[00:00] nenolod: I have more interest in defending gentoo than cmake, and I'm not convinced that the very concept of a source-based distribution isn't flawed. [00:00] nenolod: Multi-platform, perhaps. [00:01] minghua: autotools works for every platform I've every used since 1995. Where does it break? [00:02] persia: I don't really know. But I heard the strong point of CMake is its portability. [00:02] persia: Can you use autotools on Windows without cygwin/mingw? [00:03] pfft. windows. who cares about that. [00:03] minghua: http://gnuwin32.sourceforge.net/install.html [00:03] minghua: Admittedly, for many cases, one needs to install the POSIX compatibility libraries, but that just seems like the right thing anyway... [00:05] CMake says on its own website: "Generates native build files (e.g., makefiles on Unix; workspaces/projects on MS Visual C++)" [00:05] http://www.cmake.org/HTML/Features.html [00:05] minghua, who cares about VisualC++. it's not even compliant to any standard [00:05] it should be considered a miracle if that thing compiles any non MFC/Win32API code [00:05] minghua: autotools only generates Makefiles, but all the common IDEs (including VC++) can use them. [00:06] nenolod: A lot of people care. You can choose your tool, other people can choose theirs. [00:06] minghua, yeah, but most people who care probably wouldn't use CMake [00:06] nenolod: I'll have to agree with minghua about choice. [00:06] persia: I've no idea how to do that -.- [00:06] persia: I have version of OpenLibraries, adapted from debian-multimedia, for review. I think the biggest issue with the package is that currently it is hardcoded to a python version as it depends on libboost-python (which is only compiled against the current version of python). Is there a better solution? [00:06] nenolod: I am not a developer, don't argue with me. [00:06] persia, well i agree that VC++ is a valid choice, but, i'm not sure that using CMake to generate VisualC++ solution files [00:07] ;p [00:07] err insert an 'a' two words in [00:07] rexbron: Has anyone else looked at it since we last spoke? [00:07] +is [00:07] persia: is was not building when we talked about ir [00:07] *it [00:07] I was wondering if anyone here was thinking about packaging Desktop Data Manager: http://data-manager.sourceforge.net/ [00:08] It's like Glipper but awesomer [00:08] CMake would be a lot more useful if it didn't require its users to duplicate IF checks in the ENDIF statement. [00:08] Actually, I think they've got working .debs, but it's not in any repositories. [00:08] ((and if it could do string-based operations as well as Perl.)) [00:09] persia, so, debian/rules for a CMake project is not necessarily the same as any other specific CMake project's debianisation? [00:09] man, that sucks :D [00:09] rexbron: OK. I don't like to be a sole contact about things, and encourage you to ask questions without addressing a specific person unless you believe only they can help. My python and python packaging is rather weak compared to others here, but I suspect that you'll be fine if you comply with the NEW Python Policy: it should set things up for all compatible & available python interpreters at compile time, and check again at runtime. [00:09] Err. s/runtime/install time/ (I think) [00:10] persia: who would you suggest? I would be happy to take it up with them [00:11] nenolod: close, but not guaranteed, because cmake doesn't have very stringent requirements for rule nomenclature or usage (instead of `./configure; make` one calls `cmake foo; cmake bar` where foo and bar depend on the cmake configuration) [00:11] if it's a setuptools-based python package, you can probably just use CDBS to build it [00:12] rexbron: I'd suggest describing the problem generally, and asking for someone knowledgeable about python packaging to help. That way, whoever is capable and active can respond, and you'll have the shortest wait. [00:12] ok [00:12] persia, i must wonder why they would design it that way. it seems like a giant step backwards (like, all the way back to the 1980s) [00:12] * persia continues to fail to defend cmake [00:13] persia: I think currently I'll just let it use the pbuilder script again, and let the current method there as a fallback for the case it isn't installed (with a warning that it recommends to install pbuilder, which is anyways a recommend of ubuntu-dev-tools). what do you think? [00:14] RainCT: You'll want to parse $missing_dependencies to extract the version strings where they exist. Then check the apt status cache (grep-dctrl is one tool for this) to make sure that there is a sufficient version. You could also trap the required versions, call apt with --simulate, parse the output, and match. [00:15] RainCT: I still think the dpkg-foo and apt-foo tools are much more mature than pbuilder, and that pbuilder-satisfydepends is an incomplete attempt to reinvent the wheel, but I'm opinionated about that, and my opinion doesn't represent policy. [00:19] Ugh. There is something seriously wrong along the X.org+GSteamer stack on my box. [00:19] RainCT: Another option is to leave it as-is: there are bugs, but it works for the majority of cases. If you do that, please file the bugs if it gets distributed that way. [00:19] I get hard lock every time I have some "visualization music" effect. [00:20] persia, something makes me think cmake is going to be more and more hated by packagers as it's usage becomes more and more widespread :P [00:21] * persia provides nenolod with an explicit hint about highlighting and cmake [00:23] :D === minghu1 is now known as minghua [00:24] minghua, well, something of interest, some guy is working on porting projectM to gstreamer [00:25] so soon the nightmares will get much worse ;) [00:25] projectM ♥ [00:26] i don't love them atm. they switched to CMake on me. :( [00:26] nenolod: Actually I don't need visualization... It's just enabled by default, and if I don't disable it, I get a hard lock, which is really annoying. [00:26] is there a listing of packages and their corrosponding config files etc that are added from a base linux install? [00:26] basically im trying to see if i can turn gentoo into ubuntu almost [00:27] sahil: What do you mean by "a base linux install"? [00:27] probably debootstrap [00:27] minghua:basically a fresh gentoo install [00:27] debootstrap then. [00:27] sahil: Better ask in a gentoo channel, I would assume. [00:27] sahil: http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/indices/ contains all the lists of packages. Each source package has a diff.gz with all the patches. [00:28] nenolod: do i actually have to do the debootstrap or can i just see what it does? [00:28] thanks [00:28] sahil, debootstrap installs the base system. [00:28] hi [00:28] i must say ive been a gentoo user for years and i just installed gusty on a test machine and am blown away [00:28] sahil: if you want a base install of ubuntu with nothing else (no X, no GNOME, etc), you use debootstrap. [00:28] its really something special [00:29] sahil: You might also be interested in the ubuntu-desktop meta-package, which contains the default list of software for a desktop system. [00:29] nenolod:from that point what is done to get it to the ubuntu-desktop [00:29] heh there we go [00:29] nenolod: One could also use the alternate install CD... [00:29] persia, that is true [00:29] i hadn't thought of that [00:29] how log for a package dputed to show on revu ? [00:29] proppy, the cron runs every 10 minutes [00:30] proppy: If there's no issues, it updates every 10 minutes. If it's been longer, please ask for help including the package name. [00:30] persia: Rev 25. get-build-deps: switch back to pbuilder-satisfydepends, use dpkg-checkbuilddeps as fallback [00:30] proppy, make sure you are in the revu keyring though. if you are not, the upload will be ignored. [00:30] persia: nenolod: ok thanks [00:30] you can make sure that you are, by joining the motu contrib group [00:31] nenolod: I did it last year [00:31] nenolod: so it should be still active :) [00:31] http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=447 uploaded :) [00:31] well then 10 minutes ;p [00:32] proppy, that's a lot of lintian warnings [00:32] persia: (I'll open a wishlist bug about improving the dpkg-* using thing once it got merged) [00:32] RainCT: OK. At this point, I don't really have anything further to contribute to the script, and don't generally involve myself enough in ubuntu-dev-tools to be familiar with how the package is managed. Please consider my objections to have been addressed: the script now works without pbuilder (although it works better with pbuilder). [00:32] proppy, did you do svn checkout or svn export? [00:32] proppy, if you did svn checkout, you should go back and do svn export instead. [00:32] nenolod: yep I know I just uploaded it in current state [00:32] nenolod: before fixing anything, I'm not the original maintainer [00:32] ah ok [00:33] nenolod: ok let's ok [00:33] nenolod: ok let's go [00:34] persia: nice :) [00:34] good night all [00:35] nenolod: let's fix that svn thing, that an easy one [00:35] nenolod: thanks for the hint [00:36] in debian/rules, right after "# Add here commands to clean up after the build process.", you have -$(MAKE) distclean [00:36] you should make sure you have a makefile there and not suppress errors like it does now [00:36] (the - makes it suppress errors) [00:37] * persia notes that `[ -f Makefile ] $(MAKE) distclean` is not always the correct check: there may be another reason why distclean fails that should be trapped. [00:38] indeed [00:38] * jdong kicks buildds [00:38] i think the lintian warning advnce is not necessarily a good set of advice for that case [00:38] s/advnce/advice [00:39] Hahah. [00:39] `This should be visually attractive, and could be an ideal place for easter eggs. [00:39] In the hardy-about-ubuntu spec. [00:39] Fujitsu, as long as it's not another "fire up the crackpipes!" easter egg [00:40] * persia thinks easter-eggs take up valuable CD space that could be better used for translations, othernice apps in main, etc. [00:40] (the "description" of edgy) [00:40] i saw that the other day and was like o_O [00:40] persia: just think about how many translated phrases we could be saving with aptitude -[v]+ moo! [00:41] oups I forgot to add revu host when I called dput [00:41] It uploads on upload.ubuntu.com [00:41] I hope it will get ignored [00:41] jdong: aptitude doesn't have Super Cow Powers. apt does. [00:41] persia: sure... of course it doesn't ;-) [00:41] i still use apt-get [00:41] go figure [00:41] ;p [00:42] nenolod: You're missing out on updated dependency checking and the all-powerful "download" command, which grabs the distributed binary package for inspection. [00:42] proppy: You'll get a rejection message. [00:43] persia, sounds fancy [00:43] persia: meh unless you're running hardy I doubt you'll need aptitude's dependency power [00:43] proppy@nekun:~/Desktop/20071027/mumble$ dput revu mumble_1.1.1ubuntu1_source.changes [00:43] Already uploaded to revu.tauware.de [00:43] Doing nothing for mumble_1.1.1ubuntu1_source.changes [00:43] how could I overwrite it ? [00:43] Hi I am looking for MOTU's to review my Package (easycrypt) on REVU : I currently have 0 Advocation's: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=437 [00:43] i have indeed heard that it's dependency checking is great [00:43] bump revision ? [00:44] proppy, correct [00:44] nenolod: should I add ubuntu1~revu1 ? [00:44] proppy: No, use -f on the dput commandline. [00:44] like ppa ? [00:44] StevenHarperUK_: Please only advertise your package for review once each day. [00:44] Fujitsu: ok [00:44] proppy, that'll work [00:44] jdong: It's good for sid as well :) [00:44] or yeah, manual forcing works too [00:45] persia: agreed; but for the average user I can't think of any reasons to recommend one over the other [00:46] i just have apt-get hammered into my brain [00:46] :P [00:46] jdong: `aptitude download` is very handy for users that experience a regression with a backport or update, especially because it can take an optional version argument. Alternately, `apt-get build-dep` is very handy for developers (including upstream). Depends on the use case. [00:47] * nixternal loves apt-get build-dep [00:48] just installed a new build system so I can do KDE 4 stuff w/o being bothered [00:48] * minghua loves aptitude mainly for its curses UI. [00:48] persia: apt-get takes versions in the same way though... [00:48] Comparably, synaptic's UI is really bad. :-( [00:49] forcing was a bad idea :) [00:49] jdong: But it doesn't let you download a known working version for quick application when testing :) [00:49] * persia thinks minghua spent too much time with dselect [00:49] persia: apt-get install foobar=1.2.3-4ubuntu5? [00:49] I can't really figure out when the new upload is being processed [00:49] jdong: metered bandwidth [00:50] persia: it saves the file in /var/cache/apt/archives implicitly, and doesn't remove it unless you autoclean [00:50] jdong: And autoclean is off by default? [00:50] (and making things "clean" doesn't seem like a good idea to J. Random User?) [00:50] autoclean isn't automatic, is it? [00:50] proppy, it is processed on each 10 minute mark of the hour [00:51] persia: right, it's off by default [00:51] * persia thought autoclean was automatic: deleting anything not in the current package status lists [00:51] persia: not that I know of.... I have stale versions here [00:51] nenolod: another line for marking the new upload showed up [00:51] persia: Why do you think so? I've never used dselect. [00:51] proppy, right [00:52] jdong: Do you have stale lists in /var/lib/apt/lists/ ? [00:52] proppy, the changes go to a mailing list too [00:52] persia: no, my lists update bi-daily [00:53] [jdong@jdong:tmp/Starcraft]$ ls /var/cache/apt/archives/* (10-27 19:52) [00:53] minghua: aptitude curses. I'm also a fan, but most I've encountered that like it, were dselect fans (similar interface, much weaker relationship handling) [00:53] /var/cache/apt/archives/apt_0.7.6ubuntu14.1_i386.deb [00:53] and so on... [00:53] /var/cache/apt/archives/apt_0.7.6ubuntu14_i386.deb [00:53] ignore the starcraft part... [00:53] *cough* bored [00:53] persia: Hmm... I must be a too young Debian user, then. [00:53] proppy, lintian is still complaining. are you sure you rebuilt the source package? ;) [00:54] (and so are most aptitude users I know) [00:54] jdong: Well then. Perhaps there's no good reason to use one over the other. dist-upgrading with update-manager works better than aptitude anyway. [00:54] persia: the main advantage I can come up with is unified UI [00:54] jdong: ? [00:54] persia: Joe Schmoe should not have to know search is under apt-cache, while install is under apt-get [00:55] aptitude is indeed more userfriendly [00:55] jdong: Ah. Yes. Although I do miss "source" and "build-dep". [00:55] but i am stuck in my apt-foo ways ;p [00:55] persia: I know aptitude has source... it doesn't have build-dep [00:55] nenolod: I just fixed debian-rules-ignores-make-clean-error [00:55] jdong: Also aptitude show is formatted more cleanly than apt-cache show [00:55] nenolod: with the next upload [00:55] proppy, ah. ok. [00:56] nenolod: wait another 10m :) [00:56] proppy, except, lintian still complains about debian-rules-ignores-make-clean-error [00:56] see http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/mumble-0710280200/lintian [00:56] jdong: My aptitude doesn't have source. It does have "why" though :) [00:56] nenolod: yep whe have to wait for the next upload [00:56] which is why i asked if you forgot to rebuild ;p [00:56] persia: whoa, it doesn't [00:57] proppy, what is mumble anyway? [00:57] nenolod: upload 2 was only removing .svn [00:57] persia: I swear, it had it 6 months ago [00:57] "aptitude why" is a pretty new feature. [00:57] nenolod: a voice over ip multiuser chatclient and server [00:57] * persia never remembers aptitude source [00:57] nenolod: a FOSS alternative to teamspeak [00:57] WTF sharkattack used aptitude source! [00:57] proppy, ah, ok. [00:57] minghua: I'd never seen it before. I'm excited about it :) [00:57] nenolod: bug #129081 [00:57] if you're interested [00:58] norsetto put me on this one [00:58] bot is gone :( [00:58] persia: I pretty much never use it... I use aptitude almost exclusively in curses UI (with the exception of update, perhaps). [00:58] https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/debian/+bug/129081 [00:58] Launchpad bug 129081 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] Mumble" [Wishlist,In progress] [00:59] There is a new bot, just a less smart one. :-) [00:59] * minghua pats Ubotwo. [00:59] nenolod: upload 3 lintian free http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=449 [00:59] minghua: I'm thinking of use in scripts - handy to get a list of a dependency map: perhaps when planning syncs, etc. [00:59] proppy, great [01:00] proppy: With all of "-iIv" for both binary and source? [01:00] proppy, you might consider uploading it to mentors.debian.net [01:00] yeah. that's the next step ;p [01:00] persia: what is -ilv ? [01:00] -iIv [01:00] not -Ilv [01:00] persia: http://alioth.debian.org/~fjp/debtree/ # I think you would be interested in this tool [01:00] proppy: As in `lintian -iIv foo.dsc` and `lintian -iIv foo.deb` [01:01] proppy, it checks more strictly than what revu checks, basically [01:01] proppy@nekun:~/Desktop/20071027/mumble$ lintian -iIv mumble_1.1.1ubuntu1.dsc [01:01] N: Setting up lab in /tmp/umgGDVrMuF ... [01:01] N: Processing 1 packages... [01:01] N: ---- [01:01] N: Processing source package mumble (version 1.1.1ubuntu1) ... [01:01] N: Removing /tmp/umgGDVrMuF ... [01:01] oups flood [01:02] congrats [01:02] that's how it should look ;) [01:02] Firefox can't find the server at mentors.debian.org. [01:02] .net [01:02] not .org [01:02] proppy: don't forget to check your binary packages as well :) [01:02] .net [01:03] You should just run the .changes file through lintian. [01:03] * persia also recommends `linda -v -f long -t E,I,W,X foo.dsc` [01:03] That way you check both the source and binary packages. [01:04] persia: cool I'll upload unittest++ as well to mentors.debian.net [01:04] minghua: Depends on your workflow. I use `debuild -S` and `sbuild`, so .changes doesn't contain the source. This is also true for pbuilder users, and pbuilder/sbuild are the recommended workflows. [01:04] persia: finally the DD sponsporing the upload tell me that a lib package not prefixed by lib is not a good idea [01:04] persia: so I get back to libunittest++-dev scheme [01:05] proppy: Just remember that Ubuntu requires the first new upstream version to be ...-0ubuntu1 and Debian requires ...-1. [01:05] persia: Really? My pbuilder results always include source packages. [01:05] mine don't === iceman____ is now known as iceman [01:05] minghua: Interesting. I'm not a pbuilder user, but I'm surprised the source is rebuilt: that destroys any signature that might be present. [01:05] I'm pretty sure I use default pbuilder settings. [01:06] And I run pbuilder with "pbuilder build xxx.dsc". [01:06] minghua: Defaults may also vary between environments :) [01:06] It copies the whole source package over. [01:07] persia: Right. Maybe a Debian-Ubuntu difference, actually. [01:07] minghua: Right. It keeps the signature on the .dsc, but it overwrites the signature on .changes. I suspect it's because Debian wants binary uploads, and Ubuntu wants source uploads. [01:09] * persia requests someone to look at why debtree isn't in Ubuntu, and fix that (at a lower priority than the needs-packaging bugs) [01:09] persia: cos debtree appeared more recently than the most recent sync from Debian? [01:10] sladen: So it's in queue for hardy sync? Excellent. Thanks. [01:11] persia: It's not even in Debian yet... [01:11] should I upload source changes or binary changes to mentors? [01:11] The ITP was filed like two weeks ago IIRC. [01:11] persia: http://people.ubuntu.com/~ubuntu-archive/queue/hardy/new/ doesn't look like. it [01:12] proppy: You need a combined .changes, with both source and binary. [01:12] persia: generated with debuild -sa ? [01:12] persia: debtree is currently just a single shell script [01:12] proppy: Yes. [01:13] persia: nice [01:13] persia: http://mentors.debian.net/cgi-bin/maintainer-packages?action=details;package=unittest%2B%2B [01:13] proppy: You might want to make a debian chroot, and run pbuilder there, as debuild -sa will compile against local libraries, etc. so the resulting binary might not work for your Debian mentor. [01:14] persia: the package has no dependency [01:14] * persia doesn't have the magic tokens to do anything with packages on mentors.debian.net [01:14] persia: but maybe it will failed with libc and stuff [01:14] persia, proppy: My impression is that mentors.debian.net accepts source packages only. [01:14] persia: I will the etch packaging-farm output then [01:15] proppy: How does the static library get compiled? If it's not produced at buildtime, then it's not considered free code (and yes, there are differences in glibc between Debian and Ubuntu) [01:15] persia: http://farmpoker3d.pokersource.info/packaging-farm/unittest++/gnulinux/debian/etch/src/ [01:15] persia: can I sign the package once they are builded ? [01:16] proppy: You want to push against a sid build environment, and you'll use debsign to sign afterwards. [01:16] persia: I will use http://farmpoker3d.pokersource.info/packaging-farm/unittest++/gnulinux/debian/unstable/src/ so [01:17] I don't think debsign achieves much, as it's not supported by the default package management tools... [01:19] proppy: listed to minghua :) [01:19] s/listed/listen/ [01:20] minghua: the introduction states dput mentors cream_0.32-2_i386.changes [01:20] minghua: is this a binary changes ? [01:20] persia: Uh-oh. [01:20] I'm just a casual commenter... [01:21] proppy: A .changes file can be either a source upload or binary upload. [01:21] minghua: oh I see [01:22] minghua: If there is source is the changes name > this a source upload [01:22] minghua: If there is i386 in the changes name > this a binary upload ? [01:23] Heya raof. [01:23] Heya [01:23] evening [01:23] Morning :) [01:23] Morning for you maybe. :) [01:23] 8:23PM here in Boston/. [01:24] Ah, you crazy Boston types [01:24] proppy: You can say that, but it's not exactly technically correct, just a convention of dpkg-buildpackage (and others?). [01:24] Yeah, we are kinda crazy. :) [01:24] Mmmm, pikelets with cinammon sugar [01:25] Getting to go to an UDs and all. :p [01:25] 'lo from earlier, TheMuso. [01:25] UDS [01:25] proppy: It seems the mentors.debian.net instructions is not clear on that, so I assume if your binary upload is accepted, then it's okay. [01:25] minghua: ok, I will try to sign the output of packaging-farm then [01:25] proppy: Regardless, only source packages are shown on mentors.debian.net anyway. [01:26] ok [01:26] minghua: so no need to build it in a chroot ? [01:26] * minghua just realize that UDS would overlap with baseball world series. [01:27] yeah boston is going to be crazy [01:27] proppy: You should always test building your package in a clean chroot before uploading, but no, it's not a strict requirement. [01:28] proppy: People won't be happy if you don't do that and make some error that would have be caught otherwise, though. [01:28] minghua: will try dput -f on mentors [01:28] minghua: yep lintian warning is gone http://mentors.debian.net/cgi-bin/maintainer-packages?action=details;package=unittest%2B%2B [01:29] minghua: I building it for etch/lenny/sid/dapper/edgy/feisty/gutsy right now [01:29] proppy: Don't use that URL... It requires logging in. [01:30] proppy: It seems http://mentors.debian.net/cgi-bin/sponsor-pkglist?action=details;package=unittest%2B%2B works better. [01:30] minghua: I just wanted to know if I can upload my local versoin instead of the remotely outputed one [01:30] minghua: thanks [01:30] proppy: What do you mean by "remotely outputted one"? [01:31] It shouldn't matter where it's built, since mentors.d.n only cares about source packages. [01:31] minghua: package outputed by http://farmpoker3d.pokersource.info/packaging-farm/html/index.php [01:32] Holy crap, I see REVU is a little full again [01:32] bddebian: Yeah, and hopefully I'll find time this week to attack it. [01:33] Got to go, the game is starting. :-P [01:37] evening MOTU Land [01:37] mumble uploaded ! [01:37] good morning LaserJock [01:38] 'evening. [01:38] Heya LaserJock [01:42] lintian fixed: http://mentors.debian.net/cgi-bin/sponsor-pkglist?action=details;package=mumble [01:43] there is a lot of binary lintian warning I need to fix [01:43] I just get rid of the source one for now [01:43] geser: About gnumed, I'd have to study it to have an opinion. No time (headed for the train station to go to UDS). [01:44] hey LaserJock [01:45] see you up there, ScottK. [01:46] Great. [01:46] Oh man, crims is going to be there too :-( [01:46] Err crimsun_ [01:46] bddebian: Get in your car and drive. You can crash in my room [01:46] I should have escaped for a couple of days at least :-) [01:49] ScottK: thanks for the email to -motu [01:50] Evening LaserJock, for evening it is here in Boston. [01:51] hehe [01:52] finally in a sane timezone ;-) [01:54] Sane timezone? What, 15 hours from now? :) [01:54] Or should I say 15 hours ahead? [01:54] ScottK: :( , but take your personal time and see what you can change [01:55] yeah LaserJock is just now in an insane timezone ;) [01:58] muhahaha [01:05] persia: no need to apologize ;-) [01:07] hmm, so are we going to have voip for Boston? [01:07] anybody heard anything? [01:08] * persia thinks it's been unusually quiet in preparation for this summit [01:09] I really kinda need to be in on a few discussions [01:09] it'd be bad if there was no VOIP or anything [01:10] * bddebian doesn't need to be on anything [01:11] there's a "Future of Edubuntu" BOF that'll be quite important [01:12] ScottK: I may have some time this week, if you still need my modest python skills [01:12] :-) [01:12] * santiago-ve Ausente por ahora. [01:12] it'll be interesting attending my one and only UDS as a non-dev. [01:12] ScottK: since the viewvc package is waiting for DD for looking at my comments [01:13] LaserJock: I think things have been quiet, possibly in part due to the amount of bandwidth we have available here. [01:13] ScottK: (for the getdeb against backport diff) [01:14] hopefully gobby will be available [01:14] crimsun_: yeah, that's kinda ironic, eh? :-) [01:14] it's really much more fun [01:14] UDSs are so hectic [01:15] not so much ironic as 'perfect' [01:15] LaserJock: Indeed, but fun. [01:15] heh, yes [01:15] man, I'm really wishing I could be there [01:16] LaserJock: Now you know how I've felt the last two UDSs. [01:16] yeah [01:16] I had a good run though [01:16] 3 in a row [01:16] better than most [01:16] time to step aside and let the real developers have some fun [01:17] but you are a real developer, remember? [01:17] nah, I just fake it [01:18] crimsun_: Why non-dev? [01:18] it's kind of a bummer though, seems like there will actually be a Doc team presence and a fair amount of MOTUs [01:18] more than I do [01:18] bddebian: I stepped down at the end of gutsy. [01:19] he's now MOTU (Emeritus) [01:19] ;-) [01:19] LaserJock: Lucky you. This is only my second. [01:19] Man am I out of the loop [01:19] Yet that is still more than most. [01:19] LaserJock: maybe I should get that title [01:20] Well if everyone else is stepping out, maybe it's time I did too [01:20] Andrew Mitchell, Distinguished Chair of Zope Packaging and MOTU (Emeritus) ? [01:20] bddebian: Don't be stupid. [01:21] LaserJock: I was never chair of anything [01:21] & I wasn't enough of a MOTU to claim any emeritus title [01:21] ajmitch: Error: "I" is not a valid command. [01:21] bddebian: well, stepping down doesn't imply leaving the project [01:21] silly bot [01:22] bddebian: (e.g., my MC term was one year, and I don't have the resources to devote to it) [01:22] crimsun_, you are just a slacker and dont know it yet ;) [01:22] pfft, I know I'm a slacker :-) [01:23] crimsun_: Try workaholic. [01:23] crimsun_, sound broke because of you [01:23] crimsun_: there's no expiry date on LP for it though [01:23] hah hah...new jersey is going to loose [01:26] TheMuso: Why is that being stupid? Dealing with Debian is ridiculous and this place is crazy anymore :-) [01:26]