If you’ve been using Windows

=== hoora [i=hoora@gateway/tor/x-c18af04d3a747d20] has joined #ubuntu-devel === ryu [n=chris@unaffiliated/ryu] has joined #ubuntu-devel === davmor2 [n=davmor2@82-47-39-199.cable.ubr04.wolv.blueyonder.co.uk] has left #ubuntu-devel [] [12:47] anyone interested in taking bug #136534? I've just added some analysis of the failure to the bug log [12:47] Launchpad bug 136534 in keepalived "autopkgtest gutsy keepalived: erroneous package!" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/136534 === bigon [n=bigon@ubuntu/member/bigon] has joined #ubuntu-devel === zul_ [n=chuck@mail.edgewater.ca] has joined #ubuntu-devel === zul [n=chuck@CPE0006258ec6c1-CM000a73655d0e.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel === dsas [n=dean@ubuntu/member/dsas] has joined #ubuntu-devel === bluefox_ is now known as bluefoxicy === alex-weej [n=alex@cpc2-darl3-0-0-cust237.midd.cable.ntl.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel === jml [n=jml@ppp121-44-213-76.lns1.hba1.internode.on.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:17] is there any chance of https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntulooks/+bug/145004 getting in for gutsy or is it too late now? [01:17] Launchpad bug 145004 in ubuntulooks "Implement GtkExpander styling (Code, Screenshot)" [Undecided,New] === milli_ is now known as milli === EliasAmaral [n=dark@unaffiliated/EliasAmaral] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:28] damm ekiga crashes (see bug #145006) [01:28] Launchpad bug 145006 in ekiga "ekiga: symbol lookup error: /usr/lib/libopal.so.2.2: undefined symbol: _ZN11PSafeObjectC2Ev" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/145006 [01:30] alex-weej: the UI is supposed to be frozen at this point; at minimum it would need a freeze exception, and the prereqs for that would seem to be sign-off by the doc team and the [01:30] ... and the desktop team [01:31] ah ok === jwendell [n=wendell@ubuntu/member/wendell] has joined #ubuntu-devel === chmj [n=nik0n@dsl-243-195-168.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-devel === cypherbios [n=cyr@ubuntu/member/cypherbios] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Demitar_ [n=demitar@c-212-031-182-147.cust.broadway.se] has joined #ubuntu-devel === rnorwood [i=rnorwood@nat/redhat/x-7e3409b614a3ee0a] has joined #ubuntu-devel === doko_ [n=doko@dslb-088-073-118-189.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === elmo [n=james@83-216-156-21.jamest747.adsl.metronet.co.uk] has joined #ubuntu-devel === terlmann [n=terlmann@207.254.168.168] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:47] is this where packaging maintainers are ? === terlmann [n=terlmann@207.254.168.168] has left #ubuntu-devel [] === svolpe [n=Gerrath@unaffiliated/gerrath] has joined #ubuntu-devel === blueyed_ [n=daniel@i5387CE25.versanet.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel === gouki [n=gouki@ubuntu/member/gouki] has joined #ubuntu-devel === xivulon [n=ago@87-194-85-156.bethere.co.uk] has left #ubuntu-devel [] === sjoerd [n=sjoerd@tunnel3460.ipv6.xs4all.nl] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:04] mjg59, oh... noted will be fixed [02:05] No problem [02:05] mjg59, and thanks for the heads up === blueyed__ [n=daniel@i5387CF85.versanet.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:06] I'm looking at bug #127704, and I'd just like to check that dh_installudev is safe to use in Ubuntu - Debian bug #414331 suggests that it isn't in Debian at least. [02:06] Launchpad bug 127704 in kvm "kvm: access to /dev/kvm should have a different group-ownership" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/127704 [02:06] Debian bug 414331 in kvm "must not install udev rules files" [Normal,Fixed] http://bugs.debian.org/414331 [02:07] mjg59, btw filed a bug on that already? [02:09] MacSlow: Nope [02:10] mjg59, ok I'll do that then [02:10] Thanks! [02:21] mjg59, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-control-center/+bug/145020 [02:21] Launchpad bug 145020 in gnome-control-center "failed visual/desktop effects still change workspace layout " [Undecided,Confirmed] [02:21] mjg59, should I (or would you like) add you as the inital reporter? === jack_wyt_ [n=jack@123.115.241.211] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:23] MacSlow: Sure, thanks === jsgotangco [n=JSG@ubuntu/member/jsgotangco] has joined #ubuntu-devel === m1ke [n=mike@c-67-186-85-180.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Gman [i=gman@nat/sun/x-b2ea962e0825cc25] has joined #ubuntu-devel === bddebian [n=bdefrees@c-71-224-175-179.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:51] Heya [02:53] bddebian: Hey. [02:53] bddebian: You're a udev god, right? :P [02:53] Heya RAOF [02:54] No, I'm pretty much an idiot about everything [02:54] :) [02:55] Eh, not yet an hour. Probably too early to reping the udev question === Lutin [n=Lutin@dunnewind.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:55] What's the question? [02:55] Whether dh_installudev is safe on ubuntu. [02:58] What would make it not safe? [02:58] I'm looking at bug #127704, and I'd just like to check that dh_installudev is safe to use in Ubuntu - Debian bug #414331 suggests that it isn't in Debian at least. [02:58] Launchpad bug 127704 in kvm "kvm: access to /dev/kvm should have a different group-ownership" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/127704 [02:58] Debian bug 414331 in kvm "must not install udev rules files" [Normal,Fixed] http://bugs.debian.org/414331 [02:59] "dh_installudev is badly broken" [03:00] Ah, hrm [03:00] heh [03:00] Dunno, sorry [03:00] i just went shopping, and that's still going on? [03:01] pwnguin: Not so much going on, as a slightly different question that hasn't been answered. [03:02] what was the answer to the question about keybuk's comment? [03:02] do packages provide permissions or does udev? [03:03] Yes, other packages provide it. [03:04] unfortunately, im not sure about what permissions to set. world readable would be easier than setting up a group [03:05] pwnguin: There are a bunch of groups already set up, and if you want an example of creating a new one, kvm is one such :) [03:05] fuse seems like another [03:06] Yup. [03:06] thats the one i was working from, and it uses dh_installudev [03:06] err [03:06] no it doesnt. someone else in motu told me to use installudev [03:07] instead of plain "install" [03:09] pcmciautils also doesn't use dh_installudev === freeflying [n=freeflyi@211.94.35.200] has joined #ubuntu-devel === fcestrada [n=fcestrad@189.141.239.189] has joined #ubuntu-devel [03:11] And dmsetup *does* use it, and is in main. [03:12] I think all you've proven is that nobody's thought about it recently [03:14] That's entirely possible. However, the fact that a main package uses it makes me more confident it's not utterly broken. [03:15] Well there's your first mistake ;-) [03:15] dmsetup? [03:17] Hm. Of all the packages that own files in /etc/udev/rules.d, watcom-tools, lvm2, and devmapper are the only packages using installudev [03:19] well, if debian's decided not to use installudev, then it's not like anyone's gonna go and put it back in [03:19] But it may be useful in for us, since we seem to have a different udev policy. [03:21] amusingly === edson [n=edson@unaffiliated/edson] has joined #ubuntu-devel [03:22] theres a bug in evms about it's udev rules not running === SLaPoet [n=SLaPoet@user-38lm58r.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel === `23meg [n=m@ubuntu/member/-23meg] has joined #ubuntu-devel === illovae [n=illovae@82.251.249.190] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Lutin [n=Lutin@dunnewind.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === fcestrada [n=fcestrad@189.141.239.189] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Knightlust [n=dax@ubuntu/member/knightlust] has joined #ubuntu-devel === fcestrada [n=fcestrad@189.141.239.189] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Jucato [n=jucato@124.106.193.179] has joined #ubuntu-devel === MacSlow [n=mirco@unaffiliated/macslow] has joined #ubuntu-devel [04:23] is there a written description of the meaning of various unix groups anywhere? [04:23] (in ubuntu) === stub [n=stub@ppp-58.8.11.227.revip2.asianet.co.th] has joined #ubuntu-devel [04:26] pwnguin, what do you mean by "unix groups"? [04:27] like, fuse, wheel [04:27] admin [04:27] plugdev [04:27] /etc/groups [04:27] ah [04:27] not lugs [04:29] pwnguin, you could report a bug at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-docs that it should be explained in the help [04:29] so the answer's no [04:29] ok [04:30] i looked through debian-policy and didnt come up with anything === macd [n=d@cl-151.ewr-01.us.sixxs.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Burgundavia [n=corey@ubuntu/member/burgundavia] has joined #ubuntu-devel === johanbr [n=j@blk-137-105-82.eastlink.ca] has joined #ubuntu-devel === mpt [n=mpt@121-72-130-17.dsl.telstraclear.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === glatzor [n=renate@p57AEF424.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === calc [n=ccheney@conr-adsl-209-169-119-191.consolidated.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === maniacmusician [n=maniacmu@66.251.24.170] has joined #ubuntu-devel === manchicken [n=manckn@12-226-72-69.client.mchsi.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel === CarlFK [n=carl@c-67-169-179-223.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === jml [n=jml@ppp121-44-213-76.lns1.hba1.internode.on.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === jack_wyt [n=jack@123.115.241.211] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Seveas [n=seveas@ubuntu/member/seveas] has joined #ubuntu-devel === hoora [i=hoora@gateway/tor/x-054e28692aaa50fc] has joined #ubuntu-devel === stub [n=stub@ppp-58.8.11.227.revip2.asianet.co.th] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Hobbsee [n=Hobbsee@ubuntu/member/hobbsee] has joined #ubuntu-devel === stub [n=stub@ppp-58.8.11.227.revip2.asianet.co.th] has joined #ubuntu-devel === jack_wyt [n=jack@123.115.241.211] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Amaranth [n=travis@ubuntu/member/Amaranth] has joined #ubuntu-devel === NicSnide [n=ubuntu@125.60.240.217] has joined #ubuntu-devel === j_ [n=j@blk-137-105-82.eastlink.ca] has joined #ubuntu-devel === NicSnide [n=ubuntu@125.60.240.217] has left #ubuntu-devel [] === lee_pepper [n=lee@host-69-144-112-31.lar-wy.client.bresnan.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === gouki_ [n=gouki@ubuntu/member/gouki] has joined #ubuntu-devel === j_ is now known as johanbr === johanbr [n=j@blk-137-105-82.eastlink.ca] has joined #ubuntu-devel === minghua [n=minghua@ubuntu/member/minghua] has joined #ubuntu-devel === stdin [i=stdin@pdpc/supporter/active/stdin] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Nicke [n=niclasa@ua-83-227-140-135.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Yvonne [n=Yvonne@pdpc/supporter/active/Yvonne] has joined #ubuntu-devel === asisak [n=conp@ubuntu/member/coNP] has joined #ubuntu-devel === nags [n=nags@125.16.129.16] has joined #ubuntu-devel [06:57] wow, i didn't really know the history caldera until reading its wikipedia entry, they were impressive before they became psychotic [06:58] they were creating Caldera DOS that was beer-free and quite good, esp. compared to the MS hell [06:59] IIRC [06:59] they did a whole lot more than that according to the article founded blackdown, LPI, etc [07:00] Sure, it was the only thing I knew :) [07:01] :) === xivulon [n=ago@87-194-85-156.bethere.co.uk] has joined #ubuntu-devel === XSource [n=XSource@41.201.230.240] has joined #ubuntu-devel === pitti [n=pitti@ubuntu/member/pitti] has joined #ubuntu-devel [07:10] Good morning [07:11] pitti! [07:11] hey pitti [07:12] Good morning pitti, $TIME_OF_DAY ajmitch, Hobbsee [07:12] pitti: good morning [07:17] Good morning, everyone! [07:17] good morning === calc is still testing beta cd, so hasn't gone to bed yet === coNP [n=conp@ubuntu/member/coNP] has joined #ubuntu-devel === keescook waves "hi" to everyone before heading to bed [07:34] hi & bye, keescook :) [07:34] hi keescook! [07:34] say, is the method that firefox and the kernel packages use to trigger the "you need to Xyz" update-notifier stuff documented anywhere, or is this a case of me needing to go code-dive their postinsts? [07:34] Morning pitti [07:34] hiya ajmitch, Hobbsee. :) [07:35] check out the postinsts, it's fairly basic iirc [07:36] Yeah. It's "copy a file which looks similar to a .desktop file to /var/lib/update-notifier/user.d, IIRC [07:37] hey keescook === coNP_ [n=conp@ubuntu/member/coNP] has joined #ubuntu-devel [07:37] ajmitch, RAOF: ah, yeah. /usr/share/firefox/firefox-restart-required.update-notifier [07:37] hi pitit! [07:37] er [07:37] pitti! :) === maikmerten [n=chatzill@ls5appsrv05.cs.uni-dortmund.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel === DShepherd [n=dwight@72.252.133.113] has joined #ubuntu-devel [07:43] Is anyone here running the fglrx drivers? Could you contribute the output of glxinfo to help make xgl's acceleration detection better? [07:43] after beta is released later this week the archive goes back into automatic mode for a bit right? [07:44] RAOF, sure, but i'm not running an official release of fglrx [07:44] if that's ok [07:44] That's fine. [07:45] I just want to see which GL extensions it advertises. [07:45] RAOF, here you go: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/38614/ [07:47] superm1: yes, it will be put on auto again. [07:47] Mithrandir, okay cool thanks [07:47] superm1: Damnit. That's a modern card/driver combination, right? As such, it should be capable of pbuffers? [07:48] RAOF, well depends on your definition of modern. It's a 2-3 year old card. It's around the 8.41 series of drivers [07:48] it should be capable of pbuffers though yes [07:49] So why doesn't it advertise that fact? :( [07:49] looks like is based on rv350 (if i remember my numbering right?) [07:49] RAOF, its possible pbuffers are broken in this driver [07:49] RAOF: btw, one thing that bugs me about the attempt at GL acceleration detection is of the software trying to be too cleve [07:49] RAOF, because the 'official' release of 8.41 has a lot broken on my card === calc scares himself for remembering that [07:49] Right. Interestingly, it advertises fbo's [07:50] sladen: Basically, I want to know: (1) does it support pbuffers? (2) does it support fbos. I can make the detection user-overridable, if that mollifies you :) [07:51] RAOF: too clever---IMHO software should always work (if the right primitives are; the user can choose if they like that or not)---though I /do/ agree with auto-detection for automatic enabling on install [07:52] RAOF: yeah, it bugs me the way all the window borders disappear, and /then/ it says "no, can't do" [07:52] sladen: Oh, it works. I'm just trying to hunt down why it's dog slow. [07:53] RAOF: if it's going to back out, could that be done before killing the existing window manager; and/or just even show the enable button if it is fact going to back out [07:53] sladen: You're thinking of Compiz, not Xgl, and we already do that. [07:53] sladen: Unless compiz *crashes*, and it's a bit difficult to tell that beforehand :) [07:54] RAOF: ouch, is that the abort mechanism, see if it crashes... === Jucato_ [n=jucato@ubuntu/member/Jucato] has joined #ubuntu-devel [07:54] RAOF: I have an ATI laptop at work, I'll try when I get there. poke me in an hour [07:55] sladen: No, we do a whole bunch of tests first. If it passes those, then compiz *should* work. But if it crashes, it crashes back to metacity. [07:55] sladen: Thanks. === viviersf [n=cain@gw.impilinux.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-devel === viviersf [n=cain@gw.impilinux.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-devel === viviersf [n=cain@gw.impilinux.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-devel === liw [n=liw@a91-154-119-10.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #ubuntu-devel === XSource [n=XSource@41.201.238.39] has joined #ubuntu-devel === zyga [n=zyga@ubuntu/member/zyga] has joined #ubuntu-devel [08:21] Anyone else using VMWare server? Could you try adding more than one scsi hard drive and try booting a recent gutsy CD and see if it detects more than the first disk? [08:22] soren: I could try it on vmware ws [08:22] morning [08:22] pitti: That could work, too. [08:22] soren: ah, let me install vmware; I reinstalled my desktop last night :) === xivulon [n=ago@87-194-85-156.bethere.co.uk] has left #ubuntu-devel [] [08:23] pitti: Any particular reason why you're using ws? [08:23] soren: we have licenses, and well, it was just the most logical pick from their website [08:23] pitti: server is free (as in beer, of course). [08:24] soren: what's the key difference? [08:24] pitti: WS has a few features that server doesn't yet, but the killer feature for server (for me, anyway) is that you can deetach from the server instance and the vm's keep on running. [08:25] ...and you can connect to it remotely. [08:25] soren: right, like on -- a server :) [08:25] :) === kagou [n=Patrice@88.140.234.84] has joined #ubuntu-devel [08:26] WS is better for testing multi-machine setups. [08:26] Good morning [08:26] ..since you can more easily create these shared virtual networks between your vm's. This is not quite as easy in server. [08:27] yeah, those are really cool for testing edubuntu, etc. [08:28] Right. === ant30 [n=aperezar@38.Red-80-36-82.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [08:37] soren: confirmed, second scsi disk is not detected [08:37] "great", thanks. [08:37] soren: hm, that's bad, isn't it? === carlos [n=carlos@canonical/launchpad/carlos] has joined #ubuntu-devel [08:37] soren: anyway, ubuntu does not have a problem with detecting my two IDE disks [08:38] pitti: No, it works fine in Feisty, too. [08:38] pitti: Yes, it's a bit bad :) [08:38] but I hope that vmware bug doesn't imply that it is true for all scsi disks [08:38] pitti: You wouldn't happen to have a physical box with an lsilogic controller in it, would you? :) [08:38] nope [08:39] soren: my hardware is ancient in that regard: just plain IDE disks everywhere [08:39] Ah, already reported: [08:39] https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux-source-2.6.22/+bug/140761 [08:39] Launchpad bug 140761 in linux-source-2.6.22 "Ubuntu 7.10 Alpha Gust OS does not recognize a lun with non zero target id on Vmware ESX Server" [Undecided,Incomplete] [08:45] pitti: No SATA at all? [08:45] StevenK: no, both my boxes are about 3 years old [08:45] StevenK: however, new Dell Latitude is ordered now, so this might have :) [08:46] Heh [08:46] (not that I'm particularly interested in it - it has to have a damn working HD, that's all) === ompaul [n=ompaul@freenode/staff/gnewsense.ompaul] has joined #ubuntu-devel [08:47] Yeah. I feel that way about most hardware, actually. I like it fast, though. [08:48] lightweight, long-running, good display, sane keyboard, working guts, that's my laptop :) [08:49] anyway, no catastrophes so far, what's wrong? [08:49] working suspend to ram is also one of the things I want my laptops to have [08:49] stgraber: right [08:49] do we have new Edubuntu server ISOs ? [08:50] stgraber: noone told/mailed me about why they were disabled [08:50] and what to do to get new ones [08:50] and neither ogra nor LaserJock are online [08:50] slangasek doesn't seem to know either [08:50] I disabled them yesterday as they didn't install due to moodle [08:50] why do we have a 24/7 release team available if noone tells them?? === nixternal [n=nixterna@ubuntu/member/pdpc.active.nixternal] has joined #ubuntu-devel [08:50] stgraber: ah, just dropping moodle? ok [08:51] ogra or Laserjock should have uploaded a new meta I think [08:51] stgraber: a new serveraddon-meta [08:51] 0016 (slangasek) but it still requires an edubuntu CD rebuild for it to be reflected in the beta, yes? [08:51] stgraber: but I didn't accept it since this looks a bit fishy [08:51] 0017 (ogra) yep [08:52] 0017 (ogra) i'll do that tomorrow morning [08:52] stgraber: they added lots of new apps, but the CD is almost full [08:52] sometimes it is good to keep a long scrollback :-) [08:52] torkel: thanks [08:53] stgraber: anyway, moodle appears in component-mismatches, so it's unseeded now [08:53] stgraber: I guess it was only in ship === pitti looks [08:53] message: [08:53] move moodle to ship until it has better d-i inetgration and a proper preseed file [08:54] yep [08:54] https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/edubuntu-meta/1.46 ah, cool [08:54] stgraber: ok, so only thing for me to do is trigger new images, it seems [08:55] Do you think we'll have bug 134918 and bug 144956 for beta ? [08:55] Launchpad bug 134918 in restricted-manager "Misleading error message - software source for package is not enabled" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/134918 [08:55] Launchpad bug 144956 in xorg-server "incorrect screen resolution on gutsy beta using intel" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/144956 === greeneggsnospam [n=JSG@ubuntu/member/jsgotangco] has joined #ubuntu-devel [08:55] stgraber: yes, we will have them in beta :) [08:55] stgraber: (i. e. no time to fix them and roll new CDs) [08:55] stgraber: I'll fix the two r-m bugs right after beta, though [08:56] ok :( === ant30 [n=aperezar@38.Red-80-36-82.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [09:04] ergh. when does edgy EOL? [09:04] oh, must be another 6 months or something. === Knightlust [n=dax@122.2.250.148] has joined #ubuntu-devel [09:05] Hobbsee: when hardy is out [09:05] this release no EOL :) [09:05] power of LTS ;) [09:06] fabbione: damn. [09:06] kdebase has too many bugs. === Nuscly [n=nuscly@29-231.206-83.static-ip.oleane.fr] has joined #ubuntu-devel [09:06] Hobbsee: some bugs you don't want to fix ? :) [09:06] stgraber: most are likely outdated [09:06] stgraber: and by now, most of them wont be fixed, due to kde4. === jsg [n=JSG@125.212.15.236] has joined #ubuntu-devel === nixternal [n=nixterna@ubuntu/member/pdpc.active.nixternal] has joined #ubuntu-devel === slomo [n=slomo@ubuntu/member/slomo] has joined #ubuntu-devel [09:12] hello slomo, good morning === nixternal [n=nixterna@ubuntu/member/pdpc.active.nixternal] has joined #ubuntu-devel [09:17] soren: hi, what are the neat new server features in 7.10 that should be emphasized in the beta announcement? [09:17] slangasek: that it might actually work :P === pitti slaps fabbione [09:19] I should make DKMS work for virtualbox [09:19] fabbione: you can't fool me, I've met the kernel team [09:19] slangasek: which kernel team? [09:20] fabbione: yes [09:20] slangasek: whatever.. === fabbione calls principessa .. === dholbach [n=daniel@i59F74C3C.versanet.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel [09:20] at midnight? tsk [09:21] good morning [09:21] morning dholbach [09:21] hey slangasek [09:21] slangasek: i can be very charming :P [09:22] hey Hobbsee [09:22] dholbach: hiya [09:22] how's it going? [09:23] slangasek: Um... I think there's a list of stuff we usually brag about somewhere. === dsas [n=dean@ubuntu/member/dsas] has joined #ubuntu-devel [09:25] dholbach: I'm up way past my bedtime, how are you? :) [09:26] slangasek: very good, had breakfast in the sun and am just about to dive into heaps of mails I got over the night :) === mvo [n=egon@p54A67B72.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === norsetto [n=Cesare@host217-236-dynamic.19-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #ubuntu-devel [09:30] stgraber: new edubuntu server CDs up [09:30] slangasek: ^ FYI [09:30] pitti: got the e-mail notification, davmor2 will test them [09:30] cool [09:31] I'm doing xubuntu alternate i386 and edubuntu desktop i386 at the moment [09:31] https://iso.qa.stgraber.org/qatracker/build/All looks a bit like space invaders... [09:32] :) === moyogo [n=moyogo@host-85-27-88-46.brutele.be] has joined #ubuntu-devel [09:34] hi === mayday_jay [n=mayday_j@216.145.101.109] has joined #ubuntu-devel [09:39] there are many keyboard layouts that are missing or arent in sync with whats on freedesktop.org [09:39] could xkeyboard-config be updated? [09:39] https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xkeyboard-config/+bug/135509 [09:39] Launchpad bug 135509 in xkeyboard-config "update xkb-data to include latest keyboard layouts" [Undecided,New] === nixternal [n=nixterna@ubuntu/member/pdpc.active.nixternal] has joined #ubuntu-devel === dobey [n=dobey@ip68-229-101-154.hr.hr.cox.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === amitk [n=amit@a91-154-119-106.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Knightlust [n=dax@ubuntu/member/knightlust] has joined #ubuntu-devel === seb128 [n=seb128@ubuntu/member/seb128] has joined #ubuntu-devel === nixternal_ [n=nixterna@ubuntu/member/pdpc.active.nixternal] has joined #ubuntu-devel [09:55] pitti: any idea why we're still having unionfs issue with Edubuntu desktop ? [09:55] stgraber: I saw a non-reproducible hang on ubuntu yesterday, too [09:55] stgraber: seems like not all bugs are fixed yet [09:55] hey seb128 === cassidy [n=cassidy@host-85-27-68-188.brutele.be] has joined #ubuntu-devel [09:56] seb128: did you see jamie's tracker mail? I am fine with updating and testing the package today (not for beta, of course), unless you want to? [09:56] seb128: but I guess you have tons of other release-candidate bugs on your plate [09:56] pitti: I'll reboot and retry but that's weird because the two testers of both Edubuntu desktop i386 and amd64 have reported the bug (bdmurray and me) [09:57] hello pitti [09:57] but l-u-m is .32 so we should have the fix :( [09:57] pitti: pochu is working on the update already [09:57] seb128: ah, nice === nixternal [n=nixterna@ubuntu/member/pdpc.active.nixternal] has joined #ubuntu-devel [10:01] pitti: second try didn't help (it crashed at partitioning this time) [10:01] stgraber: uh, bad [10:02] stgraber: "the fix" -> I saw lots of different kind of unionfs crashes [10:05] pitti: who should I contact about apparmor package management? [10:06] carlos: keescook and mathiaz [10:06] pitti: ok, thanks [10:06] keescook: ping === ant30 [n=aperezar@38.Red-80-36-82.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [10:07] carlos: (he went to bed an hour ago) [10:07] oh, ok [10:07] I'm a bit confused with the list of po files included in that package so I just wanted some input from him [10:10] carlos, pitti: are we getting a language pack update today? [10:10] carlos: ah, did the export succeed? [10:10] seb128: no, we had a problem with the production server and broke the export [10:11] and we didn't have time to prepare a new one [10:11] carlos: any estimation of the delay to get one? [10:11] pitti: it's being quite slow on production, so it's still in progress... [10:11] carlos: oh, the one from last night failed, too? [10:11] seb128: we are preparing one for tomorrow [10:11] ah, still ongoing, I see [10:11] right === seb128 wonders if we will get an Ubuntu cycle without blocking on rosetta === nixternal_ [n=nixterna@ubuntu/member/pdpc.active.nixternal] has joined #ubuntu-devel [10:12] seb128: well, in first place, there was no planned language pack update for the beta release... i asked pitti to do it === ogra [n=ogra@ubuntu/member/ogra] has joined #ubuntu-devel [10:12] carlos: I though we were supposed to have weekly updates this cycle? [10:13] good morning ogra [10:13] seb128: we had semiweekly ones in fact [10:13] seb128: yeah, but that was stopped due to problems with PPA changes [10:13] and as pitti just said, move to semiweekly ones [10:13] just stopped before 2.20.0 [10:13] no, the updates were uploaded straight into gutsy on Wednesdays and Sundays [10:13] which makes that we sucks again for upstream guys [10:13] they can't test their translations on Ubuntu [10:13] yeah, the 'current' symlink was not updated, and we didn't notice for a while [10:15] also, we recently moved to production, so the exports must be more reliable [10:15] and not depending on a mirror anymore [10:19] pitti: is it ok if I assign bug 134712 to you? you replied on it already [10:19] Launchpad bug 134712 in gparted "gparted didn't exit cleanly, no automount anymore" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/134712 [10:20] seb128: btw, I just found this while approving pending templates for Gutsy https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/fast-user-switch-applet/+bug/139793 [10:20] Launchpad bug 139793 in fast-user-switch-applet "fast-user-switch-applet does not contain any translations" [Undecided,Confirmed] === carlos wants longer days to get some time to produce a report with all packages with that problem... [10:22] dholbach: yes, absolutely [10:23] carlos: I'll fix it, but ideally rosetta should automatically file bugs about that [10:23] dholbach: done [10:23] seb128: see what I just said [10:23] dholbach: (i. e. assigned, not yet uploaded) === dholbach_ [n=daniel@i59F72F07.versanet.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel [10:24] seb128: that's indeed what I would really like, well, maybe not file bugs automatically but render a page with such detected problems [10:24] carlos: I understand that as you did want to review all the template yourself [10:24] seb128: indeed [10:24] ogra: hm, so no more moodle? [10:25] carlos: get danilo to do it? ;) [10:25] seb128: he's fighting with our database to get searching working... [10:25] ah ok [10:25] Maybe we could move to Mars to get longer days.. who knows... :-P [10:25] that would also be nice [10:25] pitti:hum... I might not have got your reply [10:26] dholbach: nothing fancy, just saying that I assinged the bug to me and set it to 'in progress'; will tend to it today, probably [10:26] pitti: you ROCK === dholbach hugs super-pitti === Spads_ [n=spacehob@host-87-74-18-7.bulldogdsl.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel [10:27] keescook, bryce_: how's bug 96586 coming along? [10:27] Launchpad bug 96586 in inkscape "Correct multiple inkscape issues in Feisty (SRU and Backport)" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/96586 === pitti [n=pitti@ubuntu/member/pitti] has joined #ubuntu-devel [10:31] pwnguin: /usr/share/doc/base-passwd/users-and-groups.html [10:32] excellent [10:32] Riddell: bug 136425, bug 121984? bug 121872? can either you or somebody of the kubuntu-main people at least comment on them? === Hobbsee pokes ubotu === Spads [n=spacehob@unaffiliated/spads] has joined #ubuntu-devel [10:33] Launchpad bug 121984 in kdepim "kandy: no icon in kubuntu feisty's kde menu" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/121984 [10:33] bug 136425 [10:33] Launchpad bug 121872 in qt4-x11 "*-qt4 tools should be present in $QTDIR/bin" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/121872 [10:33] Launchpad bug 136425 in qt4-x11 "qtconfig-qt4 in Accessories?" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/136425 [10:33] Riddell: if you decide to not have them in gutsy, that's fine with me, but it'd be nice to at least get back to the patch authors === Zdra [n=zdra@91.253-242-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has joined #ubuntu-devel [10:33] bug 121984 bug 121872 [10:33] pwnguin: I maintain that and am happy to document more users and groups in it, at least to some reasonable extent :) [10:33] calc: bug 135086? [10:33] Launchpad bug 135086 in unzip "zipgrep: exit code always 0" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/135086 [10:34] oh, those ones [10:34] pwnguin: BTW, the only reason pcmciautils doesn't use dh_installudev is because I haven't got around to it. As far as I know dh_installudev is safe to use on Ubuntu (we've certainly put some effort into making it so). [10:34] cjwatson: cool [10:34] keescook, soren: if anybody'd have the time to check out bug 134346, that'd be cool [10:34] Launchpad bug 134346 in traceroute "Please sync traceroute (main) from Debian unstable (main)" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/134346 [10:34] there was certianly some confusion on the issue in #-motu [10:35] dholbach: /me looks [10:35] soren: you ROCK === soren hugs dholbach [10:36] pitti: maybe you could factor in bug 114648 too? [10:36] Launchpad bug 114648 in gparted "gparted menu entry is not HIG compliant" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/114648 [10:36] dholbach: no problem [10:36] pitti: assigning === dholbach hugs pitti [10:36] dholbach: I deferred other "menu entry is not HIG compliant" to next cycle because it's late now to break translations [10:36] dholbach: stolen 121984 [10:37] cjwatson: cwiid wants a udev rule for a kernel module to make it user readable, similar to fuse. i wonder about the long term viability of adding yet another group for it [10:37] pitti: ^ [10:37] seb128: if it does that, I'll defer it [10:37] pitti: thanks [10:37] pwnguin: I don't know what cwiid is or what the purpose of the kernel module is [10:38] I should probably document the fuse group [10:38] cjwatson: cwiid is a wiimote library. one of the packages connects to the wiimote and somehow presents a mouse device to X [10:38] seb128: ok, thanks [10:38] fuse is really nothing like anything else that existed, which is why it has its own group - not really because it is a kernel module [10:38] well, the kernel module it wants is similar [10:38] uinput [10:39] fuse exposed filesystems to userspace, uinput is similar in nature [10:39] pwnguin: /dev/input/* is root:root 0660 [10:39] Hobbsee: thanks a lot [10:39] pwnguin: any reason this shouldn't be the same? [10:39] pwnguin: X starts as root so we don't need a special group here [10:40] cjwatson: i dont defend the architecture of wmpinut, but it doesn't work if the user doesnt have read access [10:40] or write access, probably [10:40] err, if it's presenting a mouse device to X, shouldn't it just need X to have read/write access? [10:40] im guessing it connects to a wiimote via bluetooth, and writes events to a uinput device [10:41] I am familiar with how uinput works === nixternal [n=nixterna@ubuntu/member/pdpc.active.nixternal] has joined #ubuntu-devel [10:41] i am not [10:41] currently, wminput is run by the user. that seems suboptimal [10:42] I'd change that if I were you :) [10:42] or make it escalate privileges with sudo or something [10:42] i think the whole thing may need more design from upstream [10:42] mouseemu is a similar precedent [10:42] you just run it as root [10:42] heh [10:42] one caution [10:42] bluetooth [10:43] presents a slightly higher vulnerability threat [10:43] but you're probably right, this is little more than an experiment that needs rethinking === jono [n=jono@ubuntu/member/jono] has joined #ubuntu-devel [10:44] well, what's hard about just adjusting it in Ubuntu to run as root? [10:45] is anyone looking at bug 119266? It's annoying to have to reload snd-hda-intel every reboot :) [10:45] Launchpad bug 119266 in linux-source-2.6.22 "Intel HDA Sound device doesn't work in gutsy" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/119266 [10:45] setuid? that sounds worse to me [10:45] no, "as root" doesn't mean set-id [10:46] I meant "you need to use sudo kthxbye" [10:46] heh === nixternal [n=nixterna@ubuntu/member/pdpc.active.nixternal] has joined #ubuntu-devel [10:46] how is it invoked? [10:46] is it an init script, a menu item, a random command you run from a terminal ...? [10:46] just a random terminal command [10:46] seb128: Can we sync a package from Debian that's no longer in testing or unstable? [10:46] sudo wminput might work, i need to remove the rule I wrote and try first though [10:47] soren: technically speaking, we have the ability to sync from anything [10:47] soren: we need the dsc [10:47] soren: I mean if you give an url to the dsc so we can dget the orig, diff, dsc we can sync it [10:47] It's on snapshot.debian.org, so it's definitely available. [10:47] Rock. [10:48] https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gcalctool/+bug/144355/comments/9 [10:48] pwnguin: it seems to me that it's convenient to be able to run it as an ordinary user, but other than that there's little benefit to the device being read/write by anyone other than root [10:48] Launchpad bug 144355 in gcalctool "Incorrect Math in version 5.9.14" [Low,Invalid] [10:48] hum, this guy is not correct [10:48] pwnguin: so it's a little awkward [10:48] cjwatson: mainly im just going off the manpage / readme [10:48] pwnguin: but I tend to think that having to add the user to more random groups is getting inconvenient in itself === Seveas [n=seveas@ubuntu/member/seveas] has joined #ubuntu-devel [10:49] cjwatson: exactly why i was looking for a better way [10:49] pwnguin: I suppose you could hook it off plugdev if absolutely necessary [10:49] sudo works [10:49] but my original response is my gut response :) [10:49] i'll just change the documentation [10:49]