[00:01] somerville32: I have no idea why the livefs buildd isn't picking up the new xubuntu-desktop seed, sorry. this will have to wait for one of the more experienced archivists to wake up and explain it to me [00:02] slangasek, try rebuilding -meta? [00:02] rebuild it why? [00:02] the one in unstable already has the correct dep [00:02] sorry, s/unstable/hardy/ [00:03] * Fujitsu was wondering why our metapackages would be in Debian. [00:03] because that's what happens when the channel only gets a quarter of my brain [00:05] Fujitsu: np, changes look great! thanks, I'm pushing the merge now [00:06] keescook: Great! Thanks. [00:07] * ogra starts his rsyncs to have the fresh isos tomorrow and goes to bed ... [00:07] slangasek, Is it possible 0-4 is being pulled in some other way? [00:07] somerville32: no, I've just checked that [00:07] slangasek, "make clean"? :P [00:08] somerville32: it was only a direct dependency because of the seed. I understand there's an extra cycle involved with updating the livefs's view of the meta packages, but I don't see why that wouldn't have been satisfied already - and anyway, if it isn't I don't know how to fix it [00:09] keescook: Aha, I see the merge seems to e done. [00:09] +b [00:10] yup, and I saw the LP "merge request" and marked it 'done' too. not sure what that really does. :P [00:10] `Merged 1 minute ago as revision 842', my branch now says. I presume that's what it did. [00:10] ah, no, I did that bit manually [00:11] That was the 34th merge ever, so I doubt anybody actually knows what it it's meant to do... [00:12] s/it // [00:12] hahah [00:19] stgraber: I don't seem to know how to enable the "upgrade" tests [01:42] siretart: libxine1-main in dapper recommends a bunch of gnome stuff but doesn't depend on any of it [02:10] dear kde. please use smaller packages. kthxbye [02:14] Haha [03:25] hi Hobbsee [03:27] hey aj [03:27] hey ajmitch [03:27] :) [03:28] Hobbsee, [03:28] Hobbsee, livefs failed again [03:29] Hobbsee, slangasek tried to fix it but doesn't know what is wrong [03:32] darn, who broke kubuntu too? [03:33] somerville32: lifefs archives look out of date. germinate's taken the change correctly, and it's mirrored correctly on the germinate output from this morning... [03:34] hello ajmitch Hobbsee somerville32 :) [03:34] hey joejaxx! [03:35] lamont: ping? [03:35] somerville32: poke elmo or lamont. this is a canonical problem. [03:35] Hobbsee: What appears to be broken? [03:36] Hobbsee: Also, hi, I'm bac. [03:36] back. too. [03:36] infinity: heya! and on a sane tz too! [03:36] Unable to type, but back. [03:36] infinity: which machine builds the livefs'es? [03:36] infinity: Hey! LTNS [03:36] Hobbsee: terranova for i386... Which arch is having issues? [03:36] infinity: both amd64 and i386 [03:37] infinity: xubuntu-meta is showing the correct thing, as is the germinate output on p.u.c, yet terranova and the other appear to be using the old package lists [03:37] Heya joejaxx [03:37] King is the amd64 livefs builder [03:38] * infinity looks. [03:38] infinity: it should be seeing xubuntu-desktop 2.53, but i'm betting it's only seeing 2.52, as it hasn't updated in a while. [03:38] thanks [03:38] Hobbsee: Oh, only xubuntu is having issues? [03:38] infinity: it appears so. [03:38] infinity: i'd say someone else has broken kubuntu, for another reason [03:39] infinity: but only xubuntu had teh -meta uploaded so late [03:39] afaik [03:39] Hobbsee: xubuntu has some hardcoded packages in livecd.sh. Did someone update the package when they updated the seeds? [03:39] E: Couldn't find package libgoffice-gtk-0-4 [03:39] ^--- That? [03:39] infinity: what would be the package of livecd.sh? [03:39] That's the hardcoded package. [03:39] infinity, we removed it from our seeds :/ [03:40] infinity, and slangasek said -meta was updated [03:40] *sigh*. and in keeping with doing non-standard things, are they going to switch all their packages to yada yet? [03:40] somerville32: The seeds had a comment in them to update livefs when that line changed. Someone should have done so. [03:40] Hobbsee: livecd-rootfs. [03:40] The livefs can't just use the seeds? [03:41] oh, nice. that didn't show up on my grep. === Shely is now known as iLeft [03:41] StevenK: It was a sticky and complex "apt resolves this incorrectly unless you kick it" thing. [03:41] infinity: right, can you please fix it? yes, it's that. [03:41] infinity: Ugh [03:41] infinity: i thought that's why they explicitly seeded it? [03:41] and so that was enough? [03:41] somerville32: Was that removed entirely from the seeds, or updated to a new SOVER? [03:42] infinity: the latter [03:42] updated to 0-5 [03:42] Hobbsee: They explicitely seed it to not seed the alternative, that won't help apt. [03:42] infinity: because apt will go for the alternative first? [03:42] Hobbsee: Right. [03:43] somerville32: you now anything about the libgoffice-gtk package? [03:43] Hobbsee: Do you have main upload rights these days? [03:43] Hobbsee: I'm not around my key yet (still in a moving mess), so I can't upload. [03:43] infinity, Hobbsee is a release manager :P [03:43] somerville32: Yes, I know she is, but those two are orthogonal things. [03:43] infinity: She's also a core-dev [03:43] somerville32: She was an RM long ago, and certainly wasn't core-dev at the time. [03:43] StevenK: Thanks. [03:43] infinity: Moving? Ugh. [03:43] Hobbsee: A cookie if you fix that for me. [03:43] infinity, I was unaware. [03:44] StevenK: Melbourne -> Calgary. [03:44] EWW [03:44] infinity: My condolences. [03:44] infinity, Is Melbourne in Canada? [03:44] somerville32: Aye. [03:44] Melbourne is in *Australia* [03:44] infinity, I'm in Fredericton [03:44] imbrandon: i was core-dev at the time i was playing RM. [03:44] er, infinity [03:44] infinity: and yes, i do [03:45] somerville32: Err, Melbourne's in Australia. Somehow, I read that as "is Calgary in..." [03:45] somerville32: i'm not, slangasek is. [03:45] (Technically, I'm an RM too, don't tell anyone) [03:45] infinity, Welcome to Canada :) [03:45] heh [03:45] * Hobbsee is still part of -release [03:45] infinity: Hope you didn't forget anything. :-P [03:45] Hobbsee: The fix is just s/0-4/0-5/ on livecd.sh, if you feel the urge. [03:45] * somerville32 urges Hobbsee [03:46] StevenK: Forgot everything. Taking a month off to move is painful on the memory. [03:46] somerville32: I was told today by an goffice upstream that libgoffice-gtk should not exist [03:46] infinity: When I say forgot anything, I meant like personal effects and stuff you left here [03:46] somerville32: do you know anything of the history of it? was it a part of the grand gtk/gnome split? [03:47] somerville32: do this prac for me hten :) [03:47] StevenK: Left a bunch of stuff behind intentionally. [03:47] StevenK: Furniture that we couldn't get rid of, mostly. [03:47] Ah [03:47] StevenK: Sucks, but oh well. :/ [03:47] * StevenK nods. [03:47] Hobbsee, Is "prac" some Aussie slang for homework? [03:47] no, practical [03:47] LaserJock, I don't know anything of the sort. [03:47] Hobbsee: If you want me to fix livefs-rootfs, I can. [03:47] LaserJock: It exists to strip libgoffice of GNOME deps, yes. [03:47] LaserJock, I'm just looking to get our desktop cd to build ;] [03:47] StevenK: i've got it here [03:48] Hobbsee: Kay [03:48] LaserJock, (would assume what infinity said) [03:48] infinity: I was told by upstream that that is not a great thing to do [03:48] LaserJock: Yes, but that's why it's free software. [03:48] HAh [03:49] as the gtk-only stuff was only there for Win32 [03:49] Oh, *EW* [03:49] so there could be lots of breakage [03:49] LaserJock: (goffice "works better" with GNOME deps, but Xubuntu is all about minimalism) [03:49] GTK on Win32 is pure crack [03:49] infinity: I realize, but I wonder if the Xubuntu guys knew what they were doing on this package [03:49] infinity: FYI, i had core dev. i just didn't have drescher access. [03:49] (for doing RM) [03:49] I'm concerned that it doesn't do what they thought it did [03:50] Hobbsee: Ahh, my mistake. Memory's fuzzy in my old age. [03:50] Hobbsee: You may now point, laugh, and call me an old fart. [03:50] nah, you're just old and decrepit [03:50] (I'm still having a hard time coping with having turned 30 2 months ago...) [03:51] LaserJock, It was done before my time. Ask mr_pouit [03:51] somerville32: I guess if nobody complains it's not a big issue, but I'm told that goffice will not print without the gnome stuff [03:51] for instance [03:51] LaserJock: goffice appears to function in Xubuntu. *shrug*... How well it functions is a matter to discuss with someone who uses fewer terminals and more GUIs than I do. [03:52] yeah, I guess we can just let the bugs decide ;-) [03:52] somerville32: what does Xubuntu use for office suite? [03:53] infinity: somerville32 uploaded. [03:53] Abiword and Gnumeric, as apt-cache depends xubuntu-desktop shows. [03:53] Hobbsee: Poor guy [03:54] infinity: thanks for pointing out my (and slangasek's) inability to read. [03:54] LaserJock, Abiword and Gnumerics [03:54] somerville32: hmm, then there could be issues [03:54] Hobbsee: Perhaps if the seed comment was in ASCII blink? [03:54] haha [03:55] somerville32: I might ask upstream a little more about it and shoot Xubuntu an email if it sounds like something to look into [03:55] LaserJock, thanks [03:55] Hobbsee: ? [03:56] imbrandon: sorry, wrong nick completion. i wanted infinity. [03:56] ahh okies [03:56] ponies ? [03:57] * LaserJock uses his laser to atomize every pony in sight [03:57] You missed one [03:57] Ponies! [03:58] * infinity ponders putting "< Hobbsee> ... i wanted infinity." in a fortune file somewhere. [03:58] It's about as close as I'll ever get to a compliment from you, I think. :P [03:59] * Hobbsee slaps infinity [03:59] infinity: i occasionally give compliments :P [03:59] Lies. Subterfuge. [03:59] Even more occasionally, they aren't back-handed compliments [03:59] * StevenK hides [04:00] Okay, life without PGP or SSH keys is actually rather crap. [04:00] infinity: where is livecd.sh and why does it hard-code this instead of pulling it via the seed? [04:00] slangasek: A) livecd-rootfs, B) apt hates me. [04:03] slangasek: If you just do a straight task-based *-desktop installation with apt, it will pull in the bloaty libgoffice instead, so we hardcode the lighter one. [04:03] slangasek: A bit of a pain, but oh well. [04:03] I hear you. [04:03] When the RCMP took my desktop (voluntarily - I did nothing wrong), I sulked [04:04] slangasek: I could add a tiny biy of logic to parse some apt-cache output to pick the right SOVER or something, but it changes once a year or so, so I didn't much care. [04:04] infinity: oh, so even though it's embedded in the seed, apt pulling in the task manages to get the wrong lib somehow? [04:04] slangasek: Yeah [04:04] somerville32: er, are you saying that the RCMP is in possession of your PGP key? [04:05] slangasek, Umm... [04:05] infinity: right, nasty then [04:05] slangasek, Possibly one of them... [04:05] And you upload to the archive using that key? [04:05] he cant upload [04:05] Ah [04:06] Umm... [04:06] * somerville32 just got a really really bad feeling in his stomach [04:06] We should change that. I'd like to see what the mounties would upload. [04:06] Haha [04:06] I had more than just pgp keys on there :/ [04:06] somerville32: If someone else gets your private key, *revoke it ASAP* [04:06] How do I revoke it without the private key? [04:07] You have a seperate revocation certificate backed up. Don't you? [04:07] No. [04:07] RCMP? [04:08] Royal Canadian Mounted Police [04:08] ion_, Canada's FBI + more [04:08] Way cool, the storm has connected as TheMuso. [04:08] I had ssh keys for certain servers owned by a certain company we all know. Should I get those changed ASAP or is it not that big of a deal? [04:09] Uh, yeah? [04:09] Why are you even asking this? :P [04:09] I thought that would have been fairly obvious. [04:09] StevenK: lol [04:09] Why did they take your computer? [04:09] Maybe somerville32 is a terrist. [04:09] lol [04:10] No no, I didn't do anything wrong [04:10] I just didn't think I had to worry about them having that, lol [04:10] * Hobbsee suspects that certain powers that be are going to rethink about giving somerville32 access [04:10] So why then? :-) I’m just curious. [04:11] I'm actually horribly embarrassed at the moment. I shouldn't have said anything. [04:11] somerville32: you'd get crucified even worse if people found out, after it was known to have been comprimised. [04:12] Well, I guess I know better now. I wasn't uploading packages or anything back then so I didn't think it mattered. [04:12] (or maybe I was, I can't really remember) [04:12] If it's in the web of trust, it matters. [04:13] But it never occurred to me how precious they might be [04:13] hum. come to think of it, why don't i have a revovication certificate for my new key? [04:13] Hobbsee: Because you didn't create one? [04:13] Hobbsee: Because you're a slacker? [04:13] * somerville32 goes to take care of this mess. [04:13] somerville32: it's not a very useful means of identifying you as a person if other people are in possession of it, is it? :) [04:13] Hobbsee: Send me your private key and your passphrase, and I'll generate a revcert for you. [04:13] StevenK: i did for my first, i forgot for my second :P [04:13] infinity: :P [04:13] Bwahaha [04:14] Hobbsee: I'm a touch-typist, I promise I won't actually read your passphrase as I type it. *nod* [04:14] He reads sbuild code, he lies! [04:14] infinity: Could you do that for me as well? I’ll post the info you requested to a pastebin. Thank you. [04:14] Bwahaha [04:15] ion_: *giggle* [04:15] Is it safe to put a backup of my private key, ssh-keys, and revok certs on my thumb drive? [04:15] I carry it with me always [04:15] somerville32: Encrypt the whole mess (valume level, or each file), and sure. [04:15] s/valume/volume/ [04:15] infinity, Can just encrypt those files instead? :P [04:16] * StevenK has an 10Mb encrypted FS on his USB key [04:16] slangasek: sup? [04:16] * RAOF thinks that is a fine idea, and looks at doing that himself. [04:16] enc-file: data [04:16] lamont: I give up, what? [04:17] somerville32: Are any of the 3 SSH keys you have listed on LP not in your possession? [04:17] slangasek: was wondering if you were still having the livefs issues, or if that's all happy [04:17] lamont: infinity tells me he's magicked it [04:17] kewl [04:17] lamont: I shamed some people into learning to read, then Hobbsee was kind enough to upload a fix, since I'm keyless this evening. [04:18] heh [04:18] * somerville32 sighs deeply. [04:18] * StevenK ponders handing infinity s/key/clue/ and then thinks better of it. [04:18] * StevenK ducks [04:18] StevenK: Behave. [04:19] StevenK: I may have been gone awhile, but I still vaguely recall how to make your life miserable. [04:19] infinity: I did think better of it. :-) [04:19] infinity: hey now, I was never looking at the seed at all, so I had no opportunity to overlook these comments. :) [04:19] StevenK: Thinking better outloud isn't quite the same thing. :) [04:20] infinity: Oh? Like you know how to do that better than I do. :-P [04:20] slangasek: Consider your slack not only cut, but in the mail. [04:22] I might go catch an early nap, so I can fight the jet-lag and deliver on this "normal core hours tomorrow" thing. [04:22] slangasek: Are you working vaguely 9-5ish most days? [04:25] slangasek: Well, assuming the answer to the above is "yes, which is why I'm not responding right now", I'll see you tomorrow morning. :) [04:25] heh [04:25] infinity: "more or less", yes [04:25] It's good to be back in a sane timezone. [04:26] But AEST is sane.... [04:26] * infinity hugs MST7MDT tightly, and refuses to let go. [04:26] infinity: if you're in the mood for taking the piss out of somerville32 more, perhaps you'll answer this. what should you do, apart from removing the keys from LP, if you don't have a revovication certificate, nor a private key for the key in question? [04:27] Hobbsee: If you have no access to the key or a revok cert, you can still get all the people who've signed your key to revoke THEIR sigs on your key. [04:27] infinity: it's a great TZ, isn't it? [04:27] infinity, no one signed it [04:27] Hobbsee: But, really, what you have is a free-floating key out there, and not much you can do about it. [04:27] Yay for the web of trust, if no one signed your key [04:27] somerville32: That's something positive, at least. [04:27] infinity: well, that's what i was thinking. presumably the only sane solution then is to attempt to drop all links from that key to you. [04:28] Hobbsee: get a farm of machines busy factoring it, and tehn you can revoke it. :0) [04:28] infinity, Are you a sys-admin? [04:28] somerville32: Depends on the day. [04:28] somerville32: We'll go with "yes", though. [04:28] lamont: it's not my key. it's somerville32's :P [04:28] infinity, Do you have access to humboldt? [04:28] Hobbsee: so? [04:28] somerville32: Oh, no I don't. [04:29] humbolt is in california. [04:29] infinity is in canada. [04:29] somerville32: Those who do are mostly in London. And asleep. [04:29] lamont: I suspect he meant root, not console. :) [04:31] Who ever Fujitsu was talking to but messaged me by mistake, my computer wasn't confiscated. [04:32] So the RCMP just took it for something to do? [04:32] They were borrowing it. [04:32] Haha [04:32] No, let them have it. Someone else did something wrong and they had evidence on that computer. It was not compromised in anyway. [04:32] what did the taser-loving RCMP do now? [04:33] somerville32: getting taken by the police == get compromised [04:33] getting, rather [04:33] ugh, my english sucks [04:33] Ok, it was compromised in that sense but I understand the ramifications at the time because I wasn't really using my keys at the time. [04:33] *did not understand [04:34] I'll call them tomorrow, get the key, and revoke it. [04:36] It isn't like I have upload rights anyhow. [04:42] somerville32: i'd be more worried about teh fact that the machines you have ssh access to may be compromised too. === mpt_ is now known as mpt === lc is now known as lcstudio === stu2 is now known as stub [07:21] Good morning [07:21] Morning pitti [07:22] pitti: do you have an ETA on the next lang pack update for Gutsy? [07:24] LaserJock: erm, one is currently in progress, I just don't get a lot of testing feedback on the -proposed packages [07:24] hey StevenK [07:25] pitti: how about for Feisty? [07:25] LaserJock: dito, in -proposed [07:25] and are the still done roughly monthly? [07:25] *they [07:28] there was a big lag, but we are planning to go back to that rhythm, yes [07:28] ok great [07:29] I'm getting gcompris cleaned up and just wondered when I could tell upstream to expect the translations [07:41] good morning [07:41] Good time of day. [07:42] hey ion_ [07:42] Howdy [08:44] From the lack of a new daily for Ubuntu Studio, I am assuming the cdimage cron has been turned off. [08:50] i have to say, this is pretty neat [08:50] http://www.bononia.it/~zack/blog//posts/2007/11/rss_powered_pts.html [08:52] pwnguin: Nice! [08:54] Greetings everybody! [08:57] * Hobbsee waves [08:57] Hey Hobbsee. [08:57] Evening Hobbsee [08:57] * Hobbsee curses cars that break down [09:00] hey Hobbsee [09:00] heya Fujitsu, TheMuso and pitti! [09:01] ogra: ping [09:22] Fujitsu: you think LP already uses something like that for sync requests? [09:22] automated sync, i mean [09:26] pwnguin: No. The autosyncer just looks at the differences between the sources files. It polls. === \sh_away is now known as \sh [09:29] hey seb128 [09:30] hello dholbach [09:36] hi [09:58] cjwatson, there was a mention of you talking about demoting xubuntu packages to universe in #xubuntu-devel. Was there much to discuss on this (that it should be moved to the ubuntu-devel ML), or is it pretty much going to be happening. [09:59] superm1: I'd like to do it, but would also like to have something resembling consensus [09:59] cjwatson, did you forsee any negative consequences by doing so off hand? [10:04] superm1: no technical consequences; the obvious consequences have the nature of marketing [10:04] superm1: IMO they could be effectively spun either way :) [10:04] yeah that's what I had thought [10:05] cjwatson, I'll bring it up on ubuntu-devel then soon and a consensus can get reached there [10:06] is there a Xubuntu developers list? [10:06] yeah i was going to CC both lists [10:10] Riddell: yes, I think we need to loosen the dependencies a bit [10:12] siretart: hey === iLeft is now known as iWebPy [10:13] siretart: do you still work on emacs22 in ubuntu? what are the reason again why the package is different from the debian one? [10:14] seb128: I'd hazard a guess at us considering GFDL free. [10:14] * Fujitsu recalls that to be correct. [10:14] Mithrandir: well, we could have the non-free package to main and Recommends it [10:14] yes, it was the gfdl documentation, and we follow the packaging of romain francoise, emacs upstream and former maintainer of emacs22 in debian [10:15] tjaalton, bryce: Debian removed xserver-xorg-video-i810; should we follow that or keep it? [10:15] Mithrandir: which would make the documentation installed [10:15] and it would drop the delta to a mere dependency change [10:16] siretart: any reason that debian doesn't use this packaging if it's better? [10:16] pitti: we probably should finally do that, now that intel upstream is again improving the driver [10:16] I was just discussing this with pitti again because of bug #172389 [10:16] Launchpad bug 172389 in emacs22 "Please remove emacs22-common-non-dfsg from the archive" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/172389 [10:16] all installations default to intel anyway [10:16] tjaalton: btw, I just had that discussion with kwwii: how do we ensure that xorg.conf points to intel on upgrades where i810 was used before? [10:16] seb128: sorry, I'm pretty busy at work, and I need to look again at the package for details [10:16] tjaalton: this should be done anyway, I guess [10:17] pitti, tjaalton: I concur [10:17] bryce: wow, didn't expect you to be awake at this hour :) [10:17] pitti: the debian -intel ships i810_drv.so symlink [10:17] tjaalton: ah, great, so it'll just work [10:17] heh [10:17] heh, it's only 2am ;-) [10:18] siretart: no hurry, that was just curiosity because the situation seems to be suboptimal and we were not sure what would not work with using the debian packaging and adding a recommends on the documentation to make it installed on Ubuntu [10:18] bryce, tjaalton: kicked then, thanks [10:19] btw, those who suffered intel lockups; there's a proposed patch for the server, and it'll probably get in upstream 1.4.1 branch soon [10:19] Hobbsee, Fujitsu: ^^ [10:20] seb128: I'm aware of the situation, and we are working on unifying the debian and ubuntu emacs packages (but granted, I need to take some more time to investigate it more closely) [10:20] siretart: ok, looks good, thanks [10:20] pitti: ^ [10:20] yup, saw it [10:20] no idea what to do with teh removal request now [10:21] tjaalton: Lockups? I've never experienced those, as far as I know. The crashes are gone, however. [10:21] but IMHO it's better to just let the package be where it is and add teh conflicts/replaces: [10:21] right [10:21] (C/R: needs to happen anyway) [10:21] tjaalton: \o/ [10:22] Fujitsu: well, it's an EXA issue, and I think you are using XAA now [10:23] that still crashes, though [10:23] tjaalton: Ah, true. With EXA it's all very slow, but that was about it. [10:23] Fujitsu: ok, that's another thing ;) [10:25] tjaalton: Has anybody worked out why that happens, or if a fix is on the way? [10:25] * Hobbsee wonders if it's worth trying EXA again [10:25] Fujitsu: if you mean that scrolling is slow, it's known [10:26] tjaalton: And rendering of new windows. [10:27] ugh, libtool from Debian experimental breaks with dash [10:27] * cjwatson scratches head [10:27] Nice. [10:27] I can see *why* [10:28] it's testing shell features with the shell that configure's using; configure re-execs itself with bash, but when libtool runs it has different logic and decides that the existing shell is fine [10:33] TheMuso: orca was removed in Debian due to being obsolete and unmaintained; is that true for Ubuntu, too? [10:34] pitti: orca or gnome-orca? [10:34] orca | 0.2.3 | hppa [10:34] orca | 0.2.3ubuntu1 | source, amd64, i386, ia64, powerpc, sparc [10:34] I think gnome-orca is the thing that TheMuso cares about [10:34] pitti: If the source package is orca, then its nothing to do with a11y. [10:35] ah, ok [10:35] Description: Router Monitoring and Graphing System [10:35] whoops, sorry :) [10:35] gnome-orca is the package for GNOME, named gnome-orca for that reason. [10:35] pitti: np [10:38] siretart: ffmpeg was removed in Debian "[auto-cruft] obsolete source package"; that's not true for us, I guess? [10:39] ah, that: [10:39] ffmpeg-free # ffmpeg -> ffmpeg-free rename in Debian (needs merge) [10:39] (on sync blacklist) [10:40] Riddell: dolphin is now built by kdebase source in Debian, and the source got removed; will you follow that? [10:41] (I don't remove it for now, since it looks maintained in ubuntu) [10:41] * Fujitsu wonders why KDE people seem intent on merging everything into one source package. [10:42] superm1: based on the discussion between somerville32 and cjwatson earlier, it appears that canonical doesn't provide commercial support for xubuntu-desktop anwyay? [10:43] Hobbsee, well it's listed on the xubuntu.org help page [10:43] that they do. perhaps they don't have any clients for it however [10:43] superm1: who wrote the xubuntu.org help page? [10:44] Hobbsee, that I couldn't tell you. I joined xubuntu-devel after it was already there. [10:44] superm1: i'm suspecting the answer is "not someone from canonical"? [10:45]