[00:00] <lamalex> want to contribute in a more concrete way
[00:00] <lamalex> and learn more about it in general
[00:00] <lamalex> figure it's a good way to get involved
[00:01] <Fujitsu> We can always do with more people :)
[00:05] <lamalex> that's what I hear
[00:06] <somerville32> :)
[00:09] <Kmos> !info cvxopt
[00:09] <ubotu> Package cvxopt does not exist in gutsy
[00:10] <Kmos> !info cvxopt
[00:10] <Kmos> !info cvxopt hardy
[00:10] <ubotu> Package cvxopt does not exist in hardy
[00:10] <Kmos> lol
[00:10] <sahil> are debbootstrap and ubuntu-server pretty much the same thing?
[00:11] <crimsun_> semantically, no
[00:13] <minghua> crimsun_: I believe they are pragmatically quite different as well?
[00:13] <crimsun_> minghua: I agree
[00:18] <geser> !info python-cvxopt
[00:18] <ubotu> python-cvxopt: python package for convex optimization. In component universe, is optional. Version 0.9-0ubuntu1 (gutsy), package size 1696 kB, installed size 3816 kB
[00:18] <geser> Kmos: ubutu works on binary packages not source packages
[00:20] <Kmos> :)
[00:20] <Kmos> i think that package can be synced.. but not sure
[00:22] <geser> Kmos: it can be synced once dsdp got synced and passed NEW
[00:23] <sahil> if im trying to make a gentoo-install as close to a ubuntu-desktop install what would be a good starting point?
[00:23] <Kmos> geser: ah nice =)
[00:24] <Fujitsu> sahil: Let's see... grab Ubuntu CD, select Gentoo partition, install :P
[00:24] <crimsun_> look at the dependencies of the ubuntu-desktop, ubuntu-standard, and ubuntu-minimal packages
[00:25] <crimsun_> as for the Ubuntu customizations, you'll need to extract them from the affected Ubuntu source packages
[00:25] <gnomefreak> can someone give me a hint on how to read a .rej file from a patch? the top section gives the - lines and bottom gives the + lines
[00:25] <gnomefreak> does that mean that hunk is not needed
[00:25] <gnomefreak> the lines are same as in patch itself
[00:26] <Fujitsu> gnomefreak: It means that hunk didn't match the file you're trying to patch.
[00:26] <gnomefreak> ah yes line numbers are wrong it looks like
[00:27] <gnomefreak> patch = http://pastebin.mozilla.org/232780 patch.rej = http://pastebin.mozilla.org/232779
[00:27] <gnomefreak> if i run autoconf2.13 like i should do the patch becomes empty
[00:28] <gnomefreak> not sure how to determine if its safe to remove patch (all signs point to yes) but i would like a confirm from another person before i do
[00:29] <geser> gnomefreak: patch.rej: the lines in the first part should get removed, the lines in the second part should get added
[00:29] <gnomefreak> the - lines get removed and the + lines get added
[00:29] <gnomefreak> just those lines though
[00:30] <geser> you get a .rej file when a chunk couldn't get applied for whatever reason
[00:30] <sahil> crimsun: with regards to the configurations for individual packages is there a way to procure just that?
[00:30] <gnomefreak> that is how the patch is done
[00:30] <gnomefreak> the top part are - in patcha nd bottom is + in patch
[00:30] <geser> either the changes aren't needed anymore or the context has slightly changed and patch couldn't apply it
[00:33] <geser> gnomefreak: a .rej file looks similar to what you get if you forget the -u switch when calling diff
[00:33] <gnomefreak> i didnt call diff
[00:33] <gnomefreak> i used quilt push -f to get a rej file
[00:34] <geser> gnomefreak: not here, but you already used diff in the past?
[00:34] <gnomefreak> yes
[00:34] <gnomefreak> see what im not getting is the same changes are in rej that are in patch but diff. line numbers
[00:35] <gnomefreak> so do i re-patch it using right line numbers?
[00:35] <gnomefreak> there has to be an easy way to do that other than making new patch
[00:35] <gnomefreak> autoconf2.13 emptys the patch
[00:35] <gnomefreak> thats not helpfull
[00:36] <Konam> hey
[00:36] <geser> the numbers have a different meaning in the patch and the .rej file
[00:36] <Konam> the firestarter packaged in the ubuntu repositories is crashing on me
[00:37] <Konam> and it doesn't initiate at startup, it "fails"
[00:37] <gnomefreak> geser: so the numbers being diff can mean nothing (they still might be right line numbers?) that the rej still tells me nothing helpfull
[00:37] <geser> gnomefreak: in the patch it mentions how many lines the next chunk affects (before and after) while in the .rej it mentions first and last line number
[00:37] <gnomefreak> Konam: file bug?
[00:38] <Konam> oh, I'll do it but I tought this was a motu thing or something
[00:38] <geser> gnomefreak: can you also paste-bin the affected file (install.rdf)?
[00:39] <gnomefreak> geser:  yeah give me a minute
[00:41] <gnomefreak> geser: a couple of minutes please since i ran autoconf it changed so give me a few to reverse that
[00:45] <gnomefreak> and yes i know that made no sense
[00:45] <gnomefreak> i thought about it after i typed it
[00:46] <gnomefreak> geser: http://pastebin.mozilla.org/232815 thats the file you asked for
[00:47] <gnomefreak> that looks like a generic file
[00:48] <gnomefreak> i dont see  <em:updateURL>http://www.mozilla.org/projects/calendar/lightning/@TARGET_PLATFORM@/update.rdf</em:updateURL>
[00:50] <gnomefreak> the homepageURL link doesnt work either
[00:51] <geser> looks like you need to redo the whole patch as the file has changed much
[00:52] <gnomefreak> thats what i was thinking after comparing them to orig install.rdf file
[00:52] <gnomefreak> ok ty ill re learn quilt and do it this weekend
[00:53] <geser> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/School/PatchingSources has an usage example for quilt
[00:54] <geser> remove the old patch (or move it away) and add a new patch with quilt and apply the changes from the old patch by hand
[00:55] <bddebian> Heya gang
[00:55] <bddebian> Hi geser
[00:55] <geser> Hi bddebian
[00:56] <YokoZar> ScottK: You still in Boston?
[00:56] <geser> time to move to bed (it's nearly 2 am again)
[00:56] <geser> night all
[00:56] <Fujitsu> Night geser.
[00:56] <Fujitsu> YokoZar: He left a couple of days ago.
[00:57] <bddebian> Gnight geser
[01:01] <Hammerhead> Hi I was wondering how I would go about offering a addition to the firehol package init.d script? The try option is not available. What is the process for submission?
[01:02] <bddebian> Create a patch and submit a bug on Launchpad
[01:03] <Hammerhead> ok thanks
[01:04] <bddebian> No, thank you. :-)
[01:51] <imbrandon> pwnguin, ready for some Indiana goodness ? http://opensolaris.org/os/project/indiana/resources/getit/
[01:53] <imbrandon> now is when i wished i had a extra x86 laying arround
[02:40] <zul> imbrandon: heathen i cast thee out
[02:42] <imbrandon> zul would i get my geek points back if i tell you i'm wiring my NES controler to my parallel port ?
[02:43] <zul> imbrandon: perhaps...bonus points for having no life too ;)
[02:46] <pwnguin> psh. these days the cool nerds are using wiimotes as NES controllers :P
[02:47] <imbrandon> bah
[02:55] <noolness> imbrandon: no geek points for you, because your computer has a parallel port ;)
[02:57] <pwnguin> what if you buy a new computer but make a point of ensuring it has parallel and serial?
[02:59] <pwnguin> hmm. an interesting problem. normally when i work with upstreams, they'll say something along the lines of "this patch is a workaround for someone elses problem, i refuse to accept it"
[03:00] <pwnguin> today I got a response of "not enough distros provide what I'd need, so I won't be fixing this"
[03:00] <Fujitsu> pwnguin: From who, and which problem?
[03:01] <noolness> sounds pretty messed up
[03:01] <pwnguin> well, he's got a point
[03:01] <pwnguin> i suggested changing the font
[03:02] <pwnguin> launchpad bug 159396
[03:02] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 159396 in apt-file "apt-file can't find Contents on /cdrom" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/159396
[03:02] <pwnguin> err
[03:02] <pwnguin> bug #159365
[03:02] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 159365 in cellwriter "Training font misleading" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/159365
[03:03] <noolness> misleading?
[03:03] <pwnguin> "Changing the font is very easy, but without a suitable replacement already installed on most Linux systems there's nothing I can do."
[03:04] <noolness> this is for what program?
[03:04] <noolness> why not just add the font?
[03:04] <noolness> instead of being annoying ;)
[03:04] <pwnguin> in part because the font doesnt exist yet
[03:05] <noolness> oh in that case it does make sense
[03:05] <pwnguin> you know of any good handwritten fonts that wont land the package in multiverse?
[03:05] <imbrandon> i could make one hehe
[03:06] <pwnguin> imbrandon: im after legible, not "handrwrity"
[03:06] <imbrandon> nah i know nothing about fonts
[03:07] <noolness> open up fontforge and make one ;)
[03:07] <noolness> although you have to make it unicode and support every single character correct? (chinese and so on right?)
[03:08] <pwnguin> no font does that
[03:09] <noolness> you know if you render a font to a bitmap it is no longer protected by copyright law
[03:09] <pwnguin> afaik, fonts cover parts of the unicode spectrum
[03:09] <pwnguin> noolness: that sounds like shennanigans to me
[03:09] <noolness> so render a good handwritten type phone at a relatively high resolution then trace it
[03:09] <noolness> inside of font forge
[03:10] <ScottK> YokoZar: No, I'm back home.
[03:10] <pwnguin> wow. fontforge is like a step back to 1994
[03:11] <noolness> there is a better program for making fonts? i don't make fonts, i just know you can make them in there ;)
[03:11] <pwnguin> there has to be
[03:11] <pwnguin> whether its packaged / free software i donno
[03:11] <noolness> come on, there this is linux
[03:12] <noolness> ah yeah there are probably programs that cost 2k that are better
[03:13] <noolness> actually i just opened it
[03:13] <noolness> it's really ugly, but it seems to be very full featured and usable
[03:14] <noolness> it just doesn't have a fancy pants gnome interface....it has a much faster drawn interface instead ;)
[03:14] <pwnguin> anyways, if i take the make it yourself approach, i'll probably look for some better tools
[05:12]  * imbrandon yawns
[05:12]  * persia provides pink pep pills
[05:59] <cbx33> hi guys....does anyone know if the python-dbus package contains bindings for the Auth features of dbus?
[06:14] <pwnguin> huh, if wikipeda is to be believed, fonts may not be copyrightable in some senses
[06:44] <highvoltage> pwnguin: ooh
[06:47] <imbrandon> some senses being a member of the pirate party ?
[06:48] <nxvl> is there any convention on debian/install
[06:48] <nxvl> or is just another file under debian/
[06:48] <nxvl> ?
[06:50] <persia> nxvl: Could you rephrase?  I think there is an answer, but I'm not sure of the question.
[06:51] <highvoltage> debhelper uses it to determine which files should go into the deb, right?
[06:52] <persia> highvoltage: Yes, if dh_install is called in debian/rules without arguments that indicate otherwise.
[06:52] <nxvl> persia: Lior kaplan has just write me again about the efax-gtk package, i write him some days ago when i was doing the merge and to warn him about the LP bug #108746
[06:52] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 108746 in efax-gtk "no icon in kde menu" [Wishlist,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/108746
[06:52] <nxvl> now he has write me back asking me to post my patch on BTS
[06:53] <nxvl> but i'm not sure if he wants the complete debdiff or just the patch on #108746):
[06:55] <persia> nxvl: That's great news.  Generally Debian maintainers prefer separated patches for specific issues, specifically excluding any changes to the changelog.
[06:55] <nxvl> persia: so i need to add only huats patch
[06:57] <persia> Looking at your debdiff, and the bug comments, I'm not sure exactly what to send.  The dpatch is an attractive target, but the maintainer doesn't use dpatch, so that wouldn't include any hooks to actually install the fixes.
[06:58] <nxvl> persia: on the one i merge
[06:58] <nxvl> it's all with dpatch
[06:58] <persia> nxvl: Debian is using dpatch now?
[06:58] <nxvl> and as i've discuss with him he will use dpatch as i ask him to do :D
[06:59] <persia> nxvl: In that case, yes, just open a bug in the BTS, attach the dpatch, and add a Debian task to bug #108746 to track the new Debian bug.
[06:59] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 108746 in efax-gtk "no icon in kde menu" [Wishlist,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/108746
[07:00] <nxvl> whats that adding a debian task to a bug
[07:01] <nxvl> that must be done on LP or in BTS?
[07:01] <persia> nxvl: Once the bug is registered with the BTS, visit the bug in LP, and use the "Also Affects distribution" action to input the BTS URL.
[07:03]  * Hobbsee waves
[07:03] <persia> Hi Hobbsee
[07:03] <Hobbsee> sky fallen in?
[07:04] <persia> Hobbsee: Not yet.  At least 14 hours to go :)
[07:04] <nxvl> i don't understand BTS, do i need to report the bugs sending an e-mail?
[07:04] <nxvl> Hobbsee: hi
[07:04] <Fujitsu> nxvl: All operations are conducted using an email interface, yes.
[07:04] <persia> nxvl: Yes.  See http://www.debian.org/Bugs/Reporting
[07:05] <nxvl> Fujitsu: finally i found you
[07:05] <Hobbsee> persia: woot!
[07:05] <Hobbsee> hi nxvl
[07:05] <persia> Fujitsu: Well, there are other ways to poke the BTS, but they aren't as easy.
[07:05] <Hobbsee> Fujitsu: heh, good forums post
[07:05] <nxvl> Fujitsu: i was looking for you about mozilla-mplayer
[07:05] <nxvl> Fujitsu: i'm patching a bug and i need to know if you want to add other bug fixes
[07:05]  * persia wants a URL to a "good forums post" in suspended disbelief
[07:06] <Hobbsee> persia: oh, just telling them that they're silly to be running hardy yet, shoudl expect breakage, etc
[07:06]  * nxvl wonders if he has talk to asap and its looking for Fujitsu or it's the oposite?
[07:06] <persia> Ah.  Yes.  Hardy was stable last weekend, but is likely to be completely broken by now :)
[07:07] <nxvl> persia: can i install hardy and use it?
[07:07] <persia> nxvl: That's an interesting question, to which even the principals may not have an answer
[07:07] <persia> nxvl: Yes, but it's unlikely to do what you want unless you like finding bugs (and there's no point filing the majority of them at this point either) :)
[07:08] <persia> nxvl: On the other hand, if you'd like to keep working on bug patches and using IRC, I'd recommend sticking with gutsy, at least until DIF, and likely until FF, unless you're really confident about fixing your system when it breaks (no "if" involved)
[07:08] <nxvl> i need to spleep
[07:08] <Hobbsee> persia: it's not *that* broken, though.
[07:09] <Hobbsee> although it thinks that i'm trying to do a partial upgrade from hardy --> gutsy
[07:09] <Hobbsee> which is weird.
[07:09] <persia> Hobbsee: We're not at DIF yet, and it's still UDS, so nobody is doing NBS.  Just wait another week :)
[07:09] <Hobbsee> and i'm avoiding the X stuff
[07:09] <Hobbsee> persia: no point doing NBS yet anyway - may as well do all the merges first.
[07:09] <nxvl> persia: i will not change until it's usable, i was only kind of curious about
[07:10]  * Hobbsee is eyeballing all changelogs of all updates, though :P
[07:10] <persia> Hobbsee: Well, I sometimes do NBS when syncs have pulled in a partial transition, and it's breaking one of my merge builds, but otherwise I agree.
[07:10] <Hobbsee> ah, true
[07:11]  * persia also plans to do some NBS in response to siretart's recent request
[07:11] <nxvl> i need to have some sleep
[07:11] <nxvl> i hate to be so workaholic
[07:12] <persia> nxvl: Sleep well.  Come back tomorrow :)
[07:12] <nxvl> persia: heh, i'm at work
[07:12] <nxvl> persia: i need to prepare a machine to start my lab tomorrow
[07:12] <persia> nxvl: At this time of day?  Are you not in Peru?  Isn't that not a normal time to be at work?
[07:12] <Hobbsee> yay, suspend fixes!
[07:13] <nxvl> persia: its 2:13 am here
[07:13] <persia> Hobbsee: When do we get to start fixing things again?
[07:13] <Hobbsee> persia: for hardy?
[07:13] <Hobbsee> persia: a week ago?
[07:13] <Hobbsee> persia: hardy's been open for a while
[07:13] <Hobbsee> i think things have actually built, up to X, or so
[07:13] <Hobbsee> at least, that was last night
[07:13] <nxvl> and today is not a working day
[07:13]  * persia was responding to "suspend fixes"
[07:13] <nxvl> well
[07:13] <nxvl> i'm going home
[07:14] <Hobbsee> persia: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-intel/+bug/133118
[07:14] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 133118 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "very corrupt X after suspend/resume" [High,Fix released]
[07:14] <nxvl> i will finish this tomorrow
[07:14] <Hobbsee> i've not seem the bug in question, as i dont suspend much
[07:14] <Fujitsu> nxvl: Ah, hi. Sorry, been studying most of the time lately.
[07:14] <Fujitsu> nxvl: I've got no changes I want to make at the moment, and I've dealt with the plugin very little. Do with it what you wish.
[07:14] <persia> Hobbsee: Yes.  Apparently my sense of humor late on a friday afternoon when attempting to avoid establishing paradigms for market segmentation doesn't translate well.  Sorry for the confusion.
[07:15] <nxvl> Fujitsu: ok, thnx
[07:15] <nxvl> k
[07:15] <nxvl> see you in about 7 hours
[07:15] <nxvl> :S
[07:15] <Hobbsee> persia: i think i'm still a little hazy.  dont worry :)
[07:15] <nxvl> bye
[07:16] <Fujitsu> AFAIK this laptop is up to date to a few hours ago, with nothing held back, which is good.
[07:18] <persia> Fujitsu: And that's after the full sync built?  Nice!
[07:18] <Fujitsu> Oh, I see, xorg-xserver just broke video driver ABI.
[07:19] <Fujitsu> (I just updated my mirror, and now it wants to kill off everything X-ish)
[07:19] <Fujitsu> SO that's what everyone is complaining about.
[07:20] <warp10> Hi all
[07:21] <Fujitsu> Hi warp10.
[07:22] <Hobbsee> Fujitsu: yeah, looks like it.
[07:22] <Hobbsee> Fujitsu: i suspect everything else needs to build on the new xorg-server, though
[07:22]  * persia thinks X may well be the first NBS processed, or we'll have a heap of FTBFS in the queue :)
[07:30] <Hobbsee> persia: huh?
[07:32] <persia> Hobbsee: Lots of things build-dep on X, no?  If we change the ABI, don't we need to rebuild that to avoid dependency-wait for clients?
[07:32] <Hobbsee> persia: er, various parts of it, yes.
[07:32] <Hobbsee> persia: i think most of it will be synced from debian - they tend ot push it together
[07:32] <Hobbsee> i dont think new people are silly enough to attempt to do X merges, while the entire X stack is being merged at the same time.
[07:33] <Hobbsee> and i think the regulars know better
[07:33] <Hobbsee> the newer people (who would stick patches on u-u-s) would fall over at the dependancy names and such of X, as it's quite confusing.
[07:33] <persia> Hobbsee: I expect the entire NBS transition to be done by the shared efforts of the Debian and Ubuntu X maintainers, I just think it will be first.
[07:34] <Hobbsee> persia: NBS had blown up prior to X transition anyway :)
[07:34]  * persia looks
[07:34] <Hobbsee> i think StevenK may have already done some work on it earlier.
[07:37] <persia> Hobbsee: Quite possibly.  I only see six items needing real work at this point.
[07:38] <Hobbsee> heh :)
[07:38]  * Hobbsee advocates merging.
[07:38] <persia> ("real" == "high volume of coordinated work")
[07:38] <Hobbsee> done that sru for gnome-hearts yet, or you're still testing?
[07:38] <Hobbsee> ah, yes
[07:38] <persia> Hobbsee: Haven't even looked at it: I need to clear my plate of past commitments before chasing new ones :)
[07:39] <Hobbsee> fair enough
[07:39] <Hobbsee> pkern: were you doing to deal with dhelp?
[07:45] <Hobbsee> persia: interesting.  these are the bugs in universe with the greatest number of dupes.  http://people.ubuntu.com/~brian/tmp/gt2dups-universe.html
[07:45] <Fujitsu> Can I guess the first one?
[07:46] <Fujitsu> It wouldn't be gaphor, would it?
[07:46] <Hobbsee> yes
[07:46]  * persia seems to be assigned to the bug on the top of the list, and really promises to try to clear the plate of past committments
[07:46] <Fujitsu> Hahaha.
[07:46] <Hobbsee> i dont recall that being what i asked for, but it's still interesting.
[07:46] <persia> Hobbsee: In good news, I do have a working gaphas locally now: I just have to find one of the myriad upstream versions of gaphor that works with it...
[07:46] <Hobbsee> yay!
[07:47] <Fujitsu> Hobbsee: What did you ask for?
[07:47] <persia> Hobbsee: Oh.  From a collection of links perspective?  Thanks!  That's a good source.  Let's try to get all of them assigned, and poke people until they get done.
[07:48]  * persia encourages Fujitse to look at bug 87602 :)
[07:48] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 87602 in lastfm "[apport] lastfm crashed with SIGSEGV in audioCallback()" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/87602
[07:48] <Hobbsee> persia: that wont be rerun, unless it's useful
[07:48] <Hobbsee> Fujitsu: i asked for a list of packages in universe that had the most bugs.
[07:48] <Fujitsu> Hobbsee: Ah.
[07:48] <persia> Hobbsee: Ah.  Yes.  4783 seconds isn't quick.
[07:49] <Fujitsu> 1.5 hours.. LP is efficient!
[07:50] <Fujitsu> Hobbsee: I could probably modify one of my scraping scripts to get a list from ~ubuntu-bugs/+packagereports and sort it, like I do with ~motuscience now. But then we'd need to filter by component..
[07:50] <persia> Hobbsee: I'll take a deeper look at that tonight: it may be worth running weekly or so, just to make sure we get them assigned to people who might actually fix them.
[07:50] <Hobbsee> Fujitsu: it's from bughelper
[07:51] <Fujitsu> Hobbsee: Ah, that would explain the ridiculous slowness.
[07:51] <Hobbsee> Fujitsu: and when from running it in teh DC, it's not too bad
[07:52] <Fujitsu> Oh, ~ubuntu-bugs doesn't have a list of packages it is contact for. Fun.
[07:52] <Hobbsee> bug #83127
[07:52] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 83127 in supertuxkart ".desktop file missing" [Low,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/83127
[07:52] <Hobbsee> debian bug 406873)
[07:52] <ubotu> Debian bug 406873 in supertuxkart "File for application menu entry (.desktop file) missing" [Normal,Fixed] http://bugs.debian.org/406873
[07:52] <Hobbsee> debian bug 406873
[07:53] <Fujitsu> Hobbsee: What about them?
[07:53] <persia> Hobbsee: If you just want bug URLs, is not #ubuntu-bugs a better channel?
[07:54] <Fujitsu> Hobbsee: Also note that the Debian bug is linked, so you can click on it on the bug page.
[07:55] <Hobbsee> persia: true
[07:55] <Hobbsee> Fujitsu: sorry
[07:55] <Hobbsee> persia: oh desktop file master...
[07:55] <persia> Hobbsee: Yes?
[07:55] <Hobbsee> persia: do i need to include "TryExec=/usr/games/supertuxkart" in the desktop file?
[07:56]  * persia hunts context, as the answer depends on the exception handling system in place in the package
[07:56] <Hobbsee> it seems that's the only part debian hastn taken.
[07:56] <Hobbsee> persia: supertuxkart, i'll copy the dsektop file
[07:56] <Hobbsee> persia: http://wedontsleep.org/~sarah/supertuxkart.desktop
[07:56] <Fujitsu> Isn't that only used if there's an additional binary that's required for it to run?
[07:57] <Hobbsee> persia: if that's not needed, we can sync it.
[07:57] <persia> Fujitsu: It can also be used when there is a nice GUI handler explaining why it won't run (a nice feature for GL games), or perhaps one .desktop file for both the GL and non-GL versions.
[07:58] <persia> Hobbsee: Right.  Look at Luca's patch.  That's an upstream change, not ours.
[07:58]  * persia grumbles that merges should research package history rather than blindly trusting the parental bots
[07:58] <Hobbsee> persia: ah, good.
[07:58] <persia> s/merges/mergers/
[07:58] <Hobbsee> yeah, well
[07:58] <persia> Hobbsee: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/6988972/supertuxkart_0.2-1ubuntu1.debdiff
[07:58] <Hobbsee> i didnt check luca's patch itself.
[07:59] <persia> Hobbsee: I'm not in favor of bothering the last person to work on the package, but that only works if one tries to understand what the last person was doing, and why.  Otherwise we get accidental cruft.
[08:00] <Hobbsee> true
[08:00]  * Hobbsee files the sync request.
[08:01]  * Hobbsee tries on the machine that actually *has* her gpg keys on it
[08:01] <elmargol> Is there a way to pay a ubuntu developer to fix a bug i have?
[08:02] <persia> elmargol: There are support arrangements for packages in main.  Some MOTUs can be bribed for packages in universe.
[08:02] <pkern> Hobbsee: I'm currently MIA because I don't have a sensible Ubuntu box. I will return in two weeks, I'd guess.
[08:02] <Hobbsee> use online banking?  offer a bounty?
[08:02] <Hobbsee> pkern: fair enough. consider it left for you, anyway
[08:02] <pkern> Hobbsee: Laptop is about to be sent to repair today.
[08:02] <Hobbsee> pkern: ouch
[08:02] <pkern> Hobbsee: Assign it to me if there's a bug open.
[08:03] <Hobbsee> no bug open yet
[08:03] <Hobbsee> it's just listed on mom
[08:03]  * Hobbsee --> dinner
[08:03] <pkern> Ok.
[08:19] <sebastian^> good morning folks :)!
[08:20] <persia> Good evening sebastian^
[08:24] <sebastian^> good evening ... oh yeah, on some places on earth we don't have german time ;)
[08:30] <pkern> sebastian^: They could be neglected... we're almost GMT/UTC :-P
[08:31] <sebastian^> pkern: right ;)
[08:32]  * persia grumbles about the other 7/8ths of the world having at least some utility
[08:33] <Fujitsu> persia: We don't exist.
[08:35] <persia> Fujitsu: :)
[08:55] <sebastian^> so, first of all before start working i need coffee brb
[09:17] <huats> morning everyone
[09:24] <sebastian^> morning huats
[09:35] <sebastian^> hmmm is there anywhere information what i have to note for setting up an ubuntu cd mirror?
[10:02] <geser> morning
[10:05] <huats> morning geser
[10:05] <huats> sebastian^: I think, but I might be wrong that it is the same thing than setting up a debian one
[10:29] <Kmos> morning :)
[10:30] <huats> morning Kmos
[10:30] <Kmos> huats: hji
[10:30] <Kmos> hi
[10:37] <sebastian^> hmm okay, thanks huats :)
[10:39] <Hobbsee> bluekuja: would be nice if you could respond to your bug report to debian.  http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=423260
[10:39] <ubotu> Debian bug 423260 in libkarma0 "libkarma doesnt build" [Normal,Open]
[10:52] <zul> morning
[10:53] <Fujitsu> Hi zul.
[11:28] <deadwill> mornin' people o/
[11:30] <siretart> hey deadwill!
[11:30] <siretart> morning folks
[11:30] <deadwill> siretart, my friend!
[11:30] <deadwill> at boston?
[11:30] <siretart> jupp
[11:30] <siretart> just woke up
[11:30] <deadwill> :)
[11:55] <zul_> freak its cold
[12:05] <rexbron> Hey, question time!
[12:06] <persia> rexbron: What's the question?
[12:06] <jpatrick> "6 * 7" = 42
[12:06] <rexbron> What is the suggested course of action if an upstream ships code without a license in the headers?
[12:08] <persia> rexbron: You've two choices: either bug upstream, or repack the tarball not to include that code.
[12:08] <persia> jpatrick: Try that in base 13
[12:09] <jpatrick> persia: I always knew there was something wrong with this place..
[12:09] <rexbron> persia: at the expense of having the program (effectively) function?
[12:10] <DktrKranz> rexbron, so you should ask upstream to provide them. it's not a heavy task, unless your project has lots of files
[12:11] <persia> rexbron: Unfortunately.  If you can patch around it, that's nice.  If not, upstream really needs to fix it.
[12:11] <bigon> does somebody know how can I get a git branch from a specific tag?
[12:12] <zul> bigon: google knows
[12:12] <Hobbsee> ROCK ON!  new pingus version!  more levels!
[12:12] <rexbron> DktrKranz: jussi01 tackled this problem before and it took several months for upstream (one man dev team) to get around to release the source with license headers
[12:12] <rexbron> I sent a patch upstream that would homoginzise
[12:12] <rexbron> err homogenize
[12:13] <rexbron> the license headers, as COPYING was GPL3 and many of the source files were gpl 2 or later
[12:13] <rexbron> it has been about two weeks sine I sent that email
[12:13] <DktrKranz> rexbron, that could be frustrating, but I think archive-admins nor ftp-masters would accept things with licensing issues
[12:14] <rexbron> DktrKranz: understandably
[12:14] <DktrKranz> I have a similar issue, but I asked upstream to insert them in the next release, and he seems happy with that
[12:15] <persia> rexbron: The homogenisation is less important, as 2+ can be 3, but the missing headers make the archive admins reject it right away.
[12:15] <rexbron> persia: afaik, the headers are all there. It was the organ files, wasn't it?
[12:16] <persia> rexbron: Yep.  If I remember correctly, only one or two organs were missing the headers, so the rest of the package ought to be able to go with a repack.  If upstream fixes the licensing for the next release, we can drop repacking it (just be sure to be extra clear in your repacking comments)
[12:18] <DktrKranz> rexbron, is upstream happy to insert license headers or has difficulties?
[12:18] <rexbron> persia: that should be documented in the change log? and where should I place the script to repack the tarball?
[12:18] <DktrKranz> (or do not reply at all)
[12:18] <persia> DktrKranz: Happy, but exceedingly slow.
[12:18] <rexbron> DktrKranz: Upstream is receptive to colableration, it is just a matter of finding time
[12:19] <rexbron> like I said, one man dev team
[12:19] <persia> rexbron: You'll mention repack in debian/changelog, you'll document why in debian/copyright, and you'll include the repacking script as part of a get-orig-source rule in debian/rules.  If you add a watch file, it will be easier to sync when upstream does their thing.
[12:21] <DktrKranz> persia, my first day running piuparts was not good. Maybe I did some wrong steps, but piuparts included in ubuntu complains a lot. Now I'm going to use Debian version (which is newer)
[12:22] <persia> DktrKranz: Is there Ubuntu variation to piuparts?
[12:22] <DktrKranz> a huge one, IIRC
[12:22] <persia> (alternately, we could be surprisingly broken)
[12:23] <DktrKranz> I didn't look at a merge, though
[12:23] <DktrKranz> just because I'm only chasing testing purposes, not a full run
[12:23] <persia> DktrKranz: It's probably worth investigating that: there may be a reason why Debian's isn't the right choice.  Also, when you get something working, you might ping bmk789_, who might be willing to donate some cycles to help.
[12:24] <DktrKranz> cycles? that's what I miss...
[12:24] <DktrKranz> anyway, I tried to reinventing the wheel too by running a test based on pbuilder
[12:25] <DktrKranz> it is much faster, but I'm not sure about accuracy
[12:25] <persia> DktrKranz: ...cycles to help.
[12:26] <persia> DktrKranz: What sort of pbuilder-based test?  Does it still do the whole install / remove / upgrade / purge testing?
[12:26] <DktrKranz> it lacks install phase
[12:26] <DktrKranz> *upgrade
[12:26] <rexbron> persia: regarding some of your comments made on the genpo revu page, is a debian menu file necessary if a .desktop is included?
[12:27] <persia> rexbron: No, but it's nice.  Some people use alternate windowing environments (e.g. fluxbox) that depend on the Debian menu infrastructure.
[12:27] <DktrKranz> basically, I just prepared a script which execute some commands directly into a pbuilder environment (via pbuilder execute command)
[12:27] <rexbron> ok
[12:28] <DktrKranz> these commands install and purge a given package, taken from a list
[12:28] <DktrKranz> just a homemade try :)
[12:28] <persia> DktrKranz: Do you think it's sufficient?  You might want to find a known broken package, just to make sure it fails properly.  I'm open to alternate solutions, but want to make sure we don't miss too much.
[12:28] <DktrKranz> mh.... I look at the results
[12:29] <DktrKranz> here's one: http://ubuntu.linuxdc.it/installtest/fail/em8300
[12:30]  * persia fondly remembers when em8300 was a more useful package
[12:31] <persia> DktrKranz: Great.  If it's faster, and can feed us some basic issues to start, I'm happy.  I'd like full testing prior to release, but anything is better than now, where we're blind.
[12:31] <geser> does the piuparts from gutsy work for someone? I get a python traceback when I try to use it
[12:32] <DktrKranz> geser, that's the error I got
[12:32] <DktrKranz> using 0.28 solves that for me
[12:32] <DktrKranz> but it's debian version
[12:32] <geser> ok, so it's not me who called piuparts wrong
[12:33] <DktrKranz> at least we are two
[12:33] <persia> geser: No, you're doing it right
[12:34] <rexbron> persia: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/43013/
[12:34] <geser> from the changelog entry for the ubuntu changes it looks like I don't need them and will try to use Debian package
[12:35] <persia> rexbron: http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2007/07/msg00000.html
[12:35] <DktrKranz> persia, running pbuilder homemade tests on multiverse took me about 10 hours on a *very* old hardware. Using it on a powerful box will boost performances.
[12:36] <persia> DktrKranz: How many packages?
[12:36] <DktrKranz> I was not able to "answer" maintainer script questions, though. Is there a dpkg/apt option to do so and choose the default answer?
[12:37] <DktrKranz> persia, about 500
[12:37] <persia> DktrKranz: preseeding is likely your solution
[12:37] <persia> So, universe would be about 300 hours for you?  Maybe 100 on a more modern system?
[12:38] <DktrKranz> 500 binary packages. universe is almost 30 times bigger
[12:39] <persia> DktrKranz: Ah.  500 vs 25,000.  So, 500 hours for you, maybe 150 on modern hardware?
[12:39] <DktrKranz> I fear so
[12:40] <Fujitsu> It should be able to be fairly easily split over several people, shouldn't it?
[12:40] <DktrKranz> if we get a local ubuntu mirror, maybe we should be able to reduce it
[12:41] <persia> Fujitsu: Absolutely.  Also, if someone has a multiproc multicore server, it's even less.
[12:41] <persia> DktrKranz: Oh, yes.  Very much so.
[12:41] <DktrKranz> how many gb is ubuntu archive?
[12:42] <Fujitsu> DktrKranz: About 12GiB per release per arch, plus about that much for source.
[12:42] <Fujitsu> Doing much without a local mirror is likely to make things very slow, and be generally silly.
[12:43] <DktrKranz> so... the main point is we should have at least two tests, one for i386 and one for amd64
[12:43] <persia> Fujitsu: Depends on geography.  Those in .kr have only rare needs for local mirrors due to country-wide fast ethernet fabirc
[12:43] <Fujitsu> True.
[12:43] <persia> DktrKranz: Sounds sane to me.  If we can do lpia & sparc, that'd be cool too.
[12:44] <DktrKranz> lpia
[12:44] <Fujitsu> Does anybody have sparc machines?
[12:44] <DktrKranz> chroots should non be an issue
[12:44] <persia> Low Power Intel Architecure
[12:44] <Hobbsee> persia: you'll be there via voip for the motu processes thing today, i assume?
[12:44] <DktrKranz> since they should run on i386 hardware without many issues
[12:45] <persia> Hobbsee: Right.  Thanks for reminding me: I need to test my voip
[12:45] <Fujitsu> DktrKranz: Right, LPIA will run fine on i386/amd64.
[12:45] <persia> Fujitsu: Should it be run against x86_64 or ia32?
[12:46] <Fujitsu> persia: It's closer to ia32, but x86_64 is pretty much a superset of that, so is fine.
[12:46] <DktrKranz> IIRC lpia is not much different from a common i386
[12:46] <Fujitsu> LPIA isn't really an architecture, it's more a set of optimisations.
[12:47] <Fujitsu> Or other low-power/mobile-specific changes.
[12:50] <persia> Right.  I just wasn't sure if the kernel was setting the underlying processor in an emulation mode, etc.  If there's no need to worry about architecure when seeking hosting for the run, I'm not worried.
[12:53] <SWAT> I'm currently trying to package some software, but my spirits are low, any mental help would be appreciated. I have the feeling that I've taken on something too complicated (trying to build packages for firebird from scratch)
[12:53] <DktrKranz> bigon, try with cogito: cg-clone git.repo.url#tagname
[12:54] <Fujitsu> SWAT: Don't we already have firebird packages in the archive?
[12:55] <bigon> DktrKranz: thx
[12:58] <SWAT> yes, but they aren't the latest version and am giving me quite a few issues (and I thought it would be a nice training if I could package it_
[12:58] <SWAT> Fujitsu, yes
[13:03] <proppy> hi
[13:03] <joejaxx> jdong: ping if you are still around :)
[13:03] <joejaxx> proppy: hi
[13:17]  * TheMuso_Boston kills another merge.
[13:17] <dholbach> rock on Bostonian TheMuso
[13:17] <TheMuso_Boston> lol
[13:18] <zul> dholbach: the motu bof is at 11 correct?
[13:18] <dholbach> zul: yeah
[13:18] <zul> okies ill listen in
[13:19] <TheMuso_Boston> Unles the schedule changes.
[13:19] <zul> true
[13:19] <dholbach> TheMuso_Boston: that's a fixed one
[13:19] <TheMuso_Boston> Ok.
[13:35] <Hobbsee> Kmos: do i even want to ask about blobwars?
[13:36] <Kmos> Hobbsee: what about it ?
[13:36]  * zul ducks yet again
[13:36] <Hobbsee> Kmos: what's your patch?
[13:36] <Fujitsu> Hobbsee: Er, did I see an attachment go missing?
[13:36] <Hobbsee> Kmos: looks like rainct has provided a bug
[13:36] <Hobbsee> er, a patch
[13:36] <Hobbsee> and you've added another?
[13:36] <Kmos> :)
[13:37] <Kmos> nop
[13:37] <Hobbsee> Kmos: oh, you've removed the patch.
[13:37] <Hobbsee> Kmos: why?
[13:37] <Kmos> Hobbsee: i removed the first one, that's not complete as rainct said
[13:37]  * persia notes that the removed patch was a different LP URL than RainCT's patch,
[13:37] <Kmos> the one in the bug, is the correct one
[13:38] <Hobbsee> ...
[13:38] <Hobbsee> what were you told about hijacking bugs?
[13:38] <Kmos> Hobbsee: i just tried to clean it up
[13:38] <Hobbsee> taht doesnt answer the question.
[13:38] <Hobbsee> if someone files a bug with a patch, you leave it alone.
[13:39] <Kmos> ok, i just tried to clean it up, to motu members not spend more time that is needed
[13:39] <Kmos> sorry
[13:39]  * Hobbsee recalls you saying "ok, i wont do that again" back in gutsy.
[13:41]  * Kmos lunch
[13:41] <Kmos> i need to go
[13:41] <Hobbsee> funny, that.
[14:10] <khanreaper> Anyone willing to review a package?
[14:11] <persia> khanreaper: Which package?
[14:11] <khanreaper> `darkplaces' on revu.tauware.de.
[14:11] <persia> khanreaper: URL?
[14:11] <khanreaper> Linda and lintian have been very loving of it. ;-)
[14:11] <persia> khanreaper: Did you run them against the binary package as well?
[14:11] <khanreaper> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=darkplaces
[14:11] <khanreaper> Oui.
[14:12] <persia> Tres bien
[14:12] <proppy> khanreaper: dans la bouche
[14:12] <persia> Ugh.  Obj-C.  Grumble...
[14:14] <khanreaper> As far as I know, the Quake I engine did not use Objective-C.
[14:15] <persia> khanreaper: Just reacting to foo.app.  Anyway, does darkplaces-data install all the /usr/share/games/darkplaces/idi/* ?
[14:16] <khanreaper> /usr/share/games/darkplaces/dpmod.
[14:16] <khanreaper> Normal users woud be required to install proprietary game data into /usr/share/games/darkplaces/id1, per the customary rules of the Quake I engine.
[14:17] <persia> khanreaper: OK.  I guess I'm confused about how the user uses this then.  Does it rely on non-free content from the original game distribution?
[14:17] <khanreaper> Yes.
[14:17] <khanreaper> Well, users can use free content replacements.
[14:17] <khanreaper> They exist.
[14:17] <khanreaper> This package is akin to the various Doom packages in Debian.
[14:18] <persia> khanreaper: Ah.  It may be worth setting the appropriate Recommends: on the free content, just to make the package work out of the box.  As it is, I'm looking it over, but I won't be able to test.
[14:19] <khanreaper> The reason that there is a data package is that the engine, while completely backward-compatible with old data, uses some new GPL resources in places.
[14:19] <khanreaper> Let me examine what open content alternatives there are.
[14:20] <persia> khanreaper: Thanks.  Also, is anything actually GPL-3?  It may be worth pointing to GPL-2 in copyright rather than GPL-e.
[14:20] <persia> s/e/3
[14:21] <khanreaper> It is GPL-2 per http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/darkplaces-0710311610/darkplaces-20070927.r7592/COPYING.
[14:22] <persia> khanreaper: Right, but the link mentioned in debian/copyright is GPL-3.  It's GPL-2 (or later), so that's not necessarily a problem, but worth looking at.
[14:22] <khanreaper> OK. :-)
[14:22] <persia> khanreaper: I'd also suggest renaming darkplaces-dedicated to darkplaces-server, just to make it clear for people too lazy to read the descriptions.
[14:23] <khanreaper> Are you referring to the filesystem URI pointing to v. 3?
[14:24] <persia> khanreaper: /usr/share/common-licenses/GPL is a symlink to GPL-3
[14:25] <persia> khanreaper: I also don't see much difference between the -glx and -sdl manpages.  Am I missing something?  Could they perhaps be combined (and hardlinked at install) in darkplaces-data?
[14:27] <khanreaper> There is an open Quake data projected called Open Quartz, but it isn't packaged.
[14:27] <persia> khanreaper: Well, there's your next project :)
[14:27] <khanreaper> Heh.
[14:28] <khanreaper> So, I would be willing to point to Quake III package as precedent for this one to be packaged as it is.
[14:28] <persia> khanreaper: Why are you installing the todo in /usr/share/doc ?
[14:28] <khanreaper> To my understanding, it is incumbent on the user to have the proprietary game data to run.
[14:28] <khanreaper> That was something that debhelper must have added.
[14:29] <persia> khanreaper: I'd not reject it from universe for lacking data, but it'll likely linger until someone with the data can test.
[14:29] <khanreaper> Also on certain systems, it is more desirable to use either GLX or SDL.
[14:29] <khanreaper> It really depends.
[14:29] <khanreaper> There are tradeoffs for each.
[14:29] <persia> I completely agree with the package split for -glx / -sdl, I just didn't see any difference between the man pages.
[14:29] <persia> (aside from the name, etc.)
[14:30] <khanreaper> The commandline flags are the same.
[14:30] <khanreaper> It is just a different backend.
[14:30] <khanreaper> Plus, I only extracted the important CLI flags from the source fles.
[14:31] <persia> Right.  To save archive space, it'd be nice to have the darkplaces-data package contain a single manpage that applied for whichever of -glx / -sdl the user had installed.
[14:31] <persia> (two copies for the archive, instead of 18)
[14:32] <khanreaper> OK. I will revisit these issues and reupload shortly.
[14:33] <persia> khanreaper: No rush.  I'm distracted by several other things.  Wait a bit more, and I'll feed you more :)
[14:37] <khanreaper> Quite a few other packages install TODOs---e.g., qemu, rsnapshot, bzr, etc.
[14:38] <persia> khanreaper: Would you mind adding a watch file: it makes it much more likely the package can be maintained.  Also, I don't see any menu entries, either .desktop or debian-style.
[14:38] <persia> Yes they do.  I just don't think the contents of darkplaces todo is of much interest to users.
[14:38] <persia> (it's also really hard to read)
[14:39] <khanreaper> This really isn't a package that can be started by a .desktop with ease.
[14:39] <persia> khanreaper: Even the clients?
[14:39] <persia> khanreaper: I'd agree about the server: that needs a manual start, but I'm envisioning one person running the server, and their freinds with laptops connecting for a deathmatch.
[14:40] <khanreaper> Most people use a utility like xqf, which is part of the distribution.
[14:40] <khanreaper> I could make a menu entry.
[14:40] <khanreaper> I guess I am just too used to my game workflow .;-)
[14:41] <persia> khanreaper: That'd be nice.  perhaps something that calls xqf in the standard manner.
[14:41] <persia> khanreaper: Also, builddate.c doesn't have a license.  It's silly, as it's one line, but it's policy.
[14:43] <persia> khanreaper: Also, Ubuntu doesn't use /usr/X11R6/lib64 for anything.  You'll likely want to patch the makefile more agressively.
[14:43] <rrittenhouse> Is it just me or is vmware not in Gutsy (32bit or 64bit) ?
[14:43] <persia> !vmware gutsy
[14:43] <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about vmware gutsy - try searching on http://ubotu.ubuntu-nl.org/factoids.cgi
[14:43] <Fujitsu> rrittenhouse: It is proprietary, so why would it be?
[14:43] <persia> Fujitsu: -partner?
[14:43] <LjL> that would be !info vmware gutsy
[14:44] <Nafallo> archive.canonical.com ?
[14:44] <Fujitsu> (vmware-player was removed because it was built against prehistoric libraries)
[14:44] <LjL> anyway, the player is not available anymore - the server might be somewhere in Canonical's repos, not sure
[14:44] <persia> !info vmware gutsy
[14:44] <ubotu> Package vmware does not exist in gutsy
[14:44] <rrittenhouse> It was in commercial last time.
[14:44] <rrittenhouse> ah
[14:44] <Fujitsu> persia, Nafallo: Wouldn't call that `in gutsy'.
[14:44] <persia> rrittenhouse: vmware-player 1.x got knocked out for security reasons.  2.x apparently didn't get in.  Perhaps try an alternative?
[14:45] <rrittenhouse> I should have specified vmware server. Ill just create a package for it or somethin
[14:45] <rrittenhouse> thx
[14:45] <persia> khanreaper: I'm not seeing anything else at first glance, but I've only hunted about half the source files for copyright.
[14:48] <sladen> Hobbsee: there's another motu session in 10minutes
[14:48] <TheMuso_Boston> Anbody know why appart from being blacklisted, which it is not, a package hasn't been picked up by the autosync? The package was updated in September.
[14:48] <Hobbsee> sladen: cool, thanks.
[14:49] <TheMuso_Boston> The package in question is nifticlib
[14:49] <TheMuso_Boston> Debian has 0.6, but hardy still only has 0.41
[14:49] <Fujitsu> TheMuso_Boston: It hasn't moved to contrib or non-free?
[14:49] <TheMuso_Boston> Fujitsu: let me check.
[14:49] <Fujitsu> Hm, that looks fine..
[14:50] <zul> ow...
[14:50] <Fujitsu> TheMuso_Boston: It was synced more than a week ago.
[14:50] <TheMuso_Boston> Fujitsu: hmmm ok.
[14:50] <Fujitsu> TheMuso_Boston: But there are more than 1500 outstanding builds - it's probably one of them.
[14:51] <Fujitsu> Hm, no, I have 0.6-1 binaries here.
[14:51] <TheMuso_Boston> Fujitsu: The source hasn't even synced.
[14:51] <Fujitsu> TheMuso_Boston: Yes it has..
[14:51] <TheMuso_Boston> This is from archive.ubuntu.com
[14:51] <Fujitsu> https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nifticlib
[14:51] <TheMuso_Boston> Fujitsu: Its not in hardy changes.
[14:51] <Fujitsu> TheMuso_Boston: Autosyncs don't appear there.
[14:51] <persia> TheMuso_Boston: That happens sometimes :(
[14:51] <TheMuso_Boston> Um ok.
[14:52] <persia> Fujitsu: Ever?  I swear I've seen a bunch by "Ubuntu Installer".  Are those all manual syncs?
[14:52] <TheMuso_Boston> Ok. I forgot to check lp.
[14:52] <Fujitsu> persia: Those are manual, yeah.
[14:53] <TheMuso_Boston> Ok it must be in the new queue somewhere. it has built.
[14:53] <TheMuso_Boston> Oh well, I'll just have to wait.
[14:53] <Fujitsu> TheMuso_Boston: The binaries and source are on archive.ubuntu.com...
[14:53] <h4x0r7h11> Is there somewhere I can look to get an explanation for why a package was removed??
[14:53] <h4x0r7h11> (libapache2-mod-security, in dapper, not in feisty)
[14:53] <TheMuso_Boston> Fujitsu: No thats what I'm saying.
[14:54] <Fujitsu> h4x0r7h11: http://people.ubuntu.com/~ubuntu-archive/removals.txt
[14:54] <Fujitsu> TheMuso_Boston: What are you saying?
[14:54] <persia> h4x0r7h11: For a more verbose description, you might also look for "Fix Released" bugs against the package that request removal.
[14:54] <TheMuso_Boston> Since the binary packages changed, its in binary new.
[14:54] <h4x0r7h11> persia:  I would find that in launchpad?
[14:54] <Fujitsu> Ah.
[14:54] <TheMuso_Boston> Fujitsu: No worries, I've pinpointed it.
[14:54] <TheMuso_Boston> As I said, I'll just have to wait.
[14:55] <persia> h4x0r7h11: Yes.  https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/source-package-name/+bugs, and then "Advanced Search"
[14:56] <zul> jono: i guess comments from the peanut gallery for the bof will be from here as well
[14:58] <h4x0r7h11> persia:  ah I see.  It's a license conflict, not a non-open-source issue
[14:58] <persia> h4x0r7h11: linuxsampler?
[15:00] <h4x0r7h11> persia:  mod security is GPL, apache is APL, mod_security uses apache headers, this creates a license conflict
[15:00] <h4x0r7h11> persia:  upstream created the conflict on purpose
[15:00] <persia> h4x0r7h11: Ah.  Sorry: the other happens to be my most frequently answered license conflict question :)
[15:02] <h4x0r7h11> persia:  upstream seems to be playing the business field; binaries become non-redistributable technically, though fedora et al don't seem to care (gentoo doesn't have to care)
[15:03] <persia> h4x0r7h11: Ah.  Annoying that.
[15:03] <h4x0r7h11> persia:  projection:  if Apache upstream kept the source APL but re-licensed the headers MIT, the conflict would go away with pretty much no (expected) damage to control of the Apache source (someone could rip off the headers and re-wrtie the actual programming logic; let's all clap for them)
[15:04] <h4x0r7h11> persia:  Further projection:  Upstream mod_security would get pissed off, de-GPL mod_security, and make it a closed source product in response.
[15:04] <persia> h4x0r7h11: That there is an interesting solution.  Perhaps an interesting lobbying challenge?
[15:05] <h4x0r7h11> persia:  Licensing is more personal than functional in most cases (in this case it's functional).  I might as well be arguing religion if I try to push that idea to upstream Apache :)
[15:05]  * Fujitsu decides it's probably time for bed.
[15:05] <TheMuso_Boston> MOTu process session about to start at UDS.
[15:05] <StevenK> Fujitsu: But it's only 11am
[15:06] <Fujitsu> TheMuso_Boston: Yeah, unfortunately late.
[15:06] <Fujitsu> StevenK: -stabs-
[15:06] <TheMuso_Boston> Fujitsu: Yeah I know.
[15:06] <StevenK> Ouch!
[15:06]  * Fujitsu cackles evilly.
[15:06] <StevenK> Fujitsu: Just think of me being horribly jet-lagged on the 12th
[15:06] <Fujitsu> StevenK: True, true.
[15:07] <Fujitsu> This is almighty Daniel speaking?
[15:08] <h4x0r7h11> persia:  also, the entire issue describes modules as being a derivative work of Apache because they use Apache headers to build.  Interface being non-copyrightable, you can likely get away with doing a number of things, like rewriting your own apache headers ;)
[15:09] <jono> zul: peanut gallary?
[15:09] <jono> gallery
[15:09] <Hobbsee> jono: comments from those not there
[15:10] <jono> eh?
[15:10] <Hobbsee> jono: ie, comments from the peanut gallery
[15:10] <Hobbsee> Fujitsu: yeah, it's daniel.
[15:10] <jono> right
[15:12] <slangasek> hum, not really tha traditional meaning of "peanut gallery" :)
[15:13] <siretart> Hobbsee: is that you?
[15:13] <Hobbsee> siretart: no.  it's the green alien.
[15:13] <siretart> oh
[15:13] <Hobbsee> slangasek: that's what i'm assuming it is, anwyay
[15:14]  * Hobbsee waves to jbailey
[15:15] <jbailey> Hobbsee: Heya!
[15:16] <h4x0r7h11> persia:  if you want to play politics, poke bluefoxicy later when I'm not at work
[15:17] <persia> h4x0r7h11: No.  I have enough games to play :)
[15:18]  * Fujitsu hides from Hobbsee.
[15:18] <Hobbsee> Fujitsu: :P
[15:18]  * Hobbsee beats Fujitsu with a stick
[15:18] <TheMuso_Boston> lol
[15:19]  * StevenK idly notes Fujitsu is typing a lot for someone who is sleeping
[15:19] <Fujitsu> StevenK: Sssh.
[15:19]  * TheMuso_Boston is going to look at the uus queue next week when he returns.
[15:19]  * h4x0r7h11 takes the stick away from Hobbsee
[15:19] <Hobbsee> you cant.
[15:19] <Fujitsu> h4x0r7h11: Biiiiig mistake.
[15:19] <jbailey> You assume there's only one?
[15:20]  * Hobbsee DOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOMS h4x0r7h11
[15:20] <h4x0r7h11> jbailey:  eventually I will remove all of them and distaff Hobbsee
[15:20] <Hobbsee> youc ant.
[15:20] <jbailey> I thought she had a collection for fending off mneptok.
[15:20] <TheMuso_Boston> The connection here is somewhat slow, and the local mirror is somewhat broken.
[15:20] <TheMuso_Boston> So merges for me at least, will now wait till I get back home.
[15:27] <deadwill> heya Hobbsee
[15:27] <Hobbsee> hiya deadwill
[15:38] <rexbron> persia: problem. All of the organ files rely on the .dtd file to define the xml stucture. Does that mean that I would have to remove all of organ files, seeing as they will not work if it is not specified?
[15:39] <rexbron> actually, that question is open to any MOTU
[15:39] <persia> I'm willing to risk pushing a DTD without the comment, if all the organs have the comment.
[15:40] <rexbron> I  will remove the organs that do not (only two I believe)
[15:41] <persia> rexbron: Great.  I think you'll be in good shape for approval come REVU day :)
[15:42] <rexbron> cool
[15:42] <slangasek> the left kidney and the spleen?
[15:43] <rexbron> persia: with the get-orig-source rule, would I be alowed to make the asumption that it is being run from the debian dir and that the tarball exists two dir up?
[15:43] <persia> slangasek: It's actually your call which organs have to go.  We just picked the ones without embedded GPL :)
[15:43] <slangasek> heh
[15:43] <persia> rexbron: No.  Some people make the assumption that it runs from the package directory, but policy says it should run from any directory.
[15:44] <persia> rexbron: Hold on a bit: I'll find you a wiki page with some guidelines
[15:44] <rexbron> wtf do you mean that if my heart is GPL2-Only and the blood can't link up with anything elese

[15:46]  * siretart waves to sistpoty|UDS 
[15:46]  * sistpoty|UDS waves back to siretart
[15:46] <persia> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Basic#head-6362ca31f03c0e20eec18b76830024371a410acb
[15:47] <bddebian> Heya gang
[15:47] <bddebian> Hi persia
[15:48] <sistpoty|UDS> hi persia and bddebian
[15:48] <jbailey> beedeebeedeebeedeebeedeebeedeebeedeebeedee.
[15:48] <jbailey> bddebian: What's up, Buck?
[15:48] <bddebian> Hi sistpoty|UDS
[15:48] <bddebian> Jeff!
[15:48] <bddebian> What the heck are you doing here? :)
[15:48] <persia> HI bddebian.  I previously volunteered you for the scorched3d stuff.  Hit me if I misinterpreted what you were saying earlier.
[15:48] <jbailey> IZ IN YOUR MOTU CHANNEL, LISTENING TO YER BOF
[15:49] <bddebian> persia: Not at all, I'm trying to ping Fuddl but getting nothing back :-(
[15:49] <Fujitsu> jbailey: OH NOES
[15:49] <bddebian> jbailey: Nice
[15:49] <persia> bddebian: Prep a candidate somewhere for review :)
[15:50] <bddebian> Well I'm trying to figure out what was ripped out to make it dfsg first :-(
[15:51] <deadwill> hey bddebian :)
[15:54] <bddebian> Hi deadwill
[15:57] <Fujitsu> Who's that with the really odd mic?
[15:57] <Hobbsee> i was wondering that myself
[15:58]  * persia  
[15:58] <Hobbsee> ahhh...
[15:58] <Fujitsu> persia: Ahh.
[15:59] <persia> It worked when I tested with Ng, but seems to have completely failed just in time for the session :)
[15:59] <Fujitsu> persia: Oh, it works, just you sound very electronic and quiet.
[15:59] <Hobbsee> sigh, SRU's.
[15:59] <Hobbsee> it's a shell script, done with espeak.  it's not really persia at all.
[15:59] <persia> Hobbsee: Shhhh!
[16:00] <persia> Nobody is supposed to be able to identify turing failures
[16:06] <Fujitsu> persia: It is better.
[16:06] <Fujitsu> Ah, that's much better.
[16:07] <Fujitsu> Still fairly electronic, but very audible.
[16:07] <persia> That makes all the difference.  Just needed more gain.
[16:08]  * persia still needs to work on the "humanise" filter
[16:18] <rexbron> persia: how exactly would you make the get-orig-source run from any dir?
[16:19] <rexbron> would you call it like <topsource dir>/debian/rules get-orig-source
[16:20] <persia> rexbron: Well, you could perhaps grab $(pwd) in a variable, change to where you want, do your thing (perhaps using $(pwd) to tweak the result), and then go back to where the user started.  There are other models, depending on how your rule works, and how dependent it is on other parts of the package.
[16:22] <rexbron> persia: I guess my question is, how will I know where the orig tarball resides?
[16:23] <rexbron> right now I am making the assumtion that it will funtion like uupdate
[16:23] <rexbron> in that the user has the tarball one dir up
[16:23] <persia> I recommend dropping the orig tarball in the directory from which the user calls the rule, or one level beneath (as you like).
[16:24] <rexbron> persia: still, is  it expected that this rule DL's a fresh tarball?
[16:25] <persia> rexbron: Yep.  Download a tarball, and modify it to match the current practice.  That allows people to verify the md5sums and ensure you didn't insert a trojan.
[16:27] <Fujitsu> persia: You're beeping.
[16:27] <Fujitsu> Just beeping.
[16:28]  * persia grumbles, and gives up.
[16:28] <Fujitsu> We got a few words, but then it... degraded.
[16:28] <persia> Fujitsu: Could you proxy?  I think people should set themselves as maintainer if they don't want someone else to touch it: otherwise it's fair game.
[16:28] <Fujitsu> persia: I'm not really in a position where I can speak, sorry.
[16:35] <Fujitsu> persia: That's working very well now.
[16:41]  * Fujitsu is really going to bed now... almost 4am.
[16:41] <Hobbsee> hehe
[16:41]  * Hobbsee is thinking that, too
[16:43] <Fujitsu> Night, everyone.
[16:44] <persia> Good night Fujitse
[16:51] <pochu> Nafallo: would you mind if I do irssi's merge?
[16:54] <rexbron> I am unsure on how to call the watch file in debian/ such that it downloads to the pwd
[16:55] <persia> rexbron: I thought there was an example on that wiki page.  Let me find another...
[16:56] <persia> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Recipes/DebianWatch
[17:01] <persia> rexbron: I need to be off, but if you can't make it work, just assume that the you are in the package base directory.  It's a common compromise, if not entirely desireable.
[17:58] <manchicken> Anybody managing the argus-server/client packages?
[18:26] <norsetto> bddebian: you may want to have a look at bug 159583
[18:26] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 159583 in pixelize "menu entry has no icon" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/159583
[18:45] <somerville32> Once PPA goes public, do we plan on recommending people use that instead of pbuilder?
[18:47]  * jpatrick strokes his pbuilder
[18:50] <jpatrick> somerville32: I think that'll put a lot of load on the buildds
[18:51] <bddebian> somerville32: I won't be using it :)
[18:53] <pochu> somerville32: ppas take some hours to build, whereas pbuilder only takes some minutes :)
[18:53] <gnomefreak> bryce: are you around?
[18:55] <hellboy195> pochu: some hours? that depend how big the programm is and how much traffic on launchpad. I also build a package in 5 min ;)
[18:56] <pwnguin> time to build, or time to get out of the queue?
[18:56] <gnomefreak> pochu: its been real slow due to floods of lang packs and something else we were days behind. but they just added a 3rd i386 buildd
[18:58] <pochu> gnomefreak: really? that's fine :)
[18:58] <pochu> hellboy195, pwnguin: time to get to the builders...
[18:58] <pochu> I don't have to wait for some hours here for it to get started :)
[18:58] <hellboy195> pochu: ^^ yeah the languagepacks are hard ^^
[18:59] <gnomefreak> pochu: the buildds are still playing catch up from that. something like 700+ gnome lang packs were uploaded last week or so
[19:00] <hellboy195> gnomefreak: yeah. 3 days waiting for uns :(
[19:00] <hellboy195> *us
[19:00] <gnomefreak> yep it happened to all of us
[19:02] <pochu> gnomefreak: but my ppa uploads were more than a week ago, and they took several hours... but if there are more builders then that shouldn't be that long now :)
[19:02] <gnomefreak> there are 3 buildds now i believe there was 1 maybe 2 up until early this week
[19:03] <gnomefreak> brb i have to spin iceape again
[19:30] <cyberix> "Does anyone want to review my package!"
[19:30] <cyberix> (/me wonders, if this is the correct way to do this)
[19:31] <gnomefreak> cyberix: ask and post link they will get to it when they get time, doesnt always happen right away
[19:31] <gnomefreak> assuming you pushed to revu that is
[19:43] <cyberix> Does anyone want to review my package!
[19:43] <cyberix> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=pq
[19:45] <jpatrick> cyberix: version should be 6.2-0ubuntu1
[19:47] <DktrKranz> cyberix, you should also set target to hardy, not gutsy
[19:48] <DktrKranz> and look at lintian report, it contains a couple of things which have to be adjusted
[19:48] <mohammad> Hello, would you please merge libswt3.3 to Ubuntu Hardy? http://packages.debian.org/search?searchon=names&keywords=libswt-gtk-3.3
[19:51] <Nafallo> pochu: go for it! :-)
[19:52] <imbrandon> jdong, looks like mohammad wants you !
[19:52] <cyberix> jpatrick: Should I use that as the version number everywhere?
[19:52] <jdong> mohammad: doko and man-di would be the experts on doing that. We will not be directly using Debian packaging but rather upgrade our eclipse stack altogether to get swt 3.3
[19:53] <jdong> mohammad: volunteers welcome.
[19:53] <jpatrick> cyberix: as long as it's not in ubuntu or debian
[19:53] <cyberix> jpatrick: e.g. foldername?
[19:53] <jpatrick> cyberix: no, folder name stays the same
[19:53] <cyberix> :-/
[19:54] <jdong> ok, now back to work... no calls :P
[19:54] <mohammad> jdong: Do you think if there is any possibility that swt3.3 be merged to hardy?
[19:54] <pochu> Nafallo: thank you :)
[19:54] <cyberix> jpatrick: Should I increase version number while still working in revu?
[19:54] <jdong> mohammad: please read my response. No, Ubuntu's packagers for swt and related disagree with how it's done in Debian. We will not be syncing or merging debian packaging.
[19:54] <cyberix> jpatrick: Os should 6.2-0ubuntu1 be the initial published one?
[19:54] <jpatrick> cyberix: no, only for uploads to ubuntu
[19:56] <Nafallo> pochu: upstream mailed me btw. want me to forward the mail so you can answer it when it's done? ;-)
[19:57] <mohammad> jdong: Sorry, I meant do you think Ubuntu's packager will make a new package for Hardy? The reason I am asking this question is that we are packaging a program for Debian which needs swt3.3
[19:58] <pochu> Nafallo: please :)
[19:58] <jdong> mohammad: Most likely, yes, swt3.3 will be packaged before Hardy releases
[19:58] <Nafallo> pochu: nick at ubuntu dot com, right?
[19:58] <jdong> mohammad: I have packages myself that depend on swt3.3 too :)
[19:58] <mohammad> unavailability of 3.3 means we have to change the source code. because our main target is Ubuntu not Debian
[19:58] <pochu> Nafallo: yup
[19:59] <mohammad> jdong: great. Thank you for your help :)
[19:59] <cyberix> The package will most likely be going to Multiverse. Do I have to do something special about it?
[19:59] <jdong> mohammad: sure thing. As I said, the two people I mentioned before are the experts around here on SWT/Java; I'm just echoing what they've told me
[20:01] <Nafallo> pochu: two mails sent.
[20:01] <pochu> Thank you.
[20:04] <cyberix> jpatrick: The package will most likely be going to Multiverse. Do I have to do something special about it?
[20:04] <jpatrick> cyberix: no, it does it by itself
[20:04] <cyberix> ok
[20:05] <silwol> can somebody tell me what the necessary steps are to split a debian package in an arch-independent data and arch-dependent binary package?
[20:05] <jpatrick> cyberix: if a build-dep is in multi- it automagically gets sent there
[20:07] <silwol> i already put secretmaryo into a package, but when i split it up (i looked at the supertux3 package for information) the data files still stay in the binary package
[20:07] <danboid> hi there!
[20:08] <cyberix> jpatrick: I don't think that is the case here
[20:08] <danboid> I'm got a package that I've compiled under gutsy thats missing from the repos and I'm considering packaging it- I've already reported it as a bug on launchpad
[20:08] <cyberix> jpatrick: Debhelper is going to be the only builddep it seems.
[20:09] <jpatrick> cyberix: so it's in universe :)
[20:09] <cyberix> jpatrick: No. It is lacking source code.
[20:09] <danboid> but there is a slight prob- something I need to know before I go ahead and create the package
[20:10] <danboid> prob being that its a 'dead' app, development has ceased and I'm not a coder but the prog works great and is best of its kind for Linux
[20:10] <somerville32> Where are the binary packages for hardy kept?
[20:11] <jpatrick> somerville32: in the repos?
[20:11] <somerville32> ...
[20:12] <rexbron> :p
[20:12] <somerville32> at http://archive.ubuntu.com
[20:12] <somerville32> I want to download debootstrap for hardy so that I can create a pbuilder environment for it
[20:12] <danboid> could this prevent my package being accepted into universe?
[20:13] <bddebian> danboid: It shouldn't, though it would be ideal to have an active upstream
[20:13] <rexbron>  somerville32, look at packages.ubuntu.com
[20:13] <rexbron> there is a dl link on the packages page
[20:14] <danboid> bddebian: of course! That's good news though. Once I have my deb, who shall I send it to?
[20:14] <bddebian> danboid: Upload it to REVU
[20:14] <danboid> its's got to be checked by a couple of MOTUs right?
[20:14] <bddebian> Yes
[20:14] <somerville32> rexbron, On the front page?
[20:15] <rexbron> somerville32: use the search field
[20:15] <rexbron> somerville32: and select hardy as a distro to searcg
[20:16] <nenolod> hi minghua
[20:16] <minghua> Hello nenolod.
[20:16] <somerville32> thanks
[20:17] <nenolod> would anyone happen to know when next sync from debian/main happens for hardy?
[20:31] <cyberix> How long does it take for my dput -f to become visible on REVU site?
[20:31] <somerville32> 5-15 minutes
[20:32] <Jazzva> I think I read somewhere that diff from *.po files should be removed when merging, but I can't find it atm. Is that right?
[20:33] <somerville32> I believe so
[20:35] <Jazzva> Hmm, ok... Thanks somerville32
[20:38] <LaserJock> we should maybe have the written down somewhere
[20:40] <somerville32> Is the following warning unacceptable?
[20:40] <somerville32> W: catfish source: debian-rules-ignores-make-clean-error line 30
[20:40] <Jazzva> LaserJock: The removal of po files? I think it already is, but I can't find it right now. I can add it to the Merging page on wiki.
[20:43] <Jazzva> somerville32: I think somethign along the "if [ -f Makefile ] ;make clean; fi;" should work, but I'm not sure about syntax.
[20:43] <LaserJock> Jazzva: well, we need a definitive statement and then it should go somewhere where people will find it
[20:44] <Jazzva> LaserJock: I think that the Merging page is a good place for that :). Just if it's a definitive statement...
[20:45] <LaserJock> well, I would say maybe UbuntuDevelopment or something
[20:53] <joejaxx> jdong: are you ever going to come by? :P
[21:01] <somerville32> When I try to create a new dpatch, it tells me it doesn't exist -_-
[21:02] <pochu> somerville32: use 'dpatch-edit-patch patch 10_your_patch_name.dpatch'
[21:02] <bddebian> somerville32: Add this: [ ! -f Makefile ] ||   before -$(MAKE) clean (or distclean)
[21:03] <somerville32> pochu, That is what I'm using. Oh wait. I know the issue.
[21:03] <somerville32> I added it to 00list so it looking to apply it
[21:33] <cyberix> Can I get the lintian error log somehow without uploading the package to REVU?
[21:33] <LaserJock> cyberix: sure
[21:33] <LaserJock> run lintian on your package
[21:33] <LaserJock> :-)
[21:34] <imbrandon> lintian and linda
[21:34] <cyberix> :-)
[21:34] <cyberix> That sure shortens the debugging cycle
[21:37] <somerville32> :-]
[21:38] <norsetto> cyberix: remember to run them on both the source package and the binary ones
[21:48] <cyberix> norsetto: ACK
[21:51] <jpatrick> any revu admins around?
[21:52] <cyberix> My package should depend on X, but which package would be correct?
[21:54] <crimsun_> do you mean "the X Window System" or a virtual package you happen to call "X"?
[21:54] <crimsun_> (and you'll need to be specific regarding /which/ part of the X Window System is necessary if you are in fact referring to the former)
[21:56] <cyberix> Well, I depend on Wine and I first expected it to depend on X, but it apparrently doesn't.
[21:57] <cyberix> So now I'd need to figure out which parts of X it uses while running the piece of software I'm packaging
[21:57] <cyberix> I don't see how I could easily do that.
[21:58] <crimsun_> wine doesn't imply an X Window System dependency
[21:58] <crimsun_> (e.g., try running the Monkey's Audio executable, mac.exe, through Wine.  There's no X Window System dependency.)
[21:59] <minghua> crimsun_: Do you really run mac.exe through wine?
[21:59] <crimsun_> minghua: I have, historically, but I don't currently.
[22:00] <minghua> crimsun_: Do you know there is mac's source for linux floating around, then?
[22:01] <crimsun_> minghua: yes, I'm aware of it and its potential license landmine, even
[22:01] <minghua> (probably it's better to use mplayer's decoder now, though)
[22:01] <minghua> Right, license landmine indeed.
[22:02] <crimsun_> right, now ffmpeg has a decoder of some fashion, but I'm not convinced it's feasible [since ffmpeg is in Ubuntu main]
[22:03] <crimsun_> cyberix: wine seems to Depend on the core libs and then some.  Are there any "Missing extension foo" errors?
[22:03] <minghua> Yeah.  But at least the licensing situation is clear.
[22:03] <gnomefreak> crimsun_: are you gonna be around in a few hours or tomorrow?
[22:04] <crimsun_> gnomefreak: I'll be around until 9ish tonight EDT
[22:04] <crimsun_> possibly 10 if the coffee shop remains open - haven't been here in a while so I don't recall the hours
[22:04] <gnomefreak> ok ill see if i have GUI around than
[22:04] <crimsun_> ok
[22:05] <gnomefreak> i ran into issues with trilug site
[22:05] <gnomefreak> hopfully iceape is fixed and i can boot gutsy
[22:06] <somerville32> Why is there two QA tools (linda + lintian)?
[22:07] <somerville32> Why not just have one?
[22:08] <LaserJock> because linda sucks less? ;-)
[22:09] <crimsun_> inertia, probably.
[22:10] <crimsun_> case in point: despite oss and alsa both existing, neither are going anywhere anytime soon.  We end up with the quagmire that is audio in Linux.
[22:10] <LaserJock> good example
[22:10] <Nafallo> ehrm
[22:10] <Nafallo> when did I become the bug contact for erlang? :-P
[22:13] <Burgundavia> the you-touched-it-last beast
[22:14]  * Nafallo goes to rectify ;-)
[22:14] <Nafallo> I hate erlang!
[22:14] <Nafallo> I didn't touched it last btw...
[22:14] <Nafallo> I rather think I was out of my mind one evening.
[22:14] <Nafallo> one I can't remember
[22:16] <LaserJock> in Debian they guilt people into taking on packages "Think of all the poor orphans"
[22:16] <LaserJock> in Ubuntu we just have random LP "bugs" that assign you packages ;-)
[22:18] <Nafallo> lol
[22:18] <somerville32> Why isn't revu hosted by Canonical?
[22:18] <Nafallo> somerville32: it is.
[22:19] <somerville32> Ok
[22:19] <somerville32> Why does it have the domain that it has?
[22:19] <somerville32> Why not revu.ubuntu.com or something?
[22:19] <Nafallo> somerville32: ask siretart. it's his domain ;-)
[22:21] <somerville32> Does revu purge accounts?
[22:21] <somerville32> It says I don't have one.
[22:23] <pwnguin> so on a scale from 1 to 10 how evil is c# in ubuntu?
[22:23] <crimsun_> with 1 being least evil?  Probably about a 1.
[22:23] <Nafallo> pwnguin: ajmitch slomo_ should know :-)
[22:24] <pwnguin> apparently the guy who wrote egoboo wrote a sequel
[22:25] <pwnguin> but i have no idea how to compile it and it currently shipts a .vcproj
[22:27] <norsetto> g'night good folks
[22:28] <pwnguin> hrm
[22:29] <pwnguin> maybe its just C code with some goofy macros
[22:33]  * pwnguin loves porting windows programs
[22:33] <pwnguin> you get all sorts of stupid errors like capitalization
[22:38] <somerville32> :)
[22:45] <imbrandon> pwnguin, isnt .vcproj a c++.net project file , e.g. Visual Studio 2005+
[22:46] <pwnguin> i have no idea anymore
[22:46] <pwnguin> but this is all C
[22:46] <imbrandon> and yes i agree with crimsun_ , c# / mono on ubuntu/debian is about the best ootb setup there is for mono
[22:46] <pwnguin> with some ridiulus macros
[22:46] <pwnguin> well, i was thinking about how well recieved beagle was
[22:46] <pwnguin> and mono
[22:47] <imbrandon> there are quite a few mono apps in ubuntu, its a official dep of gnome iirc
[22:47] <pwnguin> that doesnt sound right
[22:48] <imbrandon> f-spot, beagle, banshie are a few i know about
[22:48] <StevenK> banshee
[22:48] <imbrandon> yea lol
[22:48] <somerville32> Can someone pretty please review my upload? http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=499
[22:48] <cyberix> Ok. I worked the issues that were mentioned. Is there still something? http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=pq
[22:48] <pwnguin> i dont think any of those are officially gnome
[22:49] <Nafallo> tomboy
[22:49] <somerville32> Gnome does depend on mono, pretty sure
[22:49] <Nafallo> pwnguin: apt-cache showsrc nautilus
[22:50] <pwnguin> Nafallo: ?
[22:50] <somerville32> imbrandon, Would you review my package? :]
[22:50] <Nafallo> pwnguin: that will show some beagle stuff IIRC :-)
[22:50] <Nafallo> pwnguin: in the build-deps.
[22:51] <imbrandon> somerville32, give me a few moments and i can have a look
[22:51] <pwnguin> nope
[22:51] <somerville32> imbrandon, Thanks :)
[22:51] <pwnguin> oh, there it is
[22:51] <pwnguin> after launchpad integration and before tracker client
[22:52] <pwnguin> sounds like an Ubuntu thing. oh well. its all moot, as this is just C
[22:52] <Burgundavia> anybody here to do a quick review of a post before it goes live?
[22:53] <crimsun> sure, url?
[22:53] <imbrandon> Burgundavia, i can peek too if you like
[22:54] <somerville32> me too
[22:54] <crimsun> how should I be correcting?
[22:54] <Burgundavia> tell me in the PM
[22:54] <crimsun> (not identified, don't recall the pass)
[22:55] <Burgundavia> crimsun: can you not see the URL?
[22:55] <pwnguin> is there a standard header for C typedefing BOOL?
[22:55] <crimsun> I saw it, but I'm trying to find a way to tell you corrections
[22:55] <Burgundavia> crimsun: just tell me in PM, if that works
[22:56] <james_w> Just to let you know that I believe it should be possible to sync accerciser, even though MoM shows conflicts. I can't work on it myself at the moment though.
[22:56] <Burgundavia> I would create you an account, but that sets a precedent. however, you are a person that I don't see a problem with having the account
[22:56] <Burgundavia> imbrandon, somerville32: sorry, crimsun was faster
[22:56] <imbrandon> Burgundavia, no worries
[22:58] <imbrandon> pwnguin, no since Gnome 2.16 Mono is an official dependency, loking for the revelant links now
[22:59] <imbrandon> its not just a Ubuntu thing
[22:59] <imbrandon> looking*
[23:08] <_16aR_> Hello
[23:08] <somerville32> Hiya :)
[23:08] <_16aR_> is it possible to create package only docs ?
[23:08] <_16aR_> like : debian/packagename.docs
[23:11] <imbrandon> e.g. make a packeg containing only documentaion
[23:11] <imbrandon> sure
[23:12] <somerville32> imbrandon, poke
[23:13] <imbrandon> somerville32, is this package in debian too ?
[23:13] <somerville32> Not when I first packaged it in Feisty
[23:13] <imbrandon> somerville32, i dident forget looking now
[23:13] <imbrandon> somerville32, what about now ?
[23:14] <somerville32> I'm not sure how to look
[23:14] <imbrandon> http://packages.debian.org/catfish would be a first place to start
[23:14] <imbrandon> ( i havent looked )
[23:15] <somerville32> no results
[23:15] <imbrandon> looks like it isnt, thats cool so the maintainer dosent need to be changed
[23:15] <imbrandon> but i would sugest it, not a requirement though
[23:15]  * imbrandon is still looking
[23:16] <somerville32> Someone told me when I first packaged it that I should push it up to debian
[23:16] <somerville32> I'm not sure how to do that either.
[23:16] <imbrandon> yea i would sugest that
[23:16] <imbrandon> ok it looks good, you want me to upload ? it dosent require 2 ack's since its only an update
[23:16] <imbrandon> and i'll help you get a debian sponsor too if you wish
[23:17] <imbrandon> debian sponsorship acts much like ubuntu sponsorship
[23:17] <imbrandon> justa  few diffrent tools
[23:17] <imbrandon> and it helps that there are willing DD's to upload in here at times
[23:18] <imbrandon> azeem sometimes is willing to sponsor new packages to Debian, but i cant speak for him, you might poke him later
[23:18] <imbrandon> somerville32, ^^
[23:19]  * azeem is currently very busy with opensync stuff, sorry
[23:19]  * cheatr is looking for help packaging a small perl script
[23:19] <imbrandon> azeem, cool thanks, just the first person that came to mind :)
[23:20] <somerville32> imbrandon, That would be awesome. Is it harder to get something uploaded in Debian?
[23:21] <imbrandon> not really as long as its a quality package
[23:21] <somerville32> And how would I continue to maintain the package? Would I have to get a sponsor each time?
[23:21] <imbrandon> yes, often you can work with the same sponsor and build a relationship with them
[23:22] <imbrandon> somerville32, have you ever seen mentors.debian.net ?
[23:22] <somerville32> Nope.
[23:22] <imbrandon> its kinda like REVU for debian
[23:22] <imbrandon> take a look at it while i upload this
[23:25] <crimsun> hmm.  Well, can't build the new ladspa module for pulseaudio.
[23:26] <crimsun> silly main/universe split
[23:26] <imbrandon> crimsun heh
[23:27] <imbrandon> somerville32, catfish uploaded , please archive on REVU, it might take a while to build if the buildd's are still backed up
[23:29] <imbrandon> somerville32, iirc http://mentors.debian.net will explain how to file a ITP and such after you have uploaded it there, it will give your perspective DD a good place to review it, SOMETIMES DD's will use REVU also and you can just point them there, but rember there will have to atleaste be a versioning change to upload to debian
[23:29] <somerville32> imbrandon, I don't think I can archive on REVU.
[23:30] <imbrandon> somerville32, you should be able to, on the main page list off to the right of the package
[23:30] <imbrandon> should be under the "Actions" column , irrc anyone can archive uploads
[23:30] <imbrandon> iirc*
[23:30] <somerville32> The actions column is blank
[23:30] <imbrandon> ahh ok, i'll do it for you then
[23:31] <imbrandon> sorry about that
[23:31] <somerville32> Thanks :]
[23:40] <crimsun> hmm, pasuspender probably needs to remain in the main package.
[23:43] <imbrandon> anyone got a merge they just dont feel like doing ? i'm outa merges
[23:44]  * Nafallo looks
[23:45] <crimsun> sure, there're alsa-*
[23:45]  * crimsun cackles
[23:45] <bddebian> heh
[23:46] <crimsun> 'evening, barry
[23:46] <bddebian> Heya crimsun
[23:46] <Nafallo> imbrandon: nope. irssi taken and gajim is mine :-P
[23:47] <imbrandon> crimsun heheh
[23:49] <imbrandon> RAOF, ping
[23:50] <joejaxx> StevenK: are you steve kowalik?
[23:51] <imbrandon> joejaxx, yes
[23:51] <joejaxx> oh ok
[23:51] <imbrandon> RAOF, are you actively working on the apt-proxy merge ? if not i'll grab that one real fast
[23:51] <imbrandon> joejaxx, got me a ppc iso yet? heh
[23:51] <imbrandon> with KDrive
[23:51] <imbrandon> :P
[23:51] <somerville32> How do I setup a pbuilder env to work with debian?
[23:52] <joejaxx> imbrandon: no lol i have been doing uds stuff all week
[23:52] <crimsun> somerville32: use a Debian release [name]? : )
[23:52] <joejaxx> plus my laptop was out of commission
[23:52] <imbrandon> somerville32, just subsitute hardy with sid when building it
[23:53] <somerville32> What would be the sources.list?
[23:53] <crimsun> I wouldn't even worry about that
[23:54] <somerville32> Well, I have three environments setup
[23:54] <somerville32> /var/cache/pbuilder/<distro>
[23:54] <somerville32> And in it, I have apt.config which is the apt config files
[23:54] <crimsun> i.e., cp /usr/share/doc/pbuilder/examples/pbuilder-distribution.sh ~/pbuilder-sid && mkdir -p ~/pbuilder/result && ~/pbuilder-sid create
[23:55] <imbrandon> yup as crimsun said ^^
[23:55] <zul> hey
[23:55] <crimsun> heya zul
[23:55]  * Fujitsu awakes.
[23:55] <imbrandon> wasup zul
[23:55] <somerville32> E: Failed getting release file http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/sid/Release
[23:56] <crimsun> hey Fujitsu
[23:56] <white> Fujitsu: it's about time ;)
[23:56] <white> even lazy students are already awake :)
[23:56] <zul> not much just got home
[23:56] <Fujitsu> white: Bah, I was up until past 4am.
[23:56] <Fujitsu> (and had breakfast)
[23:57] <white> oh breakfast ...
[23:57] <imbrandon> somerville32, you need to change that to e.g. http://ftp.us.debian.org.debian sid main contrib non-free, or similar
[23:57] <white> last time i had proper breakfast was at home home
[23:57] <crimsun> hmm, that's definitely a bug
[23:57] <somerville32> crimsun, What is?
[23:57] <crimsun> oh, no it's not.
[23:58] <crimsun> (I just read changelog.gz)
[23:58] <imbrandon> i wish we had a ITP system, i'd really like ot know if someone intends on packaging awn before i upload it
[23:58] <Fujitsu> imbrandon: needs-packaging bugs?
[23:58] <crimsun> somerville32: the default archive is archive.ubuntu.com is pbuilderrc
[23:58] <imbrandon> Fujitsu, on LP? people actualy use that ?
[23:59] <crimsun> in pbuilderrc, even
[23:59]  * somerville32 grumbles.
[23:59] <imbrandon> whats our policy on syncing from mentors.d.n ?
[23:59] <azeem> w35
[23:59] <azeem> oops