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[07:04] <real_ate> ... not sure if this is the right place to ask but can anyone tell me if a mobile phone can be used as a microphone? wanna know if it is impossible or not
[07:05] <kwwii> real_ate: not the right place to ask
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[07:11] <lucasr> hi all
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[07:13] <real_ate_> sorry... got disconnected there... anyone get an answer for me? 
[07:13] <real_ate_> ;)
[07:14] <agoliveira> real_ate_: Sorry, not what's channel is about. Check out the faq.
[07:15] <real_ate_> agoliveira: thanks ;) i shall continue my search elsewhere :P
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[10:30] <rustyl> is anyone familiar with the xmessage launch feedback protocol used by libstartup-notify?
[10:31] <rustyl> Mithrandir, FYI, the matchbox crash that we see when starting an application as a dbus service is related to this protocol
[10:32] <rustyl> i found a bug in libstartup-notification, but i'm a bit unclear on how this code should work
[10:33] <Mithrandir> I have never looked at the code, so no.
[10:35] <rustyl> seems the libstartup-notification is expecting an xmessage that looks like "add: some=value", but instead the message looks like "add: some:value"
[10:35] <rustyl> that combined with some braindead code that just assumes the parsing worked out ok, and then attempts to dereference a null pointer
[10:36] <rustyl> beyond the assumption that the parsing worked out fine, i'm now trying to figure out whos falt it is that the xmessage protocol has not been followed, just incase this is a symptom of something more nasty
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[11:28] <agoliveira> bspencer: Hi Bob. You told me once that you're providing the clock applet or am I in need of some sort of psichyatric treatment?
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[11:29] <bspencer> agoliveira, I haven't thought much about it
[11:29] <bspencer> we could have a control panel applet for configuring it
[11:30] <bspencer> and launch said applet from the marquee plugin
[11:30] <bspencer> I also wondered if the marquee plugin should show a calendar drop-down when clicked
[11:30] <agoliveira> bspencer: For now I'll be happy to know if this up to you or us :)
[11:30] <bspencer> but it currently doesn't have an owner.  Suggestions welcome
[11:30] <bspencer> agoliveira, yes, me too. 
[11:31] <bspencer> It might be part of control panel... which we would cover
[11:31] <bspencer> or PIM, which we wouldn't :P
[11:31] <bspencer> arm-wrestle ?
[11:32] <agoliveira> bspencer: I just did threw a coin and I won. Sorry: it's up to you :)
[11:32] <bspencer> dang
[11:32] <kwwii> hi bob, adilson...any way we can set up a pow-wow to discuss the hildon-theme-tools?
[11:32] <bspencer> kwwii, pow-wow in session
[11:32] <bspencer> I turn the time to kwwii 
[11:32] <agoliveira> bspencer: Seriously, the PIM does not have support for it.
[11:32] <bspencer> agoliveira, ok.  well at a minimum we will have a clock applet and a configuration tool in control panel
[11:33] <bspencer> but no link to a dates calendar
[11:33] <bspencer> sound ok?
[11:33] <agoliveira>  kwwii: Hi Ken. The problem is that I'll be here in US the whole week.
[11:33] <bspencer> agoliveira, coincidentally I will be too
[11:33] <agoliveira> bspencer: Coool.
[11:33] <bspencer> agoliveira, why is that a problem for pow-wow?
[11:34] <agoliveira> bspencer: Yes but youe on you territory :)
[11:34] <kwwii> bspencer: well, I downloaded the tools, ran hildon-theme-bootstrap (which creates and empty theme), added a template svg and png...how can I now build it to test it?
[11:34] <kwwii> agoliveira: right, I was hoping that bspencer has an idea of how this stuff works ;-)
[11:35] <bspencer> kwwii, what libraries do you need to build?
[11:35] <agoliveira> No problem. JUst that Ill have a hard time to follow.
[11:35] <bspencer> kwwii, I haven't done it
=== bspencer says shamefully
[11:35] <bspencer> I just modified an existing plankton theme in the <theme> folder
[11:35] <kwwii> bspencer: I do not think I need to build any libraries, but rather create an installable deb out of the theme package I (think, hope) I created
[11:36] <bspencer> kwwii, if you are asking for help with the packaging, I can 
[11:37] <kwwii> bspencer: hrm, I would guess the long-run we will want to create an installable theme out of this, right?
[11:37] <bspencer> certainly
[11:37] <bspencer> and create tools that make the deb pkg automagically
[11:37] <kwwii> to be honest, I am not sure if the hildon-theme-bootstrap will even do exactly what we want to do
[11:37] <kwwii> bspencer: how did you run the slicer tool? 
[11:37] <bspencer> never did
[11:37] <bspencer> never started with a template
[11:38] <kwwii> hehe, you really did cheat :p
[11:38] <bspencer> totally
[11:38] <bspencer> I figured it was pointless to embed my pics in a template when I knew they would never get used
[11:38] <kwwii> bspencer: well, the template I created is a quick tweak on the plankton stuff and now I need to test it...the colors for the theme are also taken from the template file - that is the real thing to test now
[11:39] <kwwii> bspencer: should I send you a tar.gz of the stuff I made? (the names and definitions are changed so it will not replace any existing theme)
[11:39] <bspencer> sure
[11:40] <kwwii> bspencer: I tried to find info on the maemo website and although I found a definition of pretty much every pic used I found no docs on the tools themselves
[11:40] <bspencer> i recall running the same circles
[11:40] <bspencer> is the slicer tool part of gutsy?
=== bspencer checks
[11:41] <kwwii> yes, it should be in the hildon-theme-tools package
[11:41] <kwwii> at least, I got it from launchpad
[11:41] <bspencer> right
[11:41] <bspencer> and you can't get the slicer to work on your template?
[11:41] <bspencer> installing that package now...
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[11:44] <kwwii> bspencer: to be honest I did not try it yet, as we need more than just that tool
[11:45] <bspencer> let me remind myself of the process...
[11:45] <kwwii> bspencer: there is also a tool for picking the middle color of the boxes on the right of the template and putting them in the right text file
[11:45] <bspencer> 1) create a template png file (with layout file that specifies all the locations)
[11:45] <kwwii> the bootstrap tool simply makes an empty package (while allowing one to enter the name, definition, author, etc directly in the terminal)
[11:45] <bspencer> 2) run the slicer to create a directory of all graphics indidually
[11:46] <bspencer> hm... the bootstrap comes before #1 ?
[11:46] <kwwii> yepp
[11:46] <kwwii> and somehow in the build process there should be some tool to call the slicer and a couple of other tools
[11:47] <kwwii> at least, I assume that the slicer is only a cutter-upper as there are other tools in hildon-theme-tools 
[11:47] <bspencer> well, I thought it would be:  #3) put your directory of images , you directory of icons, and your matchbox theme and gtkrc files in a folder and run "theme-to-debian-package" tool
[11:48] <kwwii> bspencer: is there already a theme-debian-package-tool I am missing?
[11:48] <bspencer> no
[11:48] <bspencer> #3 is a manual process 
[11:49] <bspencer> looking at my list of exsting tools
[11:49] <kwwii> hrm, it is also important that in addition to the slicer we run at least hildon-theme-rc-parser
[11:49] <bspencer> right
[11:49] <bspencer> mk-bundle just seems to make a zip
[11:49] <kwwii> basically, we want to cut it up, pick the right colors, make makefiles or whatever to put the files in the right places after install and then build the deb
[11:50] <kwwii> yeah, I think that makes a theme which one can install without creating a deb or such
[11:50] <kwwii> any idea what hildon-theme-subst does?
[11:50] <kwwii> I assume it substitutes something :-)
[11:51] <bspencer> maybe just change the colors magically?
[11:51] <kwwii> yeah, I was not sure if the rc-parser did that
[11:52] <bspencer> is Michael Dominic your friend
[11:52] <bspencer> his name is on everything
[11:53] <kwwii> yeah, as is my friend tuomas, but I think he is on vacation
[11:53] <bspencer> Let me try out bootstrap...
[11:53] <bspencer> i assume layout-4 is going to be recent for us?
[11:54] <bspencer> I haven't heard of anything newer
[11:54] <kwwii> that is the latest that I now of
[11:54] <kwwii> we'll probably have to change a lot anywasy
[11:54] <kwwii> s/anywasy/anyway
[11:54] <kwwii> as there is a clock in the template, etc
[11:55] <kwwii> the digital numbers for a clock are there too, I guess that is more along the lines of what we want
[11:55] <bspencer> kwwii, our clock is dumb and just uses a font
[11:56] <bspencer> it doesn't get number individually from a theme
[11:57] <kwwii> well then, we can remove all of that from the theme
[11:57] <kwwii> ;-)
[11:57] <kwwii> I sent you a tar.gz file - installing it will probably make some things unreadable, etc but unless I can test it (including the colors) we will never know
[11:58] <bspencer> ok, I'll look at it
[11:58] <bspencer> is it a sliced template?
[11:58] <bspencer> (lots of small files?)
[11:59] <bspencer> you have the ability to create a target environment on your workstation, right?
[11:59] <bspencer> and try out your theme on it?
[12:00] <kwwii> no, it is not cut up yet
[12:01] <kwwii> yes, I have a test system on my laptop as well as using the Q1
[12:01] <kwwii> I would rather test things on the Q1, so I see the difference in DPI, etc
[12:01] <kwwii> my laptop is only 1024x768 so running it in a window is kinda hard (window deco, etc)
[12:04] <kwwii> LOL, intel does not accept tar.gz as an attachment?
[12:04] <kwwii> The attached message was not delivered to the intended recipient.
[12:04] <kwwii> The following file(s) appear to be of a type that is not accepted by Intel;
[12:04] <kwwii> hildon-theme-blackandorange.tar.gz
[12:04] <bspencer> oh, sorry
[12:04] <bspencer> can you put it on a webserver?
[12:04] <kwwii> no worries, I'll put it on my server
[12:07] <bspencer> I ran ./autogen.sh
[12:07] <bspencer> then configure
[12:07] <bspencer> and make
[12:07] <bspencer> (after bootstrap)
[12:07] <kwwii> ok, mail resent...check it out and let me know what you think (not sure how much longer I will be awake tonight)
[12:07] <kwwii> hehe, so revolutionary :-)
[12:08] <bspencer> all the files seem to be in template dir
[12:08] <bspencer> and the "data" dir
[12:08] <bspencer> but I don't see any generated package
[12:10] <kwwii> on my end it appears to need to be in a build environment somehow as it complains about hildon-theme-layout-4, etc.
[12:13] <kwwii> anyway...time for sleep here...we can talk about this tomorrow
[12:16] <bspencer> k
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[12:30] <Mithrandir> Charliefjohnson: just uploaded a fixed moblin-image-creator, so tomorrow's images should be fine.
[12:31] <Charliefjohnson> Mithrandir: OK. We'll check them out then.  
[12:33] <Mithrandir> sorry it wasn't fixed earlier; just too much going on here.
[12:48] <ian_brasil> it would probably be a good idea to document 'how to make a theme' as soon as someone figures out how it is done ;)
[12:49] <kwwii> ian_brasil: I plan to do it as we figure things out
[12:50] <ian_brasil> i was hoping you were going to say that :)
[12:52] <ian_brasil> when i made a theme for maemo i used this http://thememaker.garage.maemo.org/About%20Theme%20Maker.html ...i don't know if it helps
[12:53] <kwwii> I was hoping that we could come up with something like that in the end as well
[12:54] <kwwii> it won't fit quite for what we need right now, but we could adopt it or make something like it
[12:57] <kwwii> actually, that gives me a good idea...I can test my theme and color using that on my N770
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[12:58] <bspencer> kwwii, must be sleep walking
[12:58] <kwwii> bspencer: hehe, normally I stop working after I pop open a beer but Ian drew my back in ;-)
[12:59] <kwwii> I will go to bed sometime soon though, 
[12:59] <kwwii> *really*
=== ian_brasil feels guilty about stopping the beer flowing
[12:59] <kwwii> ;-)
[01:00] <kwwii> actually, my wife will probably come in soon and tell me to go to bed
[01:01] <ian_brasil> sounds great !!
[01:01] <ian_brasil> :)
[01:02] <kwwii> hehe, you know my wife?
[01:05] <kwwii> actually I told her about your house in Brazil and I think she is ready to pack her things and visit you ;-)
=== ian_brasil runs and hides
[01:07] <ian_brasil> seriously, i have just reformed that house...it floats a lot better now
[01:07] <kwwii> sounds like a lot of work
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[01:08] <ian_brasil> yes, i was a bit concerned of it sinking whilst i slept
[01:09] <kwwii> might be a shocking way of waking up
[01:10] <kwwii> then again, drowning in your own house is a unique way of dying
[01:11] <ian_brasil> well i had not planned on checking out just yet but setting it on fire and drifting out into the amazon...sort of going out viking style has its appeal
[01:13] <kwwii> probably make for amazing photos, let me know beforehand
[01:14] <ian_brasil> you can have front row seats 
[01:14] <kwwii> lol