[12:20] <DaSkreech> ryanakca: I was going to say semantik but never mind
[12:22] <ryanakca> kwwii: ok
[12:22] <ryanakca> DaSkreech: okies :)
[12:22] <DaSkreech> It's a KDE4 app
[12:22] <ryanakca> yeah, looks cool, from what I see on kde-apps :)
[12:24] <DaSkreech> Yeah It's just kdissert ++
[12:24] <DaSkreech> !info kdissert
[12:24] <DaSkreech> !info semantik
[12:24] <ubotu> kdissert: mindmapping tool. In component universe, is optional. Version 1.0.6.c-2ubuntu1 (feisty), package size 895 kB, installed size 2668 kB
[12:24] <ubotu> Package semantik does not exist in feisty, feisty-seveas
[12:24] <nixternal> ahh, I need to map my mind...I am always losing it
[12:49] <kwwii> man, kpdf SUCKS
[12:50] <kwwii> almost fscked up the printing of CD's due to it's lack of decent anti-aliasing
[12:51] <fdoving> libpoppler sucks for pritning, xpdf is much better. there is a bug-report somewhere.
[12:53] <kwwii> more and more I end up using gnome apps due to the fact that they simply work better :-(
[12:53] <kwwii> except konqueror - I still love good old konqi :-)
[08:53] <Tonio_> yo
[08:54] <nixternal> yo
[08:57] <nixternal> uh oh
[08:59] <nixternal> to late
[08:59] <nixternal> I have been doomed since day one
[09:01] <Hobbsee> heh
[09:01] <Tonio_> yo Hobbsee ;)
[09:02] <Hobbsee> heya Tonio_!
[09:10] <nixternal> g'nite
[09:11] <Hobbsee> night oh doomed one
[09:11] <Hobbsee> !nixternal | nixternal
[09:11] <ubotu> nixternal: Oh no!  The pointy-clicky Vista lover has arrived!  He's rumoured to be giving out free money, too!
[09:12] <_StefanS_> morning
[09:21] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: hey, you up for some hacking ? :)
[09:27] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: yup
[09:27] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: kdebluztooth works :)
[09:28] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: http://ubuntu.tonio.homelinux.org
[09:28] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: please test
[09:28] <Tonio_> everything is just fine with me
[09:28] <Tonio_> except uploading a file
[09:30] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: sweet
[09:31] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: yes !! I see my mouse nmow
[09:31] <_StefanS_> now
[09:31] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: I see the .service files are in place ;)
[09:31] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: and /usr/lib/bluetoothd-input|serial as well
[09:32] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: want me to dig into the file upload thingy?
[09:34] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: everything is done :)
[09:34] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: just dist-upgrade using my repo and that'll work
[09:34] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: also file file upload?
[09:34] <Tonio_> nope, not yet.....
[09:34] <Tonio_> would be nice to investigate on that point
[09:35] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: well that was what I meant :) "want me to dig into the file upload thingy?"
[09:35] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: yeah I know....
[09:36] <Tonio_> brb, awaken this time :)
[09:36] <_StefanS_> gotta reboot
[09:52] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: do you know any way to change the steps for the volume up/down in kmilo ?
[10:06] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: have you tried to browse your phone's directories, and click the "Up" icon in konqueror? the path doesn't work correctly
[10:08] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: must be something with  konqueror
[10:11] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: that worked with obex:/
[10:11] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: looks like obex2:/ needs love :)
[10:11] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: probably ;)
[10:11] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: you can compare with the code of actual kdebluetooth version
[10:11] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: might find interesting things in the code to improve the second version
[10:12] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: right, what actual kdebluetooth version do you mean ?
[10:12] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: the on in the repos
[10:12] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: kde's ?
[10:12] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: or ubuntu?
[10:12] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: 0.99-beta2
[10:12] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: ubuntu
[10:13] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: I'm sure we can get it to work pretty easilly
[10:13] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: right
[10:13] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: eventually Riddell can commit to the kde svn branch btw
[10:13] <Tonio_> s/we/you :)
[10:13] <_StefanS_> :)
[10:13] <Tonio_> unfortunatelly I can only package and test
[10:14] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: what do you mean ? havent you got gutsy installed?
[10:14] <Tonio_> yes, but gutsy doesn't have the latest kdebluetooth in the repos
[10:14] <_StefanS_> nope, thats right.
[10:14] <Tonio_> http://packages.ubuntu.com/cgi-bin/search_packages.pl?keywords=kdebluetooth&searchon=names&subword=1&version=gutsy&release=all
[10:14] <_StefanS_> got it now
[10:14] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: I need to write a MIR for this
[10:15] <Tonio_> will do that right now
[10:15] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: do you know where the obex/obex2 code is in the package?
[10:15] <_StefanS_> ah got it.
[10:17] <Tonio_> :)
[10:17] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: I negociated a bit and we'll probably release with hidd enabled
[10:18] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: that's usefull for autoreconnect, as the kdebluetooth frontend just replaces the hidd search
[10:18] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: I tested disconnection and reconnection, works perfectly graphically btw, which is very good for us
[10:19] <_StefanS_> Tonio_:  hidd: sounds good. I have it disabled now, and mouse works anyways.
[10:19] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: yes but you had to connect it right ?
[10:19] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: did it work just while booting
[10:20] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: yep, it asked me when I logged in and turned on the mouse
[10:20] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: I had to accept the connection, and then it worked.
[10:20] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: (I dialog asked me..)
[10:20] <Tonio_> it asked you ? col :)
[10:20] <_StefanS_> I/a
[10:20] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: yep
[10:20] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: with hidd enabled, you shouldn't have to accept
[10:20] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: well I disabled hidd just to test what you said yesterday :)
[10:21] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: requires testing to be sure that works, if it doesn't, no need to enable hid by default
[10:21] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: and it worked well without
[10:21] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: how about rebooting with hidd enabled ? will it autoreconnect the mouse ?
[10:21] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: yep
[10:21] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: hidd is just for autoreconnection afaik, the dbus thing just avoids using hidd cli as I said
[10:21] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: oki great
[10:22] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: so we need hidd enabled by default
[10:22] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: just to recap... I sorta tested the other way around, so first with HIDD = enabled, and it just worked with the mouse. Second I disabled HIDD, and was asked to verify that I indeed wanted to connect the mouse
[10:23] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: yes, enabling HIDD would be alot easier for the users. It just "works".
[10:23] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: I will look at that obex/obex2 thing
[10:24] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: super, you rock :)
[10:24] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: ping ?
[10:24] <_StefanS_> :)
[10:24] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: semi-pong
[10:24] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: I just realised I promissed someone to get kplayer in the archives for gutsy :) I'm just doing the packaging, will you have some time today to review ?
[10:25] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: perhaps.  unsure.  i'm going out in a minute
[10:25] <Hobbsee> stdin: meaning "i'm partially here"
[10:26] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: oki ;)
[10:26] <stdin> like being out of shift with the space-time continuum ?
[10:26] <_StefanS_> stdin: where's stderr?
[10:26] <stdin> _StefanS_: off sick
[10:26] <stdin> :)
[10:26] <_StefanS_> :)
[10:27] <_StefanS_> touch
[10:30] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: I have a feisty laptop around, I think I know what is causing it
[10:32] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: great
[10:33] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: talking about the "up" thing or the 32KB thing ?
[10:33] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: up thing at the moment.
[10:33] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: k
[10:33] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: @bluetooth ..
[10:33] <_StefanS_> obex://[00:1c:35:4f:0a:45] :10/Card memory vs. obex2://00:1c:35:4f:0a:45@bluetooth:10/Card memory
[10:34] <Tonio_> hum interesting
[10:34] <_StefanS_> I find it funny as well, that the []  is removed also.. that part seems to work though
[10:36] <Tonio_> hum that kplayer is just so nice......... incredible
[10:41] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: I just sent you a mail.. check out that debug
[10:41] <Tonio_> oki
[10:41] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: I think it just cant get the source file filesize actually
[10:42] <Tonio_> hum oki but why is that required to upload the file ?
[10:43] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: ho right, the file is read to be 32KB
[10:43] <_StefanS_> :)
[10:43] <Tonio_> how stupid.....
[10:44] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: I suspect that's not that hard to fix right
[10:44] <Tonio_> ?
[10:44] <_StefanS_> :) right
[10:44] <_StefanS_> I' will post back when I find something
[10:44] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: by analogy with sql, I just suspect this is a matter of buffer definition or something ?
[10:45] <_StefanS_> Tonio_:  I'm not sure yet
[10:45] <Tonio_> k
[10:45] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: actually I believe a system call would reveal its correct size for putFile()
[10:46] <Tonio_> nixternal: ping ?
[10:47] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: oki :)
[10:47] <Tonio_> nixternal: I just repackaged kplayer for revu
[10:47] <Tonio_> nixternal: didn't see anything in debian yet, so I though that due to freezes approaching, it would be nice to have something packaged....
[10:48] <Tonio_> nixternal: I didn't split the package at all, as only one backend is compatible, so I didn't see any need of package splitting
[10:48] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: thats just goofy... they miss the code for determining the filesize completely.
[10:48] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: mouarf ;)
[10:48] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: looking at the download thing, its all there.
[10:48] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: getFile()
[10:48] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: how stupid.........
[10:53] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: do they test what they code sometimes ? :)
[10:54] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: well they surely havent tested this.
[11:08] <Tonio_> nixternal: just looked at the comments on the revu page for kplayer.... WTF is that ?
[11:08] <Tonio_> Reasons for non-advocation:
[11:09] <Tonio_> 4) .desktop file shouldnt use a type extension for the icon
[11:09] <Tonio_> 1) The kplayer binary still has 51% (4MB) in /usr/share
[11:09] <Tonio_> nixternal: do they smoke ?
[11:09] <Tonio_> nixternal: should we recode every app we package ?
[11:09] <Tonio_> the funny thing is this :
[11:09] <Tonio_> 2) Consider using debian/kplayer.manpages instead of DEB_INSTALL_MANPAGES_kplayer := debian/kplayer.1 in debian/rules
[11:10] <Tonio_> -> consider doing the way I like and not the way you like, despite both ways are perfectly correct and work.....
[11:11] <Tonio_> so they expect we'll patch the build system to change the icon place, and then patch desktop files
[11:11] <Tonio_> just for absolutly no change to the user, and nothing anyone will figure out ? that's just ridiculous....
[11:13] <Tonio_> we should drop OOo from the repos then, it doesn't have icons in pixmaps too...........
[11:15] <Riddell> desktop files shouldn't have the icon name extension in them, that is a bug
[11:15] <Tonio_> I know, but I wouldn't reject an upload for this, honnestly.....
[11:15] <Riddell> saving 4MB*no-of-arches in the archives is a good idea
[11:15] <Tonio_> I would note it and ask to ping upstream....
[11:16] <Riddell> 2 is daft
[11:16] <Tonio_> Riddell: I don't say the comments are bad, I just say than rejecting for this is stupid...
[11:16] <Tonio_> Riddell: we can drop 90% of packages in the archives then
[11:17] <Tonio_> Riddell: and concerning 1) except splitting the doc, where is the difference ?
[11:18] <Tonio_> Riddell: split to have datas in -common package, and make kplayer package depends on kplayer-common
[11:18] <Tonio_> doesn't make any difference to me.....
[11:18] <Tonio_> splitting the doc, I'd say why not, even if I don't see the need of this except for defualt inclusion to keep space on the cd....
[11:19] <Tonio_> Riddell: btw, those are good comments, but , imho, strange reasons for rejecting a package.....
[11:20] <Tonio_> Riddell: concerning the doc splitting, that also can be annoying since most people won't figure out the doc package, and miss the documentation...
[11:20] <fdoving> splitting kplayer into 3 packages? - that sounds insane. isn't it just that little player-thing?
[11:20] <Riddell> I'd have a -data package and make the main one depend on it
[11:21] <Riddell> this is just revu right?  it's not being rejected it's being reviewed
[11:21] <Tonio_> Riddell: I see your point in keeping 4mb datas in the archives, of course, but well, to many splitting makes dealing with packages supercomplex for the users....
[11:22] <Tonio_> Riddell: yes I know, but well, a too complex accepting policy is not always good...
[11:22] <Tonio_> look at the last comment...
[11:23] <Tonio_> Riddell: "forget this, I'll get the package in debian, and it'll be sync in ubuntu"....
[11:23] <Tonio_> fdoving: yeah it is just a little player.....
[11:23] <Tonio_> fdoving: I wouldn't split this one, except to go in main, as we need to take care of the size used on the cd
[11:24] <Tonio_> fdoving: if we start splitting every package to keep space in the archives, we will never see the end..... and dealing with packages will become a nightmare for the users
[11:24] <Tonio_> fdoving: lots of them already complain that for example typing openoffice in adept gives 200 results, what should they install then ?
[11:26] <fdoving> debian? :)
[11:26] <Riddell> use adept-installer
[11:28] <Tonio_> Riddell: not everything is in it
[11:28] <Tonio_> Riddell: and btw how do you install an app documentation with adept-installer ?
[11:28] <Tonio_> Riddell: youhave to do it with adept..... that's the problem
[11:29] <Tonio_> Riddell: and I don't think missing the documentation of an installed application is good
[11:29] <Riddell> I've never suggested doing that
[11:29] <Tonio_> Riddell: I know, but that comes with the idea of splitting the package to keep space in the archives
[11:30] <Tonio_> Riddell: that's a consequence
[11:30] <Riddell> no it's not, as I said you make a -data package and make the full package depend on it
[11:30] <Tonio_> but yeah, that can be done for icons and things like that
[11:30] <Tonio_> Riddell: that is indeed more acceptable
[11:31] <Riddell> however, the true lesson is that if nobody sane bothers with revu then you'll end up with perniquerty people only reviewing stuff
[11:33] <Tonio_> Riddell: true
[11:44] <Riddell> apachelogger_: khalkhiapplet uploaded
[12:14] <apachelogger_> Riddell: thx
[12:19] <Riddell> oh jings, they added an embedded terminal to dolphin
[12:23] <Riddell> apachelogger: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=6226 kopete-otr uploaded
[12:26] <Riddell> apachelogger: what's the status of kopete-thinklight ?
[12:28] <apachelogger> Riddell: looking for tester of new permission setting included by upstream, and waiting for upstream to include a COPYING.LIB
[12:47] <Tonio_> Riddell: great, I use the embedded terminal a lot
[12:47] <Tonio_> Riddell: one thing I'd like to see in kubuntu and dolphin is the little zoom effect I added to konq
[12:48] <Tonio_> Riddell: I'll try to adapt the patch
[12:52] <kwwii_away> but dolphin was supposed to be simple - here we go with the geek-ificaiton of the newest attempts to fix things
[12:54] <Riddell> exactly
[12:59] <Tonio_> kwwii, Riddell: true, but well, OSX is meant to be simple, without geek-ification, and has the same effect
[12:59] <Tonio_> the effect is not geeky, just smooth imho :)
[12:59] <Riddell> it doesn't have a terminal embedded in Finder!
[12:59] <kwwii> having a built in terminal is simply geeky
[12:59] <kwwii> there is no need for it
[12:59] <Tonio_> kwwii: ho, the terminal........ yeah I can agree on that point
[01:00] <kwwii> the zoom effect is a nice idea ;-)
[01:02] <Tonio_> kwwii: I just hope patching dolphin for this will not be too complicated
[01:02] <Tonio_> Riddell: we didn't resolve the problem if dolphin and ark..... I'll have a look on that point
[01:02] <Tonio_> Riddell: also, how can a user switch back to konq by default ?
[01:05] <Riddell> by changing the inode/directory mimetype preference (or removing the file that changes it in k-d-s)
[01:16] <Tonio_> Riddell: not very friendly....
[01:17] <Tonio_> Riddell: would be nice to be able to use the component chooser in systemsettings, but it might be too late to code this...
[01:17] <Tonio_> Riddell: would you have some time for a quick revu ?
[01:18] <Riddell> what's to revu?
[01:21] <Tonio_> Riddell: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=6284
[01:21] <Tonio_> I think the package is ready this time
[01:21] <Tonio_> about nixternal comment, I'll of course sync once the package is in debian, but I'd like to have it ready for gutsy
[01:28] <Riddell> Tonio_: a couple of comments (of which the first is the blocker) http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=6284
[01:30] <Tonio_> Riddell: I was sure you were about to say that hehe :)
[01:31] <Tonio_> Riddell: what about elmo said the other day ?
[01:31] <Tonio_> did that only concern the debian/copyright or also the tarball ?
[01:34] <Riddell> Tonio_: which part of what elmo said
[01:34] <Riddell> Tonio_: you don't need all copyright holders, but I would say you need all licences mentioned in debian/copyright
[01:34] <Riddell> and at the least the licence text needs to be included in the tar
[01:35] <Tonio_> hum oki
[01:52] <mhb> good afternoon
[02:15] <Tonio_> Riddell: should be okay this time
[02:15] <Tonio_> Riddell: also concerning the 2 space for the homepage
[02:27] <Tonio_> Riddell: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=6284
[02:28] <Riddell> apachelogger: seen my comments on your kio-sysinfo package?
[02:28] <Tonio_> Riddell: discovered a nasty bug in dolphin.....
[02:28] <Tonio_> Riddell: did you play with the "split" option ?
[02:28] <Tonio_> just ugly
[02:28] <Riddell> split seems to work
[02:29] <Riddell> but no icon previews in dolphin sucks
[02:39] <Tonio_> Riddell: works, but isn't the second window position completly stupid ?
[02:39] <Tonio_> Riddell: yes, taht sucks, I agree
[02:39] <Riddell> it makes the information pane wider
[02:40] <Tonio_> Riddell: that's it
[02:40] <Tonio_> Riddell: and you have to resize manually everytime you activate this
[02:40] <Tonio_> also you can only compress folders, not files...............
[02:40] <Hobbsee> :)
[02:41] <Tonio_> Riddell: honnestly, I start wondering if switching to dolphin is a good idea.....
[02:41] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: I'm still onto that readData() thing of bluetooth.. I'm getting closer :)
[02:41] <Tonio_> Riddell: lots of users will probably complain
[02:41] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: you rock :)
[02:41] <Tonio_> Riddell: dolphin in kde4 seems great, but the kde3 version seems a bit limited for a all day long usage, no ?
[02:42] <sebas> No :-)
[02:42] <Tonio_> sebas: talking about kde3 right ? :)
[02:42] <sebas> (But kde4's dolphin is cooler, that's right)
[02:42] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: its fast!
[02:42] <sebas> Yes. I'm using it for months already
[02:42] <Riddell> Tonio_: a couple of comments, nothing major http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=6286
[02:42] <Tonio_> sebas: well, how do you for example compress a big text file with it ?
[02:43] <sebas> Tonio_: I don't, usually. When I have to, it's usually in kmail, and there's the tickbox
[02:43] <Tonio_> Riddell: thanks, I'll fix concerning the second point
[02:43] <sebas> So, I've got limited usecases, but then it works fine for me.
[02:43] <Tonio_> Riddell: looks like a lot of package don't use capitalized "homepage"
[02:44] <Tonio_> sebas: my point is that I'm really unsure what it'll be for most people usage...
[02:45] <Riddell> Tonio_: ok
[02:47] <sebas> Tonio_: Frankly, the autoresizing listview makes up for it for me at least.
[02:48] <Tonio_> sebas: using the split thing ?
[02:48] <sebas> No, normal view
[02:48] <Tonio_> Riddell: how to know what are the licences for admin/ files ?
[02:49] <sebas> No horizontal scrollbars like in konqueror, that annoyed the shit out of me.
[02:49] <Riddell> Tonio_: well look at them, but you can get away with just saying "some files are LGPL"
[02:49] <Tonio_> Riddell: only acinclude.m4.in clearly has a licence in the code
[02:50] <Tonio_> also doxygen.sh has a licence, and that's it.....
[02:50] <Riddell> am_edit has a strange licence too
[02:50] <Tonio_> that admin/ content really bores me today :)
[02:51] <Tonio_> hum I should have grep "general" and not gpl hehe :)
[02:52] <Tonio_> but only one seems to be lgpl at least
[02:52] <Riddell> don't list specific files, that way disaster looms
[02:54] <Tonio_> Riddell: no of course, I just wanted to do that for me :)
[02:54] <Tonio_> to know about those licences in admin/
[02:54] <Tonio_> they caused me so many "NO" recently that I want to make it clear ;)
[02:56] <fdoving> hum.. my maxtor 1touch usb-disk died yesterday. i wonder if that has anything to do with the sync/async settings. it couldn't handle backups every night for more than 3 years. ohwell.
[02:57] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: now I can write 64kb ! thats twice as good :)
[02:57] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: LOL
[02:58] <_StefanS_> hehe
[02:58] <fdoving> Tonio_: you can copy over the servicemenus from konq to dolphin.
[02:58] <_StefanS_> fdoving: let me handle all the copying .. as long as it isn't above 64 kb :)
[02:59] <_StefanS_> well back to hacking again ..
[02:59] <fdoving> _StefanS_: sure thing :)
[03:04] <Tonio_> fdoving: it is not a servicemenu for konq, but a lib
[03:04] <Tonio_> fdoving: dolphin kde3 isn't compatible with konqueror plugins, that's my problem with it
[03:05] <fdoving> Tonio_: most things can be done with servicemenus.
[03:05] <Tonio_> fdoving: well I tried, but ark is hardly reproducible
[03:06] <Tonio_> fdoving: especially as the content of the context menu isn't static with it
[03:08] <Tonio_> fdoving: honnestly, I'm playing with dolphin for a few days now and I start wondering if it is ready to be used as default for everyone....
[03:08] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: isn't the meeting today ?
[03:08] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: for you
[03:08] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: my today only lasts for another 52 mins
[03:08] <mhb> ah :o)
[03:08] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: hehe oki :)
[03:09] <Tonio_> fdoving: especially since it'll be kinda hard to switch back to konq as default for noobs.....
[03:10] <mhb> Hobbsee: have you worked on that "kubuntu-kde4" meta package?
[03:10] <Hobbsee> mhb: nope!
[03:10] <Tonio_> fdoving: don't get me wrong, I'm not against dolphin, as I submitted the idea of dolphin in gutsy, but the more I use it, the more I'm a bit unsure if we're doing the good thing.....
[03:11] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: i'll second that.  it's still a little...well, very different, and missing some stuff
[03:11] <Tonio_> mhb, Hobbsee should't we wait for kde4 to be out to start the default settings for it ?
[03:11] <Tonio_> I mean to may things are going to change before the release, and we'll have to undo lots of things if we start now....
[03:12] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: very different isn't the problem, immature is an issue :)
[03:12] <Hobbsee> that's wha ti meant
[03:12] <Hobbsee> my brain is fried
[03:12] <Hobbsee> i need more sleep
[03:12] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: like the bug on spliting windows, the lack of ark integration, of capability to switch back to konqueror, etc....
[03:12] <mhb> Tonio_: may be, but we'd like to have a metapackage for KDE4, so that users are able to install pre-relase KDE4 easily
[03:12] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: exactly
[03:12] <ScottK> You need to use kmail as your mail clieant (for Hobbsee from ubuntu-devel)
[03:12] <Hobbsee> hah
[03:13] <mhb> Tonio_: finding packages like "kdeliba5" or "kde4base" is pretty hard
[03:13] <Hobbsee> mhb: everything should be a dependancy of kde4base, it seems
[03:14] <Tonio_> mhb: ho sorry you talked about a metapackage, I though you meant starting a defualt settings thing added to a metapackage :) sorry for the stupid comment then
[03:14] <ScottK> Hobbsee: As long as one doesn't use IMAP it's very good.  (IIRC you use IMAP, so ...)
[03:14] <mhb> still, I'm for a cool-name package like "kubuntu-kde4". It's easier to remember and we can add the default-settings later)
[03:14] <Tonio_> ScottK: kmail is excellent for imap, but using the disconnected mode
[03:14] <Hobbsee> ScottK: yes, i use imap
[03:14] <ScottK> Ah.
[03:14] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: what's the point of disconnected imap?
[03:15] <ScottK> Tonio_: Excellent disconnected or excellent when not disconnected?
[03:15] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: download the all messages every X minutes, like pop
[03:15] <Tonio_> but doing the sync local/remote the way imap does
[03:15] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: the only difference is that you are not all day long connected
[03:15] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: pretty nice for my usage, pinging the server every 5 minutes
[03:16] <Tonio_> ScottK: kmail is excellent when using disconnected mode
[03:16] <ScottK> OK.  Understood.  Good to know.
[03:16] <Tonio_> ScottK: I don't know concerning the standard imap (aka connected) since I don't use it
[03:16] <ScottK> Thanks.
[03:17] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: ah right
[03:17] <ScottK> There were claims that it wouldn't suck anymore for 3.5.7, but I haven't tested it.
[03:17] <Tonio_> ScottK: btw disconnected is way better when spending lots of time reading my mail in the train hehe :)
[03:17] <ScottK> I bet.
[03:18] <Tonio_> ScottK: looks like they've patched lots of things yes, but well I may not be able to test as I spend 40% of my maling time in the train :)
[03:18] <Tonio_> disconnected mode is just de facto the mode I need
[03:18] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: have 3 minutes to review this please ? ;)
[03:18] <ScottK> Makes sense.
[03:18] <Tonio_> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=6286
[03:19] <ScottK> Of course, patched lots of things may or may not get you all the way to doesn't suck.
[03:19] <Tonio_> ScottK: sure, anyone testing giving his opinion would be nice
[03:20] <ScottK> Figure out if Kmail IMAP still sucks -> TODO
[03:21] <ScottK> Got it.
[03:42] <_StefanS_> Riddell: that was quite a kde4 upload ;)
[03:47] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: it iterates through all the kbytes now, just need to memcpy to the buffer, which will be sent to putFile().
[04:11] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: great :)
[04:57] <Hobbsee> uh oh.  meeting in 6 hours.
[04:58] <mhb> Hobbsee: shouldn't you be sleeping now so you can wake up for the meeting? :o)
[04:59] <Hobbsee> mhb: yeah, but i had to deal with motu blowing up and such
[05:01] <Riddell> motu blew up?
[05:02] <Hobbsee> Riddell: Kmos
[05:02] <ScottK> Ugh.
[05:12] <ScottK> Riddell: It looks to me like opensus just published an update for CVE-2007-3388 which affects qt3.  mitre.org doesn't list it yet: http://www.cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvename.cgi?name=2007-3388 - Do you want the suse announcement?
[05:12] <ubotu> ** RESERVED ** This candidate has been reserved by an organization or individual that will use it when announcing a new security problem.  When the candidate has been publicized, the details for this candidate will be provided. (http://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvename.cgi?name=CVE-2007-3388)
[05:12] <ScottK> It's got the words "execute arbitrary code" in it.
[05:13] <Riddell> ScottK: presumably this one http://trolltech.com/company/newsroom/announcements/press.2007-07-27.7503755960 ?
[05:13] <Riddell> yes
[05:13] <ScottK> What address is best?
[05:13] <Riddell> address?
[05:13] <ScottK> Email address.
[05:14] <Hobbsee> ScottK: i'd suggest you give norsetto some of 'apt-cache unmet -i | grep Package''s that look sane to fix.
[05:14] <ScottK> OK.
[05:14] <ScottK> Or yes, it's the same?
[05:14] <Riddell> what am I being e-mailed?
[05:14] <ScottK> I thought your yes was a response to should I send you the opensuse announcement.
[05:14] <ScottK> I'm guessing that was wrong.
[05:14] <ScottK> It was yes, it's the same...
[05:15] <Riddell> it waw
[05:15] <Riddell> was
[05:16] <ScottK> OK.  Well just wanted to make sure you knew.
[05:16] <Riddell> you either need to convince kees to prioritise it above the other security stuff he's doing, or wait for me to finnish with kde 4 and get on to it
[05:17] <ScottK> No problem.  Just wanted to make sure it hadn't been missed.
[05:18] <Riddell> I'm really looking forward to compiling and testing 8 qts :)
[05:18] <ScottK> I'm sure.
[05:32] <Hobbsee> as in, if i do, i'm likely not go;ing to be coherant
[05:42] <Hobbsee> heh
[05:46] <Riddell> need a wakeup call?
[05:47] <Hobbsee> Riddell: i seriously dont think i'd be coherant enough even for that
[05:47] <Riddell> fair enough
[07:06] <nixternal> are we ready for some meeting love today?
[07:07] <fdoving> what time is the meeting?
[07:08] <fdoving> in 4 hours.
[07:08] <nixternal> ya
[07:08] <nixternal> hehe
[07:09] <nixternal> Tonio_: do you have any idea on how to properly relibtoolize the kplayer package? that is all I am working on right now in order to get it sponsored into Debian
[07:16] <bddebian> Heya
[07:18] <fdoving> hi bddebian.
[07:18] <bddebian> Hello fdoving
[07:25] <Tonio_> nixternal: what is the problem with this ?
[07:25] <nixternal> all of the lib files in the kplayer deb
[07:25] <nixternal> man, I just realised that this latest release is GPLv3
[07:28] <Tonio_> nixternal: yes but what is the problem with the libs ?
[07:28] <nixternal> none that I know of..I was just told by a DD that it needs to be relibtoolized
[07:30] <Riddell> nixternal: !
[07:30] <Riddell> nixternal: of kplayer?
[07:30] <nixternal> uh oh
[07:30] <nixternal> Riddell: yes
[07:31] <Riddell> nixternal: well it's not distributable then, Qt being GPL 2 only
[07:31] <nixternal> ya, that is why I just said the part about just realising that
[07:31] <Tonio_> Riddell: why relibtoolizing something as long as it builds, works and is nice ?
[07:32] <Tonio_> Riddell: argh, I didn't figure out this, indeed.....
[07:32] <nixternal> Tonio_: I would like to know the same for future references
[07:32] <nixternal> hehe
[07:32] <Riddell> Tonio_: dunno, you'd have to ask whoever wanted it
[07:32] <Riddell> debian qt-kde packagers like to keep their .diff.gz clean of anything outside debian/
[07:33] <Tonio_> Riddell: means no buildprep for example...
[07:33] <Riddell> means you run buildprep and put the diff into a patch
[07:33] <Tonio_> Riddell: in a certain way that's good, since that helps for easy package update
[07:35] <Tonio_> Riddell: stop me if I'm wrong, but is it really impossible to redistribute a gpl3 app using gpl2/only code ?
[07:35] <ScottK> According to GNU it is.
[07:35] <Riddell> it is impossible
[07:36] <Tonio_> grmpf, how stupid.....
[07:36] <nixternal> yup
[07:36] <Tonio_> nixternal: e should ping upstream about that....
[07:36] <Riddell> of trolltech for not updating to gpl 3?
[07:36] <nixternal> I read the RMS talk about how they are incompatible
[07:36] <nixternal> Riddell: no, for it being imcompatible
[07:36] <Tonio_> Riddell: nope, of the next version of the licence beeing uncompatible with the previous one......
[07:36] <nixternal> ya, I can speeel
[07:36] <Riddell> that's sort of the point of it
[07:37] <Tonio_> Riddell: but that would be possible with some "gpl v2 or higher" code right ?
[07:37] <fdoving> stupid gpl3.
[07:37] <Riddell> Tonio_: sure, it's just qt that's the blocker
[07:38] <Riddell> nothing stupid about gpl 3 that I've noticed
[07:38] <Tonio_> Riddell: yes, but it means that atm, any qt or kde based gpl3 application is not distribuable
[07:38] <Tonio_> Riddell: because it has 2 different FREE licences that conflict, both licences coming from the same fundation ?
[07:39] <Tonio_> Riddell: that's one of the most stupid things ever.....
[07:40] <Riddell> choosing a licence which makes your app undistributable is somewhat daft
[07:40] <Tonio_> Riddell: the guy probably didn't knew that
[07:40] <Tonio_> Riddell: but I'll have to ping him then....
[07:41] <Tonio_> Riddell: well whoever is the fault, this is just a stupid situation.... ;)
[07:42] <Tonio_> Riddell: I'll ping upstream toonight on that point
[07:46] <Tonio_> Riddell: one question (maybe stupid) come to my mind....
[07:46] <Tonio_> Riddell: how can a kde-app be licenced "gpl v2 or at your option any later version" if qt iv v2 only and v3 uncompatible ?
[07:47] <Tonio_> Riddell: doesn't make sense to me....
[07:47] <nixternal> Tonio_: I emailed kiriuja about it. I don't blame him/her if they want to keep it GPLv3..we need more people pushing for the change honestly..and I hate this incompatibility issue
[07:47] <Riddell> so that we don't have to re-licence all of KDE when qt becomes gpl 3 happy
[07:47] <Riddell> not all of KDE is "or later" though alas
[07:48] <Tonio_> Riddell: okay then it makes sense :) didn't thought about the fact qt might change :)
[07:49] <Tonio_> nixternal: I don't blame him at all, I just think that making the 2 licences uncompatible will oblige people to switch one day if they want to make their software distribuable
[07:49] <Tonio_> nixternal: same thing microsoft does with incompatibility to oblige people to upgrade their softwares
[07:49] <Tonio_> nixternal: same thing I hate
[07:49] <nixternal> ya
[07:50] <nixternal> ya, that kind of kills a lot of things as well
[07:50] <Tonio_> nixternal: where is the "ability to choose" when to make a distribuable software, you have to use the licence that is choosen for you in the first place ?
[07:50] <nixternal> so no v3 kernel modules, you can't link to v2 stuff
[07:50] <nixternal> Tonio_: when you find that answer, let me know :)
[07:51] <Tonio_> nixternal: so stupid........
[07:52] <nixternal> that it is
[07:52] <Tonio_> okay so let's comment on revu so that people don't waste their time on it.....
[07:53] <nixternal> hehe
[07:54] <nixternal> if only I read the last line of the changelog for KPlayer, it states "that all versions from this point on will be GPLv3"
[07:54] <Riddell> nixternal: linux modules would have to be gpl 2 or gpl2 or later
[07:54] <Riddell> same as KDE
[07:54] <nixternal> ahh
[07:54] <nixternal> so if it has the "gpl2 or later" then it is fine?
[07:55] <Riddell> sure
[07:55] <nixternal> gotcha..and Qt is gpl2 only, no "later" clause
[07:55] <ScottK> Yep
[07:55] <ScottK> As is a lot of stuff.
[07:55] <Tonio_> okay let's go to lunch, brb for the meeting
[07:56] <nixternal> I am glad I just learned that...I have been slowly working on an app, top secret, that was planned for GPLv3
[07:56] <nixternal> haha
[07:56] <nixternal> lunch time!
[07:56] <nixternal> ScottK is buying
[07:56] <ScottK> Sorry, not lunch time here.
[07:56] <nixternal> ya, 2pm there
[07:57] <nixternal> Riddell: I see you are rocking on the KDE 4 packages btw...I hadn't even realised the x.92 release until the commit messages this morning
[07:57] <Riddell> it hasn't been announced yet
[07:57] <nixternal> I didn't even realise it was time for that to even happen
[07:57] <nixternal> man, time is flying
[07:58] <Riddell> it's a pretty crappy beta to be honest
[07:58] <nixternal> that stinks
[07:58] <nixternal> no major changes since the last release?
[07:59] <Riddell> probably, but it all crashes
[07:59] <nixternal> ouch
[07:59] <nixternal> I have to admit, my SVN copy has been rocking...I am trying to get all of the effects working because I am giving a KDE 4 talk in a couple of weeks at IIT
[08:00] <nixternal> and the more bling, the more Gnome to KDE converters I can get when October rolls around
[08:00] <nixternal> :)
[08:04] <Riddell> optimism, that's what we want :)
[08:17] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: hey.. it works ;)
[08:17] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: got it worked some hours ago, but had to attend to the family.
[08:18] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: first I thought it didn't work at all, but I forgot how slow bluetooth is ;)
[08:26] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: the patch is in your mail.
[08:46] <mhb> hmm, so the edubuntu folks have only one hour for the meeting?
[08:52] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: you rock :)
[09:11] <nixternal> we have a little bit of a problem
[09:11] <nixternal> our meetin is at 21:00 UTC, and the Edubuntu meeting is at 20:00 UTC
[09:11] <nixternal> @schedule
[09:11] <ubotu> Schedule for Etc/UTC: 01 Aug 20:00: Edubuntu | 01 Aug 21:00: Kubuntu Developers | 02 Aug 20:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 07 Aug 15:00: Kernel Team | 08 Aug 12:00: Edubuntu | 09 Aug 15:00: Ubuntu Development Team
[09:12] <nixternal> typically the Edubuntu meetings don't last all that long, so I don't think a delay will be all that big of a deal
[09:14] <_StefanS_> anyone got the highlights from last nights meeting?
[09:15] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: thanks :)
[09:16] <mhb> nixternal: that's what I said few minutes ago :o)
[10:19] <manchicken> Why doesn't kopete have the ability to ignore users?
[10:19] <manchicken> that's so irritating.
[10:32] <prisca_> i just installed kde4-dev and configured kdm to show kde4 in the list but when i choose it and login  i get kicked back to login screen
[10:33] <Riddell> prisca_: did you add the three export lines?
[10:33] <prisca_> yes
[10:35] <Riddell> prisca_: look at the .xsession-errors
[10:37] <prisca_> ok
[10:38] <nixternal> Kubuntu needs a "beach" theme
[10:43] <prisca_> kdecore (KLibLoader): WARNING: KLibrary: /usr/lib/firefox/plugins/libunixprintplugin.so: undefined symbol: NP_GetValue
[10:45] <prisca_> thats probably not the right error line
[10:53] <ryanakca> meeting in 5 minutes?
[10:55] <mhb> ryanakca: it's delayed until the edubuntu folks finish
[10:57] <nixternal> haha, apachelogger what are you getting chears for?
[10:57] <apachelogger> nixternal: membership :D
[10:57] <nixternal> ahhh
[10:57] <nixternal> didn't see you name on the list
[10:57] <apachelogger> Harald Sitter (apachelogger) candidates for Kubuntu-members [WWW]  https://wiki.kubuntu.org/HaraldSitter [WWW]  https://launchpad.net/~apachelogger
[10:57] <nixternal> oh, there it is
[10:57] <apachelogger> very well hidden :P
[11:00] <Riddell> ** kubuntu meeting in #ubuntu-meeting
[11:03] <Riddell> kwwii: ping
[11:43] <ScottK> Tonio_: The big problem right now for backporting clamav into Dapper/Edgy (Feisty is in good shape) is testing and updating the rdepends.
[11:45] <ScottK> Tonio_: On -updates, we've been getting good work done in -security for Feisty, but Dapper/Edgy are still roadblocked by an ancient base clamav version.
[11:45] <ScottK> Not sure how to fix that.
[11:51] <elcuco> Riddell: is that meeting over?
[11:51] <Riddell> elcuco: nope
[11:52] <elcuco> sweet, btw, where can i get the drupal theme used on the main site?