[12:38] <crimsun>     libpq5 | 8.2.5-0ubuntu0.7.04.1 | feisty-proposed | amd64, i386, powerpc
[12:38] <ajmitch> hi crimsun
[12:39] <ScottK> ajmitch: I'd go for it.
[12:39] <ajmitch> ScottK: cool, changelog is showing mostly bugfixes
[12:39] <leonel> tanks crimsun
[12:39] <ScottK> ajmitch: Bug #141013 is already filed.
[12:39] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 141013 in pylint "Gutsy should use a new pylint package" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/141013
[12:39] <ajmitch> yeah, it'll be a straight sync, too
[12:40] <ajmitch> thought so, he's a LP developer :)
[12:40] <ScottK> Assuming it builds for Python2.5.  I haven't checked.  There's a "Please build for python2.5" bug outstanding in the Debian BTS.
[12:41] <ajmitch> they use a number of checking tools in their test suites
[12:41] <ScottK> I didn't have time to test build it.
[12:41] <ajmitch> XS-Python-Version: current
[12:41] <ajmitch> I'll test build now
[12:42] <ajmitch> building will be no problem, and I think that it'd be intended for python >= 2.4
[12:51] <ajmitch> ScottK: bad news is that python-logilab-astng & python-logilab-common would need to be updated as well
[12:56] <ajmitch> only other package that uses them is python-constraint
[12:56] <ajmitch> they all share a common upstream
[01:45] <keescook> ScottK, leonel: holy cow, that's a big patch to clamav.  :P
[01:48] <leonel> keescook:  the diff came  big  but  there really was  3 files patched with  little changes   the bigger was for  clamav-milter
[01:48] <keescook> leonel: ah!  a .orig file snuck in.
[01:48] <keescook> +--- clamav-0.90.2~/libclamav/htmlnorm.c.orig	1969-12-31 18:00:00.000000000 -0600
[01:48] <keescook> ++++ clamav-0.90.2/libclamav/htmlnorm.c.orig	2007-04-12 17:55:14.000000000 -0600
[01:49] <leonel> should I redo the patch ?
[01:49] <keescook> that's why it seemed big.  the rest of the changes look good.  Can you, yeah?  Also please adjust your changelog entry to look more like the ones here:
[01:49] <keescook> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityUpdateProcedures
[01:49] <keescook> (See "Template" in step 5)
[01:50] <leonel> keescook:  but  how the orig got  into ?
[01:50] <leonel> keescook:  I've just   dpatch-edit-patch   foo
[01:50] <leonel> then  patch
[01:51] <leonel> daaaaaaaaaa
[01:51] <keescook> leonel: right, I think you didn't check for .orig files before exiting
[01:51] <leonel> found it
[01:51] <leonel> I've made a   diff   not  a  debdiff
[01:51] <leonel> sorry
[01:51] <leonel> doh !
[01:51] <keescook> heh
[01:51] <keescook> no problemo; let me know when it's updated and I'll get it published.  thanks for tracking down the fixes!
[01:52] <leonel> it was a debdiff   ...
[01:53] <leonel> where the orig  came from ??
[01:53] <leonel> ok
[01:53] <leonel> start over ..
[02:04] <hendrixski> gnome 2.2 was released :-)  How soon will that end up in the repositories?
[02:06] <pochu> hendrixski: it's already there... in the Gutsy repos
[02:06] <ajmitch>   libgnome | 2.20.0-1ubuntu2 | http://nz2.archive.ubuntu.com gutsy/main Sources
[02:06] <ajmitch> ubuntu generally gets GNOME as it's released :)
[02:06] <hendrixski> pochu, wow that's almost instantanious
[02:06] <hendrixski> but is it getting backported to feisty?
[02:06] <ajmitch> beta release is scheduled for just after GNOME releaase
[02:07] <ajmitch> no, there are no backports of the whole desktop
[02:07] <ajmitch> we've never done that, and I doubt that it's ever planned
[02:07] <hendrixski> ajmitch, oh
[02:07] <hendrixski> as a kind of newbie... may I ask why?  to unstable?
[02:08] <ajmitch> because it's a large amount of work for no gain
[02:08] <ajmitch> backporting several large components requires a lot of testing
[02:08] <ajmitch> ubuntu's release schedule always follows gnome's, so with a bit of patience you'll get a shiny release with the latest gnome
[02:09] <hendrixski> ah, Gnome is also on a 6 month release schedule?  good deal... I was wondering about that since I saw that they're at 2.20 after6 months, and my current one in feisty was 2.14
[02:10] <ajmitch> no, feisty has 2.18
[02:10] <leonel> after  exit   dpatch-edit-patch    leaves  a  dpatch with  the  .orig  file in it
[02:11] <leonel> Am I doing something wrong ?
[02:11] <hendrixski> apt-cache search gnome gives me: Version: 1:2.14.3.3ubuntu1
[02:11] <leonel> but that's only with 1 file
[02:11] <leonel> and the patch has 2 patched files
[02:11] <ajmitch> hendrixski: you're probably looking at the wrong package
[02:12] <ajmitch> since gnome is made up of a lot of separate packages, many with different individual versions
[02:12] <hendrixski> ajmitch, oh... wow, i still have a good deal to learn about Ubuntu's packaging ...
[02:12] <ajmitch> leonel: it could be that your editor is doing something funny, but I wouldn't really know for sure
[02:13] <leonel> ajmitch: its   dpatch-edit-patch    foo
[02:13] <leonel> ajmitch: then  patch -p1 -i  thepatch
[02:13] <ajmitch> hendrixski: go to system->about gnome
[02:13] <leonel> then exit
[02:13] <hendrixski> I never even noticed the dpatch-edit-patch left .orig
[02:13] <ajmitch> leonel: right, and did the patch apply cleanly?
[02:13] <hendrixski> ajmitch, ah... you're right 2.18
[02:16] <leonel> ajmitch: not to clean  2 warnings
[02:16] <leonel> ajmitch: Hunk #1 succeeded at 1395 (offset 13 lines).
[02:16] <leonel> Hunk #2 succeeded at 1475 (offset 13 lines).
[02:17] <hendrixski> yeah, one of these days I should just take a walk on the wild side and install the unstable release in another partition then just mount my /home directory on both of them
[02:17] <ajmitch> the unclean patching is possibly what created the .orig
[02:18] <leonel> I guess  I'll go  with the power of the keyboard to apply that patch
[02:18] <leonel> or is there an  "easy" way to fix it ?
[02:18] <ajmitch> rm the .orig? :)
[02:18] <ajmitch> you should be checking the patch anyway if it didn't apply cleanly, to make sure that the patch hunks applied in the right plce
[02:18] <ajmitch> s/plce/place/
[02:19] <leonel> ajmitch:  they did apply clean
[02:19] <ajmitch> but you said that you got warnings
[02:19] <leonel> yes
[02:20] <leonel> I mean  I checked  the file  patched and  all the patched got applied
[02:20] <ajmitch> and the default (as stated in the manpage) is to create a backup .orig if there's not an exact match
[02:20] <leonel> yes  there's a  .orig file
[02:21] <leonel> well
[02:21] <ajmitch> I know, that's what you said the problem is :)
[02:21] <leonel> I've learned another  motu tip
[02:21] <leonel> one step  closer :)
[02:41] <ScottK> So is Canonical people blowing off community processes something I should just accept or be bitter about.  Bug 141101 being the latest.
[02:41] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 141101 in xorg "[UVFe]  Please sync xserver-xorg-video-radeonhd (universe) from Debian experimental" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/141101
[02:43] <zul> evening
[02:43] <ajmitch> hi zul
[02:43] <zul> hey ajmitch how goes it?
[02:44] <ajmitch> it goes
[02:44] <zul> ScottK: well users will want it then yeah no need to be bitter about it
[02:45] <ScottK> Users want all this stuff people are trying to shove in at the last minute, or so we are told.
[02:45] <zul> just a regular day at canonical ;)
[02:48] <zul> son of a *grumble *grumble*
[02:48] <ScottK> What now?
[02:53] <zul> liam woke up
[02:58] <StevenK> ScottK: I'm just keeping in mind what Hobbsee said - a blanket no, except for things that are deemed important/special - my opinion is that radeonhd is special.
[03:02] <zul> uvf is less stressful when you dont get upset about things I find ;)
[03:07] <RAOF> Ok.  So, xgl leaves behind it's lockfiles when it's connection with the underlying Xserver dies.  It doesn't execute any of it's cleanup stuff.
[03:08] <RAOF> Does anyone have an example of something that does that *right*, so I can check/learn/fix?
[03:22] <ScottK> StevenK: OK, but if mdz is going to figure it all out, why do I bother?
[03:34] <ScottK> zul: That's pretty much true of everything.
[03:51] <LaserJock> geeze, you'd think by this point Main apps should generally at least start :(
[03:52] <zul> well it is beta :)
[03:52] <zul> or near beta...im off
[03:54] <minghua> Well, as I've pointed on -devel list, some doesn't start due to missing dependency, yet nobody seems to care...
[03:54] <StevenK> Is there a bug?
[03:54] <minghua> s/pointed/pointed out/
[03:54] <LaserJock> gnumeric: symbol lookup error: /usr/lib/libspreadsheet-1.7.11.so: undefined symbol: go_direction_get_type
[03:54] <minghua> StevenK: yes, bug 139249
[03:54] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 139249 in scim "scim-launcher crashed with SIGSEGV in scim::FrontEndModule::load()" [Undecided,Triaged]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/139249
[03:55] <StevenK> LaserJock: That smacks of koffice
[03:55] <minghua> LaserJock: Hey... that smells like a missing dependency too.
[03:55] <LaserJock> well, go_direction_get_type is in goffice
[03:56] <LaserJock> is it saying it can't find it?
[03:59] <StevenK> minghua: This scim bug is a mess.
[04:00] <minghua> StevenK: If you want a cleaner one, I can file one (and then propose for release blocker, etc.).
[04:01] <StevenK> minghua: No no, just the chain I'm following through
[04:01] <minghua> StevenK: But you apparently haven't seen _really_ messy scim bugs.
[04:01] <StevenK> Twitch
[04:01] <StevenK> I would suggest discussing it with Riddell on IRC.
[04:01] <minghua> StevenK: You should just read my mail to -devel directly.
[04:02] <StevenK> I did.
[04:03] <minghua> StevenK: I am not really fond of trying to catch people on IRC to start discussion.  I am available if some core developer want to discuss though.
[04:03] <minghua> StevenK: It's out of my reach currently, and I don't use Ubuntu daily anyway.  Thanks for the attention, though.
[04:12] <ScottK> StevenK: I guess I've been a consultant too long.  I'm just not used to random bosses jumping in the middle of stuff I'm supposed to be doing.
[05:55] <ScottK> \sh_away: I'd be interested in comments on the updated WINE package on REVU if you have the time ....
[06:08] <tonyyarusso> imbrandon: I'm going to try using apt-mirror for pushing updates out over a LAN to my 17-person computing class in uni - don't fail me now ;)
[06:09] <jdong> local mirror FTW :)
[06:14] <StevenK> jdong: It bet it gets a beating around this time next month
[06:14] <StevenK> s/It/I/
[06:14] <jdong> StevenK: can't wait :) welcome the hoards :)
[06:15] <jdong> I'll be on full seeding force with my 4 100mbit ports in my room :)
[06:56] <tonyyarusso> I don't suppose apt-torrent has made any progress?
[07:00] <minghua> Is apt-torrent a different thing than debtorrent?
[07:02] <tonyyarusso> jdong: ^^ (haha, you incriminated yourself by replying to forums posts)
[07:02] <tonyyarusso> minghua: I think it's different implementations of the same concept.  I don't see either available in Ubuntu though
[07:02] <jdong> tonyyarusso: oh? what did I say?
[07:03] <tonyyarusso> jdong: "I have contacted the author of apt-torrent, and I hope we can work together to make apt-torrent a distribution method for Backports."
[07:03] <minghua> tonyyarusso: Okay.  I just know that debtorrent is available in Debian unstable now.
[07:03] <jdong> LOL
[07:03] <jdong> tonyyarusso: lol wha'ts that from? Warty? :D
[07:03] <tonyyarusso> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=35907
[07:03] <jdong> a 5-digit threadid!
[07:03] <tonyyarusso> jdong: Hoary I think, but a while ago
[07:03] <jdong>  May 20th, 2005
[07:03] <jdong> :D
[07:03] <jdong> that was before we had gracious hosting by canonical
[07:04] <jdong> and when poor ubuntu-geek was paying for 25GB/hr of traffic
[07:05] <tonyyarusso> ah
[07:05] <tonyyarusso> still, it would be nice for Canonical to save some cash
[07:06] <tonyyarusso> looks like debtorrent is more current than apt-torrent, and is being looked at for Hardy?  https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/106382
[07:06] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 106382 in ubuntu "[sync request]  Please sync debtorrent from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Confirmed] 
[07:09] <tonyyarusso> See also https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/apt-torrent
[07:32] <dholbach> good morning
[07:32] <Czessi> morning dholbach
[07:33] <dholbach> hey Czessi
[07:33] <dholbach> how's it going?
[07:34] <Czessi> nightship is over, going to sleep in the next few minutes
[07:37] <dholbach> Czessi: sleep tight then :)
[07:40] <Czessi> dholbach: thanks, i work to get run the rt2500 card run in gutsy. the driver includes in linux-ubuntu-modules freezes my system
[07:40] <dholbach> Czessi: best to talk to bryce about that
[07:44] <Czessi> dholbach: yeah, add to basket, thanks. someone add the bug to linux-source-2.6.22, but the driver is in linux-ubuntu-modules-2.6.22. i hope i did the right changes in launchpad  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux-source-2.6.22/+bug/133251
[07:44] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 133251 in linux-ubuntu-modules-2.6.22 "[Gutsy]  Network Manager freezes system when logging into a WPA WiFi network using ralink rt2500" [Undecided,New] 
[07:44] <dholbach> Czessi: best ot ask the guys in #ubuntu-kernel later on today, most of them are in a US timezone
[07:46] <Czessi> dholbach: i'll ask there
[07:47] <Czessi> dholbach: do you present at the ubucon?
[07:48] <dholbach> Czessi: no, I guess not :-/
[07:48] <dholbach> and also not at the release party
[07:52] <Czessi> dholbach: i'll present kubuntu, kde and kde4 and the release party and i'm present kubuntu and ubuntu at ubucon, practical linux (gieen) and linux info tag dresden
[07:53] <dholbach> Czessi: woah... that's amazing
[07:54] <dholbach> Czessi: great stuff
[07:54] <dholbach> Czessi: when are you going to be a MOTU? :-)
[07:54] <dholbach> Czessi: we should talk about that over a beer :)
[07:56] <Czessi> dholbach: good idea, i'll be a MOTU between gustsy  and hardy. in the summer month i have much to work. to much crazy childrens in berlin holidays.
[07:57] <dholbach> Czessi: right... it'd just be nice to have you in the team :-)
[08:01] <Czessi> dholbach: i've some nice packages for hardy in my repo. buts to late for gutsy .... like kio-ftps (ftps-tls=
[08:02] <dholbach> Czessi: it'd be great to have all that stuff in Ubuntu proper
[08:02] <dholbach> hardy will be great :)
[08:04] <Czessi> i think so, gutsy is also great (without the rt2500 stuff ;)  )
[08:04] <Czessi> at th e moment
[08:07] <Czessi> dholbach: i'm to get tired. have a nice day
[08:07] <dholbach> Czessi: you too! :)
[08:07] <Czessi> cu dholbach
[08:08] <dholbach> see you around
[08:27] <Hobbsee> elmargol: "tell him he's dreaming, son!"
[08:27] <elmargol> ?
[08:27] <RAOF> elmargol: The Castle.  A movie.
[08:29] <jussio1> lol
[08:29] <Hobbsee> elmargol: you suck.  you're clearly not australian
[08:29] <Hobbsee> RAOF: is clearly a proper australian.
[08:29] <elmargol> There is only dessert in australia ;D
[08:30] <jussio1> lol
[08:30] <RAOF> Mmmm, dessert
[08:30] <jussio1> what, chocolate icecream?
[08:30] <jussio1> cheesecake?
[08:30] <RAOF> Although s/ss/s/ and you're approximately true :)
[08:30] <elmargol> desert :D
[08:32] <RAOF> All glory to the hypnosheep!
[08:36] <StevenK> RAOF: You know, hypnosheep went downhill in the 3rd season ....
[08:38] <StevenK> I gave up on electricsheep when I discovered it had downloaded 800Mb into my ~/.electricsheep directory
[08:47] <elmargol> RAOF: is this movie form 1997 or from 2001?
[08:47] <RAOF>  Um.  97 I think.
[08:47] <jussio1> I need a picture that represents software....any ideas
[08:48] <RAOF> jussio1: A big squiggle, with evil looking hooks protruding from odd angles.
[08:48] <elmargol> jussio1: blue screen of death?
[08:48] <jussio1> lol
[08:48] <jussio1> no, no, no....
[08:48] <elmargol> RAOF: A Melbourne family is very happy living where they do, near the Melbourne airport (according to Jane Kennedy, it's "practically their back yard"). However, they are forced to leave their beloved home, by the Government and airport authorities.
[08:49] <RAOF> elmargol: That's the one.
[09:29] <elmargol> find ./dists -name Packages.gz -execdir zcat Packages.gz > Packages \;
[09:29] <elmargol> why doesn't this work?
[09:29] <soren> ajmitch: Which package?
[10:27] <proppy> ScottK: hi
[10:28] <proppy> zul_: thanks for the ACK
[10:28] <proppy> once the UVFe is approved what is the next step ?
[10:29] <dholbach> hey proppy
[10:29] <proppy> uploading my -ubuntu1 package on REVU (for revu?) ?
[10:29] <proppy> or waiting for a MOTU to upload the package ?
[10:30] <proppy> wiki says "  Once one of the  team members marks the bug as Confirmed you can proceed with uploading. "
[10:30] <proppy> but where should I upload ?
[10:31] <dholbach> proppy: the normal sponsoring process
[10:31] <proppy> ok, so when zul_ says "+1 from me go ahead and upload." He is talking to me ?
[10:32] <proppy> not to ScottK
[10:32] <proppy> ok
[10:32] <dholbach> yes
[10:32] <proppy> So I should go thru Sponsorship process ?
[10:32] <dholbach> proppy: I clarified that in FreezeExceptionProcess
[10:32] <dholbach> proppy: yes
[10:32] <proppy> describe on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess
[10:35] <proppy> dholbach: I guess new upstream version is considered as a "new package", so I should get throught REVU/
[10:35] <proppy> ?
[10:35] <dholbach> proppy: no
[10:35] <dholbach> proppy: 'NEW' means 'not in Ubuntu at all'
[10:35] <huats> dholbach: Hi daniel
[10:35] <huats> dholbach: thanks for your comments
[10:36] <proppy> dholbach: ok
[10:36] <huats> dholbach: and of course I'll be more tahn happy to coninue :-)
[10:36] <dholbach> hey huats
[10:36] <dholbach> huats: rock on :)
[10:36] <dholbach> huats: best to talk about desktop packages in #ubuntu-desktop - maybe seb128 has another easy one to get working on
[10:36] <huats> dholbach: I am heading there
[10:36] <huats> :-)
[10:55] <ajmitch> soren: context?
[10:56] <ajmitch> ah, my question about UVFe earlier was for pylint
[10:56] <ajmitch> but would have to be for python-logilab-{common,astng}, and maybe python-constraint as well
[10:56] <ajmitch> all sharing the same upstream
[10:57] <soren> ajmitch: Something about a diffstat about 11 hours ago.
[10:57] <ajmitch> yes, I just scrolled up & found what I was talking about :)
[10:58] <ajmitch> kiko wants it for use with LP testing, I think
[10:58] <soren> ajmitch: Yes, but which package is it?
[10:58] <ajmitch> 20:56 < ajmitch> ah, my question about UVFe earlier was for pylint
[11:02] <dholbach> the wiki is a madhouse
[11:02] <dholbach> myriads of cascading redirects, stale pages etc
[11:02] <ajmitch> very true
[11:02] <ajmitch> every time we've tried cleaning, we got stuck in the mess of pages
[11:03] <dholbach> I hope http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/WikiCleanUp is a good plan
[11:03] <dholbach> going through all pages with MOTU in the title, then tagging them, asking for feedback for two weeks, get stuff done
[11:04] <soren> ajmitch: Well, if we're certain it doesn't break python-logilab-common (the only rdepends of pylint), I'm fine with it.
[11:04] <ajmitch> Hobbsee!
[11:04] <Hobbsee> ajmitch!
[11:05] <ajmitch> soren: which means that python-constraint needs to be checked -it's the only other user of python-logilab-common
[11:06] <soren> ajmitch: Kiko asked for it directly or was he referring to an existing UVFe request?
[11:07] <ajmitch> he asked directly, there was another UVFe request by another LP developer
[11:08] <ajmitch> not sure which came first :)
[11:35] <proppy> trying to use ppaput: It failed when signing with the following error http://paste.ubuntu.com/321/ any hint ?
[11:40] <proppy> will try to use debuild and dput separatly instead
[11:41] <bluekuja_> proppy, hey
[11:41] <bluekuja_> what are you trying to do?
[11:42] <proppy> uploading a package to ppa for revu
[11:42] <proppy> following https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess
[11:42] <Hobbsee> proppy: use debsign *.changes -k<yourkeyid>
[11:42] <Hobbsee> then dput
[11:43] <proppy> ok
[11:43] <Hobbsee> proppy: and/or stick this line in .bashrc.  GPGKEY=7D2BCE85
[11:43] <Hobbsee> with your correct key
[11:43] <proppy> ok
[11:43] <Hobbsee> export DEBEMAIL=hobbsee@ubuntu.com is also useful
[11:43] <proppy> thanks
[11:43] <proppy> ok
[11:43] <Hobbsee> againk with your correct email
[11:43] <Hobbsee> proppy: it's probably looking for the wrong key
[11:43] <proppy> maybe ppaput didn't manage to extract my email from the debian changelog
[11:45] <proppy> DEBEMAIL=proppy@aminche.com ppaput my-ppa -sa did the trick
[11:45] <proppy> thanks :)
[11:46] <dholbach> proppy: I'll add a note to SponsorshipProcess
[11:47] <Hobbsee> proppy: something in there sometimes dies somewhere.
[11:47] <Hobbsee> proppy: i find after sticking those bits into ~/.bashrc, i never have a problem.
[11:47] <proppy> Successfully signed dsc and changes files
[11:47] <proppy> proppy@nekun:~/Desktop/20070920/UploadPokernetworkPackagesToPPA/poker-network-1.2.0$
[11:47] <proppy> do not know if it successfully dput'ed
[11:47] <proppy> (using ppaput)
[11:48] <proppy>                  This PPA does not contain any packages yet.
[11:48] <Hobbsee> did it show all the bits getting uploaded?
[11:48] <dholbach> proppy: it takes a while
[11:48] <Hobbsee> yeah, it takes ~20 minutes to show, iirc
[11:48] <dholbach> proppy: is there a .upload file?
[11:48] <proppy> yep in ../
[11:49] <proppy> thanks :0
[11:49] <proppy> http://paste.ubuntu.com/322/ tsugoi !
[11:50] <dholbach> neat
[11:50] <proppy> thanks, hope It will comment the bug report automagicly :)
[11:50] <proppy> yes !
[11:52] <proppy> is this  launchpad who auto-comment the bug report or ppaput ?
[11:54] <bluekuja_> proppy, is the package on revu already?
[11:55] <proppy> bluekuja_: As it's not a "new" package I thought that  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProces advised to upload it to ppa instead
[11:55] <bluekuja_> proppy, ScottK already told you that, revu is used for NEW and new upstream packages
[11:55] <bluekuja_> at this time
[11:56] <bluekuja_> proppy, so, as I suggested you yesterday, you need to upload the package on revu
[11:56] <bluekuja_> and put the link on the bug report
[11:57] <proppy> sorry but I asked here just before following Sponsorship Process
[11:57] <proppy> (10:35:00 AM) proppy: dholbach: I guess new upstream version is considered as a "new package", so I should get throught REVU/
[11:57] <proppy> (10:35:01 AM) proppy: ?
[11:57] <proppy> (10:35:08 AM) dholbach: proppy: no
[11:57] <proppy> (10:35:19 AM) dholbach: proppy: 'NEW' means 'not in Ubuntu at all'
[11:57] <bluekuja_> dholbach, ?
[11:57] <proppy> Should I do both ?
[11:57] <bluekuja_> proppy, maybe he misunderstood what was your request
[11:57] <dholbach> bluekuja_: it's perfectly fine to use LP for sponsoring bugs
[11:58] <bluekuja_> dholbach, yea, but revu is better to review them if they are new upstream or no?
[11:58] <proppy> sorry for causing internal arguing :(
[11:58] <bluekuja_> dholbach, I saw a lot of new upstream releases on revu atm
[11:58] <dholbach> I think it's pretty much the same
[11:59] <bluekuja_> dholbach, yeah, that's it
[11:59] <dholbach> bluekuja_: if you look at motu-uvf bugs, lots of them were not on REVU
[11:59] <dholbach> proppy: that's fine, don't worry :)
[11:59] <bluekuja_> dholbach, so it's mostly a personal decision :)
[11:59] <dholbach> yeah
[11:59] <bluekuja_> proppy, no internal arguing :)
[12:00] <bluekuja_> proppy, we just talk to exchange our ideas
[12:00] <bluekuja_> :)
[12:00] <proppy> bluekuja_: I guess PPA just sounded hiper to me :)
[12:00] <bluekuja_> dholbach, ok thanks, and sorry for bothering
[12:00] <bluekuja_> :)
[12:00] <dholbach> have a nice day
[12:00] <bluekuja_> you too, daniel ;)
[12:02] <bluekuja_> :)
[12:02] <bluekuja_> proppy, I'm currently checking it
[12:03] <bluekuja_> proppy, do you think changelog desc is ok?
[12:04] <bluekuja_> proppy, it's not properly a merge
[12:04] <bluekuja_> you can just write New upstream release
[12:04] <bluekuja_> with some details about it from upstream website
[12:04] <proppy> Ok, I thought it was a merge cause there is still Ubuntu specific changes to be kept
[12:04] <bluekuja_> proppy, yeah
[12:05] <proppy> In the control files
[12:05] <bluekuja_> proppy, but you should define
[12:05] <bluekuja_> that is a new upstream release
[12:05] <bluekuja_> proppy, mmm wait
[12:05] <bluekuja_> proppy, unstable uploaded that as new upstream release
[12:05] <bluekuja_> so you're correct
[12:05] <proppy> yep
[12:06] <proppy> is this a merge ?
[12:06] <bluekuja_> I thought *you* packaged that for ubuntu
[12:06] <proppy> nop
[12:06] <bluekuja_> ok, that's correct then
[12:06] <proppy> ok
[12:07] <proppy> thanks for taking a look
[12:07] <bluekuja_> proppy, np
[12:07] <bluekuja_> proppy, I'm checking the remaining changes
[12:07] <bluekuja_> atm
[12:08] <bluekuja_> proppy, where did you find those changes?
[12:09] <proppy> oops my upload tagged the bug report as "Fixed released"
[12:09] <proppy> but I guess it's not released yet, only uploaded to ppa
[12:09] <proppy> bluekuja_: synced from the debian package using merge.ubuntu.com
[12:09] <dholbach> proppy: that's a bug in LP, already filed and hopefully soon fixed, please reopen the bug
[12:09] <proppy> http://merges.ubuntu.com/
[12:10] <proppy> ok
[12:10] <bluekuja_> proppy, I dont see any ubuntu entry on the changelog
[12:10] <proppy> dholbach: In Progress?
[12:10] <bluekuja_> proppy, why?
[12:10] <dholbach> proppy: sounds good
[12:11] <proppy> bluekuja_: http://paste.ubuntu.com/324/
[12:11] <bluekuja_> proppy, apart from yours
[12:11] <bluekuja_> :)
[12:11] <proppy> bluekuja_: oh ok
[12:11] <proppy> bluekuja_: I should merge with ubuntu changelog ?
[12:12] <proppy> bluekuja_: instead of overwriting with debian one ?
[12:12] <bluekuja_> proppy, you did a bad merge
[12:12] <bluekuja_> :)
[12:12] <bluekuja_> proppy, changelog need to merged with changes as well
[12:12] <bluekuja_> you dont have to overwrite it
[12:12] <bluekuja_> with debian
[12:12] <bluekuja_> that's why I dont see any ubuntu entry *apart* from yours
[12:12] <proppy> bluekuja_: ok I just took the debian package, and overwrite control with the upstream provided control.gutsy
[12:13] <bluekuja_> proppy, try to use grab_merge.sh file
[12:13] <bluekuja_> please
[12:13] <proppy> bluekuja_: I should do a proper merge of debian/ subdirectory instead
[12:13] <bluekuja_> and work with it
[12:13] <bluekuja_> proppy, grab that file
[12:13] <bluekuja_> then create a dir
[12:13] <proppy> ok
[12:13] <bluekuja_> chmod it
[12:14] <bluekuja_> and use it
[12:14] <bluekuja_> like grab-merge packageonmerges.ubuntu.com
[12:14] <bluekuja_> proppy, I see a conflict in debian/control, you fix it
[12:14] <bluekuja_> and that's all
[12:14] <proppy> Ok
[12:14] <bluekuja_> upload it again
[12:14] <bluekuja_> ;)
[12:14] <proppy> thanks
[12:15] <bluekuja_> I comment the bug out
[12:15] <proppy> should I leave  -- Ubuntu Merge-o-Matic <mom@ubuntu.com>  Wed, 19 Sep 2007 03:00:57 +0100 entry ?
[12:18] <proppy> new package uploading
[12:18] <bluekuja_> proppy, no
[12:18] <bluekuja_> proppy, overwrite it
[12:18] <bluekuja_> with your entry
[12:18] <proppy> Successfully uploaded poker-network_1.2.0-1ubuntu1.dsc to ppa.launchpad.net.
[12:18] <proppy> oups
[12:18] <bluekuja_> :)
[12:24] <ion_> I have two packages that obviously arent going to get to gutsy anymore, but is it sensible to upload them to REVU already for possible inclusion in hardy?
[12:24] <bluekuja_> proppy, link?
[12:25] <bluekuja_> ion_, you can upload to revu and get a review, but it will take some time
[12:25] <bluekuja_> to get them inside
[12:25] <bluekuja_> but you can start
[12:25] <ion_> Yeah
[12:25] <bluekuja_> to work on them
[12:25] <ion_> Thanks
[12:26] <bluekuja_> ion_, we work on some other things atm, so it will be harder to get a review
[12:26] <bluekuja_> that's it
[12:26] <bluekuja_> so need some more patience
[12:26] <proppy> Successfully signed dsc and changes files
[12:26] <proppy> ../poker-network_1.2.0-1ubuntu1_source.changes was not uploaded.
[12:26] <proppy> strange
[12:26] <ion_> Could an admin please resync the REVU uploaders keyring? I joined u-u-contributors.
[12:26] <ion_> bluekuja: Yeah, its obvious the packages arent going to get any time soon, i have no problem with that. :-)
[12:27] <bluekuja_> ion_, perfect, then
[12:27] <bluekuja_> proppy, provide me the link
[12:27] <ion_> s/get/get in/
[12:27] <bluekuja_> to dget them
[12:27] <proppy> ppaput failed to upload
[12:27] <bluekuja_> oh :/
[12:28] <proppy> Should I name it ppa2 ?
[12:28] <bluekuja_> proppy, yeah, anyway I gonna change it
[12:28] <bluekuja_> to a proper version
[12:28] <bluekuja_> to upload on the archive
[12:28] <bluekuja_> ;)
[12:28] <proppy> appending ~ppa1 solved the probleme
[12:29] <proppy> Hope It will overwrite the previous one properly
[12:29] <DarkSun88> Hi all
[12:29] <bluekuja_> heya DarkSun88
[12:29] <DarkSun88> Hi Andrea. :)
[12:29] <bluekuja_> proppy, when done, ping me
[12:29] <bluekuja_> :)
[12:29] <proppy> bluekuja_: uploaded
[12:30] <bluekuja_> proppy, http://ppa.launchpad.net/proppy/ubuntu/pool/main/p/poker-network/poker-network_1.2.0-1ubuntu1~ppa2.dsc?
[12:30] <proppy> ~ppa1 overwritten
[12:30] <bluekuja_> ah k
[12:30] <proppy> not yet it seems
[12:30] <proppy> let me upload a ~ppa2
[12:31] <proppy> it will be less confusing
[12:31] <bluekuja_> better
[12:31] <bluekuja_> ^^
[12:33] <proppy> dget -x http://ppa.launchpad.net/proppy/ubuntu/pool/main/p/poker-network/poker-network_1.2.0-1ubuntu1~ppa1.dsc
[12:33] <proppy> oups sorry
[12:33] <proppy> Successfully uploaded poker-network_1.2.0-1ubuntu1~ppa2_source.changes to ppa.launchpad.net.
[12:33] <proppy> better
[12:35] <bluekuja_> proppy, ok, need to wait a while before
[12:35] <bluekuja_> wget it
[12:35] <proppy> yep
[12:35] <proppy> seems so
[12:35] <bluekuja_> error 404 atm
[12:35] <bluekuja_> ^^
[12:36] <proppy> the bug comment happen earlier that the actual files
[12:37] <bluekuja_> proppy, did you get accepted mail?
[12:37] <proppy> yep
[12:38] <bluekuja_> proppy, you forget to change the maintainer too
[12:38] <bluekuja_> to XSBC
[12:39] <bluekuja_> proppy, gonna do it
[12:39] <proppy> in the control files ?
[12:39] <bluekuja_> yep
[12:39] <bluekuja_> dont worru
[12:39] <proppy> ok
[12:39] <bluekuja_> *worry
[12:39] <proppy> that's because I've overwritten in
[12:39] <proppy> this was the conflicted one
[12:40] <bluekuja_> ppa2
[12:40] <bluekuja_> is still not there
[12:40] <bluekuja_> now yes
[12:40] <proppy> ye
[12:41] <proppy> I just set the bug back to In progress
[12:41] <bluekuja_> ok
[12:44] <bluekuja_> proppy, on B-D you added python-central
[12:44] <bluekuja_> and deleted python-gtk2-dev
[12:44] <bluekuja_> am I right?
[12:46] <proppy> iirc that was still the case in ubuntu2.debdiff
[12:46] <bluekuja_> yup
[12:48] <proppy> bluekuja_: according to debdiff poker-network_1.1.1-1.dsc poker-network_1.1.1-1ubuntu2.dsc I kept ubuntu changes
[12:48] <ion_> Should i use hardy as the distribution for an upload to REVU, since the package isnt going to make it to gutsy?
[12:48] <proppy> I mean I kept this specific changes as the patch to control file was forwarded and commited upstream to control.gutsy
[12:49] <bluekuja_> ion_, I think yes
[12:50] <bluekuja_> proppy, I'm trying to understand changes
[12:51] <proppy> bluekuja_: let me know if I can help
[12:51] <proppy> I've commited 2 patch to ubuntu1 and ubuntu2 versions
[12:51] <proppy> of package 1.1.1-1
[12:52] <proppy> which where merge merged upstream in 1.2.0-1
[12:52] <proppy> norsetto also provided fixes to control.gutsy
[12:52] <bluekuja_> proppy, I see  python-central in current ubuntu
[12:52] <bluekuja_> proppy, got deleted python-gtk2-dev, libjson-perl
[12:52] <bluekuja_> from debian
[12:53] <proppy> bluekuja_: in b-d ?
[12:53] <bluekuja_> proppy, yep
[12:53] <proppy> bluekuja_: python-central was in ubuntu2 as well
[12:53] <proppy> python-gtk2-dev deleted in ubuntu2 as well
[12:54] <proppy> libjson-perl new in 1.2.0-1
[12:54] <proppy> and need by poker-web test suites according to upstream
[12:55] <proppy> +ed
[12:56] <bluekuja_> proppy, libjson
[12:56] <bluekuja_> has been added now?
[12:56] <bluekuja_> I dont see it in 1ubuntu2
[12:56] <bluekuja_> so has been added in debian?
[12:56] <bluekuja_> or by you?
[12:57] <siretart> wow. the new devscripts package in debian rocks!
[12:57] <bluekuja_> siretart, :D
[12:57] <bluekuja_> siretart, a guy was asking for revu keyring reload
[12:58] <siretart> uh?
[12:58] <proppy> bluekuja_: added in debian with 1.2.0-1 cause some new test suites depend on it
[12:58] <bluekuja_> siretart, <ion_> Could an admin please resync the REVU uploaders keyring? I joined u-u-contributors.
[12:58] <bluekuja_> proppy, ok
[12:58] <bluekuja_> proppy, B-D looks fine now
[12:58] <bluekuja_> proppy, lets move to depends
[12:58] <siretart> bluekuja_: you can do that yourself now
[12:59] <bluekuja_> siretart, ah yeah, you're right, where is that script placed?
[12:59] <bluekuja_> or what's the name
[12:59] <siretart> bluekuja_: sudo -u revu1 /srv/revu-production/bin/revu-key update
[01:00] <bluekuja_> siretart, thanks
[01:00] <bluekuja_> let me do it
[01:03] <bluekuja_> proppy, what was changed in depends?
[01:07] <proppy> from the debdiff I see libjson-perl added to python-poker-network
[01:07] <proppy> dependencies
[01:07] <ion_> bluekuja: Should i be able to upload now?
[01:07] <bluekuja_> ion_, I'm updating right now
[01:08] <proppy> bluekuja_: ttf-freefont added (but that was also the case in ubuntu2)
[01:08] <proppy> oups no
[01:08] <proppy> ttf-freefont was not in ubuntu2
[01:08] <proppy> but was forwarded upstream by norsetto IIRC
[01:08] <bluekuja_> ok
[01:08] <bluekuja_> going for lunch
[01:09] <bluekuja_> ion_, gonna ping you when done
[01:09] <ion_> bluekuja: Thanks
[01:09] <proppy> in bug #137573
[01:09] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 137573 in poker-network "poker2d crash (SIGSEGV) at startup" [Medium,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/137573
[01:17] <bluekuja_> siretart, mv: overwrite `/srv/revu-production/uploaders.gpg', overriding mode 0664? chgrp: changing group of `/srv/revu-production/uploaders.gpg': Operation not permitted
[01:17] <bluekuja_> chmod: changing permissions of `/srv/revu-production/uploaders.gpg': Operation not permitted
[01:19] <proppy> bluekuja_: going to lunch, brb in nearly 1 hour
[01:19] <bluekuja_> proppy, I dont know if I'll be here
[01:19] <bluekuja_> maybe this evening
[01:19] <bluekuja_> late evening
[01:20] <bluekuja_> proppy, you can assign it to me
[01:20] <siretart> bluekuja_: uh?
[01:20] <proppy> bluekuja_: let's continue the REVU asynchronly on the bug report ?
[01:20] <Hobbsee> bluekuja_: damn.
[01:20] <Hobbsee> bluekuja_: where'd you see that?
[01:20] <bluekuja_> Hobbsee, after updating keys
[01:20] <Hobbsee> bluekuja_: oh right, so you're in revu1 now
[01:21] <bluekuja_> siretart, I got that at the end of the update
[01:21] <proppy> bluekuja_: assign or suscribe ?
[01:21] <bluekuja_> proppy, assign
[01:21] <bluekuja_> Hobbsee, yup
[01:21] <Hobbsee> bluekuja_: er, were you running that as sudo -u revu1 -H ...<etc>?
[01:21] <bluekuja_> Hobbsee, <siretart> bluekuja_: sudo -u revu1 /srv/revu-production/bin/revu-key update
[01:21] <Hobbsee> right
[01:21] <proppy> bluekuja_: and de-assign ScottK ?
[01:21] <Hobbsee> bluekuja_: fix it, then :)
[01:22] <bluekuja_> proppy, I dont know if ScottK wanted to take care of it, maybe you can ask him
[01:22] <bluekuja_> and if ok assign me
[01:22] <bluekuja_> Hobbsee, how? :)
[01:22] <proppy> bluekuja_: ok
[01:22] <Hobbsee> bluekuja_: no idea, but you have access to the code :0
[01:22] <proppy> bluekuja_: let's eat I will take care about this this afternoon
[01:22] <siretart> bluekuja_: for some reason, the keyring was owned by www-data. I changed that now to 'revu1', so it should work again
[01:22] <bluekuja_> Hobbsee, :D
[01:22] <Hobbsee> siretart: why would it have been?
[01:22] <proppy> bluekuja_: thanks a lot for feedback and fixes :)
[01:23] <bluekuja_> proppy, np and keep doing this good work
[01:23] <siretart> Hobbsee: no idea right now. we need to investiage that
[01:23] <bluekuja_> ;)
[01:23] <bluekuja_> siretart, updating again
[01:34] <bluekuja_> siretart, Hobbsee : works fine now
[01:34] <bluekuja_> ion_, updated
[01:34] <siretart> cool
[01:34] <bluekuja_> ion_, you can try to upload it then ;)
[01:34] <bluekuja_> siretart, nice fix :D
[01:34] <ion_> bluekuja: Thanks!
[01:35] <bluekuja_> ion_, let me know if something get wrong
[01:35] <\sh> moins
[01:36] <bluekuja_> heya \sh
[01:37] <\sh> guys, I justinstalled a clean gutsy with latest updates...and somehow the shadow from the panel disappeard (compiz-fusion)...it's just a white square...the same with the menus and some dialog boxes...normal windows are ok
[01:38] <ScottK> bluekuja_: If you want to do poker-network, that's fine.  Just please make sure it will install correctly on a system that's never had myssql (client or server) on it.
[01:38] <ScottK> \sh: I'm thinking we REALLY ought to upload WINE before the beta.  Comments on the newest version on REVU?
[01:39] <siretart> bluekuja_: what fix? I only did a chown
[01:39] <ScottK> bluekuja_: Just assign yourself the bug if you want it.
[01:39] <bluekuja_> ScottK, no well, it's assigned to you, so don't worry
[01:39] <bluekuja_> siretart, yeah :)
[01:39] <\sh> ScottK: I'll check this evening...
[01:40] <bluekuja_> ScottK, I just helped proppy a bit
[01:40] <bluekuja_> ScottK, for doing the merge in a proper way
[01:41] <bluekuja_> ScottK, he uploaded a new package, you should check it et all
[01:42] <bluekuja_> I'm leaving now, cya later
[01:43] <zul> morning
[01:43] <dholbach> hey zul
[01:45] <zul> hi dholbach how are you?
[01:45] <geser> Hi zul
[01:45] <Q-FUNK> sumerian demi-god spotted.
[01:45] <zul> uh ok
[01:45] <zul> hi geser
[01:46] <ScottK> propeat: Process wise what you had in the UVFe was fine (debdiff from the Debian version you want to merge).  That debdiff did have some issues (debian/changelog and needs maintainer changed to MOTU to start), but I'd prefer the traditional approach of a debdiff in the bug.  Please ping me when you've attached it.
[01:47] <dholbach> zul: ok, still ill - how are you?
[01:47] <zul> good still trying to wake up
[01:48] <ScottK> First cup of coffee and all that....
[01:48] <zul> coke works for me
[01:48] <zul> usually
[01:48] <ScottK> That's what I used to use.
[01:48] <ScottK> 5 years in the Navy and I graduated to coffee.
[01:49] <zul> meh i was surrounded by coffee fields growing up dont like the taste either
[01:49] <ScottK> It's an acquired taste.
[01:50] <ScottK> Q-FUNK: Please don't.
[01:50] <Q-FUNK> :)
[01:52] <zul> dholbach: if you are ill then why are you here ;)
[01:52] <Hobbsee> zul: insanity.
[01:53] <zul> Hobbsee: works for me
[01:53] <dholbach> tell me the last time you stayed in bed the whole day :)
[01:53] <zul> uh pre-baby or post-baby?
[02:07] <ion_> My packages showed up at REVU, but http://revu.tauware.de/lostpw.py?email=debian@johan.kiviniemi.name doesnt seem to work. My key should have an elgamal subkey.
[02:15] <Hobbsee> ion_: use the primary address in LP
[02:16] <ion_> No REVU account for launchpad.net@johan.kiviniemi.name exists yet.
[02:19] <Hobbsee> ion_: what was the email in the changelog that you uploaded?
[02:19] <ion_> debian@johan.kiviniemi.name
[02:20] <Hobbsee> ion_: interesting.  there's a p/w set for it
[02:21] <Hobbsee> ion_: so it just hates you
[02:21] <ion_> Heh
[02:21] <StevenK> Or you've forgotten it. :-P
[02:22] <ion_> Theres nothing to forget, im trying to get to see my password for the first time. :-)
[02:22] <StevenK> Maybe the password is "Haha, fooled you"
[02:23] <Hobbsee> no, it's "Hobbsee Rules All"
[02:23] <Hobbsee> duh.
[02:23] <ion_> :-)
[02:30] <propeat> ScottK: ping
[02:31] <ScottK> Pong
[02:31] <proppy> ScottK: you want me to generate a debdiff from between the debian and my ppa package ?
[02:32] <ScottK> proppy: I want you to generate a debdiff between the Debian package and what you wanted uploaded.  If that's to what's in your PPA, that's a pleasant coincidence.
[02:32] <proppy> ScottK: what I want uploaded is what is in my ppa
[02:32] <proppy> ScottK: dholbach told me to follow bluekuja_
[02:32] <proppy> ScottK: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess
[02:33] <proppy> s/bluekuja_/SponsoringProcess
[02:33] <proppy> I guess I can easily generate a debdiff between debian and the package I just generated
[02:34] <ScottK> dholbach: When did we agree that PPA was part of the merge sponsoring workflow?
[02:34] <proppy> Just wanted you to know there were packages on ppa that I thought will be reviewed before upload consideration
[02:35] <ScottK> proppy: I've yet to look at anything in a PPA and it'll probably stay that way for a while.
[02:35] <ScottK> BTW, PPA is the alternative way to do it.  The proper process is debdiff in a bug.
[02:35] <proppy> Ok let me upload it
[02:36] <proppy> let me remove the ~ppa2 from debian changelog
[02:37] <ScottK> Can we PLEASE have a moratorium on random undiscussed process churn.
[02:37] <ScottK> dholbach: ^^^
[02:37] <jdong> ScottK: would it be a bad idea to do this stuff through PPA's? You get free reliable buildtests out of it...
[02:38] <ScottK> jdong: I just want us to quit churning the process without discussion.
[02:38] <jdong> ok
[02:38] <ScottK> Personally, I find the PPA ToS unacceptable, but that doesn't stop other people from doing it.
[02:38] <jdong> oh? what's notable in the ToS?
[02:39] <TheMuso> IMO using PPA is annoying, as you would have to adjust the version number of the package, and it doesn't feel right to me.
[02:39] <ScottK> I'm not comfortable with the bit that says that even if I upload perfectly FOSS stuff, if Canoncial gets sued, I have to pay their legal bills.
[02:39] <ScottK> TheMuso: That too.
[02:39] <jdong> mmm
[02:39] <jdong> I suppose that's an indirect reference to uploading things like libdvdcss?
[02:40] <ScottK> jdong: It doesn't matter.  They get sued, you are liable.  Doesn't matter how rediculous the lawsuit is.
[02:40] <jdong> no I agree with that
[02:40] <ScottK> I think we had a perfectly reasonable merge sponsorship workflow.
[02:41] <ScottK> PPA is nice, but now people read the wiki and think PPA is the way to do it.
[02:41] <proppy> sorry for triggering internal process mahiem
[02:41] <ScottK> I know it says otherwise, but there is a lot more text about how to do a merge with PPA than there is about a debdiff.
[02:41] <ScottK> proppy: Not your fault.
[02:42] <TheMuso> I would have thought debdiffswould actually be easier.
[02:42] <TheMuso> Theres more screwing around with PPA.
[02:42] <ScottK> Agreed.
[02:42] <ScottK> I would want a debdiff an any case so I can easily see what is being changed from Debian.
[02:42] <proppy> ScottK: btw the package I uploaded to ppa were bad
[02:42] <ScottK> OK.
[02:43] <proppy> ScottK: there is remaining upstream commit debian/patches
[02:43] <ScottK> Let me know when you have something worth reviewing.
[02:43] <proppy> ScottK: should I let the patches directory empty or remove it ?
[02:43] <ScottK> Leave it.
[02:44] <ScottK> Since you've got the patching system there, it'll be that much easier if an SRU is needed.
[02:45] <ScottK> jdong: My major beef on process changes is this mess with trying to track packaging status in LP (beyond needs-packaging - in progress - fix released).  We are now doing everything multiple places, in multiple ways, and it's impossible.
[02:45] <Hobbsee> ScottK: really?
[02:46] <StevenK> ScottK: Why?
[02:46] <TheMuso> ScottK: Noooo! You are a great contributer!
[02:46] <StevenK> And what TheMuso said.
[02:46] <ScottK> 1.  Random process changes that are then "the way it's done and can't be changed".
[02:46] <StevenK> "No PC RTC found" Well done kernel, you figured out the machine isn't x86
[02:47] <ScottK> 2.  Wasting time trying to actually manage Universe development towards something working and then just getting ignored when it's at all incovenient.
[02:48] <ScottK> 3.  Tools/processes getting further and futher from Debian so it's less and less convenient to work in both.
[02:48] <StevenK> I work on both. Fairly easily too,.
[02:48] <StevenK> s/,//
[02:49] <ScottK> StevenK: That's true today, but the clear trend is to LPize everthing and so that can't continue.
[02:49] <broonie> StevenK: Lots of things use the same I/O controllers that PCs use.
[02:49] <StevenK> broonie: Shush :-)
[02:50] <ScottK> BTW, quitting doesn't, in my mind, mean disappearing.  It just means being more focused on stuff I actually care about and less on the distro as a whole.
[02:51] <ScottK> That would be ~90% reduction though.
[02:51] <ScottK> 4.  More care given about the feelings of random idiots than actually getting work done.
[02:51] <ScottK> How could I forget that one.
[02:53] <proppy> ScottK: bug #140915 updated with debdiff
[02:53] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 140915 in poker-network "Please merge poker-network (1.2.0-1) from debian unstable main" [Wishlist,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/140915
[02:53] <ScottK> proppy: Thanks.  I'll have a look shortly.
[02:54] <ion_> Should i request someone to review my packages in REVU or just wait for someone to take interest in them?
[02:56] <Hobbsee> ScottK: the feelings of which random idiots?
[02:56] <Hobbsee> ion_: request - people arent looking at REVU.
[02:57] <ion_> hobbsee: On this channel? On a mailing list?
[02:57] <Hobbsee> ion_: either.  this channel tends to work reasonably well
[02:57] <ScottK> Hobbsee: The one (in particular) I'm thinking of I already violated the CoC once over and I won't do it again by naming him.
[02:57] <ion_> Ok. I uploaded http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=271 and http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=272
[02:58] <ion_> No hurry with reviewing them, since they arent going to get into Ubuntu until hardy.
[02:59] <proppy> ScottK: I've to move to another place, brb
[02:59] <ScottK> OK.
[02:59] <Hobbsee> ScottK: ah yes, right.
[03:18] <Kopfgeldjaeger> hi
[04:20] <proppy> ScottK: back
[04:20] <ScottK> Hi.
[04:20] <ScottK> It's building now.
[04:21] <proppy> ScottK: k thanks
[04:21] <ScottK> The only thing I noticed is you left out changing the Maintainer to MOTU.  I added that.
[04:22] <superm1_> how do people get away with local test builds without even changing the maintainer to something with @ubuntu.com?  Doesn't debuild complain?
[04:22] <ScottK> proppy: Once I update my system, I'll test it and upload it if it's good.
[04:22] <ScottK> superm1: It warns, but no longer fails as it once did.
[04:22] <superm1> ah i see
[04:26] <proppy> ScottK: thanks sorry for the Maintainer thing I'm not really used to
[04:26] <ScottK> Not a big deal.
[04:26] <ScottK> Just remember it for next time.
[04:27] <ScottK> Of course there is a new kernel, new OOO, and new kdebase today, so the update is taking a bit....
[04:28] <Hobbsee> ScottK: new kdebase today?  which one is that?
[04:28] <ScottK> Hobbsee: ubuntu23
[04:29] <Hobbsee> ScottK: dont bother downloading it, wev'e got another one asap
[04:29] <ScottK> Already done.  Is it broken or just incomplete?
[04:29] <Hobbsee> ScottK: no, it works
[04:29] <Hobbsee> it just doesnt contain teh security fix
[04:29] <ScottK> Hobbsee: Cool.
[04:29] <ScottK> OK.
[04:30] <dholbach> ScottK: I did not say that "this is the de-facto way to do it", so please calm down.
[04:31] <ScottK> dholbach: Don't worry.  Odds are I won't be bothering you about it.
[04:31] <dholbach> ScottK: What do you mean?
[04:31] <dholbach> ScottK: if you read http://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess you will note that I point it out as an alternative method
[04:32] <ScottK> Right.  And it should not be.
[04:32] <ScottK> The defacto bit was about trying to status track packaging progress in two places.
[04:33] <ScottK> We've argued it plenty before.
[04:33] <dholbach> What do you mean in proppy's case?
[04:34] <ScottK> No, in general.
[04:34] <dholbach> I don't understand what you're complaining about rightnow
[04:34] <ScottK> I've got a list.
[04:35] <ScottK> Basically, it is my impression, that you have been unilterally altering the MOTU workflow without any consensus from the people in the community.
[04:35] <dholbach> How?
[04:35] <dholbach> By writing ppaput?
[04:35] <ScottK> Similarly, I feel that motu-uvf is pretty pointless.
[04:35] <dholbach> I think you're exaggerating - the team has been doing absolutely great work and you know that
[04:36] <ScottK> Where was the discussion where anyone agreed that using PPA for a merge was an acceptable alternative to our normal workflow?
[04:36] <dholbach> people have been uploading packages to all kinds of places
[04:36] <ScottK> Not for sponsored merges
[04:36] <dholbach> having them auto-built and downloadable in launchpad is a good thing
[04:37] <dholbach> Why do you think motu-uvf is pointless?
[04:37] <Hobbsee> ScottK: dholbach != mdz, nor the archive team.
[04:37] <ScottK> Hobbsee: Agreed.
[04:37] <dholbach> You've been tracking lots and lots of release upgrades and verified lots of bits - that's very valuable work
[04:37] <Hobbsee> i think blaming dholbach is unhelpful, because it's not his fault.
[04:38] <ScottK> Hobbsee: I'm not blaming dholbach for that.
[04:38] <Hobbsee> dholbach: it's only any use if everyone follows it.
[04:39] <dholbach> Are you looking for a clause somewhere in the docs saying "the TB or the release managers can override decisions" or what is your goal?
[04:39] <Hobbsee> ask ScottK
[04:40] <dholbach> I still think that the motu-uvf team is not pointless and I'm grateful that you guys do that work and I'm sure that everybody agrees on that.
[04:40] <ScottK> dholbach: If there is a solid reason, I don't mind, but unless there is a rush, I think we should be consulted.
[04:41] <ScottK> As an example, rather than mdz writing bugmail to go ahead and upload a package, I think it would have been more courteous for him to suggest to motu-uvf in the bugmail that he thought it would be a good package to uplaod.
[04:41] <dholbach> Right
[04:41] <ScottK> There is still a secret list of UME related packages that do not require a UVFe.
[04:43] <Hobbsee> i gave you teh list, via irc.
[04:43] <ScottK> Hobbsee: Was that the complete list?
[04:44] <ScottK> proppy: Uploaded.  Thank you for contributing.
[04:44] <Hobbsee> afaik, pretty much.  but i dont work on mobile.
[04:44] <ScottK> Right.  Me neither.
[04:44] <Hobbsee> now that you know as much as i do, you could, of cousre, document it.
[04:45] <ScottK> I'm not looking for you to document it.
[04:45] <Hobbsee> so you're ranting because a person in this channel hasnt documented it.
[04:45] <Hobbsee> how helpful.
[04:45] <Hobbsee> sorry, a person NOT in this hcannel.
[04:45] <proppy> ScottK: thanks for reviewing it so fast
[04:45] <ScottK> It's a symptom of what is in my opinion a broader issue.
[04:45] <ScottK> proppy: You're welcome.
[04:46] <ScottK> Additionally, as that list covered both Main and Universe (IIRC) it's not my place to document it.
[04:47] <zul> *grumble* *grumble*
[04:47] <bddebian> Heya gang
[04:47] <Hobbsee> ScottK: you can do the universe side, though.
[04:47] <Hobbsee> the problem with marking it as SEP, is that someone else then should do it - and may or may not do it in your timezone.
[04:48] <Hobbsee> s/timezone/timeframe/
[04:50] <ScottK> Sure, but as you may have noticed my motivation level is a little low just now.
[04:50] <ScottK> One of the risks of relying on volunteers.
[04:50] <Hobbsee> ScottK: what concerns me - if you whine about something that hasnt been done by a person who isnt in this channel - all your'e doing is ranting pointlessly - you may as well rant at your wall, for the good it does.
[04:50] <ScottK> dholbach: Asked me to explain.  I'm explaining.
[04:51] <Hobbsee> and you may well be dropping the rationale of other people, in the process - or certainly not being conductive.
[04:51] <Hobbsee> i was referring to the mentions over the past few days about the UME stuff.
[04:52] <ScottK> As far as that goes, Mithrandir was in the channel when we discussed it and I made my views known then.
[04:52] <Hobbsee> true - and so the point in repeating them when he's not here is....
[04:53] <ScottK> Mostly answering questions about why I'm so disgruntled.
[04:53] <ScottK> I don't expect it to change.
[04:54] <dholbach> But you must admit that "motu-uvf is pointless" is a bit much.
[04:54] <ScottK> Sure.
[04:55] <rexbron> what is standard operating procidure for upstreams that ship lots of (3rd-party) libs with their code?
[04:55] <dholbach> If stricter rules is what you want and it really bothers you to not have them, we should discuss that somewhere, maybe on a list where people have time to think about what they write and it reaches more than a few people on IRC.
[04:55] <dholbach> rexbron: we try to rip those things out and have those parts packaged properly.
[04:56] <ScottK> dholbach: It's not that I want stricter rules, it's that I want some consensus on process change.
[04:56] <rexbron> dholbach: Including modifying configure/make files so they look in the right place?
[04:56] <ScottK> I think a lot of the recent process churn has been confusing for MOTUs and hopefuls alike and have made things more complex to little point.
[04:57] <rexbron> dholbach: I will email upstream and see what they have to say on the matter
[04:57] <dholbach> rexbron: that's great, if they can add a ./configure option where we can specify our own location for those parts, that'd be nice
[04:57] <dholbach> ScottK: PPA was introduced, it has benefits, people want to use it
[04:58] <ScottK> dholbach: OK, but then there should be some discussion about how.
[04:58] <dholbach> ScottK: always when we had new opportunities we tried to use them
[04:58] <ScottK> Sure, but let's talk about it.
[04:58] <dholbach> ScottK: so people tried using bzr for their packaging
[04:58] <dholbach> ScottK: you have to try things out to see if they're worth pursuing
[04:58] <ScottK> Agreed.
[04:58] <dholbach> ScottK: I did not say 'PPA is the way to go, shut down REVU'
[04:58] <dholbach> and that makes a huge difference to me
[04:59] <dholbach> so I don't understand why you let it bother you that much
[04:59] <ScottK> For merges, I would still want a debdiff and to build it myself, so I find the use of PPA a potentially interesting addition, but not a substitute for the current process.
[05:00] <dholbach> Right, I see your usecase
[05:00] <dholbach> and I have debdiffs on my todo list
[05:00] <dholbach> but as far as I can see that's not a reason to be angry like that
[05:00] <ScottK> For REVU, during Feisty one could work in REVU on new packages and it was fine.  Now one has a bunch of extra (in my opinion pointless) LP book keeping to do.  It's not a help.
[05:00] <StevenK> But PPA also means that people can build on amd64 and correct issues before they bug people to look at it.
[05:01] <ScottK> Agreed.  That's why I say a useful adjunct to existing process.  Not an alternative.
[05:01] <StevenK> (Since many people don't have amd64/don't run a long mode processor in it)
[05:01] <dholbach> ScottK: we have people who like it, who are used to bug lists and we have loads of needs-packaging bugs anyway
[05:01] <dholbach> if you don't want to touch them that's your decision - I'm not saying the current situation is perfect
[05:02] <dholbach> but I feel we must try things to find the best alternative and improve things
[05:02] <StevenK> ScottK: So someone says the package is on my PPA, and you say "Okay, come back with a debdiff, and I'll glance at the build logs on the PPA.", surely?
[05:02] <dholbach> seb128 for example never wanted to do things on REVU, because he didn't want to bother to sign up for yet another page
[05:02] <ScottK> Except it's not my decision when stuff gets uploaded based on the LP status and not because of what's in REVU.
[05:02] <dholbach> and I know other people who thought exactly the wrong way
[05:02] <dholbach> ScottK: what do you mean?
[05:03] <ScottK> StevenK: Sure, but that's not what dholbach's alternative process says.
[05:03] <ScottK> dholbach: We are currently trying to status progress of packaging in two places.  That is bad.  We've discussed this before.
[05:03] <StevenK> ScottK: I'm guessing dholbach's alternative process is not set in stone, and open to discussion.
[05:03] <geser> Hi bddebian
[05:04] <ScottK> StevenK: That's not what the wiki page says.
[05:04] <ScottK> It just says here is an alternate process.
[05:04] <dholbach> StevenK: absolutely
[05:04] <StevenK> dholbach: Mind confirming?
[05:04] <ScottK> Nothing about expermental.
[05:04] <StevenK> Just because it's open to discussion doesn't make it experimental
[05:04] <ScottK> And contributors are now confused.
[05:04] <bddebian> Heya geser, thx :-)
[05:05] <StevenK> dholbach: Okay, would you mind putting a note at the top of the wiki page saying that this is a proposed new process, and is subject to change, and open to discussion on the IRC channel or mailing list?
[05:05] <StevenK> ScottK: ^
[05:05] <ScottK> So currently if you read that page, provision of a debdiff is optional.  I don't agree with that.
[05:05] <dholbach> ScottK: if you would have said it like that before, everything would have been fine
[05:06] <dholbach> I'm happy to make that change
[05:06] <ScottK> dholbach: But the whole point is that you launched this entire process with no discussion first.
[05:06] <ScottK> We should be discussing this before, not after.
[05:06] <dholbach> ScottK: I wrote a script and asked people to test it
[05:07] <dholbach> ScottK: nobody bothered to reply, a few people tested it and told me that it worked for them, I added it as an alternative
[05:07] <dholbach> (to reply on the mailing list)
[05:08] <ScottK> Maybe I missed it, but I don't recall anything about "and we are going to use this as an alternative to the current merge process" in the mails.
[05:08] <dholbach> the tool is not about merging ... yet
[05:08] <ScottK> That's not what the wiki page says.
[05:08] <dholbach> it's about uploading things for sponsorship
[05:16] <sladen> nb. contributions happen when the barrier to entry is lowered
[05:18] <geser> but you have to look out that you don't increase the steps for the sponsors to much else nobody will sponsor
[05:21] <sladen> geser: I think that /was/ my point :)
[05:21] <ScottK> dholbach: One risk associated with the PPA approach is people forget to change the version before uploading.  Somewhere in the process there ought to be a check to stop that (maybe soyuz could auto-reject ppa revisions to non-ppa pockets).
[05:22] <dholbach> ScottK: yeah, I noticed that too
[05:22] <dholbach> ScottK: there are still some things to figure out there
[05:23] <ScottK> I'd urge you to work with the archive admins to get something in place for that before we have a problem.
[05:23] <ScottK> Also, speaking of archive admins ... I uploaded DKMS last night.  I know BenC was anxious for it to get in, so you might want to prod them on new.
[05:24] <dholbach> ScottK: right
[05:24] <dholbach> it's something we need to work on together
[05:24] <dholbach> be it a patch to devscripts or dput
[05:24] <dholbach> or bugs on soyuz
[05:24] <StevenK> Or both
[05:24] <dholbach> yeah
[05:26] <proppy> From my early contributor point of view, I get a different process for doing the same thing from each different person I talked, PPA vs REVU vs debdiff, I don't mind there is different way to do it, I guess I just have to stick to the way preferred by the person who watch my changes
[05:26] <proppy> for what it worths
[05:27] <sladen> ScottK: of PPA could enforce that if a package is already in $some main archive, the ppa name must be  foobar-1.2usernameN
[05:27] <dholbach> TheMuso: thanks a lot for the MOTU Meeting reminder
[05:28] <ScottK> sladen: No, because we want a ppa unique name for stuff in the ppa.
[05:28] <ScottK> Don't want to confuse real versioning in the archive.
[05:29] <proppy> I found the process of each steps (Merge, Sync, UVFe, Sponsoring) well documented, I only miss the glue between each steps
[05:29] <dholbach> maybe we should put this on the agenda for the next PPA IRC session
[05:29] <dholbach> or discuss on launchpad-users@
[05:29] <dholbach> as there seems to be still some things to discuss
[05:29] <ScottK> dholbach: Which?
[05:30] <dholbach> ScottK: I know that copying from one pocket to the other is a feature request for soyuz - a workflow that'd work nicely with that would be great
[05:30] <dholbach> ScottK: there's still something to discuss about that
[05:31] <ScottK> dholbach: None of those forums you mentioned are MOTU forums.
[05:31] <dholbach> ScottK: PPA concerns much more people than just MOTUs
[05:31] <ScottK> This would be a symptom of my concerns
[05:31] <dholbach> ?
[05:31] <proppy> Is there some document/wiki page that highlight these process from a bigger point a view ?
[05:31] <ScottK> dholbach: That's true, but we are discussing MOTU workflow here (mostly) and you want to discuss it on LP users.
[05:32] <proppy> i.e: how these steps are related together in time and space, instead of linking them from one page to another ?
[05:32] <dholbach> ScottK: yeah, because it concerns much more people and the more people can weigh in their opinions in discussion with launchpad developers the better the service is going to be
[05:33] <dholbach> we need to help them understand what would help us
[05:33] <ScottK> So now if I want to be involved in MOTU process discussions I need to subscribe LP-users?
[05:34] <dholbach> ScottK: that's not what I'm saying
[05:34] <ScottK> OK
[05:34] <ScottK> So far I've expressed a bunch of concern about MOTU process and workflow and you want to go discuss it in other places.
[05:35] <dholbach> I said: there are LP features planned or marked as wishlist, so in a planning phase; if we can make LP people (and other users) see, what would help us, it will be beneficial for the discussion
[05:35] <ScottK> That's how it sounds
[05:35] <ScottK> I agree with that, but when do we discuss how we (as MOTU) want stuff to work?
[05:36] <dholbach> we can start off the discussion on both lists if you like
[05:36] <dholbach> Please don't make me the bad guy who alters processes behind your back
[05:36] <ScottK> The thing is, I'm not subscribed to LP users.
[05:36] <dholbach> that's really not what I'm trying to do
[05:36] <ScottK> I accept that it's not what you are trying to do.
[05:37] <ScottK> It is how it appears to me.
[05:37] <dholbach> if you want to have a discussion on ubuntu-motu or on a wiki page before we ask on launchpad-users, that's fine too
[05:38] <dholbach> I'm not trying to stop anybody from doing that
[05:38] <ScottK> I've added an agenda item loosely about merge workflow on tomorrow's MOTU meeting agenda.
[05:39] <dholbach> maybe we should make it more specific
[05:39] <ScottK> Feel free to edit.
[05:40] <dholbach> it's your item, I wouldn't want to guess it the wrong way
[05:41] <ScottK> I think that building a proposed revision in a PPA is useful, but that the canonical source to be used for the merge still needs to be the debian repository source + debdiff.
[05:41] <dholbach> I just felt that having one about "how to deal with ppa changelog entries, etc" and one about "the merge process" would be  better
[05:41] <hendrixski> oh bugger... you guys see the new article on slashdot :-( paning the direction gutsy is taking  :-(
[05:41] <Kopfgeldjaeger> is there an elegant way of blacklisting a kernel module? not something like sed etc.
[05:45] <ScottK> hendrixski: Anyone who says "KDE users will have to settle for version 3.5.7." really doesn't know much IMO.  KDE 4 is no where near ready for production use.
[05:46] <ScottK> dholbach: The PPA issue mirrors my concerns, in some respects, about using a vcs.  You have to have one canonical source for the software.  For merging, I think it has to be Debian + debdiff.  Anything else is an intersting adunct.
[05:47] <ScottK> So PPA changelogs never actually enter into it.
[05:47] <hendrixski> ScottK, :-( he does raise a few points about just ease of use... but you're right... he doesn't know the details with which to divine the future of Ubuntu
[05:47] <dholbach> ScottK: that's something we need to point out somewhere out of #ubuntu-motu
[06:00] <huats> ScottK: Hi
[06:00] <ScottK> Hello huats
[06:01] <ScottK> dholbach: All I can solve it MOTU.  The rest is up to others.
[06:01] <huats> ScottK: since you had a close look at bug #108742 can you give me your opinion at bug #108746 ?
[06:01] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 108742 in acidrip "no icon in kde menu" [Wishlist,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/108742
[06:01] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 108746 in efax-gtk "no icon in kde menu" [Wishlist,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/108746
[06:01] <huats> ScottK: they are quite close.....
[06:02] <dholbach> ScottK: that's not true; you can share your views and experience with others
[06:02] <ScottK> dholbach: Agreed, but as a volunteer I have limited time to expend on Ubuntu.  I have to choose how to focus it best.
[06:02] <dholbach> ScottK: nobody is asking you to implement something in soyuz :-)
[06:03] <ScottK> Sure.
[06:03] <ScottK> My focus though is on making the MOTU workflow work.
[06:03] <dholbach> right, but if you can ask others to implement something to help with your workflow...
[06:03] <huats> ScottK: I was wondering it the better solution would be to include the icon currently used by efax-gtk, inside the efax-gtk package itself... instead of depending on a big gnome package.... The other pb is that this icon is only 24x24....
[06:04] <ScottK> huats: I'm really not an icon expert.
[06:04] <ScottK> I'd say ask in #kubuntu-devel what the general policy is on this.
[06:04] <huats> ScottK: no but you are a Kubuntu oriented MOTU :-)
[06:05] <ScottK> Yes, but I'm more of a server developer and a Kubuntu user/tester.
[06:05] <huats> to be honnest I have already asked once, but I got no answer at all
[06:05] <huats> ScottK: ok, I'll try another shot at #kubuntu-devel then... thanks anyway
[06:06] <ScottK> Hobbsee: Can you help huats get an anwser to his question ^^^^
[06:06] <Hobbsee> no
[06:06] <ScottK> OK
[06:06] <Hobbsee> (because i can never remember)
[06:06] <huats> Hobbsee: ok
[06:07] <huats> I'll ask the same question on kubuntu-devel
[06:10] <huats> thanks anyway for your help (you are always very helpful, you have the right of a one time failure ;-))
[06:26] <pochu> What is "$@" for when passed to python?
[06:26] <pochu> e.g. python -OO /usr/lib/listen/listen.py "$@"
[06:27] <POX_> pochu: man bash
[06:27] <pochu> nice to see you here :-)
[06:27] <POX_> (all parameters)
[06:28] <POX_> in Debian, you cen remove -OO
[06:28] <POX_> s/Debian/Ubuntu, whatever
[06:28] <pochu> is -OO passed by default?
[06:29] <POX_> if you have pyc files, pyo are not needed
[07:06] <Nafallo> could someone good with licensing look at http://kent.dl.sourceforge.net/sourceforge/irrpt/irrpt-1.26.tar.gz please? :-)
[07:07] <Nafallo> I would think it's allowed.
[07:07] <ScottK> Hobbsee: I documented the discussion on motu ml.
[07:08] <ScottK> Nafallo: Why woulnd't it be?
[07:09] <Hobbsee> ScottK: great!
[07:12] <Nafallo> ScottK: hm. I'm not just sure AS-IS is a valid license? :-)
[07:12] <ScottK> Ah.
[07:12] <ScottK> That's not a problem.
[07:12] <ScottK> That's part of this disclaimer of warranty and pretty standard.
[07:13] <ScottK> The key bit is "Redistribution and use in source and binary forms, with or without modification, are permitted provided..."
[07:14] <\sh> ScottK, ping wine...the package won't work like that...some simple mistakes, libs are again not in /usr/lib32 if it's not fixed, I wouldn't approve the UVE
[07:15] <ScottK> \sh: Could you give him feedback on the ML then?
[07:15] <ScottK> I'll comment on REVU so no one uploads it.
[07:15] <\sh> ScottK, ok...or I can try to fix it tomorrow, when I have access to an amd64 system to build
[07:16] <\sh> or just fixing it and uploading to ppa
[07:17] <ScottK> to REVU maybe?
[07:17] <\sh> ScottK, hmmm....revu doesn't have a amd64 build option ;)
[07:17] <\sh> I need to testbuild it
[07:18] <\sh> btw...what's scott ritchies irc nick=
[07:18] <\sh> ?
[07:18] <ScottK> Ah.  I was thinking when you had something worth uploading.  Not for test build.
[07:18] <ScottK> \sh: Dunno
[07:22] <\sh> ScottK, you'll get a fix tomorrow...I'm too tired today to work on anyti
[07:22] <\sh> anything...and propably you can upload this crap ;)
[07:42] <\sh> hmmm..who syncbombed during this release?
[07:50] <\sh> ScottK, if wine uve is approved, or it's a wildcard, I dunno, please upload the package ... we fix it after beta freeze
[07:50] <ScottK> \sh it's a wildcard approval.
[07:51] <ScottK> If you'll have a better package tomorrow, I'd perfer to wait.
[07:51] <\sh> cool
[07:53] <geser> Nafallo: the project page for irrpt says it's BSD licensed and the license text matches pretty well the one in /usr/share/common-licenses/BSD
[07:53] <\sh> cu tomorrow
[07:53] <ScottK> CU tomorrow
[07:55] <jussi01> !u | ScottK
[07:55] <ubotu> ScottK: Unless you're Dutch or Flemish, the letter 'U' is not a pronoun.  If you want to be taken more seriously, please bother to type out the extra letters in "you".  The same goes for "why", "because", "anyone", and so on..
[07:55] <jussi01> :P
[07:56] <ScottK> jussi01: The same for \sh_away then.
[07:56] <jussi01> ScottK: lol, i was only teasing...
[07:56] <jussi01> :P
[07:57] <jussi01> sorry
[07:59] <Nafallo> geser: ah. kewl. thanks. would be easy to pack I guess ;-)
[09:40] <ScottK> Heya proppy.
[09:41] <ScottK> BTW, poker-network will never build on lpia and hppa due to problems with dependencies.
[09:49] <proppy> ScottK: is the buildlog avaiable anywhere ?
[09:49] <proppy> ScottK: lp?
[09:50] <ScottK> Yes.  On LP.  You'll see that lpia is dependency wait on python-pygames which is dep wait on some sound lib that FTBFS.
[09:51] <proppy> FTBFS ?
[09:51] <ScottK> Feel free to dive in and figure out how to fix it.
[09:51] <ScottK> Fail To Build From Source
[09:51] <proppy> ScottK: how do I test ?
[09:53] <ScottK> proppy: lpia is an i386 subset.  Somewhere there are instructions on how to make an lpia chroot if you have i386.  I don't recall where..
[09:53] <proppy> libsdl-mixer1.2-dev
[09:53] <proppy> ok
[09:53] <ScottK> Yeah.  That one
[09:55] <pochu> hmm
[09:55] <pochu> wesnoth is also dep-waiting for that library...
[09:55] <proppy> linux/awe_voice.h missing
[09:56] <proppy> debian bug Bug#434303
[09:57] <ScottK> Maybe you two can work together on it.
[09:57] <pochu> Debian #434303
[09:57] <ubotu> Debian bug 434303 in sdl-mixer1.2 "sdl-mixer1.2: FTBFS: Cannot find linux/awe_voice.h" [Serious,Fixed]  http://bugs.debian.org/434303
[09:57] <DarkSun88> Good night at all.
[09:57] <ScottK> Good night DarkSun88
[09:57] <proppy> which kernel is gutsy ?
[09:58] <ScottK> 2.6.22
[09:58] <proppy> seems this include is dropped in 2.6.22
[09:59] <proppy> there is a debian patch to use upstream provided awe_voice.h
[09:59] <pochu> right
[09:59] <ScottK> There appears to be one in http://packages.ubuntu.com/gutsy/libdevel/libuclibc-dev. Would that work?
[09:59] <proppy> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?msg=15;filename=patch;att=1;bug=434303
[09:59] <josephpiche> speaking of the kernel, what are the chances the 2.6.23 kernel will be released in time to get included in gutsy
[10:00] <ScottK> Zero
[10:00] <josephpiche> is there a scheduled date of release?
[10:00] <ScottK> For what?
[10:00] <josephpiche> 2.6.23
[10:00] <proppy> fixed in sdl-mixer1.2 1.2.6-3
[10:00] <jdong> that is irrelevant
[10:01] <ScottK> Dunno, but for Gutsy the decision has been made
[10:01] <jdong> even if it's released this minute it's not gonna change the situation
[10:01] <proppy> so requesting a sync should do the work
[10:01] <proppy> pochu: are you agree ?
[10:01] <pochu> we backport bug fixes though, don't we?
[10:02] <pochu> proppy: either that or apply the patch
[10:02] <pochu> proppy: since it has some other changes, I haven't looked at them yet
[10:02] <proppy> lets me debdiff
[10:02] <ScottK> Also it's in Main, so we'll need a core-dev to ack it.
[10:03] <proppy> do ack a patch too ?
[10:03] <ScottK> Yes
[10:03] <proppy> I guess acking a patch in main is simpler that acking a sync ? like in MOTU ?
[10:03] <proppy> universe I mean
[10:03] <ScottK> It's pretty much the same.
[10:04] <ScottK> Just a smaller group of people to do it.
[10:04] <geser> proppy: every upload to main must be acked by a ubuntu RM now
[10:04] <pochu> until the freeze ends
[10:05] <proppy> understood :)
[10:05] <geser> which will be the release
[10:06] <proppy> http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/main/s/sdl-mixer1.2/sdl-mixer1.2_1.2.6-3/changelog
[10:06] <ScottK> proppy: Would you please do a test build of the -3 revision?
[10:06] <proppy> the -3 release is build clean and adding a patch system
[10:06] <proppy> + patches
[10:07] <proppy> ScottK: np
[10:07] <ScottK> I'm asking you (or pochu) to build it yourself in a Guty environment (not a Debian environment).
[10:07] <ScottK> Once it builds, I'll ask RM if they want a sync or to try just the patch.
[10:08] <proppy> pochu: let's race :)
[10:09] <pochu> proppy: I'm busy right now, but maybe later... :)
[10:09] <proppy> pochu: I'm too excited to wait, maybe next time
[10:09] <pochu> proppy: or send me a debdiff and we see who has a faster machine :-)
[10:09] <proppy> pochu: ok :)
[10:10] <pochu> cool :)
[10:10] <ScottK> pitti was there so I went ahead and asked which he'd prefer
[10:10] <proppy> pochu: I build using a chroot, I can't stand pbuilder tgz
[10:10] <pochu> hehe
[10:10] <pochu> let's see PBUILDER VS CHROOT then ;)
[10:10] <proppy> :)
[10:11] <ScottK> [16:11]  <pitti> ScottK: judging by that changelog, I'd rather sync
[10:12] <ScottK> So please test and let me know how it goes.
[10:12] <proppy> ok
[10:12] <proppy> pitti = RM ?
[10:14] <geser> yes
[10:15] <proppy> pochu: builddeping :|
[10:23] <proppy> building
[10:26] <proppy> pochu: where do I put the debdiff ?
[10:26] <proppy> ScottK: build fine on gutsy
[10:26] <proppy> ScottK: where can I upload log ?
[10:26] <ScottK> proppy: No need.  Does it install?
[10:27] <pochu> proppy: to make the race? pochu at ubunt...
[10:27] <proppy> ok
[10:29] <proppy> pochu: done
[10:29] <pochu> checking
[10:30] <proppy> ScottK: http://paste.ubuntu.com/337/
[10:30] <proppy> ScottK: it installs fine
[10:30] <pochu> proppy: got it
[10:30] <pochu> let me get the source :)
[10:31] <proppy> pochu: dget http://ftp.de.debian.org/debian/pool/main/s/sdl-mixer1.2/sdl-mixer1.2_1.2.6-3.dsc
[10:31] <ScottK> proppy: Why don't you go ahead and file a sync request and then give me the bug #.  I'll check it.
[10:31] <proppy> ScottK: np
[10:32] <proppy> ScottK: do not know that the process was the same than MOTU
[10:32] <ScottK> It's the same just you need a main sponsor rather then a Universe sponsor
[10:33] <proppy> ScottK: I should provide info for a UVFe as well ?
[10:33] <proppy> oups
[10:33] <pochu> ScottK: not needed
[10:33] <proppy> its not new upstream version
[10:33] <ScottK> Right
[10:33] <pochu> right :)
[10:34] <pochu> proppy: ok, ready :)
[10:34] <pochu> are you ready?
[10:34] <proppy> pochu: waiiiit
[10:34] <pochu> when ScottK says 'Ubuntu rules' then we start building :-)
[10:34] <proppy> pochu: no ccache  !
[10:34] <pochu> proppy: sure, take your time :)
[10:35] <proppy> pochu: ready
[10:35] <ScottK> Kubuntu rules
[10:35] <ScottK> Ubuntu rules
[10:35] <pochu> :)
[10:35] <ScottK> ;-)
[10:35] <proppy> :)
[10:35] <pochu>  -> extracting base tarball [/var/cache/pbuilder/base.tgz] 
[10:35] <pochu> argh
[10:35] <proppy> ahahahah
[10:36] <ScottK> proppy: Let's just get the sync done before pitti gets tired and goes to bed
[10:36] <pochu> :/
[10:36] <proppy> ScottK: ok :)
[10:36] <proppy> will race later :)
[10:38] <pochu> proppy: finished :)
[10:39] <proppy> pochu: me too
[10:39] <proppy> ScottK: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/sdl-mixer1.2/+bug/141351
[10:39] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 141351 in sdl-mixer1.2 "Please sync sdl-mixer1.2_1.2.6-3 from debian unstable main" [Undecided,New] 
[10:40] <proppy> I will suscribe ubuntu-main-sponsors after you've looked at it
[10:40] <proppy> should I add the debdiff as a comment ?
[10:40] <proppy> (and/or) the install log ?
[10:40] <ScottK> proppy: I'd suggest add a comment that the current -2 revision is FTBFS in Gutsy due to whatever it was being removed and that you've test built and installed in with whatever architecture you used
[10:41] <proppy> (and/or) the build log
[10:41] <ScottK> Not needed.
[10:41] <ScottK> Just the comment I suggested
[10:42] <geser> ScottK: [22:26:51]              <-- pitti (n=pitti@ubuntu/member/pitti) has quit ("bye bye")
[10:42] <proppy> sorry :)
[10:42] <geser> that's about 15 min ago
[10:43] <geser> so no need to hurry anymore
[10:44] <ScottK> But seb128 is still up.  Maybe he'll do it.
[10:44] <proppy> ScottK: comment done
[10:47] <ScottK> proppy: I subscribed UMS.  I also milestoned it for the Beta to make sure it doesn't get forgotten.
[10:47] <ScottK> It looks like they're busy ATM in #ubuntu-devel, so I won't bug them now.
[10:48] <proppy> ScottK: thanks a lot
[10:48] <ScottK> No problem.  Thanks for looking into it.
[10:48] <ScottK> That problem would affect a LOT of games.
[10:48] <proppy> can't wait to play poker on hppa
[10:48] <firefly2442> Does a package need to be in the Debian repo before being accepted into the Ubuntu repo?
[10:48] <ScottK> firefly2442: No
[10:48] <firefly2442> ok thanks
[10:48] <ScottK> We prefer to get stuff from Debian, but do take stuff they don't have
[10:49] <proppy> lpia too
[10:51] <firefly2442> What's a better package tool debhelper or CDBS (which uses debhelper)?
[10:51] <firefly2442> I'm trying to learn how to create a package and I'm reading through the wiki docs
[10:51] <ScottK> CDBS is easier when it works.  When it doesn't work straight away it can be a bit of a challenge to understand.
[10:51] <ion_> I like cdbs. Some hate cdbs.
[10:52] <ion_> Yeah, having read cdbs source and understanding the Makefile syntax helps.
[10:52] <firefly2442> my program is pretty simple so hopefully this will be easy :)
[10:53] <firefly2442> so if I don't have to compile anything (it's a PHP program) will that make it easier?
[10:54] <ScottK> Possibly.  Your best bet is to look for a similar php script that's packaged already and then copy from it's packaging.
[10:54] <firefly2442> ok good idea
[10:59] <YokoZar_> Do the package.install and package.dirs files respect architecture flags?  ie, can I have usr/lib32 [amd64]  in debian/package.dirs ?
[11:07] <ScottK> proppy: Sync is done.
[11:08] <proppy> ScottK: fine, I guess poker-network will just rebuild once the deps are ?
[11:08] <ScottK> Just asking about that
[11:09] <ScottK> It's automatic
[11:10] <YokoZar_> ScottK: Can I ask about Wine for a second?
[11:11] <YokoZar_> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=269
[11:11] <ScottK> You can ask.
[11:11] <YokoZar_> ScottK: I'm trying to do \sh's suggestion for putting the libs in /usr/lib32 on amd64
[11:11] <proppy> ScottK: cool thanks
[11:11] <ScottK> I really hope you aren't about to ask me how to do that.
[11:11] <YokoZar_> no
[11:12] <ScottK> Great.  Because I've no idea.
[11:12] <YokoZar_> My worry is just about what putting /usr/lib32 into wine.dirs would do on a 32 bit machine
[11:12] <ajmitch> good morning
[11:12] <YokoZar_> Would it make an empty /usr/lib32 directory?
[11:12] <YokoZar_> Or can I make a wine.dirs.amd64 file?
[11:12] <ScottK> I think you can do that latter, but I'm not sure the exact syntax.
[11:13] <YokoZar_> hmmm
[11:13] <ScottK> Look in a metapackage like kubuntu-desktop and see how they do it.
[11:13] <YokoZar_> Yeah good idea
[11:13] <ScottK> IIRC they have arch specific package lists.
[11:13] <ajmitch> or you could conditionally call dh_installdirs :)
[11:14] <YokoZar_> Yeah, I think you're right
[11:14] <ScottK> I'd listen to the advice you're getting on #ubuntu-devel.
[11:15] <ScottK> They person giving the advice used to be a Debian release manager.
[11:15] <ajmitch> so I'll be silent
[11:16] <ScottK> ajmitch: It's Steve Langasek is that rings any bells.
[11:16] <ScottK> is/if
[11:16] <ajmitch> yes, I know
[11:16] <ScottK> OK
[11:17] <ScottK> Gotta run.
[11:17] <ScottK> See you all later.
[11:17] <ajmitch> filterdiff?
[11:17] <ajmitch> bye
[11:17] <ScottK> probably (filterdiff)
[11:18] <ajmitch> alias  autodiff to be filterdiff with the common autocrap options :)
[11:32] <proppy> see you
[11:52] <TheMuso> Hey folks.
[11:53] <ajmitch> hi TheMuso
[11:53] <ajmitch> how are you today?
[11:53] <TheMuso> ajmitch: Well thanks. Yourself?
[11:54] <ajmitch> wishing I'd gone to bed earlier :)
[11:55] <pkern> Could someone on gutsy try out a repository for me? (i.e. if an apt-get update works properly)
[11:56] <ajmitch> sure
[11:56] <pkern> ajmitch: deb http://ubuntu-sourcedeps.philkern.de gutsy main universe
[11:56] <pkern> (The repository is not yet signed.)
[11:56] <stgraber> Is there someone around here who can help me with an easy apache URL rewriting rule ? We currently have https://iso.qa.stgraber.org/isotesting, but we are moving to https://iso.qa.stgraber.org/qatracker
[11:57] <ajmitch> Get: 21 http://ubuntu-sourcedeps.philkern.de gutsy/universe Packages [1347kB] 
[11:57] <stgraber> I'd like to keep compatibility with old URLs and then rewrite /isotesting to /qatracker
[11:57] <pkern> ajmitch: Please let it run through, if the update at the end completes successfully.
[11:57] <ajmitch> pkern: ok, waiting patiently
[11:57] <pkern> ajmitch: It's a lot of packages, which might be harmful to apt's cache.
[11:57] <ajmitch> updating from archive.ubuntu.com takes awhile
[11:59] <ajmitch> just how many packages are in there, and how would it be harmful? :)
[12:00] <pwnguin> ok, so how does this motu stuff work for newcomers? there's a little mention of Hopefuls
[12:00] <ajmitch> pkern: no problem
[12:00] <pwnguin> but all that's there is a definition =/
[12:01] <pwnguin> for example, there's a package I'd like to add a udev rule to
[12:01] <ajmitch> pwnguin: 'hopeful' just means you do the work, and get it uploaded
[12:01] <pkern> ajmitch: Thank you :D
[12:02] <ajmitch> being a motu means you can upload yourself :)
[12:02] <ajmitch> otherwise you go through the normal sponsorship queues
[12:02] <geser> pkern: works here (amd64)
[12:02] <pkern> geser: Fine, thanks. (:
[12:04] <geser> pkern: is it what the name suggests? an archive to keep track of installed build-depends (automatically/manually installed)?
[12:05] <pkern> geser: Yep. It uses the same software as sourcedeps.debian.net.
[12:05] <ajmitch> for what purpose?
[12:06] <pkern> ajmitch: I regularly build specific software on my machine, packages for which I am upstream.
[12:06] <ajmitch> so just a minimal cache of packages required to build things?
[12:06] <pkern> ajmitch: The dependencies are tracked with aptitude when builddep packages are used.
[12:06] <geser> ajmitch: apt can keep track if a depends was installed manually or through other depends. this archive allows you to do this also for build-depends
[12:07] <pkern> ajmitch: A pkgname-build-depends package depends on all build-dependencies needed to build the package pkgname.
[12:07] <ajmitch> ah right
[12:07] <pkern> ajmitch: i.e. if you remove it all corresponding dev packages which are no longer needed are removed, too.
[12:08] <ajmitch> could be useful
[12:17] <nixternal> keescook: bug 141378 - review that for me if you get the chance - KDM security patches for Dapper - Feisty
[12:17] <ubotu> Bug 141378 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/141378 is private