[00:02] <begert> still figuring out this whole building KDE while in Kubuntu
[00:02] <begert> I have stuff built, just sure how to check if what I am running is what I built or not
[00:03] <DaSkreech> Ooooh I have this one I think
[00:04] <DaSkreech> http://randomguy3.wordpress.com/2007/10/25/kde4-bash-functions/
[00:05] <begert> usefull++
[00:05] <begert> thanks
[00:06] <DaSkreech> Yeah
[01:26]  * Jucato waves good evening/morning/afternoon
[01:30] <begert> hey
[01:31] <Jucato> hi
[01:31] <Jucato> !seen nixternal
[01:31] <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about seen nixternal - try searching on http://ubotu.ubuntu-nl.org/factoids.cgi
[01:31] <Jucato> bah.. no such function? :D
[01:31] <begert> heh
[01:35] <nixternal> Jucato: /msg seenserv seen nixternal
[01:35] <nixternal> ;)
[01:35] <jjesse> back from dinner
[01:35] <nixternal> although, it will just tell you I am here on IRC with you :)
[01:36] <Jucato> back from pizza breakfast :)
[01:36] <Jucato> hehehe
[01:36] <nixternal> mmm, pizza sounds good
[01:36] <Jucato> some IRC bots have smartass answers though... something like "Open your eyes! Foo is in here right now!"
[01:36] <nixternal> I am sittin' in class, and it looks like I am about the only loser sitting here
[01:36] <nixternal> everyone has gone home but me :)
[01:37] <Jucato> whoa? still at school?
[01:40] <jjesse> sorry you are still at school
[01:40] <nixternal> hehe
[01:40] <jjesse> olmost 9 o'clock pm for you right?
[01:41] <nixternal> gotta learn how to be cool like you all are
[01:41] <nixternal> shoot, this class typically goes until 10pm
[01:41]  * Jucato is uncool :)
[01:41] <begert> can someone help me out with a couple things?
[01:41] <nixternal> but the teacher went through and we did our ajax stuff and said "that's it, have a nice night"
[01:41] <nixternal> so, I am going to head home now, see you in a bit
[01:41] <Jucato> yay! take care
[01:41] <begert> later
[01:41] <Jucato> jjesse: how's UDS coming along? and how's kwwi?
[01:41] <begert> + PCRE: Perl Compatible Regular Expression <www.pcre.org>Provide better regular expression support in KJS.+ ALSA, 1.0.14a: current alsa-lib is needed for dmix and virtual device listing <http://www.alsa-project.org/>
[01:42] <Jucato> O.o
[01:42] <begert> are there packages for these?
[01:42] <jjesse> kwii's ok, very nice in real life
[01:42] <jjesse> UDS is great
[01:42] <Jucato> I thought you were staying away from him last night :D
[01:42] <begert> I am building kdelibs and it suggests that it would be nice if i had those
[01:43] <Jucato> of course there are :)
[01:43] <Jucato> !info libpcre3
[01:43] <ubotu> libpcre3: Perl 5 Compatible Regular Expression Library - runtime files. In component main, is optional. Version 7.2-1ubuntu2 (gutsy), package size 189 kB, installed size 388 kB
[01:43] <Jucato> !info libpcre3-dev
[01:43] <ubotu> libpcre3-dev: Perl 5 Compatible Regular Expression Library - development files. In component main, is optional. Version 7.2-1ubuntu2 (gutsy), package size 233 kB, installed size 592 kB
[01:43] <Jucato> that's probably what you'll need
[01:44] <jjesse> Jucato: that was this morning
[01:44] <jjesse> cause he was cranky and sick
[01:44] <Jucato> oh yeah.. morning... :/
[01:44] <begert> I installed them, the kde environnment doesn't seem to find them
[01:44] <begert> :(
[01:51] <yuriy> wow Jucato you're big on longwinded posts, huh
[01:52] <Jucato> yuriy: yeah it seems so... need to cut down really...
[01:52] <Jucato> (the first draft was .5 longer than that one though :P)
[01:54] <yuriy> and i think edubuntu is at least as officially supported as kubuntu is, at least they do get shipit
[01:54] <Jucato> poor xubuntu :(
[01:56] <dasKreech> hi ju
[01:56] <Jucato> hi das
[01:56] <dasKreech> Jucato: goes to rabidness
[01:57] <jjesse> which was  the long post?
[01:57]  * Jucato innocently whistles
[01:57] <jjesse> was that the one where he says he hates kubuntu
[01:57]  * jjesse ducks
[01:58] <Jucato> quack
[01:58] <Jucato> it would probably have been easier if I hated Kubuntu, wouldn't it? :(
[01:59] <jjesse> yeah it would have
[01:59] <jjesse> have you had feedback on your post?
[01:59] <Jucato> 30 so far
[01:59] <jjesse> nice, will have to read
[02:00] <dasKreech> Digg!
[02:00] <Jucato> please no! :/
[02:00] <Jucato> I'd rather it be kept within the more sane *buntu community
[02:00] <Jucato> but even in the community, there are crackpots... :)
[02:00] <Jucato> "As a GNOME user i’ll ask so what if Kubuntu is going down the drain?"
[02:01] <jjesse> wow don't agree with the whole rm -rf *Riddell
[02:01] <Riddell> I'm being deleted?
[02:01] <jjesse> one of the comments from Jucato's post says to remove Riddel from Kubuntu if i read the comment correctly
[02:01] <Jucato> I think he mistook you for a GNOME dev :)
[02:01] <jjesse> http://jucato.org/blog/quo-vadis-kubuntu/
[02:02] <Jucato> but the command won't work.
[02:02] <jjesse> you've tried?
[02:02] <Jucato> rm: cannot remove `riddell': No such file or directory
[02:02] <Jucato> Linux is case sensitive :)
[02:02] <dasKreech> needs to be context sensitive :)
[02:03] <dasKreech> imbrandon: Dude!
[02:04] <coreymon77> Jucato: what the hell?
[02:04] <coreymon77> Jucato: remove riddell?
[02:04] <Jucato> heh yeah I did get some very interesting comments :)
[02:13] <dasKreech> Is there a korean chan?
[02:13] <Jucato> !kr
[02:13] <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about kr - try searching on http://ubotu.ubuntu-nl.org/factoids.cgi
[02:13] <Jucato> none
[02:13] <Jucato> (it seems)
[02:14] <Riddell> there's a KDE Koran channel on an obscure irc server
[02:15] <Riddell> #kde at the HanIRC server
[02:15] <Jucato> there seems to be #ubuntu-ko
[02:15] <Riddell> in basket, how do I make notes so they can be moved around freeform?
[02:15] <Jucato> right-click on the basket -> Properties -> Disposition
[02:16] <yuriy> i was thinking today about how i'd want basket features in korganizer
[02:17] <yuriy> have the nice click anywhere and start typing thing to make events, and merge the todo list features
[02:18] <Riddell> Jucato: thanks
[02:18] <Jucato> np :)
[02:18] <dasKreech> Jucato: isn't that north korea?
[02:18] <Jucato> that I don't know....
[02:20] <dasKreech> are there any issues with ubuntu shutting down and then not bringing the machine back up properly?
[02:20] <Riddell> I'd imagine it's south korea
[02:21] <Riddell> dasKreech: not that I know of
[02:21] <nosrednaekim> you know... after setting up compiz to act right with kde, I found some programs hat really should be in our repositories
[02:22] <nosrednaekim> kicker-compiz and taskbar-compiz
[02:22] <dasKreech> Such as>
[02:22] <dasKreech> ok
[02:22] <nosrednaekim> the former is a modified pager, and the latter a taskbar that is "desk space" friendly
[02:27] <yuriy> oh, interesting
[02:27] <jjesse> yeah?
[02:27] <yuriy> they fix the pager and taskbar problems?
[02:28] <Jucato> or are they separate 3rd party apps?
[02:28] <begert> so if I build my own KDE4 apps and want to submit a bug report, is it valid to put it in launchpad or is that a strictly kde.org thing?
[02:28] <Jucato> but it still kinda sucks that they have to do it all externally :(
[02:28] <dasKreech> begert: Did you submit them to KDE?
[02:28] <begert> I have done nothing yet?
[02:29] <Riddell> begert: bugs.kde.org
[02:29] <Jucato> begert: you mean built KDE 4 from SVN?
[02:29] <begert> heh, not a question
[02:29] <begert> yes, built from SVN
[02:29] <Jucato> then Riddell's answer is the one :)
[02:29] <Riddell> nosrednaekim: packages welcome :)
[02:30] <nosrednaekim> Riddell: I'm not a packager (and really can't be too easily since I am on dial-up)
[02:30] <nosrednaekim> Riddell: just normal updates are hard for me.
[02:30] <begert> k, thanks
[02:30] <Jucato> nosrednaekim: do the next best thing... find someone who will :D
[02:30]  * Jucato thinks jpatrick is still looking for stuff to do...
[02:30] <dasKreech> begert: Oh Built... sorry wrong context
[02:31] <nosrednaekim> Jucato: yeah...jpatrick isn't around
[02:31] <Jucato> nosrednaekim: or wait... don't we have  a compiz team? maybe that'd be their area of responsibility
[02:31] <nosrednaekim> do we?
[02:31]  * Jucato thought we did... 
[02:32] <Jucato> better ask in -motu
[02:32] <nosrednaekim> ok
[02:34] <yuriy> Riddell: the new printer tool won't be a kcm?
[02:35] <Riddell> yuriy: it'll be qt4, so not sure
[02:35] <nosrednaekim> yuriy: in KDE4?
[02:35] <Jucato> nosrednaekim: https://wiki.kubuntu.org/KubuntuHardyCatchup
[02:35] <Jucato> Riddell: were you able to read my comment about the Flash install script earlier?
[02:35] <Riddell> Jucato: nope
[02:35] <yuriy> nosrednaekim: in kde 3. i saw that it is going to be PyQt 4 which is why i'm asking
[02:36]  * Jucato greps
[02:36] <nosrednaekim> yuriy: ehh never mind misinformed me ;)
[02:36] <Riddell> yuriy: we can probably load it from system settings, but not integrate it properly
[02:36] <Jucato> Riddell: <Jucato> comment on the Codec installation: with Flash in Konqueror, currently it uses a different script and installs to the user's $HOME right? shouldn't it be done like Amarok/Kaffeine and use adept-batch to install flashplugin-nonfree?
[02:38] <Riddell> Jucato: yes it maybe should, but the current one works so I don't plan to change it
[02:38]  * dasKreech waves at CPrgmSwR2
[02:38] <CPrgmSwR2> hey
[02:38] <CPrgmSwR2> I am wondering if kde4-beta4 is being worked on or is the packages made yet?
[02:38] <Riddell> CPrgmSwR2: yes, but buildds are being slow with the debian imports
[02:38] <Jucato> Riddell: ok. I'm guessing no one's complaining yet that when they installed Flash in one user, other users don't get it as well?
[02:39] <Jucato> ouch.. chest hurts brb...
[02:39] <CPrgmSwR2> Jucato: Oh no wonder I had that issue
[02:39] <dasKreech> :-(
[02:39] <Riddell> Jucato: I've not heard any complaints
[02:39] <dasKreech> asthma attack
[02:39] <CPrgmSwR2> Riddell: I have had issues with that
[02:39] <dasKreech>  he'll be back
[02:40] <CPrgmSwR2> Riddell: will the beta4 take place of beta3 once its released?
[02:41] <Riddell> CPrgmSwR2: it'll be in gutsy-backports
[02:42] <Jucato> back...
[02:42] <Jucato> dang that hurt.. not asthma though
[02:42] <dasKreech> Hobbsee: ping
[02:42] <Jucato> morning Hobbsee!
[02:42] <Hobbsee> hiya!
[02:42] <Hobbsee> dasKreech: pong
[02:42] <dasKreech> Jucato: jalepeno balut pizza?
[02:42] <dasKreech> Hey Hobbsee  :)
[02:42] <dasKreech> How are you?
[02:42] <Jucato> ew!
[02:42] <Hobbsee> doing OK
[02:43] <Hobbsee> done one prac, and a lecture
[02:43] <dasKreech> Hobbsee: Hows tracker?
[02:43] <Hobbsee> purged.
[02:43] <Hobbsee> :)
[02:43] <Hobbsee> i dont hav emuch use for desktop search
[02:45] <dasKreech> Hobbsee: So no impressions of it?
[02:45]  * Jucato likes the gnome deskbar
[02:45] <dasKreech> I hear if KDE had a deskbar... about twice a week
[02:46] <nosrednaekim> pffft, KDE has so many OTHER things that GNOME doesn't
[02:46] <Jucato> you can add "if KDE had a panel drawer" from me
[02:46] <yuriy> what's a deskbar?
[02:46] <Hobbsee> dasKreech: appears to work, but i prefer battery life
[02:46] <Jucato> http://raphael.slinckx.net/deskbar/
[02:47] <Jucato> oh better site: http://browserbookapp.sourceforge.net/deskbar.html
[02:47] <dasKreech> nosrednaekim: Yes but people like delicious
[02:47] <dasKreech> Jucato: Umm we don't?
[02:47] <Jucato> and it doesn't depend on tracker (only recommends)
[02:47] <yuriy> so like the strigi applet but looks better?
[02:47] <dasKreech> I'm almost sure KDE had a panel drawer
[02:48] <yuriy> umm and what's a panel drawer then?
[02:48] <Jucato> yuriy: somewhat, but doesn't depend on a search engine like tracker... dunno what it uses
[02:48] <Jucato> yuriy: have you seen OS X Leopard's new Stacks feature for the Dock yet?
[02:48] <yuriy> Jucato: no, i haven't looked at Leopard
[02:49]  * Jucato looks for good links
[02:49] <yuriy> i imagine we'll be upgrading the lab macs at some point, and then i'll have a look
[02:49] <jjesse> so does anyone have any problems w/ delete taking forver in dolphin
[02:49] <jjesse> takes longer then vista's delete
[02:49] <yuriy> i've had delete take forever before, not sure why, but i doubt it's dolphin's fault
[02:50] <begert> https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=135932 decent addition to a bug report?
[02:50] <ubotu> KDE bug 135932 in general "KFind crash when clicking "stop"" [Crash,Unconfirmed]
[02:50] <yuriy> Jucato: gnome deskbar uses beagle
[02:51] <dasKreech> tracker in Gutsy
[02:51] <Jucato> http://packages.ubuntu.com/gutsy/gnome/deskbar-applet
[02:51] <yuriy> well anyways, depends on a search engine
[02:51] <Jucato> no depends on beagle or tracker... only recommends...
[02:52] <Jucato> did edgy have beagle or tracker? because that was the first (and last) time I tried the deskbar
[02:53] <Jucato> yuriy, dasKreech: the GNOME drawer is like the quicklaunch applet, except that it can hide/show by clicking a button on the panel. it doesn't take up that much space
[02:53] <yuriy> doesn't sound terribly useful, now you need 2 clicks for "quick" launch
[02:53] <Jucato> there are workarounds for KDE to have that, but not that easy to do
[02:54] <Jucato> if space is a luxury you can't afford, it's useful :)
[02:54] <yuriy> if you have so much stuff in there that you need another click to show the whole thing, that's the kmenu
[02:54] <Jucato> specially if you have, say  more than 6 apps there?
[02:54] <Jucato> and in the kmenu you'll have at least 3 clicks :)
[02:55] <Jucato> anyways, just my personal wishlist :)
[02:55] <yuriy> how so? you don't need to click on submenus, so anything in there is exactly 2 clicks away
[02:55] <dasKreech> One if you start with alt+f1
[02:55] <yuriy> also the hide button itself would waste space
[02:56] <yuriy> dasKreech: ok, actions
[02:56] <dasKreech> Alncelot has that down to one
[02:56] <dasKreech> lancelot
[02:56] <Jucato> yuriy: you're right, 2 clicks only.. but then you'd have to also navigate through the menus. not really that quick either
[02:56] <jjesse> is that a new start menu?
[02:56] <jjesse> lancelot?
[02:56] <dasKreech> It's a launcher
[02:56] <Jucato> yeah
[02:57] <dasKreech> wehn beta4 spits out you can play with it
[02:57] <Jucato> well not a "Start" menu (we'll get sued!)
[02:57]  * Jucato wonders why his chest is hurting...
[02:57] <dasKreech> It's not even close to a Start Menu
[02:57] <dasKreech> Do you do pucshups?
[02:57] <Jucato> nope
[02:58] <dasKreech> hmm
[02:58] <Jucato> I think what yuriy meant by Start menu was a main menu (like K menu)
[02:58] <dasKreech> So it's not muscles growing
[02:58] <dasKreech> I don't think lancelot is that either
[02:58] <Jucato> hm.. gas... heartburn.. dunno... anyway it stopped again..
[02:58] <dasKreech> I'm not sure I like it yet
[02:58] <Jucato> it is definitely a main menu
[02:59] <dasKreech> we shall see
[02:59] <Jucato> basically a launcher would be like katapult or krunner
[02:59] <dasKreech> well lancelot is supposed to be a mouseless launcher
[02:59] <dasKreech> That for some reason currently uses the mouse
[02:59] <Jucato> and looks like a menu. :)
[03:00] <Jucato> anyway, it is a sort of parking lot. "launching lot" = lancelot :)
[03:00] <dasKreech> Yeah it's a round of laffs :)
[03:00] <dasKreech> still not sure I like it
[03:00] <dasKreech>  Esp since it can't die yet
[03:01]  * yuriy never said Start menu
[03:01] <Jucato> oh sorry, that was jjesse
[03:01]  * Jucato needs to look at the colors more closely
[03:01]  * yuriy doesn't have colors
[03:01]  * Jucato does
[03:01] <jjesse> Jucato: i thought thats waht it was from the images i saw
[03:01] <yuriy> dasKreech: it's not supposed to be mouseless, just clickless
[03:01] <jjesse> as lest thats what it looked like to me
[03:01] <dasKreech> ah
[03:01] <dasKreech> ok
[03:01] <dasKreech> still not sure I like it
[03:02] <yuriy> but it uses hovering to replace clicks, which just sounds annoying to me
[03:02] <Jucato> you don't have to :)
[03:02] <Jucato> there's a (configurable?) delay for it anyway
[03:02]  * Jucato wonders if we'll be using custom/special icons for the new XDG Home Dirs...
[03:03] <dasKreech> I hope they have hover back in for Kickoff
[03:03]  * ScottK recalls that being discussed at UDS.  I think we need to just have some.
[03:03] <dasKreech> Right now the mix of hovering and clicking really bugs me
[03:03] <dasKreech> Go raptor!
[03:03] <Jucato> ScottK: Crystal SVG already has some
[03:04] <Jucato> something like icons w/ overlays
[03:04] <ScottK> Jucato: Then it should be simple.  I know they already work as I've got one for my Documents dir on this box.  The /home was copied over from opensuse when I switched and the icon came with it.
[03:05] <dasKreech> The KDE4 icons already do overlays and emblems right?
[03:05] <Jucato> yeah I used to do that to my home dirs too... but I ran out of "overlays" :)
[03:05] <Jucato> dasKreech: not the ones for file icons I think... not really sure
[03:05] <dasKreech> Ok
[03:05]  * dasKreech backs away from the danger
[03:06] <Jucato> DeadlyPointyStic: aw.. :(
[03:06] <yuriy> i don't know why i find qt designer so confusing
[03:06] <Jucato> "Alter applications to use the relevent directory by default. Amarok to use Music, Kaffeine to use Video, Digikam to use Photos, KOffice to use Documents, Konqueror to Downloads." <-- I wonder how you can set Konqueror to always download into Downloads...
[03:06] <Jucato> yuriy: Qt 4?
[03:06] <yuriy> Jucato: yeah
[03:07] <Jucato> it helps if you don't have all the palettes open at once :)
[03:07] <Jucato> er... "Tools"
[03:07] <yuriy> well even just the properties pallet
[03:07] <yuriy> te
[03:08] <Jucato> I think most people already familiar with GUI designers are familiar with that setup, from Visual foo maybe?
[03:08] <yuriy> every time i go try to use designer it just makes me want to code the GUI
[03:09] <Jucato> you always can :)
[03:09] <yuriy> Jucato: i've used VB before, but that was a long time ago
[03:09] <Jucato> I haven't looked much into Visual foo actually...
[03:09] <yuriy> well just now i was thinking of starting on a ui for the printer thing because seele's blog got me excited abou tit
[03:09] <yuriy> *about it
[03:09] <Jucato> I was saved early on by Linux
[03:09] <Jucato> O.o
[03:09] <Jucato> nice typo :)
[03:10] <yuriy> hate that typo, make it all the time too
[03:11] <dasKreech> yuriy: just embrace tit
[03:12] <Jucato> tsk tsk... now that's not a typo :P
[03:12] <n8k99> hello?
[03:12] <Jucato> hi?
[03:12] <n8k99> just thought this was a good moment for greetings
[03:13] <Jucato> great timing! :)
[03:15] <jjesse> sorry we dont allow greetings here
[03:15] <Jucato> aw shucks!
[03:15] <jjesse> hello Jucato
[03:15] <jjesse> :P
[03:15] <Jucato> haha :)
[03:15] <claydoh> greetings!
[03:15] <Jucato> ey claydoh! h
[03:15] <claydoh> lol too late as usual
[03:16] <n8k99> jjesse: i'll find you tomorrow and greet you!
[03:16]  * claydoh watches ghost hunters, its live....and booooorring
[03:16] <jjesse> n8k99: looking forward to it
[03:17] <claydoh> hello Jucato
[03:54] <jjesse> wow found a bug still refrencing 5.10
[03:55] <Ahmuck> i want a kubuntu coffee cup *sniffle*
[04:03] <dasKreech> cafepress?
[04:10] <ScottK> Any suggestions where to start looking if the keyboard quits working for one and only one user on a Kubuntu Gutsy box just after login?
[04:13] <Ahmuck> in #kubuntu
[04:13] <dasKreech> ScottK: don't know happens to me every now and again
[04:13] <dasKreech>  I just use the mouse and logout and sudden;y it's working again
[04:14] <ScottK> dasKreech: That shound different than this.  It's gone and stays gone.  I mentioned it to Riddell at UDS and his eyebrow raised.
[04:15] <ScottK> I give for tonight.  Good night all.
[05:24] <lnxkde> hey guys when will be beta4 of kde 4 available for Kubuntu?
[05:30] <nixternal> within the next day or so...UDS is swamping us right now
[05:30] <Jucato> [Thu Nov 1 2007] [10:38:52] <CPrgmSwR2> I am wondering if kde4-beta4 is being worked on or is the packages made yet?
[05:30] <Jucato> [Thu Nov 1 2007] [10:39:09] <Riddell> CPrgmSwR2: yes, but buildds are being slow with the debian imports
[05:30] <Jucato> (sorry for those highlighted)
[05:30] <nixternal> :)
[05:31] <nixternal> that is getting asked quite a bit
[05:31] <Jucato> hehe
[05:31] <nixternal> our buildd's are struggling
[05:31] <Jucato> you have to admit, it's highly unusual for Kubuntu to be behind :)
[05:31] <lnxkde> yea
[05:31] <nixternal> can't help it...it is just Riddell and I doing the builds right now..and we have 2 new package introductions
[05:31] <Jucato> nixternal: I presume you're home now? or still at school? :D
[05:31] <lnxkde> I hope it is usable :)
[05:31] <nixternal> I am home
[05:32] <Jucato> lnxkde: you can always compile from SVN and see for yourself :D
[05:32] <nixternal> lnxkde: it should be usable, we are including the new kdebase-runtime and the plasma-playground
[05:32] <Jucato> nixternal: hm.. about that... haven't some of the plasmoids been moved to extragear or something?
[05:32] <lnxkde> Jucato: no thankx ;) I leaved Gentoo becouse it takes a lot of (&$%)($&^ time! compiling things
[05:32] <nixternal> OK, it seems Riddell's changes have been posted, now I just need them to build, point my schroot sources.list at the ppa, and build away :)
[05:33] <lnxkde> nixternal: nice
[05:33] <nixternal> tomorrow I should get some time
[05:33] <Jucato> nah, KDE4 doesn't take much time
[05:33] <nixternal> you can compile kde4 in less than 2 hours time...and that is pretty much everything
[05:33] <nixternal> except on a monday, that is a dangerous day to attempt the build
[05:33] <Jucato> http://websvn.kde.org/trunk/extragear/plasma/
[05:34] <Jucato> and of course http://websvn.kde.org/trunk/playground/base/plasma/
[05:34] <Jucato> oh well... :/
[05:34] <lnxkde> no I will not get pesuaded to build it ;) I will not sleep if I sart playing with code
[05:34] <lnxkde> and I got java class tomorow
[05:34] <Jucato> ooh java
[05:35]  * Jucato can't relate, but nixternal sure can :)
[05:35] <nixternal> lnxkde: Java FTW! :)
[05:35] <lnxkde> java = sucks Its too slow and eats resorces
[05:35] <lnxkde> but well
[05:35] <nixternal> I have been trying to get ODBC and JDBC working nicely in Linux so I can do a DB demo tomorrow, but it isn't working as planned
[05:35] <lnxkde> that is collage
[05:35] <Jucato> oh I just remembered.. nixternal, yuriy was also interested in doing a UI for the printer config thingy
[05:36] <nixternal> none of my code is slow, nor does it eat resources....our class would lose points for such a thing
[05:36] <nixternal> good, he can do it then :)
[05:36] <Jucato> lol
[05:36] <lnxkde> well even my profesor code is slow to load
[05:36] <lnxkde> :s
[05:36] <lnxkde> or maybe is just my pc....
[05:37]  * Jucato wonders what language they'll be using in his CS course next year....
[05:37] <Jucato> besides English of course...
[05:37] <nixternal> I just wrote a multithreaded client/server address book to demo, tested and fixed all memory leaks, which originally there were quite a few...and it is pretty snappy
[05:37] <lnxkde> wow that is nice
[05:37] <lnxkde> we do stupid stuff
[05:37] <lnxkde> things that have no use...
[05:38] <nixternal> I will admit that java is not what people say it is anymore...you go back to <1.4, it was a mess
[05:38] <Jucato> nixternal: how does it compare to kaddressbook now? I'm really looking forward to a saner app :)
[05:38] <nixternal> haha
[05:38] <lnxkde> for example...      geocities.com/lnxkde/StickAnimals.html
[05:38] <nixternal> when I am finished with it, you will have several connection choices
[05:38] <nixternal> ya, I hate applets, those are slow
[05:39] <nixternal> I have urged the professor to stay away from them, as they are freakin' useless
[05:39] <nixternal> although she doesn't listen
[05:39] <lnxkde> well that is way I hate Java so much
[05:39] <lnxkde> my profesor uses Java for applets mostly!
[05:39] <nixternal> lnxkde: hahah, that is cool actually
[05:39] <Jucato> nixternal: brb
[05:40] <nixternal> thanks for the warning Jucato
[05:40] <Jucato> er.. that wasn't meant to be direct :?
[05:40] <nixternal> :)
[05:40] <Jucato> lol sorry
[05:40] <Jucato> I was about to say something, forgot. then needed to brb
[05:40] <Jucato> bah! I'm really losing some sKrews
[05:40] <lnxkde> nixternal: what is cool?
[05:40] <nixternal> the lil kitties
[05:40] <lnxkde> my applet? Thankx.... did you see the one that killed the other one
[05:40] <nixternal> hahahahahaha, wth
[05:40] <nixternal> the big cat jumped the little cat
[05:41] <lnxkde> that was my second exam..
[05:41] <lnxkde> and well the little one should be a mouse but I just reused the code and -rested some numbers to make it litle
[05:41] <lnxkde> LOL
[05:42] <nixternal> hehe
[05:42] <lnxkde> for example...      geocities.com/lnxkde/StickAnimals.java
[05:42] <nixternal> I have only done one or two applets in my time, and never once did I like them
[05:42] <lnxkde> that is the code
[05:43] <nixternal> nothing I hate more than .draw* and .paint and .repaint
[05:43] <lnxkde> lol
[05:43] <nixternal> unless you are going to be mapping stuff, totally useless, and confusing as all hell
[05:44] <nixternal> I don't even like looking at draw* code at all, leads to a migrane :)
[05:44] <lnxkde> lol
[05:44] <lnxkde> sorry ;)
[05:44] <nixternal> I have to say though, that is pretty good stuff
[05:45] <lnxkde> :-)
[05:45] <lnxkde> but little boring...
[05:45] <lnxkde> now we are starting with arrays
[05:46] <lnxkde> well tomorow we will start with it
[05:46] <nixternal> what's up with the "spanglish" comments :p
[05:46] <lnxkde> well I am from Puerto Rico and I satrted comenting in English also I bowored some code from the proffesor ;)
[05:46] <lnxkde> and was comented in spanish
[05:46] <nixternal> ahh...hehehe
[05:47] <lnxkde> but I was 6hrs left for the dead line
[05:47] <lnxkde> and I started doing stupid things like letting my coments in Spanish
[05:47] <nixternal> I have a buddy in the dominican republic that does the same thing
[05:47] <lnxkde> I was not thinking. Its stange but I hate Spanish + PC Stuff
[05:48] <nixternal> he moved back there from Chicago a few years ago, and he tries to comment in spanish as much as possible, but it is funny...i always poke fun at him
[05:48] <lnxkde> I like all my computher things ins english
[05:48] <nixternal> growing up, I spoke better spanish than I did english...I remember all of my friends parents back then, they were like "holy shat whiteboy, you can talk like a mexican"
[05:49] <lnxkde> but I you know spanish well. you will notice I suck at spanish and english too
[05:49] <lnxkde> ;)
[05:49] <nixternal> that's what you get when you grow up in a predominately latino neighborhood of chicago
[05:50] <lnxkde> nice I got a uncle there
[05:50] <nixternal> I was a D student in English during high school, but honors Spanish with all A's :)
[05:50] <nixternal> every latino has an uncle here in Chicago :)
[05:50] <lnxkde> LOL
[05:50] <nixternal> if you live in Chicago, you are either Polish or Latino
[05:50] <nixternal> or Hobbsee
[05:50] <nixternal> oh shoot, she's here
[05:51] <lnxkde> lol
[05:51] <lnxkde> well I hope to go to chicago soon I want to visit the states and get a MAC BOOK in a apple store!
[05:51] <nixternal> haha
[05:51] <lnxkde> and see my family of course
[05:51] <nixternal> there are a few of those here in Chicago
[05:52] <nixternal> where at in Chicago are your family, do you know?
[05:52] <lnxkde> Illinoise
[05:52] <nixternal> hehehe
[05:52] <nixternal> Chicago is a city in Illinois
[05:52] <lnxkde> :P
[05:52] <lnxkde> yea sorry
[05:52] <lnxkde> well they are someone in Chicago
[05:52] <lnxkde> lol
[05:52] <lnxkde> somewhere...
[05:53] <nixternal> my neighbor just moved her from Puerto Rico...he is nuts though
[05:53] <nixternal> s/her/here
[05:53] <Hobbsee> hiya
[05:53] <Hobbsee> heh
[05:53] <nixternal> wasabi Hobbsee
[05:53] <lnxkde> sh*t is 1:53 am here after 1 my english gets worst ;)
[05:53] <lnxkde> Hobbsee: sup
[05:53] <nixternal> hahahaha
[05:53] <Hobbsee> fiddling with gnome
[05:53] <nixternal> lnxkde: my english gets worse all day long
[05:53] <lnxkde> nixternal: well I dont know where thay live but I know their lastname is Marrero
[05:53] <nixternal> with gnome, you will always be fiddling
[05:54] <Hobbsee> i hadnt been for a while
[05:54] <Hobbsee> but yeah, stuff is easier to set in kde - without a registry
[05:54] <nixternal> I can't remember my neighbors last name...if your uncle rides a harley, it might be him
[05:54] <nixternal> this guy moved here, and became a biker
[05:54] <nixternal> last summer, all you would hear was Daddy Yankee coming from his house
[05:54] <nixternal> now, he is playing rock and roll, and riding a chopper
[05:54] <lnxkde> nixternal: na they have been living there almost 25 years
[05:55] <lnxkde> nixternal: then he is cured from the "CACO" culture of Puerto Rico
[05:55] <nixternal> and then some
[05:55]  * Jucato waves to Hobbsee, nixternal, and lnxkde (again)
[05:55] <Hobbsee> :)
[05:55] <nixternal> quit waving, your hands will fall off
[05:56] <lnxkde> lol
[05:56]  * Jucato is still waving...
[05:56] <Jucato> I think it's stuck...
[05:56] <nixternal> I would love to see the kid who tried to smash my pumpkins tonight
[05:56]  * lnxkde daws an axe and aims 
[05:56]  * dasKreech drowns Jucato  in waves
[05:56] <nixternal> I bet his toe hurts...you can see where someone kicked in the face
[05:56] <Jucato> didn't you set up the webcam?
[05:57] <nixternal> no, I forgot like a moron
[05:57] <Jucato> :(
[05:57] <nixternal> but I did the old "fill up the pumpink with cement" trick
[05:57] <Jucato> lol
[05:57] <Jucato> ouch :)
[05:57] <lnxkde> LOL
[05:57] <nixternal> I cleaned out the shed the other day, and there was a bag of quickcrete in there, so I added water like it was a flower, and boom, I turned a 5 pound pumpkin into about 25 pounds of rock hard pumpkin
[05:58] <lnxkde> nixternal: that is mean...
[05:58] <nixternal> I know, but they deserve it
[05:58] <nixternal> I actually learned that when I was about 10, and my buddy and I went out smashing pumpkins
[05:58] <nixternal> I thought I lost my toes after kicking this one pumpkin
[05:59] <nixternal> I expected it to launch like a football
[05:59] <lnxkde> LOL
[05:59] <nixternal> I might have actually cried that night...I remember it hurt bad
[05:59] <Jucato> what? cementifying a pumpkin is meaner than kicking a poor, defenseless pumpkin smack in the face? :)
[05:59] <lnxkde> that is a trick then that will be pased from generation to generation of pumpkin Smashers
[05:59] <nixternal> heh, and I can't believe they didn't notice the concrete sticking out of the front of the pumpkin..some spilled out and it looked like a tongue
[06:00] <Jucato> roflmao
[06:00] <Jucato> I can only imagine :)
[06:00] <Jucato> pics would be great :D
[06:00] <nixternal> that would have been a great YouTube video though
[06:00] <lnxkde> lol
[06:01] <lnxkde> guys I have to tell you all something I am in love with mac OS X... and I dont know how to get rid of this!!
[06:01] <Jucato> throw it out... that's a sure way :)
[06:01] <Jucato> or give it to me. that will be better
[06:01] <lnxkde> I got no mac...
[06:01] <nixternal> I am glad someone is...I could never get used to it...everytime I would start playing with it, it reminded me a lot like Gnome, the annoying as all hell part that is
[06:02] <lnxkde> I got a pc with Linux/and a Hacked vercion of OS X
[06:02] <Jucato> OS X is sort of like a mix between GNOME and KDE for me...
[06:03] <mhb> lnxkde: start working on it, find out how \\\UTF-8 support goes in Terminal, get frustrated from all the 30-day trials and you'll be back in no time
[06:03] <freeflying> lnxkde: its cracked, not hacked
[06:03] <nixternal> hehe
[06:03] <nixternal> it's crap, not Mac
[06:03] <freeflying> lol
[06:03] <nixternal> got milk?
[06:03] <Jucato> it's... um...
[06:03] <Jucato> hm...
[06:04] <nixternal> I do love Mac hardware though...I think it is gorgeous
[06:04] <lnxkde> if these hackers would come to linux they would be very usefull! they had OSX 10.5 Leopard cracked and working on a normal pc in hrs after the relese
[06:04] <lnxkde> or crackers
[06:04] <lnxkde> LOL
[06:04] <nixternal> and now my buddy is following the tutorial that Christer did and was playing Neverball using the sensors in his macbook tonight in class
[06:04] <nixternal> that was pretty cool
[06:04] <mhb> yeah!
[06:04] <lnxkde> Crackers LMAO
[06:04] <mhb> that is cool
[06:04] <mhb> I tried it yesterday :o)
[06:05] <nixternal> that would be cool to mess with
[06:05] <nixternal> this guy had one of them ginormous Dell XPS laptops at school with Kubuntu on it today
[06:05] <mhb> of course, OS X has some nice features, for example, the computer tells you a knock knock joke if you ask nicely
[06:05] <nixternal> I have to admit, I was envious
[06:05] <nixternal> this thing had lights and all kinds of stuff...it was a case modded laptop, with a HUGE screen running at like 3048302843280342 x 8430280438208432 widescreen
[06:06] <lnxkde> nixternal: you dint tell him u are adeveloper of it... and grabed the laptop and ran?
[06:06] <nixternal> haha, should of told him I need it for testing
[06:06]  * Hobbsee wonders what daily updates there are today
[06:07] <lnxkde> yea or to build the bins for KDE4 ;)
[06:07] <mhb> yeah, you should have used the secret GPL clause which says that software developer can confiscate any computer his software runs at
[06:07] <nixternal> lol
[06:07] <Hobbsee> mmm...sounds like fun
[06:08] <nixternal> oh well, bed time for me....I will chat with ya'll later today
[06:08] <nixternal> g'nite
[06:08] <lnxkde> me too
[06:08] <lnxkde> see ya guys
[06:08] <Hobbsee> night al
[06:08] <Hobbsee> er, you two
[06:09] <lnxkde> good night and God bless
[06:09] <Jucato> nixternal: good night!
[06:09] <Jucato> knight!
[06:10] <mhb> see you
[06:16]  * Hobbsee sees another 2 line update + changelog, and decides to pin that.
[06:18] <Jucato> bah! I'll do the bug triaging session next week :(
[06:18] <Jucato> sorry manchicken
[06:18]  * Hobbsee notes that's one of the really annoying things about kubuntu
[06:18] <Jucato> which one?
[06:19] <Jucato> bugs?
[06:19] <Hobbsee> no, the one change uploads - another 10+ mb each time.
[06:19] <Jucato> aaah
[06:19] <Hobbsee> like, the entire block of binaries, usually
[06:22] <Jucato> gawd I really need to learn to edit myself... my comments are almost as long as my original posts :(
[06:27] <Hobbsee> aptitude to the rescue.
[06:27]  * Jucato plays superman background music
[06:27] <dasKreech> Well
[06:27] <dasKreech> good nigth all
[06:28] <Jucato> knight!
[06:28] <Jucato> :)
[06:28] <imbrandon> ello all
[06:33] <Hobbsee> right.  pinned.
[06:33]  * Hobbsee wonders if anyone here knows much about apt pinning - namely, how to force the aptitude equivalent of =, not F
[06:41] <imbrandon> so whom has downloaded and tested the Debian KDE4 live cd's ?
[06:41] <imbrandon> heh
[06:42] <freeflying> I've test openSuSE's :P
[06:43] <mhb> freeflying: and you survived? Congrats!
[06:44] <mhb> I knew I should have been a stand-up comedian
[06:45] <Hobbsee> do they work?
[06:46] <freeflying> some work
[12:02] <mhb> hi fellers
[12:02] <mhb> hi jjesse
[12:06] <Hobbsee> hiya mhb
[12:06] <jjesse> hiya mhb
[12:06] <jjesse> hello Hobbsee
[12:06] <mhb> hi Hobbsee , what was that comment you had some time ago about not needing to use Kubuntu?
[12:07] <Hobbsee> mhb: the kde apps on ubuntu seem to work OK, excluding twinkle.
[12:07] <Hobbsee> will be interesting to see which gets used more often
[13:35] <manchicken> Jucato: That's cool, I probably won't be able to get around to any more bugs until next week.
[13:36] <Jucato> ah! I join the ranks of the IMAP literate soon :)
[13:37] <Hobbsee> Jucato: that's not hard.
[13:37] <Jucato> I realized that I now have gmail imap :)
[13:38] <Jucato> probably. just scared that I might fsck up or something :/
[13:38] <jjesse> Jucato: i have it as well, but kmail just keeps downloading it over and over again :(
[13:38] <Jucato> time to try mailody perhaps? :D
[13:39] <manchicken> Does anybody know if it's possible to get kontact to emulate outlook when sending invites?
[13:40] <manchicken> Because that would just be so badass.
[13:40] <manchicken> I'm trying to find clever new ways to sync my blackberry, and it works OOTB with Outlook invites.
[13:40] <manchicken> They claim it also works with Thunderbird invites.
[13:40] <ScottK> manchicken: I think so, but I haven't bothered trying in some time.
[13:43] <manchicken> I got Ubuntu w/GNOME running on my newly acquired machine.
[13:43] <manchicken> It's fascinating, but my old employer didn't want their machine back.
[13:43] <manchicken> So I wiped off Vista and decided to try out the GNOME with Edubuntu and Ubuntu.
[13:46] <Hobbsee> manchicken: what do you think of it?
[13:46] <manchicken> I think it's nice.
[13:46] <manchicken> I think there are some pretty wide gaping gaps in functionality though.
[13:47] <manchicken> Particularly related to PIM and WM functionality.
[13:47] <Jucato> noooooo! not you too? :)
[13:47] <manchicken> Jucato: This laptop is staying KDE, and it's my primary machine :)
[13:48] <manchicken> Jucato: I'm far too addicted to kontact and katapult and kwin to go anywhere.
[13:48] <Jucato> well as long as it's *buntu :)
[13:48] <manchicken> And karm is now my chosen software for tracking hours to bill clients.
[13:48] <manchicken> So I'm pretty entrenched in KDE.
[13:48] <Jucato> hehe :)
[13:48] <Jucato> oh well :)
[13:49] <Jucato> freedom of choice
[13:49] <manchicken> My wife really wanted to try out edubuntu though.
[13:49] <manchicken> I kinda already set expectations that my kiddos will not be major consumers of proprietary software.
[13:50] <manchicken> So we'll be pretty big users of edubuntu.
[13:50] <Jucato> just minor consumers :)
[13:50] <manchicken> Or the edubuntu-kde stuff.
[13:50] <manchicken> Jucato: We play console games, so that's all proprietary.
[13:51] <Jucato> :D
[13:52] <Riddell> mhb: about?
[13:52] <mhb> Riddell: sure
[13:52] <Riddell> I believe there's going to be a restricted manager session in 10 minutes
[13:53] <Riddell> will you be listening in?
[13:53] <mhb> hmm, too bad I am at school, cannot get there by voice.
[13:53] <manchicken> mhb: You can get there by spirit.  Go-go Gadget Meth!
[13:54] <mhb> Riddell: sorry about that.
[13:54] <Riddell> mhb: so you can't listen to the icecast?
[13:55] <mhb> this computer here doesn't have a sound card.
[13:55] <mhb> tough for me to listen (and I am at a public place)
[13:55] <mhb> so alas, I cannot.
[13:58] <Jucato> how about gobby?
[13:59] <bddebian> Heya
[13:59] <Jucato> hi bddebian
[13:59] <bddebian> Hi Jucato
[14:00] <Riddell> gobby isn't really a method for discussion
[14:03] <jjesse> for what session?
[14:06] <mhb> jjesse: restricted-manager rewrite
[14:06] <Riddell> which is currently pitti talking to himself :)
[14:09] <mhb> :(
[14:12] <mhb> Riddell: you are there, too?
[14:18] <Riddell> yes
[14:19] <mhb> at least he's not alone in there :o)
[14:27] <jjesse> anyone tried to setup imap and kmail for gmail?  it just keeps downloading and redownloading for me
[14:28]  * nosrednaekim prefers pop3
[14:28]  * manchicken doesn't use gmail with imap.
[14:28] <jjesse> just trying it out as it is "new"
[14:34] <mhb> I can't help you at UDS, but I can do something useful for Kubuntu.
[14:41] <manchicken> mhb: Can you really?  Useful you say?
[14:42] <mhb> manchicken: hehe :o)
[14:42] <mhb> no, I just fool around with designer-qt3
[14:42] <manchicken> Sweet.
[14:43] <n8k99> jjesse i use it
[14:44] <jjesse> n8k99: it just keeps trying to download the smae mail messages
[14:45] <n8k99> yeah- i'm not super pleased with it so far
[14:45] <ScottK> jjesse: IMAP is a notoriously finicky protocol.  Even the guys that write the protocol have trouble getting things consistent and correct.
[14:46] <ScottK> jjesse: Does gmail use IMAP or IMAPS (is it encrypted on the wire)?
[14:49] <mhb> Riddell: do we have any icons for "No effects/Normal effects/Extra effects, can we count on somebody creating a Crystal/Oxygen style of those for us?
[14:49] <jjesse> ScottK: i don't remember, i setup imap and had kmail determine the security on it
[14:50] <ScottK> jjesse: If it's not encrypted, a wireshark extraction of the communication would be very useful for debugging.
[14:50] <jjesse> ScottK: thanks i'll have to take a look at it
[14:50] <Riddell> mhb: doesn't gnome use screenshots?
[14:52] <mhb> Riddell: I cannot see any screenshots on the Desktop Effects tab in the Appearance capplet
[14:52] <Riddell> I could be wrong
[14:53] <n8k99> jjesse: where are you?
[14:53] <jjesse> n8k99: right now in the server room
[14:53] <n8k99> ah
[14:53] <jjesse> well server team room in uds
[14:54]  * n8k99 in hallway, sipping a soda
[15:13] <Lure> Riddell: what is IRC nick of Chris Edwards?
[15:14] <Riddell> Lure: Zelut
[15:14] <nosrednaekim> Lure: hey, what is happening with guidance-power-manager in Hardy? is it being rewritten qt4?
[15:14] <Riddell> Lure: what are you wanting to ask him about?
[15:14] <nosrednaekim> oh is that his real name... ;)
[15:14] <Lure> nosrednaekim: I thought sebas had somebody doing qt4 port
[15:15] <Lure> Riddell: just want to check if power-manager dcop methods for brightness do the right thing on his laptop
[15:15] <nosrednaekim> Lure: ah, ok
[15:17] <sebas> I'm not rewriting it.
[15:17] <sebas> Please read the message on the future of powermanagement I sent to kubuntu-devel some time ago.
[15:18] <sebas> For Hardy, we should probably use the current version (unless kpowersave is being ported)
[15:20] <Riddell> yes, we'll stick with the current one in hardy
[15:20] <nosrednaekim> sebas: ah...ok, I remember seeing that email,I didn't know if there was progress or anything though.. thanks.
[15:21] <mhb> Riddell: http://mhb.ath.cx/kubuntu/desktop-effects-kde.png
[15:22] <Riddell> mhb: bling bling
[15:22] <mhb> Riddell: instead of the Qt logos think the screenshots (I liked the idea)
[15:22] <Riddell> mhb: we should find out if there's a way top test if compiz is likely to work before it is installed
[15:22] <manchicken> Jucato: Bad news, the folks in #ubuntu just showed me the beauty of the Deskbar applet.
[15:23] <mhb> also we should somehow tell the user that this is not Kwin Desktop Effects, but Compiz.
[15:23] <Riddell> I suspect there isn't without copying the startup script from compiz
[15:23] <Jucato> manchicken: I knew you'd like it too :)
[15:23] <mhb> perhaps naming the configuration Compiz Desktop Effects
[15:23] <Riddell> mhb: this is what suse is doing https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=332079#c19
[15:23] <ubotu> Novell bug 332079 in KDE "Cannot select Compiz in KControl" [Normal,Assigned]
[15:23] <Riddell> I'm not actually sure was it is though yet
[15:24] <manchicken> Jucato: Are you on GNOME?
[15:24] <Jucato> nope
[15:24] <Jucato> last time I've tried the deskbar was in Edgy I think. and back then I already loved it :)
[15:24] <mhb> Riddell: so there is a Kcontrol compiz configuration tool?
[15:24] <Riddell> manchicken: port it to a plasmoid!
[15:24] <mhb> Riddell: the people in that bug comments refer to it
[15:25] <Riddell> mhb: no, I think they must have patches to kcontrol's session module
[15:25] <Lure> Riddell: if you see Zelut, ask him to try these dcop calls:
[15:25] <Lure> Riddell: dcop `dcop | grep power-manager` power-manager brightnessUp
[15:25] <Lure> Riddell: dcop `dcop | grep power-manager` power-manager brightnessDown
[15:25] <Riddell> Lure: I'll track him down at lunch
[15:26] <nosrednaekim> Lure: he's over in ubuntu-motu
[15:26] <Lure> Riddell: great, would be good to know if HAL methods work on his hw
[15:26] <manchicken> Riddell: I should.  heh
[15:26] <Lure> nosrednaekim: hi did not respond on my ping in #uds-boston and I have to run
[15:26]  * Lure bbl
[15:26] <nosrednaekim> ah, ok :)
[15:27] <Riddell> Lure: any idea why eject doesn't work on his laptop?
[15:28] <nosrednaekim> mhb: looks good, just a mock-up, right?
[15:33] <mhb> nosrednaekim: well, it's a designer-qt3 product
[15:33] <mhb> nosrednaekim: those can morph into software quite rapidly
[15:33] <Riddell> it just needs to write a settings somewhere
[15:33] <Riddell> then we add a script to compiz-kde which goes in /etc/X11/Xsession.d and sets KDEWM if the compiz setting is true
[15:35] <manchicken> Is it possible to get kontact to send a vcalendar rather than an icalendar?
[15:37] <Riddell> mhb: here's the suse patch http://kubuntu.org/~jriddell/tmp/optional-kwin.diff
[15:38] <Riddell> I think I'd prefer an all new kcontrol module
[15:40] <mhb> Riddell: right-o.
[15:41] <Riddell> it seems to include a way of testing for compiz working, but I'd prefer to use the same one we have in compiz
[15:41] <Riddell> in our compiz that is
[15:46] <mhb> adept batch refuses to work here, is it known?
[15:46] <mhb> QObject::connect: No such signal konsolePart::processExited(const KProcess*)
[15:46] <mhb> this might be the show stopper
[15:50] <mhb> could someone with gutsy check if adept batch works for him?
[15:50] <nosrednaekim> mhb: sure... what should I run?
[15:50] <jjesse> mhb: when i installed mp3 support adept batch worked to install tem
[15:51] <Riddell> mhb: I get that error but it otherwise works fine
[15:52] <mhb> ah, my fault most likely
[15:52] <mhb> although Adept Batch could tell me that the package is already installed
[15:54] <mhb> Riddell: what do you suggest as the least painful way in Python to check if a package (compiz-kde) is installed?
[15:54] <Riddell> mhb: use python-apt
[15:54] <mhb> okay.
[15:54] <Riddell> glatzor can probably point you to some sample code
[15:54] <Riddell> should be pretty simple to do
[16:08] <mhb> http://mhb.ath.cx/kubuntu/desktop-effects-kde.png -- Now With Stock Screenshots!
[16:10] <Riddell> needs borders around them
[16:11] <mhb> indeed, just samples
[16:11] <Jucato> mhb: wow! is that a working app already?
[16:12] <mhb> Jucato: not yet, it just installs the compiz-kde package.
[16:13] <Jucato> oooh but still. nice :)
[16:14] <mhb> Jucato: thanks, I am going to reward myself and get me some food.
[16:14] <mhb> see you later.
[16:14] <mhb> and enjoy the UDS!
[16:14] <mhb> think of those that cannot .o)
[16:46]  * mhb is back from dinner
[16:47] <mhb> Riddell: is glatzor reachable at the moment or is he at UDS, too?
[16:47] <mhb> hmm, answered
[16:47] <mhb> I guess he's away, otherwise he'd respond after mentioning him.
[16:49] <Riddell> he's at UDS
[16:50] <mhb>  /whois told me
[17:12] <glatzor> mhb: hello
[17:12] <glatzor> mhb: RIddell told me that you want to check for the status at startup time of the application
[17:12] <glatzor> mhb: so you should operate on a low level:
[17:12] <glatzor> #!/usr/bin/env python
[17:12] <glatzor> import apt_pkg
[17:12] <glatzor> from apt.progress import OpProgress
[17:12] <glatzor> progress = OpProgress()
[17:12] <glatzor> cache = apt_pkg.GetCache(progress)
[17:13] <glatzor> def is_compiz_installed():
[17:13] <glatzor>     for pkg in cache.Packages:
[17:13] <glatzor>         if pkg.Name == "compiz-kde":
[17:13] <glatzor>             if pkg.CurrentVer is not None:
[17:13] <glatzor>                 return True
[17:13] <glatzor>     return False
[17:13] <glatzor> is_compiz_installed()
[17:14] <mhb> glatzor: thanks!
[18:09] <mhb> Riddell: when I set an "Author" in a LP branch, will that make the author able to commit to the code?
[18:09] <mhb> Riddell: or do I have to change "Registrant" for that?
[18:10] <mhb> hmm, I guess I have to do the latter
[18:11] <mhb> https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-members/guidance/desktop-effects-kde might be a good branch to subscribe for anyone interested
[18:11] <mhb> Riddell: and for you of course :o) ^^
[18:12] <Riddell> mhb: anyone in the team can commit
[18:13] <mhb> Riddell: good, that's what I wished for
[18:14] <mhb> not that I expect suddenly a wave of Kubuntu members polishing the code, but it would be nice to see an open-source spirit in action :o)
[18:15] <mhb> especially because I'm not getting paid for it this time :o)
[18:16] <Riddell> reminds me, I've not had my SoC t-shirt
[18:16] <jpatrick> mhb: to bad my pythons average
[18:17] <mhb> Riddell: they haven't sent them yet
[18:19] <mhb> jpatrick: excuses, excuses :o) my python has been average once too
[18:19] <mhb> jpatrick: or perhaps it still is, who knows ... I keep learning
[18:19] <jpatrick> mhb: nah, my problem is that I prefer ruby.. or something...
[18:21] <mhb> well, time for my evening class, see you ... and when I come back, I want to see 300 commits on the new branch! :o)
[18:21] <mhb> I should clone myself soon
[18:26] <jjesse> mhb: instead of cloning yourself just create a branch in launchpad
[19:03] <jpatrick> anyone know what causes this weird button behaviour? http://img260.imageshack.us/my.php?image=we4ym6.png
[19:06] <ScottK> jpatrick: I suppose you're looking for a more specific answer than compiz.
[19:06] <jpatrick> ScottK: I was talking about the tiny QButtons
[19:07] <ScottK> jpatrick: I don't know actually.  It's just if compiz is running, it's who I tend to blame for anything on the display.
[19:07] <ScottK> It's a rule of thumb that doesn't often go wrong.
[19:07] <jpatrick> I don't have compiz running
[19:07] <ScottK> Darn.  Dunno then.
[20:25] <ScottK> So apparently the biggest obstacle to mass acceptance of Linux on the desktop is not enough KDE: http://www.informationweek.com/shared/printableArticle.jhtml?articleID=202600158
[20:27] <Riddell> flamewar!
[20:28] <ScottK> It is kind of nice Kubuntu was the only KDE distro actually mentioned.
[20:30] <Riddell> they're wrong about suse defaulting to gnome
[20:34] <ScottK> Last I looked it seemed like an even choice between the two on opensuse.
[20:35] <Riddell> it is
[20:35] <Riddell> although three quarters of their users go with KDE
[20:36] <ScottK> If I was willing to use an RPM based distro where the Free version I was using wasn't the company's final product, opensuse is probably what I would use.
[20:38] <Riddell> :)
[20:40] <fdoving> i tried it. it's nice. the only real problem for me is rpm/zypper, and that i don't have the sparetime needed to learn to use it effectively. i feel much more confident with dpkg/apt.
[20:42] <ScottK> Well I tried opensuse 10.1.  It was very shiny and worked well except it completely couldn't be updated due to them doing a complete changeout under the hood of the update technology after the last public beta.
[20:42] <fdoving> their update applet is nice. you can rightclick the notifier thing and make it check for updates etc.
[20:43] <ScottK> That I probably could have gotten over, but the attitude I sensed from their developers were along the lines of, "It's only opensuse, SLES is the one that has to work."
[20:43] <ScottK> That's when I bailed for Kubuntu.
[20:43] <fdoving> yeah, that's annoying.
[20:45] <ScottK> Thus, "the product I use must be what the sponsoring entity thinks of as the final product" is one of my hard and fast distro rules now.
[20:50] <Riddell> ScottK: I take it we're not going to be seeing you again?
[20:50] <ScottK> No.  I'm back home now.  Get me sponsored for the next one and I'll stay the whole time.
[20:51] <fdoving> man, software raids does rock.
[20:52] <fdoving> sata connectors does suck.
[21:01] <buz> jpatrick: i'll test the kryptomedia packages tomorrow if i can find the time at all, will have to look at getting them to buil dfor x86 first
[21:02] <jpatrick> buz: it looks good, and there is a i386 deb now :)
[21:04] <jpatrick> buz: it'll complain about overwriting kdebase (I think) due to the patched source, but I've added that patch to kdebase so I'll fix that later
[21:06] <buz> ok i'll try it
[21:06] <buz> thanks!
[21:07] <buz> gotta get up early tomorrow so i'll go to bed now ;)
[21:07] <buz> night ;)
[21:20] <mhb> jjesse: did you read my previous comments?
[21:20] <mhb> jjesse: if you did, you may have missed the line where I posted the link to the bzr branch :o)
[21:23] <mhb> ScottK: yeah
[21:24] <mhb> ScottK: they actually have a nice page on novell.com which states that SLES/SLED is for "professional" and opensuse for "enthusiasts"
[21:24] <mhb> ScottK: this attitude is the reason I'm with Kubuntu :o)
[21:25] <ScottK> +1
[21:26] <ScottK> My requirements for a distro were: Server and Desktop both with the same internals, KDE, Debian package management system, good Postfix support, resonably regular/current releases, and the free distro must be the final product.
[21:26] <ScottK> That narrowed it down to one.
[21:52] <Lure> Riddell: brightness fix would require change of kdeutils/kmilo (add KGlobalAccel to call pm) and kdebase-bin (ubuntu.xmodmap mapping) - is this too big change to be considered for gutsy-updates?
[21:52] <Riddell> Lure: I think it would take some persuasion
[21:52] <Lure> Riddell: if there is chance to have something like this included, I would prepare proper solution in my ppa, otherwise I would document workaround
[21:53] <Lure> Riddell: good thing is that the fix is obvious
[21:53] <Lure> Riddell: and _StefanS_ had it in the week of RC, just did not work on his Dell (due to kernel/hal issue)
[21:54] <Riddell> Lure: there's a chance yes, it just needs pitti to be persuaded
[21:54] <Riddell> Lure: I thin kit's worth preparing a patch for gutsy and asking him to review
[21:54] <Lure> Riddell: ok, will upload fix to my ppa and hardy
[21:55]  * Lure is bored while kde4 is being rebuild, so have started to do some triage on gutsy top issues
[21:55] <Lure> ;-)
[21:56] <mhb> hooray for Lure
[21:56] <Lure> mhb: this should be fixed before release (if I would have more time at that time)
[21:57] <Lure> mhb: you just ensure that hardy will blink, so that we get Hobbsee back from ubuntu ;-)
[21:58] <mhb> okay, I'll do my best :o)
[21:59] <mhb> personally I think having a compiz possibility in KDE is a Good Thing, because I don't see KWin4 effects being stable ... they don't work at all on my opensource Intel drivers
[22:02] <dasKreech> Use mesa :)
[22:08] <mhb> hi jpatrick , thanks for the commits!
[22:08] <mhb> that was nice of you
[22:08] <jpatrick> mhb: I'm trying...
[22:09] <jpatrick> now, I'm stuck cos I have no idea what to add to it
[22:10] <mhb> jpatrick: it needs to a) be made into a systemsettings module b) the radiobox buttons have to be edited so that they work correctly
[22:10] <jpatrick> yes, I have been thinking about b)
[22:11] <mhb> so clicking the Standard Effects triggers a setEffects("standard") method etc.
[22:11] <jpatrick> ok, I'll see what I can do
[22:12] <mhb> I'll bzr up and do something too .o)
[22:12] <jpatrick> mhb: I think we need any "ok" button...
[22:13] <mhb> do we?
[22:13] <mhb> well if you say so :o)
[22:13] <jpatrick> or do we apply changes automagically?
[22:14] <mhb> we can do both, the way you suggest is more "KDE" I think
[22:14] <mhb> let's go for an apply button
[22:14] <jpatrick> ok :)
[22:14] <mhb> okay, you can tweak on the radiobuttons, I'll do the designering ... or vice-versa?
[22:14] <mhb> whichever you like more
[22:15] <nixternal> they are talking about Ubuntu on our local news
[22:16] <jpatrick> err, I'll look into a) for now, coding anything new from me might be messy
[22:16] <mhb> a) is which one?
[22:16]  * mhb is a bit lost
[22:16] <jpatrick> the module
[22:16] <mhb> hmm, okay
[22:17] <mhb> it'll be a tad complicated
[22:17] <mhb> because you actually have to add-in some Makefile and compile a middle layer
[22:17] <mhb> like other Guidance modules do
[22:18] <mhb> but you can copy it eventually, just check out what userconfig or some other module does
[22:18] <jpatrick> I'll try and tweak the buttons then
[22:18] <mhb> ookay, I'll do this part
[22:21] <jpatrick> brb
[22:27] <jpatrick> mhb: would it be something like this: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/42956/ ?
[22:30] <mhb> a bit like that
[22:30] <mhb> I guess the first argument to the method has to be "self"
[22:30] <mhb> and there's no need for an effectType if you're going to check inside the method
[22:31] <mhb> jpatrick: could you wait with the coding a teeny bit?
[22:31] <jpatrick> mhb: course
[22:32] <Lure> Riddell: is anything wrong with buildfarm? basket is waiting for more than 24h, and only hppa builder are running...
[22:32] <Riddell> Lure: it's full of 10,000 imports from debian
[22:33] <Lure> Riddell: but only hppa is doing something: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+builds
[22:34] <Lure> Riddell: most of them are idling and having party: https://edge.launchpad.net/+builds
[22:34] <Lure> ;-)
[22:34] <jpatrick> you have to let them cool off for a while ;)
[22:34] <Lure> jpatrick: that may be it... ;-)
[22:35] <Lure> good that ppa is on xen ;-)
[22:35] <Lure> mhb: you also have problems with brightness keys (macbook), right?
[22:37] <mhb> jpatrick: please update your branch
[22:37] <mhb> jpatrick: I'm done with the reshuffling
[22:38] <Riddell> hmm, curious
[22:38] <mhb> Lure: I do, the curious and likely helpful thing is that guidance-powermanager can change the brightness correctly, but the keys don't work
[22:38] <Lure> mhb: great, so you will be my first guinea pig ;-)
[22:39] <Lure> mhb: I just uploaded packages with fix to my ppa, so they should be available in couple of hours
[22:41] <imbrandon> Riddell, ping
[22:41] <mhb> Lure: splendid
[22:41] <Riddell> hi imbrandon
[22:41] <mhb> jpatrick: so you can continue on whatever you were doing .o)
[22:42] <Riddell> Lure: eject also doesn't work on his machine
[22:42] <jpatrick> mhb: hmm, how do I update the branch? (bzr checkout don't work)
[22:42] <Riddell> dunno if that's a general problem
[22:42] <imbrandon> heya, any problem with me stright syncing libzip , looks like you did the initial packing but debian -repacked it as -1 exactly the same cept for maintainer rtc
[22:42] <imbrandon> Riddell, ^^
[22:42] <Riddell> imbrandon: go ahead
[22:42] <imbrandon> kk
[22:42] <Lure> mhb: what keycode does "eject" key produce?
[22:43] <Riddell> Lure: he has it mapped to XF86Eject
[22:43] <mhb> 204, by the way - it was magically fixed in KDE 3.5.8
[22:43] <Lure> mhb: really? so it works now?
[22:44] <imbrandon> my eject key works too on my mac usb keyboard
[22:44] <imbrandon> not sure what keyboard your speaking of
[22:45] <Lure> imbrandon: macbook pro
[22:45] <mhb> hey, it doesn't work anymore!
[22:45] <imbrandon> ahh ok, prbably the same
[22:45] <mhb> well I remember it working at some point
[22:46] <imbrandon> whats the app to tell the keycode ?
[22:46] <mhb> xev?
[22:47] <imbrandon> yea 204 here too
[22:47] <imbrandon> so its the same
[22:48] <Lure> mhb: does "eject" command from console work for you
[22:48]  * Lure thinks kmilo just calls "eject"
[22:48] <imbrandon> vol up , dn, and mute work too keys, f13 just does nothing ( as expected )
[22:49] <imbrandon> err f13 - f16 do nothing ( as expected )
[22:49] <mhb> Lure: eject works fine
[22:50] <Lure> imbrandon: brightness has regressed for some laptop as they dropped kernel code in favour of userspace implementation
[22:50] <Lure> imbrandon: and nobody did kubuntu implementation ;-)
[22:50] <imbrandon> ahh well i'm on a noramal PC, i just use my apple keyboard on it :)
[22:50] <imbrandon> normal*
[22:51] <nixternal> wasabi hillbilly!
[22:51] <imbrandon> my iMac's seem to be fine though, when X decides to work
[22:52] <nixternal> iMacs and Volkswagen Beetles, something that should be in the closet of every teenage girl around the world." - my Globalization Professor :)
[22:53] <nixternal> I quoted him wrong as all hell though
[22:53] <nixternal> oh well, you get the idea
[22:54] <mhb> are we going to get simple Flash installation into Konqueror via packages like Firefox has?
[22:54] <dasKreech> nixternal: What was ubuntu doing on the news?
[22:54] <nixternal> gOS and Wal-Mart
[22:54] <nixternal> I am dl'n gOS right now to see what it is about
[22:55] <nixternal> either this is going to flop miserably, or Canonical has been silent as all hell and is backing this adventure
[22:55] <begert> i would be interested to know what its like
[22:56] <Riddell> mhb: we've had simple flash install for ages
[22:56] <nixternal> www.thinkgos.com
[22:57] <mhb> Riddell: well not an interactive one within Konqueror, or had we?
[22:57] <mhb> just an kubuntu-restricted-extras package
[22:57] <mhb> perhaps I am on 64-bit for too long)
[22:57] <Riddell> mhb: sure, it's a qizard in konqueror
[22:58] <mhb> I must test the 32-bit version sometimes :o)
[22:58]  * mhb shuts up then
[23:02] <imbrandon> nixternal, i have 2 of those via computrs ( built myslef ) they are quite nice, and gOS is just ubuntu with E loaded
[23:03] <imbrandon> they are pretty nice
[23:03] <nixternal> ya, and 10 developers and a small community...anyone else watch the shows about wal-mart and mom-and-pop companies?
[23:03] <dasKreech> mhb: I use the live Cd a lot
[23:03] <nixternal> there has to be backing to them, otherwise it will not work
[23:03] <dasKreech> I always install through the wizard
[23:04] <nixternal> plus, Wal-Mart hasn't even sold $1,000 worth of computers in the year 2007 in the Chicago land area
[23:04] <nixternal> we have Frys, Tiger Direct, Micro Center, and more here, no way that Wal-Mart would be successful with a computer line here again
[23:04] <imbrandon> nixternal, really? hell i bought 3k worth here in KC myself
[23:04] <nixternal> they removed all of their computers out of the 3 local stores I just noticed
[23:04] <imbrandon> and we have microcenter etc etc etc too
[23:04] <imbrandon> diffrent market
[23:05] <nixternal> hell, KMart is selling a PC called "The Blue Machine" or something like that
[23:05] <nixternal> it looked like an old packard bell
[23:05] <nixternal> probably had win95 on it :)
[23:05] <nixternal> I will call this now...this machine will not be a hot seller, I do not see it happening
[23:05] <imbrandon> nixternal, cat /proc/cpuinfo http://paste.ubuntu.com/1591/
[23:06] <nixternal> that's fine and dandy, but does your modem at least work :p
[23:06] <nixternal> I have a Via processor for a keychain now because mine died
[23:06] <imbrandon> who still uses a modem? and actualy i dont have a modem in that box
[23:07] <imbrandon> really? via cpu's are sodered on the MB as a combo :)
[23:07] <nixternal> well seeing that less than 60% of all internet users in the US use broadband, that means the other 40% are either still on AOL, or dialing up Verizon nightly for their pr0n
[23:07] <dasKreech> fortnightly
[23:07] <nixternal> heh
[23:07] <nixternal> imbrandon: believe me, I know it was soldered on...it was a pita to get off
[23:08] <imbrandon> nixternal, that dosent mean it cant be successfull , hell look at dells offering, it dosent out sell the windows ones but still "successfull" i'll take you on this one
[23:08] <nixternal> my question is where the hell did I put it...it used to hang up with my other keys, but I don't see it smiling at me
[23:09] <imbrandon> just like the eee laptop
[23:09] <nixternal> I heard they are going to have it with a bigger screen eventually
[23:11] <nixternal> well, if gOS and the Green PC takes off, I will eat my words and put it on YouTube :)
[23:11] <imbrandon> nixternal, if they sell 5000 units thats 5000 more people off MS and on Ubuntu
[23:11] <imbrandon> :P
[23:11] <nixternal> if they sell 5000 units, I will jump off of the sears tower
[23:12] <nixternal> I will cannon ball off of the sears tower
[23:12] <nixternal> hell, even a belly flop :)
[23:12] <imbrandon> honestly i dont care if they put SuSE or Debian on it etc, Linux is Linux as long as it gets to the mainstream THEN ubuntu will "win"
[23:12] <nixternal> no doubt
[23:12] <nixternal> but come on...we are talking a group of 10 people and then Wal-Mart...the math doesn't add up
[23:12] <dasKreech> nixternal: no fair using padding  :-p
[23:12] <nixternal> there has to be corporate backing
[23:13] <imbrandon> nixternal, your talking ~10 people for Kubuntu too, and ? look Kubuntu has millions of installs AND isnt in wallmart
[23:13] <nixternal> I mean Wal-Mart took Lindows off the shelves and put them on the web because they were not selling
[23:14] <nixternal> and Kubuntu has been around for a couple of years, has at least a little bit of corporate backing
[23:14] <nixternal> gOS, go to their website, it isn't ready
[23:14] <imbrandon> nixternal, gos is built on ubuntu so it has the same backing
[23:15] <Riddell> uses enlightenment too which is interesting
[23:15] <imbrandon> plus it has the buzzword "google" :)
[23:15] <begert> plus they only need to support architectures sold at wal-mart
[23:15] <nixternal> OK, so they don't have to do much packaging work...but umm, support? real development? and at least some packaging...documentation...support, oh wait, I said that already
[23:16] <nixternal> imbrandon: that is why I think there is a Google backing...at least fingers point that way
[23:16] <nixternal> and not the middle ones either :)
[23:16] <imbrandon> nixternal, i think your downing it a little tooo soon because it dosent have "buntu" in the name, honestly i think it could really take off
[23:16] <nixternal> no, I could care less what it has in the name
[23:16] <nixternal> hell, PCLOS would have a better chance honestly
[23:16] <imbrandon> nixternal, it was a figure of speach, in other words you havent even had your hands on one yet ;)
[23:17] <nixternal> you don't create an OS today and sell it at Wal-Mart the same week...it is just asking for disaster
[23:17] <imbrandon> btw my little VIA C7 is a work horse ;) I love that thing and its supper quiet
[23:18] <nixternal> the hardware could be god for all that matters, the potential problem is the software
[23:18] <nixternal> don't get me wrong, I am all for Linux in the retail sector
[23:18] <imbrandon> really? ok think about this, is UBUNTU with a bunch of desktop icons to google apps? what is there to maintain ?
[23:18] <nixternal> but this just doesn't smell right to me...
[23:19] <imbrandon> as long as google supports firefox and flash works on x86's they are selling ( it does ) your fine
[23:19]  * nixternal points at Mepis which was based on *buntu, that horse one too, and lets not forget the mandriva guy trying to create his own os
[23:19] <imbrandon> there is no building an os, we did that already
[23:20] <nixternal> although, Mepis isn't that great of an example, because they have a decent backing nowadays
[23:20] <Riddell> they do?
[23:20] <nixternal> imbrandon: no, but there is maintaining one
[23:20] <nixternal> Riddell: actually, here in the US it is pretty big
[23:20] <imbrandon> nixternal, if you actualy look at it, they use us 1000% almost, they just have diffrent icons on the launcher OOTB
[23:21] <imbrandon> there isnt much a single person couldent maintain full time
[23:21] <nixternal> no doubt, but say 5000 people go and purchase this, and start hitting gOS for help...then what?
[23:21] <imbrandon> then they get help i would assume, what about it ?
[23:22] <nixternal> 10 people to help 5000...that is like putting 1 prison guard in a prison
[23:22] <nixternal> it doesn't add up
[23:22] <dasKreech_> nixternal: the mandriva guy?
[23:22] <imbrandon> sides when you sell a platform like this to walmart , they buy the initial pc's from you then sell them, so the company has a cash influxz right now to handle just that
[23:22] <nixternal> ya, the old president of mandriva, create ulteo or something like that
[23:22] <Riddell> nixternal: maybe, but there's no backing as such
[23:23] <nixternal> if Wal-Mart is selling them for $200, then that means they purchased them for under $100 each
[23:23] <dasKreech_> nixternal: ah ok.
[23:23] <nixternal> or, walmart purchased the everex pcs and then they are installing the gOS on them
[23:24] <imbrandon> nixternal, and ? i built my via c7 computer for $65 bux, i'm sure they get a volume discount
[23:24] <imbrandon> that was one of the main reasons i built it , it was 1.5ghz for under 100$
[23:25] <imbrandon> so add a case and such and yea its $90 bux, ok so thay make $10 on each PC net, wallmart buys 20,000 for their 3k stores to sell, thats $10 x 20k initial payment
[23:25] <imbrandon> pretty good for 10 people
[23:26] <nixternal> its all about the math..I would love to see this succeed, but Wal-Mart, being fueled by nothing more than greed, is what scares me about the whole deal
[23:26] <imbrandon> any company is all about the $$, you think dell did this if they dident think there was $$ in it ?
[23:26] <nixternal> Before you purchase this product you will want to be aware that it has a Linux OS. This means most (If not all) Windows products, Games and programs WILL NOT RUN without you adding the appropriate plugins. Unless you are already familiar with Linux, you may want to look at the Windows units.
[23:27] <nixternal> ya, that is how serious walmart is about it
[23:27] <dasKreech_> You think canonical doesn't think about the money?
[23:27] <nixternal> see, that right there just goes to show you, this will not last
[23:27] <imbrandon> dell has the same disclaimers, umm and you were all for that
[23:27] <nixternal> Wal-Mart is warning you to purchase Windows, and lets see, 99.9% of the people who walk into Wal-Mart, if they have ever touched a computer, it was more than likely Windows
[23:27] <imbrandon> i dont see where you stand nixternal
[23:28] <dasKreech_> he stands against walmart :)
[23:28] <nixternal> I stand for Linux making it in retail, I think it is great, but it isn't great when the potential for backfire and failure outweighs everything else
[23:28] <imbrandon> clearly, but againsta  product just because walmart sells it?
[23:28] <nixternal> and yes, I stand against Wal-Mart
[23:28] <nixternal> I could care less if Jesus stood out on the corner and sold it
[23:29] <imbrandon> nixternal, there is potential for backfire in everything , look at System76, hell they only sell online and do just fine
[23:29] <dasKreech_> nixternal: couldn't
[23:29] <nixternal> the potential for failure is there, glaring right in your face...granted I believe in risk, but I wouldn't carry a very well known trademarked name into a risk with me, unless I knew the outcome would be well
[23:29] <imbrandon> what you as a linux advocate should be saying though is not "this sucks i wont help it" is "how can i make this NOT backfire"
[23:29] <nixternal> imbrandon: and Wal-Mart even has posted:
[23:30] <nixternal> Recommends this product? No
[23:30] <nixternal> I am glad that copy/paste crashes konqi :)
[23:30] <nixternal> took me a while to get that
[23:30] <imbrandon> nixternal, and you think dells disclaimers are better ?
[23:30] <nixternal> no, but when it comes to computers, who do you trust more, Dell or Wal-Mart?
[23:31] <imbrandon> both are exactly on the same level ground to me as a company
[23:31] <imbrandon> they are both about the $$
[23:31] <imbrandon> and both trying something new
[23:31] <nixternal> yes, but at least Dell knows where the power button is
[23:31] <imbrandon> nixternal, walmart dosent even support its windows PC's
[23:31] <imbrandon> so thta dosent matter
[23:31] <nixternal> well, neither of them tried something new...Dell always sold Linux, just not as public, and Wal-Mart already flopped Linux once with Lindows and Linspire
[23:32] <imbrandon> ugh, your against it i can see that, but just do me one favor and stand back and look why your really against it , thats all i'm asking
[23:32] <imbrandon> brb
[23:33] <nixternal> heh, I am not against it, I am all for it, but when it flops, don't say I didn't tell you so
[23:33] <nixternal> and just so you know, Wal-Mart does provide up to 3 years support on their PCs
[23:33] <nixternal> their service center for Chicago sits right off of the Elgin O'Hare Expressway right up the road
[23:34] <imbrandon> nixternal, i have bought many pc's at walmart, and their "support" is replace / exchange, not what you are thinking
[23:34] <nixternal> not here it isn't...you can actually get a support contract...they share space with what used to be the Circuit City tech center
[23:35] <imbrandon> honestly i really would be more worried that MS gave africa 17000 free OS liceses so mandriva wouldent be installed, instead of weather Walmart can support what its selling
[23:35] <nixternal> http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=4100407
[23:36]  * seele waves to sebas_ 
[23:36] <nixternal> they don't offer 1 year anymore, but they have the 2 and 3 year service plans
[23:36] <imbrandon> heya seele and sebas_
[23:36] <nixternal> imbrandon: no need to be worried about MS and Africa, it has already happened, so I am going to do wage a Proprietary Jihad on them, I am trying to load up on enough cherry bombs right now :p
[23:37] <Lure> Riddell: maybe we should add this to DialupSupport: http://www.kde-apps.org/content/show.php/UbuDSL?content=64905
[23:38] <imbrandon> nixternal, and that "recomends: no" was from a customer not walmart that you quoted :)
[23:38] <nixternal> ya, I just noticed that about 2 seconds before you said that
[23:38] <nixternal> odd how there are already customer reviews it still has a month before it comes out
[23:39] <imbrandon>  	
[23:39] <imbrandon> Availability:
[23:39] <imbrandon>     *
[23:39] <imbrandon>       • Online - IN STOCK
[23:39] <imbrandon> ?? a month ?
[23:39] <nixternal> imbrandon: it can't be in stock...gOS hasn't even released their OS yet
[23:39] <nixternal> they have a rather broken download for developers to check out right now
[23:40] <imbrandon> http://thegreencompany.servdns.com/thinkgos.com/files/gos-live-1.0_386.iso
[23:40] <nixternal> ya, and it is a mess..I am looking at it
[23:40] <nixternal> it is a DVD
[23:41]  * nixternal thinks that thinkgos.com is feeling the effects of /. and digg
[23:46] <imbrandon> Riddell, did you see the Debian Live team released a KDE4 live cd ?
[23:47] <imbrandon> http://pkg-kde.alioth.debian.org/kde4livecd.html
[23:47] <coreymon77> imbrandon: wow, now you can crash your computer with a livecd too
[23:47] <imbrandon> coreymon77, lol
[23:51] <nixternal> hrmm, I never knew that Wal-Mart and SuSE partnered up and sold Linux PCs
[23:52] <nixternal> damn, Mandrake too
[23:54] <nixternal> imbrandon: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21564221/  <-- MSNBC's coverage of the Wal-Mart Linux deal - interesting read actually
[23:55] <dasKreech> imbrandon: what's that about free OS licenses?
[23:56] <imbrandon> dasKreech, huh ?
[23:56] <imbrandon> oh the africa thing?
[23:56] <nixternal> http://tinyurl.com/yqvltt
[23:56] <nixternal> tell me, does that not look funny to you? that is what you get when you search "Linux" on MSNBC.com
[23:56] <dasKreech> yeah
[23:56] <dasKreech> I know that mandriva wrote an open letter
[23:57] <nixternal> is it me, or does every topic start with Microsoft :)
[23:57] <dasKreech> nixternal: Nope
[23:57] <dasKreech> http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5594729/
[23:57] <dasKreech> that doesnt
[23:58] <nixternal> heh
[23:58] <imbrandon> dasKreech, http://blog.mandriva.com/2007/10/31/an-open-letter-to-steve-ballmer/
[23:58] <dasKreech> Yeah I saw that
[23:58] <nixternal> I was reading the msnbc.com article on Wal-Mart and gOS earlier today, and I wanted to post a quote out of it, so I went to my history, and then clicked onthe link, and boom, the article is no longer there