=== apachelogger_ is now known as apachelogger [01:11] bug 150913 [01:11] Launchpad bug 150913 in ubuntu "screen and graphics crashed after pressing test button (dup-of: 137194)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/150913 [01:11] Launchpad bug 137194 in displayconfig-gtk "displayconfig-gtk crashes on Test" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/137194 [02:07] * Jucato yawns and stretches.... [02:21] Jucato: YAY! [02:21] yay? [02:21] it's alive! [02:22] I overslept again.. hahaha [02:22] Jucato: good morning hi and yay! [02:22] but I woke up LOL'ing [02:22] Jucato: last image you saw was my face? [02:22] no no, that whould have made you cry [02:23] that would have killed me on the spot [02:23] true, possibly so [02:25] nixternal: so how was the Kubuntu session? [02:25] * Jucato imagines the first one was more exciting [02:25] I can't remember [02:25] :) [02:26] they were both good...I like the involvement today of the entire team though [02:26] *^_^* [02:26] that's me... blushing... supposedly [02:27] hehe [02:27] bwahahah!! I love seele's post! :) [02:28] oops... I just highlighted her :( [02:31] nixternal: is it 8:30 p.m. for you? [02:31] you got it [02:31] kool. still early :) [02:31] yet oh so tired [02:32] aw... poor overworked nixternal [02:32] !helpersnack | nixternal [02:32] nixternal: Wow! You're such a great helper, you deserve a cookie! [02:32] haha [02:32] * Jucato wonders if he should make a !devsnack factoid [02:33] I have found a flaw in the "Popularity" of an application in Ubuntu now...when you open up the 'Add/Remove Applications' in Gnome, each package has a rating, and everything that is installed by default has 5 stars..is that because each update counts as a download I wonder? [02:33] Jucato: and cause ubotu abused by us? [02:34] same goes with Kubuntu/Adept I would guess [02:34] nixternal: time to make huge number of fixes to Kopete ;--P [02:35] * Jucato wonders about it all... [02:36] I want to check out Anjuta and Mono development environments..I have heard a lot of good stuff about it [02:37] soon we'll be hearing "I want to check out GNOME. I've heard a lot of good stuff about it".. and then he's gone :) [02:37] haha, nevah [02:38] I don't like that I can tweak it the way I want...I mean how hard can it be to make the bars transparent? [02:38] I have select transparency in the settings, but that doesn't work [02:39] nixternal: try change tab bar from top to bottom in GNOME [02:39] anywhere there [02:41] that's what I did [02:41] nixternal: found any way? [02:41] no..I selected transparency, and even tried to change the color..it didn't take effect though [02:41] yah [02:42] anjuta seems to be a slimlined kate, just that it has built in compile/debug options [02:42] which you can do with Kate and a couple of macros or whatever they are called [02:43] * Jucato wished Kate actually had macros... like vim recording [02:43] I like e-macs :) [02:43] oh hai [02:44] kthxbai [02:44] :P [02:44] I can has KDE? [02:44] no weiz [02:44] emacs? was that the OS without a kernel? [02:44] the great OS w/o a good text editor :) [02:44] anyway... [02:45] ah that one [02:47] http://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/ [02:47] we know :) [02:47] OK, KDE vs. Gnome for development tools (Anjuta IDE, MonoDevelop, Bluefish, and Scream) [02:48] KDE 1 [02:48] Gnome 0 [02:48] KDE <3 [02:48] as a matter of fact, Kate does everything each one of those apps do [02:48] was there even a contest? :) [02:48] I wanted to see [02:48] except a Class Browser... [02:48] KDevelop is just way to strong of an IDE...it is getting close to Eclipse in that way [02:49] Quanta+ > Bluefish/Scream [02:49] I am actually disappointed..I had quite a few people tell me how good anjuta was...and it doesn't even do code completion from what I just saw [02:49] and when you compile c++, it works great, actually to great...but go to execute it, and it tells you the file isn't local...derrr [02:50] I have one big disappointment w/ KDevelop... you practically can't use it to compile a simple C++ program... without having to make a project.. or without having to use the embedded Konsole [02:51] ya, that is why I use Eclipse whenever I am doing STL work [02:51] * Jucato just uses Kate for now... no too much Classes [02:52] but Gnome does have an app I absolutely love [02:52] Tomboy [02:52] oh yeah, basket needs some features like that [02:53] and deskbar! (imho) [02:53] forget Basket, KNotes [02:53] what is deskbar? [02:53] I need to play man [02:53] hehe [02:53] play man? [02:53] deskbar is like Katapult on the panel. launcher and search engine [02:54] w/o the indexing overhead of beagle (I think) [02:54] I take it that it is not in the repos? [02:54] it's built-in to GNOME [02:54] oh [02:54] oh and drawers on the gnome panels! [02:54] oh, I see deskbar [02:54] I thought that was something for tracker [02:55] hm.. maybe I was wrong.. but tracker doesn't seem to be a depends [02:55] aaaanyway... at least it works :) [02:56] deskbar is nice [02:57] uh oh... I'm guilty of converting nixternal to GNOME! [02:58] hehe [02:58] I think KRunner in KDE 4 is better though [02:58] and I think Katapult is better for launching apps [02:58] +1 katapult [02:58] I know a ton of people who use Katapult on Gnome actually and they love it [02:58] +0.5 krunner [02:59] well I haven't used krunner for 2 weeks so I can't really say... but last time I had performance, aesthetics, and usability issues with it [02:59] I have been using KDE for about and I didn't figure out what Katapult was until about 2 weeks ago :P [03:00] for about what? :) [03:00] *about a year [03:00] hehe :) [03:00] got ahead of myself [03:00] it's ok... using KDE is a lot like treasure hunting [03:01] I "opened" it along time ago, but never thought to just start typing something [03:01] it looked to much like a splash image [03:02] it's not entirely intuitive unless you know Quicksilver [03:02] I just kept waiting for it to start [03:02] Gnome does have Epiphany, which I like 2nd only to Konqueror [03:02] hm.. it has a weird way of dealing w/ bookmarks though... [03:03] Epiphany I mean [03:04] so while I was sitting here I had an idea, and though I really havn't done anything for Kubuntu except write bug reports, I thought it was a decent idea [03:04] ooh, I forgot about Galeon as well [03:05] I thought it could be neat to set a day every 1/2 weeks where people would focus on using a single KDE app in an attempt to find bugs and such [03:06] thats 1 to 2 weeks [03:06] not half weeks [03:06] begert: that is what we would call a bug day kind of, or a hug day rather [03:06] but we definitely need to do it here on the Kubuntu side [03:07] the Ubuntu people get a lot of people to show up for Hug Days, whereas only a few of us here show up for them [03:07] but also (I know little) aren't those days more focused on known existing bugs? [03:07] in a way yes, but that doesn't mean we can't edit the definition right :) [03:07] I think it is a good day [03:08] and idea [03:08] I am thinking more on the testing side of trying all you can to break 1 specific app for that day [03:08] that is what I meant to say..I think that is a good idea :) [03:08] very true [03:08] :) [03:10] I can at least contribute ideas for now [03:10] I'm going to be traiging all Adept and System Settings bugs next week... and forwarding them to manchicken :P [03:11] * Jucato sees himself in begert almost 2 years ago... minus the ability to use emacs... [03:11] hehe [03:11] well I never said I was "good" at using emacs [03:11] 2 years ago... I didn't even know how to use both emacs and vim [03:12] I use vim... not good at it though [03:12] I dont know how to use those [03:12] nor care to know [03:12] I just know enough to do :%s/nixternal/vista/ [03:12] I tried vim, i didn't like it [03:12] Jucato: Righto. You do that :) [03:12] haven't tried emacs... I tried vim first at the behest of a friend [03:12] but i know people that love it [03:13] either way, both are great [03:13] manchicken: should I just assign them to you are should I just poke you with a list? [03:13] Jucato: Could you poke me with a list (preferably via email)? [03:14] I'm going to be picking up the Kubuntu slack a bit when I start this indy job. [03:14] manchicken: sure :) [03:14] I will probably give my comments too :P [03:14] Any info you could give--including cause suspicions--would be nice. [03:15] (and then we all decide to move to packagekit bwahahah!) [03:15] I'll try if I can even fix the lowest hanging fruits... you know, the ones low enough for worms to eat? :D [03:19] * Jucato decides to take a risk... [03:19] hm... nvm [03:23] heh [03:24] If there's low-hanging fruit, I probably already ate it. [03:24] I think the resolution of the database lock is probably the most complicated bug fix I've done. [03:26] heh, I think I might like Compiz a little bit [03:28] I like it alright, I just don't like its limitations. [03:29] I am having to much fun with it [03:29] I think I shall install it on my laptop [03:29] It's fun for about a week. [03:29] show them Mac people what it is all about [03:29] manchicken: I got enough of it in 2 minutes =) [03:29] If we can't get some of these issues fixed, I may move to GNOME for a little while. [03:29] As much as it pains me to say that. [03:29] This artsd/kmilo/kmix thing is killing me. [03:30] And not being able to use my headphone jack is just too much. [03:30] It's bad enough that I can't suspend/resume. [03:30] arts... I think I have heard that few years ago... ;) [03:30] * Tm_T doesnt use it =) [03:30] When you don't have a hardware mixer, you need something. [03:31] true [03:31] I love KDE, but right now this is just killing me. [03:31] Ooh, I should try KDE4 now. [03:31] yes! [03:31] how you even could think of GNOME before trying KDE4 ?! [03:32] Because I know GNOME works :) [03:32] And because System76 will give me full support for GNOME. [03:32] :( [03:32] heh [03:32] * Tm_T get panic attacks from gnome [03:32] manchicken: iirc someone was having problems with that database lock resolution thingy.... [03:32] Not saying I don't want to make KDE better though. [03:32] Jucato: Yeah, but I haven't been able to replicate any of those issues. [03:32] it crashes Adept again iirc [03:33] Jucato: And if I can't replicate them, or get a super-sweet dump file, I can't really troubleshoot it. [03:33] It's all nixternal's fault. [03:33] manchicken: heh the worst kind of bugs... [03:35] Trying KDE4 [03:42] of course it'd be nixternal's fault. [03:42] well well well, if it isn't old crimsun! [03:42] that's geezer crimsun to you, kiddo! [03:42] crimsun!!!! [03:52] good night people, talk to you later [03:53] k'night begert! [04:08] Does KDE4 have a working panel yet? [04:08] I wasn't able to get that working at all. [04:09] Just plasma and a handful of plasmoids. [04:10] semi-working [04:51] seele: ha ha :) nice backend [05:38] * Jucato burps [05:41] * Daskreech wakes up .45 miles away [05:41] What just happened? [05:43] me just happened [07:13] nixternal: http://www.tm-travolta.net/shots/current.png [07:16] Wouldn't manchicken be more interested? [07:16] he maybe too [07:16] Daskreech: but why he more? [07:16] manchicken is a RMS fiend :) [07:16] he'd love it [07:17] well I know nixternal keep fuzzing about gpl, well, atleast kept =) [07:19] btw http://www.tm-travolta.net/pics/art/gpl3-grey-02.png [09:04] <_StefanS_> morning [09:47] nixternal: poke [10:00] _StefanS_!!! Hobbsee!!! [10:00] <_StefanS_> heeeeyy [10:00] * Jucato falls asleep again... [10:00] nixternal: ha ha, I CC'ed you teh reply to my e-mail [10:01] * Jucato waves to Riddell too [10:02] hiya Jucato! [10:04] hi Jucato [10:05] * Riddell in heathrow vip lounge [10:05] lots of whisky here [10:05] ooooh [10:05] hahah [10:05] haha [10:05] but no irn bru? :) [10:05] * Hobbsee is jealous. [10:06] of the whiskey or being in heathrow? [10:06] (just one wrong typo, and it's deathrow :P) [10:06] going to UDS [10:06] ah... yeah.. who isn't? :) [10:07] ayt... brb :) [10:08] :) [10:16] are our (try pronouncing that!) KDE4 packages built with fulldebug? [10:17] <_StefanS_> Jucato: yep I think they are [10:17] ah ok :) [10:47] Riddell, ping === Mez is now known as Mez|Away === Mez|Away is now known as Mez === Mez is now known as Mez|Away === jpetso is now known as jpetso_away === Mez|Away is now known as Mez === Mez is now known as Mez|Away === Mez|Away is now known as Mez === Mez is now known as Mez|Away [12:56] hey === Mez|Away is now known as Mez === Mez is now known as Mez|Away === Mez|Away is now known as Mez [13:10] seele: ping === Lure_ is now known as Lure [13:11] * Jucato waves at Lure [13:11] hi Jucato [13:12] Jucato: how is support of gutsy in #kubuntu going on? good or bad? [13:12] hm.... how can I say? both good and bad :) [13:12] Jucato: what is bad? kopete crash? dolphin? [13:13] yes, plus some reports of debconf crashing during the upgrade === Mez is now known as Mez|Away [13:13] Jucato: yep, upgrades are always tricky... never tested enough imho... [13:13] I'm going to keep an eternal gutsy vm just to test all upgrade to hardy for each milestone... [13:14] there's also the small problem of people looking for features that Ubuntu has that Kubuntu doesn't :) === Mez|Away is now known as Mez === Mez is now known as Mez|Away === Mez|Away is now known as Mez === jpetso_away is now known as jpetso === mzungu_ is now known as mzungu [13:45] hi Jucato, Lure :) [13:45] hi Tonio_! :) [13:46] Jucato: didn't find out how to trust a protocol in konqueror.:/ [13:46] hi Tonio_, I see you are already hitting hardy-changes! [13:46] oh... [13:46] * Lure still needs to upgrade to hardy [13:47] Lure: well kio-apt shouldn't have been there.....;; I just override that one, it should have gone to my ppa :) [13:47] Lure: fancy testing kio-aot ? [13:47] Tonio_: ;-) [13:47] apt [13:47] Tonio_: maybe during weekend, busy now... [13:47] oki [13:48] Lure: no idea how to make konqueror consider a protocol is secured ? [13:48] just came from US and now on business meetings for the second day [13:48] Lure: I can't find out how to make it to consider apt:/ is a trusted protocol [13:48] Tonio_: like https? [13:48] Tonio_: what would be the difference [13:49] Lure: konqueror doesn't like unknown protocols while clicking on links [13:49] no problom when typing in the address bar [13:49] Tonio_: oh, that... [13:49] Lure: yep ;) [13:49] Tonio_: no idea. [13:49] Lure: I guess we'll have to patch konqueror for this [13:49] looks like ardcoded feature [13:49] * Lure is not using Konqueror for browsing and do not know the code at all [13:50] probably something in kio-http btw [13:50] or khtml [13:50] * Lure downloads new Opera beta... ;-) [13:50] yo [13:51] yop jpatrick [13:51] Jucato: the installation reporting succes/failure now works in kio-apt [13:52] woot! :) [13:52] hm. is kio-apt making use of gdebi-kde btw? [13:53] Jucato: no it just uses adept-batch [13:53] oh [13:53] * Jucato wonders why we couldn't have developed adept-batch in the first place... [13:54] I mean for .debs... [13:54] bah nvm.. apt... heheh [13:54] Jucato: adept-batch is for apt-get installation [13:54] gdebi is for dpkg (aka local) installation [13:54] that's just completly different [13:54] yeah. I sort of... :) [13:54] manchicken: ping ? [13:54] manchicken: I just discovered that adept-batch just segfaults when using a bad package name [13:55] manchicken: sudo adept-batch install blablatoto [13:55] that's bad :/ [13:57] Jucato: do you use a i*86? [13:58] yes. but my kubuntu install is currently hosed :) [13:58] damn [13:58] * Jucato might need to download an ISO instead of waiting for shitit [13:58] er shipit [13:59] hosed so much that you can't test: http://ihosted.info/~jpatrick/kde-style-domino_0.4-0ubuntu1_i1386.deb ? [13:59] * Jucato nods [13:59] * Hobbsee wonders how you broke it. [14:00] tried to do a fresh install since any kernel higher than 2.6.22-12 (can't recall) freezes [14:00] lucky as I am... my only feisty cd isn't working as well :) [14:01] Tonio_: Wuddup homes? [14:02] Tonio_: You got a bug for that just so that I don't forget about it? I'll see if I can take a peeky-peek at it right now. [14:02] jpatrick: ahoy!.... http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=423 http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=424 [14:02] * Hobbsee notes that she's officially been using ubuntu for a week now. [14:03] well, 8 day.s [14:03] Tonio_: I can replicate it. [14:03] Hobbsee: How you like it? [14:03] apachelogger: warum bist du niemal hier wann ich dich sehen will!? [14:03] manchicken: there's some really nice polished stuff in there [14:03] but konversation is a must, is as amarok [14:03] I think it's pretty good. I just don't think I could pull myself away from the well integrated, but not always as simple, KDE. [14:03] manchicken: the lack of functionality in some places is annoying - like the lack of kioslaves. [14:03] jpatrick: private problems which currently need a lot of time [14:03] ah, right [14:04] Hobbsee: I don't like how limited metacity is compared to kwin. [14:04] jpatrick: btw, I'd split domino, since it's a theme a style and a window deco [14:04] manchicken: well, it's with compiz too, so... [14:04] manchicken: it's more stuff like nautilus [14:04] Hobbsee: Or xchat vs. konvi, konsole vs. terminal, etc. [14:04] yeah, true [14:04] Hobbsee: D3lphin smokes nautilus [14:04] i've found terminal to be fine, actually [14:04] * Hobbsee isnt much of a fan of d3lphin [14:04] * Jucato has to agree w/ the d3lphin comment unfortunately... [14:04] And kontact beats the hell out of evolution imho. [14:04] apachelogger: hmm, might do, for tastymenu rm the debian dir in source and retar it [14:04] oh, indeed. thunderbird sucks less than either of them, though [14:05] note in changelog and send a message upstream :) [14:05] manchicken: gnome-term has one feature that will only arrive in Konsole in KDE 4 though [14:05] I'm not a thunderbird fan. [14:05] clickable links [14:05] * apachelogger goes retaring [14:05] Jucato: I'm not a big fan of clickable links in my terminal sessions :) [14:05] ehehe [14:05] manchicken: strange........ [14:05] ah yes, i like the clicking [14:05] can someone try to reproduce ? [14:05] i want to see kde4, though [14:05] Lure: pong [14:05] Tonio_: I can reproduce the problem. [14:05] Hobbsee: kde4's konsole is awesome [14:06] seele: nice blog post btw ;) [14:06] Tonio_: I just can't get a good dump file. [14:06] Jucato: haha thanks [14:06] manchicken: okay but does this crash for you too ? [14:06] Tonio_: Could you put a bug in for that if there isn't one already? I'm going to hopefully get back into the kubuntu hacking here soon. [14:06] Tonio_: Yes. [14:07] manchicken: oki :) [14:07] Tonio_: Without any good debugging other than a STL exception message. [14:07] apachelogger: you should also put (LP: #xxx) after IR in changelog to close the LP bug [14:08] seele: I have a German customer that would need usability consultant, so I am thinking some kde-usability person can do the job [14:08] seele: anyone from germany that is doing this kind of consultancy work? [14:09] manchicken: okay, I'll just report the bug on launchpad atm [14:09] Much thanks. [14:09] I think it's probably just iterating through all packages it knows of without paying attention to whether or not its at the end of its list. [14:10] If I'm right then that'd be a simple issue to fix. [14:10] Lure: Ellen Reitmayr (ellen@reitmayr.net) does consulting and Jan Muehlig (jan.muehlig@relevantive.de) has a consultancy called Relevantive [14:10] manchicken: it's frustrating having to look up how to do things, which usually Just Work [14:10] seele: thanks, will contact them [14:10] Lure: both have been involved in KDE usability and are a part of OpenUsability [14:10] Lure: np [14:10] Hobbsee: Yes. That it is. [14:11] Hobbsee: It's pretty well polished though, but it's just not what I like to use. [14:11] Tonio_: bug report exists [14:11] https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/adept/+bug/153710 [14:11] Launchpad bug 153710 in adept "adept_batch crashes if target package does not exist" [Undecided,New] [14:11] manchicken: true [14:11] Even though KDE 3.5.8 is sucking for me right now. [14:11] Tonio_, manchicken: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/adept/+bug/153710 [14:11] rawr [14:11] * Jucato runs from WaltzingAlong [14:11] life's so unfair.. [14:11] seele: our larger customes have own usability expert, but in this case they do not have one and we do not like to do major UI redesigns with one [14:11] heh [14:11] ;0 [14:12] s/with/witnout/ [14:12] I'll confirm and prioritize and assign that bug. [14:12] (that's one less Adept bug to triage!!! :P) [14:13] jpatrick: uploads in progress, thanks for revuing :) [14:13] That bug is updated. [14:13] no prob [14:13] Jucato: Oh, you could still triage it ;) [14:13] good thing they are called bugs and not spiders. would not be cool to squish one spider only to see hundreds emerge from it [14:13] manchicken: do the honors haha :) [14:14] * manchicken doesn't know the official process for triaging bugs. [14:14] * Jucato wonders what's the diff between https://bugs.launchpad.net/ and https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/ [14:14] I'll confirm and prioritize and assign that bug. <--- um.. that? :) [14:14] Righto then [14:15] Tonio_: If you get any output from your crash or any dump output that you could paste into that bug, that would be very helpful. [14:15] oh and https://launchpad.net/bugs/ too! :) [14:15] 3 URL's that go to the same page heheh :) [14:16] you haven't mentioned edge.* yet [14:16] manchicken: I don't get anything too..... [14:16] oh yeah... [14:16] manchicken: will try with gdb [14:16] Tonio_: Okie dokie. [14:16] Tonio_: Ooh, that'd be very kind of you. [14:18] ;) [14:18] of course... it's Tonio_ :) [14:20] Time to continue my time where I can't do any work of my own, but I can play Nintendo. [14:20] This sucks. I can't wait until Wednesday. [14:23] apachelogger: new pkgs approved, now find someone else to review and I'll upload [14:24] Anyone in revu mood? :) [14:27] Jucato: just found how to trust the apt protocol :) [14:27] Jucato: fancy testing ? [14:27] Tonio_: not today :( [14:27] oki [14:27] I can do tomorrow (downloading Gutsy ISO) [14:27] 6 hours... [14:28] so that you can test it, copy this in your /usr/share/kubuntu-default-settings/kde-profile/defualt/kdeglobals file [14:28] http://paste.tonio.homelinux.org/1804 [14:28] just copy this, reload kde and it might work [14:28] Tonio_: cool got a new deb?;-) [14:28] nosrednaekim: yep ;) [14:28] nosrednaekim: no supports checking if installation was successfull or not [14:29] nosrednaekim: mostly done for apt:/ now starting apt+http:/ [14:29] * nosrednaekim is supposeing that was a "now" [14:29] nosrednaekim: you might get the deb on my ppa soon [14:29] k [14:29] ah, well got dc enabled ? [14:29] dcc [14:30]