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avatar_@schedule amsterdam08:09
ubotuSchedule for Europe/Amsterdam: 23 Oct 17:00: Server Team | 23 Oct 18:00: Kernel Team | 30 Oct 17:00: Kernel Team | 08 Nov 16:00: Community Development Team08:09
juliuxmorning mvo08:58
mvohey juliux!09:16
mvojuliux: I think I hadn't had the chance to congrat you yet for the very nice ubucon event09:17
juliuxmvo, thanks09:17
juliuxmvo, can you send me your slides? we want upload them on the website09:17
mvojuliux: sure09:17
juliuxmvo, thanks09:18
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pferrari@schedule Zurich14:24
ubotuSchedule for Europe/Zurich: 23 Oct 17:00: Server Team | 23 Oct 18:00: Kernel Team | 30 Oct 17:00: Kernel Team | 08 Nov 16:00: Community Development Team14:24
zul@schedule montreal15:23
ubotuSchedule for America/Montreal: 23 Oct 11:00: Server Team | 23 Oct 12:00: Kernel Team | 30 Oct 12:00: Kernel Team | 08 Nov 10:00: Community Development Team15:23
soren@schedule Copenhagen15:30
ubotuSchedule for Europe/Copenhagen: 23 Oct 17:00: Server Team | 23 Oct 18:00: Kernel Team | 30 Oct 17:00: Kernel Team | 08 Nov 16:00: Community Development Team15:30
sorenOh, server team meeting! That sounds very interesting!15:30
abogani@schedule Rome15:30
ubotuSchedule for Europe/Rome: 23 Oct 17:00: Server Team | 23 Oct 18:00: Kernel Team | 30 Oct 17:00: Kernel Team | 08 Nov 16:00: Community Development Team15:30
penguim@schedule Brazil15:36
penguim@schedule Bahia15:40
ubotuSchedule for America/Bahia: 23 Oct 12:00: Server Team | 23 Oct 13:00: Kernel Team | 30 Oct 13:00: Kernel Team | 08 Nov 12:00: Community Development Team15:40
nealmcb@schedule denver15:43
ubotuSchedule for America/Denver: 23 Oct 09:00: Server Team | 23 Oct 10:00: Kernel Team | 30 Oct 10:00: Kernel Team | 08 Nov 08:00: Community Development Team15:43
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nealmcbupcoming agenda: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam/Meeting15:47
=== ubotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Current meeting: Server Team Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 23 Oct 16:00 UTC: Kernel Team | 30 Oct 16:00 UTC: Kernel Team | 08 Nov 15:00 UTC: Community Development Team
mathiazHi everyone !15:57
sorenHey, Mathiaz!15:58
penguimhi all15:58
* jdstrand waves15:58
mathiazok. So let's get this started.16:01
MootBotMeeting started at 16:01. The chair is mathiaz.16:01
MootBotCommands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]16:01
mathiazShort agenda for today: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam/Meeting16:01
mathiaz[TOPIC] Review ACTION points from previous meeting.16:02
MootBotNew Topic:  Review ACTION points from previous meeting.16:02
mathiazLast meeting notes are here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/Server/2007100916:02
sorenThere weren't any?16:03
sorenAction points, that is.16:03
mathiazsoren: there were two small ones for me.16:03
mathiazsoren: I did them IIRC16:03
sorenmathiaz: Oh, you're right.16:04
sorenSomething about e-mail fridge-devel to sort something out?16:04
mathiazsoren: when do you think you'll start the mta debate on debian-devel ?16:04
sorenmathiaz: Tomorrow. I meant to do it today, but I got tied up.16:04
mathiaz[TOPIC] Lessons learned from gutsy about Xen16:06
MootBotNew Topic:  Lessons learned from gutsy about Xen16:06
mathiazzul: ^^16:06
zulon the phone just a sec16:06
mathiazok.. So while waiting, anyone upgrade their server to gutsy ?16:07
zulok im back16:07
zulok basically xen in gutsy was a mess compared to feisty and Im looking for help this time around16:08
mathiazzul: what's the current state of xen in gutsy ?16:08
zulmathiaz: people were having problems loading their domUs and other problems16:08
ScottKmathiaz: I upgraded one of mail mail servers around beta timeframe with no issues.  I plan on doing production servers this weekend.16:09
zuli emailed a list of ideas for hardy to rick and we can go from their at uds16:09
mathiazzul: is this because there wasn't enough testing done during gutsy development phase ?16:09
mathiazzul: ok. Is there a spec registered about this ?16:09
zulmathiaz: true thats part of it16:09
zulmathiaz: not yet i have to talk to rick more probably16:10
zulthere is a session a uds about this16:10
mathiazzul: will you be at uds ?16:10
zulno I have sent my ideas to rick already ill be listening in though16:10
nealmcbzul: what sorts of suggestions do you have?16:11
mathiazzul: ok. If there is a session scheduled, there is probably a blueprint associated with it.16:11
mathiazzul: it may be worth creating the wiki page and add your ideas there.16:11
zulnealmcb: better tools for creating guests, not just me working on it16:11
mathiazzul: explain what was wrong with gutsy and what should be done about it.16:12
mathiazzul: are you the only one doing xen work/developpement in Ubuntu ?16:12
zulmathiaz: basically it was a switch in where were we getting the sources from and the lack of people testing ti16:12
zulmathiaz: yes i am16:12
zulso another set of eyes would be good, if it helps Ill send an email to the ubuntu-server ml16:13
avatar_zul: you'r not in #ubuntu-xen ?16:14
mathiazzul: I think that's a good idea.16:14
zulavatar_: not regularily16:14
zulok so I will send an email when I get home tonight16:15
mathiazavatar_: is there a mailing list for ubuntu-xen ?16:15
zulno there isnt16:15
avatar_mathiaz: afaik just an irc channel16:15
mathiazzul: ok. It seems that there isn't any spec for xen.16:16
mathiazzul: could create a wiki page about XenSupportInHardy ?16:17
zulmathiaz: true, I can do that no problem16:17
nealmcbzul: what sorts of assistance would be most helpful for the xen effort - what skill sets?16:17
zulnealmcb: packaging testing documentation16:17
zulespecially for amd64 and windows guests16:18
mathiazzul: that would help a lot if you'd listed what is needed in the wiki page.16:18
nealmcbthanks for doing so much by yourself - sounds like we should be able to find folks with those skills....16:19
zulI could start an XenTeam wiki page as well16:19
avatar_i would like help testing, but amd64 or windows guests requires me to buy new hardware...16:19
mathiaz[ACTION] zul will create a wiki page XenSupportInHardy to describe what is needed for xen16:19
MootBotACTION received:  zul will create a wiki page XenSupportInHardy to describe what is needed for xen16:19
zulavatar_: ditto :)16:19
mathiazzul: A team may be a good idea in mid-term.16:19
mathiazzul: let's start by figuring out what needs to be done for hardy16:20
zulmathiaz: sure Ill get started on it tonight16:20
zulmathiaz: i have a rough idea in my head I just need to write it down16:21
mathiazzul: once people will be interested in it, we could consider the creation of a team16:21
mathiazzul: excellent !16:21
mathiazzul: meanwhile, I think you can use the ubuntu-server mailing list to discuss it.16:22
nealmcbwhat was the change in xen sources - from where to where?16:22
zulnealmcb: dom0 sources from redhat to novell16:22
mathiaz[TOPIC] Review each section of the ServerTeam/Roadmap16:23
MootBotNew Topic:  Review each section of the ServerTeam/Roadmap16:23
mathiazAs you may know, the hardy archive is now opened.16:24
mathiazWhich means that we're in merge phase.16:24
soren\o/ Merge-o-rama!16:25
mathiazWhile doing this, it would be great to forward deltas to Debian via their BTS16:25
mathiazusing https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Debian/Usertagging16:25
ScottKAs long as they are applicable.16:25
mathiazsommer: how is the server guide review going ?16:27
sommermathiaz: it's coming along... still working through the official docs16:27
sommerI also updated, some of the wiki pages I've contributed to, for Gutsy16:28
sommerat this point basically the ones listed on the Server Team RoadMap page16:28
mathiazI've also noticed you've been working on a macro for the wiki to indicate which release is relevant for wiki pages.16:28
mathiazsommer: Are they tagged in the wiki ?16:28
mathiazsommer: May we could create a link to the list of page relevant to the ServerTeam category.16:29
sommermathiaz: sounds like a good idea... they currently aren't tagged except for CategoryDocumentation16:30
mathiazsommer: the idea being that we can point new contributors to the page when they show interest in server documentation.16:30
sommershould we post to the doc ml for additional help?16:31
mathiazsommer: hum... I don't know.16:31
ScottKsommer: One documentation point you might look into while you are reviewing is that I got the fix for Bug #150067 uploaded late in the Gutsy process, but the resulting config file change isn't documented.  It'd be useful if there was an appropriate place to put that.16:32
ubotuLaunchpad bug 150067 in courier "Courier 0.56 has broken SSL support" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/15006716:32
mathiazScottK: is there a way to tag bugs fixed that need documentation update ?16:32
* ScottK has no idea.16:33
ScottKI'm only thinking about that one because I uploaded the fix and dealt with a bug filed today where the only problem was they didn't know about the setting.16:33
sommerthere is a list of bugs pertaining to the official docs16:34
mathiazScottK: yes. It's a general issue actually.16:34
mathiazthe mysql bug database has such a workflow.16:34
mathiazyou can see when fixes are committed, then documented.16:34
mathiazIt may be interesting to be able to mark bugs that need a documentation review (with an appropriate tag for example).16:35
nealmcbmathiaz: and then remove the tag when it is documented?16:35
mathiaznealmcb: yes.16:36
nealmcbsounds useful - a link to a mysql example would be handy16:36
mathiazAnyone has another example of such a situation ?16:36
sorenI know I have one, but I forget what it is :)16:37
sommerthe evms issue everyone seems to have?16:38
sommeror is that one documented somewhere?  I just recall several questions about it.16:38
mathiazsommer: I think that was put in the release notes.16:38
mathiazsommer: update-manager should take care of it.16:39
mathiazsommer: but not everyone uses update-manager to upgrade to gutsy.16:39
sommerso if a bug requires documentation is the process to update the official docs, or a wiki page?16:40
mathiazsommer: well - it depends where it needs to be fixed.16:40
sommermathiaz: okay16:40
mathiazsommer: if it's in the official documentation, I think that a new bug should be filed against the documentation package16:41
mathiazsommer: otherwise, the wiki page should be updated.16:41
mathiazThis is usually what I do whith the AppArmor package and User guide.16:41
sommercool sounds good to me16:41
mathiazThe problem is that most developper don't know which wiki page on help.u.c needs to be updated.16:41
nealmcbsending an example of the mysql workflow to the doc team might help - they may have similar ideas16:42
mathiazI think this should be raised with the ubuntu-doc team.16:42
mathiazI'll send an email about this.16:42
mathiaz[ACTION] mathiaz will send an email to ubuntu-doc about bugs and documentation update.16:43
MootBotACTION received:  mathiaz will send an email to ubuntu-doc about bugs and documentation update.16:43
mathiazScottK: I'll give your courrier bug as an example.16:43
mathiazIf someone else has another example, let me know.16:43
mathiaznealmcb: what's the state with the factoids ?16:43
ScottKmathiaz: Thanks.16:43
nealmcbmathiaz: sorry - distracte - I need to get back to them!!16:45
mathiaznealmcb: did you send an email to ubuntu-server with your proposal ?16:46
nealmcbnot yet.  I've got some fleshed out on the page, but want to finish that first16:46
mathiaznealmcb: ok.16:47
mathiazAs you may know, the Ubuntu Developer Summit will start next week16:48
mathiazwith a BarCamp this coming Weekend.16:48
soren*cough* FOSSCamp *cough*16:48
mathiazA list of blueprints will be discussing for Hardy can be found at https://blueprints.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-server16:48
mathiazsoren: hum - it was renamed ?16:49
sorenEr.. no?16:49
nealmcbthat's the name - Fosscamp16:49
MootBotLINK received:  http://www.fosscamp.org/16:49
mathiazsoren: hum... ok.16:50
sorenNo biggie.16:50
mathiazSo if you wanna get involve in the discussion, the blueprints and their associated wiki page are the place to look at.16:50
mathiazIs there anything else ?16:51
nealmcbwill the schedule at http://people.ubuntu.com/~scott/uds-boston-2007/2007-10-29/index.html  point to the blueprints?16:52
mathiaznealmcb: it should16:52
Keybuknealmcb: it already does16:52
nealmcbIn the past I remember it being hard to find out about some topics16:52
nealmcbKeybuk: hmmm - the titles don't seem to be links - ahh - some are16:53
Keybukthey're links if they have a little note icon next to them16:53
Keybukif they're not, then the spec doesn't exist in LP yet16:53
nealmcbI'd just encourage folks to get something in both lp and the wiki - it helps a lot with context :-)16:54
KeybukI've been doing just that16:54
mathiazOk. It's time to wrap up.16:55
mathiazNext meeting in two weeks, same time, same place ?16:55
sorenEr.. We might be busy at that point?16:55
sorenAllHands, you know..16:56
nealmcbwell, not everyone knows :-)16:56
sorenSorry, no :) It was for mathiaz :)16:56
sorenLet's shoot for two week, same time, same place.16:57
sorenWe'll work it out.16:57
mathiazAlright - then.16:57
mathiazThanks all and happy merging !16:57
nealmcbbut I met Lamont in person at the Colorado gutsy party, and heard about it...  a canonical meeting...16:57
* nealmcb waves to lamont16:57
sommerthanks all16:57
MootBotMeeting finished at 16:57.16:57
nealmcbmathiaz: thanks!16:58
nealmcbback to class, now, folks....  and thanks to soren for the ubuntu open week session yesterday in  #ubuntu-classroom16:58
=== ubotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Current meeting: Kernel Team Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 30 Oct 16:00 UTC: Kernel Team | 08 Nov 15:00 UTC: Community Development Team
BenCHello everyone17:00
BenCUnfortunately, most of the kernel team is either not present, or working hard on post-gutsy issues, or UDS planning17:01
BenCI'll open the floor for anything from the community17:01
BenCAnd if there is nothing, then I'll end the meeting :)17:02
ogasawaraBenC: just curious if there is any specific area you want my to focus my triaging?17:03
ogasawaraBenC: for now i'm just trying to cut down the number of New and Unassigned bugs for 2.6.20 and 2.6.2217:03
BenCogasawara: Our main problem has been unanswered bugs, which gives people the impression we don't care (and we really do)17:04
aboganiBenC: Are there plan for change security model to "Posix file capabilities" ?17:04
BenCabogani: not that I'm aware of...that's a decision for security/server teams17:05
zulBenC: fyi ive already started forward porting the xen tree again17:05
BenCin general the kernel team doesn't make policy decisions that affect userspace that broadly...we follow what the distro decides as a whole17:05
BenCzul: good luck :)17:05
zulBenC: yeah thanks..17:05
zul2.6.24 right?17:06
BenCas of right now, that's the plan17:07
BenCwont be decided until next week at UDS17:07
zulim assuming 2.6.24 though17:07
BenCas of right now, .23 and (virtual).24 are the same thing :)17:08
zul2.6.23 would be easier for me17:08
BenCogasawara: how are things coming along with the current bug lists?17:09
BenCogasawara: also, now that gutsy is released, it may be best to not spend too much time on 2.6.2017:10
ogasawaraBenC:  so obviously there are lots of "New" bugs that still need to be processed, but for the most part things are moving fairly smoothly17:11
ogasawaraBenC: was curious if this might be a good forum to bring up specific bugs I think you guys should take a look at?17:11
ogasawaraBenC: or should I just hit you guys up on #kernel17:12
BenCogasawara: It would be a good forum, but considering most of us aren't here, I'm on a conf call while doing this little bit, it's just not a good day for it :)17:12
* ogasawara nods :)17:12
BenCogasawara: another good point would be to make good use of "Wont Fix" in released kernels17:12
BenCI think most of the bugs fall into this category right now17:13
ogasawaraBenC: yah, I've already been marking a lot of these17:13
BenCogasawara: did you want me to schedule a kernel-team session with you at UDS?17:15
ogasawaraBenC: yah, was just about to ask you that17:15
BenCor will a OOB meeting at the pub after hours do? :)17:15
ogasawaraBenC:  at the pub would be perfect17:15
ogasawaraBenC: actually, bdmurray and I have been compiling a short list of questions for you that can totally be addressed over a beer or two17:16
BenCexcellent, favorite kind of meetings17:16
BenCAnything else before I cut the meeting?17:17
ogasawaraBenC: nope, I'm good.17:17
zulnone here17:17
BenCOk, thanks everyone17:18
aboganiBenC: Thank you!17:18
=== ubotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 30 Oct 16:00 UTC: Kernel Team | 08 Nov 15:00 UTC: Community Development Team
Keybukmdz, mjg59: No TB tonight?20:07
mjg59I thought we decided to skip it, given UDS?20:11
Keybukdid we20:12
Keybukit's a good decision :p20:12
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