jaguarondi_ | Hi guys, just testing bzr atm. I did a nested branch and 'bzr status' returns it as unknown. Is the normal practice to add these nested branches to the ignore list? | 12:07 |
---|---|---|
=== BasicOSX [n=BasicOSX@216.243.156.81] has joined #bzr | ||
=== jrydberg [n=Johan@c80-216-246-123.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #bzr | ||
=== jaguarondi_ [n=david@216.252-64-87.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has left #bzr [] | ||
=== BasicMac [n=BasicOSX@warden.real-time.com] has joined #bzr | ||
=== Verterok [n=ggonzale@75-108-235-201.fibertel.com.ar] has joined #bzr | ||
Verterok | moin | 12:28 |
Peng | MediaWiki? | 12:30 |
=== jrydberg [n=Johan@c80-216-246-123.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #bzr | ||
Vantage13 | is there an environment variable to set to specify a different bzr lib directory? | 12:41 |
=== bialix [n=chatzill@77.109.20.25] has joined #bzr | ||
=== elijah [n=whatever@c-69-252-219-78.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has joined #bzr | ||
=== arjenAU [n=arjen@ppp215-29.static.internode.on.net] has joined #bzr | ||
=== AfC [i=andrew@office.syd.operationaldynamics.com] has joined #bzr | ||
=== schierbeck [n=daniel@dasch.egmont-kol.dk] has joined #bzr | ||
=== schierbeck [n=daniel@dasch.egmont-kol.dk] has left #bzr [] | ||
=== _thumper_ [n=tim@canonical/launchpad/thumper] has joined #bzr | ||
=== herzel104 [i=herzel@gateway/tor/x-724e02254a2eb317] has joined #bzr | ||
=== cprov [n=cprov@canonical/launchpad/cprov] has joined #bzr | ||
=== herzel104 [i=herzel@gateway/tor/x-5da007e002bf3a05] has joined #bzr | ||
=== _thumper_ is now known as thumper | ||
=== jml_ [n=jml@ppp108-61.static.internode.on.net] has joined #bzr | ||
=== joejaxx [i=joejaxx@fluxbuntu/founder/joejaxx] has joined #bzr | ||
=== jml__ [n=jml@203-113-250-169-static.TAS.netspace.net.au] has joined #bzr | ||
=== jml__ is now known as jml | ||
=== Admiral_Chicago [n=FreddyM@ubuntu/member/admiral-chicago] has joined #bzr | ||
=== AfC [i=andrew@office.syd.operationaldynamics.com] has joined #bzr | ||
=== abentley [n=abentley@64.229.18.231] has joined #bzr | ||
=== statik [n=emurphy@189.66.188.72.cfl.res.rr.com] has joined #bzr | ||
=== orospakr [n=orospakr@65.95.1.79] has joined #bzr | ||
=== jml_ [n=jml@ppp121-44-213-76.lns1.hba1.internode.on.net] has joined #bzr | ||
=== dous_ [n=dous@124.104.0.255] has joined #bzr | ||
=== orospakr [n=orospakr@65.95.1.79] has joined #bzr | ||
=== nir [n=nir@moinmoin/fan/nir] has joined #bzr | ||
=== Verterok [n=ggonzale@75-108-235-201.fibertel.com.ar] has joined #bzr | ||
=== orospakr [n=orospakr@bas4-ottawa23-1096745295.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #bzr | ||
=== AnMaster [n=AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster] has joined #bzr | ||
=== hdima [n=hdima@idealer.cust.smartspb.net] has joined #bzr | ||
=== pbor [n=urk@host216-21-dynamic.60-82-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #bzr | ||
=== jml_ is now known as jml | ||
=== zyga [n=zyga@ubuntu/member/zyga] has joined #bzr | ||
=== matkor [n=matkor@EUROCZESCI.wbs.ssh.gliwice.pl] has joined #bzr | ||
matkor | Hi ! What is idea beging merging files using olive-gtk and meld ? I get three views BASE OTHER THIS, where should I store final (merged) version ? | 08:49 |
=== g0ph3r [n=g0ph3r@p57A09DEB.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #bzr | ||
=== pitti [n=pitti@ubuntu/member/pitti] has joined #bzr | ||
pitti | hello | 09:02 |
pitti | whoa, the first time in years that bzr really failed for me... | 09:02 |
=== Lo-lan-do [n=roland@mirenboite.placard.fr.eu.org] has joined #bzr | ||
pitti | I checked out a Debian SVN with "bzr get svn+ssh://...", and now try to merge this into a native bzr branch; when doing that, I get | 09:03 |
pitti | bzr: ERROR: Repository KnitRepository('file:///home/martin/ubuntu/hal/hal/.bzr/') is not compatible with repository KnitRepository3('file:///home/martin/ubuntu/hal/hal-debian/.bzr/') | 09:03 |
pitti | any idea about that/ bzr upgrade'ing the debian svn checkout doesn't work either ("Cannot convert to format <RepositoryFormatKnit1>. Does not support rich root data.") | 09:04 |
Lo-lan-do | You need to convert your branch to dirstate-with-subtrees or something | 09:05 |
pitti | hm, 'dirstate-with-subtrees' does not exist, it is already 'dirstate', and it refuses to convert to 'knit' | 09:07 |
Lo-lan-do | dirstate-with-subtree, sorry | 09:11 |
vila | try dirstate-with-subtree | 09:11 |
vila | :) | 09:11 |
Peng | Are you planning to drop pycurl? One comment in a bug mentions it. | 09:11 |
Lo-lan-do | I'm still confused as to why that format, which was supposed to become the default format around 0.15 or so, isn't even mentioned in "bzr help formats" | 09:12 |
fullermd | Because it's its purpose is to enable a feature there's not much of a UI for. I don't think it's slated to become a default any time soon. | 09:14 |
fullermd | At one point, there was a discussion about changing it from a parallel format to a flag, I think. But that was a long time back. | 09:15 |
ubotu | New bug: #147530 in bzr "pycurl http implementation peeks under the covers" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/147530 | 09:15 |
Lo-lan-do | I see. But I guess bzr-svn could be a bit more explicit in its error messages then. | 09:16 |
fullermd | Well, I don't think the error message is coming from bzr-svn. | 09:16 |
Lo-lan-do | I don't know where it comes from, but I do know it's confusing :-) | 09:17 |
pitti | meh, now bzr merge excepts out on me; I guess I'll revert the conversion and use classical patch for now | 09:17 |
fullermd | It's just a 'normal' bzr, "Hey-your-formats-are-incompatible-I'm-dying-here!" cry. | 09:17 |
=== mvo [n=egon@p54A675D8.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #bzr | ||
=== fog [n=fog@debian/developer/fog] has joined #bzr | ||
=== jaguarondi_ [n=david@193.190.210.10] has joined #bzr | ||
=== allenap [n=allenap@87-194-166-60.bethere.co.uk] has joined #bzr | ||
=== mrevell [n=matthew@canonical/launchpad/mrevell] has joined #bzr | ||
=== jaguarondi_ [n=david@193.190.210.10] has left #bzr [] | ||
vila | Peng: see bug #82086 about dropping pycurl | 10:33 |
ubotu | Launchpad bug 82086 in bzr "pycurl transport causes tracebacks if the server's SSL cert cannot be verified." [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/82086 | 10:33 |
vila | fixing bug #147530 will at least gives a better error | 10:34 |
ubotu | Launchpad bug 147530 in bzr "pycurl http implementation peeks under the covers" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/147530 | 10:34 |
=== pitti [n=pitti@ubuntu/member/pitti] has left #bzr ["Bye"] | ||
=== luks [n=lukas@unaffiliated/luks] has joined #bzr | ||
=== jml_ [n=jml@ppp121-44-213-76.lns1.hba1.internode.on.net] has joined #bzr | ||
=== jml [n=jml@ppp121-44-213-76.lns1.hba1.internode.on.net] has joined #bzr | ||
=== GaryvdM [n=chatzill@mtngprs4.mtn.co.za] has joined #bzr | ||
=== gabe [n=gabriel@91.84.56.254] has joined #bzr | ||
fullermd | vila: What about the "stop making pycurl default if it's around" path that's been discussed a time or two? | 11:10 |
vila | fullermd: and stop verifying site certificates by default ? I'm really no comfortable with that... | 11:11 |
fullermd | Well, we're not verifying the certs by default for all the people who don't have pycurl installed. | 11:11 |
vila | There is still the option to make urllib the default for http and pycurl the default for https, but I'm not really comfortable with that wither | 11:12 |
vila | fullermd: yeah, I know, but windows installs it by default, ubuntu installs it by default, I think debian does that too, so who don't have pycurl really ? | 11:13 |
fullermd | I don't have it as a dependancy of the BSD port. | 11:13 |
vila | hmm | 11:13 |
fullermd | It's vaguely irritating to know that I could have a working setup with a self-signed cert or whatever, that nevers gives me any problems, then install some unrelated software that happens to install pycurl and suddenly have my branch blow up. | 11:14 |
vila | Well, I don't think I'm the one to take that decision, I can implement it though, but I'd feel better with an urllib solution | 11:14 |
vila | fullermd: you can't have working setup with a self-signed cert unless bzr pycurl http implementation is patched | 11:15 |
fullermd | Sure I can. I can not have pycurl installed and be using urllib, without having any idea that it's a problem. | 11:15 |
vila | thinking that an urllib setup works scares me ! | 11:15 |
fullermd | ("I" being not necessarily me personally. Me personally, I don't think I use http with bzr anywhere except for pulling bzr itself, and plugins) | 11:16 |
vila | Do you know what was my *first* proposed patch for bzr ? | 11:16 |
=== cory_ [i=cory@zeus.penguinhosting.net] has joined #bzr | ||
fullermd | Renaming the command 'vila'? | 11:17 |
vila | lol, no. it was enabling self-signed certificates (or more precisely disabling certificate validation for self-signed sites)... 1 year and 1/2 ago I'd say :-) | 11:18 |
vila | Now, call me stubborn, but all my http-related activity is aimed at dropping pycurl support (while providing a better urllib impl. though) | 11:19 |
vila | So dropping pycurl while not providing certificate verification | 11:19 |
vila | ... does not fit the bill :) | 11:19 |
vila | I tried to summarize in bug #82086 | 11:20 |
ubotu | Launchpad bug 82086 in bzr "pycurl transport causes tracebacks if the server's SSL cert cannot be verified." [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/82086 | 11:20 |
fullermd | Oh, I'm not proposing dropping pycurl; I'm mostly questioning whether it makes sense to use it by default when it appears. | 11:20 |
vila | Well, it's true that the subject has come quite often lately, may be a list discussion is in order then | 11:23 |
vila | so that all personal preferences and implications can be exposed | 11:24 |
=== fullermd nods. | ||
fullermd | I don't have a particularly strong opinion, and it certainly doesn't really affect me. It just seems to come up with some regularity. | 11:25 |
fullermd | My going across the network tends to mostly be bzr+ssh :p | 11:26 |
=== AfC [i=andrew@office.syd.operationaldynamics.com] has joined #bzr | ||
=== GaryvdM [n=chatzill@mtngprs4.mtn.co.za] has joined #bzr | ||
=== phanatic [n=phanatic@ubuntu/member/phanatic] has joined #bzr | ||
=== Mez [n=mez@ubuntu/member/mez] has joined #bzr | ||
=== jaguarondi_ [n=david@193.190.210.10] has joined #bzr | ||
=== NamNguyen [n=namnt@148.177.217.131] has joined #bzr | ||
NamNguyen | abentley, ping | 11:57 |
=== jaguarondi_ [n=david@193.190.210.10] has left #bzr [] | ||
fullermd | Prob. be a while before he's around. | 11:58 |
=== GaryvdM_ [n=chatzill@mtngprs2.mtn.co.za] has joined #bzr | ||
NamNguyen | alrighty ;-) | 11:58 |
=== GaryvdM_ is now known as GaryvdM | ||
NamNguyen | i just hit a problem with bb | 11:59 |
NamNguyen | 2nd time | 11:59 |
=== lukas__ [n=lukas@wired-201.fi.muni.cz] has joined #bzr | ||
=== lukas__ is now known as luks | ||
=== mvo_ [n=egon@p54A65CD0.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #bzr | ||
=== metze_ is now known as metze_asleep | ||
=== Lo-lan-do [n=roland@mirexpress.internal.placard.fr.eu.org] has joined #bzr | ||
=== GaryvdM [n=chatzill@mtngprs5.mtn.co.za] has joined #bzr | ||
=== nir [n=nir@moinmoin/fan/nir] has joined #bzr | ||
=== Lllama [n=Lllama@217.154.92.11] has joined #bzr | ||
Lllama | Morning all. Easy question: I've just resolved some conflicts and 'status' tells me I have pending merges. Do I just need to commit for these to take effect? | 12:49 |
Lo-lan-do | Yes | 12:49 |
Lllama | Lo-lan-do: cheers. | 12:50 |
=== bac [n=bac@canonical/launchpad/bac] has joined #bzr | ||
=== jrydberg_ is now known as jrydberg | ||
GaryvdM | Hi - I'm trying to push to a ftp server. I'm getting this error: http://pastebin.com/m57d74483 - and I am not sure what to do. | 01:12 |
=== jamesh__ [n=james@canonical/launchpad/jamesh] has joined #bzr | ||
=== Lllama [n=Lllama@217.154.92.11] has left #bzr [] | ||
=== NamNguyen [n=NamNguye@cm38.delta196.maxonline.com.sg] has joined #bzr | ||
matkor | Easiest way to see changes introduced in given revision or since given revno ? Prefereable like kdiff presents changes ? | 01:59 |
Lo-lan-do | bzr diff -c 1234 | 01:59 |
=== Zindar [n=erik@83.241.192.2] has joined #bzr | ||
=== cprov [n=cprov@canonical/launchpad/cprov] has joined #bzr | ||
GaryvdM | I'm still having a problem pushing to a ftp server. It creates a file called /bzr-pushtree/trunk/.bzr/branch-lock/kasvrj7jcy.tmp/info.tmp.1191240308.188999900.3268.1560928192 | 02:12 |
GaryvdM | Then dose a RNFR /bzr-pushtree/trunk/.bzr/branch-lock/kasvrj7jcy.tmp/info | 02:13 |
=== niemeyer [n=niemeyer@200-140-230-150.ctame705.dsl.brasiltelecom.net.br] has joined #bzr | ||
GaryvdM | That file dose not exist. | 02:13 |
matkor | Lo-lan-do: bzr diff ... it is text only ... no graphical tool for that ? | 02:13 |
Lo-lan-do | Oh. Dunno, maybe in olive-gtk. | 02:14 |
GaryvdM | There is bzr-gtk - but it will not show you a sisde by side diff | 02:14 |
GaryvdM | Try https://launchpad.net/bzr-difftools/trunk | 02:15 |
=== bac [n=bac@canonical/launchpad/bac] has joined #bzr | ||
GaryvdM | err https://launchpad.net/bzr-difftools | 02:15 |
harrisony | "353 MB .zip file" hmm pain | 02:18 |
harrisony | oops wrong window, sorry | 02:18 |
=== zyga [n=zyga@ubuntu/member/zyga] has joined #bzr | ||
=== gander [n=gander@agander.plus.com] has joined #bzr | ||
=== bac [n=bac@canonical/launchpad/bac] has joined #bzr | ||
=== gander [n=gander@agander.plus.com] has joined #bzr | ||
=== schierbeck [n=daniel@dasch.egmont-kol.dk] has joined #bzr | ||
=== mrevell is now known as mrevell-lunch | ||
=== ubotu [n=ubotu@ubuntu/bot/ubotu] has joined #bzr | ||
=== kiko [n=kiko@canonical/launchpad/pdpc.supporter.active.kiko] has joined #bzr | ||
=== UnUnOctium [i=mb0b0@dsl-146-56-168.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #bzr | ||
=== UnUnOctium [i=mb0b0@dsl-146-56-168.telkomadsl.co.za] has left #bzr [] | ||
matkor | Is there easy way to test (using bzrlib) if at given path there is checkout or branch ? | 03:55 |
gabe | hi, what can i do about this showing up in bzr st? kind changed: | 03:55 |
gabe | emailer/steves_mailer (directory => tree-reference) | 03:55 |
matkor | I do bzrlib.workingtree.open_containing(path) , what should be next ? | 03:55 |
=== pete__c [n=pete@032-461-712.area7.spcsdns.net] has joined #bzr | ||
=== orospakr [n=orospakr@132.213.238.4] has joined #bzr | ||
=== bigdo2 [n=scmikes@72-197-8-8-arpa.cust.cinci.current.net] has joined #bzr | ||
AnMaster | Unable to obtain lock sftp://anmaster@hosthere/var/www/envbot.org/htdocs/bzr/.bzr/repository/lock <-- bzr timed out when I pushed, how do I fix this?, deleting the whole repo dir is not an option | 04:22 |
fullermd | AnMaster: 'bzr break-lock' | 04:23 |
fullermd | (of course it's an option. It's just a really bad one ;) | 04:23 |
AnMaster | fullermd, yes because uploading about 50 MB on 128 kbps up for just the main branch will be a PAIN | 04:23 |
AnMaster | fullermd, I hope this won't leave it in a broken state or so? | 04:24 |
fullermd | Well, it's a Big Red Button. If the lock _should_ still exist (like somebody else is writing to it), breaking it could be bad. | 04:24 |
fullermd | But if it's just a stale lock from a lost connection or something, it'll be fine. | 04:25 |
AnMaster | yep I know what it was | 04:25 |
AnMaster | also how do I with rspush from bzrtools specify the port that ssh is on? it is simple to do with normal sftp push but haven't found a way with rspush | 04:26 |
fullermd | That, I have no idea on. | 04:26 |
AnMaster | because ssh is on non standard port on this host | 04:26 |
LeoNerd | Can't you just use the .ssh/config file in the usual way? | 04:27 |
AnMaster | ah | 04:27 |
AnMaster | LeoNerd, I normally do it like ssh -p port user@host but ok | 04:28 |
LeoNerd | Yes; but the config approach has the advantage that all the SSH tools will use it | 04:28 |
LeoNerd | And you don't have to think about it | 04:28 |
AnMaster | true | 04:28 |
=== AnMaster goes to read up on syntax of it | ||
=== Demitar [n=demitar@c-212-031-182-147.cust.broadway.se] has joined #bzr | ||
=== mrevell-lunch is now known as mrevell | ||
=== AnMaster swears loudly at trac-bzr | ||
=== luks [n=lukas@unaffiliated/luks] has joined #bzr | ||
=== mw|out is now known as mw | ||
=== bwinton [n=bwinton@mail.phantomfiber.com] has joined #bzr | ||
=== AfC [i=andrew@office.syd.operationaldynamics.com] has left #bzr [] | ||
=== mthaddon [n=mthaddon@canonical/launchpad/mthaddon] has joined #bzr | ||
=== BasicOSX [n=BasicOSX@warden.real-time.com] has joined #bzr | ||
=== jamesh__ is now known as jamesh | ||
=== michelp [n=michelp@69-30-72-119.dq1sf.easystreet.com] has joined #bzr | ||
=== bigdo1 [n=scmikes@72-197-8-8-arpa.cust.cinci.current.net] has joined #bzr | ||
=== allenap [n=allenap@87-194-166-60.bethere.co.uk] has joined #bzr | ||
=== luks [n=lukas@unaffiliated/luks] has joined #bzr | ||
=== nir [n=nir@moinmoin/fan/nir] has joined #bzr | ||
=== Lo-lan-do [n=roland@mirexpress.internal.placard.fr.eu.org] has joined #bzr | ||
=== cprov is now known as cprov-lunch | ||
=== mvo__ [n=egon@p54A66BD0.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #bzr | ||
=== sabdfl [i=sabdfl@ubuntu/member/pdpc.silver.sabdfl] has joined #bzr | ||
mrevell | Hey guys - I'll be holding the first of our two Bazaar Documentation meetings here on the hour. | 05:52 |
fullermd | What all ground are you intending to cover? | 05:54 |
mrevell | fullermd: My main aim is to find gaps in the current documentation, so I'm looking for people to suggest areas that they feel are missing from the current docs. | 05:56 |
bwinton | Ooh, in that case, I'm going to run and quickly get lunch and be back here in 4 minutes. (Hopefully. Feel free to start without me.) | 05:57 |
=== p4tux [n=p4tux@189.169.70.141] has joined #bzr | ||
fullermd | Well, my main bug on that is the Fundamentals stuff, which we've covered on the list. That, and the lack of a good reference to the commands. | 06:01 |
fullermd | I've issues with the tutorials, but I think one of the two biggiest (proliferation of partially-overlapping ones) has been resolved since the last time I sat down with the docs. Been way too busy with work lately :| | 06:01 |
mrevell | fullermd: Thanks. I'll get the meeting under way. | 06:02 |
mrevell | Welcome to this Bazaar Documentation meeting! Thanks for coming. | 06:02 |
mrevell | The purpose of today's meeting is to identify gaps in the current Bazaar documentation. | 06:02 |
=== zyga [n=zyga@ubuntu/member/zyga] has joined #bzr | ||
mrevell | My aim is to help the Bazaar team to find and plug those gaps in time for the 1.0 release. | 06:02 |
mrevell | I've divided the agenda into: | 06:03 |
=== BasicOSX [n=BasicOSX@gatekeeper.real-time.com] has joined #bzr | ||
mrevell | * Is the user reference complete? | 06:03 |
mrevell | * What is missing from the user guide? | 06:03 |
mrevell | * What do we want to add the "advanced topics" and "best practice" sections? | 06:03 |
mrevell | So, who's here for the meeting? Say "me", if you're here to chat about the docs. | 06:03 |
mrevell | me | 06:03 |
james_w | me | 06:04 |
Lo-lan-do | Not me, sorry, I'm here to pester jelmer about bzr-svn :-) | 06:04 |
fullermd | me (somewhat) | 06:04 |
mrevell | Thanks guys, we can keep things pretty informal :) | 06:04 |
mrevell | So, my first question: | 06:04 |
james_w | Lo-lan-do: I didn't forward your latest bug as you said that jelmer was already aware. | 06:05 |
mrevell | What do you feel is missing from the user reference? | 06:05 |
Lo-lan-do | james_w: Fine by me | 06:05 |
james_w | http://doc.bazaar-vcs.org/bzr.dev/en/user-reference/bzr_man.html | 06:06 |
james_w | mrevell: ^ that one? | 06:06 |
mrevell | james_w: That's it, yeah. | 06:06 |
keir | examples | 06:07 |
james_w | so that is generated from bzr help. | 06:07 |
mrevell | james_w: My main concern is that every command should be covered, as it's also the bzr help | 06:07 |
fullermd | I feel that having the 'reference' generated from the online help is a wrong path; the needs of the two cases are totally different. | 06:07 |
mrevell | james_w: Right, yeah | 06:07 |
james_w | it's a good way of getting something together though. | 06:07 |
fullermd | Examples are a big thing (and good examples often cross command boundaries). | 06:08 |
james_w | I agree that it is not complete, or ideal though. | 06:08 |
fullermd | Really need to tackle each command and answer, "when would I use this?", "when would I not use this?", "what side effects can this cause?", etc. | 06:08 |
keir | examples are usually what i want in man page type help | 06:08 |
keir | sometimes it's not obvious how to string together the arguments for a command | 06:08 |
james_w | yeah, a clear statement for each about whether it modifies the working tree, uses network etc. might be good to have as well. | 06:09 |
fullermd | Thsoe sort of discussions get long, which isn't really suitable for online help (which should be more "remind me what the args/action is" than "describe in detail what each of these things do") | 06:09 |
keir | usually, some command as only a couple 'common use cases' | 06:09 |
james_w | fullermd: indeed. It might be useful to have online though. | 06:09 |
fullermd | Reasonable example: merge --reprocess. Describing just what that does, and when you would/wouldn't want to use it is a couple paragraphs. Fitting that into an option list summary doesn't work well :) | 06:09 |
fullermd | Well. I'm iffy on that. If 'bzr help xyz' is more than a screenfull or two... | 06:10 |
james_w | with the topics shadowing feature it would be possible to define long help for each command which is shown if you run bzr help topics/command (I think that's the syntax). | 06:10 |
james_w | yes, not by default, but available. | 06:10 |
james_w | hmmm, short meeting. | 06:10 |
=== mrevell [n=matthew@canonical/launchpad/mrevell] has joined #bzr | ||
fullermd | See? The help was too long for him ;) | 06:10 |
mrevell | Hmm, got disconnected. | 06:10 |
mrevell | :) | 06:10 |
james_w | :) | 06:10 |
mrevell | Would it be reasonable to include a link to web based help, if a description was too long for bzr help? | 06:11 |
fullermd | A good coverage of what sort of conflicts can happen, how you can provoke them, and how to clean them up, would be another thing a ref manual should have. | 06:11 |
james_w | mrevell: reasonable yes, distros can patch this to point to a local copy as well. | 06:12 |
fullermd | It would probably have to be a pretty shallow link. "For more, see the Bazaar Reference Manual (online at ....)", rather than a deeper one. That way would lie madness... | 06:12 |
james_w | fullermd: there is conflicts documentation, but it needs some work, and I agree it should be in the reference section. | 06:12 |
bwinton | I agree with fullermd on the link-to-online-docs point. | 06:13 |
mrevell | fullermd: Why would deeper linking be a problem? Perhaps I'm missing something obvious :) | 06:13 |
fullermd | Ditto for merging; we have some talk about workflows (we have some on the wiki; should emphasize the full continuum from "single shared branch" to "full mesh"), and the merging strategies that work. | 06:13 |
=== bigdog [n=scmikes@72-197-8-8-arpa.cust.cinci.current.net] has joined #bzr | ||
james_w | mrevell: are you against having it in bzr then? | 06:14 |
fullermd | Also, 3-way vs. weave/knit, why you'd use one over the other, and degenerate cases. | 06:14 |
bwinton | mrevell: a deeper link will prevent us from radically changing the structure of the docs. | 06:14 |
james_w | no, you can link to $version. | 06:14 |
mrevell | james_w: No, not at all, I was just picking up the point above that some of this might get too long for the internal help | 06:14 |
fullermd | mrevell: Change between two unsync'd things has bitten me too many times :) | 06:14 |
mrevell | Ah, thanks fullermd and bwinton | 06:14 |
james_w | mrevell: ok. | 06:15 |
mrevell | So, should we aim for examples for each command? | 06:15 |
fullermd | And of course the pre-mentioned Fundamentals stuff; a good chapter up front on that will save your life many times over later on. | 06:16 |
fullermd | Yes, definitely. Particularly on the options; when you'd use --xyz on a given command, not just the quickie description of what it does. | 06:16 |
james_w | mrevell: yes. Covering as many use cases for the command as possible. | 06:16 |
mrevell | Great. | 06:16 |
fullermd | "Why would I use --reprocess?" "What does --verbose actually mean for this command?" etc. | 06:16 |
james_w | (we could make bzr help examples/command work). | 06:17 |
mrevell | james_w: Do you think there'd be some people who wouldn't want to see the examples? | 06:17 |
james_w | no, but again consideration of keeping the default help output reasonably short. | 06:18 |
mrevell | right | 06:18 |
james_w | I'm not suggesting removing all examples from the help output. | 06:18 |
james_w | they are usually the most useful bit. | 06:18 |
mrevell | james_w: Just keeping it to a reasonable length | 06:18 |
james_w | indeed. | 06:18 |
fullermd | I consider "bzr help xyz" to mean "I know how this works, remind me of the options". | 06:18 |
mrevell | fullermd: Great, thanks. | 06:18 |
fullermd | (the concensus may be that the online help should be more involved than that; just my reflex view) | 06:19 |
mrevell | Are there any commands that are missing entirely from bzr help, that you know of? | 06:19 |
james_w | there are hidden commands, but few of those are useful. | 06:19 |
james_w | (in general). | 06:19 |
fullermd | And even they have help; they just don't show up in 'help commands'. | 06:20 |
mrevell | james_w: I presume they're hidden for a reason, though? | 06:20 |
james_w | some commands could do with a brusign up of the help, and a couple of examples. | 06:20 |
james_w | not all have helpful help, but yes they are hidden for a reason. | 06:20 |
james_w | mrevell: are we concentrating on the in-source docs? | 06:21 |
mrevell | Okay, so the main thing I draw from this is that we need examples in bzr help, covering as many use cases as possible. I also take note of "<fullermd> I consider "bzr help xyz" to mean "I know how this works, remind me of the options"." | 06:22 |
mrevell | james_w: Anything that's in doc in the trunk atm. | 06:22 |
james_w | yes, with a short synopsis. | 06:22 |
james_w | mrevell: great. | 06:23 |
mrevell | james_w: But I'd be interested to hear about docs that are on the wiki and should be moved to the branch. | 06:23 |
=== abadger1999 [n=abadger1@136.245.4.252] has joined #bzr | ||
james_w | yeah, I'm not sure about that. | 06:23 |
=== dpm [n=dpm@p54A13896.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #bzr | ||
mrevell | james_w: Yeah, obviously it'd have to be a special circumstance. | 06:24 |
mrevell | Okay, unless anyone's got anything else to say about the user reference I'd like to move onto the user manual | 06:25 |
james_w | go ahead. | 06:25 |
=== phanatic [n=phanatic@ubuntu/member/phanatic] has joined #bzr | ||
=== jkakar [n=jkakar@204-174-36-45.dhcp802.dsl.ucc-net.ca] has joined #bzr | ||
=== p4tux [n=p4tux@189.169.70.141] has joined #bzr | ||
mrevell | I'd like to make the user manual flow a little more and take the user on a journey from introduction through to in-depth, advanced topics. | 06:29 |
mrevell | The basic question, though, is again: what is missing from what we have already? | 06:30 |
james_w | is http://doc.bazaar-vcs.org/bzr.dev/en/user-guide/index.html the one you mean? | 06:30 |
fullermd | Well, not missing, but it's weird that the HTTP smart server doc is separate from, in a different section from, and not linked to, the page that talks about the rest of the smartserver interfaces. | 06:30 |
fullermd | ("not linked to from", that is) | 06:31 |
mrevell | james_w: Yes, that's it. | 06:31 |
mrevell | fullermd: It's linked from the page james_w referenced, isn't it? | 06:32 |
fullermd | I wonder if the User Manual and User Reference really should be so separate. It almost seems like it should be one manual, with a spectrum from the relatively linear (step above tutorials) to the more random-access (command reference) | 06:32 |
fullermd | Yes, but there's "Running a Bazaar server" under "Basic Topics", that says nothing about and doesn't link to the bzr+http doc, which is under Best Practices (somewhat incongruously) | 06:33 |
mrevell | fullermd: Right, yes, "best practices" does seem like the wrong place for it. | 06:33 |
fullermd | Now, bzr+http setup is pretty long and involved, so it probably should be external to the rather short, simple setup for the other types. But more closely related than it is. | 06:34 |
mrevell | I'd propose to turn the user manual intoa tutorial | 06:34 |
mrevell | that takes the user from the start of using Bazaar right through to more involved processes. I think the distinction between that tutorial and the user reference would be more concrete then. | 06:35 |
mrevell | So, anything that isn't part of the (new) tutorial moves from the user manual to the reference. | 06:36 |
fullermd | ISTM that there are 3 natural divisions. | 06:37 |
fullermd | One is the "quick start". That's the "bzr in 5 minutes", the "here-kid-the-first-one-is-free" stuff. | 06:37 |
mrevell | :) | 06:37 |
fullermd | The second is the more miniseries-style tutorial stuff, which are individual pieces, but follow a reasonable progression without too much overlap. Taht would be the "Learning bzr" sort of doc. | 06:38 |
mrevell | Yep | 06:38 |
fullermd | And the third would be the reference. In-depth discussion of commands and use-cases, lists of config options and revspecs, etc. | 06:38 |
fullermd | The second two could be bundled together as a 2-part "book" potentially. Certainly there'd be a lot of references to (3) in (2), "For more info, see ...". | 06:39 |
fullermd | The first would stand alone, and operate more as a hook. | 06:39 |
fullermd | Sorry. I'm real full of very etheral handwaving, and not so much concrete :| | 06:39 |
mrevell | I agree with those divisions. The mini-tutorial (which I've proposed become "Bazaar in 5 minutes") matches the first division. | 06:39 |
mrevell | Great, thanks for the feedback. | 06:41 |
=== fullermd shuts up for a while. | ||
mrevell | thanks very much for your input fullermd :) | 06:42 |
=== thatch [n=thatch@pool-71-96-248-177.dfw.dsl-w.verizon.net] has joined #bzr | ||
mrevell | If anyone thinks of any other gaps in the documentation - i.e. specific areas where we don't have any or we have very sparse documentation for a particular Bazaar feature - feel free to mail me matthew.revell@canonical, or of course mail the bzr list :) | 06:43 |
mrevell | I'm holding another of these meetings tomorrow (Tues) at 08.00 UTC. | 06:44 |
mrevell | Thanks everyone :) | 06:45 |
mrevell | Meeting ends but feel free to contact me any time with docs suggestions. | 06:45 |
james_w | thanks mrevell | 06:46 |
fullermd | OK. The rest of you can get words in edgewise now ;) | 06:46 |
=== dpm [n=dpm@p54A12E75.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #bzr | ||
=== cprov-lunch is now known as cprov | ||
=== GaryvdM [n=chatzill@dsl-243-161-42.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #bzr | ||
=== grimboy [n=grimboy@85.211.237.147] has joined #bzr | ||
=== mrevell is now known as mrevell-dinner | ||
=== cypherbios [n=cyr@ubuntu/member/cypherbios] has joined #bzr | ||
=== marianom [n=marianom@ubuntu/member/marianom] has joined #bzr | ||
=== Vernius [n=tomger@p508AF23C.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #bzr | ||
=== mvo_ [n=egon@p54A66BD0.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #bzr | ||
=== BasicOSX [n=BasicOSX@216-250-174-201.static.iphouse.net] has joined #bzr | ||
=== phanatic_ [n=phanatic@dsl5400C5D3.pool.t-online.hu] has joined #bzr | ||
=== phanatic_ is now known as phanatic | ||
=== zyga [n=zyga@ubuntu/member/zyga] has joined #bzr | ||
=== fog [n=fog@debian/developer/fog] has joined #bzr | ||
=== sabdfl [i=sabdfl@ubuntu/member/pdpc.silver.sabdfl] has left #bzr [] | ||
=== jaguarondi_ [n=david@82.243-246-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has joined #bzr | ||
=== mvo_ [n=egon@p54A66BD0.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #bzr | ||
=== Mez_ [n=Mez@ubuntu/member/mez] has joined #bzr | ||
=== herzel104 [i=herzel@gateway/tor/x-3eac73957eb94f65] has joined #bzr | ||
statik | anyone in here figured out how to configure meld to work with the extmerge plugin? | 09:55 |
=== statik is being thick about understanding how meld arguments match up to extmerge | ||
=== cprov is now known as cprov-afk | ||
=== schierbeck [n=daniel@130.225.237.208] has joined #bzr | ||
schierbeck | phanatic: mjellow | 10:14 |
=== bwinton [n=bwinton@mail.phantomfiber.com] has left #bzr [] | ||
phanatic | schierbeck: hey, what does that mean? :) | 10:14 |
schierbeck | hello :) | 10:14 |
schierbeck | what's the status on using "revision history"? i say we go for it! | 10:15 |
=== dbn [n=chatzill@vpn-034.comnets.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #bzr | ||
dbn | Hi all | 10:18 |
Peng | "all" being like 2 people. | 10:19 |
dbn | Hi peng. May I ask you a question concerning bzr 0.90? | 10:20 |
dbn | I have a problem using the bundle command. | 10:20 |
Peng | You can ask any question, but I may not know the answer. | 10:20 |
Peng | 0.91 is out, FYI. | 10:20 |
dbn | :) I give it a try, then. | 10:21 |
dbn | I have setup a remote repository using bzr serve. | 10:21 |
dbn | I made a branch from that location, applied some changes and said bzr bundle | 10:21 |
dbn | bzr now gives a traceback complaining that | 10:22 |
dbn | 'RemoteRepository' object has no attribute '_make_parents_provider' | 10:22 |
Peng | That's strange. | 10:23 |
dbn | That's what I thought. That's why I came here ;) | 10:23 |
Peng | The usual workflow is to keep one copy of the upstream branch on your computer, then to branch off of that to make changes. | 10:23 |
Peng | Maybe it's a 'bzr serve' bug. | 10:23 |
Peng | Report it on the mailing list, maybe? | 10:23 |
Peng | Well, I guess it's not a 'bzr serve' bug. | 10:24 |
dbn | It works well when the remote repository is not contacted via the bzr protocol | 10:24 |
james_w | yeah, that sounds like a bug. | 10:24 |
phanatic | schierbeck: okay, i'll wait till tomorrow. if noone has anything against it, i'll merge "revision history" | 10:25 |
dbn | Do you want me to file a bug report for this? | 10:26 |
Peng | If you do, include steps to reproduce it and a full traceback .. | 10:26 |
james_w | dbn: yes please. | 10:26 |
dbn | Probably I should try out 0.91 first. Maybe this is already resolved ... | 10:27 |
james_w | yes, it might be. | 10:28 |
=== cprov [n=cprov@canonical/launchpad/cprov] has joined #bzr | ||
dbn | Ok, thanks. I will gather the steps to reproduce the bug and file it in the bugtracker. | 10:32 |
james_w | dbn: it is easy to reproduce here. | 10:33 |
james_w | bzr bundle bzr+ssh://localhost/home/jw2328/devel/bzr/bzr.dev | 10:33 |
dbn | james_w: Shall I include that line in the bug report then? Is that sufficient for you? | 10:38 |
=== calin [n=calin@89.136.187.239] has joined #bzr | ||
james_w | dbn: unless you have any more interesting information. I think the problem is obvious enough. | 10:38 |
=== Gwaihir [n=Gwaihir@ubuntu/member/gwaihir] has joined #bzr | ||
dbn | james_w: Ok, thanks. | 10:40 |
=== luks [n=lukas@unaffiliated/luks] has joined #bzr | ||
=== hsn_ [n=chatzill@234.114.broadband5.iol.cz] has joined #bzr | ||
hsn_ | bzr packages for windows are on wiki listed as 0.91 but they are 0.90 | 11:02 |
ubotu | New bug: #147836 in bzr "bzr 0.90.0 bundle command fails with bzr remote repositories" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/147836 | 11:05 |
=== BasicOSX [n=BasicOSX@216-250-174-201.static.iphouse.net] has joined #bzr | ||
=== pacharasil_ [n=astromme@12-214-205-206.client.mchsi.com] has joined #bzr | ||
james_w | hsn_: thanks, that's a known issue. You can get 0.91 if you access them directly, rather than using the current links. | 11:15 |
=== sabdfl [n=sabdfl@ubuntu/member/pdpc.silver.sabdfl] has joined #bzr | ||
hsn_ | james_w: should i fix wiki? | 11:23 |
=== asak [n=alexis@201-0-38-199.dsl.telesp.net.br] has joined #bzr | ||
=== GaryvdM [n=chatzill@dsl-243-161-42.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #bzr | ||
=== phanatic [n=phanatic@ubuntu/member/phanatic] has left #bzr [] | ||
GaryvdM | Is their anyone here that is familiar with the merge_sort code? | 11:35 |
GaryvdM | I am having a problem where by it does not return revision number 1 | 11:35 |
GaryvdM | But that revision is in the graph and in the mainline | 11:36 |
GaryvdM | Code here: http://codebrowse.launchpad.net/~bzr/bzr-gtk/trunk/annotate/szilveszter.farkas%40gmail.com-20071001083733-mn111f1k16ojsqd8?file_id=graph.py-20051016214152-ebf565808c860cf7#L47 | 11:37 |
ubotu | New bug: #147860 in bzr "[BUG] renaming + kind change == assertion failure" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/147860 | 11:40 |
GaryvdM | Ok - found my problem. | 11:43 |
=== abadger1999 [n=abadger1@65.78.187.68] has joined #bzr | ||
GaryvdM | You need to have revision number 1 at index number 1 of the mainline. Hence mainline[0] needs to be something else like None. | 11:44 |
=== sabdfl [n=sabdfl@ubuntu/member/pdpc.silver.sabdfl] has left #bzr [] | ||
=== fog [n=fog@debian/developer/fog] has left #bzr [] |
Generated by irclog2html.py 2.7 by Marius Gedminas - find it at mg.pov.lt!