sbalneavEvening all03:07
=== jsgotangco_ is now known as greeneggsnospam
=== greeneggsnospam is now known as jeromesg
RichEdgreat edubuntu review: Microsoft matters less every 6 months07:51
RichEdhi js07:52
jeromesgnice write up :)07:54
RichEdjeromesg: he is a champion of ours ... is in love with our LTSP07:55
jeromesgi havent been using ltsp lately, doing mostly servers07:58
jeromesgnot much on desktops07:58
kgoetzltsp+pxe ftw07:59
=== `6og is now known as Kamping_Kaiser
arnadelohas anyone installed edubuntu 7.10 with ltsp server10:49
oslHi everybody , i am facing a problem in starting X on a terminal , can anyone help ??11:40
desertcI don't know, but #ubuntu generally answers technical questions.11:44
osldesertc, it's about LTSP11:45
RichEdosl: also ask in #ltsp ... that is the same implementation as ours11:55
sbalneavMorning all13:22
ogra_cmpchey sbalneav13:36
sbalneavHow's it going ogra?  Getting geeked yet?13:40
ogra_cmpcall scripts and modifications for cmpc are done13:46
ogra_cmpcnow i need to create packages for that13:46
ogra_cmpcbeyond that i only need the code for the notetaking app (RichEd ?) and to write a little installer13:47
sbalneavNotetaking app?13:48
ogra_cmpcthe squashfs and initramfs for gutsy are done ,,, switching to virtual 800x600 screen works (i wrote a little panel applet for that) aned its properly installable13:48
ogra_cmpcfor that clippable scanner device that you can clip on a sheet of paper13:49
sbalneavOh, I don't have that little widget :)13:49
ogra_cmpcit reads the inpout from the device and transfers what you wrote to a canvas that you can save as bitmap remember ?13:49
ogra_cmpcbut intel had it when they presented cmpc13:50
sbalneavYeah, I heard people talk about it but I never saw it.13:50
sbalneavin action at least.13:50
sbalneavCool.  Should I bring my CMPC with me?13:50
ogra_cmpci would write an app myself (especially since theirs was gtk1.2 iirc) but i dont know anything about hid programming13:51
sbalneavDo we have the source for the old one?13:51
ogra_cmpcif you want a gutsy image, bring it, yes :)13:51
ogra_cmpci'm waiting for the source13:51
sbalneavI'll need a 2 gig memory stick too, yes?13:51
sbalneavYou get the speed problem sorted out?13:51
ogra_cmpcno, i'll bring several13:52
sbalneavYou will?13:52
sbalneavYo've got a 1 gig image?13:52
ogra_cmpcnot yet13:52
sbalneavoh, but you will?13:52
ogra_cmpcthe one the installer script will use will be a 1gig one13:53
ogra_cmpcprobably only 600M13:53
sbalneavGood job!13:53
ogra_cmpcdepends how smart i'm with teh script13:53
sbalneavWhat did the slowness turn out to be?13:53
ogra_cmpcthe installed system will in any case be 1gig13:53
ogra_cmpcthe slowness is still there13:53
ogra_cmpcits kless slow and well usable with one or two a\pps running13:54
sbalneavIs it a "disk speed" issue or a "processor speed" issue?13:54
ogra_cmpcboth :)13:54
ogra_cmpcno L2 cache in the CPU limits the IO there oretty much13:54
ogra_cmpcand teh flashdisk is slow by design13:55
ogra_cmpcif i dont disable the disk cache in FF and try to load planet it takes about 5min13:55
ogra_cmpcwithout disk cache its usable (still around 1min but significantly different)13:56
sbalneavOh, BTW, is mdke a canonical employee?13:56
ogra_cmpcnot that i know13:56
ogra_cmpcat least not yet13:56
ogra_cmpcwhy ?13:56
sbalneavWe need to get him to re-run whatever magic to get the new handbook up on the website13:56
sbalneavWonder if he's in #ubuntu-doc13:57
ogra_cmpcivf he's here he likely is13:57
sbalneavJust pinged him, I'll keep an eye out for him today.13:59
ogra_cmpci was going through a list with possible specs today13:59
sbalneavCool!  We have some up on the site? I need to sit down and bang a few in.14:00
sbalneavbrb coffee14:00
ogra_cmpcnot yet14:01
ogra_cmpcwhat i have so far:14:01
ogra_cmpc- virtual-hal-devices14:01
ogra_cmpc- localapps14:01
ogra_cmpc- gui frontends for ltsp tools14:01
ogra_cmpcany additions are welcome :)14:02
=== RichEd-1 is now known as RichEd
=== ogra__ is now known as ogra
sbalneavogra_cmpc: Bug #156229 seems kind of weird, eh?  I can't see why that would hang.14:39
ubotuLaunchpad bug 156229 in ltsp "ltsp_config hanging in NFS_root environment" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/15622914:39
ogra_cmpcme neither14:40
RichEdhi ogra / ogra_cmpc15:36
RichEdthat medibuntu thread is a bit sad15:36
ogra_cmpcah well15:36
ogra_cmpcwe cant control the derivatives users build15:36
RichEdwe cannot be called in to be police over "a set of personal laws"15:36
ogra_cmpcand we cant deny wiki access15:37
RichEdand there is a strong moral issue behind that all ... i always say that if someone is allowed to browse the world cup soccer site at work, then a babe site is just another "non-work" use of facilities15:37
RichEdto say which is right or wrong is not an absolute call15:38
ogra_cmpcand not up to us if we have defined that space as public wiki15:38
ogra_cmpche could go to teh CC with teh issue or so to have it discussed and find a policy thqat makes everyone happy15:39
RichEdyep ... otherwise we end up curtailing freedom of expression ... once you say that ABC is not acceptable, then, the door is open for any other decision about "stuff we don't like"15:39
ogra_cmpcor he could ask medibuntu to put the hotbabe stuff not on the frontpage15:39
RichEdif you allow a christian ubuntu, we should also allow a druid and pagan ubuntu etc.15:40
ogra_cmpcmubuntu exists already :)15:40
ogra_cmpci wouldnt object druidbuntu or paganbuntu ,,,,15:40
ogra_cmpckkkbuntu would probably not coc conform though :)15:41
ogra_cmpc*not be15:41
ogra_cmpcbut beyond that i love to see new derivativews15:41
RichEdshould i respond to the email thread, or is it better to let that sort of stuff die a natural death ?15:44
sbalneavmediabuntu thread?  Link?15:45
ogra_cmpca mail to all of the people listed on teh edubuntu.org contacts page15:46
ogra_cmpccomplaining about a link from teh ubuntu wiki to the medibuntu frontpage15:46
ogra_cmpcthey advertise their hotbabe package15:47
ogra_cmpcdirectly on teh frontpage15:47
ogra_cmpcyay !15:49
* ogra_cmpc just got a phonecall .... if i return from boston they'll install my new SDSL line here\15:50
=== ogra_cmpc is now known as ogra
ograthats better15:52
RichEdogra: if i return from boston <- well with your travel luck that's only 95% certain15:59
ograi have direct flights this time16:01
ograand both with reliable lufthansa16:01
ogragerman train conductors are on strike16:01
ograso my flights should be fine, i'm just not sure i can reach them in time (or return home afterwards)16:02
stgraberogra: :)16:28
ogrataxi frankfurt -> kassel is doable for 300 euros :P16:29
* ogra did that once when he was totally desparate16:29
ograit wasnt my most expensive taxi ride :)16:30
sbalneavWhat WAS your most expensive taxi ride?16:33
* sbalneav is now curious16:33
ografor about 500km16:34
ograwhich is quite a good rate still ... for a taxi16:35
sbalneav500 km taxi ride?! Wow16:35
ograwell, it was 250 each direction and he had relatives in hamburg so he pikcked me up teh next day for return and we justified a fixed price16:36
ograwith the train situation in .de i'm really considering to buy a cheap car for the winter16:38
highvoltageLaserJock: ping18:14
LaserJock_highvoltage: here18:18
LaserJock_highvoltage: bah, one sec18:19
LaserJockI forgot I had irssi on my other machine still running18:20
highvoltageah :)18:20
pips1LaserJock: highvoltage I'm here18:43
LaserJockpips1: hi18:43
highvoltagepips1: ah, great18:43
pips1hi there18:44
highvoltagepips1: since you have write permissions, can you get https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~newz/fridge/fridge-theme-v218:44
highvoltagepips1: and install it and create a user that uses that theme so that we can see how it affects things?18:44
pips1I'm currently busy fetching the theme18:48
pips1erm, this sure takes a while18:54
LaserJockwelcome to bzr :-)18:54
pips1highvoltage: I have enabled the theme for your existing theme-testing user19:10
pips1now I need to cook diner for my better half :-)19:11
pips1LaserJock: ^^^19:11
pips1ok guys, cu later19:12
pips1erm, there fridge seems really scrambles things up well... :-/19:19
pips1cu folks19:32
nixternalogra: if you are around, it seems it is your turn in the classroom20:10
* desertc watches the Edubuntu presentation in #ubuntu-classroom ....20:14
desertcAnyone want to talk about Edubuntu for a half an hour?20:31
LaserJockwhat's going on?20:32
desertcOliver Grawert who was scheduled to talk in #ubuntu-classroom is a no show.  Still a half-hour of the session left.20:32
desertcLaserJock: Thanks.20:34
stgraberdesertc: I probably can answer some questions about Edubuntu but I'm not ogra and my answers won't be as accurate has him20:35
stgraberdesertc: I'm more of the LTSP server part20:35
desertcstgraber: you may want to join the channel, and the -chat, too20:36
stgraberdesertc: already on -classroom, will join -chat too20:36
juliuxRichEd, ping?20:37
stgraberLaserJock: want help for the LTSP questions ?20:38
LaserJockstgraber: probably20:40
desertcThis Moodle: [ http://www.moodle.org ] is insanely popular with educators.  Y'all could do worse than to weave that open source software into Edubuntu.   It would be a great selling point.20:57
LaserJockdesertc: we do have it21:07
LaserJockdesertc: but it has issues so we couldn't do it by default in Gutsy21:07
LaserJockdesertc: we'll have it for Hardy21:08
desertcI attended a couple teacher conferences, and they could not stop talking about Moodle.  But they seem to have trouble maintaining the packages, since it updates so often.21:08
LaserJockyes, and was a security nightmare21:08
LaserJockwe did a lot of work on our packages for gutsy21:09
desertcIf there was a distro that maintained Moodle with a series of other applications, then teachers would feel good about using that distro.21:09
LaserJockand now it's in Main21:09
desertcThat's great to hear!21:09
LaserJockso for Hardy it should be ready to go, installed by default21:09
alterooMost amount of people I've ever seen in here I think :)21:11
desertcYou could probably get Edubuntu into schools just on being the Moodle-distro alone.21:11
nixternalI would have to agree with that one...I am seeing Moodle more and more here being used21:11
desertcI'm just going to say it... it's Moodle-insanity.  ;)  Everyone is moving from Blackboard to Moodle.21:12
LaserJockthat's why we've put a lot of effort into it21:12
desertcBut NONE of them budget a support cost around the transition.21:12
nixternaldesertc: ya, our university just switched from crap, to crap, I mean blackboard, except the IT division, they went with Moodle21:13
desertc(Problem with selling Linux as a cost savings rather than a feature improvement.)21:13
shane_hi all!21:13
lavender_dreamOne question that also coincided with what I was mainly curious about Edubuntu was asked by someone but wasn't answered due to time constraint/etc. That is: Regarding the content of the educational programs in edubuntu do you plan on expanding the content in edubuntu to college level?21:13
desertcSo there is a real opportunity for a distro that supports Moodle really well.21:14
LaserJocklavender_dream: yes21:14
desertcCan you get it on a LiveCD, I wonder?21:14
LaserJocklavender_dream: I'm a PhD student and very keen on getting Edubuntu into universities21:15
LaserJockI've been working, albeit slowly, on getting more uni level applications in21:15
LaserJockdesertc: yes, as I said, Hardy should have it :-)21:15
LaserJocknot on a LiveCD though21:16
desertcCrazy question: Do you see any way to tie Ubuntu LoCos into the Edubuntu distro?  Putting a plug into Edubuntu letting kids know about ways they can get involved with the world-wide open source community?21:16
LaserJockas it requires database setup etc. and is really a server app21:16
LaserJockwell, we'd certainly like to21:16
LaserJockas always, the problem is having enough hands to do it21:16
desertcImagine if students started understanding about the FOSS community in school....  *far away look in his eyes*21:17
LaserJockso if you have any suggestions of people ... ;-)21:17
shane_Will Edubuntu have a more simplistic interface, maybe as an option for younger children (<6yrs)? along the lines of sugar....21:20
desertcI am interested in helping out the Edubuntu team more.  So I will reserve the remainder of my questions until later.21:21
nealmcbthe leader of the https://edge.launchpad.net/~edubuntu-study-content/ team, MauricioHernandez, hasn't responded to emails or approved new members in a long time, though it seems like a very worthwhile team.  Does anyone know him?21:22
LaserJockshane_: I'm really not sure. We don't have any current plans for that21:25
LaserJocknealmcb: I know him21:25
LaserJocknealmcb: he's not really active anymore. Real life got him21:25
LaserJocknealmcb: if you'd like to join or get that going please email edubuntu-devel21:26
nealmcbLaserJock: thanks.  musashi1 has a similar team now, I forget the name, so maybe he'll pick it up.  I just hate it when dozens of people volunteer for a team that is stuck in the mud because only a single person is an admin.  They should have some sort of multiple-admin guideline in launchpad....21:28
musashi1or https://launchpad.net/~edubuntu-school-support21:29
musashi1and yes, we are stuck in the mud :)21:30
musashi1wait, wrong one21:30
nealmcbI sure know my eyes are bigger, and my head better at nodding "yes", than my hands and feet can manage :-)21:30
musashi1though the other one is a good idea too21:31
nealmcbmore teams!  we need more teams!  :-)21:31
nealmcblets appoint a committee - that will solve it :-)21:31
shane_if i may butt in with a few few questions... I would like to deploy Edubuntu at my mothers school using LTSP since most of the current machines are meant for win 98 and prior.21:34
* musashi1 is still wondering if there are efforts in canonical or the community to help further develop educational apps that are good but not "there yet"21:34
shane_what kind of hardware considerations will i have to make?21:35
shane_would i just have to plug everything in and it would work?21:35
shane_i am more concerned about the x terminal sideof things.21:36
musashi1shane_: based on my lab, a decent server with enough memory to match clients, clients that PXE boot are easier to handle but etherboot also works. other than that it "just worked" for us on old circa win98 clients21:37
musashi1and a new server21:37
shane_yes i think a new server can be organized...21:38
musashi1the whole thing has to be wired through switches too21:38
shane_does LTSP do load sharing between the server and clients?21:38
musashi1i don't know that...someone else ^^21:39
shane_since I will be using x terminals... how is the sound handled for each terminal? since the app is run on the server...21:41
shane_kids games do need the sound for the full effect :)21:41
musashi1i'm not sure i know what you mean by x-terms but in our lab the sound worked out of the client speakers. i suspect headphones would work too but didn't try21:42
hippuno reason it wouldn't21:43
shane_well i suppose you used boxes that were meant to be used as x terminals... i'm thinking of using old computers... booting off the network...21:43
musashi1shane_: that is exactly what we are doing21:44
shane_oh cool21:44
musashi1old computers21:44
musashi1and new server21:44
musashi1old server == really slow :)21:44
shane_and in terms of system admin? because i will not be there.. and no one there has ever used Linux...21:45
LaserJockmusashi1: regarding your question about edu apps. I think if there were enough people we'd be interested in help upstreams21:45
LaserJockEdubuntu essentially became a good chunk of upstream for LTSP for a while21:46
musashi1so really no attempt to "improve" the included tools21:46
LaserJockI guess the answer is pretty much no21:46
LaserJockwe've essentially got 2 people to do technical work21:47
shane_thanks guys... i'm off...21:47
musashi1it would be really nice if there could be some push to move some of the ed apps forward21:47
musashi1not sure how to do that though21:47
LaserJockyeah, it's not an easy thing21:49
desertcLaserJock: Ever thought of including a library of ebooks with Edubuntu?  Use a couple dozen megabytes to distribute some of the best Public Domain books?21:52
LaserJockwell, we've even thought about Wikipedia21:53
LaserJockthere are issues that come up though21:53
LaserJockdisc space is a big problem21:54
LaserJockyou also have to maintain and support it21:54
desertcHow about just mentioning the resources somewhere?21:54
desertcA lot of people don't realize there are 10000s of freely available ebooks at the Univ of Virginia21:55
musashi1built in links?21:55
desertcSeems like including references to great educational material available on the Internet would be a sensible thing for an educational operating system!21:56
LaserJockwell, I'm trying to work on a menuing system that will all much more "linkability"21:57
LaserJockit's not very easy22:00
LaserJockGnome doesn't support links in the menu :(22:00
musashi1what about a few really good links built into firefox ala portable aps22:01
LaserJockthat's certainly doable I think22:01
desertcmusashi1: That's a sensible idea.22:01
LaserJockthe focus for Edubuntu has been in getting a really guood educational platform22:02
musashi1it's a least a start22:02
LaserJocki.e. server bits, LTSP, etc.22:02
LaserJockonce we have that down I think content will become a bigger focus22:02
musashi1it's a good (great) platform. now we need it to be attractive to teachers. if teachers want the apps they will pressure the districts to get it22:02
musashi1right now it's only seen as a cheap windows lab (note: windows labs are usually just used to type papers and surf the web) we need it to be something that windows doesn't offer...a set of outstanding a free software that teachers see as benefical to instruction22:04

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