06:21] <StevenK> I'm bad when it comes to stairs. I will usually go up and down taking two at a time.
[06:21] <ScottK> You're legally an adult and responsible for your own actions, so whatever works for you.
[06:21] <ScottK> She's not, so ....
[06:21] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 62428 in soyuz "can't remove packages any more" [Undecided,Invalid]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/62428
[06:23] <StevenK> ScottK: You say that like you're sure. :-P
[06:25] <ScottK> Fujitsu: When I was in the Navy, I knew a guy that had done the same (hit is head) on a ship where the thing you hit is steel and been knocked unconcious with a concussion.
[06:25] <Fujitsu> Ow. This was just wood.
[06:26] <StevenK> Ouch. Bulkhead's *hurt*
[06:26] <Fujitsu> s/'//
[06:26] <StevenK> Hmph
[06:26] <ScottK> Yes.  I have hit my head on them, but not that hard.
[06:26] <StevenK> Fujitsu: I don't see how AS helps that mess. Also, yay for the magic numbers...
[06:27] <minghua> I think I fell down from stairs and was knocked unconscious once when I was very young, but I'm not so sure.
[06:27] <Fujitsu> StevenK: it means you don't have a million and one BinaryPackagePublishings.
[06:28] <joejaxx> geser: i added the total number of uploaders
[06:29] <joejaxx> currently there have been 206 people
[06:29] <joejaxx> who have uploaded to Gutsy
[06:29] <Fujitsu> That will be somewhat off due to multiple email addresses :(
[06:30] <joejaxx> Fujitsu: yeah i will have to fix that
[06:30] <joejaxx> hold on
[06:30] <Fujitsu> I know, you can use LP's excellent machine-parseable interface.
[06:30] <joejaxx> let me try something
[06:30] <Fujitsu> To work out which email address is owned by who.
[06:31] <joejaxx> Fujitsu: it is ok
[06:31] <joejaxx> i have a way :)
[06:32] <jdong> Fujitsu: there's a machine parseable interface?
[06:32] <Fujitsu> jdong: No, that would be too easy.
[06:32] <jdong> Fujitsu: don't excite me like that!
[06:32] <jdong> :P
[06:33] <StevenK> joejaxx: What about a top ten of who's uploaded?
[06:33] <minghua> It's probably a bit hard, if you count Changed-By, you count multiple addresses of the same person; if you count GPG keys, you miss sponsored uploads.
[06:33] <joejaxx> alright
[06:33] <joejaxx> the REAL number is 162
[06:33] <joejaxx> StevenK: that is already on there :P
[06:33] <Fujitsu> StevenK: That's already there..
[06:33] <StevenK> What's the URL?
[06:33] <StevenK> I forgot.
[06:33] <Fujitsu> ubuntu.joejaxx.org
[06:34] <joejaxx> let me run it again with the updated code
[06:34] <ScottK> Heya jdong.
[06:34] <StevenK> Hah! Number #4!
[06:34] <jdong> howdy ScottK 
[06:34] <ScottK> Archive admins haven't groaned yet.
[06:34] <jdong> thanks ScottK for your help with backports :)
[06:34] <joejaxx> ok updating
[06:34] <jdong> lol
[06:35] <jdong> just sit in -devel... you'll hear them groan on next archive day :D
[06:35] <jdong> I think my record is I pushed through like 30 in a week
[06:35] <ScottK> Funny thing I suddenly don't have any more backport requests pending.
[06:35] <jdong> and I got a good groan :D
[06:35] <joejaxx> jdong: :P
[06:35] <jdong> but ScottK 's probably beaten that record already
[06:35] <ScottK> No.
[06:36] <joejaxx> too bad i will never be on that list :\
[06:36] <jdong> good news is that my ruby-on-rails auto-triager is closer than ever to working
[06:36] <joejaxx> jdong: lol auto-triager?
[06:36] <ScottK> I may have done that many "Invalid - Backports is for feature requests.  Use the SRU process for bug fixing".
[06:36] <joejaxx> jdong: you are wrecking lp with that?
[06:36] <jdong> joejaxx: yeah, you fill out a simple form and the server attempts a build for you
[06:36] <jdong> joejaxx: and if it succeeds, spits out an APT repo with binaries
[06:37] <joejaxx> oh
[06:37] <StevenK> jdong: *Ouch* That's cool!
[06:37] <joejaxx> i thought you meant bug triager
[06:37] <jdong> it should filter out FTBFS and otherwise invalid backports
[06:37] <jdong> not to mention cut down on the whining of "when are packages gonna arrive?"
[06:39] <vorlon> in Singapore, I understand that's a caning offense
[06:39] <jdong> lol
[06:39] <ScottK> Careful, he might like that.
[06:39] <joejaxx> nixternal: when you get back ping me :)
[06:39] <StevenK> Singapore is a *fine* city.
[06:39] <joejaxx> caning?
[06:39] <ScottK> They do do that there.
[06:39] <StevenK> joejaxx: Thin rod they beat you with.
[06:40] <joejaxx> someone should come out with a book of rules for ever country
[06:40] <joejaxx> or that contains rules from every country rather
[06:40] <joejaxx> StevenK: oho k
[06:40] <joejaxx> oh ok*
[06:40] <StevenK> Actually, I have a shirt from Singapore that shows some of the offenses and punishments.
[06:41] <StevenK> Like, no dancing in public.
[06:43] <Fujitsu> jdong: What was it?
[06:43] <jdong> Me: "What SVN revision did you fix the bug in?"
[06:43] <jdong> Him: "err.... idn too lazy to check :D"
[06:43] <Fujitsu> Lovely.
[06:43] <jdong> upstream, rather.
[06:43] <jdong> :D
[06:43] <jdong> yay, now I get the excitement of reading svn changelogs from ktorrent
[06:43] <joejaxx> ok
[06:43] <joejaxx> the stats now correctly display the right number
[06:43] <joejaxx> 162
[06:45] <joejaxx> :)
[06:45] <joejaxx> so we have 162 people who have uploaded to gutsy up until this point
[06:45] <joejaxx> cool
[06:46] <jdong> cool
[06:46] <jdong> though I am pretty sure I won't include it in the public version
[06:46] <jdong> it won't be long before people just click every single upload for backports triage :D
[06:46] <joejaxx> backports webui?
[06:47] <jdong> a little thing in development :)
[06:47] <joejaxx> oh ok
[06:48] <jdong> one step closer to one-click backports
[06:49] <ScottK> jdong: We don't need MORE requests.  We need BETTER requests.
[06:49] <jdong> ScottK: I understand; but at least this way we don't have to spend 15 minutes on a request only to find out they don't build
[06:50] <jdong> Fujitsu: LOL
[06:50] <jdong> haha we could just have the buildd's do that :D
[06:51] <ScottK> My favorite so far was the GCC 4.2 backport request.  No risk there.
[06:51] <jdong> :)
[06:51] <minghua> Why?  Doesn't gcc-4.2 backport overwrites libgcc1 and libstdc++6?
[06:51] <jdong> if it didn't generate replacement library packages that weren't named -4.2, it would've worked :D
[06:51] <jdong> minghua: that's exactly what they do...
[06:52] <minghua> Good rule.
[06:52] <jdong> it is a good general rule :0
[06:52] <jdong> :)
[06:56] <StevenK> ScottK: But why won't you backport libc!?
[06:57] <ScottK> Because Mithrandir would book a flight, come to my house and eat me.
[06:57] <StevenK> Heh, yeah well.
[06:57] <ScottK> self preservation is a good motivator.
[06:58] <RAOF> Aww, crap.  Xgl FTBFS
[07:04] <ScottK> jdong: Got a minute to discuss backports triage policy?
[07:04] <jdong> ScottK: sure, go ahead
[07:05] <ScottK> I was thinking with the new bug status in LP...
[07:05] <ScottK> We could make Confirmed mean that the bug has the required information and meets the basic policy requirements - Is ready for testing.
[07:06] <ScottK> Then make Triaged mean that the bug has been tested and is thought to be ready to be ack'ed to the archive.
[07:06] <ScottK> Does that make sense?
[07:06] <jdong> yeah, that makes sense
[07:06] <StevenK> Maybe the other way around?
[07:06] <jdong> hmm...
[07:06] <jdong> actually...
[07:06] <jdong> the other way is probably better
[07:06] <StevenK> Triaged is "I've looked at it, and it has my rubber stamp" ; Confirmed is "Boot it into the archive"
[07:06] <jdong> because people understand already "Confirmed" to mean a successful build attempt
[07:08] <ScottK> Well in the heirarchy of LP, Triaged comes after Confirmed.  So that would be backwards of the progression Ubuntu uses.
[07:09] <ScottK> I agree it makes sense though if you think of the semantics of the actual words.
[07:09] <RAOF> What do people think about a new Xgl git snapshot to fix the stuff the new mesa has broken?
[07:09] <jdong> RAOF: aww that happened again? :(
[07:09] <ScottK> RAOF: What's it going to break?
[07:09] <jdong> ScottK: nothing
[07:09] <jdong> ScottK: Xgl git snaps don't affect anything outside of them
[07:09] <jdong> ScottK: I was pushing that the last release cycle
[07:10] <RAOF> jdong: Xgl doesn't build, due to mesa changes
[07:10] <jdong> when Xorg 7.1 broke Xgl into freeze
[07:10] <ScottK> Then I'd say go for it.
[07:10] <jdong> RAOF: I'd fully support that
[07:10] <jdong> RAOF: and I don't think anyone else would object
[07:10] <RAOF> So, git head, or cherry pick the minimal fix?
[07:10] <jdong> git head
[07:11] <jdong> there's usually enough merit in bugfixes to do that anyway
[07:11] <ScottK> lionel: Got time to do a test for backports?
[07:11] <ScottK> lionel: If you do, Bug #116458
[07:11] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 116458 in feisty-backports "Please backport gramps (2.2.8-1ubuntu1) from Gutsy to Feisty" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/116458
[07:12] <Fujitsu> Isn't Gutsy gramps broken at the moment?
[07:13] <RAOF> jdong: Can you remember offhand the git command to get _just_ Xgl from git?
[07:14] <jdong> RAOF: IIRC you needed to git clone git-clone git://anongit.freedesktop.org/xorg/xserver, then git checkout xgl-0-0-1
[07:14] <jdong> RAOF: let me check on that...
[07:16] <RAOF> Aaah, git checkout.  Of course
[07:16] <jdong> yeah, confirmed, clone all of xserver, then checkout xgl-0-0-1
[07:16] <ScottK> Fujitsu: That would be why I want someone to test it.
[07:19] <StevenK> Hrm. Aren't we due a new release of Launchpad in a few days?
[07:19] <Fujitsu> 17th or 18th, IIRC
[07:20] <Fujitsu> 18th it is.
[07:20] <Fujitsu> I see LP is getting mailing list support soon.
[07:21] <StevenK> Hrrm?
[07:21] <ScottK> Any idea awaits us with a new release of the management system the day before a Tribe release?
[07:21] <Fujitsu> There's a whole lot of mailing list specs targetted for 1.1.[78] 
[07:21] <Fujitsu> ScottK: Probably a lot of bug breakage.
[07:22] <ScottK> Handy having the bug system broken at release time.  Cuts down on the bugs we have to worry about.
[07:22] <Fujitsu> Yep.
[07:23] <RAOF> Why must git be impenetrable!
[07:24] <ScottK> Because Linus wrote it over a weekend when he was upset.
[07:25] <jdong> LOL
[07:25] <jdong> git and I didn't get off to a good start either
[07:26] <RAOF> Gah!  How am I supposed to check out xgl-0-0-1?  "git checkout xgl-0-0-1" in the xserver directory isnt the correct answer, apparently
[07:29] <ScottK> By doing it correctly comes to mind as an option ;-)
[07:30] <ScottK> Sorry.  Couldn't help it.
[07:30] <jdong> RAOF: checkout -f?
[07:32] <RAOF> jdong: "Did you intend to checkout 'xgl-0-0-1' which can not be resolved as commit?"
[07:34] <jdong> RAOF: try typing "GET LINUS" :D
[07:34] <jdong> RAOF: maybe try runnign checkout from ../
[07:35] <RAOF> "Not a git repository"
[07:38] <Amaranth> Fujitsu: arg, you got emerald removed
[07:39] <Fujitsu> Amaranth: I didn't remove emerald.
[07:39] <Amaranth> it went away
[07:39] <Fujitsu> That was before me.
[07:39] <Fujitsu> I don't recall who did it, though.
[07:39] <Amaranth> now i'll have to get it through NEW again
[07:40] <Fujitsu> Bug #124385
[07:40] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 124385 in emerald "Packages to remove from Gutsy" [Wishlist,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/124385
[07:40] <Fujitsu> Why do we want emerald, though?
[07:41] <RAOF> Because people can't be bothered trying to get engine support into metacity? :P
[07:47] <StevenK> Amaranth: Why do we need emerald?
[07:47] <RAOF> It's shinier than g-w-d
[07:47] <StevenK> Surely the CompComm people renamed it? :-)
[07:48] <Amaranth> StevenK: nope :P
[07:48] <Amaranth> and afaik we're going to be using it by default
[07:48] <RAOF> ??
[07:48] <StevenK> I was just cleaning up NBS
[07:48] <Amaranth> so we can get more 'tasteful' transparency on inactive window borders
[07:48] <RAOF> Won't that break Gnome themes?
[07:48] <Amaranth> actually 'readable' is the word i'm looking for
[07:48] <Amaranth> RAOF: apparently not important
[07:49] <Amaranth> i dunno, i have to talk to seb about it
[07:49] <jdong> what a surprise, sparc build of tomboy failed in backports
[07:50] <StevenK> Error reading from server. Remote end closed connection [IP: 91.189.89.6 80] 
[07:50] <StevenK> Hmph.
[07:50] <Amaranth> jdong: please backport compiz :)
[07:51] <jdong> sounds like fun
[07:51] <Amaranth> i'll help get it backportable if it's not now
[07:51] <Amaranth> i need to get people to stop using Trevinho's repos, they're crack
[07:51] <jdong> hmm what source packages are involved?
[07:54] <RAOF> Ah, thank god.  "git checkout origin/xgl-0-0-1" is the magical incantaition.  Now, off to make dinner for a dinner party!
[07:54] <jdong> lol
[07:54] <Amaranth> jdong: let me see
[07:56] <Amaranth> jdong: compiz, libcompizconfig, libcompizconfig-backend-gconf, compiz-fusion-plugins-main, compiz-fusion-plugins-extra, compizconfig-settings-manager
[07:56] <Amaranth> jdong: oh, and bcop
[07:56] <Fujitsu> I've seen quite a few bugs from Treviolately :(
[07:57] <jdong> Amaranth: bleh, those are all source packages? :(
[07:57] <Amaranth> jdong: yeah
[07:57] <Amaranth> the compiz-fusion guys push the modular thing to an extreme
[07:57] <ScottK> jdong: I'll let you do that one.
[07:57] <jdong> Amaranth: mmmkie
[07:57] <Amaranth> jdong: oh, and compizconfig-python
[07:58] <Amaranth> all the compizconfig stuff is split up into different tarballs to make the build system easier to work with
[07:58] <Amaranth> so they can use GNOME and KDE specific build stuff with the different backends
[07:59] <Amaranth> Fujitsu: ?
[07:59] <minghua> Fujitsu: Who is Trevio?
[07:59] <RAOF> But that's only at autogen time, right?
[07:59] <Amaranth> RAOF: no, libcompizconfig-backend-kconfig uses a full KDE build system
[08:00] <RAOF> Oh, right.
[08:00] <TheMuso> jdong: What about sbuild/LVM snapshots?
[08:00] <jdong> pbuilder-satisfydeps gets slower every release
[08:00] <jdong> TheMuso: that works too
[08:00] <Amaranth> RAOF: it does lots of magic to find Qt and KDE stuff
[08:00] <Amaranth> because they don't use pkg-config and every distro puts it in a different place
[08:01] <RAOF> jdong: Does gdebi parse the versions on the build deps now?
[08:01] <minghua> Does KDE3 use cmake?
[08:01] <jdong> RAOF: I'd expect not, but the subsequent debuild invocation by pbuilder to bomb out
[08:01] <RAOF> Amaranth: Ah, of course.  Why use standard dev tools?
[08:01] <jdong> which serves the same purpose
[08:01] <jdong> which would mean it's not necessarily all that faster
[08:01] <Amaranth> RAOF: well, pkg-config didn't exist at the time
[08:01] <jdong> if it coudl potentially go unpack 300MB of packages then figure out one is not the right version!
[08:02] <Amaranth> RAOF: and only like 3 guys know how the whole damn KDE3 setup works
[08:02] <Amaranth> minghua: no, only KDE4
[08:02] <RAOF> Heh
[08:02] <minghua> Amaranth: Thanks.
[08:03] <jdong> wheee
[08:03] <jdong> http://18.96.7.12:3000/inventory/view_log/37#end
[08:03] <jdong> it seems to be building okay
[08:03] <Amaranth> yay the libwnck dependency was relaxed
[08:04] <Amaranth> jdong: compiz builds compiz, compiz-core, compiz-gnome, compiz-kde, and compiz-plugins
[08:04] <jdong> ah, ok, that make sense
[08:04] <Amaranth> so it needs gconf and all it's deps and kdebase-dev
[08:04] <jdong> alright ,all you debian architects out there
[08:05] <Amaranth> which basically pulls in KDE
[08:05] <jdong> the enxt thing we need are metasource packages :D
[08:05] <jdong> that pull in a bunch of source packages for build :D
[08:05] <Fujitsu> Amaranth: There is (well, was) beryl-settings, beryl-settings-simple, beryl-settings-bindings... I've got no idea why they were split.
[08:06] <Fujitsu> minghua: The creator of a legendary sources.list involved dozens of unofficial breakage-prone repositories.
[08:06] <jdong> Fujitsu: doesn't he also maintain the automatic svnbuild repos of all the eyecandy?
[08:06] <minghua> Fujitsu: I see.  I still have that skull wallpaper. :-)
[08:06] <Amaranth> The one that got lots of people mad when someone noticed their repo in there and locked you to a skull and crossbones wallpaper.
[08:06] <Amaranth> heh
[08:06] <Fujitsu> minghua: That's the one.
[08:06] <Amaranth> jdong: yeah
[08:07] <jdong> that was even incompatible with the other 3rd party eyecandy repos?
[08:07] <jdong> ah, that one :)
[08:07] <jdong> I think he's in one of my sources.lists
[08:07] <Amaranth> His compiz packages include wacky junk like making dropdowns translucent (which breaks java apps) and copy-mode rendering (which breaks ABI from upstream)
[08:07] <Fujitsu> And then everybody said we should banish [owner of the skull wallpaper repo]  from the community for being evil.
[08:12] <Fujitsu> Darn.
[08:12] <jdong> Amaranth: bad news on wnck :(
[08:12] <jdong> http://18.96.7.12:3000/inventory/view_log/37#end
[08:12] <jdong> FTBFS
[08:12] <Amaranth> jdong: yeah, already saw
[08:13] <Amaranth> i wonder what trevinho does
[08:13] <jdong> Amaranth: err, IIRC he ships wnck
[08:13] <Amaranth> uh
[08:13] <Amaranth> the wnck you'd need has a different ABI
[08:13] <jdong> Amaranth: has anyone told him that? :D
[08:15] <Amaranth> ah, our old patch
[08:15] <Amaranth> #define wnck_window_get_geometry wnck_window_get_client_window_geometry
[08:15] <jdong> mmm.
[08:16] <Amaranth> i guess i'll have to get mvo to stick that back into our package
[08:16] <Amaranth> unless i can find another core-dev to do it for me :)
[08:16] <Amaranth> wait, that's the wrong way around :P
[08:16] <Amaranth> how the hell...
[08:17] <Amaranth> ((type=Menu | PopupMenu | DropdownMenu | Tooltip | Notification | Combo | Dnd | name=sun-awt-X11-XWindowPeer) | (type=Normal &amp; override_redirect=1)) &amp; !(name=sun-awt-X11-XFramePeer | name=sun-awt-X11-XDialogPeer)
[08:17] <Amaranth> *stab*
[08:18] <ScottK> Fujitsu: Have you got a moment to look at a conflicting packages bug that has me stumped.
[08:21] <ScottK> Nevermind.  I think I figured it out.
[08:54] <ScottK> jdong: You still around?
[09:05] <StevenK> Hmph.
[09:05] <StevenK> Please don't suck up 1.3Gb of RAM, g++
[09:21] <ScottK> Well, clamav 0.91 is uploaded.  Let's hope the didn't mess up the new release too badly...
[09:23] <ScottK> StevenK: Would you by chance be able to have a look at Bug #125865?  I thought I understood what was wrong, but I'm now totally confused and fried (it's gone 3AM here already).
[09:23] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 125865 in qt4-qtruby "error when installing libqt0-ruby1.8-qt4 and libqt4-ruby at the same time" [Medium,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/125865
[09:34] <ScottK> OK.  Well I guess not.
[09:34] <ScottK> Good night everyone (anyone).
[10:53] <minghua> Good for bandwidth bill. :-)
[10:54] <Fujitsu> Upstream isn't counted, fortunately.
[11:02] <persia> Fujitsu: As a side thought, perhaps having only the main page be acceptable to index might be good: it would allow "Ubuntu QA Report" to likely show up well, without churning through all the links to the generated data.
[11:05] <Fujitsu> persia: Right, I didn't exclude the root.
[11:07] <minghua> persia is as polite as a Japanese. :-)
[11:08] <Fujitsu> persia: It was a fairly valid presumption, I almost didn't think of it.
[11:09] <minghua> persia: You are not a native Japanese, aren't you?
[11:10] <persia> minghua: No, I just tend towards cultural flexibility, where feasible
[11:15] <persia> Fujitsu: If you do, take the Melbourne -> Tokyo flight, as the change in Sydney is really poorly managed (in my experience)
[11:38] <gnomefreak> anyone know if our libpng... supports animated png images?
[11:39] <Fujitsu> gnomefreak: You probably want libmng
[11:39] <gnomefreak> hmmmm
[11:40] <Fujitsu> Ah, I see libpng has very basic mng support
[11:40] <gnomefreak> that could be a problem but a good idea just hope -trunk likes it rather than using --enable-png
[11:46] <minghua> I doubt gnomefreak meant MNG.
[11:47] <minghua> The mozilla people are extending the PNG format for a new animated image format, APNG is the name I think.
[11:47] <gnomefreak> firefox 3.0 enabled animated png and it FTB with our libpng package along with --enable-png
[11:47] <gnomefreak> minghua: that would be it
[11:47] <gnomefreak> but we dont have APNG 
[11:48] <gnomefreak> but i thought libpng supported APNG (maybe not enough for firefox
[11:49] <minghua> gnomefreak: I doubt it.  Unless ubuntu is using a different libpng package than the Debian one.
[11:50] <gnomefreak> im looking at them now but i might have been mistaken
[11:50] <minghua> I heard libpng people were not happy with the Mozilla people's change.
[11:52] <gnomefreak> it seems mozilla has changed alot in granparadiso that we cant use and its starting to get annoying
[11:53] <Fujitsu> ?
[11:53] <gnomefreak> well if i get time maybe patching this to regress back to stable firefox as far as png and cairo is concered
[11:53] <Kmos> persia: bug 99393
[11:53] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 99393 in vmware-player "Please update vmware-player to version 2" [Wishlist,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/99393
[11:54] <persia> Kmos: What about it?
[11:55] <Kmos> persia: i don't think it's in progress
[11:55] <Kmos> i've subscribed mvo
[11:55] <persia> Kmos: OK.  #ubuntu-bugs is probably a better place to discuss bug status.  Why ask me?
[11:56] <Kmos> nothing in concrete
[11:56] <Kmos> you're a motu, right
[11:56] <Kmos> maybe you can package it :)
[11:56] <persia> Kmos: It's better to ask the channel in general, rather than a specific person, unless there is a concrete reason.  This improves your chances of getting the right person's attention.
[11:57] <Kmos> i added a comment
[11:57] <persia> Kmos: With regards to vmware: it was waiting on updated kernel modules, which I haven't seen yet (although I hasn't looked in the last couple weeks).
[11:58] <Kmos> jcamp@vmware.com
[11:58] <Kmos> he's from vmware :)
[11:58] <gnomefreak> Kmos: i changed tag to get it more attention
[11:59] <persia> Kmos: Also, while MOTUs can package, most of us are very unlikely to respond to packaging requests in IRC, unless we have a specific interest in the package.  We also very much appreciate assistance: e.g. a sample (tested) upgrade package on REVU, etc.
[12:00] <Kmos> persia: ok
[12:01] <Kmos> gnomefreak: nice
[12:02] <gnomefreak> also asked if Jay was gonna package final 2.0
[12:02] <man-di_> persia: status update: eclipse is progressing slowly
[12:02] <persia> man-di_: Thanks.  Good luck with it.
[12:02] <man-di_> persia: I really need luck...
[12:03] <persia> man-di_: Is it that broken?  Should we consider attempting to revert to the older version?
[12:03] <man-di_> its not that broken
[12:03] <persia> Ah, good :)
[12:04] <man-di_> its just that the latest ecj update broke another part...
[12:04] <man-di_> I expect to have a debdiff later today
[12:04] <man-di_> persia: I would like to do an upload to debian and then merge this one to gutsy
[12:05] <man-di_> persia: as both distros are broken in the same way
[12:05] <persia> man-di_: Can we do that?  I thought that the control file needed to be regenerated for Ubuntu.
[12:06] <man-di_> persia: that is why a merge is needed, and not a sync
[12:06] <persia> man-di_: Ah.  Sorry: I misread "merge" as sync.  Sounds good.
[12:07] <man-di_> the whole problem began because I filed a sync request ... I dont wanna repeat this fault
[12:11] <persia> man-di_: It's probably good in the long run: it's better to find the larger issue from the small mistake, as otherwise it just festers...
[12:14] <man-di_> right
[12:14] <man-di_> the good thing is that I found the ecj build issue, otherweise eclipse would be NBS now (and I dont know if thats tested so often)
[12:16] <persia> man-di_: I think the NBS reports are run every 6 hours or so, but I'm not absolutely sure.  Having eclipse NBS would be a little odd :)
[12:17] <man-di_> every six hours? eclipse alone takes 2 hours to build here
[12:18] <man-di_> aah, NBS is only checking build dependencies, not actively building packages
[12:19] <persia> man-di_: Not even build-dependencies.  I think it's something similar to quinn-diff, but only seeking NBS (at least I've not heard about ARBA, etc. in Ubuntu).
[12:20] <Kmos> persia: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ipkungfu/0.6.1-4
[12:20] <Kmos> can i release a fix for the package with name 0.6.1-0ubuntu1 
[12:20] <Kmos> ?
[12:20] <Kmos> it doesn't use ubuntu name
[12:22] <man-di_> persia: ah okay
[12:22] <man-di_> persia: thx
[12:23] <persia> Kmos: Firstly, as said before, you'll get better response (even from me) by asking the channel.  I'm likely to stop responding to specific requests soon :)  Secondly, without looking, I'd think that 0.6.1-4ubuntu1 would be a better choice.  You probably want to check with the defauly behaviour of dch -i (which you should be using for changelog updates), or perhaps dpkg --compare-versions.
[12:23] <Kmos> persia: ok :) thx
[12:41] <minghua> Err... It's not even Sunday morning here yet.
[12:42] <TheMuso> Thats one thing about the world that I still find fascinating.
[12:43] <persia> minghua: Not my fault if you live in an odd time zone :)  By my count, we've 49 hours until it's Tuesday in American Samoa
[12:44] <minghua> Fair enough.
[12:45] <minghua> Let those nice MOTUs at Kiribati go rolling, I'm going bed. :-P
[12:50] <persia> For those amused by such things, http://www.google.com/search?q=what+time+is+it+in+Niue%3F and http://www.google.com/search?q=what+time+is+it+in+Kiritimati%3F seem the easiest way to generate the appropriate times.
[01:42] <Fujitsu> Ah, another one of mine.
[01:42] <Fujitsu> (no, I haven't uploaded the rest this time)
[01:44] <StevenK> If quantlib-swig can take 2 and a half hours for one g++ command, I don't want to build it.
[01:44] <Fujitsu> Heheh.
[01:45] <StevenK> And with g++ taking up 1.2Gb of RAM, too.
[01:45] <TheMuso> StevenK: ouch
[01:58] <Hobbsee> persia: oh no, revu day!
[01:59] <persia> Hobbsee: Yep.  Only 47 hours left, so hurry :)
[02:00] <man-di_> when will be next MOTU Council meeting?
[02:00] <TheMuso> man-di_: THe motu council never meet.
[02:00] <man-di_> TheMuso: never?
[02:01] <TheMuso> man-di_: No.
[02:01] <man-di_> TheMuso: doesnt the motu concil decide about new motus?
[02:01] <TheMuso> man-di_: Yes.
[02:01] <TheMuso> Via email
[02:01] <man-di_> aah, I thought irc meeting
[02:01] <TheMuso> Nope.
[02:01] <man-di_> okay
[02:01] <man-di_> thanks
[02:01] <TheMuso> Mainly due to the fact that they are all in different timezones, and meeting can be difficult.
[02:02] <TheMuso> np
[02:02] <persia> TheMuso: There may be special, unofficial meetings, but nothing is ever officially decided in those.
[02:03] <TheMuso> persia: Right.
[02:29] <Jazzva> Umm, if I'm submitting a new package to REVU, and there is already an Ubuntu package somewhere out there, do I have to make it from source, or can I just submit the existing package with some corrections?
[02:29] <Jazzva> Also, since it's REVU day, there is a package I submitted few days ago: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=6010 :). Thanks for reviewing
[02:29] <persia> Jazzva: Are your changes a new upstream version, or just packaging changes (dependencies, patch, etc.)?
[02:30] <Jazzva> persia: Packaging changes, just to make it ok with the policy :).
[02:32] <persia> Jazzva: In that case, you probably will get a faster response by attaching a debdiff to a bug.  See the "Preparing New Revisions" section of https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing for some guidelines, and an explanation of the process.  Ask here if you have any questions.
[02:34] <Jazzva> persia: Hmm, but the package isn't in the repos yet. I meant there is already an Ubuntu package, but somewhere on the net.
[02:35] <persia> Jazzva: Ah.  My misunderstanding then.  REVU is the way to go: I'd recommend getting in touch with the person who created that package, as they may be willing to help.
[02:35] <persia> Hobbsee: It's REVU day, so there's a good chance you can get it in if you do.
[02:36] <Hobbsee> well, i'd have to *create* one first.
[02:36] <Hobbsee> and it'd have to be a new package, as anything else i can just straight upload
[02:36] <TheMuso> something weird just happened with my setup here...
[02:36] <persia> TheMuso: ?
[02:36] <Kmos> Hobbsee: bug 29733
[02:36] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 29733 in flite "flite: upstream released 1.3-release 6 months ago" [Wishlist,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/29733
[02:36] <Kmos> try this one :)
[02:36] <TheMuso> persia: Dunno. I just lost connectivity between all machines.
[02:36] <Hobbsee> no, no, me dumping stuff on REVU.  not taking stuff off it
[02:37] <persia> TheMuso: Very odd.  Any recent updates?
[02:37] <Hobbsee> Kmos: besides, going thru your package would require a fine toothed comb, iirc.
[02:37] <TheMuso> persia: No. Anyway, back on now.
[02:37] <persia> Hobbsee: Right.  If you dump things, and annouce them, we're more likely to advocate today than other days :)
[02:37] <Jazzva> persia: Did that. I'm already building it from source, but then I got a question am I using the package they provided. I think I read somewhere that if it's a new package then it has to be built from source (but maybe I just imagined that :)).
[02:38] <Hobbsee> persia: :P
[02:38] <persia> Jazzva: Yes.  Packages in the repositories must be built from source.
[02:38] <Kmos> Hobbsee: toothed comb ?
[02:38] <Kmos> what's that
[02:38] <Hobbsee> Kmos: ie, i'd have to go through it very carefully
[02:38] <Jazzva> persia: Thanks :D. That's what I needed...
[02:39] <Hobbsee> ScottK: and at the new LP the day before release?  nothing, i hope.
[02:42] <TheMuso> Hobbsee: What are you wanting to get in?
[02:42] <Kmos> Hobbsee: just do it from scratch
[02:42] <Hobbsee> TheMuso: nothing, i was joking :P
[02:42] <TheMuso> Hobbsee: Oh ok.
[02:43] <Hobbsee> still, a package that will write my resume for me will be appreciated...
[02:43] <Hobbsee> and do any interviews...
[02:44] <persia> Hobbsee: Don't we already have some chatbots in the archive for the interviews?  A tool to draft your CV probably needs a new package.
[02:44] <Hobbsee> persia: hmmm... :)
[02:44] <Hobbsee> pity
[02:47] <Hobbsee> Kmos: true.  that's what i'd likely have to do.  and i'd prefer to do other things.
[02:52] <Kmos> Hobbsee: you can try to flite one from scratch.. i haven't created a package with sucess for it.. some errors on compile because of some PDA code
[02:52] <Hobbsee> Kmos: oh right, so it's not ready for sponsorship anyway
[02:53] <Kmos> no
[02:53] <Kmos> http://www.speech.cs.cmu.edu/flite/doc/flite_4.html#SEC7
[02:53] <TheMuso> I'd be happy to lend a hand somewhere, as it is a package I care about somewhat.
[02:53] <TheMuso> Even though it does sound quite crap compared to other synths around.
[02:54] <Kmos> TheMuso: bug 126106
[02:54] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 126106 in ipkungfu "ipkungfu script uses wrong shell interpreter" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/126106
[02:54] <Kmos> i've attached a debdiff
[02:54] <Kmos> :)
[02:54] <TheMuso> Kmos: I am referring to flite.
[02:55] <Kmos> :-)
[02:56] <Kmos> this ipkungfu is easy one.. just a little patch
[02:56] <Kmos> to change /bin/sh to /bin/bash
[02:56] <Hobbsee> why not just fix the bashisms?
[02:56] <Hobbsee> that's the usual protocol for such things
[02:57] <Kmos> it's in bash
[02:57] <Kmos> but the author use /bin/sh on first line of init.d scirpt
[02:57] <Kmos> script
[02:57] <Hobbsee> yes, i realise that, but why not change the bashisms so it actually runs wiht /bin/sh?
[02:57] <ScottK> Hobbsee: I hope not too.  The last one doesn't encourage, but we'll see.
[02:58] <Hobbsee> ScottK: with any luck, the cds will be built before the rollout, and we wont have to respin.  but, we'll see
[02:58] <Kmos> Hobbsee: it's more easy to change all the code to work with sh or just change one line ?
[02:58] <Kmos> and the ipkungfu script is in bash
[02:58] <man-di_> Kmos: nobody said you should go the easiest way
[02:59] <Kmos> man-di_: yeah. but the standard author way =)
[03:00] <Hobbsee> er, i may be incorrect here....but, is that run during boot, where the only shell available is sh?
[03:00] <Hobbsee> or, possibly run during boot, where /bin/sh is the only script?
[03:01] <persia> Hobbsee: Depends on which runlevel: probably not.
[03:01] <Hobbsee> i'm not sure where bash actually kicks in
[03:01] <Hobbsee> persia: right
[03:01] <persia> Kmos: If I remember correctly, policy states that all init scripts must execute with /bin/sh
[03:03] <Kmos> persia: so why mysql uses bash at /etc/init.d ?
[03:04] <persia> Kmos: Perhaps it's not compliant with the latest policy?  Alternately, my memory could be incorrect.
[03:05] <Kmos> most of them are sh
[03:05] <Kmos> but mysql is bash
[03:06] <Hobbsee> or perhaps because it hastn been changed yet
[03:07] <Kmos> i'm changing it to sh
[03:07] <Kmos> =)
[03:07] <Kmos> so will attach soon another debdiff
[03:15] <persia> Jazzva: 6010 commented.
[03:15] <Kmos> there is something to validate sh code of bash code ?
[03:15] <persia> Kmos: /bin/sh
[03:16] <StevenK> dash -n will give a pretty good idea.
[03:16] <TheMuso> Night folks.
[03:17] <StevenK> That won't catch everything, like bashism variable interpolation.
[03:17] <Hobbsee> night TheMuso 
[03:17] <StevenK> persia: Perl has similar, -c
[03:19] <Kmos> persia: if i do /bin/sh script.sh, it will give me errors if it has bash instructions ?
[03:19] <persia> I've always used -w.  -c is much nicer.
[03:19] <StevenK> -w and -c do different things.
[03:19] <Kmos> ok
[03:19] <persia> Kmos: It should (/bin/sh should be a link to dash).  You can force /bin/dash if you like.
[03:20] <persia> StevenK: Very much so :)
[03:20] <StevenK> -c only parses it.
[03:20] <jpatrick> raphink: ping
[03:21] <Q-FUNK> I was comparing https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Hopeful/Recruitment and http://www.ubuntu.com/community/processes/newmember/  but I'm confused as to which one I'm supposed to follow.
[03:21] <Q-FUNK> Especially seeing as most of my work is doen on the Debian side of things.
[03:22] <Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: is that ubuntu membership, vs motu?
[03:22] <jpatrick> Q-FUNK: you need to be a member first, in order to become an MOTU (iirc)
[03:22] <persia> jpatrick: No such restriction, although it's easier to become a member than a MOTU, and working with MOTU is a good way to show contributions towards membership.
[03:23] <jpatrick> persia: ok, got it, haven't been around for a while :)
[03:24] <Hobbsee> jpatrick: i believe it used to be that way :P
[03:24] <persia> jpatrick: No worries.  In practice, you're correct, as anyone who would be considered an acceptable MOTU must meet the requirements as an acceptable member as well.
[03:24] <Q-FUNK> I'm mainly wondering whether I need to show up at any IRC meeting.  oen metions that everything is done by e-mail, the other seems more involved.
[03:24] <jpatrick> Hobbsee: I found something to do, but I need to earn my MOTU powers back
[03:24] <Hobbsee> jpatrick: oh, you revoked them?  damn
[03:25] <jpatrick> Hobbsee: No, I was considered "inactive"
[03:25] <Hobbsee> jpatrick: darn.  there's a techboard meeting in a copule of days
[03:25] <Hobbsee> but they may require proof that you're the actual jpatrick, etc
[03:25] <StevenK> Fujitsu: I think I have a cassette deck older than you. :-P
[03:25] <jpatrick> Hobbsee: cloak? lol
[03:26] <Hobbsee> jpatrick: probably an encrypted mail, etc.
[03:26] <Hobbsee> jpatrick: anywya, if you need sponsorship, you're welcome to it
[03:26] <StevenK> Signed would do it, I think
[03:26] <StevenK> Since signing requires the private key
[03:26] <Hobbsee> StevenK: then again, they were wanting \sh to actually present himself at a conference, when they were being very pedantic
[03:26] <jpatrick> Hobbsee: first, I need to find a REVU admin that's still around
[03:26] <Hobbsee> jpatrick: what for?
[03:26] <Q-FUNK> adding to the confusion, I already signed the code of conduct.  it's listed on my launchpad page.
[03:27] <jpatrick> Hobbsee: forgot old key's pass :( made a new one
[03:27] <persia> Q-FUNK: That's a good first step: you'd need to have done that for either application.
[03:27] <Hobbsee> jpatrick: as in, new key?
[03:27] <StevenK> Oh my stars! arb fails to build because our gcc is not one of x listed versions.
[03:27] <persia> jpatrick: Is your new key on LP Yet?
[03:27] <jpatrick> persia: yep
[03:27] <Fujitsu> StevenK: Niice!
[03:27] <Hobbsee> jpatrick: throw it on revu, be in the ubuntu-universe-contributors team, and i'll resync.
[03:27] <Hobbsee> i dont think that was there, during dapper...iirc, the keys were done manually
[03:28] <Q-FUNK> I think thereneeds to be a cleanup.  between ubuntero, member, core dev and motu - too many categories and a not so clear poitn of entry.
[03:28] <jpatrick> Hobbsee: joined
[03:28] <persia> Hobbsee: Yep, it was manual then.
[03:28] <Hobbsee> oh yes, that's right, and ajmitch had a go at me for it.
[03:28] <Fujitsu> Q-FUNK: They are all very well defined...
[03:28] <eagles0513875> persia: u identified dude cuz i got a question and i dont want to take the channel off topic
[03:28] <Hobbsee> eagles0513875: /whois him....
[03:29] <eagles0513875> Hobbsee: ?
[03:29] <Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: shouldnt be that complicated, is all explained under !contribute
[03:29] <persia> Q-FUNK: That's partially intentional.  The only restrictions in place are that you must be ubuntero to join most closed teams (code of conduct), and that you must be motu to be core-dev.  membership is parallel.
[03:29] <Hobbsee> eagles0513875: to see if he's identified or not
[03:29] <Q-FUNK> Fujitsu: i don't think i would be asking for clarification if things were so well defined. :)
[03:29] <eagles0513875> ahhh ok  ty Hobbsee
[03:30] <persia> eagles0513875: Are you sure it needs to be me?  For most things, asking in the channel would be better :)
[03:30] <Q-FUNK> persia: see, from the outside, the order appears to be ubunttero -> motu -> dev -> core-dev
[03:30] <persia> Q-FUNK: That would be correct.
[03:30] <Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: dev wasnt in your original lsit
[03:30] <StevenK> motu and dev are the same
[03:31] <StevenK> motu == ubuntu-dev
[03:31] <Hobbsee> where motu also includes the core devs
[03:31] <jpatrick> Hobbsee: I don't remember being a core dev..
[03:31] <persia> Q-FUNK: Right.  Sorry.  Drop "dev".  ~ubuntu-dev ~ MOTU + core
[03:31] <Hobbsee> i thought they were depreciating the term MOTU
[03:31] <Hobbsee> jpatrick: no, i meant in the future
[03:32] <persia> Hobbsee: No, MOTU is still used, it's just not appropriate to describe developers, but rather the team that cooperates here.
[03:32] <Hobbsee> ah right, so they're depreciating ubuntu-dev
[03:32] <jpatrick> Hobbsee: well I have two months free for now, then I got "study, study, study" according to what everyone says
[03:32] <eagles0513875> persia: im afraid it would take the channel off topic
[03:32] <Q-FUNK> so, unclear entry point and unclear whether I need to show up for an IRC meeitng as per http://www.ubuntu.com/community/processes/newmember/ or whetehr e-mail is enough as per https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Hopeful/Recruitment
[03:32] <eagles0513875> persia: but if u insist
[03:32] <Hobbsee> jpatrick: heh.  they said that to me, too.  i'm not really following it though :P
[03:32] <Hobbsee> jpatrick: but you should be good and study, yes
[03:33] <Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: what are you tryign to go for?
[03:33] <Q-FUNK> please bear in mind that i'm a regular so if I'm confused, think how others must see this
[03:33] <Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: membership, or MOTU?
[03:33] <persia> Hobbsee: I didn't think that was the case either.  I think ubuntu-dev was intended to be used to describe the developers in general, without reference to universe vs. main.  Anyway, I'm confused.
[03:33] <Hobbsee> heh, right
[03:34] <white> Hobbsee: so when can I expect you here in good old Melbourne? At least you could visit Melbourne this semester ... ;)
[03:34] <Q-FUNK> I think that simplifying this to dev=universe and core-deve=main might make this easier to grasp for everyone
[03:34] <Fujitsu> Q-FUNK: We just moved away from dev=universe in February or so, AFAICR
[03:34] <StevenK> Q-FUNK: However, http://www.ubuntu.com/community/processes/newmember describes the Membership processes, where as https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Hopeful/Recruitment talks about recruiting people into MOTU, which are two seperate and distinct processes
[03:34] <Hobbsee> white: melbourne is cold, and i dislike it
[03:35] <Q-FUNK> great.  more confusion.
[03:35] <persia> Q-FUNK: No: many core-devs also work in universe - we tried that, and it added to the confusion.
[03:35] <white> Hobbsee: well yes, but we have some cool debian/ubuntu people here ;)
[03:35] <Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: also, core devs are also devs, as in, people who can upload to main can also upload to universe...
[03:35] <Hobbsee> white: maybe.  you guys should come up here
[03:35] <white> Hobbsee: and i dislike cold as well. Now it is getting very hot back home :(
[03:35] <Hobbsee> awww
[03:35] <Q-FUNK> persia: core-dev can work anywhere by definition, but have exclusive dibs over main, isn't it?
[03:36] <StevenK> No wonder arb lists support GCC versions, it uses GCC-isms everywhere.
[03:36] <persia> Q-FUNK: Somewhat, although non-core can also be sponsored.
[03:36] <Q-FUNK> Hobbsee: i'm mainly trying to untie the confusion between motu (simple e-mail request as admission process) and dev (mail, plus IRC session and then some as admission process).
[03:37] <persia> Q-FUNK: Admission to dev and admission to MOTU are identical.
[03:37] <Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: but http://www.ubuntu.com/community/processes/newmember has nothing to do with neither motu nor dev...
[03:37] <Q-FUNK> persia: not accoridng to the baove pages I found, hence why  I asked.
[03:37] <Q-FUNK> Hobbsee: which further adds to the confusion
[03:38] <Hobbsee> !contribute
[03:38] <ubotu> To contribute and help out with Ubuntu, see http://www.ubuntu.com/community/participate
[03:38] <StevenK> Membership is seperate from becoming a developer.
[03:38] <Q-FUNK> too many notes, Mozart, too many notes.
[03:38] <persia> Q-FUNK: I've just looked at the pages, and I can't find "developer" in the membership page, nor references to membership in the recruitment page (which needs a serious appointment with an aestheticist)
[03:39] <StevenK> I quite like the distinction between member and developer.
[03:39] <StevenK> If I can pick on elkbuntu, she is a member, and is recognized for her contribution, but isn't a developer.
[03:39] <Hobbsee> i wonder why http://www.ubuntu.com/community/participate doesnt mention membership at all
[03:39] <elkbuntu> who's picking on me?
[03:40] <Hobbsee> elkbuntu: everyone
[03:40] <StevenK> elkbuntu: In a good way
[03:40] <Hobbsee> !member
[03:40] <ubotu> Want to become an Ubuntu member? Look at http://www.ubuntu.com/community/processes/newmember
[03:40] <Q-FUNK> persia: there is a link to the member page from the motu page I showed, suggesting that general crieteria apply.  and yet joining motu only requires an e-mail, while becoming a membe ris a more elaborate process.
[03:40] <StevenK> elkbuntu: Sorry, you're the first person I thought of that's a member but not a developer. :-)
[03:40] <elkbuntu> StevenK, no prob :)
[03:40] <Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: you've showed many pages - which page were you referring to?
[03:40] <persia> Hobbsee: There's no reason why non-members shouldn't contribute, and there's no restriction on membership for any teams.  I don't see how it's relevant.
[03:41] <elkbuntu> im just going insane trying to join some avi's together
[03:41] <persia> Q-FUNK: Which page?
[03:41] <Hobbsee> persia: true - i just note that it's not there, when it used to be
[03:41] <StevenK> elkbuntu: Is transcoding them to mpg an option?
[03:41] <StevenK> elkbuntu: If so, there's a tool called mpgcat
[03:41] <Q-FUNK> persia: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Hopeful/Recruitment
[03:41] <Hobbsee> persia: probably.  clearly i havent looked at the page in that long :P
[03:41] <Hobbsee> neither my wiki page
[03:41] <elkbuntu> StevenK, the problem isnt the joining them, it is the getting them all the same fps, size, audio etc
[03:41] <StevenK> Heh, my wiki page is also collecting lots of dust.
[03:42] <StevenK> elkbuntu: Eww
[03:42] <persia> Hobbsee: I'm probably biased though, given the nature of my participation in ~ubuntu-members
[03:42] <elkbuntu> StevenK, yeah
[03:42] <StevenK> It's ~ubuntumembers, actually
[03:42] <Hobbsee> Q-FUNK:  oh, member of the motu team, that bit is
[03:42] <StevenK> Yay for consistancy
[03:42] <Hobbsee> heh
[03:42] <persia> Q-FUNK: That's a use/mention distinction.  In that context "membership" refers to membership in the MOTU team, not Ubuntu membership.
[03:43] <Hobbsee> well, it's otherwise referenced as "team member", whihc, although it's an evil workism, is reasonably clear
[03:43] <Q-FUNK> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Hopeful/Recruitment links to http://www.ubuntu.com/community/processes/newmember as general criteria to meet before applying to motu
[03:44] <persia> Q-FUNK: Yes.  If you don't meet the criteria for membership, you cannot be a MOTU, as being a MOTU automatically grants membership if it was not previously granted.
[03:45] <Q-FUNK> persia: again, that doesn't answer my question.  do I just need to update my wiki page and send an -email to the address mentioned there for motu or must I also show up for an IRC meeting of the comunity council as mentioned in newmember?
[03:45] <Hobbsee> there we go, clearer now
[03:45] <Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: you have to do membership first.
[03:45] <Hobbsee> if you're not already a member
[03:45] <Hobbsee> which is the irc meeting with the CC, etc
[03:46] <persia> Q-FUNK: Depends on what you want.  If you want to join MOTU, you'll want to have several MOTUs tell you to apply first: if that has happened, sending the mail is fine.  If you want membership, or haven't yet met all the criteria for MOTU, the CC meeting is the way to go.
[03:46] <persia> Hobbsee: Not true.  One can go from non-member to MOTU, if one works with MOTU enough.
[03:47] <Fujitsu> Was the MOTU Council granted that right? I don't recall.
[03:47] <Hobbsee> persia: that sounds...very racy.
[03:47] <Hobbsee> i didnt think it was
[03:47] <persia> Fujitsu: Yes.
[03:47] <Fujitsu> It was going to be granted after a trial period, I thought.
[03:47] <Q-FUNK> getting back to the specifics of my case, I mention packages in Debian and also track bugs on Ubuntu for them.  I run a mixture of Debian and Ubuntu on my cluster.
[03:48] <Q-FUNK> mention/maintain
[03:48] <Hobbsee> are you a DD?
[03:48] <Q-FUNK> NM
[03:48] <Q-FUNK> I haven't bothered applying for NM for a long time
[03:49] <persia> Q-FUNK: OK.  Have a couple MOTUs given you unsolicited advice to apply to MOTU?
[03:49] <Q-FUNK> I have already been maintianing packages in Debian since late2003, early-2004 or so.
[03:49] <Q-FUNK> persia: yup
[03:49] <StevenK> -rw-r--r-- 1 steven users  19M 2007-07-10 19:22 epydoc_3.0~beta1-1.patch
[03:49] <StevenK> Ouch! Bad MoM!
[03:50] <Q-FUNK> or actually, I think the advice came from a core-dev who presumed that I was already DD, until I had asked him to sponsor an upload to debian thatmerged ubuntu fixes.
[03:51] <persia> Q-FUNK: You could apply, but generally the preference is for those working directly on Ubuntu.  Membership is one of the ways to show this, and would help your application.
[03:52] <Q-FUNK> persia: I work on both. i just merge the fixes directly into Debian.
[03:53] <persia> Q-FUNK: My apologies: I mean no offense.  I'm not familiar with your work, so I'm just spewing generalities in hopes that it will help you make a decision.
[03:54] <StevenK> Which, strictly speaking, isn't contributing directly to Ubuntu ...
[03:54] <Q-FUNK> StevenK: my activity level on launchpad speaks for itself.
[03:55] <Fujitsu> Upload privileges are granted to those who need to upload. Merging fixes into Debian doesn't require that, I don't think.
[03:55] <persia> Q-FUNK: Be careful: defensiveness about one's readiness has previously been raised as grounds for delaying approval to MOTU.
[03:56] <Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: got anything that you currently need reviewing?
[03:57] <Q-FUNK> Hobbsee: nope.
[03:57] <Hobbsee> that's helpful.
[03:58] <Q-FUNK> persia: I'm ok with that. 
[03:59] <Q-FUNK> Hobbsee: :)
[04:00] <Q-FUNK> Hobbsee: why did you ask?
[04:01] <Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: was looking to sponsor some of your stuff, so then i could put in a more concrete opinion, if/when you apply for MOTU.
[04:02] <Q-FUNK> Hobbsee: mpitt is my usual sponsor for Ubuntu-specific uploads. we co-maintian packages in both distros.
[04:02] <elektranox> can somebody review my package? (http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5902)
[04:02] <Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: right
[04:04] <Q-FUNK> Hobbsee: I had a fairly extensive discussion of NM vs MOTU and DD vs UD issues with him.  you're welcome to ask him for a sumary of my views and for his appreciation of my packages.
[04:04] <persia> Q-FUNK: The key is that you want to get as many MOTUs as possible to sponsor you, and say good things.  One person with excellent opinions won't help as much.
[04:05] <Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: oh, i will be, if you put in an application
[04:05] <Hobbsee> as will i be mentioning how much you tend to work with others, and the MOTU team.
[04:07] <Q-FUNK> persia: as I do most of my uploads via Debian to avoid deltas, that would require other MOTU members who also sponsor my packages on Debian to vouch for me.
[04:08] <StevenK> There aren't many MOTU who can do that.
[04:09] <Q-FUNK> The glass is at least half-full.  there _are_ some. :)
[04:09] <persia> Q-FUNK: Hmm..  Yes, it would.  That makes it hard for you to get the community support required for MOTU.  I'd suggest applying for membership, with a good Future Plans, and demonstrating implementation.  You might also try to get a couple specs in for gutsy+1, and get them implemented.  That might make up for the lack of direct uploads to Ubuntu.
[04:09] <Hobbsee> sounds like you need to go thru NM and such, and get to DD, more than getting MOTU, imo.  i may be wrong.
[04:10] <StevenK> Discounting core-devs, I can't think of any.
[04:10] <persia> Q-FUNK: Separately, if you're uploading to Debian, rather than Ubuntu, how would MOTU help?
[04:10] <Hobbsee> i cant see how having upload rights to universe here, will actually help you with what you do
[04:14] <Q-FUNK> there's occasional forks I need to manage, whenever Debian practices differ from Ubuntu.
[04:15] <persia> Q-FUNK: About how many packages?  Also, does the sponsors queue not work well for you?
[04:15] <Q-FUNK> likewise when a fix won't make it to Debian because of a freeze, but would still have time to make it to Ubuntu.
[04:16] <Q-FUNK> persia: point taken.  I could try REVU whenever I have Ubuntu-specific fixes.
[04:17] <persia> Q-FUNK: Alternately, if it's small, just attach a debdiff against the Debian package to a bug, and subscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors.  If it's only Ubuntu, attach a debdiff against the latest Ubuntu package, and subscribe the same team.  If it's a main package, you'll want ubuntu-main-sponsors instead.
[04:20] <blueCommand> Hello, I'm trying to build a package from REVU, but pbuilder says "E: Couldn't find package wine-dev". That package is installed, but I guess I need to do something else since it uses a fakeroot, correct?
[04:20] <geser> blueCommand: what arch are you on?
[04:20] <blueCommand> 386
[04:20] <Q-FUNK> persia: the only process I haven't got much experience with is dput'ing. I wouldn't mind uploading via REVU, from that perspective.
[04:21] <Q-FUNK> blueCommand: is it in your build-depends?
[04:21] <geser> blueCommand: is universe enabled in your pbuilder?
[04:21] <persia> Q-FUNK: You're welcome to do that, but there's only intensive effort to upload from REVU once a week.  You'll get a faster response from bugs (and it's easier for us to review, which makes us happy).
[04:22] <blueCommand> Q-FUNK, Bear with me, you mean for the package?
[04:22] <blueCommand> geser, Probably not
[04:22] <Q-FUNK> blueCommand: for the source control file
[04:22] <blueCommand> Q-FUNK, Mean this "Build-Depends: debhelper (>= 5), wine-dev, libsocket++-dev"?
[04:23] <blueCommand> geser, Where can I set that?
[04:23] <geser> blueCommand: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto#head-5e61fa0f52f7f2442fb20f074813bd691744460b
[04:24] <blueCommand> Thanks
[04:25] <blueCommand> Must have missed that section
[04:26] <AnAnt> ScottK: Hello
[04:27] <AnAnt> ScottK: regarding your comments on http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5910, in what section in the manpage should I refer to the actual help ?
[04:30] <persia> AnAnt: Sometimes people are away.  You'll always get a better response asking the channel generally (although mentioning the reviewer's name is handy, in case they are around (as this one may be)
[04:30] <AnAnt> Hello, regarding the comments on http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5910, in what section in the manpage should I refer to the actual help ?
[04:30] <AnAnt> persia: thanks
[04:35] <AnAnt> ?!
[04:38] <persia> AnAnt: I'm looking, but I haven't been able to determine enough about what the package does to understand why there is that manpage, or how it helps the user.  I suspect the comment was a request to make the man page a little more of a manual, explaining how to use the software, which command-line switches were available, where to find installed data files, etc.
[04:40] <AnAnt> ic
[04:42] <persia> AnAnt: Hmm..  I'm really not finding enough information to guide you further.  Sorry.
[04:44] <persia> AnAnt: Also, your package was mentioned in the reviews for the zekr package.  I'm not sure what the thwab-lib library would contain, but we like to avoid duplication of data, so you may want to coordinate with that packaging team to ensure that the systems can work together if required.
[04:44] <AnAnt> np
[04:56] <davromaniak> apacheLAGger2, are you here ?
[05:11] <man-di> lionel: regarding #126089 and #126090,: Whyt are sync bugs that make a package buildable again marked "Wishlist"?
[05:12] <persia> man-di: For sponsored bugs, without already set Importance, the guidance is to use "Wishlist" unless you really want to investigate.  Don't worry about it - it doesn't affect the further processing.
[05:13] <man-di> persia: thanks for the explanation
[05:14] <jpatrick> can someone please look at my upload: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=6019 ?
[05:14] <persia> More generally, a sync bug ACK'd by a developer will be sync'd regardless of priority unless it breaks a freeze.
[05:34] <geser> jpatrick: done, see my comment
[05:35] <persia> elektranox: 5902 commented
[05:39] <Baby> persia: hex-a-hop has finally entered debian, I'll try to find out how to trigger it entering into Ubuntu as soon as I finish reading mail and so on :)
[05:42] <persia> Baby: Great.  The easiest trigger is to report a bug against Ubuntu (no package) with content that matches the bugs for snowballz and whichwayisup.  Once reported, subscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors (with subscribe someone else) to get it in queue for sponsorship.  Also, if you don't mind, could you subscribe both nightrose and I?
[05:43] <jpatrick> geser: I include them ALL?
[05:43] <Baby> of course :)
[05:44] <Baby> Hobbsee: hi!!!! :))))
[05:44] <persia> Hobbsee: Certain far northern interests have expressed grave displeasure at syncs without bugs.
[05:44] <Baby> *hug*
[05:44] <Baby> btw, I'm uploading a new game today XD
[05:44] <persia> Which game?
[05:44] <Baby> I'll write about it in my weblog soon i guess :)
[05:44] <Baby> cultivation
[05:44] <Hobbsee> persia: no, i meant using requestsync, so Baby didnt have to request the sync from here
[05:44] <Baby> I finally solved that double free() problem I was having with it :)
[05:44] <Hobbsee> persia: i dont have archive access, anyway
[05:45] <Baby> what's  requestsync?
[05:45] <persia> Hobbsee: If you like.  Given the number of games that Baby watches, I'd think practice with the process would be good, but that's just me (and I really should go stick dh_icons in a bunch of places and request syncs).
[05:45] <Hobbsee> Baby: a script that requests a sync of ubuntu packages
[05:45] <persia> Baby: It's a command line interface to report a sync bug.
[05:45] <Baby> aps! cool!
[05:45] <Hobbsee> persia: true
[05:46] <Nafallo> hi Baby :-)
[05:46] <Hobbsee> Baby: it's in our devscripts.  make sure, if you use it, that you specify with -s, which means you need a sponsor
[05:47] <Hobbsee> well, i wasnt thinking of *all* of them
[05:47] <Baby> 48 comments marked as spam  .... having a weblog is a pain in the ass sometimes
[05:47] <Baby> sorry for the language :P
[05:47] <elkbuntu> hehe... do you use akismet?
[05:47] <persia> Baby: I've not been following dh_icons discussion closely.  Would it make sense to push back all the Ubuntu dh_iconcache calls, or should there be some discussion on the list?
[05:48] <Baby> nope, but i know i should :)
[05:48] <Baby> dh_iconcache does not exist in debian, does it?
[05:48] <elkbuntu> yep, you should
[05:48] <Baby> so we should need to add it conditionally
[05:48] <Baby> if dh_iconcache exists then call it, or something like that, so it's compatible with both
[05:48] <persia> Baby: No, but dh_icons does (as I understand it), and Ubuntu dh_iconcache has been rewritten to call dh_icons.
[05:49] <Baby> aha
[05:49] <Baby> cool :)
[05:49] <Baby> I want to make packages the most compatible the possible between both
[05:49] <Baby> in any case it makes sense writing about it in the list
[05:50] <Baby> if you prefer me to bring in the topic in the list, just tell me :)
[05:50] <persia> Baby: Thanks.  I'll do that.
[05:54] <Toma-> Is anyone working on getting gimpshop into the repos?
[05:55] <Baby> gimpshop was that fork of gimp making it similar to photoshop?
[05:55] <Toma-> indeed
[05:55] <Baby> it was too hacky :(
[05:56] <Baby> they changed all the text messages directly
[05:56] <Baby> so i guess translations won't work any more
[05:56] <Toma-> oh i see
[05:56] <Baby> I had a look at it some time ago, unless they fixed it
[05:56] <Baby> but have a look at it carefully, because it'llprobably be ahell to maintain
[05:56] <Toma-> ill see what the website says about intl support
[05:57] <Baby> :)
[05:57] <Baby> what i did was getting the original gimp version that was referred as the point of the fork
[05:57] <Baby> and made a diff against it
[05:57] <Baby> and the diff was too hacky to be considered seriously
[05:58] <Baby> even though some parts of it made sense, like the new XML trees and so
[05:58] <Baby> what scared me was all the changes inside the _("") gettext lines
[05:58] <Baby> instead of making them in the .po
[05:59] <persia> Umm..  That's an interesting way to do it.
[05:59] <Toma-> well, the site even quotes "Gimpshop: a GIMP hack"
[05:59] <Toma-> theres an ubuntu deb available from them anyway
[05:59] <Baby> XD yup
[06:00] <Baby> are they actively maintainig the fork?
[06:00] <Baby> or is it just a one-time fork?
[06:00] <Toma-> 2.2.11?
[06:00] <Toma-> looks a little behind
[06:00] <persia> Toma-: I think we're at 2.3.18
[06:01] <Baby> i told you, it would be a hell to maintain, even for them
[06:01] <Toma-> 2.2.13 here :o
[06:01] <Baby> the patch can be adapted to be properly done anyway, if there's interest
[06:01] <Baby> it shouldn't be too difficult, I just wonder if it makes sense
[06:02] <Toma-> just sick of people whining about photoshop :S
[06:02] <Baby> yup, people complain about everything
[06:02] <Toma-> oh well. thanks :D
[06:02] <Baby> national sport i guess
[06:02] <Baby> :)
[06:02] <Toma-> :D
[06:08] <geser> jpatrick: everyone who is mentioned in the source files to have a copyright should be mentioned in debian/copyright
[06:09] <jpatrick> ok
[06:18] <sacater> is it possible for me to use my @ubuntu.com account for jabber.
[06:29] <crimsun> something bothering you?
[06:32] <Baby> persia: what time of the day is there? :)
[06:33] <persia> Baby: 01:32.
[06:33] <Baby> XD yup then I agree
[06:33] <Baby> 18:30 here
[06:34] <Nafallo> 18:33 < Baby> 18:30 here
[06:34] <Nafallo> :-)
[06:34] <Baby> :)
[06:35] <Nafallo> Baby: so. how are you? :-)
[06:36] <sommer> Hey all, I have a quick question about package control files that's probably a noob question but:
[06:36] <sommer> what does the (= ${Source-Version}) part mean?
[06:37] <sommer> the package's source?
[06:37] <guest> I'm having problems with a package currently on REVU for comments. Anyone here prepared to give some advice?
[06:38] <Hobbsee> sommer: means the same as the source version of the package
[06:39] <Hobbsee> so, say the source package is 3.2-0ubuntu1, then that will depend on app with the version of 3.2-0ubuntu1
[06:39] <Hobbsee> and break on any other versino
[06:39] <sommer> Hobbsee: that's sort of what I was thinking, but wanted to make sure.  Thanks for the info
[06:39] <Hobbsee> sommer: no problem :)
[06:44] <guest> The problem is that I'm packaging my own source, so it's a native package with no diff file. Based on the comments on previous versions of the package, there seem to be some concerns with this approach, but I'm not sure exactly what they are.
[06:45] <Baby> is the code ubuntu-specific?
[06:47] <DktrKranz> could you please have a look at http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=6020? it's a new upstream release of oggconvert
[06:48] <guest> Baby: I assume that question directed to me. No, the source is not Ubuntu-specific, but the debian directory in the package is specifically for Ubuntu.
[06:51] <Baby> then you should better release a .tgz and make the package non-native
[06:52] <Baby> i can go through the pros and cons if you want, you might already know anyway
[06:54] <guest> Can you please explain why the package should not be native? It's a pain to move the debian dir into a diff, and I don't understand why it's necessary.
[06:54] <Baby> Hobbsee: do you have some time to teach me how to ask for the sync? :)
[06:54] <Hobbsee> Baby: using the requestsync script?
[06:54] <Hobbsee> or by hand?
[06:54] <Baby> the easiest way :)
[06:54] <Baby> :P
[06:55] <Hobbsee> hehe
[06:55] <Baby> guest: well the main pros will be that other distributions will be able to use it without being bothered with ubuntu-specific stuff, especially debian-derivatives, ....
[06:56] <Baby> .diff changes over debian/ are a pain in the ass....
[06:56] <Baby> then, if you change something in the packaging, you won't need to make a new release...
[06:56] <Hobbsee> Baby: grab the requestsync out of the source at http://packages.ubuntu.com/gutsy/devel/devscripts
[06:57] <Hobbsee> Baby: chmod +x it, run requestsync for syntax options
[06:57] <Baby> you just change the packaging stuff... in fact if other distros use it, upgrading the version for something specific of the packageing can be annoying
[06:57] <Baby> going there :)
[06:57] <Hobbsee> Baby: you'll end up needing requestsync -ns packagename gutsy
[06:57] <Baby> aha, i need to install that? :)
[06:57] <guest> Thanks, I suppose that does make sense.
[06:57] <Hobbsee> well, i wouldnt install all of devscripts, seeing as some of it is ubuntu specific
[06:58] <Baby> this is the easy way, isn't it? ;)
[06:58] <Hobbsee> -n means new package, -s means that you need sponsorship for it, so it will subscribe the universe-sponsors, instead of the archive
[06:58] <Hobbsee> yep
[06:58] <Baby> XD
[06:59] <Baby> oki, i'll extract the contents of that... i hope they don't have any dependency I need :)
[06:59] <Hobbsee> Baby: it's just a script.  apt-cache...oh wait
[07:00] <Baby> scripts have dependencies too, you know :)
[07:00] <Hobbsee> oh, no, you should be rigth.  apt-cache rmadison -u ubuntu will work on a debian system
[07:00] <Hobbsee> Baby: it used to use the local apt-cache, in whcih case you would have had a problem, obviously
[07:01] <Baby> ah!
[07:01] <Baby> ok, we go for the difficult way then? :)
[07:01] <Hobbsee> but you should have apt-cache rmadison on your debian system
[07:01] <Hobbsee> nah...
[07:01] <guest> Two additional questions. (1) Could someone knowledgeable please take a look at my package "imageinfo"  on REVU to see if there are any other issues that need to be addressed other than the native/non-native package matter? (2) Once all packaging issues are resolved, do I need to do anything to find a MOTU to advocate the package?
[07:01] <Hobbsee> i said that's the way it *used* to be - not the way it is now
[07:01] <Baby> cool :)
[07:02] <Baby> we need a GUI for all that stuff :P
[07:02] <Hobbsee> Baby: have a look at the script if you like..
[07:02] <Hobbsee> haha
[07:02] <Baby> :)
[07:03] <Baby> heh, it's python :)
[07:03] <Hobbsee> yep
[07:03] <Hobbsee> Baby: oh, you will need to have specified DEBEMAIL, and actually have a launchpad account
[07:04] <Hobbsee> (which is connected to the account at DEBEMAIL)
[07:04] <Hobbsee> else they wont know it's you
[07:04] <Baby> I'll check if I have one, I really don't know
[07:04] <Hobbsee> heh
[07:04] <Hobbsee> otherwise i can just file it from here
[07:05] <Baby> in any case i guess it would be problematic from here, i don'T have mail properly configured
[07:05] <Hobbsee> possibly
[07:05] <Hobbsee> it doesnt use a MTA
[07:05] <Baby> yup, i guess it will be the best, can you do it for me?
[07:05] <Hobbsee> Baby: otherwise, you just use the content of that, and file the bug with it
[07:05] <Hobbsee> sure
[07:05] <Hobbsee> which package names?
[07:05] <Hobbsee> (source)
[07:06] <Baby> please CC persia and nightrose too?
[07:06] <Baby> hex-a-hop
[07:06] <Baby> wait a second. i'll check
[07:06] <Hobbsee> says it's not in debian yet
[07:06] <Hobbsee> rmadison doesnt find it
[07:06] <Baby> nop, not yet in the mirrors
[07:06] <Baby> http://incoming.debian.org/
[07:07] <Baby> we'll have to wait until tomorrow
[07:07] <Baby> it's in incoming yet
[07:07] <Hobbsee> ahhh
[07:07] <Baby> I just noticed
[07:08] <Baby> XDD
[07:09] <Baby> you can wait until tomorrow
[07:09] <Baby> it will be in the mirrors by then :)
[07:09] <Hobbsee> Baby: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/126170
[07:09] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 126170 in Ubuntu "Please sync hex-a-hop from Debian Incomming" [Undecided,Confirmed]  
[07:09] <Hobbsee> done.
[07:09] <Hobbsee> i dont think they'll reject that
[07:09] <Baby> thanks!! :)
[07:10] <Hobbsee> as in, it doesnt say "no ubuntu changes", but it does say "new package to ubuntu" which syas the same thing
[07:10] <Hobbsee> says the component to sync from
[07:10] <Baby> can we subscribe persia and nightrose to that bug report too?
[07:10] <Hobbsee> done
[07:10] <Baby> thanks!!! :))))))))))
[07:10] <Hobbsee> see the left hand pane, about half way down
[07:11] <Hobbsee> no problem :)
[07:12] <Hobbsee> hmmm..     should teach requestsync about incomming too, maybe
[07:12] <Baby> heh, I'm subscribed twice in lanuchpad :P
[07:12] <Hobbsee> heh
[07:12] <tuxmaniac> w00t! Intel joins the OLPC project
[07:12] <Hobbsee> ask them to merge the accounts, if you want
[07:12] <Baby> once with my yahoo mail and once with my gmail one :P
[07:12] <Hobbsee> ahhh
[07:12] <Hobbsee> oh, you can merge them yourself then
[07:12] <Hobbsee> if you have access to both
[07:13] <Baby> that would be great :)
[07:13] <Hobbsee> Baby: login to teh one that you want to kepe, go to the other one, and there should be something about "this is me, merge my account"
[07:13] <Hobbsee> i wonder if that's only for uploads to debian, where phantom people have been created
[07:14] <Hobbsee> oh, ick.  teaching it about incomming would be kinda hard, as you cant just use rmadison for that
[07:15] <Baby> I'm still deciding which one I want to be my master account
[07:15] <Hobbsee> ahhh
[07:15] <Baby> I guess it makes more sense that it is yahoo's, as it is the one I sign my packages with
[07:16] <Baby> even though gmail is much better
[07:16] <Hobbsee> well, you can add multiple addresses to your key too, you know...
[07:16] <Baby> yup... sometime I'll find out how anyway ;)
[07:16] <Hobbsee> oh
[07:16] <Hobbsee> gpg --edit-key <yourkeyid>
[07:16] <Hobbsee> then adduid
[07:16] <Baby> wait wait.. cannot do all at once :)
[07:16] <Hobbsee> stick your name, comment, email
[07:16] <Hobbsee> haha
[07:16] <Baby> XD
[07:17] <Hobbsee> "exit", say yes you want to save.  done.  resend key to keyservers.
[07:17] <Baby> I'll use yahoo's
[07:17] <Hobbsee> you can change the primary mail on it anyway
[07:17] <Baby> OK, I'm in :)
[07:17] <Hobbsee> after you merge accounts.
[07:17] <Baby> now what? :)
[07:17] <Hobbsee> which is the account you want to merge into yours?
[07:18] <Baby> my master one is little_miry@yahoo.es , and the one I want to merge is little.miry@gmail.com
[07:19] <Hobbsee> which is the launchpad ID of the latter one?
[07:19] <Hobbsee> oh, found it
[07:19] <Hobbsee> oh darn.  because you've actually registered both yourself, you cant magically merge them, i dont think
[07:19] <Baby> It's ok anyway
[07:20] <Hobbsee> Baby: https://answers.launchpad.net/launchpad/+addquestion
[07:20] <Baby> I get lost in this environment :)
[07:20] <tuxmaniac> Hobbsee, did you attend the Classmate PC discussion in Sevilla this year?
[07:20] <Hobbsee> tuxmaniac: no - although there was some discussion in the lightning talks about it
[07:20] <Hobbsee> Baby: hehe, it gets less confusing after a while
[07:20] <tuxmaniac> Hobbsee, thanks
[07:21] <Hobbsee> Baby: say teh summary as being "please merge the little-miry-gmail account into little-miry"
[07:22] <Baby> I'm still trying to find out :)
[07:22] <Hobbsee> :)
[07:24] <Baby> it's quite strange, maybe they're already merged?
[07:24] <Hobbsee> doesnt look like it
[07:24] <Hobbsee> as in, they're showing separately
[07:24] <Hobbsee> as you'll find if you use launchpad.net/~<lpid>
[07:25] <Baby> guess I found it
[07:26] <Baby> done!
[07:29] <Hobbsee> yay!
[07:33] <Baby> I'm changing the icons, photos and so :P XD
[07:33] <Hobbsee> nice
[07:41] <guest> [Trying again]  (1) Could someone knowledgeable please take a look at my package "imageinfo"  on REVU to see if there are any other issues that need to be addressed other than the native/non-native package matter? (2) Once all packaging issues are resolved, do I need to do anything to find a MOTU to advocate the package?
[07:42] <Baby> I don't have the answers, sorry :(
[07:42] <guest> Baby: Understood. Thanks for your help though.
[07:42] <guest> Anyone else?
[07:45] <elektranox> can somebody review 6021?
[07:47] <PhinnFort> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5913 while we're at it
[07:47] <Q-FUNK> anybody who happens to be both a DD and a MOTU?
[07:58] <regis> hello, can anyone tell me how to warn the maintainer of flash that their package has a problem(md5sum mismatch install_flash_player_9_linux.tar.gz)
[07:59] <Q-FUNK> regis: file a bug in launchpad. it's probably related to the recently released upstream security fix.
[07:59] <PhinnFort> regis: try downloading the file again...
[08:00] <regis> PhinnFort, i ve tried that several times
[08:00] <regis> thanks
[08:02] <man-di> regis: macromedia changed did a new release with the same name/version of the old release
[08:02] <man-di> regis: your version of the package migth check for the old md5sum value
[08:03] <PhinnFort> ...that's why you should include full version in the name of source packages, kids
[08:04] <PhinnFort> like flash-9.23.tar.gz instead of install_flash_player_9_linux.tar.gz, which must qualify for some naming stupidity prize
[08:08] <man-di> PhinnFort: tell that Macromedia
[08:08] <PhinnFort> I will
[08:08] <PhinnFort> one day
[08:10] <PhinnFort> when I'm rich and famous
[08:12] <man-di> PhinnFort: you need to be rich and famous to write a mail to stupid@macromedia.com ?
[08:13] <PhinnFort> man-di: I need to be rich and famous to get adobe to give a sh*t
[08:13] <PhinnFort> they haven't even made a 64-but version, ffs
[08:17] <mattva01> does anyone know if the  sobby 0.4 backport for dapper is available anywhere? this is urgent!
[08:20] <Flannel> mattva01: I've backported it myself with prevu
[08:23] <mattva01> thanks
[08:24] <Flannel> mattva01: Prevu debs aren't industrial strength, but I'd be willing to let you have mine if you feel like trying them.  Since you've gotta do some version munging to get prevu to cooperate
[08:25] <mattva01> if you do that it would save me a heart attack
[08:25] <mattva01> :)
[08:28] <mattva01> where would they be available?
[08:29] <Flannel> mattva01: http://neal.bussett.com/ubuntu/
[08:30] <Flannel> mattva01: I'm not sure if all of those are required.  In fact, I'm pretty sure only a few of them are.  the one's without the dev or dbg, but just inc ase, I put them up
[08:30] <mattva01> thank you so much
[08:30] <Flannel> I believe it's just the three.  libnet, libobby and then sobby.  wihout the dev and the dbg
[08:31] <mattva01> yes
[08:36] <mattva01> hmm im getting "address family not supported"
[08:38] <mattva01> ah i see, i need ipv6 support
[08:38] <Flannel> http://gobby.0x539.de/trac/ticket/201
[08:38] <Flannel> yeah
[08:46] <mattva01> hmm even with the latest net6 ( the one on your site) it still gives me that error
[08:48] <Flannel> Did you disable ipv6 on Ubuntu?
[08:48] <mattva01> no
[08:49] <Flannel> I don't know then.  you might save time ultimately by backporting it yourself.  OR, you can, as I found out after backporting sobby, just use one gobby (from your machine) as a host
[08:50] <Flannel> since gobby <-> gobby works as well as gobby <-> sobby <-> gobby
[08:50] <mattva01> well thanks for your help
[08:51] <Flannel> sorry I couldn't be more helpful
[08:53] <regis> man-di, ok so i'll bugreport
[08:54] <blueCommand> If I have all files (dsc, orig, changes etc), is there an easy way to extract this so I can make changes to it?
[08:59] <jekil> anyone know what can cause this? http://rafb.net/p/Qln0nv60.html rules is: http://rafb.net/p/NZQZHv21.html
[09:06] <elektranox> can somebody review http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=6021 ?
[09:09] <blueCommand> How can I clean my tree and revert to whatever my .diff.gz and orig says? Extracting and applying patches normal is starting to be a hassle
[09:10] <geser> jekil: have you tried to comment out lines 8 and 9 and only use debhelper.mk and python-distutils.mk?
[09:10] <jekil> yes, same error
[09:11] <blueCommand> At the moment I start revu-build and abort it, but that couldn't be the only way?
[09:19] <zorglu_> q. what is the name of the feisty feature which intercept command line error in case of 'missing executable' to determine which package need to be installed to get the executable ?
[09:20] <geser> jekil: than you need an cdbs expert
[09:20] <blueCommand> zorglu_, "command-not-found"
[09:20] <zorglu_> thanks
[09:21] <blueCommand> np
[09:21] <jekil> geser: yes :( i am searching it :(
[09:21] <blueCommand> Are there any explict rules from running autogen in the rules file?
[09:23] <broonie> blueCommand: It's a Good Thing to make sure all the files it produces are cleaned up so that they don't pollute the diff.
[09:24] <blueCommand> broonie, will it really if I run it first in the rules file? isn't the diff to preserve the ideal state of the sourcetree when building?
[09:24] <geser> jekil: try contacting the Debian maintainers for cdbs: http://lists.alioth.debian.org/mailman/listinfo/build-common-hackers
[09:24] <broonie> blueCommand: Consider what happens if someone builds the package twice in a row without using a chroot.
[09:25] <jekil> geser: thanks
[09:25] <blueCommand> Yeah, I thought of that
[09:26] <blueCommand> I will see what I can do then
[09:28] <leonel> hello  everyone !
[09:29] <leonel> ScottK: do you need the debian/changelog  for squirrelmail  since dapper to gutsy ?  I don't really understand  what you need 
[09:34] <blueCommand> broonie, if I don't run autogen, I get these annoying errors http://rafb.net/p/IeBxac87.html
[09:34] <blueCommand> I suspect I need to remove or add something, but I have no idea of what
[09:35] <Amaranth> blueCommand: run it as a patch
[09:35] <blueCommand> Amaranth, run what?
[09:35] <Amaranth> autogen
[09:35] <blueCommand> Bear with me, I'm new at this. I'm guessing this would produce a patch what autogen does? How do I do that?
[09:36] <broonie> blueCommand: Delete them in the clean target.
[09:36] <Amaranth> you make a copy of the dir, run autogen in one, and diff the two dirs
[09:36] <blueCommand> The clean target doesn't have them
[09:37] <blueCommand> Oh it has
[09:37] <blueCommand> Since it needs to have
[09:37] <broonie> Amaranth: But note that that has gotchas with timestamp issues.
[09:37] <blueCommand> I get "could not find" errors if I doesn't have
[09:37] <broonie> rm -r
[09:37] <broonie> -f even
[09:37] <blueCommand> Start over? :)
[09:38] <broonie> No. rm -f doesn't error if the file isn't present.
[09:38] <blueCommand> Oh no not that
[09:38] <blueCommand> You see, those files are needed, that's why they are there :)
[09:38] <blueCommand> If I remove them, I _have_ to run autogen
[09:39] <blueCommand> Otherwise configure is going harikari
[09:39] <blueCommand> The goal is to make autogen unnessecary :\
[09:40] <blueCommand> broonie, Thanks anyway :)
[09:40] <blueCommand> But this makes me really irritated none the less
[09:40] <blueCommand> Can I make it update the diff or something?
[09:41] <blueCommand> http://rafb.net/p/IeBxac87.html looks like it simply can't find that there is supposed to be a symlink
[09:41] <broonie> Copying the real file in place of the symlink should make diff happy.
[09:42] <blueCommand> then I will do that, brb
[09:44] <blueCommand> Seems to be working
[09:45] <broonie> Note that there can be problems when unpacking the diff since you can end up with timestamps that tell auto* it needs to rebuild some of the generated files. In practice this mostly only happens on slow architectures that Ubuntu doesn't support.
[09:46] <blueCommand> Hm
[09:46] <blueCommand> dpkg-source: warning: executable mode 0755 of 'configure' will not be represented in diff
[09:46] <blueCommand> That _WILL_ make a hassle
[09:46] <broonie> chmod before running it or just invoke it with sh explicitly.
[09:47] <blueCommand> That sounded like that is an everyday hack :)
[09:48] <broonie> I've done this before - and decided that I much prefer running auto* during the build. :P
[09:48] <blueCommand> :O
[09:49] <blueCommand> I wanted to do that too :) And you told me not to! (Well, you made me do this!! :D)
[09:51] <blueCommand> Hm
[09:51] <blueCommand>  configure-generated-file-in-source config.log, I don't have a config.log
[09:57] <elektranox> can somebody please review http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=6021 ?
[10:01] <blueCommand> Are there any extra steps required to make it copy files fromdebian/tmp needed than $(MAKE) DESTDIR=$(CURDIR)/debian/tmp install? Becaue I notice that there is a folder named debian/package too. My debs only contain the files from debian/package :(
[10:06] <blueCommand> ah, dh_install was commented
[10:47] <blueCommand> If I have a REVU package that got turned down due to missing dependencies, do I need to resubmit it, or just poke somebody?
[10:51] <gnomefreak> blueCommand: resubmit it
[10:52] <blueCommand> Ok
[10:52] <gnomefreak> it will overwrite the existing one
[10:58] <blueCommand> bad-distribution-in-changes-file gutsy
[10:59] <blueCommand> Isn't gutsy the right tag?
[11:40] <blueCommand> Anybody with REVU access that can see what happend with winekeyd and libsocket++ ?
[11:40] <blueCommand> Not seeing them in revu
[11:44] <ajmitch> blueCommand: when were they uploaded?
[11:44] <blueCommand> 15 min ago or so
[11:44] <ajmitch> are you sure they went to the right host?
[11:45] <blueCommand> hm, did like last time, but I will check
[11:45] <blueCommand> [revu] 
[11:45] <blueCommand> fqdn = revu.tauware.de
[11:45] <blueCommand> incoming = /incoming
[11:45] <blueCommand> login = anonymous
[11:45] <ajmitch> don't count on 'revu' being default
[11:45] <blueCommand> I did dput revu *.changes
[11:46] <blueCommand> Hm
[11:46] <blueCommand> Now I can resubmit them
[11:46] <ajmitch> ah no
[11:46] <blueCommand> I couldn't back then
[11:46] <ajmitch> they were removed by a cron job
[11:46] <ajmitch> the mail just took its time to get here
[11:46] <blueCommand> Hehe, ok :)
[11:46] <blueCommand> Reason?
[11:46] <ajmitch> please make sure you upload source-only packages
[11:47] <blueCommand> i.e no debs?
[11:47] <ajmitch> yes
[11:47] <ajmitch> never upload an i386.changes file, there's a cron job that will just kill those
[11:47] <blueCommand> gotcha, you will probably have one other "binary" package soon though, since I did a re-submit :)
[11:48] <ajmitch> removed it
[11:51] <blueCommand> there we go
[11:52] <elektranox> still nobody who would review my package?
[11:52] <blueCommand> You need to be a "reviewer" for that right?
[11:52] <blueCommand> Otherwise I would gladly do it
[11:53] <ScottK> blueCommand: If you know enough about packaging, feel free to offer unofficial suggestions.  Just make clear you are not a MOTU when you do it.
[11:53] <blueCommand> ScottK, Ah what the hell, there is no better way to learn than by doing, right? :)
[11:54] <ScottK> Just don't over-reach.  If you aren't sure, let them know and don't lead them in the wrong direction.
[11:55] <blueCommand> ScottK, Nono, I will just try to review it. Don't worry :)
[11:55] <elektranox> ok this way the final reviewers have less work :)
[11:55] <elektranox> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=6021
[11:56] <blueCommand> elektranox, already building :)
[12:04] <blueCommand> Oh right. If somebody could review:
[12:04] <blueCommand> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=6023
[12:04] <blueCommand> and http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=6024
[12:04] <blueCommand> elektranox, You're looking fine so far, atleast through this reviewing guide ;-D
[12:05] <elektranox> :)
[12:05] <xtknight> so if i wanted to make an app for Gutsy, this would be the right channel to be in?
[12:06] <Burgundavia_> xtknight: sort of
[12:06] <xtknight> i was thinking of implenting an idea in the IdeaPool 
[12:06] <Burgundavia_> xtknight: which one?
[12:06] <xtknight> Burgundavia_, a hardware advisor that lets you know if your hardware is supported on ubuntu.  it would be a C/C++ windows program that could run on 2000/xp/vista
[12:06] <Burgundavia_> ah
[12:06] <blueCommand> elektranox, Did you change the orig?
[12:07] <Burgundavia_> that would be an interesting challenge
[12:07] <blueCommand> elektranox, I get diffrent MD5sums from the SF.net one and yours
[12:07] <ScottK> But this probably isn't the place to get Windows programming help.
[12:07] <xtknight> actually if you just grab the pci ids from windows and then compare them against the ubuntu pciids youve basiccally got it
[12:07] <xtknight> ah no im good with the win32 api
[12:08] <Burgundavia_> another way you could do it would be to build it into the installer
[12:08] <elektranox> mh I'm not sure - I think I'll just download the SF.net ones
[12:08] <xtknight> i'd actually rather it be separate (i bet they would too)
[12:08] <xtknight> maybe it could be on the autorun.exe for the ubuntu cd
[12:08] <Burgundavia_> xtknight: for that kind of stuff, I recommend you chat with colin watson or evan dandrea
[12:08] <blueCommand> elektranox, I will see if I can get a diff
[12:09] <Burgundavia_> xtknight: they are cjwatson and evand on irc
[12:09] <xtknight> so you stick in the ubuntu cd in windows and it brings it up, but it doesnt interfere with install or anytihng
[12:09] <xtknight> Burgundavia_, okay thanks
[12:09] <xtknight> ill prolly have to do this later, just wanted to check 
[12:09] <Burgundavia_> xtknight: another good way is to start the spec process
[12:09] <Burgundavia_> xtknight: are you familiar with that?
[12:09] <xtknight> Burgundavia_, not too much but i know about launchpad
[12:09] <Burgundavia_> basically, the idea behind a spec is to lay out exactly what you are going to do
[12:09] <xtknight> kinda confused what the difference is between a spec, a blueprint, and the other things they have there
[12:10] <Burgundavia_> blueprint == spec
[12:10] <Burgundavia_> but first chat with them, see what works best
[12:10] <xtknight> cool thx
[12:10] <Burgundavia_> I know there is a talk of a windows installer as well
[12:10] <Burgundavia_> but no real work yet
[12:10] <xtknight> figured since im not very adept with linux api i'd put my win32 api skills to work
[12:10] <blueCommand> ScottK, Do you know if renaming the directory "gafix-0.9.1" to "gafix-0.9.1.orig" is valid?
[12:10] <xtknight> and this is the perfect opportunity really
[12:10] <xtknight> help ubuntu by using win32api, couldnt get any better ;)
[12:11] <xtknight> anyhoo be back in a bit
[12:11] <Burgundavia_> ok
[12:11] <Burgundavia_> tag me if you have any questions