[12:39] <nixternal> http://www.break.com/index/a-real-ninja-turtle.html
[12:39] <nixternal> haha
[12:39] <nixternal> d'oh, wrong channel
[12:39] <nixternal> oh well, enjoy, it is quite funny
[12:41] <nixternal> haha, I have never really looked at this site, there is some really funny things
[12:46] <nixternal> http://my.break.com/media/view.aspx?ContentID=283756
[12:46] <nixternal> there you go, no flash, straight picture
[12:46] <nixternal> the new pony award?
[12:47] <LaserJock> oh my
[12:48] <LaserJock> hmm, yeah
[12:50] <LaserJock> yeah, yeah
[12:50] <nixternal> that and the "behind *" stuff that has been quiet again
[12:50] <nixternal> damn, ajmitch beat me to it
[12:50] <ajmitch> it's only been 3 months :)
[12:50] <superm1> am i still the last behind motu?
[12:50] <superm1> wow.
[12:50] <ajmitch> superm1: yep
[12:50] <LaserJock> well, I don't know if people cared too much about it
[12:50] <ajmitch> we've all been holding our breath since then
[12:51] <LaserJock> heh
[12:51] <LaserJock> doubtful
[12:51] <LaserJock> I mean, there interesting little tidbits
[12:51] <LaserJock> but it's hard to get a decent interview out of them
[12:51] <LaserJock> and then there's Ubuntu Backstage
[12:51] <LaserJock> where I'm supposed to be putting Behind MOTU stuff
[12:52] <nixternal> LaserJock: I read all of the "behind *" stuff for all the projects that have them..it is cool getting a glimpse into the people who you work with and what not online and haven't gotten to meet just yet
[12:53] <nixternal> only MOTU I have met so far is superm1
[12:53] <LaserJock> ok fine
[12:53] <superm1> only MOTUs i've met are dholbach, nixternal and keescook :)
[12:53] <LaserJock> you got me
[12:53] <LaserJock> let's see, I've met quite a number
[12:54] <LaserJock> ajmitch of course
[12:55] <alvinc> Hey there.  Do we have any apt gods online right now?
[12:55] <superm1> nixternal, your turn
[12:55] <alvinc> :)
[12:55] <Kamping_Kaiser> lol. LaserJock got owned
[12:55] <nixternal> ;p
[12:56] <LaserJock> hah
[12:56] <alvinc> lol
[12:56] <alvinc> Anyhoo....
[12:56] <Kamping_Kaiser> hehe
[12:56] <alvinc> I'm trying to apt-get the FAI sources from Etch.  did the whole apt-key and sources.list thing, but it's giving me headaches
[12:56] <alvinc> FAI on Feisty is....  suboptimal.
[12:56] <alvinc> I'm looking to fix it, and hopefully submit it back
[12:57] <ajmitch> for FAI, you want to talk to siretart if he's around
[12:57] <alvinc> lol.  how do you send private tells here?  ;)
[12:58] <Kamping_Kaiser> alvinc, you need to identify first
[12:58] <alvinc> i are n00b.  how do i do that?  ;)
[12:59] <norsetto> g'night ppl
[12:59] <ajmitch> or you could send an email :)
[12:59] <alvinc> nod.  if i knew how to get his e-mail addy.  :)
[01:00] <Kamping_Kaiser> search him up on launchpad :)
[01:01] <AndyP> or sleep-hacking
[01:01] <RAOF> bigon: I'm here now
[01:01] <bigon> RAOF: the dropped patch has been applied upstream
[01:04] <TheMuso> ajmitch: Oh so you are thinking of sticking around now
[01:04] <TheMuso> :p
[01:04] <ajmitch> TheMuso: maybe
[01:05] <alvinc> thanks you guys, by the way.  i've send siretart an e-mail on his registered addy
[01:05] <ajmitch> we'll see
[01:05] <RAOF> bigon: Cool.  You probably want to mention that in the changelog :)
[01:05] <alvinc> bah.  relay access denied from gmail to his e-mail addy.  *sigh*
[01:06] <TheMuso> ajmitch: You know you want to.
[01:06] <ajmitch> TheMuso: I don't really know that, actually
[01:08] <TheMuso> ajmitch: Of course you do.
[01:23] <luisbg> I need someone to check and advocate a very simple package I have sent to REVU. It's already checked by an other MOTU
[01:23] <luisbg> but I need two advocates
[01:23] <luisbg> anybody up for it?
[01:40] <luisbg> TheMuso, <silence>
[01:40] <luisbg> nobody wants to do the good action of the day ;)
[01:45] <TheMuso> Probably everybody is busy.
[01:46] <luisbg> ajmitch, =) hello
[01:46] <luisbg> I will wait half an hour or so
[01:46] <luisbg> after that a mail to the mailing list will be the better option
[01:46] <luisbg> jsgotangco, heyyy
[01:46] <ajmitch> hello luisbg
[01:46] <jsgotangco> hi
[01:46] <ajmitch> jsgotangco: happy birthday
[01:47] <luisbg> jsgotangco, you a motu? happy birthday!!!
[01:47] <jsgotangco> heh thanks
[01:47] <jsgotangco> no im not im a lurker here
[01:47] <nixternal> happy birthday jsgotangco!
[01:47] <ajmitch> he is far above such things
[01:47] <nixternal> 17:30:32 [ highvolta]  if jsgotangco pops up, remember to wish him happy birthday
[01:48] <nixternal> jsgotangco: that is from #ubuntu-devel
[01:48] <jsgotangco> heh
[01:48] <jsgotangco> that's facebook for ya
[01:48] <nixternal> hehe
[01:48] <nixternal> jsgotangco: you talk to your parents after our tornadic week last week?
[01:48] <nixternal> your family rather...forgot they are all still around here
[01:48] <TheMuso> Hey jsgotangco. Happy birthday.
[01:48] <jsgotangco> yes
[01:49] <jsgotangco> i actually have a fever today
[01:49] <jsgotangco> well recovering but still feverish
[01:49] <nixternal> smokin'! :)
[01:50] <luisbg> nixternal, you a motu?
[01:51] <nixternal> what's a motu?
[01:51] <nixternal> ;p
[01:51] <nixternal> luisbg: what's up?
[01:52] <luisbg> nixternal, I need some checking of a package I sent to REVU
[01:52] <luisbg> it's already checked and advocated by TheMuso
[01:52] <luisbg> but I need two
[01:52] <luisbg> to have a "pass"
[01:53] <nixternal> link me
[01:53] <nixternal> or tell me the package name
[01:53] <luisbg> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=79
[01:53] <luisbg> it's a very simple package
[02:00] <luisbg> nixternal, any problems?
[02:03] <nixternal> building it now
[02:04] <luisbg> =)
[02:04] <luisbg> thanks a lot
[02:05] <nixternal> shouldn't there be a COPYING file in the main directory?
[02:05] <TheMuso> !away | Paddy_EIRE
[02:05] <ubotu> Paddy_EIRE: You should avoid changing your nick in a busy channel like #ubuntu - it causes unrequired scrolling which is unfair on new users. The same goes for using noisy away messages : use the command "/away <reason>" to set your client away silently - See also !Guidelines
[02:06] <TheMuso> nixternal: No. I got a package like that one through into the archive without one.
[02:06] <nixternal> alrighty then, I will go ahead and upload it then
[02:07] <luisbg> nixternal, yeeiii :)
[02:07] <nixternal> uploaded :)
[02:07] <TheMuso> nixternal: all the package does is set up settings.
[02:08] <TheMuso> There is no actual program in it.
[02:08] <luisbg> no upstream
[02:08] <luisbg> nixternal, thanks again
[02:08] <nixternal> ya, I noticed nothing but .directory files
[02:08] <luisbg> TheMuso, to you too
[02:08] <nixternal> no problem luisbg, good job!
[02:08] <TheMuso> luisbg: Yes, but thats not the reason. If you look at ubuntustudio-look/icon-theme etc, they have COPYING files, for a reason.
[02:09] <luisbg> ahhh I see
[02:09] <luisbg> now universe admins will  have to look at it and upload it before freeze
[02:10] <nixternal> ya, shouldn't icon packages contain the SVGs? I have noticed a couple of icon packages w/o svgs, and png is far from source
[02:10] <TheMuso> luisbg: Not universe admins, archive admins.
[02:10] <TheMuso> nixternal: As far as I am aware, ubuntustudio's do, otherwise they wouldn't have got in.
[02:10] <luisbg> TheMuso, oops sorry
[02:10] <nixternal> I have to go through my logs and see the icon packages I looked at
[02:11] <TheMuso> nixternal: Did you archive ubuntustudio-menu on revu? If not, I'll do it.
[02:11] <nixternal> yes
[02:11] <TheMuso> ok
[02:11] <luisbg> =)
[02:13] <luisbg> anything more you guys need from me tonight
[02:13] <luisbg> 1:13 am here
[02:14] <TheMuso> luisbg: No.
[02:14] <TheMuso> Thanks for your work.
[02:15] <luisbg> =)
[02:15] <luisbg> a pleasure
[02:17] <mok0> If you guys feel like reviewing another one, I've got http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=119 waiting there...
[02:23] <TheMuso> mok0: I will in a bit.
[02:23] <mok0> TheMuso: Great
[02:56] <leonel> 
[02:57] <leonel> can any update to any package for gutsy universe  be uploaded  o is it too late ?
[02:58] <sn9> i think uvf got moved to this coming thursday
[02:59] <leonel> this is because when I install python-psycopg2  pulls  python2.4  even when  python 2.5 is installed
[03:00] <leonel> so I'm searching  why this happens  and trying to fix it
[03:01] <leonel> it needs  egenix-mx-base  and  the package name is   python2.4-egenix-mxtools
[03:02] <TheMuso> lionel: If its not a new upstream version, any bugfixes can be uploaded without approval at this point.
[03:02] <leonel> python-egenix-mxtools  pulls python 2.4
[03:02] <TheMuso> s/lionel/leonel
[03:02] <leonel> thanks  TheMuso
[03:02] <TheMuso> sn9: And What makes you say that?
[03:03] <TheMuso> leonel: Welcome.
[03:03] <sn9> it was said in this channel recently
[03:03] <sn9> in the /topic
[03:03] <TheMuso> sn9: Got a reference? If so, it would have been officially announced, which it hasn't been.
[03:04] <TheMuso> What is in the topic is for new package freeze, which is different to UVF.
[03:04] <TheMuso> sn9: BTW, has that mplayer bug you talked about recently been addressed?
[03:04] <sn9> no
[03:04] <TheMuso> ok
[03:04] <leonel> but  I can't  find  where   to change
[03:05] <sn9> and i would have thought new package freeze would come before uvf
[03:05] <leonel> found  control:XB-Python-Version : ${python:Versions}
[03:05] <TheMuso> leonel: I'm in the middle of something atm, but I'll probably get a chance to look in a bit.
[03:05] <leonel> but  where can I see where  to change that version
[03:05] <leonel> TheMuso:  thanks  no problemo
[03:06] <TheMuso> sn9: No, its the other way round.
[03:06] <TheMuso> New packages aren't likely to break the archive, whereas new upstream versions of packages are.
[03:06] <sn9> ok
[03:06] <RAOF> leonel: You're trying to change what version of python a package is built aganst?
[03:07] <leonel> RAOF:  egenix-mx-base      pulls  python 2.4  even  when  python 2.5 is installe
[03:07] <leonel> d
[03:07] <RAOF> leonel: In the archive right now?
[03:08] <leonel> yes
[03:08] <leonel> RAOF: this in  Gutsy
[03:08] <mok0> there ought to be both  egenix-mx-base-py25 and exgenix-mx-base-py24
[03:11] <sn9> how's this for a new package? it's already debianized: http://omnibook.sf.net
[03:12] <mok0> ajmitch: that depends whether or not it contains an extension module
[03:13] <RAOF> The control file seems both complex and apparently correct.
[03:16] <TheMuso> mok0: I'm going to leave a comment on revu with more comments, but not all the source files in kaksi have copyright statements.
[03:16] <ajmitch> mok0: sorry, we moved away from that model a year or so ago
[03:16] <mok0> TheMuso: I know. I contacted upstream a month ago, but havent heard
[03:16] <zul> evening
[03:17] <ajmitch> hello zul
[03:17] <mok0> TheMuso: Should I repackage tarball?
[03:17] <TheMuso> mok0: Well this won't pass unless its fixed.
[03:18] <mok0> TheMuso: It's a simple fix, but upstream is silent. I could do it an repackage
[03:18] <TheMuso> mok0: Anyway, comments on revu.
[03:18] <mok0> TheMuso: Thx a lot!
[03:18] <TheMuso> mok0: But you don't know when they were written etc.
[03:19] <mok0> TheMuso: I didn't notice variation in copyright year, did you?
[03:20] <TheMuso> mok0: I didn't have a detailed look, but I still think just adding it without upstream's knowledge/permission is not right.
[03:20] <mok0> TheMuso: OK. I guess I'll have to pester them some more.
[03:24] <mok0> TheMuso: Re: the rules file, you mean to delete the acknowledgement comment=
[03:24] <mok0> s/=/?/
[03:24] <TheMuso> mok0: yes
[03:27] <mok0> Well g'night ppl!
[03:31] <RAOF> Well, that's wierd.
[03:31] <StevenK> RAOF: ?
[03:31] <ajmitch> let me guess, you rebuilt & it had the correct dependencies?
[03:33] <RAOF> ajmitch: No.  I rebuilt it, and something's adding python2.4 & python2.5 dependencies.
[03:33] <RAOF> But the control & rules files *look* ok, at least at the level of scrutiny I gave them.
[03:33] <ajmitch> it is interesting, isn't it?
[03:34] <RAOF> Yes.
[03:34] <RAOF> Anyway, I've got marking to do, which this has been a welcome, but guilty, diversion from :)
[03:34] <StevenK> Hah
[03:34] <StevenK> RAOF: Just give them all zero?
[03:35] <ajmitch> sounds fair
[03:35] <ajmitch> or pick a number between 0 & 100, and fit a bell curve around that
[03:35] <TheMuso> heh
[03:38] <tonyyarusso> Could someone please explain the details of the following to me?:  What is the policy and process regarding updates to universe packages post-release, particularly for security fixes?
[03:40] <StevenK> ajmitch: Hah
[03:40] <ajmitch> tonyyarusso: they get done if someone cares
[03:41] <StevenK> tonyyarusso: Prepare a debdiff, with the release set to -security, document the changes well in the changelog, mentioning any CVE numbers and/or bug numbers and then ask keescook, or pitti to look at it.
[03:41] <StevenK> That is, presuming you want to do it. :-)
[03:41] <ajmitch> of course he wants to do it, he asked :)
[03:42] <tonyyarusso> StevenK: That sounds like what I need to know.  However, does debdiff use just patches or can you have a changed .orig.tar.gz to use?  (not familiar with debdiff yet)
[03:42] <StevenK> Make the changes as little as possible. I wouldn't touch the .orig
[03:42] <tonyyarusso> Okay.
[03:43] <StevenK> tonyyarusso: And debdiff is your friend.
[04:53] <sn9> oh yeah? try gcc
[04:53] <sn9> and gibc
[04:53] <sn9> *glibc
[05:00] <StevenK> sn9: So you mean, "Run Gentoo" ? :-P
[05:00] <sn9> hehe
[05:01] <sn9> i mean use ubuntu as a dev environment for embedded systems
[05:04] <StevenK> Dear Telemarketer. If I say I'm not interested, this is a sign for you get off the phone and to stop trying sell me stuff. No Love, Steve
[05:05] <RAOF> Heh.
[05:05] <StevenK> RAOF: Are you ignoring the marking again? :-)
[05:05] <tonyyarusso> StevenK: Try bartering with them.
[05:06] <RAOF> Dear Telstra.  No, I'm not going to join your network.  Not unless you pay out my existing contract, and provide me with an iPhone.
[05:06] <RAOF> StevenK: Marking has been done.  Really :)
[05:06] <tonyyarusso> "Long-distance telephone eh?  I'll swap you a microwave and some old shoes."
[05:06] <RAOF> Some :)
[05:06] <StevenK> RAOF: I wouldn't pick you being a Steve Jobs fanboy. :-P
[05:07] <tonyyarusso> ajmitch: Are you around by any chance?
[05:07] <RAOF> StevenK: Eh, it looks cool.  Also, macs make shiny hardware :)
[05:08] <RAOF> Just sadly not at the particular level that I want my laptop to be
[05:08] <StevenK> RAOF: That is to say, cheap? :-)
[05:08] <sn9> get an openmoko fic neo1973 then
[05:08] <RAOF> tonyyarusso: You can check out xserver-xgl :).
[05:08] <RAOF> sn9: That would indeed be cooler.
[05:08] <tonyyarusso> RAOF: I wouldn't really understand what I'm looking for though...I'd really appreciate someone taking a few moments to explain it if possible.
[05:09] <sn9> or, if you're a kubuntu person, qtopia greenphone
[05:09] <RAOF> tonyyarusso: I'll hunt down a weblink...
[05:09] <tonyyarusso> awesome
[05:09] <StevenK> "No, you can't call me. I'm reflashing my phone. Yes, I'm wearing pants, why do you ask?"
[05:09] <ajmitch> tonyyarusso: no
[05:09] <tonyyarusso> ajmitch: Ok ;)
[05:10] <RAOF> tonyyarusso: http://codebrowse.launchpad.net/~raof/xserver-xgl/ubuntu-raof/annotate/chalserogers%40gmail.com-20070815112605-k2y3axkh22au4rdu?file_id=rules-20070726235547-4x7rjjba8swpxwgr-8
[05:10] <RAOF> Wow.  That was a little bit longer than I was expecting :)
[05:11] <RAOF> tonyyarusso: You're after the clean: target - specifically the "config.sub" & .guess bit.
[05:11] <StevenK> Hah. tinyurl FTW
[05:11] <xtknight> pfft.  you guys dont know what a *long* url is :P
[05:12] <StevenK> RAOF: Personally, I find copying it in clean to be disquieting. clean is supposed to undo what build did, not copy stuff from the host system.
[05:13] <sn9> i once pasted an internal google video url to the avi representation
[05:13] <sn9> it took up half a page
[05:13] <xtknight> sn9, oh i hate those.  why does google do that *smacks head
[05:13] <tonyyarusso> RAOF: Okay, so if I understand that correctly, it says something along the lines of, "if in the process of cleaning you find any files named config.guess or config.sub, replace them with the version in /usr/share supplied by the autotools-dev package from the build-deps", and I should be able to directly copy-paste that code into another package.  Is that right?
[05:13] <StevenK> tonyyarusso: Right.
[05:14] <tonyyarusso> Sweet - I kinda understood a bash line!
[05:14] <StevenK> ifneq "$(wildcard /usr/share/misc/config.sub)" ""
[05:14] <StevenK> That's make, not bash
[05:14] <tonyyarusso> oh
[05:14] <tonyyarusso> Well, I kinda understood _something_, somehow
[05:14] <StevenK> if [ -f /usr/share/misc/config.sub ] ; then
[05:15] <StevenK> That's shell. :-)
[05:15] <tonyyarusso> StevenK: So your personal preference would be to have the same code, but in the build rule?
[05:15] <RAOF> StevenK: You'd prefer it in configure?
[05:15] <StevenK> RAOF: Right.
[05:18] <nixternal> make one :)
[05:19] <tonyyarusso> nixternal: Would I just put that line in it, and how would I reference to run it?  (debian/rules is my weaker point here, so try to bear with me)
[05:19] <nixternal> what are you trying to configure?
[05:19] <tonyyarusso> It's KompoZer, a Mozilla-derived product.
[05:19] <nixternal> ahh, that is the app replacing nvu until someone picks it back up right?
[05:20] <tonyyarusso> nixternal: correct
[05:20] <nixternal> are you using cdbs?
[05:21] <tonyyarusso> No, debhelper.
[05:22] <RAOF> StevenK: Hm.  But if you do it in configure, not clean, you'll end up with the lintian error tonyyarusso was getting originally, right?
[05:22] <nixternal> you have a line in rules like 'include /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/debhelper.mk'?
[05:23] <tonyyarusso> nixternal: grep include rules returns no results
[05:23] <tonyyarusso> grep debhelper just gives "# Sample debian/rules that uses debhelper."
[05:23] <nixternal> ahh, OK
[05:23] <nixternal> how do you need to run configure?
[05:23] <xtknight> should debian/*.manpages contain ALL man pages in debian/manpages?
[05:24] <xtknight> shouldn't*, i suppose since i found a package (hugin) where this is not the case
[05:24] <tonyyarusso> nixternal: I don't know.
[05:25] <nixternal> you can just run the configure stuff if need be under build-stamp:
[05:25] <nixternal> bbiaf...need to take the dog out
[05:26] <tonyyarusso> Oh, ok.  build-stamp I have.
[05:26] <tonyyarusso> RAOF: but you think anything other than rules will still give the lintian error after it's fixed?  (ie, a lintian bug or something?)
[05:35] <xtknight> what's the difference between a manual ending in .1 and .2, .7, etc?
[05:36] <xtknight> lol never mind should have looked at the manual for man, right there is a big table :(
[05:36] <tonyyarusso> haha
[05:41] <imbrandon> why are games not considered a executable
[05:41] <imbrandon> kinda strange
[05:43] <xtknight> linus associated executables with troubles and compilation errors, and games with fun?  i dunno
[05:45] <StevenK> I daresay it's a unix-ism, as opposed to a Linux thing
[05:46] <imbrandon> yea because i doubt linus had a hand in designing -man- or much for that matter outside the kernel and or a gnome patch or two
[05:47] <StevenK> imbrandon: Um? Git?
[05:47] <imbrandon> heh ok ok, you win , but still not man
[05:47] <imbrandon> ;)
[05:48] <xtknight> he started the kernel of the most popular unix desktop OS  today, but that's it, nothing more.  darn lazy bastard :P
[05:48] <ajmitch> well git probably consists of 25% of the man pages by sheer weight of binaries
[05:48] <imbrandon> lol
[05:48] <StevenK> Bwahahaha
[05:49] <imbrandon> bzr-import-git is all i need ( no idea if it even exists )
[05:49] <StevenK> I was looking at importing our (6Gb) CVS repository into bzr at $WORK
[05:50] <StevenK> I managed to shoehorn it into SVN. It turns out that SVN *really* doesn't like a directory with >15,000 entries.
[05:52] <xtknight> shouldn't debian/*.manpages contain ALL man pages in debian/manpages/*?
[06:03] <RAOF> imbrandon: Strangely, I don't think bzr git-import *does* exist.
[06:25] <TheMuso> c
[06:25] <TheMuso> ugh
[06:26] <tonyyarusso> ooF?
[06:27] <TheMuso> tonyyarusso: long story
[06:27] <tonyyarusso> TheMuso: aren't they all?
[06:27] <TheMuso> heh
[06:58] <RAOF> Amaranth: Got a minute to discuss Xgl?
[06:58] <Amaranth> RAOF: maybe
[07:00] <RAOF> I'm just wondering whether I should stop messing with session files and just stick a script in /etc/X11/Xsession.d to start & use Xgl all the time.
[07:01] <RAOF> Because rather a lot of stuff gets started automatically by Xsession before a session script can mess with it.
[07:01] <RAOF> This manifests most annoyingly by seahorse being unable to display a passphrase entry dialog.
[07:01] <RAOF> And hence GPG dying.
[07:03] <RAOF> Whereas I *could* stick a script in Xsession.d to startup Xgl & set DISPLAY and then let the rest of the session do it's thing on the right server.
[07:04] <RAOF> With the small downside that you'd need to uninstall Xgl to stop using it :)
[07:07] <RAOF> Amaranth: So basically I'm wondering how annoying it would be to have an always-
[07:07] <RAOF> on xgl
[07:08] <sn9> xgl should just die
[07:08] <RAOF> Not until nvidia get their crap together.
[07:08] <sn9> it can't work right -- by design
[07:09] <RAOF> Please expound
[07:09] <sn9> i spent a couple of weeks trying to get it to work with fglrx
[07:09] <RAOF> sn9: You're welcome to make Glucose work, of course :)
[07:10] <RAOF> sn9: Should be easy.
[07:10] <sn9> eventually, i gave up and settled for no tv-out with the free driver and aiglx
[07:10] <RAOF> Also, that's hardly broken by design :)
[07:11] <sn9> anything requiring xgl is by definition broken by design, like fglrx
[07:11] <RAOF> There's nothing that requires Xgl.
[07:11] <RAOF> Also, that's rather different from 'xgl is broken by design' ;)
[07:11] <sn9> fglrx does, if you want beryl/compiz
[07:12] <RAOF> So, yes, Xgl provides features that fglrx doesn't.
[07:13] <sn9> xgl is designed such that you cannot run any kind of window manager with it, and that's brokenness
[07:13] <RAOF> That is 100% untrue.
[07:13] <RAOF> Xgl is designed to be a faster X server than Xorg.
[07:13] <RAOF> Faster/easier to write drivers for.
[07:13] <sn9> fglrx requires xgl for beryl/compiz, ergo fglrx is also broken
[07:14] <RAOF> sn9: The fact that the fglrx driver has bugs which make performance under Xgl suck without a composite manager is not Xgl's fault :)
[07:14] <RAOF> But I'm not going to argue against the thesis "fglrx is crap" ;)
[07:15] <RAOF> It's worse than even the nvidia drivers.
[07:15] <sn9> why would anyone run xgl without compositing? what other reason could there be to run xgl than beryl/compiz?
[07:15] <RAOF> To have an OpenGL accelerated X server?
[07:16] <sn9> opengl is slower than no opengl
[07:16] <RAOF> Depends on the drivers.
[07:16] <RAOF> Also, to allow people to *only* write 3d drivers, and get full 2d accel for free.
[07:17] <RAOF> Anyway, I seem to have lost the Amaranth :)
[07:17] <sn9> when i see glxgears not stall, i'll believe it's a driver issue
[07:18] <RAOF> glxgears is not a benchmark?
[07:18] <sn9> i mean visually
[07:18] <RAOF> So turn on Vsync.
[07:18] <sn9> not the crap numbers it puts out
[07:19] <sn9> so far, i've seen xgl slow things down with the following drivers: ati, nvidia, fglrx, savage
[07:21] <Amaranth> RAOF: hi again :)
[07:21] <xtknight> wow "cc1plus" (c++ compiler) taking around 300M of ram?  isnt this extreme for everything, or normal depending on the pkg?
[07:21] <sn9> it was using libmesa rendering, but xgl made it even slower
[07:21] <RAOF> Amaranth: So, there's some backscroll way up there )
[07:21] <xtknight> was at 550M at one point
[07:21] <RAOF> xtknight: *Only* 300MB of ram?
[07:21] <sn9> btw, gutsy is supposed to provide working dri for savage, but i have yet to try it
[07:22] <RAOF> xtknight: The C++ template system is turing complete.  It is famous for using a huge amount of ram & time to compile.
[07:22] <Amaranth> RAOF: sounds great
[07:22] <xtknight> ah well i guess that other 2g im ordering this week will come in handy
[07:22] <Amaranth> i was wondering what was up with seahorse :)
[07:22] <RAOF> xtknight: Also, last time I tried to build Azureus, gcj would use 1Gb of ram + 4GB of swap, then OOM :)
[07:22] <xtknight> RAOF, ridiculous
[07:23] <xtknight> RAOF, i never had MSVC use anywhere near this
[07:23] <sn9> azureus can use gcj now?
[07:23] <Amaranth> sn9: it's accelerated indirect rendering
[07:23] <Amaranth> sn9: azureus in the archive uses gcj
[07:24] <sn9> azureus is in the archive now?
[07:24] <RAOF> Amaranth: The other option is to just work around it, by basically unsetting GPG_AGENT_INFO & running seahorse-agent again.
[07:24] <Amaranth> since feisty
[07:24] <Amaranth> RAOF: eh, too many hacks
[07:24] <Amaranth> RAOF: just make it the X server that even gdm works
[07:24] <Amaranth> that makes login smoother too
[07:24] <Amaranth> or is that not what you meant?
[07:24] <RAOF> Amaranth: That's harder, and not what I meant :)
[07:24] <Amaranth> err, even gdm uses
[07:25] <Amaranth> ah, you mean just making it start before the other stuff in Xsession.d
[07:25] <RAOF> Yes.
[07:25] <Amaranth> sounds good
[07:25] <Amaranth> less complicated for users too
[07:25] <Amaranth> literally just install and go
[07:25] <RAOF> True.  No extra sessions, installing Xgl makes it just work.
[07:27] <Amaranth> RAOF: really funny
[07:28] <Amaranth> i'm pretty sure my libeel patch is correct now but my nautilus patch got blown away by a package upgrade so i kept beating on libeel wondering what was wrong
[07:30] <RAOF> Wooo!
[07:30] <RAOF> Is it likely that we'll have compiz-handled wallpaper, then?
[07:32] <Amaranth> well, if you build and use the wallpaper plugin
[07:32] <xtknight> wait, did i hear something?  different wallpaper per screen?
[07:32] <Amaranth> hehe :)
[07:33] <Amaranth> xtknight: http://www.realistanew.com/random/desktop20070826.png
[07:33] <xtknight> need this, what is it?
[07:33] <Amaranth> not ready yet
[07:33] <xtknight> compiz/background or nautilus patch?
[07:33] <Amaranth> that reminds me, i need to clean up my compiz-python package
[07:33] <RAOF> I see you're using Glossy too :)
[07:34] <Amaranth> glossy?
[07:34] <Amaranth> the theme is clearlooks
[07:34] <RAOF> Oh, gtk2 engine.
[07:34] <xtknight> window border?
[07:34] <RAOF> Ah, not quite.
[07:34] <RAOF> Amaranth: Does that mean alpha-blended gradients etc are available?
[07:35] <Amaranth> RAOF: well, the current wallpaper plugin offers that
[07:37] <RAOF> Amaranth: And your patches basically allow the something else (such as the wallpaper plugin) to draw the wallpaper when available?
[07:38] <xtknight> any news on when nautilus/gnome itself will allow this?  without using compiz?
[07:38] <Amaranth> RAOF: yeah
[07:38] <Amaranth> xtknight: whenever someone can think up a decent GUI
[07:38] <Amaranth> but this is better anyway
[07:38] <xtknight> decent GUI?  underlying functions dont even exist though
[07:38] <Amaranth> it should allow things like xwinwrap and xsnow to work
[07:40] <xtknight> maybe it could be put into displayconfig-gtk
[07:40] <Amaranth> *shrug*
[07:40] <Amaranth> no...
[07:40] <xtknight> i think most people would love just to have a file you could use for each screen (no gradients/solid colors but better than nothing)
[07:41] <Amaranth> xtknight: that'd be dependent on my patch
[07:41] <Amaranth> xtknight: which means you'd need compiz
[07:42] <xtknight> actually as long as compiz can function without any of the effects i'm fine with that too.  the effects tend to be buggy here though
[07:43] <xtknight> but compiz still doesnt work with multiple screens, does it?  (only one big screen?)
[07:44] <RAOF> I'm not sure what you mean?
[07:44] <RAOF> As long as you've got OpenGL on both screens, Compiz should work.
[07:44] <xtknight> well last time i tried it, it wouldnt work when i was in multiple-desktop mode (actually thought this was confirmed as well)
[07:44] <xtknight> it worked fine with span mode
[07:45] <xtknight> just prefferred the former and wondered if it had been fixed
[07:45] <RAOF> Do you get 3D on all screens in multiple-desktop mode?
[07:45] <xtknight> direct rendering on both yes
[07:45] <RAOF> Because I think (without proof) than many drivers don't like that much.
[07:45] <RAOF> xtknight: Hm.  Xinerama?
[07:45] <xtknight> using nvidia proprietary
[07:45] <xtknight> not xinerama just independent screens
[07:46] <xtknight> i see two screens in the Screen Resolution applet
[07:46] <xtknight> one is 1680x1050, other is 1280x1024
[07:46] <RAOF> I *think* that last time I tried that it worked, but I don't try it very often :)
[07:47] <xtknight> composite-by-default is still "on the list" so to speak?
[07:53] <Amaranth> xtknight: unknown
[07:54] <Amaranth> but i know one of the fusion guys uses multiscreen
[08:02] <tonyyarusso> RAOF: So I tried using the ifneq stuff from that file you gave me, and when trying to build in pbuilder for some reason /bin/sh was trying to evaluate it as a shell command, rather than makefile syntax.  I put it in the build-stamp portion of rules.
[08:02] <Amaranth> RAOF: damn, same bug
[08:05] <RAOF> Amaranth: What bug?  Your patches fail to work?
[08:05] <RAOF> StevenK: Cool.  I bet it's a compiz effect :P
[08:05] <Amaranth> yeah, if the wallpaper plugin isn't enabled i get ghosts
[08:05] <Amaranth> because something isn't updating
[08:06] <tonyyarusso> RAOF: is build-stamp read differently from clean or something weird?
[08:08] <StevenK> RAOF: ENOCOMPIZ, so nyah
[08:08] <RAOF> tonyyarusso: I'm not sure.  It shouldn't be, as far as I can tell.
[08:08] <RAOF> StevenK: Compiz is pretty advanced.  It's probably shimmering your LCD to tell you that you could enable it :P
[08:08] <StevenK> tonyyarusso: Did you tab/space it in? It shouldn't be.
[08:08] <tonyyarusso> StevenK: oh, yes, I did.
[08:09] <StevenK> tonyyarusso: A tab in a Makefile means "This is a shell command"
[08:09] <tonyyarusso> StevenK: Good to know
[08:10] <tonyyarusso> All right, take 2.
[08:59] <TheMuso> .c
[08:59] <TheMuso> ugh
[09:20] <Tonio_> hi
[09:23] <ScottK2> Hi
[09:24] <ScottK2> coNP: Keep up the good work on revieiwing.
[09:24] <ScottK2> Good night all.
[09:24] <coNP> Hey ScottK2.
[09:24] <coNP> Good night...
[09:26] <Kamping_Kaiser> bugger, DktrKranz isnt about. could someone look at bug 84487 ? i just attached an updated debdiff, hopefully in line with what Luca suggeseted
[09:26] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 84487 in backuppc "removing deb leaves symlink which causes apache to fail starting" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/84487
[09:34] <coNP> LongPointyStick, StevenK, soren: Sorry to bug you again, but I think it is really bad that we get no more responses for UVFes... bug 134623 and bug 134624 and bug 134625 is what I think of.
[09:34] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 134623 in telepathy-salut "[UVFe]  Please update telepathy-salut to version 0.1.4" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/134623
[09:34] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 134624 in telepathy-mission-control "[UVFe]  Please update telepathy-mission-control to version 4.35" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/134624
[09:34] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 134625 in empathy "[UVFe]  Please update empathy to version 0.12" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/134625
[09:50] <soren> coNP: I still have 892 Launchpad e-mails after getting home from holiday. It takes a while :(
[09:51] <coNP> soren: okay, I really don't want to push any of your personally...
[09:51] <coNP> you, even
[09:52] <soren> coNP: Sure.
[09:54] <RAOF> coNP: Haven't those been ACKd, pending review of the actual packages on REVU?
[09:56] <coNP> RAOF: ACKed but not confirmed. I need two ACKs
[09:56] <coNP> RAOF: OTOH if the have been reviewed 2 MOTUs, no real REVU review is needed IMHO
[09:56] <coNP> they, even
[09:57] <RAOF> coNP: Ah, yes.  I was confused by the double ack on empathy :)
[09:58] <coNP> RAOF: yeah. But I cannot even compile it without the libs :)
[09:58] <RAOF> Yes. :)-
[10:00] <Bixente> Hi
[10:00] <RAOF> Bixente: Hi.  I haven't got around to your updated review yet.  I may get to it this evening, but maaaaaaaaaarking!
[10:01] <coNP> Hey Hobbsee
[10:01] <Hobbsee> hi coNP
[10:01] <Bixente> RAOF: thanks :)
[10:01] <Hobbsee> RAOF: yay, marking!
[10:01] <RAOF> Hobbsee: Not yay!  I don't like giving out crap marks.
[10:02] <Hobbsee> RAOF: awww....
[10:03] <Hobbsee> coNP: you can review, cant you?
[10:04] <Hobbsee> cool
[10:05] <coNP> Gnome 2.19.91 is out, MOTU-UVF team has a luck today :)
[10:05] <Hobbsee> coNP: motu-uvf's dont care - gnome's in main.
[10:06] <RAOF> And don't new Gnome revisions automatically pass UVF?
[10:06] <coNP> Hobbsee: I mean (1) I package these and won't bug you, (2) there are parts of Gnome in universe
[10:06] <coNP> Hobbsee: BTW bug 134623 and bug 134624 are part of Gnome :)
[10:06] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 134623 in telepathy-salut "[UVFe]  Please update telepathy-salut to version 0.1.4" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/134623
[10:06] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 134624 in telepathy-mission-control "[UVFe]  Please update telepathy-mission-control to version 4.35" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/134624
[10:06] <Hobbsee> coNP: true that
[10:07] <coNP> RAOF: I guess so. Since our release cycle is bound to the GNOME one
[10:08] <Hobbsee> it would be expected to run the latest gnome
[10:09] <coNP> In fact there has been feature freeze in Gnome about the same time then we had that
[10:09] <coNP> Now they release bugfix releases
[10:09] <superm1> coNP, i've got one that i was working with today and revu'ed/advocated earlier if you want to keep up the tag team effort these past few nights and give it a look :) http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=122
[10:09] <coNP> superm1: for sure
[10:09] <coNP> Young MOTUs should work together :)
[10:10] <superm1> okay bed time for me now. :) have a good one
[12:16] <jono> \sh: ping
[12:17] <gnomefreak> does anyone hav ea spare PPC they can test a bug on? or a 386/686 they can test bug in iceape on?
[12:25] <jussi01> gnomefreak: maybe TheMuso has a ppc...
[12:26] <gnomefreak> ty ill check with him a bit later i have something i have to fix that i thought was fixed :(
[12:37] <Amaranth> RAOF: you around?
[12:38] <RAOF> Yes.
[12:38] <RAOF> Man, I wish I had a magical marking machine.
[12:38] <RAOF> Also, a unicorn.
[12:38] <RAOF> Amaranth: Yes.
[12:38] <RAOF> And unicorn insurance.
[12:40] <Amaranth> RAOF: join #ubuntu-desktop
[12:44] <tonyyarusso> Hi, I'm using a freshly rolled tarball from someone 7 timezones ahead of me, and things are complaining about "timestamp in the future".  Is there any way around this?
[12:45] <man-di> tonyyarusso: touch
[12:46] <tonyyarusso> man-di: Recursively?  I basically need to touch half the code tree.
[12:46] <man-di> as you need
[12:47] <\sh> jono, ping
[12:47] <\sh> aeh pong
[12:48] <StevenK> tonyyarusso: find . -type f -exec touch {} \;
[12:48] <RAOF> StevenK beats RAOF to it.
[12:49] <tonyyarusso> StevenK: ty
[12:49] <Nicke> tonyyarusso: tar also has a --touch option, if that helps
[12:49] <tonyyarusso> Nicke: ooh, that may be even better
[12:50] <Nicke> ok :)
[01:01] <tonyyarusso> StevenK: Was your question earlier an offer to possibly sponsor KompoZer upload?
[01:05] <coNP> gthumb hates coNP today... time to get some QT love :)
[01:05] <jussi01> coNP: kinda like Hobbsee style.... :P
[01:06] <coNP> You can always learn from elder MOTUs
[01:06] <coNP> If that is the right term
[01:07] <jussi01> hehe, be careful with elder.... Fujitsu might eat you....
[01:07] <jussi01> :P
[01:08] <coNP> jussi01: why?
[01:08] <jussi01> coNP: iirc, Fujitsu is quite young....
[01:09] <coNP> I mean MOTU-age, of course
[01:09] <jussi01> oh....hehehe
[01:10] <coNP> Thanks, jussi01
[01:10] <jussi01> :)
[01:12] <coNP> Hmm... I guess I can upload qtpfsgui
[01:12] <tonyyarusso> How often does the REVU web page list update?  (ie, how long to wait after a dput)
[01:12] <coNP> tonyyarusso: long enough :)
[01:12] <jussi01> tonyyarusso: usually takes about 5 mins for me...
[01:12] <coNP> But I think as soon as it got unpacked and get out of the incoming queue
[01:13] <tonyyarusso> jussi01: hmm, 'k
[01:13] <jussi01> !revu
[01:13] <ubotu> REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
[01:13] <jussi01> Processing of uploads is done every 5 min. If your upload doesn't show up, please contact the REVU administrators by email ([MAILTO]  admin@tiber.tauware.de) or join the IRC channel #ubuntu-motu and talk to one of:
[01:13] <jussi01> there we are, every 5 mins
[01:14] <tonyyarusso> Oh boo - I forgot the -sa flag
[01:14] <jussi01> hheh, thatll do it....
[01:22] <norsetto> hiyall
[01:22] <jussi01> hiya norsetto
[01:25] <Hobbsee> hi norsetto!
[01:25] <norsetto> Hobbsee: \o/
[01:27] <TheMuso> jussi01, gnomefreak, whats up?
[01:27] <jussi01> TheMuso: gnomefreak needed someone to test a PPC bug...
[01:28] <TheMuso> ah
[01:29] <elmargol> Is it safe to build 64bit packages on a 32bit host using pbuilder? (is that even possible?)
[01:30] <StevenK> elmargol: No, I don't think it is possible.
[01:30] <norsetto> elamrgol: its not possible, not that I know
[01:33] <siretart> elmargol: you could perhaps use qemu, and install ubuntu/amd64 in such a virtual machine. but that will be really dogslow
[01:34] <coNP> Hey norsetto
[01:34] <norsetto> coNP: hiya!
[01:36] <elmargol> Isn't there a solution for this? automatic building for feisty / gutsy 32 and 64 bit?
[01:36] <norsetto> elmargol: why not a PPA?
[01:36] <elmargol> PPA?
[01:36] <coNP> pbuilder-dist is something that makes this quite easy IIRC
[01:36] <norsetto> !ppa
[01:36] <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about ppa - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
[01:36] <Kmos> elmargol: https://help.launchpad.net/PPAQuickStart
[01:36] <coNP> !coc | norsetto :D
[01:36] <ubotu> norsetto :D: The Ubuntu Code of Conduct to which we ask all Ubuntu users to adhere can be found at http://www.ubuntu.com/community/conduct/
[01:38] <elmargol> Kmos: is this service free?
[01:38] <coNP> elmargol: as beer
[01:38] <norsetto> !shutup | ubotu
[01:38] <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about shutup - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
[01:38] <Kmos> elmargol: yeah, active it at your LP account
[01:38] <norsetto> you see, the "guy" doesn't know anything about shut up .....
[01:39] <Hobbsee> problem solved.
[01:39] <Hobbsee> !beer
[01:39] <Hobbsee> !beer
[01:39] <Hobbsee> there we go.
[01:40] <tonyyarusso> The REVU e-mails the show up on the -motu mailing list; are those just forwards of something REVU automatically sends to you?
[01:40] <tonyyarusso> *that show up
[01:41] <Hobbsee> tonyyarusso: they're the accepted mails for the ubuntu archive
[01:41] <Hobbsee> (which we then forward)
[01:41] <Hobbsee> tonyyarusso: as in, they're almost the same as on gutsy changes.
[01:41] <tonyyarusso> Hobbsee: Oh, so those are the packages that are already done, not ones that need reviewing?
[01:41] <coNP> Hobbsee: why to ban ubotu ?
[01:41] <StevenK> Hobbsee: You could have +q'd ubotu. :-P
[01:41] <tonyyarusso> StevenK: she did
[01:41] <Hobbsee> StevenK: you might want to tell me what i did, then.
[01:41] <Kmos> it's better to ask seveas to remove the bot from here
[01:42] <StevenK> I thought ban was different from +q?
[01:42] <Kmos> :)
[01:42] <coNP> Are you sure you want to live without ubotu?
[01:42] <TheMuso> Ubotu is too useful.
[01:42] <Hobbsee> tonyyarusso: yeah  - as in, they've gotten thru revu
[01:42] <tonyyarusso> StevenK: note the %
[01:42] <tonyyarusso> Hobbsee: got it
[01:42] <Hobbsee> Kmos: a) why wait for seveas, he's not even here at the moment.  b) i can just ban it.  c) i dont want to get rid of it permanently.
[01:42] <Hobbsee> StevenK: :)
[01:42] <coNP> !beer
[01:42] <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about beer - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
[01:42] <Kmos> Hobbsee: thanks better
[01:43] <jussi01> !coNP
[01:43] <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about conp - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
[01:43] <coNP> Actually I guess ubotu says nothing if you don't provocate it
[01:43] <Kmos> ubotu: welcome back little boy
[01:43] <Kmos> :)
[01:43] <Hobbsee> !hobbsee
[01:43] <ubotu> I phear the stick so shhhhh
[01:43] <Hobbsee> coNP: true
[01:43] <Hobbsee> !nixternal | nixternal
[01:43] <ubotu> nixternal: Oh no!  The pointy-clicky Vista lover has arrived!  He's rumoured to be giving out free money, too!
[01:43] <TheMuso> heh
[01:43] <jussi01> lol
[01:43] <norsetto> Hobbsee: can we have a ppa entry added to it ?
[01:43] <TheMuso> !Hobbsee
[01:43] <norsetto> !jdong
[01:43] <ubotu> jdong is Hobbsee: jdong: yes, but you're FULL OF CRACK!
[01:43] <Hobbsee> norsetto: sure.  write one, it'll get sent for moderation
[01:43] <Hobbsee> norsetto: !foo is <reply> bar
[01:44] <norsetto> Hobbsee: where bar would be?
[01:44] <Hobbsee> norsetto: <insert answer that you want to be given when !ppa is done>
[01:44] <Hobbsee> !foo
[01:44] <ubotu> bar
[01:45] <elmargol> Kmos: Can I build for old version of ubuntu too?
[01:45] <Kmos> elmargol: it's better you to ask at #launchpad
[01:45] <Kmos> i'm not credible
[01:45] <Kmos> =)
[01:45] <norsetto> Hobbsee: ok, I thought that was <reply>
[01:45] <Hobbsee> norsetto: ahhh.  no, that's a tag.  sorry, i keep forgetting about those who are not familiar with ubotuesque.
[01:46] <DarkSun88> Hi all
[01:46] <Fujitsu> elmargol: Yes, you can build for any currently published version, I believe.
[01:46] <elmargol> thats nice!
[01:47] <Fujitsu> At least, I've seen people do it for {edgy,feisty,gutsy}
[01:47] <StevenK> Currently supported published version?
[01:47] <norsetto> !ppa is <reply> With Launchpad's Personal Package Archives (PPA), you can build and publish binary Ubuntu packages for multiple architectures simply by uploading an Ubuntu source package to Launchpad. See https://help.launchpad.net/PPAQuickStart.
[01:47] <Hobbsee> !ppa is <reply> With Launchpad's Personal Package Archives (PPA), you can build and publish binary Ubuntu packages for multiple architectures simply by uploading an Ubuntu source package to Launchpad. See https://help.launchpad.net/PPAQuickStart.
[01:47] <ubotu> I'll remember that, Hobbsee
[01:47] <Hobbsee> !ppa | norsetto
[01:47] <ubotu> norsetto: With Launchpad's Personal Package Archives (PPA), you can build and publish binary Ubuntu packages for multiple architectures simply by uploading an Ubuntu source package to Launchpad. See https://help.launchpad.net/PPAQuickStart.
[01:47] <Hobbsee> norsetto: nice work :)
[01:47] <tonyyarusso> StevenK, any other friendly MOTU types:  Please review if you can - http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=128
[01:48] <StevenK> I'm not friendly.
[01:48] <StevenK> :-P
[01:48] <Hobbsee> hehe
[01:48] <tonyyarusso> Ah well, I'll take what I can get ;)
[01:49] <StevenK> And the md5sum is different! BAD tonyyarusso!
[01:49] <tonyyarusso> What??
[01:49] <StevenK> md5sum of the .orig
[01:49] <tonyyarusso> I checked that before I started....
[01:50] <tonyyarusso> StevenK: the .orig and what else?
[01:50] <StevenK> d22a250ab624b9b3ef1cc07da32ec78a  kompozer_0.7.10.orig.tar.gz
[01:50] <StevenK> That's what I had when I test built it for you.
[01:50] <StevenK> 9dc04306a0b6fe148b2896e553443ad9 38503066 kompozer_0.7.10.orig.tar.gz
[01:50] <StevenK> And that's what the .dsc says
[01:50] <tonyyarusso> StevenK: You mean yesterday?  It changed in the last few hours.
[01:51] <StevenK> Why would the .orig need to change?
[01:51] <tonyyarusso> Kaze added something to the Credits.
[01:51] <tonyyarusso> (not by me)
[01:52] <tonyyarusso> Just a last-minute upstream mod.  _NOT_ anything about me futzing around with things.  :)
[01:52] <tonyyarusso> A second - I'll show you the upstream one
[01:52] <tonyyarusso> StevenK: Don't need it - New package deadline isn't until Thursday
[01:53] <StevenK> Ah, then it isn't even in the archive. Fair enough
[01:53] <ogra> StevenK, it should replace nvu
[01:53] <ogra> afaik
[01:53] <tonyyarusso> yes
[01:53] <StevenK> Didn't nvu get booted?
[01:53] <tonyyarusso> (although not Conflict: b/c apparently while slightly silly, you can in fact have both installed)
[01:53] <ogra> in favore of kompzer
[01:53] <ogra> *favor
[01:54] <nixternal> !Hobbsee | Hobbsee
[01:54] <ubotu> Hobbsee: I phear the stick so shhhhh
[01:54] <nixternal> :p
[01:54] <tonyyarusso> StevenK: http://downloads.sourceforge.net/kompozer/kompozer-0.7.10-src.tar.gz?modtime=1188302208&big_mirror=0
[02:00] <StevenK> tonyyarusso: You have a newline in your Build-Depends
[02:00] <Fujitsu> StevenK: Is that illegal now?
[02:00] <tonyyarusso> StevenK: noted
[02:01] <StevenK> tonyyarusso: I don't think Depends: ${shlibs:Depends} makes sense for kompozer-dev, it being Arch: all
[02:01] <tonyyarusso> StevenK: what would be better?
[02:01] <StevenK> Fujitsu: Certainly not, but if he's already line-wrapped, he should be consistent.
[02:01] <StevenK> tonyyarusso: Well, does it need any?
[02:01] <Fujitsu> StevenK: Ah, yes.
[02:01] <tonyyarusso> kompozer: ^^ that's a question for you methinks
[02:02] <kompozer> tonyyarusso: er, dunno - maybe kompozer-dev shouldn't have any build-deps?
[02:03] <tonyyarusso> kompozer: possibly
[02:03] <tonyyarusso> ?
[02:03] <tonyyarusso> StevenK: is it common for -dev to be blank there?
[02:04] <StevenK> tonyyarusso: Commonly, -dev will Depends: kompozer (= ${Source-Version})
[02:05] <StevenK> I'm not sure if that's the right syntax.
[02:05] <StevenK> Anyway, din-dins
[02:05] <tonyyarusso> kompozer: Oh, this is the Depends, not Build-Depends, btw
[02:06] <kompozer> yes I understood
[02:06] <coNP> Hiya jwendell.
[02:06] <jwendell> Hi, TheMuso
[02:06] <TheMuso> jwendell: Hi.
[02:06] <jwendell> hi, coNP
[02:06] <coNP> jwendell: we commented http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=25
[02:06] <coNP> There is a kind of hurry :) if you want it to get into gutsy
[02:07] <jwendell> yep, i did not understand the 2nd comment, from TheMuso
[02:07] <jwendell> a lot of packages are identical to mine...
[02:07] <jwendell> coNP, what's the deadline for gutsy?
[02:07] <jussi01> jwendell: 30th
[02:07] <coNP> August 30.
[02:08] <jwendell> hey, fernando, how are you going with vinagre?
[02:08] <coNP> jwendell: I guess you can fix it in one line
[02:09] <jwendell> coNP, how?
[02:09] <kompozer> tonyyarusso, StevenK: should I use ${Source-version} or ${binary:version} for kompozer-dev?
[02:10] <jwendell> just saying that the license can be found at /usr... ?
[02:10] <coNP> jwendell: I guess so. Ask TheMuso to be sure, though
[02:10] <jwendell> TheMuso, is that what you want?
[02:11] <tonyyarusso> kompozer: Well, firefox-dev uses "Depends: firefox (= ${Source-Version}), libnss-dev (= 2:1.firefox${Source-Version}), libnspr-dev (= 2:1.firefox${Source-Version}" if that's an indication.
[02:11] <kompozer> tonyyarusso: I read ${Source-Version} is deprecated http://lists.alioth.debian.org/pipermail/pkg-boinc-commits/2007-May/000331.html
[02:11] <kompozer> tonyyarusso: uh
[02:12] <TheMuso> jwendell: What was the name of the package again?
[02:12] <kompozer> tonyyarusso: in the KompoZer package, libnss and libnspr are already included
[02:12] <jwendell> TheMuso, evolution-rss
[02:12] <TheMuso> ah thanks.
[02:13] <tonyyarusso> kompozer: -dev is architecture: any, right?
[02:13] <tonyyarusso> wait
[02:13] <tonyyarusso> Or is it all?
[02:13] <tonyyarusso> ...
[02:13] <tonyyarusso> all, okay
[02:13] <kompozer> tonyyarusso: I guess it's 'all' - or at least this was it with Nvu
[02:13] <TheMuso> jwendell: Well, the copyright file states what license the package is under, but since the license never gets shipped with the package, there needs to be a pointer as to where users can find the license to read it.
[02:13] <TheMuso> Since the packaging is under a different license to the package itself, you should put a pointer to GPL-2 for the package.
[02:14] <tonyyarusso> kompozer: Then use ${source:Version}, according to http://help.lockergnome.com/linux/replacing-Source-Version-substvar-ftopict487353.html
[02:15] <pochu> Any English native speaker can tell me which sentence is better? http://pastebin.com/m6db44b90
[02:15] <tonyyarusso> kompozer: Is >= or = more appropriate?
[02:16] <tonyyarusso> pochu: could use either really; I'd probably go with the latter.
[02:16] <jussi01> pochu: I would say the second one.
[02:16] <kompozer> tonyyarusso: I guess = would be safer in case future versions of KompoZer don't include libnss / libnspr
[02:16] <tonyyarusso> kompozer: good point.
[02:17] <pochu> tonyyarusso, jussi01: thanks :)
[02:17] <TheMuso> Heya pochu!
[02:17] <jussi01> :)
[02:17] <jwendell> TheMuso, can this be solved by putting this text after the license:
[02:17] <jwendell> On Debian systems, the complete text of the GNU General
[02:17] <jwendell> Public License can be found in `/usr/share/common-licenses/GPL'.
[02:18] <TheMuso> What text were you thinking of?
[02:18] <pochu> hey TheMuso! It's been a long time.
[02:18] <TheMuso> pochu: Indeed.
[02:19] <TheMuso> jwendell: Oh that text. Well thats not entirely correct. The package is GPL2.
[02:19] <tonyyarusso> kompozer: Okay, I'll do a new dput with that fixed.
[02:19] <jwendell> TheMuso, GPL is a slink to GPL2 ;)
[02:20] <kompozer> tonyyarusso: thx. debian/control committed
[02:20] <TheMuso> ah of course.
[02:20] <tonyyarusso> kompozer: (check the spaces thing mentioned in IM as well)
[02:21] <TheMuso> jwendell: In that case, I take back what I said.
[02:22] <jwendell> TheMuso, isn't necessary i upload it again?
[02:22] <TheMuso> jwendell: If you say that you saw other packages in the archive with similar copyright files, and since GPL links to the GPL2, I think its fine.
[02:23] <tonyyarusso> After the initial REVU upload, you don't have to include the original source anymore, right?  (ie, leave off -sa)
[02:23] <jwendell> TheMuso, yep, thanks
[02:24] <kompozer> tonyyarusso: debian/control just re-committed (there was a LF in the Build-Depends field)
[02:25] <tonyyarusso> kompozer: Yeah, that too.  Did you catch the leading spaces note before disconnecting?
[02:25] <kompozer> nope
[02:26] <kompozer> two leading spaces in the decription fields are ok ?
[02:26] <tonyyarusso> kompozer: You want one leading space, except on the line listing the URL of the sourceforge page, which should have two.
[02:26] <TheMuso> c
[02:26] <TheMuso> ugh
[02:26] <TheMuso> wrong window
[02:27] <kompozer> tonyyarusso: committed
[02:27] <tonyyarusso> kompozer: coolio
[02:27] <tonyyarusso> Should have a new REVU URL momentarily.
[02:28] <jussi01> TheMuso: you have doen that several times now... lol
[02:28] <TheMuso> jussi01: yeah I know.
[02:29] <jwendell> TheMuso, thanks :)
[02:29] <tonyyarusso> TheMuso: are you available to do reviews?
[02:30] <TheMuso> tonyyarusso: Not any more, sorry. Got to get ready for a trip for tomorrow.
[02:30] <tonyyarusso> TheMuso: Okay.
[02:31] <xxxxx1> mornin' all
[02:31] <tonyyarusso> Hobbsee: and you said you didn't want to do reviews for this release, correct?
[02:31] <mok0> morning, xxxxx1
[02:31] <xxxxx1> hey mok0
[02:32] <Hobbsee> tonyyarusso: ooh, yes, you may put those words into my mouth
[02:32] <tonyyarusso> :P
[02:39] <zul_> heylo
[02:53] <fernando> hey all
[03:05] <xxxxx1> dae fernando
[03:18] <StevenK> tonyyarusso: You can just link to the licenses in debian/copyright.
[03:18] <StevenK> tonyyarusso: The README.Debian is completly pointless.
[03:19] <StevenK> tonyyarusso: Can't upstream include the manual page?
[03:19] <StevenK> tonyyarusso: What's the purpose of kompozer-0.7.10/debian/kompozer.patch?
[03:23] <_MMA_> Anyone know who heads Xubuntu at the moment?
[03:23] <StevenK> tonyyarusso: Why have #patch -p0 < debian/patches/amd64.patch in debian/rules? dpatch exists, and makes stuff like that brain-damagagingly easy.
[03:23] <StevenK> I think that's enough.
[03:24] <StevenK> Nope, one more.
[03:24] <StevenK> tonyyarusso: If you're going to not call debhelper programs in debian/rules, remove the call, don't just comment it out.
[04:11] <norsetto> tonio_: I hope you didn't mind me asking in bug 127739?
[04:11] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 127739 in nvtv "menu entry for nvtv has no icon" [Wishlist,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/127739
[04:15] <Tonio_> norsetto: of course not
[04:15] <Tonio_> norsetto: btw I don't see how am I concerned :)
[04:16] <norsetto> Tonio_: hmmm, well, you were assigned to that bug :-)
[04:18] <Tonio_> norsetto: indeed, looks like someone put that one to me :)
[04:18] <Tonio_> norsetto: strange, but reviewing the patch
[04:29] <Tonio_> norsetto: looks like adding the icon requires a bit of work :)
[04:30] <Tonio_> norsetto: btw better assign the bug to the mot sponsor that to me, I don't even have an nvidia card to test if patch causes troubles... :)
[04:31] <norsetto> Tonio_: well, you should talk to dholbach about it, he wanted you to look at it
[04:31] <Tonio_> norsetto: I know :)
[04:32] <Tonio_> norsetto: I'll ask him
[04:32] <Tonio_> norsetto: btw I won't upload something that has licence problem ;)
[04:32] <norsetto> tonio_: thx, and sorry to bother you :-)
[04:32] <Tonio_> norsetto: no problem
[04:55] <gnomefreak> TheMuso: are you still around?
[05:04] <desertc> Hello Masters of the Universe.  I realize your probably working on lots more important things, but I wanted to alert you to the LinCity-NG improvements of version 1.1
[05:04] <desertc> http://happypenguin.org/show?lincity-ng
[05:04] <desertc> Presently, Gutsy is slated to continue the version 1.0 release.
[05:04] <desertc> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lincity-ng
[05:05] <desertc> LinCity-NG is a fantastic game, but if you've played it, then you know it needs polish.  This update adds some of that much needed elbow-grease!
[05:07] <mok0> desertc: The best is probably to file a "needs update" bug in LP
[05:08] <Hobbsee> we're in UVF, though
[05:08] <Hobbsee> !uvf
[05:08] <ubotu> uvf is Upstream Version Freeze.  For an exception, see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess#head-9523bc4076ff011324d67cddc97969ec609618d6
[05:09] <desertc> mok0: Thank you for your response.
[05:10] <bddebian> Heya gang
[05:12] <pochu> Hello bddebian
[05:12] <bddebian> Heya pochu
[05:18] <desertc> I posted a new bug for LinCity-NG.  I don't know if I did it right, so maybe someone could correct me and allow me to update it as needed:
[05:18] <desertc> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lincity-ng/+bug/135305
[05:18] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 135305 in lincity-ng "Version 1.1 Available for Update" [Undecided,New] 
[05:23] <mok0> desertc: thanks. Hopefully it will be dealt with soon -- it's too late for gutsy, though...
[05:26] <desertc> mok0: That's a shame.  The new version has been out for a while. Out of curiosity, what is the process that is typical for packages to get updated?
[05:27] <desertc> Is it the package maintainer who checks for new updates, or is it the application dev who addresses a concern?  Who decided whether a new version is required as an update?
[05:28] <mok0> Typically the maintainer would take care of upstream updates
[05:29] <mok0> desertc: ... and they will get a copy of your bug report
[05:29] <desertc> Oh, I see - and also,  I noticed that Debian is also using 1.0.3-2.  Probably has something to do with it, too, huh?
[05:30] <mok0> desertc: perhaps that package is maintained in debian.
[05:31] <mok0> desertc: trying to find out, but the website is s-l-o-w...
[05:33] <mok0> desertc: Yes, lincity-ng is imported directly from debian unstable
[05:34] <mok0> desertc: ... so you may want to file your bug report there, too.
[05:34] <mok0> desertc: http://www.debian.org/Bugs/
[05:34] <desertc> Games must be an annoyance for you all.  They update rapidly, users want the latest versions, they are resource hogs and problematic, and they get little respect as being "important".  But, I. for one, appreciate the effort!!
[05:35] <mok0> desertc: hehe I'm sure we all play games now and then...
[05:36] <desertc> I think there is already a bug request for an update on Debian, I'm not sure.  I am not familiar with their system:
[05:36] <desertc> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=439034
[05:36] <ubotu> Debian bug 439034 in lincity-ng "lincity-ng: New upstream release" [Wishlist,Open] 
[05:38] <intellectronica> howdy!
[05:38] <mok0> desertc: it looks like v. 1.1 is now in unstable, which means it may have found its way into gutsy...
[05:39] <intellectronica> who would be a good master to talk about inclusion of the stuff in http://www.rabbitmq.com/debian.html (an AMQP server written in Erlang) ?
[05:40] <desertc> mok0: THat's good to hear.  I guess it is all being addressed, after all.  Thanks for your help.
[05:46] <intellectronica> any ideas? is this something the uncommon languages team might be interested in?
[05:50] <mok0> I don't even know what an AMPQ server is :-/
[05:54] <bddebian> Gah, looks like Mr. Corbier already fixed xmlrpc-c
[05:54] <xtknight> if it says "Merge from debian unstable, remaining changes:" generally does that mean they need to be applied again, or that they have been applied already?
[05:55] <xtknight> in changelog for a package
[05:55] <bddebian> That usually means that they were re-applied
[05:56] <xtknight> ok guess i'll check anyway
[05:56] <intellectronica> mok0: AMQP is a messaging protocol. It's like Jabber but for machines.
[05:57] <kompozer> StevenK, tonyyarusso: sorry, just got back. The debian/kompozer.patch isn't necessary. It's only useful to test the build process.
[05:59] <intellectronica> mok0: also see http://saladwithsteve.com/2007/08/future-is-messaging.html
[06:01] <mok0> intellectronica: yikes, they'd better build som encryption into that!
[06:03] <intellectronica> mok0: into the protocol? i don't know much about it, but I think it is encrypted. anyway, i'm just asking on behalf of someone - i'd like to help them get their packages into universe, but don't know who's most likely to be interested in getting involved
[06:05] <mok0> intellectronica: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Teams/UncommonProgrammingLanguages/Erlang
[06:05] <mok0> ... but it looks like it's not active
[06:06] <intellectronica> mok0: yes, i don't think it's very active, and i didn't manage to get in contact with any of the people registered as part of the team on LP
[06:08] <mok0> intellectronica: Hmmm. Isn't there an implementation in another language? Python?
[06:09] <intellectronica> mok0: there's a competing implementation in Java called QPid - Rabbit itself has a server in Erlang and client libraries in Erlang, Java, Python and C#
[06:10] <mok0> Why not package it yourself? You can get help in this forum -- although I don't know how many know about Erlang
[06:11] <intellectronica> mok0: well, the guys have already prepared .deb packages, so i guess it's just a matter of reviewing them and getting someone to include them, no?
[06:12] <mok0> Yup, that's right
[06:12] <mok0> You upload the package to REVU
[06:12] <mok0> ... and ask for review right here
[06:14] <intellectronica> mok0: thanks! i'll pass the information on and see if i can help them with any necessary fixes.
[06:15] <mok0> intellectronica: hope it works out!
[06:16] <bigon> could someone have a look at the patch I've made for bug #134607
[06:16] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 134607 in bzr-builddeb "WARNING: the 'deb822' top-level module is *DEPRECATED*, please use 'debian_bundle.deb822'" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/134607
[06:17] <bddebian> Gah maybe it's just time to fully turn in my MOTU badge..
[06:19] <xtknight> bigon, set the bug to confirmed if you have a proposed patch
[06:19] <mok0> bigon:  Looks ok from just looking at the latest patch
[06:19] <Hobbsee> bddebian: no.  do some reviewing.
[06:19] <bddebian> Hobbsee: I don't think I should do anything anymore :-(
[06:20] <xtknight> would some kind soul look at Bug 135111 ? ;)
[06:20] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 135111 in ubuntu "[UVFe]  hugin svn needs packaged for qtpfsgui" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/135111
[06:30] <Hobbsee> xtknight: is motu-uvf subscribed?
[06:30] <xtknight> Hobbsee, yup
[06:30] <Hobbsee> then wait
[06:33] <Hobbsee> bddebian: yes you should.  get to it.
[06:34] <bddebian> Hobbsee: Not after the xmlrpc-c fiasco :'-(
[06:34] <Hobbsee> bddebian: just try.
[06:34] <Hobbsee> bddebian: the reviews will have a second ack
[06:45] <geser> Hi bddebian
[06:56] <bddebian> Heya geser
[07:03] <norsetto> bddebian: go Barry go! <insert here a weaving flag emoticon>
[07:09] <bddebian> Hello norsetto
[07:17] <xxxxx1> hey bddebian
[07:20] <Toadstool> bddebian: don't blame yourself too hard for the xmlrpc-c thing :/
[07:22] <bddebian> Heya xxxxx1, To
[07:23] <bddebian> Err Toadstool
[07:23] <Toadstool> :)
[07:41] <bddebian> Toadstool: I do blame myself and I just don't get it :-(
[07:43] <Toadstool> bddebian: blah, screwing up once in a while doesn't mean that your work is not overall valuable, sh*t happens, believe me ;)
[07:43] <Toadstool> we *need* you!
[07:44] <bddebian> I highly doubt that. :-(
[07:44] <Toadstool> oh c'mon, you know better
[07:44] <pygi> bddebian, be shhhh :P
[07:46] <Toadstool> bddebian: 2
[07:46] <Toadstool> hmpf
[07:46] <Toadstool> sorry :)
[07:49] <bddebian> HuH? :-)
[07:50] <tuxmaniac> bddebian, wtf is wrong with you. You are my mentor
[07:50] <pygi> tuxmaniac, just kick him
[07:51] <bddebian> tuxmaniac: You are sick then :-)
[07:51] <Toadstool> bddebian: 'twas supposed to be something like /window 2 but I have a hard time synchronizing my hands and my brain this early in the morning ;)
[07:51] <tuxmaniac> bddebian, heh.
[07:51] <bddebian> Toadstool: Ah :-)
[07:52] <mok0> Toadstool: Irssi user, huh...
[08:10] <bddebian> Hmm, I see my pw no longer works on REVU
[08:31] <geser> bddebian: the new one? REVU started with fresh passwords for everyone
[08:32] <bddebian> geser: Yar I found that thanks, but recover doesn't work for me.. :-(
[08:33] <geser> wait for Hobbsee or siretart
[08:33] <bddebian> pfft, I have no patience.. :-)
[08:35] <jussi01> doesnt the "recover" work?
[08:36] <bddebian> Doesn't seem to for me, I just get a blank page
[08:36] <jussi01> oh...
[08:36] <jussi01> ok then
[08:37] <mok0> bddebian: I had to upload a package first
[08:37] <bddebian> Well I should say I get the gpg insructions text but no string
[08:55] <bddebian> Well jeliza has a few errors
[09:15] <tonyyarusso> kompozer: Did you see StevenK's other 5 statements as well?
[09:16] <tonyyarusso> StevenK: When you say I can just link to the licenses, I was told before that GPL/LGPL need just the preamble and a link to their /usr/share/common-licenses location, but pretty much everything else needs the full license text included.  I believe that's straight out of the Debian Policy actually.
[09:23] <tonyyarusso> StevenK: "Every package must be accompanied by a verbatim copy of its copyright and distribution license in the file /usr/share/doc/package/copyright." (http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-docs.html#s-copyrightfile) was my basis for that belief.
[09:31] <kompozer> tonyyarusso: no I didn't see StevenK's other statements
[09:31] <tonyyarusso> kompozer: I'll grab 'em - a sec
[09:34] <tonyyarusso> kompozer: 1) You can just link to the licenses in debian/copyright. [I don't think this is true...trying to follow up] , 2) The README.Debian is completly pointless. - this is true, perhaps I can find some legitimate way to expand it, 3) Can't upstream include the manual page? [I'm not sure if he's talking about kompozer-config lacking one here, or that it's in debian/ only - don't know] , 4) Why have #patch -p0 < debian/patches/amd64.pa
[09:34] <tonyyarusso> Let me know if that got cut off..../me can never remember the IRC character limit
[09:35] <sn9> 4) Why have #patch -p0 < debian/patches/amd64.p
[09:35] <sn9> the limit is also client-dependent
[09:36] <tonyyarusso> sn9: I used it before I really knew a better way and was testing, and I think that commented line is just a relic from an old testing version of the rules file.
[09:36] <tonyyarusso> sn9: I don't understand your second line though
[09:36] <sn9> "/me can never remember the IRC character limit"
[09:36] <kompozer> 4) is useless now, that's why it's been commented out. Removed.
[09:36] <tonyyarusso> sn9: oooh.  'k
[09:37] <sn9> i was echoing the last part of what was visible from you in the first line
[09:38] <tonyyarusso> ...amd64.patch in debian/rules? dpatch exists, and makes stuff like that brain-damagagingly easy. [This is from last spring I believe, and as it's commented out anyway, should probably just be removed.] , 5) If you're going to not call debhelper programs in debian/rules, remove the call, don't just comment it out. [Also valid] 
[09:39] <kompozer> ok I've read tthem all now
[09:40] <kompozer> amd64.patch is already applied
[09:40] <kompozer> in fact as I develop on Dapper, there's no specific patches to apply - the kompozer.patch is just a build tool that allows to launch KompoZer from its build directory for testing purposes
[09:41] <kompozer> so it's not applied, I can remove it
[09:41] <tonyyarusso> ah, ok
[09:41] <tonyyarusso> kompozer: You can keep it in SVN if you wish - I'll just remember to not include that.
[09:43] <kompozer> tonyyarusso: ok. I've also removed all commented lines. I guess we don't need dh_installmenu either?
[09:44] <tonyyarusso> kompozer: That's for the *.menu file, which we're using *.desktop in favor of, right?
[09:44] <kompozer> tonyyarusso: I think so, yes
[09:44] <tonyyarusso> Likely correct then.
[09:44] <kompozer> (at least, it works without this line)
[09:46] <asac> tonyyarusso: who said the things in []  brackets?
[09:46] <tonyyarusso> asac: me
[09:47] <kompozer> hi asac
[09:47] <asac> tonyyarusso: i have no idea what he wants to say with copyright
[09:47] <tonyyarusso> heh, ok
[09:47] <asac> tonyyarusso: how do you isntall it?
[09:48] <tonyyarusso> asac: I think "cd mozilla && $(MAKE) install DESTDIR=$(ndir)" is the relevant line, see http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/kompozer-0708281720/kompozer-0.7.10/debian/rules
[09:49] <kompozer> confirmed
[09:49] <asac> well .. but that doesn't install copyright, right?
[09:49] <tonyyarusso> dh_installdirs, dh_install, and dh_link are also used.
[09:49] <asac> if you don't install it explicitly then i have no idea about 1)
[09:49] <asac> and it can probably be safely ignored
[09:49] <asac> same for 5) (can be ignored) ... though a cleanup might be beneficial
[09:49] <asac> 6) remove kompozer.patch from debian dir ... so diff.gz is stripped further down
[09:50] <kompozer> asac, tonyyarusso: 4) 5) 6) committed to SVN
[09:50] <tonyyarusso> kompozer: great
[09:50] <asac> 4) use quilt ... and not dpatch ... dpatch is brain-damanged for huge source trees like mozillas
[09:51] <asac> kompozer: ok
[09:51] <asac> kompozer: tonyyarusso: did you free the orig tarball from binary files?
[09:52] <kompozer> asac: yes
[09:52] <asac> did you include the script you use?
[09:52] <asac> might be beneficial
[09:52] <asac> e.g. include remove.nonfree (if you take the one from iceape)
[09:52] <kompozer> what script?
[09:52] <asac> look in iceape debian/ dir ... there is a remove.nonfree
[09:52] <asac> maybe you missed a bunch :)
[09:53] <asac> kompozer: if you cleanup orig.tar.gz balls you have to indicate that in the upstream version
[09:53] <asac> kompozer: otherwise people will not see that you did it and forget in case they take over or do a NMU
[09:53] <asac> kompozer: e.g. 0.7.10+dfsg
[09:53] <asac> as upstream version
[09:54] <kompozer> asac: I might have misunderstood you. By "cleaning" I understood  make clean && make distclean . Did you mean something else?
[09:55] <asac> no
[09:55] <asac> remove all binary files without sources
[09:55] <asac> a good start is the iceape remove.nonfree script
[09:55] <asac> it should remove 200 files or so
[09:55] <asac> then create a new tarball ... with the version above
[09:55] <asac> so you indicate that the tarball we ship is a stripped/repacked tarball because of nonfreeness
[09:56] <kompozer> asac: I didn't even know there were binaries in the source tarball
[09:56] <asac> yeah take a look at remove.nonfree
[09:56] <asac> there are even binaries that have no source
[09:56] <asac> which is the main concern here
[09:59] <asac> kompozer: otherwise you will end up in bug 121734
[09:59] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 121734 in thunderbird "orig.tar.gz has binary-only files" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/121734
[10:00] <kompozer> asac: ok, I got the remove.nonfree from IceApe 1.0.10
[10:00] <tonyyarusso> asac: Is there any harm done to the program for Debian users from those being missing?
[10:00] <asac> no they are windows and mac files
[10:01] <asac> plus non-free branding files
[10:01] <asac> if kompozer branding is non-free you should do something about it
[10:01] <asac> but i don't know
[10:01] <tonyyarusso> ok
[10:01] <kompozer> kompozer's branding is free
[10:01] <kompozer> including the logo
[10:01] <asac> ok ... its not in other-licenses folder?
[10:01] <asac> iirc the nonfree script will remove that folder completely
[10:01] <kompozer> no
[10:01] <asac> ok
[10:01] <asac> then there should be no impact
[10:02] <asac> it might be that you have some files that iceape don't know about though
[10:02] <asac> because you are from 1.7 branch
[10:02] <asac> and the iceape above is 1.8
[10:02] <kompozer> do you know a command line to find all executables?
[10:03] <asac> well ... binary data maybe: find -type f | xargs -iI file I | grep -i data
[10:03] <asac> refine the grep at the end
[10:03] <kompozer> thanks
[10:03] <asac> but i think you need to modify it somehow
[10:04] <asac> it probably won't print the filename
[10:04] <asac> well ... binary data maybe: find -type f | xargs -iI file I | grep -B2 -i data
[10:04] <asac> maybe
[10:04] <asac> to see more context for each match
[10:09] <cavedon> hi all! I am the co-maintainer of wengophone on Debian; I would like to start supporting it on Ubuntu; I realized that sync from Debian was stopped by an upload to ubuntu (made just to trigger recompilation
[10:09] <cavedon> wengophone in gutsy is 2.1.0, in Debian it is 2.1.1
[10:09] <pygi> cavedon, it's unlikely it can go in gutsy
[10:10] <geser> !info wengophone gutsy
[10:10] <ubotu> wengophone: SIP-based software telephone with video and chat features. In component universe, is optional. Version 2.1.0.dfsg-3build1 (gutsy), package size 6842 kB, installed size 18704 kB
[10:10] <cavedon> it is just a bufixrelease, however I saw Upstream Releases are frozen
[10:11] <geser> pygi: any reason why not?
[10:11] <pygi> geser, yea, it's UVF now :)
[10:11] <geser> cavedon: you need to get an exception if you want this version included
[10:11] <cavedon> pygi: I could start making bugixes
[10:11] <pygi> right, UVF ... cassidy you can make a request for UVFE
[10:12] <cavedon> but it would mean doing the same as the difference between 2.1.0 and 2.1.1
[10:12] <cavedon> no new geatures have been added
[10:13] <cavedon> no new features have been added
[10:13] <mok0> What
[10:13] <mok0> What's the version of wengophone in gutsy?
[10:13] <cavedon> geser: do you think an exception could be made? I know the procedure
[10:13] <cavedon> 2.1.0
[10:14] <cavedon> mok0: 2.1.0
[10:14] <pygi> cavedon, if no major changes, and if it wont introduce new bugs I dont see why not
[10:15] <geser> cavedon: if you have a good reason and the changes aren't big you could try, at worst motu-uvf says no
[10:15] <cavedon> ok, that would be good news; it would be mean a lot of bugfixes;
[10:15] <cavedon> pygi, geser: thanks
[10:16] <kompozer> asac: there was no equivalent 'remove.nonfree' script in Mozilla-1.7.8 (sarge), right?
[10:16] <asac> kompozer: no
[10:28] <kompozer> asac: can I consider using some brute force here, like removing mozilla/plugin, mozilla/sun-java, and so on?
[10:32] <asac> plugin? whats in there?
[10:32] <kompozer> asac: oji
[10:32] <kompozer> (unused)
[10:34] <asac> they are not non-free afaik
[10:34] <kompozer> yes exactly
[10:35] <kompozer> I could remove some whole directories to be sure I don't forget non-free files
[10:35] <kompozer> instead of removing files one by one
[10:45] <kompozer> asac: do we have sources to build 'mangle' in Linux?
[10:48] <happyface> Can anyone help me to install the package sun-java6-* on a persistent USB version of Feisty? I get this error when installing: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=414851 and this is my strace output: http://p.opsat.net/v/xi
[10:52] <asac> kompozer: no idea :)
[10:52] <asac> is it used?
[10:52] <asac> afaik its just garbage
[10:53] <kompozer> I don't even know what it's supposed to do
[10:53] <kompozer> so I'll try to clean it
[10:57] <jamesstansell> happyface: this seems likely to be related to your /cow issue: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/sun-java6/+bug/103933/comments/8
[10:57] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 103933 in sun-java6 "Java install via Add/Remove crashed" [Undecided,Confirmed] 
[11:00] <happyface> hmm
[11:13] <happyface> "Making sure that the /proc was correctly mounted in the chroot caused the error to go away."
[11:13] <happyface> does anyone know what that means?
[11:13] <happyface> bug 103933
[11:13] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 103933 in sun-java6 "Java install via Add/Remove crashed" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/103933
[11:47] <tonyyarusso> kompozer: Are you figuring that stuff out okay?
[11:49] <kompozer> tonyyarusso: you mean, the non-free files?
[11:50] <tonyyarusso> kompozer: yes.
[11:50] <kompozer> I'm gzipping an archive right now
[11:51] <kompozer> I've removed all files found by IceApe's remove.nonfree script + all Nvu/Linspire icons everywhere + some useless directories (Java, Calendar) that had trademarked icons and/or binaries
[11:53] <tonyyarusso> kompozer: sounds good
[11:53] <Daviey> Hey.. slightly OT - but can abybody tell me how to sign a deb after it has been created?
[11:53] <tonyyarusso> (to me at least)
[11:55] <kompozer> tonyyarusso: I think it should be OK since I couldn't find any binary file that wasn't listed in IceApe's script. For the trademarked images, I had already tracked them everywhere in the code and replaced them with free icons.
[12:08] <bddebian> Daviey: Why do you want to sign the .deb file?
[12:24] <DktrKranz> any MOTU who has time to check for a SRU request?
[12:32] <kompozer> tonyyarusso: I'm uploading a 'dfsg' version of the source tarball, this should be ready in 30 minutes. Meanwhile I'm rebuilding KompoZer without these files to be sure I haven't removed any necessary file.
[12:32] <kompozer> Any thought about the three first points StevenK mentioned? (linking the licences in debian/copyright, removing/rewriting debian/README.Debian, manual page upstream)