[01:13] wow--111 developers! [01:17] when is Tribe 1? [01:18] You think everyone in this channel is a developer? [01:18] just kidding; the topic is not for non-developers :} [01:19] I tried to join the day after the release of Gutsy, but was shunted over to #ubuntu. === lukaswayne9 is now known as lt === lt is now known as lt_smooth420 [01:44] bazhang: release schedule is not final yet. === Hobbsee changed the topic of #ubuntu+1 to: Welcome to #ubuntu+1 "Home of the Hardy Heron" | This channel is for Hardy discussion only | If you need help with dapper/edgy/feisty/gutsy join #ubuntu | Release schedule not final yet | Don't run hardy, it probably doesn't work -- this is definetly pre-alpha [01:44] Hobbsee: thanks! nice to see (read) you! :} [01:45] we shunt to #ubuntu so that people stop asking fo rgutsy stuff here [01:45] :) [01:45] definitely! [01:45] sp [01:45] :} [01:46] watch out or someone (forgot who) will call ops to fix the topic spelling :} [01:46] and i'll forward them to ##windows or something [01:46] about two weeks ago or so :) [01:46] haha [01:46] s/definetly/definitely === Hobbsee changed the topic of #ubuntu+1 to: Welcome to #ubuntu+1 "Home of the Hardy Heron" | This channel is for Hardy discussion only | If you need help with dapper/edgy/feisty/gutsy join #ubuntu | Release schedule not final yet | Don't run hardy, it probably doesn't work -- this is definitely pre-alpha [01:47] ah, that's it [01:47] i always get that wrong, for some reason [01:47] * Hobbsee ponders upgrading. [01:47] why does ubotu dislike nix ternal? [01:48] hah :) === dm is now known as DM| [02:06] night all [02:06] g'night === elkbuntu_ is now known as elkbirthday [02:31] * BaD_CrC thinks dist-upgrade is gonna happen in the next couple days... [02:32] wow! [02:38] is anyone here actually running hardy? [02:39] only the very brave--don't think there is anything in the repos yet, or are there even any repos? [02:40] I had heard the rumour of 11/29 for Tribe 1, but that is salt-grain, etc. [02:43] bazhang, I'll give it a few months [02:43] bazhang, gutsy is pretty epic [02:44] agreed. on both points. though maybe a wee test here.. :} [02:44] * nrp is running what there is of hardy [02:45] whoa.. :} [02:45] just judging by the improvements between feisty and gutsy.... we should see a very nice OS out of hardy [02:45] silent: I can't imagine where they could go from here--Gutsy is just so good. [02:45] as of yet, its a newer gnu toolchain [02:45] say that three times fast [02:46] :} [02:46] hrm, gutsy is nice, but far from perfect :p [02:46] bazhang, I imagine they would do tweaking, more options, perhaps more gui configuration options, make it more user-friendly as a major goal since it's being distributed with computers now [02:46] to the general public [02:46] it'll be like windows, but wont crash, like os x but not gay... it will be.. ubuntu [02:47] good point silent; and since it is an LTS, probably make sure c-f works. [02:47] * nrp just wants 2.6.23 as soon as possible [02:47] *like windows in that it's highly configurable through gui [02:47] whew [02:47] but aren't the odd numbered kernels unstable? [02:48] that was odd second digit, but they dont do that anymore [02:48] oh. ok [02:49] i'm running 2.6.24-rc1 [02:49] bleeding edge [02:49] :( [02:49] 24 is already at rc1? [02:49] apparently [02:49] I'm not running it though [02:50] oh, heh [02:50] I wish... I'd inject my system full of Linus [02:50] and other random european developers whom I'm sure have very large bears [02:50] beards* [02:50] and I bow to them [02:51] #hardy-offtopic? [02:51] :} [02:52] I need to learn how to do kernel patches [02:52] nrp: how does one get hardy stuff? [02:53] err packages [02:53] bazhang, I doubt the repos are complete [02:53] do they even exist? [02:53] edit /etc/apt/sources.list and find and replace gutsy with hardy [02:53] probably not yet, haven't checked my local mirror [02:54] then apt-get update and apt-get dist-upgrade [02:54] so sudo dist-upgrade won't work yet? [02:54] nrp, will that actually do anything? [02:55] itll give you a newer gnu toolchain, which is what is being used to compile the rest of hardy :p [02:55] I suddenly understand the topic. [02:55] are the gnome preferences for tab size located somewhere else? [02:55] but i imagine as the development summit approaches, real new packages will appear [02:55] window list right click -> preferences [02:56] there's supposed to be another tab [02:56] did ubuntu move the menu somewhere else to confuse me? [02:56] tab size? [02:56] click help [02:56] there are supposed to be 2 tabs [02:56] there were before at some point [02:57] help in what? [02:57] window list preferences [02:57] To configure Window List, right-click on the handle on the left of the buttons, then choose Preferences. The Window List Preferences dialog contains two tabbed sections. [02:57] * 4.9.5.2.1. Behavior [02:57] * 4.9.5.2.2. Size [02:57] oh, hmm, i see what you mean [02:58] do you know if that dialogue was moved somewhere or did gnome fail on their latest release? [02:59] there's also supposed to be an option to create new keyboard shortcuts in the keyboard shortcut menu [02:59] bazhang: there are repos [02:59] bazhang: and w.u.c/HardyReleaseSchedule is up, but not final. [03:00] Hobbsee: sorry to be such a pain.. :} [03:00] and thanks! [03:00] dist-upgrade may work, but will likely blow up [03:01] I'll stick with gutsy, I just recently got it working how I want it [03:01] same here..for now [03:01] scary to think that i went to gutsy, thsi time, 6 months ago [03:01] wowza [03:01] everything worked except my wifi, iirc. [03:01] of course, it was on kubuntu though [03:02] tends to break less - maybe from less changes [03:02] I want to install Hardy Heron to my eeePC mini-laptop (eeeuser.com) [03:02] Hobbsee, at least your menus arent missing functions that are explained in the help files [03:02] -_-" [03:03] bazhang, you have an eeepc? [03:03] yes! [03:03] bazhang, howd you get one already? [03:03] how big is the keyboard? [03:03] are you in taiwan? [03:03] live in Taiwan [03:03] gotcha [03:03] smallish, but still usable kb [03:03] hows the linux distro that comes with it? [03:03] but with Xandros (ugh). [03:04] ah, heh, enough said :p [03:04] fisher-price mode only [03:04] bazhang, you can install ubuntu on it [03:04] I almost installed Kubuntu last night--had kanotix working on it, but no wifi [03:04] hmm [03:05] * nrp was considering an eee, but is holding out for OLPC G1G1 [03:05] those are nice [03:05] does the olpc still look like something you'd find in a sandbox? [03:05] sugar os [03:05] silent, or toy from a very large expensive cereal box [03:06] haha [03:07] who's the op? [03:07] bazhang, yea, i played with sugar in QEMU, it has a pretty nifty feel [03:07] nrp: it is nice. [03:08] as is Xandros, but so slow... [03:08] I have an hp tx1000 [03:08] its small enough for me [03:08] bazhang, which model did you get? [03:08] 4G [03:08] best wait a couple of weeks for 8G though [03:08] silent: heh. patches welcome. [03:09] bazhang, you can always add a 8gb sd card [03:09] join #eeepc [03:09] they aren't overly expensive [03:09] true [03:09] or wait for the new solid-state storage coming out [03:09] devices up to 32gb i think [03:10] for regular-sized flash drive/sd [03:10] is the ssd in the eee user replacable? [03:10] and higher not too distant future [03:10] not at this point. [03:10] i assumed it would be soldered on [03:10] yeah, potential for actual solid state .. "hard disk drives" [03:10] soldered on nrp [03:10] err it's [03:11] hmm, well i suppose its user replaceable for someone with a steady hand and a maginifying glass :p [03:11] and solder station, i suppose [03:12] :} [03:12] how much are the OLPCs? [03:12] last I heard they were ~100 [03:13] silent. $200 each if you buy 10,000 ;) [03:13] oh wow [03:13] waiting for ubuntu mobile [03:13] Give 1 Get 1 program is $400, and they send you one, and send one to a kid in a country that needs one [03:14] bazhang, is it ubuntu for laptops? [03:14] silent for tiny laptops, and handhelds, etc. [03:14] nrp, what's he gonna do with it? use it for fuel? [03:14] wasnt the mobile version of ubuntu supposed to come out along with gutsy? [03:15] not sure--though they do have a channel, forgot which [03:15] silent, its designed to be used in a classroom environment. the charger and connectivity are in the school, but the kid owns the laptop and can take it home to his/her family [03:16] nrp, what if the battery runs out at home? [03:16] we're giving them a 200 dollar laptop and no ac/dc adapter? [03:17] although, some of them may not have power [03:17] silent, it lasts 10+ hours in greyscale mode, i believe, but the idea is that hand/solar/whatever powered chargers are going to be available [03:17] oh wow [03:17] silent, exactly the problem, power is unstable or nonexistant in many places the OLPC is to end up [03:17] 10+ hours is good news [03:17] for them and for me [03:17] indeed. [03:17] that's unheard of in the world of mobile pcs [03:18] yep. theres some really amazing hardware and software development going on with the olpc [03:18] apparently the laptop can perform a lot of its functions with the CPU off [03:18] :O [03:18] wtf [03:19] it must have a low-clock cpu to perform certain simple calculations then [03:19] i believe the idea was that the display/graphics controller can operate independantly of the main cpu [03:20] yes but programs need the cpu [03:20] #ubuntu-mobile is the channel [03:20] or some sort of processing unit [03:20] well, yes [03:20] what sort of processor does it use? [03:20] but in ebook mode, that would mean turning on the cpu for a fraction of a second to pull another page out of flash [03:21] i assume some sort of low-clock 45nm [03:21] silent, AMD geode [03:21] ~450mhz, i think [03:21] and cow-powered now [03:21] no kidding [03:21] its interesting to see development head toward long battery life [03:21] bazhang, heh, yea, saw that picture [03:22] :} [03:22] classically it's been "we need faster processors and better batteries" end result the laptop has the same battery life [03:22] I've actually been trying to figure out a way to underclock my turion x2 and kill one of the cores [03:24] * nrp doesnt want to think about cpu power usage [03:24] it hurts when youre taking a class where you have to design a minimum power cpu [03:25] it's challenging [03:25] lots of calculus though, I assume [03:26] or do you do algebraic solutions to certain situations? [03:26] not much calculus, just painful boolean logic [03:27] how much speed are you willing to compromise in design? [03:27] trying to find the right balance between small, fast, and low power [03:27] heh, yea, thats exactly the problem [03:27] I'd say around 500mhz would be a minimum [03:27] you're making a cpu after all, not a graphing calculator [03:28] well, it depends on what it is youre trying to do. in my case, its just a basic 8 bit cpu. [03:28] but why? [03:29] its a class, those are the specs [03:29] yeah === silent is now known as The === The is now known as The_Fonz === The_Fonz is now known as silent === mssever is now known as mssever|away === bronson is now known as bronson|Zzzz [07:05] Heya :D [07:05] You people should look into this post: http://www.fsckin.com/2007/10/30/in-depth-roadmap-analysis-for-ubuntu-hardy-heron-804/ [07:08] XVampireX: who's the writer? [07:09] Not me :P [07:09] By the way I have a nice idea [07:10] Can I still make a proposal for a feature? [07:11] sure, if you want to find people to go and implement it [07:12] It's a simple idea... [07:12] I always thought that the Mixer in Linux really lacks, it really fits like Windows 95/98 fits, really old.. [07:15] So I thought something a bit more professional like some windows sound cards have for example what I have, realtek HD Audio Manager :D [07:16] ahh [07:16] feel free to code it :) === oshi is now known as oshiii-_^ === bdgraue_ is now known as bdgraue [08:12] Hobbsee, I can't code it [08:13] XVampireX: then find someone who wants to, and who can === marko-_-_ is now known as marko-_- [12:22] !update [12:22] For upgrading, see the instructions at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UpgradeNotes [12:23] !FSM [12:23] Sorry, I don't know anything about fsm - try searching on http://ubotu.ubuntu-nl.org/factoids.cgi [12:24] for flying spaghetti monster lol [12:24] heh, update manager wont update to hardy [12:25] is there anything to update to? [12:25] sure [12:25] dont know how well it works, though :) [12:25] :} [12:25] i'll be more motivated to fix it when actually running it, so... [12:25] surely you put that on a different machine.. [12:25] haha [12:25] no [12:26] although this machine does tripple boot [12:26] XP, Vista, and Ubuntu? [12:26] so there's always something on here known not-broken :) [12:26] :} [12:26] nah. xp, kubuntu gutsy, ubuntu gutsy [12:26] just joking. [12:26] it usually runs xp, kubuntu $stable, kubuntu $development [12:27] what's the best partition manager--gparted or parted magic? [12:27] the one that exists :P [12:27] for noobs, that is. [12:27] parted magic it is then [12:27] parted magic doesnt exist. [12:28] so it's just gparted with another name--just got the torrent from linuxtracker [12:28] there's qtparted, gparted, and a windows thing called partition magic [12:28] those are the main ones, anyway [12:28] and the thing in the alternate installer [12:28] parted magic is none of those. [12:28] avoid it? [12:29] dunno what it is :) [12:29] partition magic, OTOH, is OK, although i never found a working version [12:29] * Hobbsee just uses the ubuntu installers to partition [12:32] gpartd-live-cd is good for partitioning [12:33] morning all === Hobbsee_ is now known as Hobbsee [12:35] hm, not that much to upgrade [12:35] bazhang: ~180mb to upgrade [12:36] bazhang: 210 updates [12:36] 542kbps - not bad. [12:38] morning IdleOne [12:38] how are you Hobbsee [12:38] IdleOne: going to see how broken hardy is. [12:38] have fun :) [12:38] yeah, it should be [12:38] let me know how it works out [12:39] still to early for me to dive in [12:39] Hobbsee: you have a testing machine or partition ? [12:41] i dont know how to debug gnome stuff, so :) [12:41] well, not gnome-specific stuff, anyway [12:41] IdleOne: no, this is my main machine. [12:41] IdleOne: but i have 3 partitions :) [12:41] so... [12:42] IdleOne: i upgraded pretty much at this time of the cycle last time too - had to take advantage of the good bandwidth. didnt seem too broken, excluding network mangler [12:42] ahhh see all I have is this machine with a 20Gig hd cant realy partition to much here [12:43] well when it is done let me know how it turns out. if it isnt to bad 'll go ahead and upgrade also [12:47] this is 80, but i was tripple booting on 40 too [12:47] IdleOne: hm. seems OK. should i reboot? :) [12:49] Hobbsee: does it want you to? [12:50] doesnt say to - only restart firefox [12:50] we have no kernel yet, so... [12:50] so dont [12:50] why take the chance lol [12:52] ! seamonkey [12:52] Seamonkey, formerly known as "Mozilla Application Suite", is available at http://www.mozilla.org/projects/seamonkey/ with install instructions for ubuntu at http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=186011 [12:59] IdleOne: because i'll hav to eventually :P === Hobbsee_ is now known as Hobbsee [13:07] I just got a warning about not being about not being able to initiate dbus [13:07] who needs it [13:07] yeah, same here [13:07] no idea [13:08] I just upgraded to hardy, rebooting now... wish me luck :D === Zdra_ is now known as Zdra [13:08] the 'transparent' proxy here doesn't seem to work so i can't get updates :P [13:08] well, i can but the mirror is out of sync [13:09] i have half assed install of gutsy [13:09] man what a pain in the ass it has become to install [13:10] wants to stick my promise controler drives out front of pata drives [13:10] wow. hardy works. [13:12] i have it on hda2 and it says its on sdc2 [13:14] yeah [13:14] stupid shit [13:14] mine says it is sda too [13:14] well thats fine but it has two 500GB storage as sda and sdb [13:15] first [13:15] cps1966: and this is not a gutsy support channel? [13:15] thats not the way it set in bios [13:15] Amaranth: poor you :P [13:15] cps1966: I don't see a problem here [13:16] Hobbsee: i complained here long before it was released and noone did a fucking things about it [13:16] well here I go [13:16] !language | cps1966 [13:16] * IdleOne crosses fingers and toes [13:16] * Pici pokes ubotu [13:16] good luck IdleOne :P [13:16] cps1966: Please watch your language and topic, and keep this channel family friendly. [13:16] compwiz18: ty. 162 packages upgraded, 16 newly installed, 5 to remove and 0 not upgraded. [13:16] cps1966: probably because a) the devs arent here for the most part. b) irc is not a good todo list. c) not enough info [13:16] and a few other reasons [13:17] its been that way since fiesty [13:18] makes it hard to set up grub [13:18] cps1966: problem is that nobody here is paid to do this but you act like ubuntu Devs owe you something. relax and file a bug report /wish on launchpad.net hopefully it will be fixed soon [13:19] i have 7 physical drives plus dvd two raid controlers on board [13:20] so its not so simple to set up server [13:20] IdleOne: or just ignore the guy. *shrug* [13:21] update-manager worked for me [13:22] compwiz18: I changed sources.list and did a dist-upgrade [13:22] from cli [13:22] hoping it doesnt break [13:22] IdleOne, I changed the sources.list and then update-manager --dist-upgrade -d and that worked [13:22] heck this machine is old dual xeon p4 2.4 ghz 2003 old [13:23] cps1966: lolthat is brand spanking shiny new my machine is a 2000 [13:23] cps1966, that's faster then all the machines that I've got put together [13:24] well i do have a simple dual p3 1 ghz [13:24] also [13:24] and a compaq proliant dual p3 [13:25] Thanks Hobbsee! will try it on a test machine--way more cautious than you :} [13:25] you know if this doesnt work I am going to go over to Hobbsee's and make you fix my computer lol [13:25] :} [13:26] Installing new version of config file /etc/gai.conf gai????.conf [13:26] heh [13:26] GetAddressInfo [13:27] IdleOne: dream on :) [13:27] hydrogen: yeah I figured it was something techical [13:27] Hobbsee: dream on about? [13:27] oh making you fix my computer [13:27] lol [13:28] yes [13:28] although i probably will end up fixing parts of it [13:28] i'm sure i'm not the only one to have a full boat machine with lots of hardware [13:29] Hobbsee: hopefully this is going to go off withouta hich and Hardy will be released in perfect working order. the 1st OS ever to be released and not broken :) [13:29] oh, i'tll get broken. [13:30] haha [13:30] history tells us this :) [13:30] majority of merging hasnt been started yet [13:30] It'll be broken before its fixed. [13:30] lol Pici thats how it usualy works yeah [13:30] best release so far was dapper [13:30] pft. dapper broke a lot [13:30] youv'e forgotten dapper X woes? [13:31] not for me [13:31] broke for everyone, even with intel cards. [13:31] you may not have been running it early enough [13:31] i have nvidia [13:31] I spent more time fixing dapper then I did not fixing it. [13:31] edgy wouldnt boot [13:31] couldnt wait for edgy lol [13:31] feisty had major kernel troubles at the end. [13:31] gutsy...not sure what that really had... [13:32] oh, compiz woes [13:32] install troubles [13:32] still has compiz problems doesnt it? [13:32] cant find packages that are on cd [13:32] yeah [13:32] cps1966: ? [13:32] cps1966: which packages/ [13:33] cps1966: sounds like you got a corrupt cd [13:34] ah lets see after it misses one it keeps missing them all [13:34] na it checks good [13:34] md5sum is good and check media works fine [13:34] cps1966: what package does it miss to start with? [13:35] cant remember but it part of base system [13:35] if you burn the cd then do md5sum /dev/hdc, will it give you the md5sum of the iso? [13:35] i used apt-get to install kubuntu-desktop [13:35] or should it give you the md5 of the iso, rather? [13:35] leme see [13:37] would I would like is if Ubuntu can make gnome light weight . [13:37] -would / what [13:38] make it fast like XFCE but with all the gnome functionality. [13:38] * IdleOne likes having a few desktop icons [13:38] what functionability [13:39] well maybe that was the wrong word [13:39] awesome [13:39] I just want my default ubuntu install to snap to when I click on a shortcut [13:40] compwiz18: ??? [13:40] IdleOne, wrong tab, sorry [13:40] lol [13:40] * compwiz18 gets confused easily... [13:40] s'ok just dont do it again [13:40] I won't :) [13:40] * Worm likes alt+F2 shortcut [13:41] I just got a software update notification and the upgrade is not done yet :) [13:42] worm I never use it [13:45] IdleOne: Well, I don't have any icons on my desktop so I have to use it. I don't use the menu bar so often and that shortcut is very useful. [13:47] cool Boinc has finally changed it's icon :) [13:47]