=== stdin [i=stdin@pdpc/supporter/active/stdin] has joined #kubuntu-devel === lnxkde [n=lnxkde@adsl-72-50-51-18.prtc.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel === bddebian [n=bdefrees@c-71-224-175-179.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel === Pitabred [n=pita@c-67-190-48-101.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel === claydoh [n=claydoh@66-252-50-51.dyn-adsl.midmaine.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel === jack_wyt [n=jack@123.115.240.27] has joined #kubuntu-devel === Jucato [n=jucato@124.106.180.89] has joined #kubuntu-devel [03:48] !jucato [03:48] Sorry, I don't know anything about jucato - try searching on http://ubotu.ubuntu-nl.org/factoids.cgi [03:48] Bah [03:48] O.o [03:48] !fluxbuntu [03:48] fluxbuntu is a LPAE-standard compliant, Ubuntu-based derivative that maintains the goal of running on a wide range of mobile devices and computers (low-end & high-end). It is lightweight, swift and efficient. | Support Channel: #fluxbuntu on freenode | Homepage: http://fluxbuntu.org/ === apachelogger_ [n=me@N765P027.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #kubuntu-devel === Hobbsee [n=Hobbsee@ubuntu/member/hobbsee] has joined #kubuntu-devel === n8k99 [n=nathan@dsl254-078-190.nyc1.dsl.speakeasy.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel [04:15] ping Jucato [04:16] claydoh: pong. OpenSource took care of it :) [04:16] finally got that PM : [04:16] I know [04:16] hehehe :) [04:16] noticed *after* i responded lol [04:16] sorry for bothering you :P [04:16] :P [04:16] stop that [04:17] ;) [04:17] heheh :) [04:18] I want everyone to know (as a konqueror lover, I *love* dolphin [04:18] on KDE 4? [04:18] I hoipe [04:18] hope* [04:19] heck on kde3 in gutsy [04:19] ew.... [04:19] ok d3lphin [04:19] in KDE4 it looks even sweeter [04:19] ew ew ew :P [04:20] oh well... I like the real Dolphin... === n8k99 what's with teh l33t sp3ll1ng === jack_wyt [n=jack@123.115.240.27] has joined #kubuntu-devel [04:20] n8k99: D3lphin is the fork of Dolphin on KDE 3 [04:20] as in "3" [04:21] oh so when i click on dolphin's icon here in 3 it is really d3lphin i'm using? [04:21] interesting [04:21] on Kubuntu? yes [04:21] ok- cool [04:22] not so cool imho... it's severely damaging/going to damage Dolphin's reputation for KDE 4 [04:23] oh? is d3lphin that bad? === n8k99 likes it so far [04:23] compared to the one in KDE4? um.. yes? :) [04:24] I had to make a patch to even get a "Restore item" and "Empty trash" in there... [04:24] that was you?!! [04:24] which until now D3lphin upstream hasn't replied to... [04:24] YAY!!! === jack_wyt [n=jack@123.115.240.27] has joined #kubuntu-devel [04:24] hahah [04:25] my first ever major patch that actually adds a functionality more than just a checkbox :) [04:25] nice! [04:25] hey check this article out [04:25] http://www.linux.com/feature/119609 [04:25] and I just copied the implementation from Dolphin in KDE 4 [04:25] that's pretty good work- Jucato [04:26] and guess what Dolphin in kDE 4 uses to do trash management? :) [04:26] um, the trash:/ [04:26] libkonq!!!! :) [04:26] haha [04:26] that's funny [04:26] yeah I found it amusing as well :) [04:27] what other big differences... D3lphin doesn't have a Folders panel (tree list side bar), doesn't have an embedded terminal (F4 launches a separate konsole) [04:27] oooh nice! [04:27] D3lphin doesn't have grouping by categories [04:28] Dolphin (KDE 4) has those [04:28] you mean categories of files? [04:28] like tagging items [04:28] by letter, by type, etc [04:28] oh right [04:28] i see [04:28] that too I think. but I never got nepomuk to work [04:29] hm... ran into another upgrade bug yay! [04:29] oh goodie! [04:30] Detective Jucato on the case! [04:30] yep. but this time it's not a show stopper hahah [04:30] nah, I'll pass the burden on Hobbsee later :) [04:30] hehe [04:30] she'll poke you with her LongPointyStick [04:31] unless that's been upgraded to LongPointyStick2.0 [04:31] she has more sticks now... [04:31] oh dear- this is getting really dangerous [04:31] hm? [04:31] haha [04:31] yikes [04:31] LongPointyStick2.0. i like that! === n8k99 jumps === Jucato missed the days when Hobbsee used to say "oh dear" too [04:31] oh dear :P [04:31] hahaha :) [04:32] i want to brag a bit [04:32] Hobbsee: btw, the bug I'm talking about. fresh feisty install, upgrade to gutsy. upgrade is now over (after Riddell fixed the guidance bug). now the user still uses the Feisty KSplash [04:32] Linux.com wrote a story about me this week [04:32] absolutely fresh install, no modifications [04:33] Jucato: ksplash? did we change that? [04:33] the background at least [04:33] it still uses Feisty's KSplash wallpaper [04:33] n8k99: heheh yeah you're more famous than me. I only got dugg. you got linux.com'ed === n8k99 is proud! [04:34] ok over it [04:34] haha [04:34] that was quick :) [04:34] mine lasted 24 hours (digg effect) [04:35] its too dangerous for me to hang onto that feeling too long [04:35] aw.. k'mon! savor it... it only happens once :P [04:36] Jucato: ah [04:36] yes... "ah" :) [04:36] hehe === hunger_t [n=tobias@p54A73A09.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #kubuntu-devel [04:39] n8k99: I want world peace! [04:39] hunger_t: Hey! [04:39] DaSkreech: you want fries with that? [04:40] Depends. who made them [04:40] Belgians [04:40] w/ ketchup please [04:40] Mayo would be more truly Belgian. [04:40] Ok one order of World Peace and two sides of Fries [04:40] coming right up! === Hobbsee remembers meeting a linux.com reporter, iirc. [04:41] interesting bloke. [04:41] Jucato: Pfft pinheiro is hitting like 400 with his blog ;0 [04:41] no, wait, was osnews [04:41] hahah [04:41] Which reminds me. I made some really good steak fries for dinner last night. I think I'll heat the leftovers for a snack. [04:42] i didn't actully meet this reporter, just answered some email [04:42] rawr!!! you guys are making me hungry :( [04:42] Katsup? [04:42] Not a bad K app :) === n8k99 hands Jucato a cup of brown tea [04:43]

aseigo * r723203 workspace/trunk/KDE/kdebase/workspace/plasma/containments/desktop/desktop.cpp: engine explorer, thanks to Jucato for noticing [04:43] hahah! :) [04:43] DaSkreech: you in the -commits channel? [04:43] :-) [04:44] too much traffic.... I'll be spending my whole day watching lines go by === DaSkreech [n=skreech@katapult/ninja/daskreech] has joined #kubuntu-devel [05:01] Powercut [05:01] "Eckenrode is a member of the Ubuntu New York Local Community Team (NyLoCo), and "self-appointed community representative" who organizes group get-togethers and, most recently, a free CD handout in a New York City park." [05:02] n8k99 is a sacr [05:02] sacrfl? :) [05:02] haha [05:03] there was one time I went to the UN as the Ambassador from Kubuntu [05:03] saafkfl [05:04] i just wanted to make it clear that nobody told me that i could or could not go there as a representative [05:04] so i used self-appointed [05:04] hence the "sa" :) === n8k99 shrugs [05:04] :) [05:07] hehe [05:08] dude, my client/server address book rocks...it has more try/catches than there are people in the world :p [05:10] konvert to kute/kde and kombine with kontact [05:11] kuickly! [05:11] korrekt [05:13] krap [05:13] kan't kome up with another kreation :-( [05:14] keep trying you'll be kompletely kool when you sukkeed [05:15] kwit. [05:16] ok [05:16] kk === Jucato sKratches his head === ScottK really doesn't care. That was just all I could think of ;-) [05:21] hahah! :) === Hobbsee tries to figure out what on earth is going on with this krakkful email filtering [05:24] if it's kmail, why wonder? :) [05:25] no, i'ts not kmail [05:25] it's filterside spamming, and now i have to rework my sieve rule [05:26] (the rotters have decided to pick off mails from the mailing list - and then, apparently, send it thru fiordland. === jjesse [n=jjesse@207.59.146.235] has joined #kubuntu-devel [05:27] aaah [05:27] which hits the "you're in my addressbook. whitelist" section, so it all gets marked [05:28] what i'm wondering is how it seems to get thru fiordland at all. [05:32] Great [05:32] another dead Ubuntu project [05:35] what? [05:35] Home server [05:36] ah [05:36] which I thought was a dumb idea at the start anyway [05:41] Networked shadow copy my buttcheeks [05:47] n8k99: What about hospitals? [05:49] DaSkreech: i like those too [05:49] I was looking into open source for Hospitals the other day [05:49] most people point out hospitals as place where open source should not tread [05:49] why do they say that? [05:50] I was wondering if you had glanced in their direction [05:50] so that the data from hospitals can be owned by someone elses [05:50] frankly, i haven't look at hospitals much [05:51] i have seen taht Google has a Health plan [05:51] but haven't personally pursued that path [05:52] ha ha [05:52] I do't care about data I'm talking about programs inside the hospital [05:52] of course- [05:53] but some of that will definately invovle hardware manufacturers [05:53] I guess it's the thoughts of many fingers in your loved ones life systems [05:53] there are specialized pieces of equipement which are run via software [05:53] Someone was showing me pics of hospital software on the market [05:54] they were designed for windows3.1 and 95 and really haven't been updated except to run on newer platforms [05:54] not many geeks can get their hands on Ultrasound machines to write new drivers for the wand [05:55] unless they work with or for the manufacturers [05:55] would a foundation be able to? [05:55] that could be a possibility- especially through establishing a relationship with the hardware producer [05:56] Are hardware producers fussy about the specs of the machine being known? [05:56] I would think in health care they would want them more known [05:56] well, not particularly familiar with the ins and outs [05:57] but it seems that is video card manufactorers are just not getting around to being more open [05:57] much more specialized equipment would follow the proprietary path more thoroughly [05:57] but that is all opinion based upon supposition === n8k99 haven't really done any homework in the area [05:59] n8k99: Yeah well they will get sued if they talk about it. I think that medical equipment would get sued if they dont [05:59] interesting [05:59] At least I hope they would That only makes sense in my head [06:00] The first they is video card makers :) [06:00] well not everyone thinks like we do [06:00] No I'm thinking like a lawyer now [06:01] I'm sure I can convince a panel of people that the machine they get hooked up to one day will at least be understood by the doctor and hospital staff so that if something goes wrong they won't have to wait till they fly in a specialist [06:02] plus hospital equipment is not very black boxish where you put things in one end and something comes out the other end [06:02] just make sure that that panel is the purchassing committee [06:03] The mechanics of what happens has to be known in case it would affect a patient allergic to pottasium or would go into shock with too much calcium [06:03] i think some people have argued tha tdoctors need to know how patients work , not computers [06:04] there are lots of techs who handle teh testing equipment [06:04] doctors don't handle any of that sort of equipment [06:04] n8k99: Right but the people buying and maintaining the computers caring for the people will have to know [06:04] which means the specs will be there [06:05] in any case I'm getting off topic for hospitals === n8k99 isn't really arguing - but trying to explore the topic [06:05] I'm not really talking about specialized firmware for a themometer [06:05] I'm talking more about hospital/patient/drug management software [06:06] the ones I have seen are horrible at best [06:06] right- patient information data, presention software and databases [06:06] Opensoure really focuses on the enduser [06:06] So I would think that it's a good fit but people are really afraid of it since lives hang in the balnace [06:08] that would be in interesting study actually [06:08] Yes it would but there is no way anything first world will make a move towards it [06:09] they think like lawyers as well [06:09] i'm not so sure about that sentiment [06:10] i mean, it seems as if ther is a tide of movement in the general direction of greater acceptance [06:10] well they are using software from windows 3.1 cause it works [06:11] it seems to me that national medical care needs an overhaul period [06:11] this could also be a part of the overall package [06:12] particularly if an open Standard for health records is created [06:12] so that vendors are not the main part of teh issues any more [06:13] Until folks start moving away from Windows, I don't want an open standard. [06:13] Seriously. [06:14] doesnt seem like it'll be an easy egg to crack [06:15] Then at the very least there needs to be a SERIOUS overhaul in security practices. [06:16] n8k99: Third world would actually be a better place to start [06:16] DaSkreech: Good call. It's much easier to innovate where there's not a status quo to oppose new thinking. [06:16] And cost is at a premium [06:17] except that the 3rd world will think that 1st world is just trying to scrape crumbs off the table [06:17] Well, status quo opposition is why we're having so much trouble with things like electric autos and such. [06:17] not giving them the same thing that they are getting for themselves [06:17] Depending on how bad the country is the cost of clutching at a new straw may be very cheap [06:18] n8k99: again. If that's the mindset that's not where you want to start [06:18] so countries like India would be a second stop [06:19] well, that is why i have been going to the UN [06:19] to make it so that African nations which are trying to skip the analogy networking and get digital [06:19] will find it not so distasteful to accepta superior technical solution that would give them an advantage [06:20] they do not see it easily- [06:21] it is a lot of work to actually move official opinions [06:21] and i feel like I am just a volunteer lobbyist [06:21] Good. [06:21] That means you're not a corrupt a-hole :) [06:22] Professional lobbyists just buy their official opinions :) === DaSkreech waves money at n8k99 [06:22] yes, they do === n8k99 has babies to feed === cn28h [n=cn28h@pool-71-98-93-252.ipslin.dsl-w.verizon.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel [06:24] i'd actually like it more if i had several documents about nontech businesses who use FOSS to take with me [06:25] i have heard some rumors but nothing that is substanciated [06:25] yet === BentJ [n=BentJ@port46.ds1-esp.adsl.cybercity.dk] has joined #kubuntu-devel [06:29] n8k99: What kind of businesses [06:29] The JAD is moving to Linux here [06:30] some small to medium sized ones [06:30] JAD? [06:30] Jamaica Association for the Deaf [06:31] is that Jamaica the island nation or the neighborhood in Queens === n8k99 lives in Brooklyn in the midst of a Jaimaican neighborhood [06:32] and my daughter goes to Jamaican Daycare [06:32] Jah Know? [06:33] Roughneck mon raspec! [06:33] ha! [06:34] what size of installation is JAD considering? [06:34] is it on current equipment? [06:34] currently 12 computers [06:34] yes [06:35] with another possible 11 in the future [06:35] there is a lot of specialzed software we are trying to work around [06:36] so you work there? [06:36] or are part of the process of switching over? [06:36] Process of switching over [06:37] would you mind sending me an email writing up the whole thing? [06:38] and any issues or experiences which you may feel are worth sharing === Pitabred [n=pita@c-67-190-48-101.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel [06:40] $My_IRC_Nick at newyork-ubuntu.com [06:41] That would totally rock! Ja heard [06:47] n8k99: As long as you don't mind gregarious misuses of virtual machines and windows licenses :) [06:48] if i can give a nice summary of what you are doing [06:48] Ha ha Okie :) t [06:48] then it will be helpful to add to teh points in the roundtable discussion [06:48] they just want to sidestep Windows fees in the long term and not have krap krash all the time [06:49] DiBono from Goolge will be there so there is a rep for Large Enterprises [06:49] but We are getting a lot of clients who want to move wholesale to Linux here [06:49] the UN wants to hear some small to medium business voices as well [06:49] Well yeah large enterprises can move to anything once they have a will === manchicke1 [n=manchick@209-252-75-168.ip.mcleodusa.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel [06:49] right that's why it more important to hear about the little fishes than the whales [06:56] n8k99: If you can ask the big whales about hospitals and see if stallman etc have heard any whispers [06:56] i will do that for you [06:56] But I'm sure I could give you quite a few 3-5 computer business migration success stories [06:56] i don't think stallman is coming this time [06:57] once you start hitting like 10 or so it gets dicey [06:57] the web cast is not in a free format so he refuses teh invites [06:58] the JAD thing is going to be rough cause they have a good deal of testing equipment and software that only works with Windows so we are going to have put windows in a Vm and run it from there [06:58] n8k99: can' you offer to have a free alternative one? [06:58] In the spirit of the discussion it would only make sense [06:58] that is something from the offices of UNITAR who run the seminars [06:58] and that could ease the Stallman hubris a bit [06:59] that's exactly what i meant about the breadcrumbs earlier!!! [06:59] "first world doesn't use it, not even the UN uses it, so why should we?" [06:59] I don't get how allowing you to do your thing the way you want to do it is breadcrumbs [06:59] Ah [06:59] ^^^^ [06:59] In general not in this situation [07:00] exactly [07:00] What does the UN use? [07:00] wma and quicktime movies i believe [07:00] maybe even avi, but definately not ogg [07:00] Ha ha Well it's not real which is good [07:00] if only there were more online videos in ogg... [07:01] we could market mplayer/open source video players + ogg [07:01] but darn you Flash!! [07:01] Jucato: I've found that most Windows players can play vorbis but not theora [07:01] I have hopes that Flash will be a standard soon [07:01] well "soon" [07:02] hopefully there will be other Flash "IDE's"... [07:02] hm.. isn't Flash already semi-standard? [07:03] it is a standard of sorts, however it is controlled by a single entity, its creator [07:03] so everybody that uses it is at Adobe's whim [07:03] isn't PDF that way too? [07:04] yup [07:04] oh well... [07:04] its a standard based upon its ubiquity [07:04] just like .doc [07:05] saddly [07:05] n8k99: not really PDF is published [07:05] oh, good, I love when I am wrong! [07:05] hm... I think PDF is ISO in fact === mars [n=cb@LSt-Amand-152-33-21-185.w82-127.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #kubuntu-devel [07:05] YAY!!! [07:05] iirc [07:05] but not sure [07:05] more n8k99 wrongness!! === Jucato thinks there's no word such as "wrongness"? [07:06] but that still doesn't make it an Open standard [07:06] No it doesn't [07:06] You all think I'm being logical in thinking that I could increase the amount of wireless bandwidth if I just add another wireless router to my network? [07:06] Which is why I said Flash will be a standard === n8k99 has poetic license to make up words as he goes [07:06] I purposely did not say open standard [07:07] but at least then you can make a full fledged editor and player with out legal risks or pain [07:07] http://www.iso.org/iso/iso_catalogue/catalogue_tc/catalogue_detail.htm?csnumber=38920 [07:07] right- that would be important [07:07] manchicke1: Is it a N router? [07:07] ABG [07:08] No you'll just up the amount of collisions I suspect [07:08] I was thinking of just getting another wireless router and running that through my current wireless router using another channel. [07:08] manchicke1: wouldn't taht just add more users to the same pipe taht is coming into the network? [07:08] I think that this linksys is just having a hard time handling so many nodes. [07:09] I've got two laptops, one wireless-to-ethernet adapter, two mobile phones, and sporadically a Nintendo Wii, all on the same wireless router. [07:10] shouldn't that router be able to handle the load for up to 50 nodes? [07:10] I don't know. [07:10] Maybe it's just this router having technical problems. [07:11] I was kinda hoping that there was a linksys router that had better range than this WRT54g. [07:11] my mac mini can broadcast Wifi for up to 10 nodes [07:11] adding another router to a different end of the physical space could help with that [07:12] Yeah, but I don't use that nonsense here :) [07:12] or just a repeater [07:12] (the mac mini that is) === n8k99 understood the nonsense quip [07:12] :P [07:13] i bought it when i didnt know any better === DaSkreech sighs as Firefox eat 20% of my CPU and 40% of my RAM [07:13] And soon, this Vista machine will be out of my house. Thank God. [07:13] haha [07:13] manchicke1: What are your impressions of it? [07:13] Of Vista? [07:14] yes [07:14] It's rubbish. [07:14] I'm damn-near useless under Vista. [07:15] It doesn't even have a proper terminal program or SSH connectivity. === mars_ [n=cb@LSt-Amand-152-33-21-185.w82-127.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #kubuntu-devel [07:15] telnet ? [07:16] manchicke1: putty doesnt work on vista? [07:16] WTF is mimo? [07:17] Hobbsee: Why should I need a separate program to do what every other operating system does without something fancy? [07:17] manchicke1: because it's windows, and windows sucks. [07:17] manchicke1: why are you on vista anyway? did you take over nixternal's role? [07:18] nah, anyone can use vista.but only nixternal loves it :) [07:18] No, my employer provided me with a Vista machine a while ago for testing. I've only used it for IE7 until my laptop went into the shop. [07:18] Now I have to use this machine. [07:19] manchicke1: There is only two other operating systems and one of them doesn't come with any form of SSH so Nyah ;-P [07:19] DaSkreech: Really? I thought there were several others. === freeflying [n=freeflyi@211.94.35.200] has joined #kubuntu-devel [07:20] Nope [07:20] GNU/Linux, BSD, Solaris, OSX, OSN, various experimental OS' (HaikuOS, ReactOS), then there's GNU/Darwin, etc. [07:20] UNIX and symbian [07:20] All UNix [07:20] ReactOS is a WinXP clone. [07:20] HaikuOS is a BeOS clone. [07:21] except Haiku which has just got a networking stack so good luck finding a SSH client [07:21] quit talking bad about me...I am going to cry :"( [07:21] I know Haiku I keep trying to get it on Distrowatch [07:21] And then there's always VMS. [07:21] I'm not sure it fits but Meh [07:21] nixternal: You love it [07:21] But I can't afford their hardware. === milian [n=milian@p57BB2DCF.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #kubuntu-devel [07:21] !nixternal | nixternal [07:21] nixternal: Oh no! The pointy-clicky Vista lover has arrived! He's rumoured to be giving out free money, too! [07:22] thanks Hobbsee, I think the one highlight would have been enough :p [07:22] :P [07:22] jeesh, after a few thousand lines of code, my client/server address book is almost complete [07:22] Has anybody used the Netgear RangeMax wireless router? [07:22] my neighbor uses that [07:22] nixternal: kongrats [07:23] and I can connect to him without any problems :) [07:23] I tend to connect to him better than I do my wrt poopy router [07:23] that just sounds... weird.... [07:24] What one do you have? === nixternal waits [07:26] !visternal [07:26] Oh no! The pointy-clicky Vista lover has arrived! He's rumoured to be giving out free money, too! [07:36] Ha ha now we don't have to alert him === raphink [n=raphink@ubuntu/member/raphink] has joined #kubuntu-devel === Lure [n=lure@ubuntu/member/lure] has joined #kubuntu-devel === viviersf [n=cain@196.44.1.98] has joined #kubuntu-devel === viviersf [n=cain@gw.impilinux.co.za] has joined #kubuntu-devel === \sh_away is now known as \sh [08:22] moin \sh [08:23] <\sh> moins === AstralJava [n=jaska@e82-103-217-184.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #kubuntu-devel [09:04] G'morning everyone. :) Just thought I'd ask whether anyone could point me to the right direction; I set up the env variables according to http://kubuntu.org/announcements/kde4-beta1.php, then tried to run knode, but I get an error message: [09:04] /usr/lib/kde4/bin/knode: symbol lookup error: /usr/lib/kde4/lib/libkdepim.so.4: undefined symbol: _ZTI18KStaticDeleterBase [09:04] hum [09:04] Since I'm totally newbie when it comes to KDE-anything, I have no clue on what to do now. :) [09:04] I checked that that file exists. [09:05]