[01:56] <prcs> i there
[01:57] <prcs> i've just installed ubuntu
[01:57] <prcs> and i'm already interest on this MOTU community
[01:58] <prcs> can anyone help me to find more info for example how to enter on it?
[01:58] <prcs> thanks in advance
[02:01] <crimsun> prcs: please see the Contributing link in the topic
[02:01] <prcs> thanks
[02:02] <prcs> thanks crimsun
[02:02] <prcs> ;)
[02:04] <crimsun> yw
[02:48] <bddebian> Heya gang
[02:48] <gnomefreak> hello bddebian
[02:48] <bddebian> Hi gnomefreak
[02:58] <gnomefreak> what was the intel video card 965 missing that it needs to run compiz?
[02:58] <gnomefreak> i cant remember exact reason
[02:59] <jmg_> gah
[02:59] <jmg_> new york times advocating automatix :(
[02:59] <RAOF> gnomefreak: Probably that it didn't handle Xv + compiz
[03:00] <gnomefreak> jmg_: linux foundation told larry to post it in his article
[03:00] <RAOF> Which would be that the driver doesn't handle textured-video, I think.
[03:01] <gnomefreak> that sounds right
[03:01] <jmg_> gnomefreak: :?
[03:02] <jmg_> so what was the status of fluendo dvd in the end? has canonical licensed it?
[03:03] <RAOF> jmg_: Fluendo has a dvd-nav gstreamer plugin?
[03:03] <jmg_> RAOF: dont know how it works, but its required to use the dvd functionality for elisa
[03:05] <RAOF> Hm, it doesn't appear to include a DVD title nav plugin (ala dvdnav).  I wonder how that works...
[03:06] <gnomefreak> jmg_: thats what the author of the nytimes article told me
[03:07] <gnomefreak> caught flak from automatix people
[03:07] <jmg_> of course
[03:09] <gnomefreak> i miss stated what i meant and they went at me but crap happens
[03:11] <StevenK> Automatix would be easier to deal with if the authors weren't so *defensive*
[03:11] <gnomefreak> and they cleaned it up a bit ;)
[03:11] <StevenK> That too. :-)
[03:20] <RAOF> I see they at least *say* they want to come in from the cold, though.
[03:20] <ajmitch> it's a good start
[03:23] <RAOF> Will any of them be at UDS?
[03:23] <ajmitch> probably
[03:23] <gnomefreak> i get to miss it again :(
[03:24] <gnomefreak> and its close only ~800 or so miles
[03:24] <RAOF> What excuse do you have this time, then?
[03:24] <RAOF> :)
[03:26] <gnomefreak> court on oct 31
[03:27] <RAOF> As juror, I trust?
[03:27] <gnomefreak> no
[03:27] <gnomefreak> not that lucky
[03:28] <RAOF> :(
[03:28] <gnomefreak> being sued for an accedent
[03:28] <RAOF> That sucks.
[03:29] <gnomefreak> eh she wont win. too many people saw the traffic light being red when she hit me
[03:29] <RAOF> Which is worse, right?  Well, maybe.
[03:30] <RAOF> As in, it's a frivolous waste of your time.
[03:30] <gnomefreak> agreed
[03:30] <gnomefreak> 3 days worth of paperwork each year this was 2 years ago
[03:31] <DarkMageZ> it's a shame how crap like that even manages to make it to court
[03:31] <RAOF> Wow, the lightning fast arm of the law.
[03:32] <gnomefreak> yep but damn if i shoot someone for tresspassing ill be indited and found gulty faster than you can blink
[03:32] <gnomefreak> irony sucks
[03:32] <RAOF> Over IRC?  Yes.
[03:33] <gnomefreak> ;)
[03:40] <StevenK> Hrm.
[03:40] <StevenK> I think I have virtualbox-ose-modules working.
[03:41] <StevenK> Now to fudge up a copyright and get someone to test the modules actually work.
[03:44] <YokoZar1> Any REVU admins around?  I have two uploads to make, but I can't because of flaky internet and I'm not sure what to do
[04:00] <ScottK> YokoZar1: Do you have anywhere else you can post them?
[04:00] <YokoZar1> ScottK: yeah
[04:01] <ScottK> In that case, just put them up where you can and mail the motu list or ping someone here.
[04:02] <ScottK> jdong: Did you have anything to do with the Automatix "we want to play too" mail?
[04:03] <jdong> ScottK: I am unfamiliar with the e-mail itself, so probably not :)
[04:03] <ScottK> Heh.
[04:03] <ScottK> jdong: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-discuss/2007-October/001902.html
[04:04] <YokoZar1> Also, is it ok to have .svg files in the /debian folder?
[04:04] <jdong> ScottK: very interesting; I'd love to see where it will go. The attitude sounds right and promising
[04:05] <ScottK> jdong: Yes.  The concern I have is they are saying nothing about making it respect that packaging system.
[04:05] <bddebian> YokoZar1: Yes
[04:06] <YokoZar1> What is the main use case for Automatix in Gutsy now anyway?  Gutsy does a whole lot automatically
[04:06] <YokoZar1> bddebian: Thanks.  I got worried when I had to remove the .png files (also icons) since dpkg threw a fit about unrepresentable changes to source.
[04:07] <bddebian> YokoZar1: Aye, you can't add binary files.  xpm or svg are OK since they aren't binary
[04:07] <ScottK> YokoZar1: Historically the main use case has been Automatix is REALLY cool and anyone who thinks there are problems with it just doesn't understand.
[04:07] <bddebian> Sounds like compiz
[04:08] <YokoZar1> Well before people were using Automatix to add the winehq repos, for instance
[04:08] <YokoZar1> I'm going to try and pimp Third Party Apt for Hardy to get rid of that usage (since installing, say, the Wine repos would be point and click)
[04:09] <YokoZar1> People were also using Automatix to install codecs, but that's done smoothly now too
[04:09] <ScottK> YokoZar1: Sure.  Some of it's actually useful for someone who doesn't know what they are doing, but those are the same people most likely to get burned by the crackpot aspects of it's design.
[04:09] <YokoZar1> No argument here
[04:10] <ScottK> jdong: I'd hate to have the first response they get from an Ubuntu dev amount to "Yes, but are you going to make it not suck?"
[04:11] <ScottK> I think if they are going to do so, they ought to say it, if not, there isn't much to discuss.
[04:11] <ScottK> I was hoping you could ask around a little.
[04:11] <jdong> ScottK: hobbsee already took the honor of making a similar remark at the forums (linking to Matthew's analysis of the codebase)...
[04:11] <ScottK> Ah.  Cool.
[04:11] <jdong> ScottK: so at this point I think it'd be redundant to ask again, but I'll put chatting on #automatix on my todo list
[04:11] <ScottK> That's pretty much what I was tempted to do.
[04:11] <ScottK> OK.
[04:12] <RAOF> ScottK: Also, last time I checked (a month or so ago), Automatix still sigkilled dpkg.
[04:12] <ScottK> I was sort of hoping to get some dialogue going from someone they viewed as less hostile.
[04:12] <ScottK> RAOF: Thanks.  I'm not suprised.
[04:12] <ScottK> My impression is that they don't really get why that's a bad idea.
[04:13] <RAOF> How hard can it be to get?
[04:14] <ScottK> RAOF: Apparently pretty hard based on the evidence to date.
[04:14] <RAOF> Incidentally, the XFont-enabled branch of emacs-snapshot will be making Hardy if I have anything to do with it!
[04:14] <RAOF> ScottK: :/
[04:19] <jdong> hmm, will the real maildirmake please stand up?
[04:19] <ScottK> Well on the forums the response is, "Oh, yeah, I fixed all that stuff."  We'll see.
[04:20] <YokoZar1> Maybe I should talk to the automatix people
[04:21] <YokoZar1> I've been IMing with the main guy for a bit ever since he added the Wine repos to the program
[04:25] <ajmitch> jdong: the 'real' one?
[04:26] <jdong> ajmitch: there's like 3 different ones provided by various packages... is there one that's better than others, or will this dovecot one I have around work?
[04:26] <ajmitch> the dovecot one works for me
[04:27] <jdong> ok, I'll give it a shot
[04:28] <ScottK> YokoZar1: Personally, I think that, as long as they are fixing the evil in Automatix, this is a good announcement.
[04:32] <RAOF> Certainly.  Automatix is a symptom of a real problem/need, and could possibly be a useful part of a solution.
[04:34] <persia> What would a solution look like?  A repository of illegal software and a meta-package?
[04:35] <RAOF> Possibly :)
[04:35] <RAOF> That's not quite the entirety of the problem it is symptomatic of, though.
[04:36] <RAOF> Although much of the rest of the problem is already solved (restricted manager, easy-codec-install, etc.)
[04:40] <RAOF> apt-url is also eating in on the problem, too.
[04:41] <YokoZar1> RAOF: apt-url + third party APT pretty much solves it
[04:42] <Amaranth> except that apt-url is not going to work with 3rd party repos
[04:43] <persia> Amaranth: Why not?
[04:43] <Amaranth> security concerns
[04:43] <persia> Amaranth: Can't the user tweak that by adding the necessary keys?
[04:44] <ajmitch> at which point there's no point using apt-url
[04:44] <persia> clicky-clicky
[04:44] <YokoZar1> Third Party Apt could add both keys and default packages.  EG when you add the Wine repo, it'll add the winehq key and the wine package.
[04:45] <YokoZar1> I don't see how apt-url would tell apart the wine in the wine repo from the stock one, if both have valid signatures in the user's apt-key database
[04:50] <bddebian> Why do I constantly feel like I'm talking to myself anymore...
[05:01] <ScottK> bddebian: #debian-mentors can be like that.
[05:02] <bddebian> ScottK: Heh.  I mean in general but yeah, that's what prompted that remark :-)
[05:14] <bddebian> ScottK: If kmos package gets in before mine, I'm hanging it all up. :-)
[05:14] <bddebian> tritium!!
[05:14] <tritium> hi bddebian :)
[05:14] <bddebian> How you been man?
[05:15] <tritium> Good, thanks.  You?
[05:15] <bddebian> Same as always thanks :)
[05:15] <tritium> Glad to hear it!
[05:37] <Amaranth> RAOF: did you have to modify the udev rules to use iwl3945?
[06:55] <RAOF> Hey jml
[06:56] <jml> RAOF: hi
[07:09] <ajmitch> hi jml, RAOF
[07:11] <StevenK> RAOF: Isn't hindsight wonderful? (Ever touching the Azureus bugs.)
[07:12] <RAOF> StevenK: Eh, indeed.  And now people send me emails saying "please fix my Azureus" :(
[07:13] <StevenK> "Stop trying to pirate movies and animes using it. Problem solved."
[07:14] <RAOF> "A simple merge from Debian will solve it" <---- Correct, in all but the "simple"
[07:14] <StevenK> Hah.
[07:15] <StevenK> "Simple? You try it, and let me know." :-P
[07:15] <RAOF> I wouldn't foist Azureus on a prospective contributor.  They'd think we were gods or insane, or possibly both.
[07:17] <StevenK> Hah
[07:19] <StevenK> Oh, I love Telstra.
[07:19] <StevenK> "Due to a high number of calls, this service is not currently available. Please call back later. <click>"
[07:20] <RAOF>  /blink
[07:20] <StevenK> I'm ringing them to pay my bill - surely they'd love to hear from me, I want to give them some of my money!
[07:21] <RAOF> Not allowing customers to pay you money is the new business model.
[07:21] <RAOF> cf: Region locking, not-for-Australia artists on eMusic, etc.
[07:22] <StevenK> How is that possibly sustainable? :-)
[07:22] <RAOF> Magic.  By not letting them pay you money, you make more money!
[07:30] <pwnguin> RAOF: you have nouveau packaged anywhere?
[07:30] <RAOF> pwnguin: Yes, in my PPA, but it's a little old.
[07:31] <pwnguin> xrandr1.2?
[07:31] <RAOF> pwnguin: If you want to wait for this evening I'll update the packages, rebuild libdrm against -13-generic, etc.
[07:31] <RAOF> pwnguin: Yes.  Both the branch, and trunk which now has the XRandR12 xorg.conf option.
[07:32] <pwnguin> you happen to have a link to the tree?
[07:32] <pwnguin> nouveau's site is a bit ugly and hard to follow =/
[07:32] <RAOF> pwnguin: You mean, the bzr branch I'm packaging in?  No, it's on my lappy.
[07:32] <pwnguin> upstream
[07:33] <StevenK> Hum.
[07:33] <RAOF> pwnguin: However, !nouveau links to the PPA, and my packages have the full git tree in them (so they contain proper debug info)
[07:33] <pwnguin> like, where's their git/cvs/wtfever
[07:33] <RAOF> pwnguin: So, a quick dget from the PPA + a git pull should see you at trunk.
[07:33] <pwnguin> im wanting to view the source to investigate specific functionality
[07:34] <ajmitch> gitweb.freedesktop.org, I think
[07:35] <ajmitch> the dri component is in the mesa project
[07:36] <RAOF> pwnguin: ajmitch is correct.  And the DRI component isn't necessary for 2d operation (and barely works), but you
[07:36] <RAOF> *need* libdrm trunk
[07:36] <pwnguin> well, im not about to build it
[07:36] <pwnguin> just want to see if what i want is even there at all
[07:36] <pwnguin> but thanks for the tip
[07:38] <pwnguin> on a related note, what is Haiku?
[07:38] <ajmitch> beos implementation
[07:38] <pwnguin> ah
[07:38] <ajmitch> basically a free software clone of it
[07:38] <ajmitch> binary compatibility & all, apparantly
[07:39] <pwnguin> "it"
[07:39] <ajmitch> BeOS, as above
[07:39] <pwnguin> oh
[07:40] <pwnguin> i just see references to haiku every once in a while, and i thought it strange i'd never heard of it before
[07:41] <ajmitch> it's not particularly well known
[07:41] <pwnguin> i can see why now
[07:47] <pwnguin> good news, its still not fixed in the upstream
[07:47] <pwnguin> guess i'll bug their mailing list about it
[08:16] <superm1> how do i build a package without an @ubuntu.com addy for maintainer?  It's a motumedia package i'm fixing, and debuild -S complains.
[08:22] <pwnguin> set up a GPG key
[08:23] <superm1> pwnguin, you intending that for me?
[08:28] <pwnguin> yes
[08:29] <jdong> how does setting up a GPG key bypass that check for @ubuntu.com in the e-mail address?
[08:30] <superm1> yeah i've got GPG keys setup for my own @ubuntu.com addy.
[08:30] <superm1> there must be a switch to pass to debuild to change this behavior i'd think
[08:30] <superm1> i can't seem to find on the man pages however
[08:30] <RAOF> superm1: Last I checked that was a warning, not an error?
[08:31] <jdong> RAOF: on my machine it causes a FTBFS
[08:31] <superm1> dpkg-source: error: Version number suggests Ubuntu changes, but Maintainer: does not have Ubuntu address
[08:31] <superm1> debuild: fatal error at line 1247:
[08:31] <superm1> and that is all it says
[08:31] <superm1> stops right there
[08:31] <RAOF> Hm.  That's annoying.  I thought that behaviour was changed.
[08:35] <superm1> Fujitsu, siretart, slomo, how do you guys upload then?
[08:35] <tonyyarusso> superm1: you don't, you have to have it I think.
[08:36] <superm1> well how did they upload before then?
[08:36] <superm1> i mean the current version in gutsy is listed with Maintainer: Ubuntu MOTU Media Team <motumedia@tauware.de>
[08:46] <soren> superm1: What's your DEBEMAIL environment variable set to?
[08:46] <superm1> soren, to my addy, superm1@ubuntu.com
[08:46] <soren> superm1: unset it and try again.
[08:47] <soren> (that check is only enabled if $ENV{'DEBEMAIL'} ~= /ubuntu.com/
[08:47] <StevenK> It doesn'
[08:47] <StevenK> Gah
[08:47] <StevenK> It doesn't check what the Changed-By address is? That's ... interesting.
[08:48] <superm1> ah there we go.
[08:48] <superm1> thanks soren
[08:48] <soren> superm1: np
[08:48] <superm1> that's some odd behavior though.  for the people it's trying to avoid having issues, you would think they would typically be ones who don't have DEBEMAIL set
[08:50] <soren> superm1: Huh?
[08:50] <YokoZar1> I cannot upload to REVU, I have put a new Wine and ia32-libs package at my own webspace here: http://wine.budgetdedicated.com/experimental/
[08:51] <superm1> soren, isn't that behavior supposed to be to prevent new people from mis listing maintainer addy?
[08:51] <soren> superm1: If your DEBEMAIL has "ubuntu.com" in it, it's likely you're working on packages for Ubuntu. And packages for Ubuntu are the ones that should have an original maintainer field.
[08:51] <superm1> or is it a different purpose?
[08:51] <superm1> ah i see
[08:51] <asisak> Good morning!
[08:52] <YokoZar1> ScottK: http://wine.budgetdedicated.com/experimental/
[08:53] <superm1> mornin asisak
[08:54] <superm1> soren, those vmware modules you were going to be doing for l-u-m, are those going to happen for gutsy, or is l-u-m closed from new stuff now?
[08:55] <pwnguin> !nouveau
[08:55] <ubotu> Nouveau is an experimental open-source nVidia driver, aiming for full 3d support.  Homepage at http://nouveau.freedesktop.org/ - EXPERIMENTAL packages at https://launchpad.net/~raof/+archive
[09:00] <dholbach> good morning
[09:01] <tonyyarusso> pkern: Are you in charge of sobby as well as gobby?
[09:03] <soren> superm1: I expect them to land in the -virtual image for gutsy.
[09:03] <superm1> soren, awesome
[09:04] <superm1> morning dholbach
[09:04] <dholbach> hey superm1
[09:08] <pkern> tonyyarusso: Aye.
[09:08] <tonyyarusso> pkern: 'k.  What's the preferred method for submitting feature requests / specifications?
[09:08] <pkern> tonyyarusso: http://gobby.0x539.de/trac/
[09:09] <tonyyarusso> okay
[09:09] <pkern> tonyyarusso: Don't submit undo, please. :-P
[09:09] <tonyyarusso> pkern: hehe, no.  flat-file editing with sobby
[09:09] <tonyyarusso> was just talking about it in -us
[09:10] <pkern> tonyyarusso: You are free to make up a patch. Sobby is somewhat neglected, i.e. it works and it could serve as a base for further developments but well...
[09:10] <highvoltage> hey elkbuntu. how's the new job going?
[09:10] <pkern> tonyyarusso: Armin is currently working on a new solution for collaborative editing and undo still isn't implemented in obby. (Although it might be possible now, with a lot of time.)
[09:11] <tonyyarusso> pkern: I unfortunately don't know a lick of coding, but can generally describe what I have in my head decently.
[09:11] <elkbuntu> highvoltage, still in training. it's sooooooooooooooo crap.
[09:11] <highvoltage> elkbuntu: sorry :(
[09:12] <tonyyarusso> elkbuntu: you're alive!  And online!
[09:12] <tonyyarusso> elkbuntu: If it makes you feel any better, my dad is being forced to go to a 12-day, 12-hours-a-day leadership conference this week.
[09:12] <tonyyarusso> Which is especially funny since he's probably had more leadership training than the guys running it.
[09:12] <elkbuntu> highvoltage, atm we're learning how we will have to explain the countries most complex and ridiculous billing system to joe blogs type people. we're struggling to comprehend it and in 3 weeks time we'll be having to try explain it to consumers...
[09:13] <Fujitsu> superm1: Which package are you attacking?
[09:13] <elkbuntu> tonyyarusso, i'd totally prefer that actually
[09:14] <highvoltage> elkbuntu: heh, if it makes you feel any better, I went on a course last week on how to deal with government employees while we do the migration
[09:14] <highvoltage> elkbuntu: not that I have to work with the end-user anyway... at least it was just 2 days
[09:14] <superm1> Fujitsu, i attacked mplayer
[09:14] <highvoltage> elkbuntu: and we had to do a bit role-playing.. which was slightly fun
[09:14] <RAOF> superm1: With a sword, I hope.
[09:14] <superm1> RAOF, with a mighty large sword actually
[09:15] <Fujitsu> superm1: Erm, using bzr, I hope?
[09:15] <superm1> Fujitsu, two minor changes that are in a dpatch in bzr now
[09:15] <superm1> of course :)
[09:15] <Fujitsu> dpatch is bzr... if you say so.
[09:15] <Fujitsu> *in
[09:15] <Fujitsu> THey released rc2 about 45 minutes ago!
[09:15] <Fujitsu> More than 11 months after the previous.
[09:15] <superm1> well it wasn't a new uvf that i uploaded, mine were rather minor :)
[09:15] <elkbuntu> highvoltage, i'll explain more when i return, i have to now go buy more toilet paper because the crappy 1970's enameled steel cistern of my toilet decided to crack. I managed to patch it with superglue, but now i have 5 soggy rolls of toilet paper that i am so totally unwilling to use...
[09:15] <Fujitsu> Noted.
[09:16] <Fujitsu> The changelog looks sooooo much like a second RC. No new features. At all. Of course not.
[09:17] <StevenK> elkbuntu: !!!
[09:17] <elkbuntu> StevenK! please save me!!!!!!!1! :(
[09:17] <superm1> Fujitsu, gawd.  these guys need to learn what 'release candidate' means
[09:17] <StevenK> elkbuntu: Then come visit me. :-)
[09:17] <elkbuntu> anyway, afk
[09:18] <RAOF> Fujitsu: Even better, change in default behaviour since RC1. :)
[09:18] <Fujitsu> superm1: Just a bit.
[09:18] <Fujitsu> I didn't even bother to read the whole changelog.
[09:19] <RAOF> Heh, and new untested features.
[09:19] <superm1> Fujitsu, some of the changes look very appealing to me though.  h264 improvements listed across 3 areas, matroska improvements
[09:19] <pwnguin> ooh
[09:20] <Fujitsu> superm1: Yeah, but it's definitely not a RC.
[09:20] <superm1> yeah
[09:20] <Fujitsu> I'll upload it to my PPA in a couple of minutes.
[09:21] <Fujitsu> I daren't look.
[09:21] <superm1> haha
[09:22] <StevenK> RAOF: Bwahaha
[09:23] <Fujitsu> Oh, I see, Epiphany decided to render the .tar.bz2, so my machine froze up.
[09:25] <Fujitsu> superm1: Thanks for fixing those.
[09:25] <superm1> Fujitsu, yeah they were turning up mighty annoying on my boxen and resultant mythbuntu disks too :)
[09:26] <Fujitsu> Ah.
[09:26] <superm1> so i figured that's the proper solution
[09:30] <Fujitsu>  3160 files changed, 433441 insertions(+), 328901 deletions(-)
[09:30] <Fujitsu> What an RC.
[09:30] <StevenK> RC Candidate #1: Rewrote everything, kthxbye!
[09:30] <StevenK> Fujitsu: Don't make me hurt you.
[09:31] <Fujitsu> Damn
[09:31] <Fujitsu> william@irranat:~/MOTUing/MPlayer/orig/MPlayer-1.0rc1$ find | xargs wc -l
[09:31] <Fujitsu> [...] 
[09:32] <Fujitsu>  1120079 total
[09:32] <Fujitsu> That can't be right.
[09:32] <StevenK> find -type f ?
[09:32] <Fujitsu> Same...
[09:33] <Fujitsu> Modified 1/3 of the codebase. Ouch.
[09:33] <StevenK> 1.1 million lines of code? Naaaah
[09:33] <StevenK> Oh wait, are they including every single library they link against?
[09:33] <Fujitsu> Pretty much, I think.
[09:33] <StevenK> Idiots
[09:34] <Fujitsu> Only 761704 lines in *.[ch] 
[09:37] <RAOF> StevenK: Well, they have to, of course.  Libraries don't provide stable API/ABI, don't you know!
[09:37] <RAOF> Also, libraries never release
[09:37] <Fujitsu> Yay, ffmpeg.
[09:38] <StevenK> They do if their authors aren't <expletive deleted> <expletive deleted> <expletive deleted> <expletive deleted>.
[09:38] <RAOF> Indeedydo.  I'd be tempted to try and actually do some release management for them, if the developers weren't absolutely and totally hostile to the very idea of releasing their library.
[09:38] <jussi01> good morning everyone...
[09:39] <StevenK> RAOF: "Release
[09:39] <StevenK> Gah
[09:39] <jussi01> StevenK: that was a nice thing to walk in and see
[09:39] <jussi01> :)
[09:39] <StevenK> jussi01: :-P
[09:39] <RAOF> jussi01: Good morning!  Welcome to the annual "ffmpeg is stupid" bitchfest
[09:39] <StevenK> RAOF: "Release? Oh my God, then we'd have to admit we made a mistake at some point in the future!"
[09:39] <persia> Annual?
[09:40] <jussi01> RAOF: annual? I thought it was bi-weekly?
[09:40] <StevenK> Daily? :-P
[09:40] <RAOF> persia: Eh.  Whatever.  That's the first word that came to mind :)
[09:40] <RAOF> StevenK: And how could we possibly provide a stable API while still being able to micro-optimise 0.1% speedups for obscure codecs?
[09:41] <StevenK> RAOF: Without being <expletive deleted> <expletive deleted> <expletive deleted> <expletive deleted>? :-)
[09:41] <Fujitsu> Very useful, yes.

[09:56] <AJ_uni> Greeting ye Masters, sorry to barge in like this again, but I assume it's getting harder and harder to re-sync by every minute right now, if not entirely impossible already, so if any from the motu-uvf team is present, may I ask to take a look at bug #149606, and bug #145538 for the steps explaining the former? Thanks. :)
[09:56] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 149606 in python-gammu "FreezeException for python-gammu 0.22-2" [Undecided,Invalid]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/149606
[09:56] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 145538 in wammu "[UNMETDEPS]  wammu has unmet dependencies" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/145538
[10:02] <pwnguin> RAOF: what does one set the xorg driver to with your package? nouveau?
[10:03] <RAOF> pwnguin: Yup.
[10:03] <RAOF> pwnguin: Remember, it currently won't work (unless you've updated the packages)
[10:04] <pwnguin> good to know
[10:04] <pwnguin> why does your package lack a changelog?
[10:05] <pwnguin> (or readmes =/)
[10:05] <StevenK> Like Nouveau has documentation anyway
[10:06] <pwnguin> heh
[10:07] <RAOF> pwnguin: Does it?  Hm, I'll look at it when I'm updating my packages this evening :)
[10:07] <pwnguin> RAOF: xserver-video-nouveou-trunk seems to be missing a changelog in /usr/share/doc
[10:07] <pwnguin> i suppose for a PPA that sort of thing's fine
[10:08] <RAOF> As in an upstream changelog?  I don't think they have them.
[10:08] <pwnguin> no
[10:08] <pwnguin> as in any changelog
[10:08] <RAOF> Oh.
[10:08] <pwnguin> traditionally from debian
[10:08] <pwnguin> (the dir)
[10:08] <pwnguin> they do have git comments
[10:08] <pwnguin> in upstream, but its hardly the same as a readable changelog
[10:10] <RAOF> I'm not sure why the changelog isn't in there.  Although it's basically "update to new git snapshot" x 10
[10:10] <pwnguin> heh
[10:10] <pwnguin> well, i was looking for a setup hint, and all i found was a copyright. so something's right
[10:11] <pwnguin> at any rate, if you have new packages pushed out in the next eight hours, I guess I'll take a look.
[10:11] <pwnguin> I should go to bed, its 3am here
[10:13] <pwnguin> or move to austrialia
[10:13] <pwnguin> since they seem to be on my schedule
[10:14] <RAOF> :)
[10:15] <RAOF> Amaranth: Incidentally, yes.  I did have to do something to use iwl.  Blacklist ipw, and add iwl to /etc/modules
[10:16] <Amaranth> RAOF: I had to add ATTRS{type}=="1"
[10:16] <RAOF> Amaranth: To where?
[10:16] <Amaranth> in 70-persistent-net.rules
[10:16] <Amaranth> udev
[10:16] <RAOF> Hm.  Why?
[10:16] <Amaranth> RAOF: otherwise I get a broken wlan0_rename device
[10:17] <RAOF> Well, I get a *working* wlan0_rename device :)
[11:15] <huats> good morning all
[11:17] <\sh> remoins..
[11:22] <geser> morning
[11:23] <Fujitsu> Hi geser.
[11:24] <geser> Hi Fujitsu
[11:30] <PETRO> Enter text here...
[11:30] <PETRO> U
[11:30] <PETRO> U
[11:30] <PETRO> UU
[11:30] <proppy> hi
[11:33] <pwnguin> whats this about iwl? a totally free replacement for ipw?
[11:34] <dholbach> hey geser
[11:34] <geser> Hi dholbach
[11:35] <BugMaN> hi all
[11:35] <RAOF> pwnguin: Yes; also it mostly works.
[12:12] <pwnguin> seriously, why does azureus use jni? all it seems to do is tank randomly =/
[12:12] <pwnguin> # Problematic frame:
[12:12] <pwnguin> # C  [libglibjni-0.4.so+0x9172] 
[12:14] <Amaranth> pwnguin: azureus is junk anyway
[12:15] <Fujitsu> Our azureus is also out of date.
[12:15] <pwnguin> actually, aside from crashing / memory hogging
[12:15] <pwnguin> it's quite fany
[12:15] <pwnguin> fancy
[12:15] <Fujitsu> And being generally slow.
[12:15] <Amaranth> RAOF: dude the -rt kernel is awesome
[12:15] <Amaranth> Makes me so sad that I can't use it all the time
[12:15] <pwnguin> the -rt kernel has actual patches now?
[12:16] <persia> Amaranth: Why not?  Does it not work properly for some uses?
[12:16] <Amaranth> persia: It locks the CPU in C0
[12:16] <Amaranth> no good for a laptop
[12:16] <pwnguin> heh
[12:16] <persia> Amaranth: Ah.
[12:16] <Amaranth> excessive heat and power usage
[12:16] <pwnguin> well, welcome to realtime land
[12:16] <Amaranth> the heat i can handle while i'm plugged in
[12:16] <Amaranth> but i was doing some stuff earlier, ran an apt-get upgrade, didn't even notice
[12:16] <RAOF> Amaranth: What's particularly cool about -rt?
[12:17] <Amaranth> RAOF: Music never skips, GUI never stutters, no matter what
[12:17] <RAOF> pwnguin: I got an email from someone today saying "please fix azureus", because I looked at updating our packages.
[12:17] <RAOF> Amaranth: Ok, that's pretty cool.  Does nvidia work on -rt now?
[12:18] <Amaranth> yeah, i've got nvidia and iwl3945
[12:18] <Amaranth> i'm trying to remember the name of the tools to do load testing
[12:18] <Amaranth> so i can boost it to 1000 load and watch everything still work :)
[12:18] <Fujitsu> RAOF: Yes, thankyou for taking the let's-bug-him-because-he-dealt-with-it-last role from me.
[12:18] <RAOF> Fujitsu: :(
[12:19] <RAOF> We probably should do something about azureus, if only taking it out of the archive.
[12:19] <RAOF> And by "we" I mean "someone who's not me".  That package is... urgh.
[12:19] <pwnguin> RAOF: so what's the diff between azureus and azureus-gcj?
[12:20] <RAOF> pwnguin: azureus-gcj is compiled to native code; azureus runs on a jvm.
[12:20] <RAOF> Azureus-gcj works, apparently.  Maybe we should remove just remove azureus.  Eh
[12:21] <Fujitsu> I think we should probably just sync it from Debian.
[12:22] <Fujitsu> Dropping Ubuntu patches, as they seem crap anyway.
[12:22] <persia> Does Debian's version work under Ubuntu?
[12:22] <sladen> what do the ubuntu patches do?
[12:23] <pwnguin> looks like it removes a lot of that stupid internet update crap
[12:25] <Amaranth> RAOF: just ran `stress --cpu 8 --io 4 --vm 2 --vm-bytes 128M --timeout 10s`, no problems
[12:25] <pkern> What's the status I should set NACK'ed syncs to? Won't Fix or Invalid?
[12:25] <Amaranth> stress --cpu 30 starts getting touchy
[12:27] <persia> pkern: NACK'd syncs?
[12:28] <pwnguin> negative acknowledgement on a request to sync from debian
[12:29] <persia> Ah.  Depends on the reason.  If it's "We don't want that", it's "Wontfix".  If it's "That's not a properly filled out bug", it's "invalid".  If it's just a case of "not at this time in the cycle", I think it's better to leave open until the next cycle starts, and review it again.
[12:31] <sladen> you can confirm it and milestone it for later
[12:32] <pwnguin> do we have ubuntu+2 milestones?
[12:32] <persia> pwnguin: Why would we want that?  Is there something that shouldn't be in Hardy?
[12:32] <Fujitsu> sladen: Milestones won't stop -archive attacking...
[12:33] <pwnguin> persia: uh...
[12:33] <pwnguin> persia: isnt hardy ubuntu+2?
[12:34] <persia> pwnguin: No.  It's currently +1, with an expectation to become the development target in a few weeks, and 8.04 in April.
[12:34] <sladen> *brain explodes*
[12:34] <Fujitsu> persia: No, Hardy is Ubuntu+2.
[12:34] <Fujitsu> (see #ubuntu+1)
[12:34] <pwnguin> heh
[12:34] <sladen> gutsy is +1 with the expectation to become 7.10 next week
[12:34] <persia> Ah.  Yes.  Fujitsu is correct.  My apologies.  Hardy is gusty+1 & ubuntu +2.
[12:34] <persia> s/gusty/gutsy/
[12:35] <sladen> hardy is +2 with the expectation to become 8.04, 8.05, or 8.06 next year
[12:35] <Fujitsu> It had better be 8.04.
[12:35] <Fujitsu> I don't think anybody wants another Edgy.
[12:35] <pwnguin> I heard this from someone in my lug that sabdfl suggested there will be no more delays
[12:35] <pwnguin> i thought edgy was fine
[12:36] <pwnguin> from a user standpoint
[12:36] <persia> pwnguin: From a developer cycle, it was rather rushed.
[12:36] <pwnguin> indeed
[12:37] <pkern> persia: It will be autosynced in the next cycle.
[12:37] <pwnguin> although, i think it was edgy where azureus started crapping out ;)
[12:37] <persia> pkern: Easy karma then :)
[12:38] <pkern> It's not about karma ):
[12:38] <highvoltage> pkern: not!?
[12:38] <persia> pkern: Still, the bug represents a valid user wish, and we will be fixing it, so I don't think either "invalid" or "wontfix" is appropriate.
[12:39] <pkern> persia: Nope it's not.
[12:39] <pkern> persia: :-P
[12:39] <pkern> Or rather "it does not".
[12:39] <pwnguin> so mark it confirmed with a target milestone of hardy
[12:40] <Fujitsu> I'd say wontfix is probably appropriate.
[12:40] <persia> pkern: Does not represent a valid wish?  I suppose it depends on the text of the bug.  If it's "wontfix", the comment should specifically say "wontfix for gutsy because of timing"
[12:41] <pkern> I flagged it won't fix now and I think it's reasonable. :-P
[12:43] <pwnguin> i still think marking it confirmed and milestoning for hardy is reasonable, unless they're pushing for an -updates release for feisty gutsy et all
[12:49] <bigon> \o/
[12:51] <pkern> bigon: Congrats. :-P
[12:53] <bigon> pkern: thx :)
[12:59] <RAOF> bigon: Yay, congrats :)
[01:00] <bigon> RAOF: thx :)
[01:18] <huats> bigon: congratulations
[01:18] <bigon> huats: thank you :)
[01:19] <mok0> I'd like to setup locally an automated building queue to build packages in i386 & amd64 arch. Can I get a script, somewhere?
[01:20] <persia> mok0: What kind of queue?  Just for a quick build, or something automated and distributed?
[01:21] <mok0> A script that will look for *changes files in a directory at certain intervals, build the .debs, and place them in a local repo
[01:22] <persia> mok0: You might try http://debomatic.linuxdc.it/, but it's a work in progress.
[01:22] <mok0> persia: that sort of looks like what I'm looking for...
[01:23] <persia> mok0: http://packages.debian.org/unstable/devel/dak is the official everything solution, but it's more than most people want.
[01:23] <Fujitsu> dak is.... erm.... non-trivial to set up.
[01:24] <mok0> "don't look at this if you only have a few hundred packages to maintain" :-)
[01:24] <persia> That's a bit of an understatement :)
[01:24] <mok0> persia: hehe
[01:24] <mok0> persia: I'll give debomatic a try, thx for the pointer!
[01:25] <persia> mok0: No problem.  The primary author is usually around CET evenings and weekends, in case the code is insufficient documentation.
[01:25] <mok0> We just benchmarked i386 vs. amd64 on the same machine, amd64 has a speed gain of 33%
[01:26] <persia> mok0: For what application load?
[01:26] <mok0> 1
[01:26] <mok0> The 64 bit arch used to be a lot slower than i386 on the same machine
[01:27] <persia> Rather, what was it doing?  For some code, 64-bits should be faster, and for other code, slower, depending on memory, IO, internal variables, etc.
[01:27] <mok0> This is a typical application that we use. It does a lot of floating point ops, not much i/o
[01:28] <mok0> probably a lot of memory
[01:29] <mok0> Anyway, that's the way we prefer to do benchmarks, we take a typical application that people use. I don't care too much about the theory (why it is faster)...
[01:31] <persia> mok0: Just be sure to document that it's faster under load X when you publish.  Other application loads may have different results.
[01:32] <mok0> persia: OK, makes sense. There was something on slashdot today where a guy has done some tests with multiple threads on various OS's -- Linux didn't cut it too well compared to NetBSD...
[01:35] <persia> mok0: Competition is good: it makes everything better, as long as the domain is specified (e.g. thread optimisation).
[01:36] <mok0> persia: It will be interesting to see how the new fair scheduler performs
[01:41] <huats> asac: hey
[01:42] <huats> asac: I hope you had a nice WE, because I am here and I will bother you with my questions...
[01:42] <huats> :-)
[01:45] <asac> huats: sure ...
[01:45] <huats> asac: (besides my stupid questions, I really hope you had a nice WE)
[01:52] <asac> huats: are there questions left?
[01:53] <RAOF> mok0: You could also look at falcon, if Seveas has finished the buildd frontend to it.
[01:53] <Seveas> fabo, haven't :)
[02:05] <huats> asac: actually I have :-) I haven't saw your answer about the torbutton (still) but this time the icedove thing... I think it could be a good idea (since it is a dupplicate) to remove the dedicated binary which is built from the same package.And as a consequence to add thunderbird/icedove to the possible dependency of the package ? do you agree with that ?
[02:12] <asac> huats: yes ... that was the plan
[02:12] <asac> huats: if torbutton is compatible with firefox 3.0 please install a link to /usr/lib/xulrunner-addons/ as well
[02:12] <asac> and depend on firefox-3.0
[02:13] <asac> of course you need to add that dir to your .dirs file then
[02:16] <SlimG2> Is it "legal" to have a .deb package add a cronjob-entry? if so: how is this to be done the proper way?
[02:17] <persia> SlimG2: dh_installcron
[02:17] <SlimG2> persia: thank you, I'll try that
[02:17] <huats> asac: the gutsy revision is not compatible with FF3... or at least is not considered as compatible...
[02:17] <huats> asac: and for the plan, I just wanted to be sure that we shared it:-)
[02:20] <jussi01> can someone point me to a tutorial for rolling your own ubuntu cd?
[02:21] <mok0> jussi01: http://www.google.com ;-)
[02:21] <asac> huats: ok
[02:22] <jussi01> mok0: ok, ill rephrase.... can someone point me to a _good_ tutorial for rolling your own ubuntu cd?
[02:22] <SlimG2> jussi01: http://www.theyagar.com/2006/12/31/how-to-create-a-custom-ubuntu-distro/
[02:22] <gnomefreak> jussi01: theres one on the wiki iirc
[02:22] <mok0> jussi01: you mean, with your own set of software on it?
[02:23] <jussi01> mok0: yeah, but only stuff from the repos...
[02:23] <gnomefreak> jussi01: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/LiveCDCustomization
[02:24] <jussi01> gnomefreak: SlimG2 mok0 thank you very much
[02:24] <gnomefreak> np
[02:24] <SlimG2> google-proxying for your comfort ;)
[02:25] <persia> jussi01: You may also be interested in https://help.ubuntu.com/community/LiveCDCustomizationFromScratch, if you want something very different.
[02:25] <gnomefreak> any motu(s) feel like taking a look at http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=360 and http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=284 please ack if you can :) thank you
[02:26] <asisak> Hey ScottK, norsetto
[02:26] <ScottK> Hello asisak.
[02:26] <jussi01> persia: ok! thanks!
[02:26] <norsetto> scottk, asisak: Hi guys
[02:28] <norsetto> ScottK: hehe, no, that was the gulag (which is not an hungarian dish either....)
[02:28] <geser> Hi norsetto
[02:29] <norsetto> hi geser
[02:30] <ScottK> norsetto: How's your Perl?
[02:30] <norsetto> ScottK: my what :-)?
[02:30] <ScottK> norsetto: Do you code in Perl at all?
[02:35] <norsetto> ScottK: is there a way to disable this kwallet thingie? Its driving me crazy.
[02:37] <ScottK> norsetto: IIRC there is, but I don't bother, I just give it always access and so it bothers me once per reboot (which in my case is usually a long time).  If you really want to stop it, I'd ask around in #kubuntu.
[02:37] <ScottK> Sorry I don't have specific help.
[02:38] <norsetto> scottK; hey, np, its just getting on my nerves (its always asking for a password, but god only knows which one)
[02:38] <ScottK> norsetto: If wallet is asking you for a password it's (AFAIK) going to be the wallet password.
[02:39] <jpatrick> norsetto: open kcontrol -> security -> KWallet and disable it there
[02:39] <norsetto> scottK; yes, I imaged as well, the problem is what password that is (don't remember ever giving it one).
[02:39] <gnomefreak> sudo apt-get remove --purge libqt3-mt && sudo apt-get install ubuntu-desktop  (will fix all your kwallet issues i promise) ;)
[02:40] <ScottK> gnomefreak: He's already a recovering Gnome user.  I doubt he'll be seriously tempted.
[02:40] <gnomefreak> ah
[02:42] <norsetto> jpatrick: thx, this should do it
[02:44] <mok0> What are your views on the lack of an /etc/profile.d directory in ubuntu?
[02:49] <geser> Hi Hobbsee
[02:50] <leonel> Hello Motuland !
[02:54] <norsetto> hi Hobbsee
[02:54] <Hobbsee> hiya norsetto
[02:55] <jussi01> hello Hobbsee
[02:58] <ScottK> Hobbsee: Do you have time for motu-uvf stuff now?
[02:58] <Hobbsee> ScottK: perhaps, why?
[02:59] <ScottK> There's some I think worth giving a 2nd ack to.
[02:59] <ScottK> If you have time, I'll give you links.
[03:03] <ScottK> Hobbsee: Bug #148801 Bug #141640 Bug #144258 are worth a look (or maybe soren if he's around)....
[03:03] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 148801 in lyx "[UVFe]  lyx 1.5.0 -> 1.5.1" [Medium,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/148801
[03:03] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 141640 in ipod-sharp "UVFe ipod-sharp 0.6.3 -> 0.6.4" [Undecided,Incomplete]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/141640
[03:03] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 144258 in scribes "[UVFe]  Please sync scribes (universe) 0.3.2.9-1 from Debian Unstable (main)" [Medium,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/144258
[03:05] <norsetto> asac: any chance you can give a look @ bug 150529?
[03:05] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 150529 in firefox-3.0 "firefox.sh: unexpected operator ()" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/150529
[03:17] <ScottK> YokoZar1: Did you get anyone to look at your ia32 libs revision yet?
[03:20] <asac> norsetto: yes ... committed
[03:20] <norsetto> asac: thx, great!
[03:22] <asac> norsetto: can you please test if everything works for you with that change?
[03:22] <norsetto> asac: sure
[03:22] <norsetto> asac: let me change desktop
[03:36] <ScottK> Is there a MOTU here with a 64bit arch that can look at the proposed ia-32 libs update? http://wine.budgetdedicated.com/experimental/ia32-libs_2.1ubuntu3.dsc (warning it's a 360MB source).
[03:36] <ScottK> dholbach: Maybe you could find someone to look at this ^^^
[03:37] <ScottK> \sh: Have you looked at the latest WIne package? http://wine.budgetdedicated.com/experimental/wine_0.9.46-0ubuntu1.dsc
[03:37] <ScottK> \sh: I'd appreciate your comments.
[03:38] <dholbach> ScottK: best to ask doko - he knows a lot about ia32libs
[03:38] <Hobbsee> ew, ia32libs
[03:38] <ScottK> dholbach: Thanks.
[03:39] <ScottK> Hobbsee: I only care because it's blocking a Wine upload and I want to make sure we release with the latest wine crack possible.
[03:39] <Hobbsee> ScottK: mmm ok
[03:40] <Hobbsee> oh, for reviewing ia32libs.  thought you meant the uvfe stuff
[03:40] <Hobbsee> StevenK: might
[03:40] <ScottK> doko: Would you please look at a proposed ia-32 libs revision: http://wine.budgetdedicated.com/experimental/ia32-libs_2.1ubuntu3.dsc?  We need this for a proposed WINE update.  IIRC, it adds openssl 0.9.8.
[03:40] <ScottK> Hobbsee: Soren already acked the scribes UVFe, so no need to look at that one.
[03:40] <Hobbsee> ScottK: assuming it's somewhat sane, just do it.
[03:40] <Hobbsee> ah, great
[03:41] <ScottK> Hobbsee: I will, but I'd like to find someone else to share the blame if I can.
[03:41] <Hobbsee> why?
[03:41] <pkern> So what can I do? /me got spare time now.
[03:41] <doko> ScottK: diff of the non-binary files?
[03:41] <Hobbsee> pkern: you can review ia32libs!  thanks for asking1
[03:41] <pkern> Hobbsee: Aye.
[03:41] <ScottK> doko: That'll take a bit, but sure.
[03:41] <Hobbsee> Fujitsu: go ahead for lyx
[03:42] <pkern> Only 2M/s.
[03:42] <pkern> What a pity.
[03:42] <doko> ScottK, pkern: please don't upload yet
[03:43] <Hobbsee> ScottK: done
[03:43] <ScottK> Hobbsee: Thanks.
[03:43] <ScottK> doko: I'm downloading it now.  I'll make you a diff.
[03:45] <ScottK> pkern: Do you do Perl?
[03:48] <zul> hey
[03:49] <ScottK> Heya zul
[03:49] <zul> thank god for holidays today
[03:49] <ScottK> Sort of.  It's not an actual factual officialish Federal Holiday, so I'm still working.
[03:50] <zul> thanksgiving today
[03:50] <ScottK> zul: I guess I was mistaken, I'd thought you were in the US.  Silly me.
[03:50] <bddebian> Heya gang
[03:50] <zul> hell no :)
[03:51] <asisak> zul: what kind of holidays do you have today?
[03:51] <asisak> hey bddebian
[03:51] <mlind> what's the policy about milestoning bug reports? should it be done by devs only?
[03:51] <ScottK> heya bddebian.
[03:52] <ScottK> bddebian: WRT your last #debian-mentors comment, I totally feel your pain.
[03:52] <norsetto> asac: do you know why there is no firefox-3.0 binary in the archives? Perhaps its being replaced by -ubuntu2?
[03:53] <asac> norsetto: might be ... just wait a bit
[03:53] <asac> norsetto: be sure to use archive.ubuntu.com
[03:53] <norsetto> asac: yes
[03:53] <asac> norsetto: you can pull the binaries directly i guess: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/firefox-3.0/3.0~alpha8-0ubuntu2
[03:54] <norsetto> asac: thats what I did with the source, but the binary is not there (yet)
[03:55] <zul> asisak: canadian thanksigving
[03:55] <ScottK> Columbus Day here in the US.  Sort of a holiday for some people...
[03:56] <asac> norsetto: click on the architecture you have ... then on the left hand side there are links to the binary packages in _launchpad_
[03:57] <norsetto> asac: yes, just downloaded :-)
[03:57] <bddebian> Heya asisak, ScottK
[03:58] <Hobbsee> mlind: usually, yeah.  which one?
[03:58] <Hobbsee> mlind: as in, it actually has to have someone to fix it
[04:00] <\sh> ScottK, this evening I'll have a look and mail something to u-m@l.u.c
[04:00] <ScottK> \sh: Thanks.
[04:01] <pkern> ScottK: Do you have me a pointer?
[04:02] <\sh> ScottK, on my company machines I don't have any development environment ready, just because we don't know when we have to leave this company ;)
[04:02] <ScottK> pkern: I think Bug #126939 would be reasonably easy to fix for someone that actually knows Perl (e.g. not me).
[04:02] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 126939 in razor "spamd creates file in /" [Medium,Triaged]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/126939
[04:02] <norsetto> asac: cesare@desktop:~$ firefox-3.0
[04:02] <norsetto> *NOTICE* No previous firefox profile found, starting with a fresh one
[04:02] <norsetto> asac: so, it works ...
[04:02] <ScottK> \sh: Understand.  Tonight is no problem at all as I have to get a new ia32-libs uploaded first.
[04:03] <\sh> ScottK, cool...you rock :)
[04:04] <StevenK> It might blow a fuse
[04:04] <mlind> Hobbsee: it was just a generic question. bug #78690 is preventing some feisty users to upgrade to gutsy, so I though milestoning would be okay to get it in the radar of the release team.
[04:04] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 78690 in bluez-utils "[Feisty]  bluez-utils update hangs on stopping bluetooth service" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/78690
[04:08] <norsetto> asac: and if there is a profile already: cesare@desktop:~$ firefox-3.0
[04:08] <norsetto> *NOTICE* No previous firefox-3.0 profile found, we'll initialize a profile using a copy of your existing 'firefox' profile.
[04:08] <norsetto> Transfering... done.
[04:08] <asac> norsetto: good
[04:08] <asac> thats a known bug
[04:08] <asac> a fix will land for that
[04:08] <asac> does it work though?
[04:09] <norsetto> asac: yes, in both cases
[04:09] <asac> norsetto: oh ... does that happen after the first run?
[04:09] <norsetto> asac: yes, but I cleared the .moziila dir
[04:09] <asac> hmm
[04:09] <asac> ok
[04:10] <norsetto> asac: and moved my old .mozilla back
[04:10] <asac> norsetto: it cleared the .mozilla dir?
[04:11] <asac> norsetto: our _you_ cleared it?
[04:11] <norsetto> asac: first I moved my .mozilla to .mozilla-old
[04:12] <norsetto> asac: then executed firefox-3.0; and it reported *NOTICE* No previous firefox profile found, starting with a fresh one
[04:12] <norsetto> norsetto: then I deleted the just created .mozilla and moved my .mozilla-old to .mozilla
[04:13] <norsetto> asac: then I re-run firefox-3.0 and got:  *NOTICE* No previous firefox-3.0 profile found, we'll initialize a profile using a copy of your existing 'firefox' profile.
[04:13] <asac> norsetto: and now all is fine?
[04:14] <norsetto> asac: as fine as things can be with firefox .....
[04:14] <asac> norsetto: why did you do the first step?
[04:14] <pkern> ScottK: Uh where should the logfile be created in our opinion? /root?
[04:14] <asac> e.g. first I moved my .mozilla to .mozilla-old
[04:14] <norsetto> asac: wanted to check that branch
[04:14] <Hobbsee> mlind: yeah, i'd milestone that
[04:17] <ScottK> pkern: In the $HOME dir of the $USER (which in this case is root).
[04:17] <norsetto> asac: btw, I tested gecko-mediaplayer with granparadiso few days ago, and, strangely, it didn't work. Perhaps plug-ins are not yet enabled in granparadiso?
[04:18] <ScottK> pkern: There's a nother bug on SpamAssassin about starting razor with the wrong user.
[04:18] <Kopfgeldjaeger> hi
[04:19] <pkern> ScottK: When I call razor-check as root it's properly created in /root. I suspect that HOME is set incorrectly.
[04:19] <mlind> Hobbsee: thanks, will do.
[04:21] <ScottK> pkern: How does that happen then?  Is it all just an artifact of Bug #147992 or a separate issue?
[04:21] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 147992 in spamassassin "spamd starts razor as root despite -u spamd" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/147992
[04:21] <pkern> Maybe it should specify -home on invokation, hm.
[04:21] <zul> ScottK, for that disksearch im just patch and upload it
[04:21] <ScottK> zul: Sounds reasonable to me.
[04:22] <pkern> root@asterix:~# HOME= razor-check -d 9 Razor-Log: Computed razorhome from env: /.razor
[04:22] <pkern> It does not check who is running razor, it just uses HOME to deduce the "right" directory.
[04:23] <ScottK> That doesn't sound prudent.
[04:25] <pkern> ScottK: Well, what should it do? Do a getent call to determine the home of whoami?
[04:26] <pkern> ScottK: I feel that spamassassin calling razor should pass a -home.
[04:26] <ScottK> And in which case then razor would get it right.
[04:26] <ScottK> pkern: Feel like patching spamassassin then?  Dumping random files in to "/" seems like a bad thing to leave for the release.
[04:27] <pkern> ScottK: Just at http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/pkgreport.cgi?pkg=razor;dist=unstable
[04:27] <pkern> ScottK: s/Just/Look/ o_O
[04:28] <ScottK> OK.  So it's not a new problem.
[04:31] <AstralJava> dholbach: Thanks for your patience. :) Bug #150587 filed according to the FE-process.
[04:31] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 150587 in gammu "FreezeException for gammu 1.13.0 from sid" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/150587
[04:32] <dholbach> AstralJava: looks good, you just need to subscribe motu-uvf
[04:32] <dholbach> hey fernando
[04:32] <AstralJava> dholbach: ahh... forgot about that, just added you according to the email.
[04:33] <dholbach> AstralJava: thanks
[04:33] <AstralJava> dholbach: done
[04:33] <dholbach> great
[04:33] <ScottK> AstralJava: OK.  I'm confused.  I thought the reason to sync python-gammu was because it was to old for gammu.  Now we have to sync gammu too?
[04:33] <dholbach> ScottK: there's gammu, wammu and python-gammu
[04:34] <ScottK> Ah.
[04:34] <dholbach> seems wammu was synced, python-gammu synced now, now it needs a newer gammu (libgammu-dev)
[04:34] <ScottK> So how is it someone test built python-gammu and didn't find this?  Are the depends incorrectly versioned?
[04:34] <dholbach> it looks OK from what I can see, but it should have been discovered earlier that ...
[04:35] <AstralJava> Yep. Now I only see the seb128 has synced python-gammu 0.22-3, instead of 0.22-2, so I'm guessing sid got a newer version after I made the steps for FreezeException, will that cause trouble?
[04:35] <AstralJava> ScottK: I made that mistake. Didn't think it thru.
[04:35] <ScottK> Depends on what's in -3.
[04:36] <AstralJava> Guess that makes me a hopeless hopeful...
[04:36] <ScottK> Stuff like "Huge gammu/gammu.c split to smaller files." makes me very nervous.
[04:36] <AstralJava> Alright, shall I reproduce the steps for 0.22-3?
[04:37] <fernando> hey dholbach
[04:38] <ScottK> AstralJava: 0.22-3 has already been sync'ed, right?
[04:38] <AstralJava> ScottK: According to Bug 145538, that's what I'd say, but maybe I'm just reading it wrong.
[04:38] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 145538 in wammu "Sync request: python-gammu (0.22-3; universe) from sid" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/145538
[04:39] <ScottK> Yes.
[04:39] <ScottK> No need then.
[04:39] <AstralJava> 'k.
[04:41] <ScottK> I'm suprised that one got done since it wasn't approved yet.
[04:42] <AstralJava> ScottK: I was a bit surprised myself about it too, a version that wasn't even tested.
[04:42] <ScottK> dholbach: Why did you subscribe Bug 145538 to the archive when it wasn't approved yet?
[04:42] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 145538 in wammu "Sync request: python-gammu (0.22-3; universe) from sid" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/145538
[04:42] <Hobbsee> ScottK: what are your thoughts on irssi, btw?
[04:42] <dholbach> ScottK: I read your OK and somebody pinged me about it
[04:42] <dholbach> ScottK: that's why I thought it was stuck and subscribed ubuntu-archive
[04:42] <ScottK> dholbach: For motu-uvf we've been doing two acks and set to confirmed.
[04:42] <dholbach> also one task was set to 'confirmed'
[04:43] <ScottK> Not the sync one.
[04:43] <ScottK> Gah.
[04:43] <ScottK> Hobbsee: I know nothing about irssi.
[04:43] <Hobbsee> ScottK: OK, so you dont care if i get that one shoved thru from debian.  good.
[04:44] <ScottK> Hobbsee: No.  I don't care.
[04:44] <gameldar> heya all - a quick question - bug #130208 - I've just uploaded the debdiff for it - restricted/misc packages are (its linux-restricted-modules package) handled by main for sponsorship or universe (hope this is the right place to ask - I got directed here from ubuntu-devel the other day)
[04:44] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 130208 in linux-restricted-modules-2.6.22 "package nvidia-glx None failed to install/upgrade: subprocess post-removal script returned error exit status 2" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/130208
[04:44] <StevenK> Hobbsee: Which bug?
[04:44] <Hobbsee> StevenK: none yet.  debian's got a RC bug open about it
[04:44] <Hobbsee> StevenK: http://irssi.org/news/ChangeLog
[04:44] <ScottK> gameldar: Main and unless the bug in milestoned for Gutsy RC it won't be accepted at this point.
[04:45] <StevenK> Ah. Neat.
[04:45] <Hobbsee> ScottK: uh, that'd qualify for a milestone.
[04:45] <Hobbsee> ScottK: afaik.  would be worht asking in #ubuntu-kernel
[04:45] <ScottK> Hobbsee: Sure, but I'm not going to decide here.
[04:45] <ScottK> Agreed.
[04:45] <Hobbsee> ScottK: you cant anyway - l-r-m is main
[04:46] <gameldar> ScottK: ok thanks!
[04:47] <ScottK> dholbach: How about a revision for python-gammu with properly versioned build-depends so we don't get in this mess again?
[04:47] <dholbach> ScottK: what do you mean?
[04:48] <ScottK> It's my impression that the current python-gammu package lets you build against the wrong gammu package (which is why this didn't get caugh up front).
[04:48] <ScottK> caugh/caught.
[04:48] <dholbach> ScottK: maybe I misunderstand you, but the python-gammu on the LP buildds is dep-wait
[04:48] <dholbach> so it does not build against the old version at all
[04:49] <ScottK> OK.  Then I'm curious how the test build got done.
[05:03] <jboyd> what's the best way to get started contributing to motu?
[05:05] <crimsun> jboyd: please see the Contributing link in the topic.
[05:05] <jboyd> crimsun, i've looked at that, i'm wondering if there's a list somewhere of packages that need to be updated, or is it more along the lines of "find it yourself"
[05:06] <ScottK> Heya crimsun.
[05:07] <crimsun> jboyd: at this stage, 7.10 is mere days away from release, so efforts are best concentrated on release-critical bug fixes (as opposed to updating to new versions).
[05:07] <pochu> jboyd: there's an 'upgrade' tag in launchpad, and a 'needs-packaging' one. Although it may be a bit late for it.
[05:07] <crimsun> hey ScottK
[05:07] <AstralJava> dholbach: ScottK: similar pbuilder build of python-gammu-0.22-3 builds fine and install fine. wammu opens up, connects to the phone, retrieves info just fine. gammu can fetch sms texts correctly. Should I attach pbuilder log and a description of these testing actions on the bug?
[05:07] <ScottK> AstralJava: When you did you test build of python-gammu, where did "UNPACKING LIBGAMMU-COMMON (FROM .../LIBGAMMU-COMMON_1.13.0-1_ALL.DEB)" come from.
[05:07] <jboyd> crimsun, i guess once 7.10 is released it'd be a better time to start
[05:07] <azeem> 17:01  * Hobbsee looks up what gtetrinet might be
[05:07] <ScottK> AstralJava: Yes.
[05:07] <azeem> you are doomed
[05:08] <ScottK> jboyd: It won't be that long until the release, so it's not a bad time to start studying up.
[05:08] <Hobbsee> azeem: :P
[05:09] <jboyd> i'm running gutsy now, so i guess that's the first step
[05:09] <AstralJava> ScottK: That was the mistake I made earlier, failing to report about the dependencies, which I'm trying to overcome by filing the gammu (libgammu-dev) re-sync bug.
[05:09] <AstralJava> ScottK: Okay, I'll do that right away.
[05:10] <ScottK> AstralJava: I'm just trying to figure out how you satisfied them at this point.
[05:10] <AstralJava> ScottK: By downloading from sid.
[05:11] <ScottK> AstralJava: OK.  One of the major reasons for using pbuilder is to make sure that depends can be satisfied from within the archive.  I guess we just clean it up from here.
[05:12] <dholbach> looking at the amount of dups we'll make a bunch of people happy with that :)
[05:13] <AstralJava> ScottK: Sure, I understand that. I just came to this process for the first time, so I didn't realize early enough to file similar bugs for the dependencies, which couldn't have been satisfied from the current archive.
[05:13] <ScottK> OK.
[05:13] <ScottK> AstralJava: How about as penance you sign up as bug contact for the three packages and take on bug triage for them?
[05:14] <ScottK> I'll ack the sync based on that and your test results.
[05:15] <AstralJava> ScottK: As you wish, my Master. :)
[05:15] <ScottK> Heh.
[05:15] <ScottK> AstralJava: Still waiting for your comment in the bug.
[05:17] <AstralJava> ScottK: Yep, writing it as we spea^W^W^W^Wtype.
[05:17] <ScottK> OK.
[05:21] <AstralJava> ScottK: okay, attached pbuilder build log for version 0.22-3 for python-gammu, and some testing reports for gammu.
[05:21] <AstralJava> ScottK: Please let me know what further information is needed.
[05:21] <AstralJava> Btw. how does one sign up as a bug contact?
[05:22] <AstralJava> Oh nevermind, I can go to #u-bugs for this.
[05:23] <geser> AstralJava: do go the Overview page for that source package and select "Subscribe to bug mail"
[05:24] <AstralJava> geser: Thanks! ;) Was just reasoning it out myself too. :)
[05:24] <ScottK> soren or Hobbsee: Would you please ack Bug #150587?
[05:24] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 150587 in gammu "FreezeException for gammu 1.13.0 from sid" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/150587
[05:24] <Hobbsee> StevenK: can
[05:25] <AstralJava> ScottK: Okay, subscribed to all three packages as the bug contact. :) Now how 'bout my absolution?
[05:25] <ScottK> Done.  Just keep up with the bugs...
[05:26] <StevenK> Oh, I so can't.
[05:26] <AstralJava> ScottK: Thank you! :) And thanks to dholbach and Hobbsee as well, for putting up with me and taking care of the packages.
[05:26] <StevenK> I'm fighting to keep my eyes open, I just want to see virtualbox-ose-modules out of NEW.
[05:26] <Hobbsee> StevenK: you think i'm any better?
[05:26] <StevenK> Hobbsee: I never said that, I just pointed out I'm fairly useless at this point.
[05:27] <ScottK> Given that we already have the new wammu and python-gammu uploaded, we pretty much have to take gammu too, so whichever of Hobbsee/StevenK would rubber stamp it, I'd appreciate it.
[05:29] <StevenK> ScottK: Based on that, I rubber stamp it here. I'm too tired to find Firefox
[05:29] <ScottK> StevenK: Thanks.
[05:29] <StevenK> ScottK: No problem
[05:31] <ScottK> dholbach: Bug #150587 is back over to you/UUS.
[05:31] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 150587 in gammu "FreezeException for gammu 1.13.0 from sid" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/150587
[05:32] <dholbach> ScottK: gracias
[05:33] <AstralJava> Thanks again, ScottK, dholbach & StevenK!
[05:33] <StevenK> No problem
[05:33] <ScottK> AstralJava: No problem.  Please keep on top of these packages so I don't regret it.
[05:34] <AstralJava> ScottK: Will do.
[05:44] <ScottK> doko: ia32-libs debdiff (less the binary files are different cruft) is here: http://kitterman.com/ubuntu/ia32-debdiff
[05:55] <pkern> ScottK: Back.
[05:55] <ScottK> Hi.
[05:56] <doko> ScottK: looks ok, I want to check for one or two more packages, so please could you delay the upload until tomorrow?
[05:56] <ScottK> doko: Sure.  I'm currently waiting on \sh_away to review the new WINE upload, so I think tomorrow would be fine.
[05:57] <ScottK> doko: Will you upload it then when you are done?
[05:57] <doko> ScottK: yes, I can do this
[05:57] <ScottK> doko: Sounds good.
[05:57] <ScottK> doko: I'd appreciate it if you ping me after you upload it so I can deal with WINE then.
[05:58] <ScottK> pkern: If you have time, please dive in and fix bugs...
[05:58] <bddebian> ScottK: Man, is there ever anyone in -mentors? :-)
[05:58] <ScottK> bddebian: I've had limited success with it.  Most of the Debian uploads I've gotten were through DD's working on a team.
[06:00] <pkern> ScottK: I suspect lib/Mail/SpamAssassin/Plugin/Razor2.pm:169 to be the right place for such a fix.
[06:00] <bddebian> Well the games team doesn't exactly seem to have an abundance of DD's either :-(
[06:00] <ScottK> pkern: My Perl is nil, so I'd say if you think so, go for it....
[06:00] <pkern> ScottK: I don't know which directory would be the right one wrt spamassassin.
[06:02] <ScottK> pkern: I guess it would depend on who started spamassassin.  I think it should go in $USER space is called by an individual user and /Root if called by the system (running as spamd).  That's a bit of a guess though.
[06:04] <pkern> I don't think that /root is a valid location for a spamassassin process launched by the MTA.
[06:04] <ScottK> pkern: Then were?
[06:04] <pkern> It would not be obvious at least.
[06:04] <ScottK> There is no /home/spamd
[06:05] <ScottK> pkern: Another option would be just to force razor to use their syslog option and the problem solves itself....
[06:06] <ScottK> Actually the more I think about it, I like that idea.
[06:07] <pkern> Does spamassassin use syslog already?
[06:07] <pkern> At least spamassassin run as a user should not globber the syslog, that could even be inaccessible for him.
[06:07] <pkern> Yes it does.
[06:07] <pkern> Point is: if spamd already uses syslog then razor should do that, too.
[06:08] <pkern> But we would need to hack the spamassassin plugin for that I'd guess.
[06:09] <ScottK> pkern: libsyslog-perl is a recommends for SA.
[06:09] <ScottK> Err libsys-syslog-perl
[06:09] <ScottK> Yeah Perl naming conventions.
[06:09] <pkern> rofl
[06:10] <pkern> vim `which spamd`
[06:10] <pkern> "not" [new file] 
[06:10] <pkern> :next
[06:10] <pkern> "found" [new file] 
[06:11] <pkern> spamd has a syslog option, yes.
[06:12] <pkern> And it seems to be the default, but that's what looking at the code tells me, might be wrong.
[06:12] <ScottK> pkern: I think it's used if installed, but as a recommends, it may or may not be there.
[06:13] <ScottK> it being the libsys-syslog-perl package.
[06:15] <ScottK> pkern: Without having studied things in detail, I think the "right" answer is to move libsys-syslog-perl from recommends to depends and then force razor to use syslog, but not < 2 weeks before a release.
[06:16] <ScottK> pkern: On another note: Are you interested in sponsoring packages from Ubuntu people in Debian?
[06:22] <pkern> ScottK: Yep.
[06:22] <geser> Hi bddebian!
[06:22] <ScottK> bddebian: pkern is a DD ^^^
[06:23] <pkern> ScottK: But as you might know packages in Debian have distinct maintainers.
[06:23] <pkern> ScottK: So no free-for-all culture. ;)
[06:23] <ScottK> pkern: Yep.  bddebian has a new package he's trying to get in.
[06:23] <pkern> Aye.
[06:24] <ScottK> pkern: Since he's apparently MIA right now, his package is http://mentors.debian.net/cgi-bin/sponsor-pkglist?action=details;package=lordsawar
[06:25] <bddebian> Heya geser
[06:25] <pkern> ScottK: That's an abuse of the MIA term :-P
[06:25] <bddebian> Wow, I didn't know pkern was a DD too. Sheesh :-)
[06:25] <pkern> And dsc links are more appreciated, hah. :-P
[06:25] <ScottK> http://mentors.debian.net/debian/pool/main/l/lordsawar/lordsawar_0.0.3-1.dsc
[06:25] <pkern> bddebian: MOTU wouldn't have been easy otherwise ;-p
[06:26] <ScottK> bddebian: He got the DD quantity discount.
[06:26] <bddebian> pkern: We're not cheap but we're easy ;-)
[06:26] <Hobbsee> bddebian: groan.
[06:26] <bddebian> :'-(
[06:27] <pkern> bddebian: No need for the XS- prefix anymore and the homepage URL does not need to be stated in the long description (anymore, too). But those are no hard critica (yet).
[06:27] <bddebian> Well I was considering not even shipping the binary for it but thought if someone was interested maybe they could help fix it ;-)
[06:29] <pkern> bddebian: So you think we wanted broken stuff in the archives? Thanks for your trust in Debian. :-P
[06:29] <pkern> s/wanted/want/
[06:29] <pkern> Something is eating my 2D performance and I suspect it's the missing fglrx module.
[06:29] <pkern> bddebian: It's not even in Ubuntu. ;)
[06:30] <bddebian> No but both the descript and the man page state that it's broken :-)
[06:30] <bddebian> pkern: Aye, I was trying to start with Debian :-)
[06:30] <bddebian> Now I'm wondering why.. ;-P
[06:31] <ScottK> bddebian: Right now it's the right thing to be doing.
[06:31] <pkern> ScottK: If there is a certain quality, of course.
[06:32] <ScottK> Sure.
[06:32] <bddebian> What are you trying to say? :-)
[06:32] <pkern> bddebian: So it has a usable n-player mode for local play?
[06:32] <bddebian> n-player?
[06:32] <pkern> It still builds on my Debian server ;)
[06:33] <ScottK> Generally I work stuff into Ubuntu first if I can (depending on where it is in the release cycle) and then push it to Debian, but if Ubuntu is not accepting new packages, I go straight to Debian.
[06:34] <pkern> Bah my lappy is hell slow.
[06:34] <pkern> up 6 days...
[06:35] <pkern> bddebian: The dpkg version in Ubuntu is annoying as a DD. ;)
[06:35] <pkern> bddebian: Like "Heh, I don't know Homepage!".
[06:35] <ScottK> pkern: What's it running?  If it's Gutsy, the answer is yes.
[06:35] <ScottK> pkern: We don't have the one that has been taught that yet.
[06:35] <pkern> ScottK: Well I've cryptoroot on Gutsy, yes.
[06:35] <bddebian> pkern: Aye, but I have built it in both Gutsy and unstable
[06:36] <ScottK> OK.  Gutsy's had kernel updates in the last 6 days.
[06:36] <pkern> bddebian: It's currently building on gutsy too.
[06:37] <pkern> But looking at the build kills gnome-terminal off.
[06:40] <pkern> bddebian: Looks nice and clean, congrats.
[06:40] <bddebian> pkern: What arch are you on?
[06:41] <pkern> /usr/share/games/lordsawar/music/music.xml: The file is not obfuscated, attempting to read it....
[06:41] <pkern> Haha
[06:42] <pkern> bddebian: amd64 FWIW.
[06:42] <bddebian> It may fail
[06:42] <bddebian> I only know for sure that it works on i386 though supposedly it runs on others.  Though I don't think the amd64 patch will be in until 0.0.4.  I have to talk to Ben about that
[06:42] <pkern> bddebian: While playing the game?
[06:43] <bddebian> Did it start for you?
[06:43] <pkern> bddebian: Yep.
[06:43] <bddebian> Oh, excellent
[06:43] <pkern> And it built both on Debian/amd64 as on Gutsy/amd64
[06:44] <pkern> Whyever people just cannot be portable.
[06:44] <pkern> Maybe it will fail on arm or $other_random_Debian_release_arch.
[06:45] <bddebian> He tries and he's very open to patches just doesn't have access to all archs
[06:45] <bddebian> Plus the codebase started from freelords so he's doing a lot of re-writing
[06:45] <pkern> bddebian: Fire and forget for me? ;)
[06:46] <bddebian> heh
[06:47] <bddebian> hah
[06:48] <pkern> ScottK: Over X forwarding :-P
[06:48] <pkern> ScottK: As you won't get a local console.
[06:48] <ScottK> Right.  Well I guess the arch list ought to be written carefully for Debian...
[06:50] <pkern> ScottK: It WILL be built for s390.
[06:50] <\sh> scottk: could you give me the link again for wine?
[06:51] <ScottK> \sh: http://wine.budgetdedicated.com/experimental/wine_0.9.46-0ubuntu1.dsc
[06:51] <ScottK> \sh: I think you'll need the new ia32-libs if you are on a 64 bit arch too: http://wine.budgetdedicated.com/experimental/ia32-libs_2.1ubuntu3.dsc
[06:51] <\sh> ScottK, I'm not...and I can't test anything on amd64 anymore :(
[06:51] <pkern> bddebian: building for i386, will upload it afterwards, thank you for your contribution to Debian</katie>
[06:52] <ScottK> \sh: No problem.  Just wanted to make sure you had it if you needed it.  The upload for the ia32-libs is already planned for tomorrow (it adds openssl0.9.8)
[06:52] <pkern> Those refreshes are unbearable. I need at least a X11 restart for fglrx. And that's the suggestion for >R5xx users on laptops. Bah.
[06:53] <pkern> I won't recommend gutsy to any fglrx-needing laptop users.
[06:54] <\sh> ScottK, /me needs a new employer with amd64 hw ;) or new sponsored hw ;)
[06:55] <ScottK> \sh: Good luck with that.
[06:55] <ScottK> ;-)
[06:55] <pkern> \sh: Try Canonical? ;)
[06:56] <pkern> bigon: That ITP is not exactly nicely put. ;)
[06:56] <\sh> pkern, and what should I do there? ,-)
[06:57] <\sh> pkern, honestly, I don't think canonical will pay me 60k buks for testing wine on amd64 ,->
[06:57] <bigon> pkern: ?
[06:58] <pkern> bigon: build-depends should not be multiline
[06:58] <pkern> bigon: Depends shouldn't neither.
[06:58] <ScottK> pkern: Did you mean bddebian?
[06:58] <bigon> pkern: booth lool and sjoerd (for the telepathy packages) do like that
[06:58] <pkern> ScottK: Nope.
[06:59] <ScottK> K
[06:59] <pkern> bigon: Then I need to fetch a new lintian.
[07:00] <pkern> bigon: I don't get http://lintian.debian.org/reports/Tmultiline-field.html then -- I don't find the check in that version of lintian anymore. *cough*
[07:01] <pkern> Oh sure it's still there.
[07:01] <pkern> In fields.
[07:04] <pkern> bddebian: So if I haven't failed: Cheers.
[07:05] <pkern> bigon: I guess they also like cdbs? :-P
[07:05] <bigon> :p
[07:06] <pkern> bddebian: Oh and welcome to the NEW queue then if it's accepted.
[07:06] <bddebian> pkern: Thanks man, though I had a desktop update I should have uploaded first ;-)
[07:06] <pkern> Too late, ya know.
[07:07] <pkern> bigon: W: gnome-nds-thumbnailer: binary-without-manpage gnome-nds-thumbnailer
[07:07] <ScottK> Well with that done that pretty much reduces the fun on #debian-mentors to watching kmos upset people by trying to repeatedly hijack packages.
[07:07] <pkern> ScottK: To hijack packages where? In Debian?
[07:07] <StevenK> Well, at least he's moved on. Twitch.
[07:08] <bddebian> ScottK: :-)
[07:08] <bddebian> Is the NEW queue visible on Debian?
[07:08] <broonie> http://ftp-master.debian.org/new.html
[07:08] <ScottK> pkern: Yes.  He has several packages he's uploaded to mentors that are updates to other people's packages.  He doesn't seem to understand (despite repeated explanations) that it's not done that way in Debian.
[07:09] <ScottK> This is not a great suprise given his history here.
[07:09] <StevenK> ScottK: Hah. Indeed not.
[07:09] <pkern> bddebian: I guess I won't get the mail from katie but the games team and you will.
[07:09] <broonie> (you can't see the actual pacakges in case there are legal issues.)
[07:09] <pkern> bddebian: So if there is anything wrong just tell me. ;)
[07:10] <bddebian> pkern: Will do, thanks again!
[07:10] <bddebian> broonie: Thx
[07:12] <bigon> pkern: yeah I know about the man page, but the exec doesn't take any options so I don't think it's a big issue
[07:13] <Hobbsee> ScottK: still, way better there than here.
[07:14] <broonie> Don't say Ubuntu doesn't contribute things back to Debian!
[07:14] <Hobbsee> broonie: indeed!  we contribute back people who arent exactly an asset!
[07:15] <ScottK> Hobbsee: Absolutely.
[07:15] <ScottK> As slong as he doesn't start bragging about his awesome contributions to Ubuntu on Debian channels, I'm happy.
[07:15] <ScottK> slong/long
[07:16] <StevenK> Oh $DEITY, he probably would.
[07:16] <Hobbsee> well, the others will see that he's on crack
[07:16] <Hobbsee> so should just disregard it
[07:16] <pkern> bigon: How is it used?
[07:16] <pkern> bigon: Is it registered with gnome anywhere to handle nautilus file listings or such stuff?
[07:17] <bigon> pkern: yep
[07:17] <bigon> like other thumbnailer
[07:17] <bddebian> Hobbsee: hehe
[07:17] <bigon> pkern: see the schemas file
[07:17] <Hobbsee> ScottK: actually, he'd probably say tha the tried to contribute to ubuntu, and that his fixes got ignored/rejected, and that it's an impossible place to contribute to, so he came to debian.
[07:17] <Hobbsee> ScottK: that seems the far more likely option.
[07:18] <Hobbsee> and that he was doing right all the time, but that they decided to hate him, etc, etc, etc.
[07:18] <pkern> Where and how?
[07:19] <ScottK> At least bddebian's package got uploaded first, so ritual suicide (if kmos had gotten his uploaded first) is no long a risk for him.
[07:19] <ScottK> long/longer
[07:20] <Hobbsee> although, obviously baby must think his work is OK, to be doing bits of sponsoring for it
[07:20] <Hobbsee> (for debian games, iirc)
[07:20] <ScottK> His problem isnt' that everything he does is $NOTVERYGOOD, just that the volume is so high and the fraction so small.
[07:21] <Hobbsee> meh.  oh well.  now we only have to worry about the autosynx
[07:21] <bddebian> ScottK: Heh, amen :)
[07:21] <Hobbsee> er, autosync
[07:21] <Hobbsee> ScottK: although he cant thrash our changes that way
[07:22] <bddebian> Oh that's funny, Debian is easer to contribute to than Ubuntu?? Hahaha
[07:22] <Hobbsee> ScottK: compiledkernel is looking for you, btw.
[07:22] <ScottK> ??
[07:22] <Hobbsee> ScottK: forums.  he's just asked me about you on irc.
[07:22] <pkern> bigon: I would suggest priority: extra
[07:23] <sladen> pkern: I was for a moment you were thinking about a custom distro with https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Slab
[07:23] <pkern> bigon: What's an emulator for these ROMs?
[07:23] <pkern> sladen: That SLAB doesn't work on Ubuntu, too.
[07:23] <pkern> sladen: ;)
[07:24] <pkern> And libslab is weird.
[07:24] <sladen> pkern: and wondering why the technical board had refused to ship an Ubuntu-based Suse lookalike
[07:25] <pkern> Well I really like the fact that restricted-foo calls for you to enable fglrx.
[07:25] <bigon> pkern: mmm yep extra seems a bettre priority
[07:25] <pkern> But to what should I revert. Gentoo where I came from? ):
[07:26] <bigon> pkern: I don't think there is a NDS atm
[07:27] <pkern> bigon: Why are those thumbnailers shipped in /usr/bin instead of, say, /usr/lib/gnome-thumbnailers or even /usr/lib/gnome-{nds,raw}-thumbnailer?
[07:27] <pkern> bigon: If they couldn't be run seperately?
[07:28] <pkern> Hm. gnome-raw-thumbnailer has parameters to run it seperately.
[07:28] <bigon> pkern: other thumbnailer are shipped in /usr/bin (/usr/bin/evince-thumbnailer, ...)
[07:29] <pkern> evince-thumbnailer has a manpage
[07:29] <pkern> bigon: I would say please make up one.
[07:29] <bigon> pkern: ok I will do that
[07:30] <pkern> bigon: That and the extra change should be enough to get this in.
[07:30] <bddebian> Oh man, now I feel bad :-(  kaol was apparently looking at lordsawar for me.
[07:30] <pkern> :-P
[07:30] <pkern> He's probably more used to Games policy?
[07:31] <pkern> bigon: NEWS is fun, and README doesn't deserve to be shipped, too.
[07:31] <\sh> grmpf
[07:32] <pkern> bigon: And while you're on it. It's `Vcs-Bzr', not `XS-Vcs-Bzr'.
[07:32] <\sh> just to be sure, because I think I was disconnected...
 anyone: do we support *.svg icons as app icons?
 ScottK, the package itself looks sane and ok for me...I wonder if we support svg icons for installation in /usr/share/pixmaps but this scott r. could fix in no time
[07:32] <ScottK> \sh: Thanks.
[07:33] <pkern> I got 4 svgs in there.
[07:33] <StevenK> pkern: I thought Vcs-Bzr was a Debian-ism at the moment due to the new dpkg?
[07:33] <pkern> StevenK: Correct and I'm talking about a Debian package.
[07:33] <\sh> pkern, which ones?
[07:33] <StevenK> pkern: Fair enough, I'll be quiet.
[07:33] <\sh> pkern, ubuntu.svg and gnome-logo-white.svg I have
[07:33] <pkern> //usr/share/pixmaps/gnome-logo-white.svg, /usr/share/pixmaps/seahorse-applet.svg, /usr/share/pixmaps/ubuntu.svg, /usr/share/pixmaps/vim.svg, /usr/share/pixmaps/xscreensaver.svg
[07:34] <pkern> I didn't count ubuntu.svg, but I did count gnome-logo-white.svg. Weird.
[07:34] <\sh> ok..so it's supported...never realised that...
[07:34] <\sh> ScottK, ok to upload (if I would have something to say ;))
[07:34] <pkern> Well there are enough svgs in the icon themes already?
[07:34] <pkern> It might be a Gnome-ism. ;)
[07:35] <\sh> if gnome is supporting svgs...kde will support it, too ;)
[07:35] <ScottK> YokoZar1: Doko is going to upload ia32-libs tomorrow and I'll upload WINE after that.
[07:35] <pkern> Diversity is good, duplicate work isn't.
[07:36] <\sh> pkern, tell the gnomes to use qt as widget kit ,-) *runs*
[07:36] <pkern> Heh I won't, be sure of that.
[07:36] <pkern> qt with that bloody moc stuff.
[07:36] <pkern> :-P
[07:36] <pkern> gtkmm is much nicer. :-P
[07:36] <\sh> pkern, at least I'm using both :)
[07:37] <pkern> So, now it's time to get decent 2D performance again. Probably I should just recompile my kernel and maintain it on ppa.
[07:37] <\sh> and in the moment I'm using gnome more then kde, because it feels more stable...but that's my personal feeling :)
[07:37] <\sh> (regarding ubuntu that is)
[07:46] <pkern> The kernel update broke the network cards.
[07:46] <pkern> Yay, thanks for that.
[07:47] <pkern> I somehow feel that Gutsy is "not for me"(tm).
[07:48] <pkern> Sorry to say \:
[07:49] <pochu> kernel update? have I missed anything?
[07:49] <\sh> pkern, which nic type?
[07:50] <zul> could it be that a udev update broke your network?
[07:50] <jussi01> from what i hear and experience there is lots broken on gutsy atm... :(
[07:51] <jussi01> especially the ati driver... grrr
[07:51] <ScottK> Except for one kernel regression on ancient hardware, it's all working good for me.
[07:52] <pkern> \sh: tg3
[07:52] <pkern> WLAN disappeared too FWIW.
[07:52] <pkern> Hm no actually it's there, just deactivated.
[07:52] <\sh> pkern, hmmm....I just upgraded today a machine with a tg3 nic without problems....
[07:53] <pkern> Hm. I got a nice "HAL FAILED!" message after logging in.
[07:53] <\sh> pkern, I would guess it's NM+(HAL/DBUS/UDEV) magic
[07:53] <pkern> Probably that in conjunction with n-m
[07:54] <\sh> pkern, try dhclient3 ,-)
[07:55] <pkern> The quit button is broken too.
[07:55] <\sh> ah....the end of netware is near...I can feel it
[07:55] <pkern> \sh: That's how I just got into the screen session again.
[07:56] <pkern> I probably could get rid of this cryptoroot stuff.
[07:56] <pkern> In GB you get 5y in jail if you don't tell them the keys.
[07:56] <pkern> I suspect that Germany will get something similar.
[07:57] <\sh> pkern, when this will be established in germany, I'll can't remember anything, suddenly ;)
[07:57] <ScottK> Oddly enough, I don't think we have that one in the US yet.  Surprising we are "behind" in that area.
[07:57] <norsetto> \sh too many sigarettes ....
[07:58] <pkern> A HAL restart "solved" it. But even after a reboot this was needed again.
[07:58] <pkern> \sh: You will get enough time to think about it.
[07:58] <pkern> (Or even more if you have something compromising on your harddisk, like... bomb plans or something.)
[07:59] <\sh> pkern, hehe..I'm waiting for my charge using nmap and stuff and distributing it actively ;-)
[07:59] <pkern> (So YOU get the decide. In Soviet Russia the party decides for you.=
[07:59] <pkern> \sh: And MP3 codecs and CSS deciphers...
[07:59] <pkern> I want to get out of this country. Seriously.
[08:00] <\sh> yeah yeah...let me add "bombs, /bin/laden, islam, atomic kittens, dope, drugs" to it...so it can be read by stasi-schaeuble ,-)
[08:01] <\sh> wait...the door bell rings ,-)
[08:02] <\sh> luck...just my landlord ,-)
[08:04] <\sh> pkern, are you still at freiburg?
[08:06] <pkern> \sh: I never was. Karlsruhe.
[08:06] <\sh> pkern, I just saw an email addr from you at uni-freiburg...
[08:06] <\sh> hmmm
[08:06] <Nightrose> \sh: you should join pkern, sven and sput for a beer
[08:06] <pkern> \sh: That must be someone else.
[08:06] <Nightrose> and me ;-)
[08:07] <\sh> Nightrose, when? you need to write your test tomorrow ,)
[08:07] <Nightrose> hehe yea - after that
[08:07] <\sh> Nightrose, tomorrow? no problem :)
[08:07] <Nightrose> *lol*
[08:07] <Nightrose> then I have to work
[08:07] <Nightrose> next week?
[08:07] <\sh> Nightrose, sure :)
[08:07] <\sh> wednesday, la cage ;)
[08:08] <\sh> we can play some pool too :)
[08:08] <Nightrose> sounds good \sh
[08:09] <pkern> \sh: Where are you from?
[08:09] <\sh> pkern, I was born in dortmund, moved to cologne, worked all over germany, and now I'm living in au/rhein ;) working still in ka-durlach :)
[08:10] <pkern> Au am Rhein. Never heard of that one, sorry :-P
[08:10] <pkern> But near Rastatt, so nearby.
[08:10] <\sh> pkern, yeah...durmersheim :)
[08:10] <pkern> Hah (:
[08:10] <\sh> nice area . just 2.5km to the rhine :)
[08:10] <pkern> Does deep freeze affect us now?
[08:11] <pkern> \sh: Well I come from a place near Strasbourg, so it's the same. Viele Baggerseen. :D
[08:11] <\sh> pkern, haha :) yepp :)
[08:11] <pkern> (So it was a decision between Freiburg and Karlsruhe, FWIW.)
[08:11] <\sh> Nightrose, good thing is, from monday on I'm on holiday for 3 weeks :)
[08:12] <Nightrose> wohooo
[08:12] <ScottK> pkern: Not for Universe packages.  You are encouraged to concentrate on bug fixing, but upload what you've got.
[08:13] <ScottK> pkern: Please don't break stuff though ;-)
[08:14] <Nightrose> pkern: how does wednesday (17.) sound to you? I still have to check back with sven and sput - and maybe nadermann - though
[08:14] <pkern> Nightrose: O-Phase?
[08:15] <Nightrose> pkern: ahhh too bad - then we will have to do it later
[08:15] <Nightrose> \sh: ^
[08:15] <\sh> what about this weekend?
[08:15] <Nightrose> have to work
[08:15] <pkern> *cough*
[08:16] <Nightrose> hmm sunday night would be ok though
[08:17] <\sh> Nightrose, pkern: please pick a day and time, I'll be there :)
[08:17] <pkern> ScottK: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/9827371/ceferino_0.97.5-1ubuntu1.debdiff <-- Does the desktop file look ok to you?
[08:19] <ScottK> pkern: I've no idea about desktop files.
[08:20] <\sh> pkern, looks sane
[08:20] <pkern> \sh: Thanks; ScottK: me neither \:
[08:20] <\sh> pkern, desktop-file-validate helps, too :)
[08:20] <ScottK> IIRC, asisak know about .desktop files ^^^
[08:20] <pkern> \sh: Does that validate categories?
[08:21] <pkern> And do we translate desktop files?
[08:21] <bigon> pkern: I've added the man page and change the priority, same url (http://mentors.debian.net/debian/pool/main/g/gnome-nds-thumbnailer/gnome-nds-thumbnailer_1.0.2-1.dsc)
[08:21] <pkern> "A desktop file" is probably better than "no desktop file".
[08:21] <pkern> bigon: Mentors allows reuploads with the same version number? Nice. (:
[08:21] <\sh> pkern, I don't think so...because categories are free to change from distro to distro...but it helps to write sane .desktop files at all...
[08:21] <bigon> pkern: yep :)
[08:29] <pkern> bigon: Thanks for the manpage. The .IP wasn't needed, though.
[08:32] <pkern> bigon: Another fire and forget. o_O Uploaded.
[08:32] <pkern> Another Debian upload that needs sponsorship?
[08:33] <bigon> pkern: http://bugs.debian.org/444877 will comes soon :p
[08:33] <DktrKranz> pkern, can I bother you in the next few days for that? :)
[08:34] <pkern> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/audacity/+bug/149308 <-- Isn't this a violation of the Gnome HIG they propose here?
[08:34] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 149308 in audacity "short description for audacity repeated in both name and description in k-menu " [Low,Confirmed] 
[08:34] <pkern> DktrKranz: Mails to pkern@debian.org are appreciated then.
[08:34] <pkern> But I dislike cdbs packages. :-P
[08:34] <pkern> bigon: Aye.
[08:34] <DktrKranz> that's not cdbs...but I'm waiting for my previous sponsor to answer...
[08:35] <bigon> pkern: btw aren't you also a AM ?
[08:35] <DktrKranz> I don't want to overtake his work
[08:35] <ScottK> DktrKranz: I uploaded ivtools for Gutsy.  Waiting for an RM to release it.
[08:35] <pkern> bigon: I'm currently inactive.
[08:35] <pkern> bigon: In general: yes.
[08:35] <DktrKranz> ScottK, thanks...already accepted IIRC
[08:35] <ScottK> Cool.
[08:35] <ScottK> Forgot I don't get the accept mail when it's your upload.
[08:36] <pkern> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-universe-sponsors/+subscribedbugs <-- That sucks. With "ivtools (Debian)" items included.
[08:37] <ScottK> pkern: Agreed.  Thank the gods of LP who understand how we do our work better than we do that LP works that way.

[08:38] <pkern> Probably a canned query would help.
[08:39] <YokoZar1> ScottK: Most excellent.  Thank you both.
[08:39] <pkern> "dAniel hAhler" <-- That capitalisation sucks.
[08:39] <AstralJava> LPS, the Lazy Pinkie Syndrome.
[08:42] <YokoZar1> ScottK: doko: Serious question: should we release another ia32-libs just before release with the freshest possible packages?  I'm worried some 32 bit library will have some bug that got fixed that we didn't freshen.  Possibly a security one.
[08:43] <ScottK> YokoZar1: I think we should check and see if anything important is missed.
[08:43] <ScottK> YokoZar1: Doing it just because isn't, IMO, a good idea.
[08:43] <pkern> E: Failed to fetch http://ubuntu-sourcedeps.philkern.de/pool/universe/a/apt-build/apt-build-build-depends_0.12.28_all.deb: Hash Sum mismatch
[08:44] <YokoZar1> So, just now I learned about the PowerPoint viewer application...
[08:44] <YokoZar1> In Add/Remove Applications.
[08:51] <pkern> Package apt-build version 0.12.28ubuntu1 has an unmet dep: Depends: libappconfig-perl (>= 1.5)
[08:51] <pkern> Yay
[08:54] <ScottK> pkern: Then fix it I guess ...
[08:54] <pkern> So could someone tell me where libappconfig-perl disappeared in Ubuntu?
[08:54] <pkern> Soyuz doesn't tell me.
[08:54] <pkern> Ah.
[08:54] <pkern> Meep. s/libappconfig-perl/appconfig/ Sorry \:
[09:03] <mehdi2> hi motu, what may cause an error like this: Release: Unable to find expected entry  main/source/Sources in Meta-index file (malformed Release file?)
[09:04] <mehdi2> I'm running my repository and have setup it with reprepro
[09:05] <geser> ScottK: a new clamav-data got uploaded to Debian unstable yesterday. Should we stay at the current version in gutsy (20070830.234900.4110) or try to sync it?
[09:05] <pkern> !newbug
[09:05] <ScottK> geser: Sync it.  Did we have a standing UVFe for that?
[09:05] <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about newbug - try searching on http://ubotu.ubuntu-nl.org/factoids.cgi
[09:07] <geser> ScottK: afaik no, I filed a UVFe bug for the last sync
[09:07] <ScottK> geser: OK.  Well file another one then I guess.
[09:07] <ScottK> Let me know when and I'll at least give you the first ack.
[09:09] <pkern> Is there a list of bugs to fix?
[09:10] <ScottK> pkern: bugs.launchpad.net
[09:28] <geser> ScottK: bug #150679
[09:28] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 150679 in clamav-data "[UVFe] [Sync request]  Sync clamav-data (20071007.022900.4491) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/150679
[09:28] <ScottK> looks even
[09:29] <ScottK> geser: Done.  Maybe soren will give it a 2nd ack ^^^
[09:29] <soren> Sure, go ahead.
[09:29] <soren> geser: ^^
[09:30] <ScottK> soren: Are you going to mark that in the bug or do you want me to do it?
[09:30] <soren> I wasn't going to, but now I've done it anyway :)
[09:33] <bddebian> Goddamn, does anyone have a sense of humor anymore..
[09:33] <bddebian> Oh, heya geser
[09:33] <crimsun> wth?  humor?  bah!
[09:34] <\sh> bddebian, humor? you? since when? ,-)
[09:34] <bddebian> Heh, no kidding :-)
[09:34] <bddebian> \sh: Are you kidding, ajmitch LOVES my "humor" ;-)
[09:34] <ajmitch> oh sure I do
[09:35] <\sh> bddebian, ajmitch just loves your humor, but I have to love you, I mentored you...you'll be my endless motu-love ;-)
[09:35] <bddebian> heh :-)
[09:36] <bddebian> \sh: You might not want to admit to that ;)
[09:36] <\sh> bddebian, imagine, I would tell that to my fianc ;)
[09:37] <bddebian> \sh: That's fine but you might not want to admit it to any Ubuntu or Debian people. :-)
[09:38] <\sh> bddebian, right...this could cause "PC" discussions ;)
[09:49] <slavi1> if I downloaded a source package from debian's repo ... I can just use pbuild on the dsc file?
[09:50] <crimsun> pbuilder, yes.
[09:50] <slavi1> thanks
[09:50] <lamego> assuming you have pbuilder properly configured
[09:53] <crimsun> that's my second favourite.  My most fav is the inlined dmesg.
[09:55] <pkern> And the status: confirmed, assigned to: motu, Thank you for your bug report. boilerplate mails from dholbach. (:
[09:55] <\sh> cu tomorrow
[09:56] <bddebian> Later \sh
[10:13] <pkern> bddebian: Could we get something like https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux-igd/+bug/133852 removed from Gutsy out of QA reasons?
[10:13] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 133852 in linux-igd "[UNMETDEPS] [Gutsy]  Broken dependency" [Undecided,Confirmed] 
[10:14] <DarkSun88> Salve
[10:15] <geser> Hi DarkSun88
[10:15] <pkern> bddebian: If so, could I just state it and subscribe ubuntu-archive?
[10:17] <geser> pkern: yes
[10:18] <geser> pkern: btw the debian package has the same problem
[10:19] <pkern> geser: I know that.
[10:19] <geser> but luckily the project is not dead (1.0 got released in february) any only needs a new maintainer
[10:20] <pkern> There's #105165 open about that. Maybe that gets fixed for hardy ;)
[10:21] <bddebian> pkern: Sorry, was at RL work for a sec, what's up?
[10:24] <pkern> bddebian: Cleared up already :-P
[10:24] <bddebian> OK, sorry man
[10:24] <pkern> bddebian: I'm sorry too :-P
[10:40] <pkern> Does anyone have some bugs to fix/upload for me?
[10:41] <bddebian> pkern: There's a whole launchpad full of them ;-P
[10:41] <pkern> pwc-source - source for the Philips webcams pwc driver
[10:41] <pkern> Now that is one one could catch subtle humour in.
[10:41] <pkern> bddebian: Heh, any USABLE list of those?
[10:41] <pkern> bddebian: I tried MOTU assignments, but that's weird.
[10:42] <bddebian> pkern: You can look for the patch attached ones
[10:42] <pkern> i.e. "tagged" patch?
[10:42] <bddebian> Aye
[10:43] <bddebian> This page has some nice quick links: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Bugs
[10:43] <DktrKranz> pkern, patch tagged bugs are a small subset of http://tinyurl.com/39w2p3
[10:45] <pkern> DktrKranz: Aye.
[10:45] <geser> pkern: if you are bored you could check if guilt in gutsy is affected by CVE-2007-5207 (fixed in 0.27-1.2)
[10:45] <ubotu> guilt 0.27 allows local users to overwrite arbitrary files via a symlink attack on a guilt.log.[PID]  temporary file. (http://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvename.cgi?name=CVE-2007-5207)
[10:46] <pkern> I already saw that Debian bug report some days ago.
[10:46] <pkern> Hm.
[10:50] <pkern> Is there a rmadison for Ubuntu?
[10:50] <geser> pkern: yes
[10:50] <pkern> geser: And yes. (Of course) it is affected.
[10:50] <bddebian> We have madison, I didn't know about rmadison
[10:50] <geser> rmadison -u ubuntu -s gutsy
[10:51] <geser> works with devscripts from gutsy
[10:51] <ScottK> pkern: Along those lines, there is also http://django.ajmitch.net.nz/rcbugs/
[10:51] <pkern> geser: Hm yeah documented in the manpage.
[10:51] <pkern> geser: Thanks, I remembered such a thing.
[10:52] <pkern> geser: First released with Gutsy, so I just patch that and upload, without caring about any "security team"?
[10:52] <ScottK> pkern: Yes.
[10:52] <ScottK> pkern: Make sure you reference the CVE in debian/changelog so the release manager understands to let it through.
[10:53] <pkern> All my uploads today were accepted. (=
[10:54] <pkern> Somebody is still working.
[10:54] <bddebian> heh
[10:54] <Kopfgeldjaeger> good night
[10:58] <pochu> Night all.
[11:03] <bddebian> pkern: Hey, I'm supposed to be maintainer for colorgcc in Debian but I don't think I have a sponsor anymore.  If I did some work on it would you mind taking a look at it at some point?
[11:05] <pkern> geser: But the new patch is smaller.
[11:05] <bddebian> Heya persia
[11:05] <persia> hi bddebian
[11:05] <pkern> bddebian: Mail to pkern@debian.org, best with the debdiff attached (and if you did not change anything outside debian/ please filterdiff it accordingly).
[11:06] <bddebian> OK, thanks!
[11:06] <pkern> geser: Is there an Ubuntu bug open?
[11:08] <slavi1> how do I add packages to the pbuilder chroot
[11:08] <pkern> Need to get 330MB of archives. After unpacking 675MB will be used.
[11:08] <geser> pkern: no
[11:08] <pkern> Just for asciidoc xmlto, are you kidding me.
[11:10] <pkern> geser: Done.
[11:11] <geser> pkern: thanks
[11:11] <slavi1> nvm, wrong problem
[11:11] <pkern> geser: Next ;)
[11:17] <geser> pkern: if you are seriously interested: tomcat5.5: CVE-2007-1355, CVS-2007-2449 and CVE-2007-2450
[11:17] <ubotu> Multiple cross-site scripting (XSS) vulnerabilities in the appdev/sample/web/hello.jsp example application in Tomcat 4.0.0 through 4.0.6, 4.1.0 through 4.1.36, 5.0.0 through 5.0.30, 5.5.0 through 5.5.23, and 6.0.0 through 6.0.10 allow remote attackers to inject arbitrary web script or HTML via the test parameter and unspecified vectors. (http://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvename.cgi?name=CVE-2007-1355)
[11:17] <ubotu> Multiple cross-site scripting (XSS) vulnerabilities in the (1) Manager and (2) Host Manager web applications in Apache Tomcat 4.0.0 through 4.0.6, 4.1.0 through 4.1.36, 5.0.0 through 5.0.30, 5.5.0 through 5.5.24, and 6.0.0 through 6.0.13 allow remote authenticated users to inject arbitrary web script or HTML via a parameter name to manager/html/upload, and other unspecified vectors. (http://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvename.cgi?name=CVE-2007-2450)
[11:17] <pkern> Woah tomcat.
[11:17] <pkern> geser: Don't be sadistic. ;)
[11:18] <persia> Doesn't Debian have a solution for those CVEs in their tomcat?
[11:18] <geser> fixed in 5.5.25-1
[11:18] <ScottK> pkern: persia ^^ is another good person to ask about .desktop file validation, IIRC.
[11:19] <geser> !info tomcat5.5 gutsy
[11:19] <persia> Ah.  UVF.  Hrm.
[11:19] <ubotu> tomcat5.5: Servlet and JSP engine. In component universe, is optional. Version 5.5.20-5ubuntu2 (gutsy), package size 56 kB, installed size 368 kB
[11:19] <persia> pkern: What about .desktop files?
[11:19] <ScottK> Well if it's all bug fixes, I don't mine.
[11:19] <ScottK> mine/mind
[11:20] <persia> ScottK: It's only the CVE fixes & a permissions fix.
[11:20] <ScottK> persia: Sounds like a good candidate for a UVFe to me.
[11:20] <persia> pkern: See: taking tomcat isn't masochism :)
[11:21] <ScottK> pkern: Process for this is do a test build and make sure it builds/installs.  If it's good file a sync request with the UVFe stuff added and subscribe motu-uvf.
[11:21] <geser> ScottK: not merge?
[11:22] <persia> Needs a merge: different control files
[11:22] <ScottK> urr...
[11:22] <ScottK> Nevermind.
[11:23] <ScottK> pkern...  Prepare the merge, test it, file UVFe and then upload after it's approved.  Sorry.
[11:24] <ScottK> At least one too many.
[11:24] <albert23> Would it still be possible to sync a new version of sensors-applet from Debian in Gutsy? This would solve bug 147188 It builds in the Gutsy pbuilder, installs and works fine.
[11:24] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 147188 in sensors-applet "Sensors-applet report Core 2 Duo temp as A (Ampere)" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/147188
[11:25] <ScottK> albert23: What's the version that fixes it?
[11:25] <bddebian> I've noticed a lot that do it
[11:25] <albert23> It's the current Debian unstable: 1.8.1+dfsg-1
[11:26] <persia> What's wrong with distclean?
[11:26] <ScottK> pkern: This is Ubuntu.  We don't 'hate' here.  We 'have a mild aversion to' or something squishy like that.
[11:26] <bddebian> hahaha
[11:26] <pkern> I guess it's even written in the Lintian check that you should change your "ignore failure stuff" to [...]  distclean if you already use it.
[11:26] <persia> albert23: What's in the upstream changelog?
[11:26] <pkern> persia: It's not guaranteed that you can build the package afterwards.
[11:26] <pkern> persia: distclean is a maintainer utility.
[11:26] <pkern> geser: *cough*
[11:26] <ScottK> pkern: No you want the package to build.  You DD types are very picky.
[11:27] <persia> pkern: It should be: "distclean" should mean "put it in a state to be distributed"
[11:27] <pkern> ScottK: No I just fixed it and it broke down.
[11:27] <ScottK> No/Now..
[11:27] <pkern> persia: Now there could be make dist hooks which do exactly that.
[11:27] <pkern> gnome-voice-control that is, not tomcat.
[11:27] <persia> pkern: Did it break when you changed -make distclean to make distclean?
[11:28] <pkern> persia: No.
[11:28] <pkern> persia: It already contained a check similar to the [ ! -f foobar.
[11:28] <pkern> ScottK: It's a pity that you Ubuntu folks aren't that picky. :-P
[11:28] <bddebian> heh
[11:29] <persia> pkern: It's because we just NMU it rather than complaining :)
[11:29] <pkern> persia: You don't have something like a NMU I was told. :-P
[11:29] <pkern> And this particular package isn't even in Debian.
[11:29] <albert23> persia: a number of cosmetic changes and a bug fix for a wrong sensor type
[11:30] <ScottK> albert23: If a patch can be pulled out for the wrong sensor type, that could definitely be included.
[11:30] <persia> albert23: Hmm..  Cosmetic changes are tricky.
[11:31] <albert23> persia: something like this "38 C" instead of "38C"
[11:31] <persia> pkern: Ubuntu doesn't have "NMU", but it also doesn't have "Maintainers", so if a package has an issue, the discoveree is expected to just upload rather than complain.
[11:31] <ScottK> Doesn't stop a lot of people from complaining though.
[11:31] <persia> ScottK: True.
[11:32] <pkern> persia: Yeah but well, I fix something and the clean just breaks on me which causes me to unpack it just AGAIN and copying the files over.
[11:32] <pkern> ScottK: Thanks. :-P
[11:33] <persia> pkern: Ah.  That's annoying.
[11:36] <pkern> Hm ok I was wrong about distclean.
[11:36] <pkern> I meant maintainer-clean wrt semantics.
[11:37] <bddebian> Time to go, later gang.  Thanks again pkern
[11:37] <pkern> bddebian: np, cya.
[11:47] <pkern> So ready for tomcat.
[11:47] <pkern> What tools are available for a merge?
[11:48] <ScottK> pkern: http://merges.ubuntu.com/grab-merge.sh
[11:48] <persia> pkern: http://merges.ubuntu.com/t/tomcat5.5/
[11:49] <pkern> rofl@"this deleted everything in cwd"
[11:51] <ScottK> At least it warns you...
[11:51] <ScottK> Gotta run.  See you all later.
[11:55] <slavi1> what's the option to debuild to not give a key?
[11:55] <persia> slavi1: -us
[11:55] <slavi1> ty
[11:56] <pkern> And -uc or does -us imply it?
[11:56] <slavi1> gpg: [stdin] : clearsign failed: secret key not available
[11:56] <slavi1> nope :(
[11:56] <persia> slavi1: Try -us -uc
[11:56] <slavi1> yeap, uc worked
[11:56] <persia> pkern: -uc is no changes file, but I don't think -us implies it.
[11:58] <slavi1> checking for XML... configure: error: The pkg-config script could not be found or is too old.  Make sure it is in your PATH or set the PKG_CONFIG environment variable to the full path to pkg-config.
[11:58] <slavi1> that is a problem with requirements, right?
[12:00] <fredix> hi, there a problem with libgstreamer0.10-ruby1.8
[12:00] <pkern> persia: Eh. -uc is `unsigned changes'.
[12:00] <pkern> persia: Not `no changes'.
[12:00] <persia> pkern: Ah.  Thanks.
[12:03] <slavi1> is it possible for pbuilder to save any new packages it downloads when building so that it doesn't download same stuff when building packages?
[12:05] <pkern> Yeah for tomcat failing to build from source.
[12:05] <pkern> So I WILL have to get my hands dirty wrt Java.
[12:05] <pkern> Bah.
[12:05] <pkern> Can I be bothered? 1782 problems (1 error, 1781 warnings)
[12:06] <persia> pkern: You may not need to dig that deeply.  The maintainer usually tests also against Ubuntu, so it may just need a little control file tweaking.
[12:06] <pkern> "The method clear() is undefined for the type IntrospectionUtils"
[12:07] <pkern> I love such issues.
[12:08] <slavi1> man, building stuff with pbuilder is no cake :(
[12:08] <pkern> Is is.
[12:08] <pkern> s/Is/It/
[12:09] <slavi1> but what happens when the package generated doesn't install cleanly because it tries to overwrite files from other packages?
[12:09] <pkern> Then it's not pbuilder's fault?
[12:09] <persia> slavi1: That's a bug in the generated package.
[12:09] <slavi1> persia: what is best way to resolve such things? but editing the deb file or is there a "better" way?
[12:10] <slavi1> and my room being 30C is not helping :(
[12:10] <persia> slavi1: Don't install the offending file
[12:10] <slavi1> persia: right, dpkg doesn't allow it, but how would I properly fix the package?
[12:10] <pkern> Now there is a public static void clear() in the offending class. Don't know how to fix that lookup issue.
[12:11] <persia> slavi1: Make sure the install: target in debian/rules doesn't install a conflicting file.
[12:14] <slavi1> I see
[12:14] <slavi1> ty
[12:18] <pkern> geser, persia: http://durotan.0x539.de/~pkern/tomcat5.5/ -- Build breaks with one error and I cannot tell why (see the provided build log and look for ERROR).
[12:20] <persia> pkern: This is a debdiff against Debian?
[12:21] <pkern> persia: Yes. The other one would be huge.
[12:21] <pkern> But I could produce it nevertheless.
[12:22] <pkern>  2444 files changed, 59738 insertions(+), 33861 deletions(-)
[12:22] <persia> pkern: No, debdiff debian candidate is the easiest to review.  Your build-deps change a lot more than I'd expect.  You might dig into that a bit: perhaps there's something missing.
[12:22] <pkern> No fun. ;)
[12:22] <pkern> persia: Those are the build-deps of the last Ubuntu revision but ok, I'll look over them again.
[12:23] <persia> pkern: Did the build-deps change between the two Debian revisions?  Last Ubuntu isn't always right.
[12:23] <persia> From the changelog, it looks like the only build-dep changes should be s/xsltproc// and s/ecj-bootstrap/ecj/
[12:24] <persia> Um.  Rather s//xsltproc/
[12:25] <pkern> They changed from libcommons-modeler-java (>= 1.1-1) to libcommons-modeler-java (>= 2.0)
[12:26] <pkern> Now the failure didn't LOOK like that, but well.
[12:26] <persia> pkern: That sounds significant.  Do we have libcommons-modeler-java (>= 2.0)?
[12:26] <pkern> libcommons-modeler-java |      1.1-9 | gutsy/universe | source, all
[12:27] <pkern> Now 1.1 => 2.0 sounds significant, too.
[12:27] <persia> pkern: Luckily the only rdepends is tomcat: it may be possible to upgrade both (I'm not -uvf)
[12:28] <slavi1> I give up :(
[12:28] <pkern> At least no Ubuntu changes.
[12:28] <slavi1> gdl doesn't want to get build
[12:30] <albert23> It looks like I got the backport for sensors-applet. It works on to systems and downgrading to the original Gutsy version gives the bug again.
[12:30] <pkern> Oh well, that package has *tons* of warnings.
[12:30] <persia> albert23: backport?
[12:31] <persia> pkern: errors as well, or just warnings?
[12:31] <pkern> persia: Looks good now, sorry.
[12:31] <pkern> persia: Warnings.
[12:31] <albert23> persia: that's what ScottK asked for?
[12:31] <persia> pkern: Excellent.  Java developers on gutsy will appreciate the API bump.
[12:31] <albert23> persia: ScottK: albert23: If a patch can be pulled out for the wrong sensor type, that could definitely be included.
[12:32] <persia> albert23: Ah.  Excellent.  You'll want to populate the bug with your patch or a debdiff for the new candidate.
[12:33] <pkern> Hah. "DEBSMTP_PASS". So I should keep that in the environment all the time or what.
[12:33] <albert23> persia: It is now a debian package. I guess I need to make an Ubuntu package first?
[12:33] <pkern> Hm probably fiordland will do
[12:34] <persia> albert23: Are you using 1.8-1 directly, or a patch for 1.7-1?
[12:34] <pkern> Ah no, I don't have SMTP here at university. *gnarf*
[12:34] <albert23> persia: I did both, but I thought you and Scottk didn't like the 1.8 package?
[12:35] <persia> albert23: I'm not authoritative, but ScottK is, so only his opinion matters :)
[12:35] <albert23> That's why I did the backport attempt
[12:36] <persia> albert23: In that case, you'll want to apply your patch to 1.7-1, adjust the maintainer in debian/control, and add a changelog entry.  That should give you an Ubuntu package.
[12:36] <albert23> persia: OK. Should I subscribe anyone to the bug to get the patch noticed?