=== cjwatson_ is now known as cjwatson === jsgotangco_ is now known as greeneggsnospam === greeneggsnospam is now known as jeromesg === doko_ is now known as doko [07:55] moin [08:09] @schedule amsterdam [08:09] Schedule for Europe/Amsterdam: 23 Oct 17:00: Server Team | 23 Oct 18:00: Kernel Team | 30 Oct 17:00: Kernel Team | 08 Nov 16:00: Community Development Team [08:58] morning mvo [09:16] hey juliux! [09:17] juliux: I think I hadn't had the chance to congrat you yet for the very nice ubucon event [09:17] mvo, thanks [09:17] mvo, can you send me your slides? we want upload them on the website [09:17] juliux: sure [09:18] mvo, thanks === zul_ is now known as zul === dholbach_ is now known as dholbach === ogra__ is now known as ogra [14:24] @schedule Zurich [14:24] Schedule for Europe/Zurich: 23 Oct 17:00: Server Team | 23 Oct 18:00: Kernel Team | 30 Oct 17:00: Kernel Team | 08 Nov 16:00: Community Development Team [15:23] @schedule montreal [15:23] Schedule for America/Montreal: 23 Oct 11:00: Server Team | 23 Oct 12:00: Kernel Team | 30 Oct 12:00: Kernel Team | 08 Nov 10:00: Community Development Team [15:30] @schedule Copenhagen [15:30] Schedule for Europe/Copenhagen: 23 Oct 17:00: Server Team | 23 Oct 18:00: Kernel Team | 30 Oct 17:00: Kernel Team | 08 Nov 16:00: Community Development Team [15:30] Oh, server team meeting! That sounds very interesting! [15:30] @schedule Rome [15:30] Schedule for Europe/Rome: 23 Oct 17:00: Server Team | 23 Oct 18:00: Kernel Team | 30 Oct 17:00: Kernel Team | 08 Nov 16:00: Community Development Team [15:36] @schedule Brazil [15:40] @schedule Bahia [15:40] Schedule for America/Bahia: 23 Oct 12:00: Server Team | 23 Oct 13:00: Kernel Team | 30 Oct 13:00: Kernel Team | 08 Nov 12:00: Community Development Team [15:43] @schedule denver [15:43] Schedule for America/Denver: 23 Oct 09:00: Server Team | 23 Oct 10:00: Kernel Team | 30 Oct 10:00: Kernel Team | 08 Nov 08:00: Community Development Team === _czessi is now known as Czessi [15:47] upcoming agenda: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam/Meeting === ubotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Current meeting: Server Team Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 23 Oct 16:00 UTC: Kernel Team | 30 Oct 16:00 UTC: Kernel Team | 08 Nov 15:00 UTC: Community Development Team [15:52] hey [15:57] Hi everyone ! [15:58] Hey, Mathiaz! [15:58] hey [15:58] hi all [15:58] Hello [15:58] * jdstrand waves [15:58] hi [16:00] hello [16:01] ok. So let's get this started. [16:01] #startmeeting [16:01] Meeting started at 16:01. The chair is mathiaz. [16:01] Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE] [16:01] Short agenda for today: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam/Meeting [16:02] [TOPIC] Review ACTION points from previous meeting. [16:02] New Topic: Review ACTION points from previous meeting. [16:02] Last meeting notes are here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/Server/20071009 [16:03] There weren't any? [16:03] Action points, that is. [16:03] soren: there were two small ones for me. [16:03] soren: I did them IIRC [16:04] mathiaz: Oh, you're right. [16:04] Something about e-mail fridge-devel to sort something out? [16:04] soren: when do you think you'll start the mta debate on debian-devel ? [16:04] mathiaz: Tomorrow. I meant to do it today, but I got tied up. [16:06] [TOPIC] Lessons learned from gutsy about Xen [16:06] New Topic: Lessons learned from gutsy about Xen [16:06] zul: ^^ [16:06] on the phone just a sec [16:07] ok.. So while waiting, anyone upgrade their server to gutsy ? [16:07] ok im back [16:07] sorry [16:08] ok basically xen in gutsy was a mess compared to feisty and Im looking for help this time around [16:08] zul: what's the current state of xen in gutsy ? [16:08] mathiaz: people were having problems loading their domUs and other problems [16:09] mathiaz: I upgraded one of mail mail servers around beta timeframe with no issues. I plan on doing production servers this weekend. [16:09] i emailed a list of ideas for hardy to rick and we can go from their at uds [16:09] zul: is this because there wasn't enough testing done during gutsy development phase ? [16:09] zul: ok. Is there a spec registered about this ? [16:09] mathiaz: true thats part of it [16:10] mathiaz: not yet i have to talk to rick more probably [16:10] there is a session a uds about this [16:10] zul: will you be at uds ? [16:10] no I have sent my ideas to rick already ill be listening in though [16:11] zul: what sorts of suggestions do you have? [16:11] zul: ok. If there is a session scheduled, there is probably a blueprint associated with it. [16:11] zul: it may be worth creating the wiki page and add your ideas there. [16:11] nealmcb: better tools for creating guests, not just me working on it [16:12] zul: explain what was wrong with gutsy and what should be done about it. [16:12] zul: are you the only one doing xen work/developpement in Ubuntu ? [16:12] mathiaz: basically it was a switch in where were we getting the sources from and the lack of people testing ti [16:12] mathiaz: yes i am [16:13] so another set of eyes would be good, if it helps Ill send an email to the ubuntu-server ml [16:14] zul: you'r not in #ubuntu-xen ? [16:14] zul: I think that's a good idea. [16:14] avatar_: not regularily [16:15] ok so I will send an email when I get home tonight [16:15] avatar_: is there a mailing list for ubuntu-xen ? [16:15] no there isnt [16:15] mathiaz: afaik just an irc channel [16:16] zul: ok. It seems that there isn't any spec for xen. [16:17] zul: could create a wiki page about XenSupportInHardy ? [16:17] mathiaz: true, I can do that no problem [16:17] zul: what sorts of assistance would be most helpful for the xen effort - what skill sets? [16:17] nealmcb: packaging testing documentation [16:18] especially for amd64 and windows guests [16:18] zul: that would help a lot if you'd listed what is needed in the wiki page. [16:19] thanks for doing so much by yourself - sounds like we should be able to find folks with those skills.... [16:19] I could start an XenTeam wiki page as well [16:19] i would like help testing, but amd64 or windows guests requires me to buy new hardware... [16:19] [ACTION] zul will create a wiki page XenSupportInHardy to describe what is needed for xen [16:19] ACTION received: zul will create a wiki page XenSupportInHardy to describe what is needed for xen [16:19] avatar_: ditto :) [16:19] zul: A team may be a good idea in mid-term. [16:20] zul: let's start by figuring out what needs to be done for hardy [16:20] mathiaz: sure Ill get started on it tonight [16:21] mathiaz: i have a rough idea in my head I just need to write it down [16:21] zul: once people will be interested in it, we could consider the creation of a team [16:21] +1 [16:21] zul: excellent ! [16:22] zul: meanwhile, I think you can use the ubuntu-server mailing list to discuss it. [16:22] what was the change in xen sources - from where to where? [16:22] nealmcb: dom0 sources from redhat to novell [16:22] ty [16:23] [TOPIC] Review each section of the ServerTeam/Roadmap [16:23] New Topic: Review each section of the ServerTeam/Roadmap [16:23] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam/Roadmap [16:24] As you may know, the hardy archive is now opened. [16:24] Which means that we're in merge phase. [16:25] \o/ Merge-o-rama! [16:25] While doing this, it would be great to forward deltas to Debian via their BTS [16:25] using https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Debian/Usertagging [16:25] As long as they are applicable. [16:27] sommer: how is the server guide review going ? [16:27] mathiaz: it's coming along... still working through the official docs [16:28] I also updated, some of the wiki pages I've contributed to, for Gutsy [16:28] at this point basically the ones listed on the Server Team RoadMap page [16:28] I've also noticed you've been working on a macro for the wiki to indicate which release is relevant for wiki pages. [16:28] sommer: Are they tagged in the wiki ? [16:29] sommer: May we could create a link to the list of page relevant to the ServerTeam category. [16:30] mathiaz: sounds like a good idea... they currently aren't tagged except for CategoryDocumentation [16:30] sommer: the idea being that we can point new contributors to the page when they show interest in server documentation. [16:31] should we post to the doc ml for additional help? [16:31] sommer: hum... I don't know. [16:32] sommer: One documentation point you might look into while you are reviewing is that I got the fix for Bug #150067 uploaded late in the Gutsy process, but the resulting config file change isn't documented. It'd be useful if there was an appropriate place to put that. [16:32] Launchpad bug 150067 in courier "Courier 0.56 has broken SSL support" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/150067 [16:32] ScottK: is there a way to tag bugs fixed that need documentation update ? [16:33] * ScottK has no idea. [16:33] I'm only thinking about that one because I uploaded the fix and dealt with a bug filed today where the only problem was they didn't know about the setting. [16:34] there is a list of bugs pertaining to the official docs [16:34] ScottK: yes. It's a general issue actually. [16:34] the mysql bug database has such a workflow. [16:34] you can see when fixes are committed, then documented. [16:35] It may be interesting to be able to mark bugs that need a documentation review (with an appropriate tag for example). [16:35] mathiaz: and then remove the tag when it is documented? [16:36] nealmcb: yes. [16:36] sounds useful - a link to a mysql example would be handy [16:36] Anyone has another example of such a situation ? [16:37] I know I have one, but I forget what it is :) [16:38] the evms issue everyone seems to have? [16:38] or is that one documented somewhere? I just recall several questions about it. [16:38] sommer: I think that was put in the release notes. [16:39] ah [16:39] sommer: update-manager should take care of it. [16:39] sommer: but not everyone uses update-manager to upgrade to gutsy. [16:40] so if a bug requires documentation is the process to update the official docs, or a wiki page? [16:40] sommer: well - it depends where it needs to be fixed. [16:40] mathiaz: okay [16:41] sommer: if it's in the official documentation, I think that a new bug should be filed against the documentation package [16:41] sommer: otherwise, the wiki page should be updated. [16:41] This is usually what I do whith the AppArmor package and User guide. [16:41] cool sounds good to me [16:41] The problem is that most developper don't know which wiki page on help.u.c needs to be updated. [16:42] sending an example of the mysql workflow to the doc team might help - they may have similar ideas [16:42] I think this should be raised with the ubuntu-doc team. [16:42] I'll send an email about this. [16:42] cool [16:43] [ACTION] mathiaz will send an email to ubuntu-doc about bugs and documentation update. [16:43] ACTION received: mathiaz will send an email to ubuntu-doc about bugs and documentation update. [16:43] ScottK: I'll give your courrier bug as an example. [16:43] If someone else has another example, let me know. [16:43] nealmcb: what's the state with the factoids ? [16:43] mathiaz: Thanks. [16:45] mathiaz: sorry - distracte - I need to get back to them!! [16:46] nealmcb: did you send an email to ubuntu-server with your proposal ? [16:46] not yet. I've got some fleshed out on the page, but want to finish that first [16:47] nealmcb: ok. [16:48] As you may know, the Ubuntu Developer Summit will start next week [16:48] with a BarCamp this coming Weekend. [16:48] *cough* FOSSCamp *cough* [16:48] A list of blueprints will be discussing for Hardy can be found at https://blueprints.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-server [16:49] soren: hum - it was renamed ? [16:49] Er.. no? [16:49] :) [16:49] that's the name - Fosscamp [16:49] http://www.fosscamp.org/ [16:49] LINK received: http://www.fosscamp.org/ [16:50] soren: hum... ok. [16:50] No biggie. [16:50] :) [16:50] So if you wanna get involve in the discussion, the blueprints and their associated wiki page are the place to look at. [16:51] Is there anything else ? [16:52] will the schedule at http://people.ubuntu.com/~scott/uds-boston-2007/2007-10-29/index.html point to the blueprints? [16:52] nealmcb: it should [16:52] nealmcb: it already does [16:52] In the past I remember it being hard to find out about some topics [16:53] Keybuk: hmmm - the titles don't seem to be links - ahh - some are [16:53] they're links if they have a little note icon next to them [16:53] if they're not, then the spec doesn't exist in LP yet [16:54] I'd just encourage folks to get something in both lp and the wiki - it helps a lot with context :-) [16:54] I've been doing just that [16:54] :-) [16:55] Ok. It's time to wrap up. [16:55] Next meeting in two weeks, same time, same place ? [16:55] Er.. We might be busy at that point? [16:56] AllHands, you know.. [16:56] well, not everyone knows :-) [16:56] Sorry, no :) It was for mathiaz :) [16:57] Let's shoot for two week, same time, same place. [16:57] We'll work it out. [16:57] Alright - then. [16:57] Thanks all and happy merging ! [16:57] but I met Lamont in person at the Colorado gutsy party, and heard about it... a canonical meeting... [16:57] * nealmcb waves to lamont [16:57] thanks all [16:57] #endmeeting [16:57] Meeting finished at 16:57. [16:58] mathiaz: thanks! [16:58] back to class, now, folks.... and thanks to soren for the ubuntu open week session yesterday in #ubuntu-classroom [16:59] :-) [16:59] \o/ [16:59] ;) === ubotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Current meeting: Kernel Team Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 30 Oct 16:00 UTC: Kernel Team | 08 Nov 15:00 UTC: Community Development Team [17:00] Hello everyone [17:01] Unfortunately, most of the kernel team is either not present, or working hard on post-gutsy issues, or UDS planning [17:01] I'll open the floor for anything from the community [17:02] And if there is nothing, then I'll end the meeting :) [17:03] BenC: just curious if there is any specific area you want my to focus my triaging? [17:03] BenC: for now i'm just trying to cut down the number of New and Unassigned bugs for 2.6.20 and 2.6.22 [17:04] ogasawara: Our main problem has been unanswered bugs, which gives people the impression we don't care (and we really do) [17:04] BenC: Are there plan for change security model to "Posix file capabilities" ? [17:05] abogani: not that I'm aware of...that's a decision for security/server teams [17:05] BenC: fyi ive already started forward porting the xen tree again [17:05] in general the kernel team doesn't make policy decisions that affect userspace that broadly...we follow what the distro decides as a whole [17:05] zul: good luck :) [17:05] BenC: yeah thanks.. [17:06] 2.6.24 right? [17:07] as of right now, that's the plan [17:07] wont be decided until next week at UDS [17:07] im assuming 2.6.24 though [17:08] as of right now, .23 and (virtual).24 are the same thing :) [17:08] true [17:08] 2.6.23 would be easier for me [17:09] ogasawara: how are things coming along with the current bug lists? [17:10] ogasawara: also, now that gutsy is released, it may be best to not spend too much time on 2.6.20 [17:11] BenC: so obviously there are lots of "New" bugs that still need to be processed, but for the most part things are moving fairly smoothly [17:11] BenC: was curious if this might be a good forum to bring up specific bugs I think you guys should take a look at? [17:12] BenC: or should I just hit you guys up on #kernel [17:12] ogasawara: It would be a good forum, but considering most of us aren't here, I'm on a conf call while doing this little bit, it's just not a good day for it :) [17:12] * ogasawara nods :) [17:12] ogasawara: another good point would be to make good use of "Wont Fix" in released kernels [17:13] I think most of the bugs fall into this category right now [17:13] BenC: yah, I've already been marking a lot of these [17:15] ogasawara: did you want me to schedule a kernel-team session with you at UDS? [17:15] BenC: yah, was just about to ask you that [17:15] or will a OOB meeting at the pub after hours do? :) [17:15] BenC: at the pub would be perfect [17:16] BenC: actually, bdmurray and I have been compiling a short list of questions for you that can totally be addressed over a beer or two [17:16] excellent, favorite kind of meetings [17:17] Anything else before I cut the meeting? [17:17] BenC: nope, I'm good. [17:17] none here [17:18] Ok, thanks everyone [17:18] BenC: Thank you! === ubotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 30 Oct 16:00 UTC: Kernel Team | 08 Nov 15:00 UTC: Community Development Team [20:07] mdz, mjg59: No TB tonight? [20:11] I thought we decided to skip it, given UDS? [20:12] did we [20:12] it's a good decision :p === asac_ is now known as asac === The_Kernel is now known as The-Kernel