[11:44] <CIA-18> ubiquity: superm1 * r2230 ubiquity/ (8 files in 2 dirs): add mythbuntu installer icon, divert gtk icon upon mythbuntu package install
[03:23] <CIA-18> ubiquity: cjwatson * r2231 ubiquity/ (146 files in 3 dirs): * Update translations from Rosetta.
[03:48] <CIA-18> ubiquity: cjwatson * r2232 ubiquity/debian/changelog: close LP: #132157
[03:49] <CIA-18> ubiquity: cjwatson * r2233 ubiquity/ (3 files in 3 dirs):
[03:49] <CIA-18> ubiquity: * Remove question mark from popularity-contest checkbox text
[03:49] <CIA-18> ubiquity:  (LP: #135140).
[04:05] <CIA-18> ubiquity: cjwatson * r2234 ubiquity/ (3 files in 3 dirs): * Adjust grub_enable text to have more usual capitalisation and spelling.
[04:10] <CIA-18> ubiquity: cjwatson * r2235 ubiquity/ (82 files in 3 dirs):
[04:10] <CIA-18> ubiquity: * Internationalise partitioning and advanced dialogs. Remove
[04:10] <CIA-18> ubiquity:  popcon_checkbutton special case as its text now differs from that in
[04:10] <CIA-18> ubiquity:  popularity-contest.
[04:20] <cjwatson> superm1: note bug 139603 which I reassigned to the backend
[04:25] <xivulon> cjwatson, couple of quick questions:
[04:25] <xivulon> 1) what about copyting the CD to HD end ejecting in order to avoid boot selection issues?
[04:27] <xivulon> 2) I now have a "dedicated partition" mode (automatic-ubiquity without preseeding partitioning info). The partition to be resized might have to be mounted r/o when the ISO is used. Can ubiquity cope with that?
[04:37] <cjwatson> 1) sounds reasonable
[04:37] <cjwatson> 2) normal partitioning can't work if there's anything mounted off the hard disk; this is a kernel limitation. so no, that won't work.
[04:38] <cjwatson> forget that it might have to be mounted read-only - if you're mounting an ISO off it then it will be locked and the kernel will be unable to reread the partition table which totally fucks the installer.
[04:38] <cjwatson> so it's reasonable but only if using loop-mounted partitioning.
[04:45] <xivulon> it should be the same thing as hd-media (I guess)#
[04:47] <xivulon> rebranding in nsis at runtime is a major pain
[04:50] <xivulon> Found a small and cute library to dump a windows device to file (no dd in windows), source available but no license, will contact the author
[04:53] <cjwatson> don't get confused by the name. hd-media is not actually expected to be used with an ISO on a hard disk under normal circumstances.
[04:53] <cjwatson> it's expected to be used with an ISO on a USB stick
[04:53] <cjwatson> in which case this problem does not arise
[04:55] <xivulon> hmm, yeah now that I think of it I used hd-media off hd but never actually resized anything...
[04:55] <xivulon> So shall I remove "dedicated partition" mode? Guess so...
[04:56] <cjwatson> it's fine as long as you're booting from a real CD
[04:56] <xivulon> But in that case you hardly need wubi
[04:57] <xivulon> ...other than to go around bios issues... and even then, if I copy the CD to HD, it becames a moot point
[04:57] <cjwatson> working around BIOS issues is a real issue, and I'd love to use wubi for that
[04:58] <cjwatson> even without the loop-mounted partitioning
[04:58] <xivulon> sure, but that affects what we said above re dumping CD on HD
[04:58] <cjwatson> it's either that or we need to add a new tool to the CD for that (somebody recently volunteered one based on instlux on ubuntu-devel), and I don't really want to do that if I can just use wubi
[04:59] <cjwatson> err ... I thought the business about working around bios issues was that you had a way to tell Windows to boot from the CD next time it boots
[04:59] <cjwatson> not that you were copying the CD contents to the hard disk
[05:00] <xivulon> I guess there are 2 separate user cases
[05:00] <cjwatson> indeed
[05:01] <xivulon> 1. you just want to go around bios
[05:01] <xivulon> 2. you want to use the CD to spare you the download
[05:01] <xivulon> In both cases the grub4dos setup is the same
[05:01] <cjwatson> the second isn't really a use case
[05:01] <cjwatson> I would phrase it as:
[05:01] <xivulon> The only difference is that in 1. I would not copy any ISO, in 2. I would copy the ISO on HD
[05:01] <cjwatson> 1. you want to boot from the Ubuntu CD without having to reconfigure your BIOS, and are happy to deal with giving Ubuntu its own partitions
[05:02] <cjwatson> 2. you have the Ubuntu CD and want to install it, but do not want to deal with partitioning and want to just install it into files on the Windows partition
[05:02] <xivulon> No problem, it will work as expected
[05:03] <cjwatson> I think this is the same as what you described but I'm coming at it from a different angle
[05:03] <xivulon> You will have a size selector, if you select a "number" and have a CD then I extract the ISO and eject
[05:03] <xivulon> If you select "Read Only Mode" (please choose a better wording). I will not extract the ISO
[05:04] <cjwatson> I'd like the implementation of case 2. to be simpler and not involve the normal wubi UI at all
[05:04] <cjwatson> I'd prefer it to be a button in the winfoss UI
[05:04] <cjwatson> (I've been planning to talk to Henrik about having wubi launchable from winfoss, since winfoss is what autoruns when you insert an Ubuntu live CD at the moment)
[05:04] <xivulon> The advantage of using wubi is@
[05:05] <xivulon> 1 you can choose the drive where grub4dos stuff is installed, 2 language, keyboard and timezone are preselected
[05:05] <cjwatson> 2 is a disadvantage if you're just going to be thrown into ubiquity anyway
[05:05] <xivulon> I agree
[05:05] <cjwatson> wubi's selectors for those things aren't as good as ubiquity's anyway :)
[05:05] <xivulon> I could take a commandline argument
[05:06] <cjwatson> I see your point with 1
[05:06] <cjwatson> a command-line argument that caused wubi to prompt for the drive to which it should install grub4dos would be ideal
[05:06] <xivulon> so the cd button might call: wubi.exe --liveboot
[05:08] <cjwatson> sounds good to me
[05:08] <xivulon> By the way, re 2, it's not such a big issue, since keyboard and timezone selectors are hidden
[05:09] <cjwatson> we tried autodetecting the keyboard in Ubuntu before (in Warty) and it was a huge mistake
[05:10] <cjwatson> though it might be better with information from Windows I guess
[05:10] <cjwatson> you can't just do it from the locale though
[05:10] <xivulon> I think we can have both anyway, I'll keep "Read Only Mode" and add the commandline option
[05:10] <cjwatson> great, thanks
[05:10] <cjwatson> I'll mail Henrik about the winfoss integration (and CC you)
[05:11] <xivulon> re keyboard variant, the variants.ini file has to be filled by someone... I googled a bit but I could not find any good list of HKL (windows codes).
[05:11] <xivulon> I will remove "Dedicated Partition" then
[05:13] <xivulon> Shall I keep "Read Only Mode" if there is no CD?
[05:13] <xivulon> I mean that makes a minimal installation requiring only 1GB
[05:13] <xivulon> Which is good
[05:13] <xivulon> But if the user tries to run ubiquity, he might not be able to resize
[05:16] <xivulon> Or maybe I can make it explicit: if there is a CD inserted I can give the option to "Start LiveCD", and in any case I will have a "1GB (read only)"
[05:18] <xivulon> The second one extracts the ISO the first one does not.
[05:23] <xivulon> If someone can find a nice gpl-compatible burning library I can always have "Boot LiveCD", so that even when an ISO file is used the CD is first burnt, then used. That's for the stand-alone wubi version of course.
[05:42] <cjwatson> I don't mind what happens if there's no CD :-)
[05:43] <xivulon> :P
[05:44] <cjwatson> (but sounds reasonable except that 1GB is too small for an Ubuntu desktop installation; 2.5GB would be more like it
[05:44] <cjwatson> )
[05:44] <xivulon> cjwatson 1GB means booting from ISO image in read only mode
[05:45] <cjwatson> oh, you mean 1GB as in the size required for copying the ISO?
[05:45] <xivulon> yeah
[05:45] <cjwatson> ok, better wording required then as I totally didn't understand that :)
[05:46] <superm1> cjwatson, ah yes thanks for reclassing that bug.  laga came up with a workaround for now within ubiquity that i committed until its resolved in kde-guidance
[05:53] <xivulon> cjwatson it will be: "Choose installation size (GB): Boot Live CD, 1 (Read Only), 4, 5, ... , 30"
[05:55] <xivulon> 0 Boot Live CD
[06:00] <cjwatson> hmm, doesn't sound very discoverable
[06:00] <cjwatson> magic values for parameters that cause it to do something completely different are awkward
[06:00] <cjwatson> a radio button with decent wording for the options would really be better
[06:14] <xivulon> Hmm not much space left for that, I really like the idea of having all in 1 page, so that for most people it's a 1-click installation.
[06:14] <xivulon> The nsis page size is somewhat rigid
[06:15] <xivulon> Moreover, even if the implementation is technically different, for average joe it is always an "installation that lets you boot into Ubuntu", you choose the size, if you are short in disk space you have to use a CD or accept a read only mode.
[06:16] <xivulon> ...but you can still think it as a "size" decision...
[06:16] <cjwatson> I think there is an important difference in that installing into a loop-mounted partition is less flexible and means that you're still dependent on having Windows installed
[06:16] <cjwatson> it's not just a quantitative difference
[06:17] <xivulon> hmm not exactly, you are dependent on not destroying ntfs. You can delete C:\windows\* and still be able to boot ubuntu
[06:19] <cjwatson> and you're still talking about average joe? ;-)
[06:25] <xivulon> I see your point but I am not sure that education should be done within the installer, the should be done upfront or in an easily accessible faq
[06:31] <xivulon> Having only a size selector you leave users in blissful ignorance, but in a sense you make their choice simple: size.
[06:31] <xivulon> have to go, will resume tonight!
[07:50] <CIA-18> ubiquity: evand * r2236 ubiquity/ (debian/changelog ubiquity/frontend/gtk_ui.py): * Fix canceling from the intro page.
[10:50] <CIA-18> ubiquity: evand * r2237 ubiquity/ (debian/changelog ubiquity/frontend/gtk_ui.py): * Fix hostname validation (LP: #137592).
[11:33] <xivulon> /me: nsis winning...
[11:50] <evand> hahaha
[11:51] <xivulon> and bzr (https://bugs.launchpad.net/bzr/+bug/114808)
[11:51] <xivulon> ...
[11:52] <xivulon> jsut wasted my .bzr by following the instructions above
[11:53] <xivulon> without even reading them!
[11:53] <evand> yikes