[00:07] Anyone have any recommendations on a inexepensive TV out card that'll work on a small form factor? [00:32] solarbaby, pvr-150 [00:32] low profile [00:36] tv-out, tgm4883 [00:36] I've got a passively-cooled geforce 6200 which works nicely [00:36] 2400HD here [01:18] after installing mythbuntu i get an error 22 after it tries to load grub. I rebooted into the livecd and have reinstalled grub but it still doesn't work. [01:19] oddly enough though if i boot up with the livecd and choose load from hard disk it does indeed boot into my install [01:19] does anyone know whats going on? [03:14] superm1: which tv out card would you recommend for a small form factor? === Sphagnum is now known as Tari|zzz [06:57] Could someone who's running TVOutFormat COMPONENT and TVStandard HD480i tell me what their desktop resolution is? [07:08] I don't think it really matters, "1024x768" "800x600" "720x400" "640x480" [07:08] are the modes that mine runs at, though doing things with the desktop, the smaller the more readable [07:08] rhpot1991: Are you using COMPONENT output? [07:08] I believe that mythtv will scale across all of them [07:08] rhpot1991: And HD480i? [07:08] component on one, composite on the other [07:09] rhpot1991: I'm more worried about getting X setup for COMPONENT out than myth right now. [07:09] is 480i even HD [07:09] rhpot1991: I don't consider it HD, but that's what nVidia calls that mode. [07:09] rhpot1991: They call it that in their X configuration options. [07:10] let me pasetbin this [07:10] !pastebin [07:10] pastebin is a service to post large texts so you don't flood the channel. The Ubuntu pastebin is at http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org (make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the #ubuntu channel topic) [07:12] http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/44981/ [07:13] thats my xorg config that uses component and 480i [07:14] rhpot1991: yeah, that's what I'm looking for [07:14] rhpot1991: And all those modes you listed above are available to you? [07:14] obviously ignore the stuff thats commented out [07:14] rhpot1991: You said you had two computers, one running component out and the other running composite out? That xorg.conf is the one for the component out? [07:14] yep [07:15] Option"TvOutFormat""Component" [07:15] Option"TVStandard""HD480i" [07:15] rhpot1991: yeah, saw that, wanted to make sure [07:15] I use nx to access the box remotely too [07:15] so thats what I use the other settings for [07:15] rhpot1991: And, all those resolutions you listed above in the channel here are available to you when you go to a desktop? [07:16] I generally throw it to 640x480 if I'm looking on the tv screen [07:16] I use the automagic frontend login, so I am not totally sure what resoluation that chooses, but I am pretty sure mythtv will scale to any of those and video playback shouldn't be effected [07:22] make sense? [07:24] rhpot1991: yeah, thanks for the info, that's exactly what i was looking for [07:25] rhpot1991: My problem is that as soon as I put TVOutFormat COMPONENT in my xorg.conf, I get no picture on that monitor at all. [07:25] rhpot1991: If I put in SVIDEO and hook up my television via SVIDEO, it works fine. [07:26] did the card come with some component dongle? [07:26] also do you have Option"ConnectedMonitor""TV" in there? [07:26] rhpot1991: Yeah. The dongle thing fits into the graphics card, then on the other side, you can either plug in a component cable or an s-video one. [07:26] rhpot1991: Yes to ConnectedMonitor TV. [07:27] you are sure you mean component and not composite, right? [07:27] Yes, I mean component. [07:27] alright, just making sure [07:28] I had a hell of a time with svideo on my nvidia 6xxx cards [07:28] all wavy with colors [07:28] The plug-ins on the end of the dongle are red, green, and blue. Plus, the card's manual says it'll do 1080i - which has to be component. [07:28] component fixed it, but I tried just using a dongle with random cards and it didn't like that [07:28] hmmm, what card? [07:28] What do you mean a dongle with random cards? [07:29] rhpot1991: Leadtek Winfast A6200 - http://www.leadtek.com.tw/eng/3d_graphic/specification.asp?pronameid=189&lineid=1&act=2 [07:29] took a dongle from one card, and plugged it into a different card [07:29] I actually had that page up in another window. [07:29] rhpot1991: Nah, this dongle came in the box with the graphics card. [07:29] hmmm, that should work [07:29] I have 2 6200's here [07:29] rhpot1991: No kidding. [07:29] rhpot1991: They're not Leadteks are they? [07:30] though one is asus [07:30] and I'm trying to think of what the other is [07:30] le tme go check [07:31] actually one is a 7600 [07:31] both asus cards [07:32] been a while since I messed with the xorg config, I recall having a problem where my colors were all messed up when I was trying to get component working [07:32] I think setting 480i fixed that [07:32] pastebin your xorg.conf and I'll see if there is anything funky [07:33] rhpot1991: When you had that problem, did you have TVOutFormat COMPONENT in there the whole time? [07:33] I think so, but its been so long [07:35] also, did you check your xorg logs to make sure there weren't any errors when you lost the screen? [07:35] http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/44982/ [07:35] rhpot1991: Yeah, I been working on this a week. Am pretty familiar with Xorg.0.log now. [07:36] rhpot1991: I've got some modelines in there I been playing with, I've tried it without any modelines also. [07:37] whats up with the mulitple monitors/screens? Hooked up to a monitor and a tv at the same time? [07:38] rhpot1991: Yeah. [07:38] rhpot1991: But, for testing for now, I've narrowed it down so only one screen is in the layout. [07:38] rhpot1991: All the television stuff is called like "Television Device", "Television Screen", and just "Television" for the Monitor section. [07:39] ya [07:40] try to do component and check your xorg logs [07:40] see if it says anything in there [07:41] Option"ConnectedMonitor" "TV" seemes to be commented out [07:41] I'm not sure about this line either: Option"MetaModes" "720x480" [07:42] I have something similiar in mine, but its commented out [07:42] i'm doing all this stuff you're saying [07:42] hold on [07:42] ok [07:43] i just tried uncommenting ConnectedMonitor, even though I've tried that before. [07:43] you know ctrl+alt+bckspace restarts x for you, right? [07:43] Any recommendations on a trouble free video out card.. maybe a mixture of svideo and anything else that I might need, also small form factor? [07:44] what else do you need [07:44] ? [07:44] solarbaby: Whatever you do, do not get a Leadtek WinFast A6200. [07:44] nothing else yet.. but ya never know down the line.. [07:44] I dont think ahead much [07:44] heh [07:44] Thanks levander I will be sure to honor that suggestion [07:44] agp/pci/pcie? [07:45] this computer has 2 free pci, and 1 free agp.. like i said small form factor [07:46] I've been very spoiled by my xbox doing all the video out in the passed, but its time to get this baby doing its job [07:47] hmmm apparently newegg doesn't have the card I have anymore [07:47] too bad I like it, not super small, but fanless [07:47] I love their prices [07:47] quiet is a extra benefit.. this computer is nearly silent [07:48] http://www.asus.com/products.aspx?l1=2&l2=7&l3=320&l4=0&model=1479&modelmenu=1 [07:48] looks like I payed $90 for that back in august [07:49] rhpot1991: thanks for the pointers, i just uncommented the ConnectedMonitor option, put TVOutFormat COMPONENT back in, and checked the log, nothing... [07:49] just no video [07:49] I also had a hell of a time with svideo output not working properly with my tv, even called evga on it and their tech support told me to get a better card (for working svideo output!) [07:50] rhpot1991: I'm really thinking I just hit a bug with the nvidia driver. COMPONENT just doesn't work with my video card and the nvidia driver. [07:50] lavander: you said you had svideo working right? [07:50] there is no reason it shouldn't [07:50] rhpot1991: Yeah. But, how much better does component make the same resolution look? [07:50] rhpot1991: that doesn't look small form factor [07:50] rhpot1991: No reason other than a bug in the driver. [07:50] well I have that problem where svideo looks like shit from these cards [07:51] rhpot1991: Does component look better? [07:51] dunno if its my tv being picky or what [07:51] yes, but mainly cause svideo is so bad [07:51] and there shouldn't be a bug, cause mine is working [07:51] are you running gutsey? [07:51] rhpot1991: Yeah, that's why I was putting so much effort into getting component working. [07:51] rhpot1991: Yeah, Gutsy. [07:51] rhpot1991: sometimes if your tv supports both pal and ntsc with some cards it can spaz [07:52] as far as I know my tv is ntsc only [07:52] Yeah well, that'd just be a different bug than the one I think I got now. It's not like if my monitor supports PAL that I could turn it off somehow. [07:52] levander: you checked Xorg.0.log [07:52] in /var/log, right? [07:53] About 100 times now... [07:53] hmmmm [07:53] wait, are you ntsc or pal? [07:53] * solarbaby gives levander a much needed hug! [07:54] rhpot1991: It's just not normal that I would put TVOutFormat COMPONENT in my xorg.conf and I get no picture. Especially when I directly change it from TVOutFormat SVIDEO, and the picture (on an s-video cable) is fine. [07:54] I'm NTSC. [07:54] did you play around with 'auto' at all? [07:54] rhpot1991: You mean nvidia-auto-select for the resolution, or you mean something else? [07:55] you can plug auto in to random places and let it guess for you [07:55] let me look for the documentation on that [07:55] solarbaby: I hope you and your hug purchase a video card that behaves just as poorly as mine! [07:56] think this is bad, go buy an ATI card [07:56] rhpot1991: I'm going to look at onboard intel cards next. I thought I saw something, does intel have open source Linux drivers? [07:56] levander: why? [07:56] I stopped using my 9600 pro cause it only showed the top 1/3rd of the video, a well documented bug that was 18 months old [07:56] and never fixed [07:56] solarbaby: because you were sarcastic damnit [07:56] levander: no i wasn't [07:57] * rhpot1991 settles everyone down [07:57] solarbaby: Well, that makes me want to punch you in the face even more. [07:57] levander: I dont find joy in other peoples technical problems [07:57] Okay, just ban solarbaby. I'm sick of him. [07:57] I'm gonna getta smoke. BRB. [07:57] levander: your just having a hard time, you'll feel better tomorrow.. [07:58] rhpot1991: the cards listed in the wiki dont really state opinions or ease of use [07:59] rhpot1991: and not a single one of them specify small form factor [08:00] by small form factor, do you mean half height? [08:00] yes [08:00] just find an nvidia 5-7 series [08:00] and you should be fine [08:01] anything other than that, find someone who has one and ask them [08:01] some guys here use ATI now, but I gave mine up a year or so ago [08:01] I dont mind going with the flow on video [08:02] Does Intel have open source graphics card drivers? [08:02] solarbaby: If they do, you can't get much more silent or cheap than an onboard card. [08:02] the only thing with the 6-7 cards is you get monocrome osd's with XvMC [08:02] any special details I should pay attention too? like for now Svideo will be fine.. but later on I may upgrade my TV, so should I get a card that has svideo and other stuff too? [08:02] levander: yes, but they aren't really open IIRC [08:02] solarbaby: For upgrading you definitely want at least component. But, the best is to get HDMI. [08:03] rhpot1991: I need to look into Intel video cards next time I get a chance. [08:03] I got something to try [08:03] solarbaby: HDMI (I think) is the only way you might ever be able to get HD DVD or BluRay on your PC. [08:03] change your "TVOutFormat" to "AUTOSELECT" [08:04] plug in your component only [08:04] k, hold only [08:04] and leave the tvsdtandard on 480i [08:04] component only already plugged in [08:04] levander: thats what I was thinking after all the things I read but didn't entirely understand [08:04] reboot x and see what happens, then we can check for something in the log [08:04] solarbaby: I still don't understand all that HDMI mess. [08:05] I haven't taken the dive to HD either, so I can't speak there [08:05] I think in about a year i'll be ready to look into HD.. but for now im good [08:05] I'm still opposed to paying comcast half of my pay and the rest for a TV [08:06] as much as I have enjoyed the MythTV frontend, Im betting that the XBMC frontend to MythTV is going to be soemthing very special... Honestly Im used to that setup [08:07] XBMC Linux frontend is what im talking about specificly.. too bad its not ready yet [08:08] never used it [08:08] maybe when I get a 360 for giftmas I'll mod my xbox and play with it [08:08] I doubt it'll ever have all the Scheduling goodies MythTV's frontend has, but as far as being able to scrape data for TV shows and stuff online, they have it down [08:08] rhpot1991: you wont regret it [08:09] any luck with that yet? [08:09] Okay, it's up and running with auto-select. I've got picture, it's black and white. It looks the same as when I have TVOutFormat SVIDEO. [08:10] What did you want me to check for in the log? [08:10] search for TVOutFormat [08:10] see what it picked [08:11] I just searched the log for TVOutFormat, this is the only line that showed up: "(**) NVIDIA(0): Option "TVOutFormat" "AUTOSELECT"" [08:11] It's just echoing what I have in xorg.conf. [08:11] vi the log and look around there [08:11] should say somewhere that it picked a certain mode to use [08:11] or nano if you prefer [08:11] The log is open in emacs, which is superior to vi. [08:11] so be it [08:11] I C-r'd, the word TVOutFormat is only in there once. [08:12] maybe just look for TV [08:12] Oh wait, I just found this: "(**) NVIDIA(0): TV output format is auto selected" [08:12] I'll search 'tv'. [08:13] I looked through searching tv, didn't see anyting that looked good. [08:13] The words 'svideo' and 'component' don't show up at all. [08:14] let me try it on mine and see if I can find what I am looking for [08:14] also where the hell did I come up with 720x400 from [08:14] that's what someone told me to do [08:14] xorg is apparently removing that, double check the res section and make sure it didn't pull your res out [08:15] (WW) NVIDIA(0): No valid modes for "720x400"; removing. [08:15] (II) NVIDIA(0): Validated modes: [08:15] (II) NVIDIA(0): "1024x768" [08:15] (II) NVIDIA(0): "800x600" [08:15] (II) NVIDIA(0): "640x480" [08:15] is what it says in my log [08:15] I can take it out, all xorg does is throw it out because it's an invalid mode, then it goes back to nvidia-auto-select, and then it choose 800x600. [08:16] maybe run with that for now [08:16] Run with what? [08:16] till yuou get it working then add more resuoltions [08:16] nvidia-auto-select, or 800x600 [08:17] That's what I'm running with anyway. xorg just throws out 720x480. But, I'll take it out of the xorg.conf file. I'm convinced that other guy's suggestion isn't going to work anyway. [08:17] any idea if there is a way to reboot x from cli? [08:18] there, i just put it on nvidia-auto-select and commented out anything to do with 720x480 in xorg.conf [08:18] rhpot1991: "sudo /etc/init.d/gdm stop" is what i do [08:18] rhpot1991: But, I start X via gdm. [08:18] rhpot1991: I guess you could kill the X process directly. [08:19] rebooted it already [08:19] There's no "stopx" script is there? [08:19] I checked init.d [08:19] wasn't [08:19] I'm working remotely on this box with no keyboard attached to it, so I only have cli [08:19] rhpot1991: Do you start X via gdm? Like, do you log in with a graphical screen? Or, do you log in on a text screen? [08:20] rhpot1991: I see. [08:21] My resolution is set to nvidia-auto-select now. [08:21] I use the mythtv frontend package to automagically login [08:21] via gdm [08:21] and nx/ssh to access from elsewhere [08:22] if mythtv is using gdm to login, i'd try the "gdm stop" script sometime to see if that kills X [08:22] alright [08:22] hmmm, I'm seeing autoselect in here too [08:22] I swear it used to tell you what it picked [08:25] rhpot1991: I've found lots of places where NVIDIA messages in Xorg.0.log could mean one thing, could mean something else. [08:26] so when you do autoselect its giving you what, black and white now? [08:27] yeah, black and white [08:27] I think the thing is, an S-Video signal is in a different format than a component signal [08:28] And, because of the way my dongle lets you plug in either a s-video, or a component cable, or you can plug in both at the same time... [08:28] I'm thinking I'm just looking at an s-video signal through a component cable. [08:28] And, the image does show up when you do that. [08:28] It just shows up black and white. [08:29] So, I try to change it to a COMPONENT signal via TVOutFormat, and I don't get any picture at all. [08:29] That's what I think is happening anyway. [08:29] what happens if you change TVStandard to "NTSC-M" [08:29] same thing [08:29] lemme try it again [08:30] you can try a test where you force svideo and plug in the component, see if you get black and white then [08:30] yeah, same thing [08:30] also have you tried with a svideo cable when you had component on to see what happens? [08:30] rhpot1991: I've done that test, lots. [08:30] rhpot1991: What's itneresting.. [08:31] rhpot1991: If you have the black and white component signal up, you can then go in and plug in the svideo cable, and you get a color picture on the svideo cable without restarting X. [08:31] rhpot1991: Yeah, I've had both plugged in at the same time. [08:31] rhpot1991: They're actually both plugged into the same monitor, I cycle through the inputs with a button on the monitor. [08:31] ya it sounds like that card is pumping out svideo only for some reason [08:31] I tried it with both, only one, etc., etc. [08:31] rhpot1991: Exactly. [08:32] make a copy of your xorg.conf and try stipping junk out [08:32] stripping [08:32] rhpot1991: And, when I try to turn it to COMPONENT with TVOutFormat, I lose all picture altogether. [08:32] rhpot1991: Okay, that's not a bad idea, stripping out everything. [08:32] It's gonna take awhile though. [08:33] just make sure you m ake a copy first [08:33] I'll go back to my distribution one and just modify it by hand to be TVOut. [08:33] that way you can make sure you don't have some random line intefereing [08:33] ya [08:33] here is a useful link [08:33] rhpot1991: Yeah, I've got a bunch of xorg.conf backups, all cleverly named. [08:33] http://us.download.nvidia.com/XFree86/Linux-x86/100.14.19/README/chapter-16.html [08:33] rhpot1991: I know about everything on that page. [08:33] http://us.download.nvidia.com/XFree86/Linux-x86/100.14.19/README/part-01.html [08:33] is the index [08:33] alright [08:33] rhpot1991: If you have questions about it, feel free to ask. [08:34] rhpot1991: You're about the 3rd guy I've gotten to pay attention to this problem. [08:34] rhpot1991: You're going over a lot of the same stuff. Which gives me confidence I've checked all the usual stuff. [08:34] did you buy the card online or from a store? [08:34] rhpot1991: I doappreciate you looking at it. [08:34] rhpot1991: With other ideas, I'm all ears. [08:34] I went through it all before too [08:35] Went through all what? [08:35] so I'm glad to help out [08:35] tv out troubles [08:35] Yeah. Did it take you a week of free time to figure it out? [08:35] took me a while to get it all working, then I just left it be [08:35] more than that [08:35] I ordered serveral cards to try and figure out why svideo looked like crap [08:35] rhpot1991: That's the thing though. Setting TVOutFormat to COMPONENT really shouldn't take my picture away. [08:36] lol @ several cards... [08:36] figured that it was a brand problem, so I kept testing cards and it never went away [08:36] hahahaha [08:36] started ripping hardware out to see what could be interfering [08:36] nothing ever helped [08:36] Oh my god. [08:36] rhpot1991: I think S-Video just looks like crap. [08:36] I've seen it mentioned around a few times. [08:36] I had wavy action happening in bright colors [08:36] red/orange/etc [08:37] only on svideo though [08:37] and it happend on boot (like if I go into the bios), so it clearly wasn't a driver issue [08:37] Yeah, I've seen waves. But, I'm not sure if that was me looking at S-Video signal through a component cable. That's really what I been testing component. I just noticed S-Video is blurry. [08:37] but no company wanted to hear that from me (tech support kept giving me the run around) [08:38] if you don't get anywhere, try another card [08:38] Myabe it's a blessing that my card manufacturer, Leadtek, stopped doing business in the US. I never bothered to try and call them. [08:38] most companies will get confused when you say "I'm not running windows" [08:38] rhpot1991: That's the thing, I think I just need another card. [08:38] rhpot1991: Don't want to spend the money right now though. [08:38] is that card new? [08:39] circuit city took many cards back from me, all of which I told them were defective [08:39] rhpot1991: They only pay those support guys like $10/hr that answer the phone. All they know is whatever script the company puts in front of them. Then, they handle so many problems on the phone, some of them pick it up, most don't. [08:39] rhpot1991: Lol @ defective. [08:39] yep [08:39] But that's exactly why Circuit City is better than Best Buy. [08:40] Best Buy gives you bullshit hassle about returning stuff. [08:40] I think Best Buy employees make commissions somehow from refusing returns. [08:40] I was calling and they would let me talk to a manager right away after the first call at least [08:40] Calling the graphics card companies? [08:40] I used to work at circuit city actually [08:40] ya, xvga specifically [08:41] they were helpful that they would send me a new one, but I knew it wouldn't work as I already got myself a new one from CC [08:41] ended up telling me to get a better one, and I didn't like that solution (I did test it though, didn't help) [08:42] rhpot1991: But, you're only problem was waves in S-Video? That's what all this was trying to get over? [08:42] yep [08:42] I'm kinda anal about fixing things when they don't work [08:42] rhpot1991: Me too.... [08:42] went on and on about why should I pay $x when svideo doesn't even work [08:43] rhpot1991: You know, I've got three computers here, all with the cases off, all of which I've ripped the hardware apart several times, and I've never lost a single piece of hardware. [08:43] and my ATI card's svido didn't do the waves, but it had the whole driver issue where playback didn't work [08:43] rhpot1991: So, the problem wasn't even on the video card? [08:44] it has to be something with the svideo output from the nvidia cards and my tv being picky about it [08:44] cause its not some common problem that people know about [08:44] yeesh, that sux [08:44] but I tested so many cards I can tell you its not some single manufacturer or a single type of card [08:44] just got some fluke that cannot be avoided I guess [08:44] but component works fine, so I just pretend that svideo doesn't exist [08:44] yeah, it'd be nice if you could try a different tv [08:45] component is better anyway [08:45] would be, but I don't have another with svideo available here [08:45] wish my problem was that svideo doesn't work and component does [08:45] heh [08:45] i wouldn't bother testing it if you got component working [08:45] you can try ripping out the tvoutput line too, I just did that here and it worked still [08:46] didn't say autoselect anywhere, but I suspect thats what its falling back on [08:47] rhpot1991: Yeah, that was how I first got any picture at all on a component cable. I ripped out TVOutFormat. That's when I first got black and white on component. Later I realized I was probably looking at an S-Video signal over a component cable, and that's what causing the black and white. [08:48] thats what it sounds like [08:48] I had b&w when I didn't have component configured correctly, but you have the needed lines for it [08:48] Have you ever tried email linux-bugs@nvidia.com? I emailed them Thursday night, wonder if they'll get back to me. [08:49] rhpot1991: Yeah, lots of people have the black and white problem. It sounds like they all fix it a different way. Lots of different things must cause black and white. [08:49] can't say that I have [08:49] I'll be shocked if they reply. [08:50] I think changing from ntsc-m to hd480i fixed my b&w problem, but it was so long ago that I cannot be certain [08:50] But, now that I know more about the problem, I'm gonna try emailing them again tomorrow. With a better email. [08:50] have you tried posting in ubuntuforums.org? [08:50] rhpot1991: Yes. [08:50] http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=3780404#post3780404 [08:50] can try the ubuntu irc channel too, though I never had any luck in there [08:51] rhpot1991: That channel is for newbies. I never get any questions answered in there anymore. [08:52] I was asking about SATA speeds, I got a strange problem where I have 2 SATA drives in a box and one is slower, but not the drive, the first controller no matter what drive is plugged into it [08:52] everyone ignored me, each time [08:52] now I'm sad I just reminded myself that I never fixed that [08:53] you should go out to CC and pick up a new card, test it out and see if it works then take it back [08:53] would at least tell you if its the card or not [08:53] Sometimes I'll go in #debian and act like I'm just running testing in there. They can at least give you pointers as to where to go. [08:53] just make sure you get it back by 14 or is it 30 days [08:53] rhpot1991: Yeah, I may do that. [08:53] rhpot1991: You know that Circuit City has extended holiday return times? [08:54] then pick one up from newegg or something [08:54] might not give you cash back though [08:54] you might get stuck with a gift card [08:54] I think it's like anything bought between Oct. 1 and Dec. 31 can be returned until Jan. 1. [08:54] I got into a fight with them today [08:54] I called up on thursday and they said they would do a price match [08:54] I go to get it today and they wouldn't do it [08:54] a fight? [08:54] heh not really a fight, but had to argue with their customer service agent [08:54] yeah, that's weird [08:55] well the problem is they are all kids who don't care and will say anything to get you off the phone [08:55] i've gotten to the point where when anything out of the ordinary happens, i specifically ask the phone rep to make a note on my account [08:55] then wh en you go in and get someone else they say that its not their policy [08:55] and, i ask like 3 times, and i ask their name, to try to make sure they make a note [08:55] I need to start asking for names [08:55] rhpot1991: Yeah, I got sick of the thing where they go, "who'd you talk to?" [08:55] I specifically asked if they would price match a gift card deal and they said yes [08:56] even double checked for me [08:56] Like you have any idea. You just know that somebody answered the phone. [08:56] lol @ double checked [08:56] I had them screw me on 0% intereste before too [08:56] You shop as hard core as I do. [08:56] they told me I could add to a purchase to qualify for 1 year 0% [08:56] sure enough I never got it and when I showed up complaining they said there was nothing I could do [08:57]