[12:36] <Riddell> evand: uploaded
[12:36] <evand> thanks Riddell!
[03:03] <StevenK> infinity: You'll deal with all the lpia builds that failed due to chroot problems?
[03:21] <infinity> StevenK: Oh, feh.  Yeah, need to fix the buildds to fix that.  Go me.
[03:48] <calc> got a set of debs to test! :-)
[03:49] <calc> assuming these work i just need to update changelog and then upload
[03:50] <calc> everyone else can test them in gutsy ;)
[03:50] <Nafallo> argh ;-)
[03:51] <calc> they work, no hang, yipee :)
[03:51] <StevenK> And the patch was only 5.4Mb? :-P
[03:52] <calc> the patch to fix the original patch was like 80 bytes or something
[03:52] <calc> 2 lines of code change
[03:54] <calc> bbl, doing the changelog now
[04:13] <stiv2k> hi
[04:14] <stiv2k> do i have voice?
[04:14] <stiv2k> ok
[04:14] <Nafallo> no
[04:14] <stiv2k> i have this extremely annoying CUPS problem that all seemed to start when i reformatted my server's hard drive about a month ago...
[04:14] <stiv2k> the printer just disappears on its own after some aarbitrary amount of time has passed since i added it
[04:14] <Nafallo> stiv2k: try #ubuntu first
[04:14] <stiv2k> Nafallo: have
[04:15] <stiv2k> nobdoy knew anything
[04:15] <Nafallo> stiv2k: if it is a bug, then file it.
[04:15] <stiv2k> well i'm not too good at diagnosing this stuff
[04:15] <infinity> StevenK: Fixed.
[04:15] <stiv2k> perhaps someone could help me extract some more details before i file the bug
[04:15] <stiv2k> anyways
[04:16] <stiv2k> i have to constantly re-add the printer only for it to disappear again later
[04:16] <StevenK> infinity: Yay! Can you look at libnss-db now? :-)
[04:16] <Nafallo> stiv2k: or you file a bug and someone tells you what to do... no matter which, this isn't the channel.
[04:16] <infinity> StevenK: I haven't slept...
[04:16] <stiv2k> Nafallo: uh huh...where do you propose i file it
[04:16] <Chipzz> launchpad.net, cups package?
[04:16] <stiv2k> see i dont know if its CUPS that's the problem
[04:17] <stiv2k> it almost seems like a USB problem but i cant put my finger on it
[04:17] <Nafallo> stiv2k: file it against Ubuntu then
[04:17] <Chipzz> if it isn't then it'll get reassigned
[04:17] <Nafallo> or that
[04:17] <Chipzz> but cups sounds like a good starting point
[04:17] <Nafallo> agreed
[04:17] <Nafallo> that or Layer1 :-)
[04:18] <Chipzz> layer1?
[04:18] <stiv2k> hmm
[04:18] <stiv2k> alright
[04:18] <Nafallo> physical layer
[04:21] <stiv2k> dammit
[04:22] <stiv2k> launchpad.net keeps timing out tryign to search for bugs
[04:23] <Chipzz> well I'ld say that since you're not sure the bug is in cups the bug will have to be looked into deeper anyway
[04:23] <stiv2k> what do you mean?
[04:24] <calc> yipee, changelog done
[04:24] <Chipzz> so there's probably not much harm done in filing it without looking for dups then
[04:24] <stiv2k> its a really strange issue
[04:24] <stiv2k> Chipzz: oh i was just trying to search for 'cups' bugs to see if anyone else had the same problem
[04:25] <ScottK> Please look for dups first.
[04:25] <infinity> There's an ongoing war about that.
[04:25] <infinity> I'm in the "please don't look for dupes" camp, myself.
[04:25] <infinity> Because 95% of the "me too" followups I have to bugs are people with DIFFERENT bugs who think they're the same.
[04:25] <infinity> And then trying to separate that is hell.
[04:26] <stiv2k> ScottK: what is dups ?
[04:26] <mjg59> It wouldn't surprise me if it's the USB autosuspend issue
[04:26] <ScottK> stiv2k: Duplicates.
[04:26] <stiv2k> oh
[04:26] <ScottK> infinity does have a point.
[04:27] <infinity> Marking a bug as a duplicate is trivial.  Trying to break one bug into 5 different ones is a pain.
[04:27] <stiv2k> ughh
[04:27] <stiv2k> unfortunately i dont see anyone with the same problem asm e
[04:27] <stiv2k> which just makes me more weary
[04:27] <ScottK> BTW, here are the open bugs against cups https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cupsys/
[04:29] <stiv2k> one thing
[04:30] <stiv2k> i DO remember there being a bug causing cups printers to disappear
[04:30] <stiv2k> something to do with dbus
[04:30] <stiv2k> or libdub
[04:30] <stiv2k> libdbus
[04:30] <stiv2k> but i heard that word of mouth
[04:30] <stiv2k> i never actually saw this bug
[04:30] <calc> i'll have openoffice.org source uploaded in 30m or so
[04:30] <stiv2k> and i dont know if my problem pertains to that
[04:31] <stiv2k> forget it -- i can't find any, i'm submitting one
[04:41] <mathiaz> infinity: Is /etc/apache2/apache2.conf supposed to be overwritten during an apache2 package upgrade ?
[05:01] <calc> er where am i supposed to dput to... 'jackass'?
[05:01] <calc> i got a bounce back saying could not find distribute 'UploadQueue'
[05:01] <calc> er distribution
[05:03] <ScottK> calc: I just dput to upload.ubuntu.com
[05:03] <ScottK> It's the default location in Ubuntu's dput.
[05:06] <calc> ScottK: yea thats what i actually did according to dput info
[05:06] <calc> but it failed with the following
[05:06] <calc> Rejected:
[05:06] <calc> Could not find distribution 'UploadQueue'
[05:06] <calc> Unhandled exception processing upload: [Errno 13]  Permission denied: '/srv/launchpad.net/ubuntu-queue/incoming/upload-20070821-035939-000539/UploadQueue/tmpMMLoBP'
[05:06] <ScottK> That doesn't sound fun.
[05:06] <calc> grr and most of the people that could fix it are asleep
[05:07] <ScottK> Sounds like either you haven't been added to the right whatever it is or it's a bug in the system.
[05:07] <calc> yea
[05:07] <calc> well i'm in core-dev so i think i should be able to upload, unless there is something else to do
[05:07] <calc> i just got added last week though
[05:08] <calc> seems to be a really bad error message in any case, heh
[05:09] <mjg59> calc: Hm. It should just be core-dev
[05:10] <calc> mjg59: ok
[05:10] <mjg59> I don't know enough about the upload queue to know if it's based on groups.
[05:10] <calc> ok
[05:10] <mjg59> Which distribution did you upload to?
[05:10] <calc> gutsy
[05:11] <mjg59> What does your dput.conf look like?
[05:12] <calc> mjg59: http://pastebin.com/d7ad83392
[05:14] <mjg59> calc: Incoming is /, not /UploadQueue
[05:15] <calc> fun, i found a bug in a server then it defaults to that in the dput there
[05:16] <mjg59> Hm. Pretty sure my dput.cf is stock.
[05:17] <mjg59> calc: dput.cf as shipped is just:
[05:17] <mjg59> [ubuntu] 
[05:17] <mjg59> fqdn = upload.ubuntu.com
[05:17] <mjg59> incoming = /
[05:17] <mjg59> login = anonymous
[05:18] <calc> ok
[05:18] <mjg59> The error message is kind of weird, though
[05:19] <calc> yea
[05:20] <infinity> mathiaz: No, it should only be created on a fresh install.  It's a bug if sf broke that...
[05:21] <mathiaz> infinity: ok. Thks. I'll investigate the releveant bug tomorrow.
[05:37] <calc> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/openoffice.org/1:2.3.0~oog680m1-1ubuntu1
[05:37] <calc> :
[05:37] <calc> :)
[05:38] <ScottK> How long does that take to build on the buildd's?
[05:38] <mjg59> calc: Woo!
[05:39] <mjg59> calc: Just in time for freeze
[05:39] <calc> yep
[05:39] <calc> well we have a few days left before tribe-5, not like when i did the upload for tribe-4 ;)
[05:40] <calc> about 10m before the l10n is done uploading
[07:19] <pitti> Good morning
[07:20] <kylem> morning pitti
[07:20] <pitti> hey kylem
[07:26] <StevenK> Morning pitti
[07:26] <pitti> hey StevenK
[07:34] <StevenK> pitti: Would you mind giving gchempaint back on amd64, ia64 and ppc?
[07:34] <pitti> StevenK: done
[07:34] <StevenK> pitti: Thanks. Hopefully, they'll build and libopenbabel1 can be killed.
[07:36] <StevenK> And then I might kill man-di since sear is *still* not sorted out.
[07:50] <StevenK> pitti: And qobex can be killed if the MIR that kdebluetooth is waiting on gets promoted and kdebluetooth builds...
[07:54] <bryce> heya pitti
[07:54] <pitti> hey bryce, how are you?
[07:54] <pitti> StevenK: oh, a lot of KDEish things were recently approved, right; I'll promote them
[07:55] <bryce> doing ok.  My new fiancee's moving in this past week
[07:55] <pitti> bryce: did you get a nice ring?
[07:55] <pitti> bryce: and congratulations!
[07:55] <bryce> oh yeah :-)
[07:55] <pitti> bryce: took a little longer than an hour, I suppose? Took us half a day, in total
[07:55] <bryce> wow
[07:56] <pitti> bryce: well, I needed two hours to find an engagement ring, the wedding ring took longer
[07:56] <bryce> well I'd already picked out the diamond, so it was just the matter of selecting a setting.  We'd already decided on the metal, too
[07:56] <pitti> ah
[07:57] <bryce> I'd gotten the diamond in a temporary setting.  Worked out well; she absolutely _loved_ being able to pick out her own engagement ring
[07:57] <pitti> since my gf didn't know that I was about to ask her, I picked it myself, too
[07:58] <bryce> it's hard!
[07:58] <StevenK> We went out together while I tried to gauge what she liked.
[08:00] <bryce> on a more topical note...  for backporting patches, how strict should I be?  Is it like with SRU's that they should only be fixes for critical flaws, or are fixes for more minor issues (like man pages, etc.) also acceptable?
[08:02] <ScottK> Usually backports are done for features, not for fixes, althouth minor fixes would certainly be entertained.
[08:04] <pitti> infinity: I got a couple of lpia 'chroot problem' FTBFS mails with 'package architecture (lpia) does not match system (i386)'; I guess you are on that?
[08:06] <StevenK> pitti: I also got a bunch of mails about it, infinity fixed it a few hours ago.
[08:06] <StevenK> pitti: I suspect he then crashed and went to bed.
[08:07] <pitti> cool
[08:09] <StevenK> Because I made the mistake of asking him about libnss-db ...
[08:11] <StevenK> pitti: Would you mind checking to see if rothera is spinning aimlessly?
[08:14] <pitti> StevenK: apparently something is wrong with it, but I can't see more than you can
[09:38] <rugueux> I need some advice for packaging a multibinary, do somone can give me advice ?
[09:38] <fabbione> what do you mean by multibinary?=
[09:39] <rugueux> In fact I want to package iscan, that contain the library, and some gui stuff and plugin
[09:39] <rugueux> I want to have those elemets in different packages
[09:40] <fabbione> so you want one source that generates several binary packages
[09:40] <rugueux> but the make install do install it all at a time
[09:40] <rugueux> yes
[09:40] <fabbione> that's not an issue...
[09:40] <fabbione> look into packages like redhat-cluster-suite
[09:40] <fabbione> it's a simple example that does that
[09:40] <fabbione> the make install puts everything in one place
[09:40] <fabbione> lots of other small bits will move stuff around properly
[09:40] <fabbione> or also openais
[09:41] <fabbione> infinity: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/8898482/buildlog_ubuntu-gutsy-lpia.redhat-cluster-suite_2.20070816-0ubuntu1_CHROOTWAIT.txt.gz
[09:41] <fabbione> infinity: is there anything i should do there?
[09:42] <rugueux> yes, everythings is in one place, dh_make rule put then everything in ./tmp
[09:43] <rugueux> I thought it was possible to say in "pkgname".install in debian or something like that which files belong to which package, but I'm not sure
[09:50] <fabbione> rugueux: yes you can do that.. you use dh_install or dh_move. look at the 2 source packages i mentione
[09:50] <fabbione> +d
[09:51] <cjwatson> don't use dh_movefiles please, it's hideously obsolete
[09:51] <fabbione> oh is it? ok..
[09:52] <fabbione> then dh_install only
[09:55] <dholbach> hey seb128!
[09:56] <seb128> hey dholbach
[09:57] <rugueux> to use dh_install, I have only to put the files I want to install in debian/pkgname.install ? and uncomment dh_install in rules ??
[10:04] <rugueux> in my install file I have usr/lib/sane/libsane-epkowa.so.1.0.15 but dh_install is not putting my file into the package
[10:04] <rugueux> do it is missing something in rules
[10:06] <cjwatson> rugueux: the upstream Makefile (or something else) also needs to install it into debian/tmp beforehand ...
[10:06] <cjwatson> rugueux: #ubuntu-motu would be more appropriate for all of this, though
[10:06] <cjwatson> rugueux: (also, set DH_VERBOSE=1 in the environment to get more verbose information on what debhelper commands are doing)
[10:07] <rugueux> ok many thanks for your help, I'm going to motu to ask my questions, bye ;)
[10:16] <blazemonger> is there a way I can disable the loading of the restricted kernel images?
[10:17] <blazemonger> i'm wanting to tweak my ubuntu to my tastes :)
[10:18] <Riddell> everyone ready to freeze?
[10:19] <Hobbsee> Riddell: no!  send me some heat!
[10:19] <StevenK> Riddell: I thought you were just supposed to declare it?
[10:19] <Hobbsee> Riddell: did you fix that kdepim upgrade bug?
[10:19] <seb128> I've still some updates to do but I guess I can get freeze exceptions? ;)
[10:19] <Hobbsee> seb128: Riddell might be ruthless, and not give them out :P
[10:21] <Riddell> Hobbsee: I've only seen a but about kdepimlibs
[10:21] <Riddell> which isn't so important
[10:21] <cjwatson> blazemonger: you can just remove linux-restricted-modules-* if you like
[10:21] <pitti> hey seb128
[10:22] <pitti> moin Riddell
[10:22] <Hobbsee> Riddell: oh, i thought the bug i pointed you at a couple of days ago was for kde3, not 4.
[10:22] <seb128> hi pitti
[10:22] <cjwatson> blazemonger: assuming that's what you mean
[10:22] <blazemonger> yahy
[10:22] <Hobbsee> guten tag pitti!
[10:22] <Riddell> Hobbsee: hmm, seems it is
[10:22] <cjwatson> blazemonger: note that it will also remove the 'linux' metapackage at the moment, but that's OK
[10:22] <cjwatson> blazemonger: you'll still have 'linux-image' installed to track upgrades
[10:24] <Riddell> seb128: updates for tribe 5?
[10:24] <blazemonger> ok cool
[10:24] <blazemonger> thanksw
[10:25] <blazemonger> you folks seem more my kind ..i'm new to linux but im migrating from amiga's and netbsd
[10:25] <blazemonger> to PC's and Linux
[10:25] <blazemonger> so i just reinstall  the linux metapackage
[10:25] <blazemonger> and everything that got deinstalled
[10:26] <seb128> Riddell: yes
[10:27] <cjwatson> blazemonger: right, if you want to put them back again
[10:28] <cjwatson> blazemonger: I trust you're sure that your system isn't depending on any of the restricted modules for e.g. network access
[10:28] <blazemonger> yeah
[10:28] <blazemonger> i like ubuntu but my system just doesnt need that restricted stuff which slows it down
[10:28] <blazemonger> since im only on a p4 and i know there's tweakis just have to know the distro well
[10:29] <blazemonger> once i get good at this i'm going to make something like a cross between ubuntu but use more true to linux :)
[10:30] <cjwatson> gobuntu, which is just getting started, may be to your taste, depending on exactly what you mean by that
[10:30] <cjwatson> (Ubuntu without restricted bits, basically)
[10:47] <blazemonger> like have it more like debian
[10:47] <blazemonger> like more compatible with deb packages
[10:48] <blazemonger> i only like ubuntu just because it's a slack way to install debian sid hehehe
[10:49] <blazemonger> is kernel-i686 still valid too?
[10:51] <cjwatson> blazemonger: Ubuntu doesn't provide anything of the sort, and kernel-image-686 et al don't exist in Ubuntu no
[10:52] <cjwatson> if you have a specific compatibility concern rather than a vague comment, we'd be happy to try to address that
[10:59] <blazemonger> how compatabile are sid packages compared to feisty packages
[11:01] <pitti> blazemonger: that is an invalid question I'm afraid
[11:01] <blazemonger> i dont see any kernal image's
[11:01] <pitti> blazemonger: since sid changes daily and feisty is a stable release, the answer changes every day
[11:01] <pitti> blazemonger: but in general you will have quite a lot of dependency problems due to different library versions
[11:02] <cjwatson> that's true between Debian sid now and Debian sid one month later too, though
[11:02] <blazemonger> oh okay
[11:02] <blazemonger> so kernal-image-* doesn't exist anywhere in ubuntu
[11:02] <blazemonger> ?
[11:02] <cjwatson> linux-image-*
[11:02] <blazemonger> *confused*
[11:03] <cjwatson> we repackage the kernel from scratch
[11:03] <blazemonger> i see a linux-image-i686
[11:03] <cjwatson> and since we were doing that anyway, it made sense to apply the name change that people have been talking about in Debian for ages but not got round to
[11:03] <cjwatson> 686, not i686
[11:03] <cjwatson> but you probably want linux-image-generic
[11:04] <Mithrandir> it's been linux-image-* in Debian too, for quite a while.
[11:04] <cjwatson> of course, so it has
[11:04] <blazemonger> mm
[11:04] <blazemonger> interesting
[11:05] <cjwatson> linux-image-686 |   2.6.22+9 |      unstable | i386
[11:18] <pitti> StevenK: ah, the mysterious buildd non-progress has just been resolved; slave-scanner wasn't running
[11:18] <StevenK> Neat
[11:26] <tkamppeter> pitti, hi
[11:26] <pitti> hi tkamppeter
[11:27] <tkamppeter> first I hope you had a nice wedding, and congratulations
[11:27] <pitti> tkamppeter: I had indeed, thank you!
[11:27] <tkamppeter> but now eo the problem: bug 133743
[11:27] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 133743 in cups-pdf "package cups-pdf 2.4.6-3ubuntu3 failed to install/upgrade: " [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/133743
[11:27] <pitti> tkamppeter: http://www.piware.de/fotos/Hochzeit-Vorschau/ <- sneak preview (real photos will follow in some weeks0
[11:28] <tkamppeter> pitti, thanks.
[11:28] <pitti> tkamppeter: hm; can you reproduce that?
[11:29] <tkamppeter> The cups-pdf package sets up a PDF printer if none is there.
[11:29] <kagou> Pici, tkamppeter, Hi :)
[11:29] <kagou> tkamppeter, could you take care of Bug #132994 for your next packaing of s-c-p ?
[11:29] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 132994 in system-config-printer "S-c-p should recommend hal-cups-utils" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/132994
[11:29] <tkamppeter> To check, it asks CUPS via the "lpstat -v" command and greps for cups-pdf:/ URLs.
[11:29] <tkamppeter> hi kagou
[11:30] <keyes> hi
[11:30] <keyes> hi mpt
[11:30] <tkamppeter> If there is no PDF printer, it creates one with lpadmin.
[11:30] <amitk_> hey pitti, I sure would like to know what the log-cutting ritual is :)
[11:31] <tkamppeter> Now it seems that some users do not have CUPS running
[11:31] <pitti> amitk_: the young couple has to prove that it can achieve something together
[11:31] <pitti> amitk_: usually with a horribly blunt, rusty, and unset saw, for extra fun for the audience :)
[11:31] <tkamppeter> So on each install or update of cups-pdf "lpstat -v" fails due to the missing CUPS.
[11:32] <pitti> tkamppeter: ah, right
[11:32] <tkamppeter> pitti, now what is the best to do?
[11:32] <pitti> tkamppeter: replace it with a grep -v '^DeviceURI cups-pdf:/' /etc/cups/printers.conf ?
[11:32] <pitti> tkamppeter: but hm, that won't help you much, since you still need lpadmin to actually set it up
[11:33] <tkamppeter> Simply ignore setting the PDF queue? Starting CUPS if it is not running? Or to do everything by modifying config files (the germans say "zu Fuss")?
[11:33] <pitti> tkamppeter: starting cups in cups-pdf backend, or manually modifying the configuration files -> EBW
[11:33] <tkamppeter> What means "EBW"?
[11:33] <pitti> tkamppeter: not configuring the PDF queue is acceptable, but usually I wouldn't worry too much
[11:34] <pitti> tkamppeter: "evil, bad, and wrong"
[11:34] <Mithrandir> pitti: so you should make sure to bring a leatherman or similar so you can at least set the saw somewhat?
[11:34] <pitti> Mithrandir: well, after ten minutes, the father usually becomes merciful and gives you a real saw :)
[11:35] <kylem> they didn't make you use a herring?
[11:35] <Mithrandir> pitti: heh. :-)
[11:35] <pitti> Mithrandir: carrying a leatherman in your suit spoils the look somewhat :)
[11:35] <pitti> kylem: a herring for cutting a log? uh, that sounds ... ambitious
[11:35] <Mithrandir> pitti: depends on the suit, I suppose.
[11:35] <surak> leatherman, herring, saw.... no more coffee for me. :)
[11:35] <Hobbsee> pitti: sounds perfectly sane.  monty python says so.
[11:36] <pitti> tkamppeter: hm, just adding the entire <Printer> stanza to printers.conf manually would work, too, I guess
[11:37] <pitti> tkamppeter: but I don't quite like it, if the format or options ever change, then this will result in a mess you cannot recover from
[11:37] <tepsipakki> does anyone know why mysql uses latin1 by default, and not utf8? (see bug 34181)
[11:37] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 34181 in mysql-dfsg-5.0 "locale and charset problem in mysql" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/34181
[11:37] <tkamppeter> pitti, and adding the stuff manually to the config files will also not set the paper size. So an ugly "perl -p -i -e ..." has to be applied to the PPD.
[11:38] <pitti> tkamppeter: nah, let's not get into that then; just don't do anything then if cups is not running, there's little that you can do about it at that point
[11:38] <tkamppeter> pitti, perhaps I will simply silently ignore the queue setup if CUPS is not running
[11:38] <pitti> tkamppeter: I agree
[11:39] <tkamppeter> And users who intendedly stop CUPS probably know how to call system-config-printer later to set up the queues which they need.
[11:40] <ogra> Riddell, i see linux-* was just uploaded, i have a small fix for gnome-screensaver id like to have in http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/2.19.6-0ubuntu2vs-0ubuntu3.debdiff (drops most of the patch) ok with you ?
[11:41] <tkamppeter> pitti, or any other seed/release guru, is cups-pdf added to the seeds now?
[11:41] <pitti> tkamppeter: yes, check the Recommends: list of ubuntu-desktop
[11:42] <seb128> pitti: could you accept glib2.0 2.14.0?
[11:42] <Riddell> ogra: what does it fix?
[11:42] <pitti> Riddell: ^
[11:42] <Riddell> seb128: what does it fix/change?
[11:42] <tkamppeter> pitti, thanks. Can you close the cups-pdf Blueprint as fixed then?
[11:43] <seb128> Riddell: it's the new GNOME 2.20 stable version and I want it for the new tribe? ;)
[11:43] <ogra> Riddell, the former fix only worked if you manually activated the screensaver ... (so it died when called from the desktop idle watcher, but remotely locking worked) this change fixes the issue completely
[11:43] <seb128> Riddell: some bug fixed since 2.13.7
[11:43] <kagou> tkamppeter, great news
[11:43] <pitti> tkamppeter: done
[11:44] <Riddell> ogra: ok, upload
[11:44] <tkamppeter> kagou which great news?
[11:44] <ogra> Riddell, thanks :)
[11:44] <Riddell> seb128: I don't suppose that includes the initialisation broken in nspluginviewer, opera, acroread etc bug?
[11:44] <kagou> tkamppeter, that this blueprint is now fixed/approved
[11:44] <seb128> Riddell: no, it's not clear that's a glib bug
[11:45] <tkamppeter> pitti, I see you have also closed the printer auto setup Blueprint
[11:45] <pitti> tkamppeter: yes, you asked me to?
[11:45] <pitti> and it seems to work, by and large
[11:46] <ogra> pitti, is there anything thats holding back gobby from re-entering main ? (we had it approved and moved in already but demoted it because of the libhowl dep which is gone now)
[11:46] <pitti> ogra: no, nothing; let me do some promotions, Riddell needs some, too
[11:46] <ogra> yay, pkern will be happy :)
[11:47] <mpt> hello keyes
[11:47] <keyes> how are you ?
[11:48] <mpt> I tried out your program for a couple of minutes, but haven't looked at it thoroughly
[11:48] <keyes> ok
[11:48] <mpt> though it's still on my to-do list for today
[11:48] <keyes> thanks :)
[11:48] <mpt> I was a bit confused by the "Choose Recipients" window
[11:48] <mpt> What do you mean by "recipients"?
[11:49] <keyes> recipients ??
[11:49] <keyes> where do you see that ?
[11:49] <mpt> It's the window that comes up when I choose "Encrypt..."
[11:49] <Riddell> seb128: accepted.  but I think it's quite incorrect to say that a new version of a library which breaks half the world isn't the fault of the library
[11:50] <keyes> I don't have the word "recipients" here in this windows :|
[11:50] <seb128> Riddell: it doesn't break "half of the world", nothing in GNOME has been b0rked
[11:50] <keyes> just "Folder", "Password" and "Confirmation"
[11:50] <mpt> that's odd
[11:50] <Riddell> seb128: I didn't say the whole world :)
[11:50] <seb128> Riddell: openoffice uses gdk functions without calling gdk_init(), dunno about the others
[11:51] <mpt> keyes, you've added the "Edit" > "Encrypt..." menu item, correct?
[11:51] <pitti> Riddell: just the commercial half :)
[11:51] <keyes> where ?
[11:51] <keyes> if you run : conceal-gtk
[11:51] <keyes> it's a "Gnome system tools"-like window
[11:51] <keyes> without menu
[11:52] <mpt> So I've been looking at completely the wrong program the whole time?
[11:52] <mpt> heh
[11:52] <keyes> your maybe looking at the nautilus extension ?
[11:53] <mpt> keyes, I thought "nautilus-conceal" would mean it added a menu item to Nautilus
[11:53] <keyes> yes it do
[11:53] <mpt> So, what is the name of the menu item?
[11:53] <keyes> Encrypt...
[11:53] <mpt> In the Edit menu?
[11:53] <keyes> but still not "recipients" word
[11:53] <keyes> in the right click menu
[11:53] <keyes> and maybe in the edit yes
[11:53] <mpt> yep, that too
[11:53] <seb128> what does this program do?
[11:53] <mpt> When I choose either of them, I get "Choose Recipients"
[11:54] <keyes> :|
[11:54] <mpt> seb128, encrypts files/folders
[11:54] <seb128> isn't seahorse doing that already?
[11:54] <keyes> seb128, not the same
[11:54] <seb128> why not updating seahorse to do it?
[11:54] <keyes> seb128, seahorse is a GnuPD frontend
[11:54] <keyes> GnuPG
[11:54] <mpt> Implementation detail!
[11:55] <mpt> A good reason would be "Seahorse's UI is obviously about X, not about encrypting/decrypting files" :-)
[11:55] <keyes> yep
[11:55] <seb128> not true
[11:55] <seb128> it adds a nautilus context menu option
[11:55] <keyes> still don't understand why you have a choose recipients label :/
[11:56] <mpt> I'm not saying that's true, just that it would be a valid reason if you had a good value for X
[11:56] <keyes> i send you a shot of the "excepted window"
[11:56] <seb128> well, you can add a extra simple UI to a program
[11:56] <seb128> no need to write a different one
[11:56] <keyes> I think that seahorse was really not adapted to what I want to do
[11:57] <mpt> Looking at Seahorse, I tend to agree
[11:57] <mpt> It looks like a key/password library, not an encryption tool
[11:57] <keyes> a lot of end user don't know even what is a "SSH key" or a "GNUPG key'
[11:57] <mpt> I'd more expect to find an encryption UI in file-roller, actually
[11:57] <mpt> than in seahorse
[11:57] <surak> guys, you have no idea how nice it is to be on the sabe timezone than most of devs. Way better then entering here at 4:00 am :)
[11:58] <seb128> but do you need an "encryption UI"? shouldn't that be a nautilus menu action?
[11:58] <mpt> seb128, well, exactly :-)
[11:58] <keyes> seb128, it's the two ;)
[11:58] <mpt> That's what I thought it was
[11:58] <mpt> But if conceal isn't providing this "Encrypt..." menu item in my copy of Nautilus, who is?
[11:58] <seb128> seahorse ;)
[11:58] <keyes> no
[11:58] <keyes> conceal provide the "Encypt..." entry
[11:58] <seb128> ah
[11:59] <mpt> The window has an "All Keys" menu
[11:59] <mpt> and a "Search for:" field
[11:59] <mpt> and a huge list of people that I've never added to anything
[11:59] <keyes> mpt, it's not my app whoch is loaded :d
[11:59] <mpt> and "Sign message as:", which makes no sense *regardless* of which app is doing it, because I'm not sending anyone a message
[11:59] <keyes>  i send you a shot :|
[12:00] <keyes> it's seahorse loaded npow ???
[12:00] <keyes> no ?
[12:00] <mpt> Perhaps, but there's no clue to that
[12:00] <mpt> oh, I could use xwininfo
[12:00] <keyes> really byzarre
[12:00] <elmo> is X known to be broken in the latest i386 desktop daily?
[12:00] <keyes> noone has reported a bug like this :)
[12:00] <mpt> Yes, it's seahorse
[12:00] <seb128> it's likely to be seahorse
[12:00] <seb128> see ;)
[12:01] <mpt> Oh, seb128, I never doubted you
[12:01] <keyes> the Nautilus entry has a "lock" icon ?
[12:01] <mpt> No, it has no icon at all
[12:01] <keyes> hum
[12:01] <keyes> so it's not my extension I think
[12:02] <mpt> So maybe your tool tried to add another "Encrypt..." icon, and Nautilus said "no, sorry, I've already got one of those"
[12:02] <mpt> s/icon/item/
[12:02] <seb128> I don't think so
[12:02] <seb128> nautilus doesn't forbid you to have 2 identic labels
[12:03] <seb128> you can uninstall seahorse to be sure
[12:03] <mpt> Wouldn't that lose all my passwords? :-S
[12:03] <dholbach> doko: does bug 63200 make any sense to you?
[12:03] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 63200 in gdb "Mistakes in gdb strings" [Low,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/63200
[12:03] <keyes> mpt, what happens if you just run
[12:03] <keyes> conceal-gtk
[12:03] <keyes> ?
[12:04] <mpt> keyes, I get a tiny window
[12:04] <mpt> with a table and six buttons
[12:04] <surak> a question: I have a "un-bug" - that is, a hardware which works correctly, the module and the firmware are part of the main kernel, and they work perfectly. (its a prism54 wireless pci network card) - how should I report it?
[12:04] <doko> dholbach, ugh, doc fix ...
[12:04] <seb128> mpt: uninstalling a package doesn't change the user configuration, you can uninstall and reinstall that should work
[12:05] <cjwatson> as long as you don't purge
[12:05] <mpt> seb128, ok
[12:05] <keyes> mpt, so it's my app
[12:05] <keyes> the question no is why the nautilus extension don't load
[12:05] <cjwatson> (in which case you might lose system configuration in /etc)
[12:05] <surak> I mean, it's just a matter of loading the module. No idea what its not loaded by default, as this firmware is working for quite some time.
[12:05] <elmo> hmm, X is choosing vesa on a laptop with i945 graphics - that's pretty special
[12:06] <kylem> elmo, which pci id
[12:06] <keyes> have you got nautilus-conceal, python-nautilus and python2.4-dev installed ?
[12:06] <surak> elmo: better then what it loads intel-agp and panics if you happen to have a second card on the same machine :)
[12:07] <keyes> ho may be simply
[12:07] <keyes> have you got logged in / logged out or runned "nautilus -q && nautilus --restart" ?
[12:07] <elmo> kylem: 8086:27a2
[12:07] <elmo> maybe 8086:27a6
[12:08] <kylem> nice.
[12:08] <kylem> new.
[12:08] <mjg59> elmo: Intel really do seem to hate us sometimes
[12:08] <mpt> keyes, python-nautilus is not installed.
[12:08] <seb128> Riddell: could you accept pango1.0 1.18.0 also (same situation as the new glib2.0, GNOME 2.20 version, bug fix update)
[12:08] <elmo> mjg59/kylem: should I report this is a bug somewhere?
[12:09] <mpt> keyes, is it by default in Gutsy?
[12:09] <kylem> elmo, yes.
[12:09] <kylem> elmo, against discover-data
[12:09] <mjg59> elmo: If you set the driver by hand, does it work?
[12:09] <mpt> keyes, or did you forget to mark the dependency?
[12:09] <mjg59> If so, discover is just broken
[12:09] <keyes> mpt, no but it's a dependency of my package :|
[12:09] <elmo> which driver do I want?
[12:09] <Riddell> seb128: I hope you're not uploading the whole of gnome 2.20 this morning :)
[12:09] <elmo> IIRC there's two intel ones
[12:09] <kylem> elmo, -intel
[12:09] <tkamppeter> pitti, the fixed cups-pdf is ready for upload now:
[12:09] <tkamppeter> http://www.linux-foundation.org/~till/tmp/ubuntu/gutsy/cups-pdf/
[12:09] <seb128> Riddell: no, I'm done with new versions now
[12:10] <kylem> elmo, wait, at what point is it failing to choose the correct card?
[12:10] <keyes> mpt, ok it's my fault :s
[12:10] <pitti> tkamppeter: please put a debdiff there for Riddell to review and ack
[12:10] <mpt> keyes, ok, installing python-nautilus now
[12:10] <keyes> i've missed the dependency in the new control file
[12:10] <keyes> :S
[12:10] <elmo> kylem: I just tried to boot a live CD, and it came up with 'haha X hates you' message, I looked at the log/config, and it's using vesa
[12:10] <mjg59> kylem: Is the plan still to move 915+ over to intel?
[12:10] <kylem> elmo, sigh, ok. yeah, it's a discover problem.
[12:10] <pitti> tkamppeter: (it would be nice if you could always do that for me, too, easier to review)
[12:11] <kylem> mjg59, yes, although i was hoping to discard discover entirely in the process.
[12:11] <keyes> so please apt-get install python-nautilus and python2.4-dev we are missing :s
[12:11] <keyes> sorry
[12:11] <kylem> that seems to be too ambitious given how little time i have to even sleep these days.
[12:11] <elmo> whee, /etc/init.d/gdm start exploded
[12:12] <elmo> with some funky looking stacktrace thing (glibc double free?)
[12:12] <kylem> elmo, is this a fresh cd install, or has it been upgraded?
[12:12] <elmo> kylem: fresh cd install, I've only just taken it out of the box
[12:13] <kylem> is intel_agp loaded?
[12:13] <elmo> tes
[12:13] <elmo> yes
[12:13] <mpt> keyes, do I need to log out and log in too?
[12:13] <kylem> elmo, what kind of laptop is it?
[12:13] <kylem> this is special.
[12:13] <keyes> mpt, yes or just run
[12:13] <elmo> kylem: HP NC6320
[12:14] <keyes> nautilus -q && nautilus --restart
[12:14] <kylem> oh, ha ha.
[12:14] <elmo> ok changing the driver to Intel has got me X
[12:14] <Riddell> seb128: accepted
[12:14] <seb128> Riddell: thanks
[12:14] <kylem> elmo, oh. what were you doing before?
[12:14] <elmo> kylem: to get the stack trace?  I was running /etc/init.d/gdm stop, /etc/init.d/gdm start
[12:14] <surak> what's the correct package to submit a kernel bug?
[12:14] <kylem> elmo, can you toss a bug on discover-data with a full lspci -vvnn
[12:14] <kylem> elmo, yeah, but with which driver?
[12:15] <elmo> kylem: intel still - but the stack trace was from gdm, it was being stupid
[12:15] <elmo> and SIGABRT-ing itself when asked to run again
[12:15] <kylem> ah ha.
[12:15] <tkamppeter> pitti, riddell, debdiff for cups-pdf is up, same directory as the sources. So for non-UVF-exception you need it, too?
[12:16] <pitti> tkamppeter: tribe5 freeze
[12:17] <tkamppeter> pitti, you told that cups-pdf is in Recommends: of ubuntu-desktop. Is this enough that an automatic default installation (for example Ubiquity) installs it? Does it not have to be in Requires?
[12:17] <pitti> tkamppeter: debdiff looks good, uploaded; up to Riddell to accept or defer it
[12:17] <pitti> tkamppeter: yes, it is enough
[12:18] <pitti> tkamppeter: it merely means that the user can manually uninstall it if he desires, without killing ubuntu-desktop
[12:19] <tkamppeter> pitti, OK. Thanks.
[12:19] <keyes> mpt, please try the tool only on test or backuped folder
[12:19] <keyes> it's still in test !
[12:19] <mpt> keyes, I installed python-nautilus and reinstalled nautilus-conceal, and the menu item didn't appear.
[12:19] <mpt> Restarted Nautilus, still nothing
[12:19] <mpt> Logged out and logged in again, still nothing :-/
[12:20] <mpt> (I already had python2.4-dev installed)
[12:20] <keyes> mpt, have you installed python2.4-dev tii ?
[12:20] <keyes> ok
[12:20] <elmo> you know, the whole zoom in to choose your city is looking a bit stale  in the compiz era
[12:20] <keyes> what is the output of nautilus-q && nautilus --restart ? ;|
[12:20] <elmo> when are we hooking up google earth so you can zoom into your HOUSE?
[12:21] <mpt> keyes, still one "Encrypt..." menu item, belonging to Seahorse
[12:22] <keyes> mpt, nautilus-q && nautilus --restart ?
[12:22] <surak> elmo: not long - http://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF8&ll=37.79934,-122.39439&spn=0.034317,0.059223&z=14&om=0&layer=c&cbll=37.781873,-122.39514&cbp=1,336.44531249999994,0.4563646752870103,0
[12:22] <keyes> mpt, either : ls -l /usr/lib/nautilus/extension-1.0/python
[12:22] <mpt> keyes, crypt.py and crypt.pyc
[12:22] <keyes> ls -l /usr/lib/nautilus/extensions-1.0/python/
[12:23] <keyes> so it must be Ok :/
[12:23] <keyes> and no error when starting nautilus :/
[12:24] <mpt> Now nautilus seems to have hung
[12:25] <mpt> ok, restarted
[12:25] <mpt> and still your item's not there
[12:26] <keyes> :/
[12:26] <mpt> keyes, meanwhile, a few suggestions for conceal-gtk
[12:26] <mpt> The list's frame is missing
[12:26] <mpt> "Encrypt" should be "Encrypt"
[12:27] <mpt> It's not clear what the "Open" column heading means
[12:27] <keyes> what do you call "list's rfame" ?
[12:27] <mpt> border
[12:27] <mpt> outline
[12:27] <keyes> ok
[12:27] <mpt> There's just white pixels, then grey pixels
[12:27] <keyes> "Is open ?" for the list ?
[12:27] <mpt> It should look inset
[12:27] <keyes> ok
[12:30] <keyes> mpt, what is the "correct" term in Ubuntu,
[12:30] <mpt> keyes, also, the first thing I tried to do was drag a folder into the list, but it didn't work
[12:30] <keyes> folder or directory ?
[12:30] <mpt> keyes, folder
[12:31] <keyes> ok
[12:31] <keyes> mpt, ok for drag'n'drop
[12:31] <mpt> keyes, also, I suggest a larger default window size
[12:31] <keyes> ok
[12:31] <mpt> perhaps 1.5~2 times as wide as now
[12:32] <mpt> The left edge of the Help button should line up with the left edge of the list
[12:32] <mpt> hmm
[12:33] <mpt> actually, the problem is that the gap between the left edge of the list and the left edge of the window is less than the gap on the right or the gap on the bottom.
[12:33] <keyes> ok
[12:33] <keyes> i've added a frame
[12:33] <keyes> it seems to correct this problem too
[12:34] <elmo> \o/
[12:34] <elmo> now ubiquity crashed
[12:34] <mpt> Drag-and-drop works onto the "Folder:" menu, neat
[12:34] <surak> pitti: ping
[12:35] <pitti> hey surak
[12:35] <Kmos> pitti: welcome back pitti!
[12:35] <pitti> hi Kmos
[12:35] <mpt> keyes, the "Folder:" "Password:", and "Confirmation:" labels should not be right- or left-aligned, not centered
[12:35] <Kmos> pitti: this channel isn't the same with you :))
[12:35] <mpt> (I prefer left-aligned, Gnome HIG says "left unless you like right")
[12:35] <pitti> Kmos: heh, thanks
[12:35] <mpt> er
[12:35] <keyes> ok
[12:36] <pitti> Kmos: and I didn't even really leave (just for a day and a half so far)
[12:36] <mpt> (I prefer *right*-aligned, not left-aligned)
[12:36] <Kmos> pitti: yeah :)
[12:36] <surak> hello. A question: is really necessary that network-manager-gnome asks for the keyring password to use a AP's wep one? I mean, its unpleasant to get into your computer, type your login, your password, and then a password to access your everyday network...
[12:37] <giskard> surak, there is a pam module that should help you
[12:37] <giskard> pam_keyring something
[12:38] <giskard> if your keyring/login password are the same
[12:38] <mpt> wah
[12:38] <mpt> keyes, disembodied progress meter!
[12:39] <surak> giskard: my question is why this is not default. I've been far from ubuntu for some time, and I like the way mac os handles this. I mean, I already typed my login password, and connecting to a wifi network is not a big deal...
[12:39] <mpt> keys, is that progress bar supposed to be inside a window?
[12:39] <keyes> mpt, no
[12:39] <mpt> it looks very strange
[12:39] <keyes> just to 'block' the app when she run
[12:39] <elmo> cjwatson: I seem to have run into the 'LanguageApply failed with code 2' problem, looks like there's 6 or so bugs about it already - is there anything you want me to do, other than AOLing one of the bugs?
[12:39] <giskard> surak, don't know.
[12:39] <surak> (and besides, that "you are connected to wifi network xxx" is so windowish)
[12:39] <Kmos> pitti: check if dupcheck for LP is running :) lol
[12:39] <elmo> cjwatson: (in ubiquity, sorry - brand new laptop install, gutsy i386 daily)
[12:40] <surak> giskard: that's why I'm asking pitti :)
[12:40] <mpt> keyes, I suggest putting the progress bar to the left of the buttons in the "Encrypt Folder" dialog instead
[12:40] <mpt> (visible only during encryption)
[12:40] <pitti> surak: it shuold even be the default nowadays
[12:40] <keyes> mpt, ok
[12:40] <pitti> surak: if your gnome-keyring password and PAM password match, it should work (at least seb128 told me so)
[12:41] <surak> pitti: I'm on feisty. you mean after it?
[12:41] <pitti> surak: yep, it was fixed in gutsy, Tribe-3 I think
[12:41] <surak> oh. time to download again :) thanks for your attention.
[12:42] <Kmos> cjwatson: greetings for patch's for gnome 2.19.90 :)
[12:42] <blazemonger> how free is ubuntu ?
[12:42] <cjwatson> elmo: should be fixed shortly, according to evand it was due to busybox bug 131961 causing /rofs not to be available
[12:42] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 131961 in busybox "Segfaults during boot (from mount)" [High,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/131961
[12:42] <mpt> keyes, how long is it supposed to take to encrypt one file?
[12:42] <blazemonger> for some reason i just feel wierd using a commercialized distro
[12:42] <cjwatson> Kmos: err, what have I got to do with that?
[12:42] <mpt> keyes, of about 50 KB
[12:42] <keyes> mpt, it encrypts folder
[12:43] <cjwatson> blazemonger: http://www.ubuntu.com/community/ubuntustory/licensing
[12:43] <blazemonger> freebsd i know corporations might use it, but it sticks to being more unix like
[12:43] <mpt> ok, a folder with one 50 KB file in it
[12:43] <keyes> mpt, really a short time
[12:43] <surak> have all a nice day. Time to go back to my thesis.
[12:43] <Kmos> cjwatson: http://ftp.gnome.org/pub/GNOME/desktop/2.19/2.19.90/NEWS -> some Colin Watson there
[12:43] <mpt> keyes, ok, it's been going for five minutes now
[12:43] <keyes> bug :/
[12:43] <cjwatson> Kmos: sure, I poked at deskbar-applet a bit
[12:43] <keyes> someting displayed in the term ,
[12:43] <keyes> ?
[12:43] <Kmos> cjwatson: ah =) hehe
[12:44] <blazemonger> oh so ubuntu gives you a CHOICE rioght?
[12:44] <cjwatson> Kmos: hardly significant though
[12:44] <cjwatson> blazemonger: yes
[12:44] <Kmos> cjwatson: if it isn't not significant, why anyone catch the rat ? :) hehe
[12:44] <mpt> keyes, there is, but I wasn't watching to see if it appeared at the same time
[12:44] <Kmos> cjwatson: so you deserve it
[12:44] <keyes> can you copy me it ?
[12:44] <mpt> keyes, line 464, "'module' object has no attribute 'NotWritable'"
[12:45] <elmo> cjwatson: hmm, ok.  thanks
[12:45] <Kmos> another kernel ... 2.6.22.4
[12:45] <doko> calc: you made ooo-l10n arch any ????? currently blocking all the buildds :-((
[12:45] <blazemonger> im not on stallmans level of non-free stuff but some distros have this commercialization feel or look
[12:45] <keyes> ok
[12:45] <Kmos> oh god
[12:45] <blazemonger> not a bad thing but ..
[12:45] <cjwatson> elmo: I think some debootstrap hosage may be causing livefs build problems
[12:45] <blazemonger> even wigth the distrosw saying they only use free stuff
[12:46] <mpt> keyes, http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/34516/
[12:46] <Kmos> !CVE 2007-3848
[12:46] <ubotu> Linux kernel 2.4.35 and other versions allows local users to send arbitrary signals to a child process that is running at higher privileges by causing a setuid-root parent process to die, which delivers an attacker-controlled parent process death signal (PR_SET_PDEATHSIG). (http://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvename.cgi?name=CVE-2007-3848)
[12:46] <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about cve 2007-3848 - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
[12:46] <cjwatson> blazemonger: I think you may be confusing "commercial" with "professional" ;-)
[12:46] <keyes> mpt, ok
[12:46] <keyes> so i've a bug in gtk (fixed in svn)
[12:47] <keyes> and are you in the FUSE group ?
[12:47] <keyes> your user
[12:49] <mpt> keyes, I've never heard of "fuse" before
[12:49] <keyes> System -> Administration -> users and groups
[12:49] <keyes> and check you are in the fuse group
[12:50] <mpt> keyes, I am
[12:50] <keyes> ok
[12:50] <keyes> fuse ?
[12:50] <mpt> yes
[12:51] <keyes> it's a system to create userland filesystems
[12:51] <cjwatson> the fuse group exists because it lets you mount userspace filesystems, which could be used to elevate privileges
[12:51] <mpt> ok
[12:51] <keyes> http://fuse.sourceforge.net/
[12:51] <cjwatson> yet it can be awfully convenient to do it as non-root for things like sshfs
[12:51] <mpt> I suppose calling it "canmountdevices" would have been too obvious ;-)
[12:51] <cjwatson> not to mention wrong
[12:52] <mpt> or even canmountuserspacefilesystems
[12:52] <cjwatson> somewhat less obvious if you don't speak English, perchance
[12:52] <pitti> it'll go away eventually (in gutsy+1, I assume)
[12:52] <freizo> anyone know some clearer version of Edubuntu
[12:52] <freizo> it's too fat
[12:52] <Mithrandir> mpt: cangobblyusermooblahsomething you mean?
[12:53] <mpt> cjwatson, understandable in 0 languages is not better than understandable in 1 language
[12:53] <pitti> as soon as our kernel gets ACL support for tmpfs enabled, we can activate the hal/consolekit magic to grant access to such devices (also to cameras/scanners/USB sticks) based on active consoles
[12:53] <pitti> mpt: I don't expect users to understand the particular groups they are in anyway
[12:53] <pitti> mpt: the users-and-groups tool neatly hides them behind the 'Desktop' profile
[12:54] <mpt> I didn't notice any hiding
[12:54] <cjwatson> mpt: there is no facility for the bare names of Unix groups to be localised, therefore they should not require extensive localisation.
[12:54] <mpt> but if it's going away, then cool
[12:54] <mjg59> mpt: I don't think any sensible proportion of our group names make any sense to an uninitiated user
[12:54] <pitti> ah, it only does it for creating a new user, not for modifying existing ones; hmm
[12:55] <pitti> we will get rid of 'plugdev', 'scanner', etc.; 'fuse' is a bit special, because it's also useful for remote operation
[12:55] <pitti> so that might actually stay around
[12:55] <mpt> I'm not saying it should be changed *now*
[12:55] <cjwatson> I suspect you'll find Mac OS X has plenty of Unix-style group names under the hood too
[12:55] <mpt> It's just an example
[12:55] <mpt> Yes, and it's the poorer for it, IMO
[12:55] <cjwatson> it is not correct to change the group name. the correct approach is to not present the group name as such in the UI.
[12:56] <pitti> mpt: I think this should just be covered better in users-admin
[12:56] <mjg59> pitti: Yeah, really the "User privileges" pane of user admin should also be usable for the existing users
[12:56] <cjwatson> rather than typing in longer and longer group names because somebody thought it was a good idea to include a full description in the name
[12:56] <mpt> An electrical device with color-coded wires is better designed than one with all-black wires, even if 999% of people never see the wires.
[12:56] <cjwatson> identifiers exist for a reason damnit
[12:56] <mpt> 99.9%, rather
[12:56] <mjg59> mpt: When creating a user it's represented as "Allow use of fuse filesystems like LTSP Thin Client blockdevices"
[12:56] <seb128> users-admin doesn't show the system group name
[12:56] <cjwatson> and that's a dreadful description, but it illustrates the point
[12:57] <cjwatson> mpt: my mum doesn't know what "userspace" means. Should the group be "canmountfilesystemsrunbyexternalprograms"?
[12:57] <cjwatson> and for that matter my mum doesn't know what a filesystem is
[12:57] <pitti> "mount"?
[12:57] <cjwatson> we should not change the group name every time somebody finds something new to explain
[12:58] <blazemonger> however i will say Mint seems pretty good
[12:58] <cjwatson> identifiers exist so that we do not have this sort of compatibility nightmare for text exposed to users
[12:58] <blazemonger> even if it does come with proprietary software
[12:58] <mpt> cjwatson, just as understandable in 0 languages is not better than understandable in 1, understandable to 1% of people is not better than understandable to 3%.
[12:58] <cjwatson> mpt: you appear to have entirely ignored me, so I will not discuss this further with you
[12:58] <mpt> ok
[12:58] <mjg59> mpt: The failure is having that group name be visible
[12:59] <keyes> mpt, thanks for the suggest
[12:59] <mpt> mjg59, agreed
[12:59] <pitti> mpt: where do you see it actually?
[12:59] <keyes> can I recontact you when new packages (and bugfixes..) are availables
[12:59] <keyes> ?
[12:59] <keyes> will be*
[12:59] <mpt> pitti, Users & Groups > Manage Groups
[12:59] <Mithrandir> cjwatson: your mother probably doesn't know what an external program is either. :-)
[12:59] <mjg59> mpt: The group name itself is an implementation detail and should only need to make sense to people who understand what they're doing
[12:59] <pitti> mpt: ah, there, I se
[12:59] <pitti> e
[12:59] <cjwatson> Mithrandir: quite so, which is why trying to explain it all in the group name is utterly stupid
[01:00] <Mithrandir> cjwatson: indeed.
[01:00] <mjg59> mpt: In much the same was as blue and brown are completely arbitrary choices of wire colours
[01:00] <cjwatson> I suppose all of our internal interfaces should be written to the lowest common denominator
[01:00] <mjg59> They have significance to people who know how to wire a plug.
[01:04] <mpt> Perhaps "Groups settings" could have a blacklist of system-related groups, or a special token to tell which are user-created ones
[01:04] <seb128> mpt: that's already the case
[01:04] <cjwatson> dear me, debootstrap currently installs libdb4.[2346] 
[01:05] <pitti> mpt: that's easy, groups >= 500 are user-related, 1 to 499 are system groups
[01:05] <cjwatson> pitti: 1000, not 500
[01:05] <mpt> So is it a bug that I'm seeing all the system-related ones?
[01:05] <pitti> cjwatson: that's a Debianism
[01:05] <cjwatson> the ranges are specified in the Debian policy manual
[01:05] <pitti> cjwatson: LSB's treshold is 500
[01:05] <elmo> err, so is there really no way to configure the compiz crack?
[01:05] <elmo> (and by configure, I mean turn it off)
[01:05] <cjwatson> pitti: for compatibility with RH, yes
[01:05] <elmo> (and by configure, I mean graphically_)
[01:06] <mjg59> elmo: Yes
[01:06] <pitti> elmo: System -> Settings -> Appeareance?
[01:06] <cjwatson> pitti: but system groups on Debian/Ubuntu might well show up >= 500
[01:06] <seb128> elmo: system, preferences, appearance, desktop effects, none
[01:06] <pitti> LAST_SYSTEM_UID=999
[01:06] <cjwatson> pitti: so it should be done based on the system in use, not based on some misguided attempt to find the union
[01:06] <pitti> erk, yes
[01:06] <elmo> mjg59/pitti/seb128: thanks
[01:06] <pitti> that should be fixed
[01:06] <cjwatson> I disagree
[01:07] <blazemonger> is mint linux just ubuntu with theme change?
[01:07] <pitti> (for new installs, that is)
[01:07] <seb128> mpt: there is some bugs open about that already
[01:07] <cjwatson> we cannot assume that upgraded Debian/Ubuntu systems have no IDs in 500-999
[01:07] <pitti> cjwatson: right
[01:07] <cjwatson> and so no tools can assume that either
[01:07] <cjwatson> I don't think there's value in changing it
[01:07] <elmo> sweet, clicking 'extra effects' just kills the WM and nothing comes back to replace it
[01:07] <cjwatson> blazemonger: you'd have to ask the Mint guys
[01:07] <cjwatson> I doubt many people here know offhand what they changed
[01:08] <seb128> mvo: ^
[01:08] <mvo> elmo: what card/x driver?
[01:09] <mvo> elmo: did you clicked on effects ? or extra effects?
[01:09] <cjwatson> pitti: any chance we can do some libdb migrations before tribe-5?
[01:10] <elmo> mvo: i945/intel
[01:10] <elmo> mvo: I clicked on 'extra effects'
[01:10] <pitti> cjwatson: Riddell's call, but if it only affects packages without on-disk transactions, it should be possible
[01:10] <pitti> cjwatson: I doubt that anything debootstrap touches uses them
[01:10] <cjwatson> Riddell: ^-- installing four libdbs seems a bit excessive
[01:10] <mvo> elmo: thanks, its likely that the decorator got not started for some reason, does it help if you click on the normal (middle) effects thing?
[01:10] <elmo> mvo: yes, then everything comes back
[01:11] <mvo> elmo: thanks, I look into this today
[01:11] <elmo> mvo: ok - no rush or anything, I can file a bug if you like
[01:11] <mvo> elmo: I think I can reproduce it here (at least sometimes) so it should be fine
[01:12] <A20> Hi
[01:12] <A20> Does any one know when BenC will be available?
[01:12] <pitti> cjwatson: for db4.5 it's more or less just curl, bogofilter, and wvstreams
[01:12] <pitti> then we can demote it
[01:12] <cjwatson> A20: he's on the east coast of the US, so that sort of timezone
[01:13] <pitti> cjwatson: apt-utils and perl are the ones for db4.4 which affect debootstrap
[01:13] <elmo> since I'm in a whiny mood - is there any chance we'll ever default to subpixel when we know we're on an LCD? (i.e. laptops)
[01:13] <cjwatson> perl could be problematic
[01:14] <cjwatson> I don't recall how we've handled that in the past
[01:14] <pitti> right, because we don't know which apps use transactions
[01:14] <Pici> kagou: pong?
[01:14] <cjwatson> though the same goes for python
[01:14] <doko> pitti: please accept the new openoffice.org-l10n
[01:14] <A20> cjwatson: Yeah, but he was on vocation last week and I'm not sure if he is back now...
[01:14] <pitti> cjwatson: 1. stick fingers in ears, 2. sing "lalala" ?
[01:14] <cjwatson> I'd be happy to get it down to maybe two in debootstrap for tribe-5
[01:14] <cjwatson> A20: he's back
[01:14] <A20> cjwatson: TX
[01:15] <pitti> doko: looking
[01:15] <infinity> cjwatson: Transitioning perl and friends to a new DB isn't too bad.
[01:15] <infinity> cjwatson: You just have to nail all the perl rdeps that use it too (various modules, apache/mod_perl, etc)
[01:15] <pitti> infinity: not for perl/python itself, but that potentially breaks perl/python programs using on-disk transactions
[01:15] <infinity> cjwatson: I've done the perl/apache/etc libdb transition 2 or 3 times now.
[01:15] <pitti> infinity: and all the third-party stuff that might use perl/python?
[01:16] <infinity> pitti: We've done it before with no real complaints.
[01:16] <infinity> pitti: Check your perl deps in, say, breezy versus dapper.
[01:16] <infinity> pitti: People using transactions should be prepared to have to do painful things to compensate, unfortunately. :/
[01:16] <cjwatson> infinity: yeah, I just mean tricky to do in a hurry
[01:16] <infinity> pitti: We can't "fix" that.
[01:17] <infinity> Anyhow, I'd rather have the ReducingDuplication discussion when we open gutsy+1, unless people really have the free time to attack it now.
[01:17] <pitti> doko: accepted
[01:18] <infinity> And by the time we open gutsy+1, we might be happy enough with db4.5, or even db4.6, to do a wholesale move to something shiny.
[01:18] <cjwatson> I'm just concerned that it's 1.5MB of wasted CD space
[01:19] <infinity> Remove OOo.
[01:19] <infinity> *cough*
[01:19] <doko> infinity: the idea is to have packages independent of transactions to b-d on libdb-dev, and the others should b-d on the specific libdbX.Y-ddev package
[01:20] <infinity> doko: That still doesn't solve anything, as in "how do the latter group ever upgrade to a new DB?"
[01:20] <doko> infinity: let seb128 fix the bloody gnome cdbs build system so that it doesn't include all doc dirs in every package. saves 10mb or so ...
[01:31] <cjwatson> Riddell: I'd like to sync a new version of debootstrap to resolve problems the mobile guys are having; the patch is just this to umount_exit_function:
[01:31] <cjwatson> -    umount "$TARGET/${dir#/}"
[01:31] <cjwatson> Riddell: ok with you?
[01:31] <cjwatson> +    umount "$TARGET/${dir#/}" || true
[01:31] <Riddell> cjwatson: sure
[01:32] <cjwatson> thanks. I've tested it of course and it's working better here.
[01:33] <Riddell> doko: I don't see openoffice.org-l10n
[01:34] <StevenK> infinity: libnss-db now that you've slept.
[01:34] <StevenK> infinity: Or something. :-)
[01:35] <doko> Riddell: you're slow, pitti was faster ;)
[01:35] <pitti> Riddell: it's an OMGbrokenpreviousuploadneedthisASAP thing, so I accepted it
[01:36] <Riddell> ok
[01:41] <Riddell> calc: amd64  Failed to build
[01:43] <Riddell> doko: fancy fixing openoffice or should I phone calc to wake him up?
[01:44] <kagou> pitti, ping
[01:44] <pitti> hi kagou
[01:44] <kagou> hey Pici  :)
[01:45] <kagou> hey pitti :p
[01:45] <Pici> kagou: Did you mean to say hi to me early this morning? or am I just a typo?
[01:45] <kagou> Pici, a typo i think
[01:46] <kagou> sory :D
[01:46] <Pici> kagou: No problem :)
[01:46] <doko> Riddell: when needs the build to be ready?
[01:47] <Riddell> doko: as soon as possible so we can get some CDs built to test
[01:47] <kagou> pitti, do you need more informations for Bug #133818
[01:47] <doko> Riddell: well, you can build CDs with the current package, can't you?
[01:47] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 133818 in cupsys "[GUTSY]  Turboprint don't work due to apparmor" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/133818
[01:47] <doko> asac_: good morning
[01:48] <asac_> doko: that is not funny ;)
[01:48] <doko> =)
[01:48] <Riddell> doko: I could, but there wouldn't be much point since they would have a broken open office on them
[01:48] <doko> Riddell: not more broken than the previous one
[01:58] <tepsipakki> I'd like to get pixman from debian experimental in ubuntu, but should I just upload that as is or report a sync-request?
[01:59] <cjwatson> sync request is fine
[01:59] <cjwatson> we can sync from more or less anywhere at a push; experimental is easy
[02:00] <tepsipakki> cjwatson: thanks, I'll do that. It also supercedes the old libpixman (not used by anything)
[02:04] <tepsipakki> cjwatson: oh, I didn't specify that it's a new package.. does that change things?
[02:07] <cjwatson> tepsipakki: not especially
[02:08] <tepsipakki> cjwatson: ok, it'll get in the queue anyway
[02:10] <atlas95> hello, f-spot 0.4 is buggy import failed
[02:19] <pitti> Riddell: is http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/tmp/apport-changes.txt good for you? it fixes my last tribe-5 bug, and otherwise just adds manpages and fixes two trivial bugs
[02:21] <ogra> mvo, ping
[02:21] <mvo> ogra: pong
[02:22] <ogra> mvo, did you ever think about GL screensavers and compiz ...
[02:22] <ogra> t just struck me that we might get bad probs her
[02:22] <ogra> e
[02:22] <mjg59> ogra: They're fine
[02:22] <ogra> ok
[02:22] <mvo> ogra: not really, no. because it runs fullscreen
[02:22] <mvo> preview in window is a bit of a problem (when the window is moved)
[02:22] <ogra> i thought GL doesnt work if composite is enabled
[02:22] <mvo> s/a bit of/a problem/
[02:23] <mvo> ogra: no, GL is fine, its "just" that for windowed 3d no damage events are generated when the window is moved and it can't be put behind another window and uglines like this
[02:23] <ogra> ah, k
[02:23] <mvo> ogra: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/122549 <- that one is a problem
[02:23] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 122549 in compiz "[gutsy]  compiz fusion breaking gnome-screensaver behaviour" [High,Incomplete] 
[02:24] <ogra> yeah, i just stumbled over it
[02:24] <ogra> thats why i asked :)
[02:24] <mvo> its the input that goes wrong, I think its only if a certain compiz setting is enabled (that we disable by default) that it gets triggered
[02:24] <mvo> but I'm not yet sure what causes it
[02:28] <Riddell> pitti: ok with me
[02:28] <pitti> Riddell: thanks, uploaded
[02:30] <Riddell> accepting
[02:32] <pitti> Riddell: thanks
[02:32] <pitti> yay, all my tribe5 bugs are fixed with that
[02:33] <ogra> still got the udeb ahead :/
[02:33] <Hobbsee> pitti: \o/
[02:33] <Riddell> ogra: udeb?
[02:34] <doko> Riddell: I'm looking (until calc is awake)
[02:34] <ogra> Riddell, bug 121547
[02:34] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 121547 in ltsp "[Gutsy]  LTSP chroot building process hangs at 50% on Tribe1 CD" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/121547
[02:35] <ogra> Riddell, the currentl ltsp udeb needs extension for the progress reporting of mksquashfs
[02:35] <ogra> thats my last tribe bug
[02:36] <Riddell> ogra: any ETA for that?
[02:36] <ogra> and was just moved to tribe6 ....
[02:36] <Riddell> oh, ok
[02:36] <ogra> Riddell, if i have more than half a day time for it to write that function
[02:37] <ogra> testing udeb stuff is quite time consuming
[02:44] <cjwatson> that's why you don't test that stuff in the udeb context until the very last step
[02:44] <cjwatson> you write it such that you can test most of the components in the regular system
[02:55] <doko> Riddell, pitti, seb128: it seems that the current OOo i386 build doesn't fail like the amd64 one. that will lead us to uninstallable packages on amd64. the upload ships some new binaries, so maybe keep the upload in NEW? Same for the -l10n upload if it succeeds
[02:56] <Riddell> doko: ok
[02:57] <doko> Riddell: but I don't know if -l10n has NEW packages ...
[03:01] <calc> doko: huh, something went wrong with the regeneration of the control file?
[03:02] <doko> calc: you didn't regenerate it
[03:02] <calc> doko: look at the top of the file, it should say... "openoffice.org-l10n"
[03:02] <calc> if it does it was regenerated
[03:04] <doko> calc: as I did say, it was not regenerated
[03:04] <doko> look in the diff.gz which you did upload
[03:05] <calc> its regenerated in the dir, looking in the diff.gz
[03:09] <calc> the diff.gz is killing firefox
[03:11] <calc> /usr/bin/ld: cannot find -lgcj <- wtf?
[03:12] <cjwatson> don't look at .diff.gzs in firefox :-)
[03:12] <cjwatson> (w3m works much better for them)
[03:12] <cprov> siretart: ping
[03:13] <cjwatson> calc: is libgcj<something>-dev installed in the buildd chroot? look at the head of the log
[03:13] <iwj> keescook: I have reproduced your triggers bug and am testing my fix now.
[03:13] <iwj> cjwatson: I think I've made it possible for a package's postinst to trigger that same package.  I'm testing that too.
[03:14] <cjwatson> calc: amd64 build of which package? openoffice.org-l10n?
[03:14] <doko> cjwatson, calc: no, it's not. testing a fix. looks like a merge bug
[03:14] <iwj> Riddell: Are you happy with a new version of dpkg to fix bug 133172 and address Colin's requirement ?
[03:14] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 133172 in dpkg "dpkg-triggers transitional activation did not happen" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/133172
[03:14] <iwj> I think perhaps I should have lunch though.
[03:14] <calc> cjwatson: openoffice.org (not l10n
[03:14] <cjwatson> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/8914285/buildlog_ubuntu-gutsy-amd64.openoffice.org-l10n_1%3A2.3.0%7Eoog680m1-1ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz lists libgcj8-dev as being installed
[03:14] <cjwatson> oh
[03:15] <doko> nevermind, wrong chroot
[03:15] <calc> doko: it failed due to -lgcj not being found in the log...
[03:15] <doko> calc: yes, my current work since 90min ...
[03:15] <cjwatson> likewise http://launchpadlibrarian.net/8914284/buildlog_ubuntu-gutsy-amd64.openoffice.org_1%3A2.3.0%7Eoog680m1-1ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz lists libgcj8-dev
[03:16] <calc> doko: and the original upload of openoffice.org-l10n was regenerated i looked in the diff.gz just now
[03:16] <calc> doko: so what did you do to fix the issue?, just regenerated the control file... again?
[03:17] <StevenK> pitti: libopenbabel1 can be NBS'd
[03:18] <Riddell> iwj: what's the change?
[03:19] <doko> calc: no, it was not. see ronne:~doko/ooo/23/23.debdiff
[03:19] <calc> ok looking now
[03:23] <calc> doko: ok
[03:23] <doko> I took the packages directly out of librarian
[03:24] <calc> hmm definitely doesn't look like it regenerated properly on my upload, sorry about that :\
[03:26] <calc> i can redo the upload turning off java for sparc if needed
[03:26] <calc> the failure on amd64 looks like a bug in gcj though at least from the error message
[03:28] <calc> doko: note that in the previous upload of oo.o java was completely disabled since it failed even on i386
[03:29] <doko> sparc is still building
[03:29] <calc> ok
[03:29] <StevenK> pitti: Didn't you say you promoted obexftp to fix kdebluetooth?
[03:30] <pitti> StevenK: I was about to, but the MIR wasn't approved
[03:31] <pitti> doko: ack
[03:31] <StevenK> pitti: Does the MIR need work?
[03:31] <Riddell> it needs a question answered
[03:31] <Riddell> Tonio_ may have talked to upstream, I'm not sure
[03:33] <StevenK> Ewww, I'm not touching that.
[03:35] <Tonio_> Riddell, StevenK, pitti: there are 2 issues in fact
[03:36] <Tonio_> the build-dep in universe had been removed as it is now obsolete, I have to get the change sync with debian
[03:36] <Tonio_> concerning the potential security issues, it appears obexftp in only used with the user's permissions, within an ioslave
[03:36] <iwj> Riddell: To fix 133172, arranging for package interest transitional processing to happen in all appropriate states of each package in question.
[03:36] <iwj> Riddell: To address Colin's requirement, to defer trigger Deferred file incorporation following a postinst until after the package status is updated.
[03:37] <Tonio_> no response from upstream yet on that point, but I suspect there shouldn't be any major security potentiel issue
[03:37] <Riddell> iwj: I mean is it a small change?
[03:38] <iwj> The former is very small.  The latter is a fairly small change semantically but involves a systematic change to about half a dozen places where the postinst is used.
[03:39] <iwj> Riddell: I'm just finishing my lunch and then going to eyeball the diff again carefully to make sure each one is correct.
[03:40] <Riddell> iwj: sound fine, since we have time with linux and OO still to be re-uploaded, although if you have a diff to eye over that would be good
[03:40] <doko> calc: -L/usr/lib/jvm/java-gcj/lib64
[03:40] <doko> this is crap. we don't have lib64
[03:40] <iwj> Riddell: OK, I'll eyeball it myself first.
[03:40] <calc> doko: the line where it failed also had -L/usr/lib though...
[03:41] <iwj> Should be with you in the next hour or so.
[03:41] <calc> doko: so it can't find it even in the normal dir
[03:41] <doko> calc: doesn't matter libgcj.so isn't found in /usr/lib
[03:41] <cjwatson> $ zgrep -F libgcj.so /mirror/ubuntu/dists/gutsy/Contents-i386.gz
[03:41] <cjwatson> [...] 
[03:41] <cjwatson> usr/lib/gcc/i486-linux-gnu/4.2/libgcj.so                    libdevel/libgcj8-dev
[03:41] <cjwatson> (though -L'ing that directory is probably a bad plan!)
[03:42] <pitti> hi gouki
[03:42] <doko> yes, and g++ (4.1) is used for linking
[03:42] <calc> the libgcj.so.* is in /usr/lib for the .so is in another dir?
[03:42] <calc> s/for/but/ ?
[03:43] <doko> calc: to be able to install compilers in parallel. so apparently our dear debian maintainer did upload a package which ftbfs ...
[03:43] <calc> fun :\
[03:43] <Tonio_> iwj, pitti: should I update the mir wiki page on that point or are those infos enough ?
[03:44] <pitti> Tonio_: I don't see how "obexftp only used with user's permissions" makes it any less of a security issue
[03:44] <calc> doko: so it needs to say /usr/lib/gcc/x86_64-linux-gnu/4.2/ ?
[03:44] <Hobbsee> pitti: just means it can trash ~ instead of / :P
[03:44] <pitti> Tonio_: remotely stealing or corrupting your files is no small risk :)
[03:44] <Hobbsee> minor data loss, really
[03:44] <Tonio_> pitti: that a repsonse for iwj in fact
[03:45] <doko> calc: no, -L/usr/lib/jvm/java-gcj/lib
[03:45] <calc> doko: oh ok
[03:45] <pitti> Hobbsee: I don't know about you, by my ~ is more precious than my /usr ;)
[03:45] <Hobbsee> pitti: indeed :0
[03:45] <Hobbsee> pitti: see the :P
[03:45] <pitti> heh, yeah
[03:45] <pitti> Tonio_: yes, please mention any answers on the wiki page, so that we have a record
[03:45] <calc> doko: i probably should wait to see if there is anything else needed for sparc before i upload this fix, right? :)
[03:46] <Tonio_> pitti: absolutly agree on that point, but going further concerning the security means looking carefully at the code, which I can't do myself
[03:46] <Hobbsee> calc: at least, not without a large sheild.
[03:46] <pitti> calc: depends; amd64 and i386 block CD builds, sparc doesn't
[03:46] <pitti> Tonio_: right
[03:46] <pygi> mr_pouit, ping
[03:46] <calc> pitti: true, /me looks to see if he can determine how long sparc still has to build
[03:49] <calc> looks like maybe 3-4 hr left, i'll get the next version ready to upload and just upload once i look at the sparc output in case its an easy fix
[03:54] <Tonio_> pitti, iwj: updated https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MainInclusionReportObexftp
[03:56] <doko> calc: I have a fix for the build failure on amd64
[03:57] <calc> doko: ok, can you send it to me?
[03:57] <calc> doko: unless you really want to do the upload, heh, i was going to disable java on powerpc for now unless you think its an easy fix
[03:57] <calc> doko: looks like registration fails which causes the build to fail for powerpc
[03:57] <calc> doko: if i am reading the log correctly
[03:58] <Treenaks> crimsun: Do you have an update about bug 119266? I just rebooted for the first time in ages, and the sound still didn't get detected.. :(
[03:58] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 119266 in linux-source-2.6.22 "Intel HDA Sound device doesn't work in gutsy" [Low,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/119266
[04:00] <geser> calc: wouldn't using g++-4.2 fix it also as it should look for libgcj.so in the right directory then?
[04:00] <calc> pitti: can you promote stlport4.6 back into main for now?
[04:00] <doko> calc: no, please do. ronne:~doko/xxx.diff it's not the correct one (that would be to use $JAVA_HOME/lib instead of $JAVA_HOME/lib64, but I didn't find that one)
[04:00] <pitti> calc: what about 5.1?
[04:00] <doko> calc: please could you build completely without stlport?
[04:01] <doko> pitti: doesn't work
[04:01] <calc> doko: thats what i am doing currently
[04:01] <calc> doko: well building with internal copy i think is what it ends up doing anyway
[04:01] <doko> calc: no, I mean building *without* stlport
[04:01] <calc> doko: oh, hmm i'll take a look and see if i can disable it entirely
[04:02] <calc> doko: yea i can disable it
[04:05] <ogra> pitti, did you promote gobby but missed its deps ? looks like on http://people.ubuntu.com/~ubuntu-archive/component-mismatches.txt
[04:07] <pitti> ogra: ah, apparently; demoted again, the report doesn't mention libxml2.6++ and it's in universe
[04:07] <ogra> ouch
[04:07] <ogra> new dep i guess
[04:08] <pitti> MIR queue updated
[04:08] <bigon> hi, could someone have a look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/devscripts/+bug/132928
[04:08] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 132928 in devscripts "debcommit: add options to specify changelog path" [Unknown,Fix committed] 
[04:23] <dholbach> Riddell: I assigned bug 121872 to you - hope that's ok
[04:23] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 121872 in qt4-x11 "*-qt4 tools should be present in $QTDIR/bin" [Undecided,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/121872
[04:28] <ogra> Keybuk, if i want to replace the shutdown command in /etc/event.d/control-alt-delete with "reboot -fp" (for thin clients) should i just divert the file or would you recommend any better way ?
[04:30] <eliast> Anybody has a good pointer for learning how to build my own deb from sources in new releases? like http://packages.ubuntu.com/gutsy/devel/mercurial
[04:32] <ogra> sudo apt-get install packaging-guide ?
[04:32] <pitti> eliast: man dpkg-buildpackage; quite technical and mostly not relevant, but it boils down to installing the build dependencies and 'debuild -us -uc -b'
[04:33] <eliast> thanks ogra, pitty
[04:33] <eliast> so in that url I pasted, there's the original source of the package and the diff.
[04:33] <eliast> I can patch the original, but then what.. debuild ... is the right direction then?
[04:33] <pitti> eliast: ah, dpkg-source -x foo.dsc to unpack it
[04:34] <pitti> eliast: yes, debuild will build the source package and create .debs for installation
[04:37] <infinity> calc: So, do we know anything about the OOo failures on amd64/powerpc?
[04:38] <calc> doko: it looks like $JAVA_HOME needs to be $(JAVA_HOME)
[04:38] <calc> infinity: we have a fix for both, amd64 had bad path for libgcj.so and powerpc fails for java in a different way so I am disabling java on it
[04:38] <doko> calc: ??? it's a configure script, not a Makefile
[04:39] <calc> infinity: waiting to see what sparc does
[04:39] <calc> doko: well it failed without the ()
[04:39] <calc> doko: actually nm
[04:39] <calc> doko: it still fails anyway, it hadn't gotten to that point in the configure when i thought that fixed it
[04:39] <doko> calc: do what you want, my build is running, 6000 files built
[04:39] <eliast> pitty, thanks! it all worked. dpkg-source -x foo.dsc and debuild did it all. awesome I love this stuff.
[04:40] <calc> doko: is xxx.diff the full patch you applied?
[04:40] <doko> calc: yes
[04:40] <iwj> Riddell: YHM - that triggers diff.  I did -U10 since it seemd to make it clearer to read.
[04:41] <iwj> I've done some basic tests and I'm going to rebuild for upload now.
[04:44] <Riddell> iwj: go for it
[04:44] <iwj> Thanks.
[04:47] <keescook> iwj: fix> cool.  :)
[04:53] <cjwatson> pitti: have you looked at promoting apturl yet? it makes livefs builds fail
[04:53] <pitti> cjwatson: no, I haven't
[04:53] <pitti> oh, new dependency of ubufox
[04:53] <cjwatson> yeah
[04:53] <cjwatson> would you, if you have a moment?
[05:23] <seb128> Riddell: could you accept the totem upload? That's a one line patch that makes the multimedia keys work again out of the box
[05:39] <Riddell> seb128: accepted
[05:39] <Riddell> seb128: but one day, you need to accept all the kde stuff in New in return!
[05:40] <seb128> Riddell: tomorrow is my archive day, I'll do some NEW ;)
[05:40] <Riddell> ooh, please
[06:12] <alex-weej> any idea when LP is back?
[06:12] <infinity> It went somewhere?
[06:12] <infinity> (Works for me)
[06:12] <cjwatson> alex-weej: it works for me
[06:12] <alex-weej> Sorry, you can't do this right now
[06:12] <alex-weej> Launchpad is offline at the moment for maintenance. It should be back, better than ever, soon. Thanks for your patience.
[06:12] <alex-weej> The Launchpad team
[06:12] <infinity> Reload that page.
[06:12] <alex-weej> third time lucky, whaddayaknow
[06:12] <infinity> You sometimes get it when the load-balancing messes up.
[06:13] <cjwatson> there is the cunningly named #launchpad channel for this sort of question, anyway
[06:13] <alex-weej> :o
[06:13] <infinity> cjwatson: Filthy lies and subterfuge.
[06:25] <Riddell> infinity: do you know if it's possible to build-dep on sun java?  it seems to fail at the debconf licence checkin my ppa
[06:27] <calc> i have 1ubuntu2 ready for OOo, I will upload it once I see what sparc does, its at 6hr now and failed before at 6:30 so shouldn't be too long if it is going to fail again
[06:27] <Riddell> calc: ok
[06:32] <calc> Riddell: any idea why kdelibs-dev would not be installable on lpia?
[06:32] <calc> Riddell: it shows as built on lpia
[06:32] <infinity> Riddell: Currently no, I've had requests form people to preseed the debconf question, but the Right Answer is to take it out completely, since it's not required by the license anymore.
[06:34] <calc> Riddell: hmm actually it looks like the packages that kdelibs4-dev depends on aren't installable
[06:35] <Riddell> calc: seems to install for me in my chroot
[06:35] <Riddell> doko: any chance of the debconf question being removed from sun java then?
[06:36] <calc> Riddell: hmm ok
[06:37] <alex-weej> asac: any chance you can help me out with https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager/+bug/131349 ?
[06:37] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 131349 in network-manager "NetworkManager crashed with signal 5 when attempting to connect to VPN" [Medium,New] 
[06:39] <asac> alex-weej: does it always happen?
[06:39] <infinity> calc: You can.
[06:39] <alex-weej> asac: yes.
[06:39] <asac> alex-weej: maybe you need just to restart?
[06:39] <asac> restart network-manager
[06:39] <alex-weej> asac: i have done so about 100 times since i started using gutsy :P
[06:39] <infinity> calc: Where are you seeing kdelibs-dev being uninstallable?
[06:39] <asac> how do you restart?
[06:39] <alex-weej> asac: my whole computer
[06:40] <asac> no try to restart network manager
[06:40] <alex-weej> asac: i do, every time it crashes
[06:40] <asac> so it doesn't happen always
[06:40] <alex-weej> does PPTP work for you? do you think this might be an upgrade path problem?
[06:40] <calc> infinity: it says not installed, not actually uninstallable
[06:40] <calc> infinity: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/8919258/buildlog_ubuntu-gutsy-lpia.openoffice.org_1%3A2.3.0%7Eoog680m1-1ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
[06:40] <alex-weej> asac: no it definitely ALWAYS happens every time i attempt to log on to VPN
[06:41] <calc> it appears debootstrap can't create a lpia chroot on my box at least
[06:41] <alex-weej> NM crashes, so i restart it
[06:41] <alex-weej> asac: then i try it again, same thing
[06:41] <alex-weej> restart NM
[06:41] <calc> infinity: i was going to try installing it locally but it seems debootstrap doesn't know how to handle lpia yet
[06:41] <infinity> calc: It does so.
[06:42] <infinity> calc: debootstrap --variant=buildd --arch lpia gutsy gutsy
[06:42] <asac> alex-weej: please attach your daemon.log as well to the bug?
[06:42] <calc> infinity: oh so its still at buildd level?
[06:42] <alex-weej> asac: sure, if you can tell me where it is
[06:42] <infinity> calc: Should work without variant=buildd too, but you're debugging a buildd install failure, right? :P
[06:43] <calc> infinity: yea true :)
[06:43] <alex-weej> asac: also are we interested in NetworkManagerDispatcher as well?
[06:43] <asac> alex-weej: /var/log/daemon.log
[06:45] <alex-weej> asac: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/8919655/daemon.log
[06:45] <asac> alex-weej: i guess the dispatcher doesn't crash, right?
[06:46] <alex-weej> asac: i don't really know how to tell as i don't know what it does
[06:46] <asac> alex-weej: which vpn packages are installed?
[06:46] <alex-weej> dbus says: '(null)'  'Failed to run vpnc binary.'. -- pptp != vpnc, no?
[06:46] <calc> infinity: heh, buildd variant doesn't even include apt-get
[06:46] <asac> alex-weej: you need vpnc ?
[06:46] <asac> hmm
[06:47] <alex-weej> asac: the daemon.log says so
[06:47] <alex-weej> asac: but i'm not using cisco
[06:47] <infinity> calc: Err, bloody well should.
[06:47] <calc> infinity: yea it should, very annoying without it
[06:47] <infinity> calc: If it doesn't it's failing earlier.
[06:47] <ScottK> Riddell: Would you please push clamav 0.91.2-0ubuntu1 out the door.  It's universe (i.e. not frozen).
[06:47] <alex-weej> asac: network-manager-openvpn and openvpn are installed, but i'm not using OpenVPN
[06:47] <calc> infinity: ah it did say something about failure retrying 5 times
[06:47] <asac> alex-weej: try to install it and see if it helps (yes I know you should not need it)
[06:47] <infinity> calc: No, I mean it "should" as in "it does, unless something's broken".
[06:47] <infinity> calc: Yeah, that would be the failure.
[06:47] <alex-weej> asac: ok 1 minute
[06:47] <asac> alex-weej: do you have network-manager-vpnc installed?
[06:48] <alex-weej> asac: no
[06:48] <asac> alex-weej: if so .. maybe remove it
[06:48] <asac> hmm
[06:48] <keescook> how did vnc4 enter main?
[06:48] <asac> alex-weej: well then insatll vpnc
[06:48] <calc> infinity: ah ok :)
[06:48] <Riddell> ScottK: accepted
[06:48] <alex-weej> asac: OpenVPN and PPTP are the only VPN types NM lists
[06:48] <ScottK> Riddell: Thanks.
[06:48] <calc> infinity: well then yea lpia is broken at buildd level, can't even generate a chroot right now
[06:48] <infinity> calc: Anyhow, since that's not happy with you right now, give me 30 seconds and I'll tell you what the kdelibs problem is.
[06:48] <asac> alex-weej: yes ... try please
[06:48] <calc> infinity: ok thanks :)
[06:49] <alex-weej> asac: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/8919728/daemon.log.2
[06:49] <doko> Riddell: I don't understand
[06:50] <cjwatson> Package: apt
[06:50] <keescook> Riddell: with your archive powers, do you know how to figure out how vnc4 ended up in main?
[06:50] <cjwatson> Build-Essential: yes
[06:50] <cjwatson> calc: ^-- ergo in buildd variant
[06:50] <elmo> I noticed the same thing last time I debootstraped lpia
[06:50] <calc> cjwatson: yea currently its failing to install via debootstrap :\
[06:51] <calc> cjwatson: debootstrap gives error message that it is retrying five times, then looked like it completed but actually failed
[06:51] <cjwatson> calc: either /debootstrap/debootstrap.log or /var/log/bootstrap.log in the chroot, depending on how far it got
[06:51] <cjwatson> the useful log should be in there
[06:52] <cjwatson> calc: openoffice.org on lpia is hardly urgent, though
[06:52] <cjwatson> calc: I wouldn't put effort into it
[06:52] <Riddell> keescook: can't see anything in the history, others (infinity?) may know how to search better, I presume someone promoted it
[06:52] <calc> cjwatson: ok
[06:52] <infinity> cjwatson: has that log EVER proven useful at that failure stage? :P
[06:52] <cjwatson> oh, although I suppose it is needed to get live filesystems working
[06:52] <calc> cjwatson: just wondering why it couldn't even install the depends
[06:52] <cjwatson> calc: ignore what I said, I guess we should care at least to some level
[06:52] <cjwatson> damn those language packs
[06:52] <keescook> cjwatson, infinity: we really do not want vnc4 in main -- it is totally unmaintained.
[06:53] <Riddell> doko: infinity says sun java doesn't need the manual licence approval, does that mean we can remove the debconf question?
[06:53] <infinity> cjwatson: I'm happy with it not being in main, no idea why it was in the first place.
[06:53] <keescook> it wasn't prior to gutsy; I don't see an MIR for it either
[06:53] <cjwatson> may predate MIRs
[06:53] <doko> Riddell, infinity: I'm not aware that anything did change. could you point me to the license change?
[06:54] <cjwatson> xvnc4viewer is in the desktop seed
[06:54] <calc> doko: are you going to commit the gcj fix to ooo-build?
[06:54] <cjwatson> revision 972, added by pitti to replace xvncviewer in response to bug 85403
[06:54] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 85403 in vnc4 "ship xvnc4viewer by default (in main)" [Undecided,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/85403
[06:54] <infinity> doko: Err.  Sun relicensed hava ages ago...
[06:54] <infinity> doko: The new license can't possibly include an EULA.
[06:55] <infinity> s/hava/java/
[06:55] <doko> infinity: what do you mean by "ages ago"? between java5 and java6?
[06:55] <alex-weej> asac: any ideas or do you want to phone a friend?
[06:55] <calc> cjwatson: it fails at "I: Unpacking the base system..."
[06:56] <doko> calc: well, that's temporary,
[06:56] <cjwatson> calc: that's not useful ...
[06:56] <calc> Setting up startup-tasks (0.3.8-1) ...
[06:56] <calc> dpkg: --unpack needs at least one package archive file argument
[06:56] <asac> mvo: is apturl already in main?
[06:56] <cjwatson> calc: ah, that sounds like it failed to find anything in build-essential
[06:56] <calc> says the --unpack line several times
[06:56] <cjwatson> yeah, it repeats just in case it helps, ignore that
[06:57] <calc> i can send that log file somewhere if it is useful to anyone
[06:57] <keescook> cjwatson: thanks for the link, I'll talk to pitti
[06:57] <cjwatson> calc: no need
[06:57] <calc> cjwatson: ok
[06:57] <cjwatson> it's correct, binary-lpia/Packages.gz has nothing Build-Essential: yes
[06:57] <calc> cjwatson: should it have installed apt-get?
[06:57] <cjwatson> oh, ARGH
[06:58] <cjwatson> this needs a launchpad patch
[06:58] <cjwatson> calc: yes, it should
[06:58] <asac> alex-weej: ... i'll try to look into the code tonight (when i get back from sport) ... otherwise i will take a quick look tomorrow ... at best ping me again.
[06:58] <cjwatson>   for arch in i386 amd64 powerpc sparc ia64; do
[06:58] <calc> cjwatson: heh
[06:58] <ivoks> cjwatson: i might be PITA, but please, don't let another ubuntu release with broken symbols (bug 93077) in couple of keymaps :)
[06:58] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 93077 in console-setup "Non-exsisting layouts" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/93077
[06:58] <alex-weej> asac: ok, cheers
[06:59] <cjwatson> ivoks: I'll look at it when I have time
[06:59] <cjwatson> which is not today
[06:59] <mr_pouit> pygi: pong
[07:00] <pygi> mr_pouit, you've got bug report on forums about new package
[07:00] <alex-weej> can someone triage this please and set a reasonable importance? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libbonobo/+bug/90923
[07:00] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 90923 in libbonobo "bonobo-activation-server doesn't exit after logout, prevents Bonobo-activated D-Bus applications from working on new login" [Undecided,Confirmed] 
[07:01] <cjwatson> doko: why did you ask the kernel guys for lpia udebs?
[07:01] <calc> going for 7 hours on sparc, thats a good sign (i think)
[07:02] <calc> or at least its a sign of tying up buildd resources ;\
[07:02] <cjwatson> doko: we're not doing d-i on lpia yet, so udebs are unnecessary
[07:02] <doko> cjwatson: hmm, maybe before you said we're not having the alternate disk?
[07:02] <cjwatson> I don't know when it happened, just now from kyle is the first I heard of it
[07:02] <mr_pouit> pygi: I don't have enough time to check the forums :/ (I am already a moderator of the french one)
[07:03] <pygi> mr_pouit, as you wish
[07:05] <ivoks> cjwatson: ok
[07:08] <infinity> calc: The kdelibs thing was transient, now libcompress-zlib-perl is the only uninstallable in your build-dep list.  *shrug*
[07:10] <infinity> Oh, libcompress-zlib-perl doesn't exist.  That would do it.
[07:10] <infinity> ... because it's dep-wait on something else... On all arches.
[07:12] <infinity> dep-wait on a package we don't have, even.  Awesome stuff.
[07:12] <calc> leet
[07:12] <cjwatson> I think that only disappeared recently?
[07:12] <cjwatson> it certainly used to exist
[07:12] <calc> infinity: but why did it mention kdelibs as well, or was that spurious?
[07:13] <calc> infinity: oh ok, i see you mentioned that already, nm
[07:13] <infinity> cjwatson: Doesn't exist in any dist, according to madison.
[07:13] <cjwatson> oh, you mean a dep-wait from libcompress-zlib-perl?
[07:13] <infinity> libio-compress-zlib-perl, that is.
[07:13] <infinity> Yeah, it's brand new in Debian, needs a sync.
[07:14] <infinity> And then an MIR and promotion.
[07:14] <infinity> \o/
[07:14] <cjwatson> libio-compress-base-perl too
[07:14] <kylem> winning
[07:14] <cjwatson> that shouldn't have been synced
[07:14] <cjwatson> doko: did something else need the newer libcompress-zlib-perl
[07:14] <cjwatson> ?
[07:15] <calc> hmm ooo doesn't use it, what was pulling that package in
[07:16] <cjwatson> there's no rationale in bug 129651, though it was pre-UVF
[07:16] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 129651 in libcompress-zlib-perl "sync request" [Wishlist,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/129651
[07:16] <infinity> calc: "apt-cache rdepends libcompress-zlib-perl", and marvel at the list.
[07:16] <calc> infinity: haha
[07:16] <infinity> (po-debconf would be your answer)
[07:16] <calc> infinity: i see :)
[07:17] <doko> cjwatson: well, I didn't check, it was pre-UVF
[07:17] <cjwatson> po-debconf is needed by practically everything
[07:17] <cjwatson> doko: there is a reason we stop syncing automatically, you know ... ;-)
[07:18] <doko> cjwatson: I didn't touch libio-*
[07:18] <cjwatson> doko: they weren't needed before the version of libcompress-zlib-perl you requested be synced
[07:18] <cjwatson> so that introduced a bug
[07:18] <doko> ouch
[07:21] <iwj> cjwatson: I'll ask you since Scott isn't around: would you be able to arrange for bug 54389 to be prioritised ?
[07:21] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 54389 in malone "Implement a milestone command in the email interface" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/54389
[07:21] <iwj> doko asked me to file autopkgtest bugs with a milestone set and I can't do that atm.  I'm about to reset the autopkgtest system and expect to have a huge pile of bugs to report by the end of the week.
[07:22] <iwj> It looks to me like it ought to be reasonably straightforward.
[07:23] <cjwatson> iwj: OK, I'll see what I can do. Not sure the rollout schedule will allow for it by end of week though (not my fault etc.)
[07:23] <iwj> Yes.
[07:23] <iwj> This has just got to the top of my stack.
[07:23] <cjwatson> iwj: in the meantime, is filing with a tag possible?
[07:24] <cjwatson> that would at least be conveniently searchable
[07:24] <iwj> If you discover when the feature is likely to arrive please let me know.
[07:24] <iwj> No.
[07:24] <iwj> But the subject lines are very formulaic.
[07:28] <tkamppeter> Riddell, I have fixed some bugs in system-config-printer, bug 102389 (HIGH), bug 127152 (MEDIUM), bug 128261 (MEDIUM), and bug 132994 (LOW)
[07:28] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 102389 in gnome-cups-manager "printer auto-detection does the wrong thing for Xerox 7228" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/102389
[07:28] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 127152 in system-config-printer "Samba printers are not displayed" [Medium,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/127152
[07:28] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 128261 in system-config-printer "Wrong name displayed for smb printer" [Medium,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/128261
[07:28] <mvo> asac: not yet in main AFAIK
[07:28] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 132994 in system-config-printer "S-c-p should recommend hal-cups-utils" [Low,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/132994
[07:28] <tkamppeter> see bug 133891 for the upload.
[07:28] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 133891 in system-config-printer "UVF ER: system-config-printer SVN rev 1415" [High,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/133891
[07:28] <cjwatson> iwj: I've asked; I'll let you know what I get back
[07:28] <iwj> Ta.
[07:29] <infinity> cjwatson: So, what do we do about the installability of po-debconf?  Sync, sync, promote, promote, all with our eyes firmly shut?
[07:30] <cjwatson> that's my vote
[07:30] <cjwatson> I seriously can't see perl modules being a problem
[07:30] <infinity> No, neither can I.
[07:30] <cjwatson> I thought they were basically just split out of libcompress-zlib-perl, at least in spirit
[07:30] <infinity> Generally.
[07:30] <infinity> Alright, I'm gonna go sync away.
[07:31] <calc> infinity: can you sync libwpg to universe while you're at it?
[07:31] <calc> infinity: its not in ubuntu yet
[07:32] <calc> infinity: its needed for OOo so i will be writing a MIR shortly
[07:33] <infinity> calc: Sure.
[07:33] <infinity> calc: What's your LP ID?
[07:33] <calc> infinity: ccheney
[07:34] <infinity> E: libwpg: not found
[07:34] <infinity> Try harder.
[07:34] <infinity> Oh, it's THAT new.
[07:37] <cjwatson> infinity: (update-sources)
[07:37] <cjwatson> might as well update the lot rather than just one
[07:38] <infinity> cjwatson: Ahh, didn't realise anyone had scripted it, was going to mention that we should. :P
[07:39] <infinity> cjwatson: Why not just cron that or something, so it's always ready?
[07:46] <cjwatson> infinity: I think it's in case it collides with a sync
[07:46] <cjwatson> s/$/ run/
[07:46] <cjwatson> it doesn't update the files atomically, which is a bug
[07:47] <infinity> cjwatson: That would take about 10 seconds to fix...
[07:47] <cjwatson> http://people.ubuntu.com/~cjwatson/tmp/grub-installer.14244.diff
[07:47] <cjwatson> how much does that make people scream in terror?
[07:47] <cjwatson> (the answer will not necessarily stop me uploading it, if it works)
[07:48] <Mithrandir> cjwatson: the changelog or the code?
[07:48] <cjwatson> the code
[07:48] <infinity> cjwatson: What does this fix, exactly?
[07:48] <Mithrandir> the code is.. scary.
[07:48] <Mithrandir> the changelog looks fine though
[07:49] <doko> Riddell: so unless infinity gives me a hint *why* the question can be removed, we will keep it
[07:49] <cjwatson> infinity: the bug noted in the changelog ...
[07:49] <cjwatson> infinity: some loony BIOSes refuse to boot if there's no active partition on the disk
[07:50] <infinity> cjwatson: Meh.  Fair enough.
[07:50] <infinity> cjwatson: Should this be in grub-installer at all?
[07:50] <infinity> cjwatson: lilo-installer would surely need the code duplicated.
[07:50] <infinity> cjwatson: (So, partman or something?)
[07:51] <Riddell> doko: I'm guessing he's thinking of the GPL version
[07:51] <infinity> If there's no active partition, mark boot, or root, or first primary, in that preference order.
[07:51] <mvo> elmo: the compiz bug you mentioned this morning (no decoration) is now fixed in my local repo, thanks for raising the issue
[07:52] <cjwatson> infinity: lilo-installer already has it ...
[07:52] <cjwatson> infinity: needs to go in the bootloader installer 'cos you need to munge the disk you're putting the bootloader on
[07:52] <cjwatson> and you don't know that in partman
[07:52] <infinity> cjwatson: Ahh.  Is this a cargo-cult of lilo's code? That would make me feel better about knowing it works. :)
[07:52] <ion_> The one thing that annoys me the most about compiz is that window decorations change to show the new focused window after a delay.
[07:53] <cjwatson> infinity: ish. it's different because it has to convert BACK from grub device names to OS device names, and I also decided I didn't care about marking /boot as active if GRUB was going in the MBR; first primary would do fine
[07:54] <cjwatson> though if you know of a reason it's important to try /boot then / then first primary, I'm willing to listen
[07:54] <infinity> cjwatson: I imagine marking /boot just looks prettier in an fdisk list.  (or, at least, looks less confusing)
[07:54] <cjwatson> I suspect there are BIOSes that insist on a primary being active though
[07:54] <infinity> cjwatson: It has to be a primary, yes.
[07:54] <infinity> cjwatson: An active logical is plain wrong.
[07:54] <cjwatson> maybe I should go for /boot-if-primary (!) then first primary
[07:54] <cjwatson> works on some BIOSes that suffer from this bug, but I agree with you
[07:55] <mvo> ion_: what do you mean exactly?
[07:55] <infinity> cjwatson: Most modern BIOSes are completely forgiving about the whole thing, but the old skool DOS world, it had to be a primary.
[07:55] <infinity> cjwatson: So, being anal pays here, I guess.
[07:55] <infinity> cjwatson: Even though it's an utter lie anyway, cause we're chaining from the MBR.
[07:56] <cjwatson> personally I was surprised this bug appeared at all on a modern BIOS
[07:56] <infinity> Some OEMs manage to spectacularly fuck up their BIOSes.
[07:56] <cjwatson> oh, I tell a lie, the reporter said it worked if they marked the extended partition containing the logical containing Ubuntu active
[07:56] <lamont> seb128: got time for yelp complaints?
[07:56] <infinity> Despite Pheonix/AMI/Award/whoever providing them with perfectly useful stuff out of the box.
[07:57] <cjwatson> so probably just "anything in the main MBR partition table" was good enough there
[07:57] <ion_> mvo: For instance, my active windows have a brown decoration and inactive windows have a grey decoration. When i alt-tab to another window or switch a workspace, the resulting newly active windows decoration only changes to brown after all the transition effects have finished. When alt-tabbing, i can already write a short piece of text to the new window before its decoration changes to brown.
[07:57] <tkamppeter_> Riddell, ping
[07:58] <ion_> mvo: When i switch to a new window, i think its decoration should show that immediately while a transition effect is running, not after it.
[07:59] <Riddell> tkamppeter_: hi
[08:00] <tkamppeter> Riddell, I have fixed some bugs in system-config-printer, bug 102389 (HIGH), bug 127152 (MEDIUM), bug 128261 (MEDIUM), and bug 132994 (LOW)
 Launchpad bug 102389 in gnome-cups-manager "printer auto-detect
[08:00] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 102389 in gnome-cups-manager "printer auto-detection does the wrong thing for Xerox 7228" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/102389
[08:00] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 127152 in system-config-printer "Samba printers are not displayed" [Medium,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/127152
[08:00] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 128261 in system-config-printer "Wrong name displayed for smb printer" [Medium,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/128261
[08:00] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 132994 in system-config-printer "S-c-p should recommend hal-cups-utils" [Low,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/132994
[08:01] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 102389 in gnome-cups-manager "printer auto-detection does the wrong thing for Xerox 7228" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/102389
[08:01] <tkamppeter> see bug 133891 for the upload.
[08:01] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 133891 in system-config-printer "UVF ER: system-config-printer SVN rev 1415" [High,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/133891
[08:01] <doko> cjwatson, infinity: one of you doing the libio-compress-* packages? if not I would do it now
[08:01] <Riddell> tkamppeter: I've uploaded it
[08:01] <doko> calc: my amd64 build did fail in the install step
[08:02] <tkamppeter> Riddell, this was quick. Thanks.
[08:02] <calc> doko: odd
[08:02] <cjwatson> doko: I think infinity is on it
[08:02] <calc> doko: do you have a log?
[08:03] <doko> ERROR:  /scratch/packages/ooo/23/openoffice.org-2.3.0~oog680m1/ooo-build/build/current/solver/680/unxlngx6.pro/bin/regcomp -register -br  ...
[08:03] <doko> it's within the java components
[08:04] <calc> doko: oh it fails more or less the same on powerpc i think also
[08:05] <mvo> ion_: heh :) I never notice, but you are right
[08:06] <ion_> mvo: That has been bugging me for a long time. Ive just never got around to posting a bug report or even trying to fix it.
[08:06] <infinity> doko: Already done.
[08:06] <calc> doko: it failed here on powerpc "regcomp -register  -br ../../unxlngppc.pro/misc/bridgetest/bootstrap.rdb -r ../../unxlngppc.pro/lib/uno_services.rdb..."
[08:07] <calc> doko: i'll disable java on amd64 as well for the next upload, that should keep that from failing
[08:09] <doko> no, the bridgetest failure seems to be another one
[08:10] <calc> doko: oh so its two separate issues not just that regcomp is broken?
[08:10] <jdstrand> cjwatson: I was trying to add a new task to tasksel, but get 'tasksel: aptitude failed (100)'.  I don't know if it is related to bug #131134 or if I have just done something stupid.
[08:10] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 131134 in tasksel "When attempting to install lamp-server, returns "aptitude failed (100)"" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/131134
[08:10] <jdstrand> cjwatson: see http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/34546/ for the file I used
[08:11] <jdstrand> cjwatson: is there something I need to do beyond adding that file to ubuntu-tasks?
[08:11] <doko> calc: no, regcomp is not broken, but fails to install something for some reason. yes, the tool has very poor diagnostics
[08:12] <cjwatson> jdstrand: that'll only work if Task: ossh-server is in your Packages file ...
[08:12] <calc> doko: oh ok
[08:12] <cjwatson> jdstrand: is this for automatic installation?
[08:13] <jdstrand> cjwatson: well, the #ubuntu-server team wanted to add openssh as a taskel option, so I said I'd look into it, and wanted to provide you with everything so you didn't have to do extra work.
[08:13] <jdstrand> cjwatson: but here I am asking you for help.  :)
[08:13] <cjwatson> jdstrand: blink, it seems far too small for a task
[08:13] <doko> calc: maybe you could look for the place where $JAVA_HOME/lib64 is defined and used, and replace that one with $JAVA_HOME/lib
[08:14] <kylem> elmo, did you file a bug for that i945 stuff?
[08:14] <lamont> Riddell: yelp_2.19.90-0ubuntu2 uploaded to fix ftbfs on lpia (and hppa).  whether you accept it or not before tribe 5 is left as an exercise for you
[08:14] <cjwatson> jdstrand: if one were to do it, the correct answer is to add a seed for it to bzr+ssh://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/ubuntu-seeds/ubuntu.gutsy/ with the right Task-* headers, and after that just run the thing in tasksel which automatically regenerates ubuntu-tasks/
[08:14] <jdstrand> jdstrand: yeah-- it is, but they wanted something obvious on install for installing openssh, for those LAMP installations that want it
[08:14] <calc> doko: ok will look around and see where that is defined
[08:14] <cjwatson> jdstrand: (files dropped into ubuntu-tasks/ manually will be erased)
[08:14] <lamont> hrm... I suppose I should file a bug for that.
[08:15] <cjwatson> jdstrand: they should just get a core-dev to create an openssh-server seed, anyway. (not ossh-server, please)
[08:15] <infinity> lamont: File a bug for the one you just fixed?
[08:15] <infinity> lamont: That's a spectacular waste of time.
[08:15] <cjwatson> it's a simple text file
[08:15] <lamont> with the patch, dude
[08:15] <lamont> seb128: new yelp that builds on lpia (and hppa) uploaded, just fyi
[08:16] <Riddell> lamont: a debdiff would be better than a bug
[08:16] <jdstrand> cjwatson: I just did 'ossh-server' in my debugging since 'ssh-server' can be either openssh or lsh-server.  I didn't know if that error was a namespace thing or not (I am new to tasksel)
[08:16] <lamont> Riddell: to where?
[08:17] <cjwatson> right, openssh-server is a less confusing name though. :)
[08:17] <cjwatson> you definitely want to list real packages not virtual packages
[08:17] <Riddell> lamont: to me :)
[08:17] <cjwatson> and if it's a one-package task ...
[08:17] <jdstrand> cjwatson: yes.  ;)
[08:17] <cjwatson> jdstrand: tasks and package names are in different namespaces
[08:17] <lamont> Riddell: if you reject -0ubuntu2 can I re-upload?
[08:18] <cjwatson> tasks are magic though, you need launchpad integration to create them, and that's achieved through the seeds
[08:18] <Riddell> lamont: sure, something wrong with it?
[08:18] <lamont> yeah.  debian/control.in is used.
[08:18] <Riddell> ooh, evil
[08:18] <jdstrand> cjwatson: ok cool.  I'll take you comments on over to #ubuntu-server and go from there.  thanks!
[08:18] <cjwatson> if it's listed as inherited by server-ship (or ship or ship-live) in the STRUCTURE file, you'll get tasks for it)
[08:18] <cjwatson> s/)$//
[08:19] <dobey> hmm.
[08:19] <cjwatson> actually nowadays you get tasks for anything with Task-* headers, but in this case it should be inside server-ship anyway
[08:19] <cjwatson> jdstrand: cool
[08:20] <calc> cool sparc failed due to ICE :(
[08:21] <Riddell> lamont: rejected
[08:21] <calc> at least it wasn't OOo's fault
[08:22] <lamont> Riddell: and diff sent
[08:22] <lamont> and correct version uploaded
[08:23] <lamont> Riddell: and note that it is in no way critical for tribe 54
[08:23] <lamont> s/4//
[08:23] <lamont> unless infinity is planning on tribe5 media
[08:24] <lamont> unless infinity is planning on tribe5 media for lpia
[08:24] <lamont> (that came out wrong there for a moment)
[08:25] <ion_> Could cups-pdf be added to xubuntu-desktop as well, btw?
[08:27] <mathiaz> keescook: what was the reason to add a .dfsg to the apparmor package ?
[08:28] <kylem> gfdl docs?
[08:28] <keescook> mathiaz: yawp, kylem is right; I dropped the PDFs
[08:28] <mathiaz> keescook: the pdfs are no longer in the repository.
[08:29] <mathiaz> keescook: they'Re generated during the package building
[08:29] <Riddell> ion_: it has been
[08:29] <mathiaz> keescook: with pdflatex
[08:29] <keescook> mathiaz: ah-ha!  great; they found the original sources then.  :)
[08:29] <mathiaz> keescook: and I've actually disabled the doc build for now.
[08:30] <mathiaz> keescook: so should we remove the dfsg part of the package name ?
[08:30] <keescook> yeah, if the new upstream doesn't have anything to drop, sure.
[08:30] <lamont> mathiaz: if the docs are gfdl, then they still have to get dropped, don't they?
[08:30] <keescook> sorry, I wasn't clear.  they're not gfdl, they're gpl, but the old versions didn't have source
[08:31] <mathiaz> lamont: I think the original problem was that the upstream repository had pdf files in it.
[08:32] <ion_> riddell: Ah, thanks. The change hadnt bubbled up to my system yet.
[08:32] <mathiaz> keescook: I guess I'll have to add an Obsolete or Conflict tag to the control file.
[08:32] <keescook> mathiaz: ?  we should still build the docs
[08:32] <Riddell> ion_: no, we're frozen
[08:33] <mathiaz> keescook: yes. I'll add that too... It just that it pull 500 Mb of dependencies
[08:33] <mathiaz> keescook: just to build the doc.
[08:33] <seb128> lamont: thanks
[08:33] <mathiaz> keescook: I'll put these in the apparmor-doc package.
[08:33] <keescook> mathiaz: what did you mean about the Conflict/Obsolete issue?
[08:33] <lamont> seb128: that was the first one that I ran into, fwiw
[08:34] <mathiaz> keescook: well. hum... dfsg is part of the version ?
[08:34] <mathiaz> keescook: or not part of anything...
[08:35] <keescook> mathiaz: it's just part of the version, no problems.
[08:35] <mathiaz> keescook: ah ok. So I just to drop it, and it won't be a problem during the upgrade.
[08:35] <mathiaz> keescook: ?
[08:35] <keescook> mathiaz: right, as long as other parts of the version are higher than the prior one.  :)
[08:36] <mathiaz> keescook: I think so. I'm now at apparmor_2.1+939.dfsg-0ubuntu1
[08:36] <infinity> calc: I can kill the i386 OOo build, right, since there's another planned?
[08:37] <calc> infinity: yea
[08:37] <mvo> it looks like python dbm files created with older python versions can not be read with latest python with db4.6.? (bug #133691 looks like it)
[08:37] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 133691 in command-not-found "doesn't cope with db format transition" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/133691
[08:37] <cjwatson> mathiaz: forget about Obsolete, it's ... er ... obsolete
[08:37] <cjwatson> actually I think that was Obsoletes
[08:37] <seb128> lamont: first one of what? packages not building on lpia?
[08:37] <cjwatson> you probably read a mention of it in the policy manual for the benefit of those running across truly ancient packages
[08:38] <lamont> seb128: first gnome package failing to build on hppa.
[08:39] <lamont> lpia was a convenient excuse to fix it, since it was found to be broken there (by inspection).
[08:39] <lamont> at the moment, yelp is dep-wait on lpia.....
[08:43] <lamont> seb128: although the glib2.0 thread tests are being annoying on hppa. (which comes as little surprise, sadly)
[08:45] <lamont> seb128: and gnome-power-manager needs some love, gnome-system-tools needs love on all architectures
[08:49] <calc> ooo 1ubuntu2 uploaded
[08:51] <seb128> lamont: I'll have a look at the g-s-t build issue
[09:10] <alex-weej> a question about our new friend, displayconfig-gtk
[09:10] <alex-weej> if i have enabled the fglrx driver via restricted-manager
[09:10] <alex-weej> and i choose "ati" in displayconfig-gtk
[09:11] <alex-weej> i don't think DRI will work unless it uninstalls fglrx
[09:11] <alex-weej> as fglrx supplies its own libGL etc.
[09:11] <alex-weej> there needs to be some interplay i think here...
[09:11] <alex-weej> anyone have any ideas?
[09:14] <alex-weej> at least this was a problem for me before we had restricted manager and i was trying to use the ati driver by setting up my xorg.conf manually
[09:14] <alex-weej> i needed to uninstall fglrx so that X would use the right GL driver
[09:14] <alex-weej> ... GL implementation
[09:47] <seb128> Riddell: could you accept the gdm update? it's a one key change to make the user lists theme work out of the box
[09:47] <seb128> alex-weej: maybe worth mentioning on the #ubuntu-x channel
[09:50] <alex-weej> seb128: on it thanks
[10:14] <Riddell> seb128: can I see a debdiff?
[10:17] <cprov> seb128: hi, do you know who is covering mvo on update-manager issues ?
[10:17] <seb128> Riddell:
[10:17] <seb128> +-Browser=false
[10:17] <seb128> ++Browser=true
[10:17] <seb128> Riddell: basically
[10:18] <seb128> cprov: nobody? what issue exactly?
[10:18] <seb128> cprov: I don't think other people from the team work on update-manager, better to ask on the chan if you have an issue
[10:19] <cprov> seb128: it's refusing to refresh indexes from a specific PPA
[10:22] <cprov> seb128: well, I don't have enough information (things are working normally here ), let the user come back with a better description of the problem. (thanks)
[10:25] <Riddell> seb128: accepted
[10:25] <seb128> Riddell: thanks
[10:25] <seb128> cprov: maybe better to open a bug on launchpad or wait tomorrow when mvo will be around
[10:26] <cprov> seb128: right.
[10:46] <calc> i wrote two MIRs for openoffice build-depends :)
[10:59] <Riddell> calc: presumably not the version currently compiling?
[11:00] <calc> Riddell: no i'm just going to use them for the next upload later, i am using internal copy for the current build
[11:01] <calc> Riddell: there will be several more ooo uploads before gutsy, so it doesn't need to be in for the current build
[11:02] <calc> once i verify libwpg builds everywhere i will be writing a MIR for it
[11:24] <Riddell> infinity: I've accepted linux-source .29, hopefully you can see it and lrm/lum/meta compiled and I'll get up early tomorrow for CD building
[11:24] <Riddell> bonus points if you update seeds and d-i too :)
[12:00] <elmo> kylem: yes
[12:00] <kylem> ?
[12:00] <elmo> kylem: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/discover-data/+bug/133824
[12:00] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 133824 in discover-data "Intel chipset on HP NC6320 (PCI 8086:27a2) not recognised" [Undecided,New] 
[12:00] <kylem> thanks.