[00:03] <h3sp4wn> infinitycircuit: The hpet ones are not that important to me (got a working bios for that eventually after much proding of gigabyte)
[00:04] <infinitycircuit> h3sp4wn, yeah it all depends on your hardware.  the hpet patches give me huge power savings on my thinkpad x40
[00:05] <h3sp4wn> infinitycircuit: interesting I did notice on my thinkpad X31 that the fan works properly with 2.6.24
[00:06] <h3sp4wn> i.e not just on all the time when it doesn't need to be
[00:21] <DanaG> wtf?  Choosing a theme doesn't change my metacity theme.
[00:22] <DanaG> I select any theme, and it immediately jumps to "custom" because it's not using the right Metacity theme.
[00:43] <brianski> !roadmap
[00:43] <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about roadmap - try searching on http://ubotu.ubuntu-nl.org/factoids.cgi
[00:43] <brianski> hrm
[00:43] <WorkingOnWise> !kernel
[00:43] <ubotu> The core of the Ubuntu Operating System is the Linux kernel: see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Kernel - You shouldn't have to compile your own, but if you're convinced you do, see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Kernel/Compile - For more: /msg ubotu stages
[00:45] <brianski> !hardy
[00:45] <ubotu> Hardy Heron is the code name for the next release of Ubuntu (8.04-LTS), due April 2008 - For more info, see: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardyHeron - Discussion and support in #ubuntu+1, NOT #ubuntu
[00:48] <h3sp4wn> !msg the bot
[00:48] <ubotu> Please investigate with me only in /msg or in #ubuntu-bots (type also /msg ubotu Bot). Don't use commands in the public channels if you don't know if they really exist. Also avoid adding joke/useless factoids.
[00:49] <brianski> yeah, clearly my 2 queries really messed up the roaring flow of conversation in this channel
[00:50] <WorkingOnWise> So I see that Hardy is using 2.6.22 for a kernel. Is that right? The same kernel as Gutsy?
[00:50] <crimsun> WorkingOnWise: that is correct currently.  It will release with a 2.6.24-based one.
[00:51] <WorkingOnWise> crimsun: ok. I was mildly concerned that my upgrade didn't go as smooth as I thought.
[00:51] <DanaG> I also can't seem to drag from File-roller to Nautilus.
[00:53] <crimsun> WorkingOnWise: it was decided at UDS-Boston that a reasonable attempt to ship 8.04 with a 2.6.24-based one would be made.  Obviously, since 2.6.24 has not been released yet, 8.04 continues to use 7.10's 2.6.22-based one.
[00:56] <DanaG> Oh yeah, that reminds me:
[00:56] <DanaG> A friend asked me about something to do with "No high-resolution timers available" in some audio app.
[00:56] <WorkingOnWise> crimsun: ty.
[00:56] <DanaG> It turns out, Dell apparently either is missing, or deliberately broke, HPET in their BIOS.
[00:56] <DanaG> Is there any way to work around that?
[00:57] <h3sp4wn> perhaps just use 2.6.24
[00:57] <WorkingOnWise> DanaG: lt is probably Audacity. I know nothing else about it, bit I have seen the same error.
[00:58] <h3sp4wn> or use the patches - http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/people/tglx/hrtimers/ (I think they have the hpet series enabled that went into 2.6.24)
[00:58] <h3sp4wn> Infact I don't think I know they do
[00:59] <DanaG> Oops, you lost some punctuation, and that made that sentence a bit ambiguous.
[01:00] <crimsun> insert the comma proceeding the 'k'
[01:00] <crimsun> or the semicolon if you wish to be pedantic
[01:01] <DanaG> aah.
[01:01] <infinitycircuit> DanaG, make sure you boot with hpet=force if dmesg| grep hpet fails to show anything
[01:02] <DanaG> Well, it's not my PC, so I'll have to remember it for next time I see that person.
[01:03] <crimsun> cfs 24 for 24-rc3 seems pretty nice
[01:04] <DanaG> It's funny -- I tried 'osx86' on my laptop, and while it worked reasonably well, I concluded I have no real reason to actually use it.  Ubuntu works more than well enough for me -- and it's more customizable.
[01:05] <DanaG> I realized that for some reason, I find it FUN fixing things when they break.
[01:05] <DanaG> Or abusing things to see if they WILL break -- for example, setting window transitions to slow 'dodge' and clicking back and forth between windows makes compiz-fusion hard-lock.
[01:06] <h3sp4wn> infinitycircuit: are you using the latest thinkpad-acpi ?
[01:07] <h3sp4wn> I am not sure whether to bother sourcing a usb floppy drive to update the bios on mine (apparantly I don't need to if I use that something to do with NVRAM)
[01:44] <PirateHead> The home of X breakage? Maybe I don't want to try out the alpha after all. :-\
[02:04] <gsker> Here goes nothing!  :-)
[02:04] <h3sp4wn> gsker: Thats probably how you will feel later
[02:06]  * gsker ponders that
[02:09] <gsker> I wonder how long this will take......
[02:10] <Hobbsee> a while.
[02:10] <gsker> give or take?   :-)
[02:10] <gsker> Done getting.... unpacking .... installing....
[02:14] <h3sp4wn> gsker: Obviously it depends on the connection it didn't take long at all for me
[02:14] <h3sp4wn> perhaps if there is tons of people upgrading right now it will take longer
[02:14] <gsker> well since I got it all, it doesn't depend on the connection any more....
[02:15] <h3sp4wn> I don't remember it taking a noticable amount of time
[02:15] <gsker> :-) Noticeable?  you like, blinked and it was done!???
[02:15] <DanaG> I usually have two mirrors.
[02:16] <DanaG> A fast, local, but often out-of-date mirror, and the official US mirror.
[02:16] <DanaG> Put the faster one above the other in sources.list, and it'll be preferred for any packages not out of date.
[02:16] <h3sp4wn> gsker: perhaps I was not paying attention (probably so)
[02:16] <DanaG> I use mirrors.kernel.org.
[02:17] <gsker> I just followed the 3 lines of instruction from linuxjournal.
[02:18] <gsker> sudo sed -i "s/gutsy/hardy/g" /etc/apt/sources.list;sudo aptitude update;sudo aptitude dist-upgrade
[02:18] <h3sp4wn> I used perl -pi but other than that the same
[03:02] <dick-richardson> is kde 4.0 planned to be released with hardy?
[03:05] <hashbrowncipher> dick-richardson: it appears so, see https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/kubuntu-hardy-kde4
[03:29] <hydrogen> not as the default desktop
[03:29] <hydrogen> however
[04:03] <gsker> Well, I had to blink a coupla times, but it's there!
[04:11] <infinitycircuit> is anyone else having trouble with brightness control in hardy?
[04:12] <infinitycircuit> my laptop screen reverts to maximum brightness every minute even if i bring it down with the keyboard keys
[04:20]  * Hobbsee supsects that's laptop specific
[04:23] <RAOF> infinitycircuit: I think that may be a g-p-m bug - maybe if you have "dim when idle" set, then the brightness level that gets triggered by the dim is the default brightness - some number, rather than current brightness - some number.
[06:03] <choudesh> is the new kernel in the repos yet?
[06:03] <choudesh> for hardy that is
[06:03] <Hobbsee> no
[06:03] <choudesh> ahh, ok.
[06:04] <pwnguin> where's the best avenue to hunt down developers who can fix SD readers?
[06:06] <Hobbsee> depends how they're broken, i expect, but driver developers, i guess...
[06:12] <pwnguin> it worked with like .17, but hasnt since
[06:59] <choudesh> if there way to blacklist a package from a certain repository? say if I wanted to download update-manager from a different repo then ubuntu's and not use priorityies - is there a way to do it?
[06:59] <choudesh> say to use packages from gutsy instead of hardy
[07:03] <chowmeined> choudesh, preferences
[07:03] <chowmeined> chowmeined, man apt_preferences
[07:41] <DanaG> Odd: trying to add wallpapers to the list doesn't work.
[08:06] <chronographer> what repositories do I use and is Hardy going to break for me?
[08:06] <chronographer> I'm going to update without checking what is to be updated
[09:09] <choudesh> anyone having issues with hardy + azureus?
[09:10] <RAOF> jdong will be most upset :)
[09:11] <RAOF> choudesh: What sort of issues?
[09:11]  * RAOF doesn't, of course, because he uses either deluge or transmission.
[09:11] <choudesh> #19 /usr/lib/jvm/java-6-sun-1.6.0.03/jre/lib/i386/client/libjvm.so [0x620bc6d]
[09:11] <choudesh> java: xcb_xlib.c:82: xcb_xlib_unlock: Assertion `c->xlib.lock' failed.
[09:11] <RAOF> Babaw!
[09:11] <RAOF> Use icedtea-java7
[09:11] <RAOF> All the other sun java vms are broken.
[09:12] <RAOF> (And have been forever, it's just that Xorg didn't care so much before)
[09:12] <choudesh> what is the package name?
[09:12] <RAOF> icedtea-java7, I think :)
[09:12] <RAOF> !find icedtea hardy
[09:12] <ubotu> Found: icedtea-java7-bin, icedtea-java7-demo, icedtea-java7-doc, icedtea-java7-jdk, icedtea-java7-jre (and 2 others)
[09:12] <choudesh> icedtea-java7-sdk and jre
[09:12] <choudesh> I apt-cached it. ;-)
[09:13] <choudesh> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
[09:13] <choudesh>   icedtea-java7-jre: Depends: icedtea-java7-bin (>= 7~b21) but it is not going to be installed
[09:13] <choudesh> I love being an early adopter. ;-)
[09:13] <RAOF> Technically, the problem is that all the sun JRE's have some Xlib stuff, built without threading support, statically linked in.  Since absolutely everyone has Xlib built with threading enabled, this is a problem :)
[09:14] <choudesh> ahhhh. I see.
[09:14] <RAOF> choudesh: Hm.  Aptitude *may* be able to find some way to install it.
[09:14] <choudesh> damn libgif4 has a done of depends.
[09:14] <RAOF> Yup, indeed.
[09:15] <choudesh> I just have a script that looks at depends and starts at the beginning.
[09:15] <RAOF> Oh, if you really can't install icedtea, I think you can work around this with an evil, evil hack.
[09:15] <RAOF> Basically by sedding out the XINERAMA string from the java VM binary.
[09:15] <choudesh> Need to get 36.9kB of archives.
[09:15] <choudesh> After unpacking 154MB disk space will be freed.
[09:15] <choudesh> that is odd
[09:15] <RAOF> WHat's it removing?
[09:16] <choudesh>   kde4base kde4libs-bin kdelibs5 kdepimlibs5 libgdiplus
[09:16] <choudesh>   libmono-winforms2.0-cil libungif4g monodevelop
[09:17] <RAOF> Heh.  kde4base is big :)
[09:17] <choudesh> yea... I missed that one when I looked. I was like, holy ****
[09:17] <RAOF> This may be a good time to check out various other bittorrent clients, though :)
[09:18] <RAOF> Either deluge-torrent or (maybe) transmission would be worth a look.
[09:18] <choudesh> heh. I have deluged installed - but I love azureus...it is heavy but I just love some of the plugins
[09:18] <choudesh> does icedtea-java7-jre update java-alternatives?
[09:18] <RAOF> Probably not.
[09:19] <RAOF> I'm not sure.  It'd be a good plan to check :)
[09:19] <choudesh> root@duo:/home/choudesh/.azureus# java -version
[09:19] <choudesh> java version "1.7.0"
[09:19] <choudesh> IcedTea Runtime Environment (build 1.7.0-b23)
[09:19] <choudesh> IcedTea Client VM (build 1.7.0-b23, mixed mode, sharing)
[09:19] <choudesh> it does. ;-)
[09:19] <RAOF> Score.
[09:19] <RAOF> Now, does azureus run under icedtea? :)
[09:19] <choudesh> yeppers
[09:19] <choudesh> thanks for your help
[09:19] <RAOF> NP.
[09:20] <RAOF> (Let this be a lesson: static linkind FTL!)
[09:20] <choudesh> heh
[09:20] <RAOF> s/d/g/
[15:00] <Richie> Hi, for some reason my sound will stop working after a couple of hours. I go System > Preferences > Sound and when i hit Test i get this: audiotestsrc wave=sine freq=512 ! audioconvert ! audioresample ! gconfaudiosink profile=chat: Internal data flow error.
[15:01] <Richie> Any ideas on how to fix?
[15:23] <bardyr> !info linux-image-generic hardy
[15:23] <ubotu> linux-image-generic: Generic Linux kernel image. In component main, is optional. Version 2.6.22.14.21 (hardy), package size 24 kB, installed size 52 kB
[15:23] <bardyr> :(
[15:24] <bardyr> 2.6.24-rc has been accepted and even after the alpha1 release isnt out :(
[17:03] <hetauma> when I try to use vncviewer I can't type in password. I know that this is due to compiz but is there any workaround that ?
[17:03] <h3sp4wn> hetauma: disable compiz
[17:04] <hetauma> h3sp4wn, apart from that?
[17:15] <stdin> hetauma: I don't use compiz but I've heard shift+click may work
[17:19] <hetauma> stdin, worked fine thanx alot :D
[17:20] <stdin> heh, reading blogs can actually be useful sometimes :p
[19:17] <yogi> what do I need to do get intel wireless (thinkpad t60) run with the hardy kernel?
[19:17] <yogi> I'm using gutsy as base, but I would like to use 2.6.24 for the power savings (on AMD64)
[19:21] <void^> 2.6.24 isn't released, yet
[19:21] <yogi> void^: IK;  I am using linux for 12 years...
[19:22] <yogi> I'm just not clear on the whole /lib/firmware thing
[19:22] <yogi> and what ucode goes with what version
[19:22] <yogi> especially since the intel wireless code changed from .22 to .24
[19:22] <crdlb> gutsy + hardy kernel isn't supported at all (not even here)
[19:23] <[ifr0g]> I heard CNR will come with hardy, is the rumor true ?
[19:23] <yogi> crdlb: define 'supported'
[19:24] <h3sp4wn> crdlb: There is not a massive difference between the 2 at the moment that I can see - gutsy with a custom kernel should be supported
[19:24] <crdlb> I'm not saying it won't work
[19:24] <yogi> crdlb: does that mean 'does not run at all' or does it mean 'you cannot pay anybody to fix it for you'
[19:24] <yogi> crdlb: I'm not interested in the second answer...
[19:24] <crdlb> I'm saying that this channel is for people actually running hardy :)
[19:25] <yogi> are you running hardy on a laptop ATM?
[19:25] <crdlb> nope
[19:25] <h3sp4wn> Theoretically - I am running hardy on a thinkpad X31
[19:26] <yogi> I have built the kernel from the sources in http://ftp.ubuntulinux.org/ubuntu/pool/main/l/linux/
[19:26] <yogi> since I could not find linux-image and linux-modules packages in the pool
[19:26] <yogi> the kernel package installed fine, everything works, except the wireless
[19:27] <yogi> I have copied ipw3945.ucode  iwlwifi-3945-1.ucode from 2.6.22-14-generic to 2.6.24-1-generic/
[19:27] <yogi> and I'm getting a 'wlan0_rename' interface
[19:28] <yogi> does NetworkManager need a bump?
[19:28] <h3sp4wn> I doubt it
[19:29] <h3sp4wn> Just use http://www.intellinuxwireless.org/iwlwifi/downloads/iwlwifi-1.2.22.tgz
[19:32] <yogi> h3sp4wn: isn't that (or something really close to it) already part of the linux kernel?
[19:33] <h3sp4wn> Maybe - with wireless I usually just use whatevers the newest stable release
[19:34] <h3sp4wn> I haven't messed with mac80211 for a client though - I think its still compatible with wext
[19:34] <h3sp4wn> But I know for hostapd you need the devicescape driver
[20:24] <h3sp4wn> Does ubuntu mobile support the eepc ?
[20:58] <pwnguin> h3sp4wn: i think it targets a different set of devices. you can probably wedge normal ubuntu on it though
[21:00] <h3sp4wn> pwnguin: I want to play with it but I dunno what devices I can get (for not a silly amount of money a $1000 dev board is too much)
[21:01] <h3sp4wn> They are both x86 the one it does support and the eepc
[21:02] <pwnguin> what i mean is that they're after a smaller touchscreen type device
[21:03] <pwnguin> you should be able to use a chroot and xephyr to get an idea
[21:12] <underwatercow> I upgraded to hardy, and now my sound isn't working... is it likely this is related?
[21:13] <crimsun> related to what?
[21:13] <crimsun> your dist-upgrade?  Unlikely.
[21:13] <crimsun> We're still using the same kernel.
[21:14] <crimsun> note: I'm not referring to "some random mixer element is muted" but to "sound driver is broken completely"
[21:14] <crimsun> I'm not concerned about the former; the latter is significant.
[21:14] <underwatercow> I got a new card recently, but it was working... so it's possible it's still just related to my still not having it working right
[21:15] <underwatercow> the gnome mixer shows the right card and that sound is working and everything, but the alsamixer is showing my onboard card... could this be why?
[21:16] <crimsun> underwatercow: no, that's irrelevant.
[21:17] <underwatercow> I still think that the dist-upgrade had something to do with it somehow...
[21:17] <underwatercow> though I know it shouldn't have
[21:17] <crimsun> underwatercow: download http://trilug.org/~crimsun/alsa-info.sh, run it using bash, and tell me the url.
[21:19] <underwatercow> crimsun: does it need su?
[21:19] <crimsun> no.
[21:21] <underwatercow> crimsun: still running... :-p
[21:21] <crimsun> wait a tic; it may take a bit.
[21:22] <underwatercow> crimsun: who wrote this script?
[21:22] <crimsun> underwatercow: members of #alsa
[21:22] <underwatercow> crimsun: ah, nifty
[21:25] <underwatercow> crimsun: um.... it says Your ALSA information is located at
[21:25] <underwatercow> Please inform the person helping you.
[21:26] <crimsun> underwatercow: ok, then your connection to pastebin.ca is fubar
[21:26] <crimsun> underwatercow: instead, pass the --debug option
[21:26] <crimsun> underwatercow: it will place an alsa dump text file in /tmp/
[21:27] <underwatercow> crimsun: want me to paste it manually to pastebin?
[21:27] <crimsun> underwatercow: yes
[21:27] <underwatercow> crimsun: now it has to run again.... *sigh* :-p
[21:27] <crimsun> there's a no-upload option, too.
[21:28] <underwatercow> crimsun: that's a good call
[21:33] <underwatercow> crimsun: which pastebin would you like me to use? or does it matter?
[21:34] <crimsun> doesn't really matter.
[21:35] <underwatercow> crimsun: http://pastebin.com/d4f41fdb9
[21:35] <crimsun> (ok, sec, on the phone.)
[21:35] <underwatercow> crimsun: sure
[21:36] <underwatercow> crimsun: fyi, the Intel is my onboard that I don't want to use
[21:39] <crimsun> hmm.
[21:39] <crimsun> you seem to have compiled 1.0.15 manually.
[21:40] <underwatercow> crimsun: I was trying to, lol... don't know if I did it right
[21:40] <crimsun> (we ship -driver with 1.0.14 by default and 1.0.15rc3 in linux-backports-modules)
[21:40] <crimsun> (we also don't ship libasound2-dev by default, which would be required for the script to pick up the lib version)
[21:40] <underwatercow> crimsun: I'm not partial to 1.0.15 for any reason... I just want my sound working
[21:41] <crimsun> well, it's good to be running 1.0.15 -driver and -lib, but note that you've messed with the Ubuntu infrastructure
[21:41] <crimsun> I recommend at some point you do a clean install of a Hardy Alpha
[21:41] <crimsun> anyhow, let me look more closely
[21:41] <underwatercow> crimsun: will hardy include 1.015 at some point?
[21:42] <crimsun> underwatercow: I've already uploaded 1.0.15
[21:42] <underwatercow> lol
[21:42] <crimsun> the version that ships in the kernel, however, is still 1.0.14.  It uses Gutsy's kernel.
[21:43] <underwatercow> gotcha...
[21:43] <crimsun> well, this problem is fairly straightforward.
[21:43] <crimsun> Your asoundrc references your onboard HDA, which is index 0.
[21:43] <crimsun> your ice17xx-based card is not index 0 but index 1
[21:43] <underwatercow> oh.... the asoundrc was one I got online... do I need it even?
[21:44] <crimsun> you may need it for non-GSt-aware apps.
[21:44] <underwatercow> the reason I got it was I was trying to make my surround sound work, which I may have without it
[21:44] <crimsun> I'd mv ~/.asoundrc ~/.asoundrc.bak
[21:44] <underwatercow> it*
[21:44] <crimsun> then `asoundconf set-default-card Revolution51`
[21:44] <crimsun> then log out and back in
[21:45] <underwatercow> crimsun: thanks, I'll brb
[21:52] <underwatercow> crimsun: Ok... I have sound now, though I had to do a full restart. It didn't seem to want to fully load gnome from a logout
[21:52] <underwatercow> crimsun: I don't have surround now though
[21:53] <underwatercow> crimsun: I also got a popup that says "Refresh Advanced Linux Sound Architecture (ALSA) configuration presets"
[21:53] <crimsun> yes, that's correct.
[21:53] <crimsun> can you use -Dplug:surroundXX ?
[21:53] <underwatercow> crimsun: I don't know?
[21:54] <crimsun> asoundconf list
[21:54] <underwatercow> crimsun: it says Revolution51 and Intel?
[21:54] <crimsun> I need the specific order
[21:54] <underwatercow> that order
[21:55] <crimsun> ok, so test plug:surround51:0
[21:55] <crimsun> use a multichannel file as appropriate
[21:55] <crimsun> or use speaker-test(1)
[21:55] <crimsun> speaker-test -c6 -Dplug:surround51:0
[21:56] <underwatercow> the first did nothing, the last...
[21:56] <underwatercow> Unable to set sw params for playback: Invalid argument
[21:56] <underwatercow> Setting of swparams failed: Invalid argument
[21:57] <crimsun> remove the :0
[21:58] <underwatercow> same
[21:58] <crimsun> probably hitching on S32_LE, then
[21:58] <underwatercow> what is that?
[21:58] <crimsun> it's the format that your driver requires
[22:00] <underwatercow> crimsun: should I use the .asoundrc with the correct sound device? or should I be able to get it working without?
[22:00] <crimsun> sure, you can erase ~/.asoundrc and ~/.asoundrc.asoundconf
[22:00] <crimsun> and mv ~/.asoundrc.bak ~/.asoundrc
[22:02] <underwatercow> crimsun: so do I still need to change to hardware 1? or did making it default do that?
[22:03] <underwatercow> make it 0 that is
[22:03] <crimsun> you can leave it 0, since the ice17xx-based one is currently index 0
[22:03] <underwatercow> aight... is it enough to restart alsa-utils? or should I log out?
[22:04] <crimsun> I would also use the slots parameter for snd to force the driver to always load as index 0
[22:04] <underwatercow> what do you mean?
[22:05] <crimsun> echo options snd slots=snd-ice1724,snd-hda-intel |sudo tee -a /etc/modprobe.d/alsa-base
[22:07] <underwatercow> ok, done
[22:07] <crimsun> yeah, you'll likely need to log out and back in for the asoundrc change
[22:07] <crimsun> (to be safe, at least)
[22:07] <crimsun> without knowing what you have running, that's the safest guess
[22:08] <underwatercow> crimsun: very little at the moment, but I'll log out
[22:08] <underwatercow> brb again
[22:16] <underwatercow> crimsun: ok, has surround now :-p
[22:16] <underwatercow> crimsun: is it just duplicating the front to the back?
[22:17] <crimsun> underwatercow: well, yes, that's what your asoundrc specifies.
[22:17] <underwatercow> crimsun: is that the only way I can do it? or can I have genuine surround sound? lol
[22:19] <crimsun> genuine?
[22:19] <underwatercow> crimsun: different channels I guess for the rear speakers?
[22:19] <underwatercow> crimsun: so you can have different sound in the front than in the back
[22:19] <crimsun> if the app sets the appropriate parameters via alsa-lib, of course you can have "genuine" surround
[22:19] <crimsun> e.g., xine-lib, GSt, etc.
[22:19] <crimsun> mplayer, too
[22:20] <underwatercow> crimsun: even with the back duplicating the front?
[22:20] <crimsun> I don't think you understand your asoundrc dupe stanza
[22:20] <underwatercow> crimsun: apparently not, lol
[22:20] <crimsun> that's an upmix that's used for "plain" 2-channel files
[22:20] <underwatercow> crimsun: oh...
[22:21] <underwatercow> so without the file
[22:21] <underwatercow> it would be stereo unless the app was set up for 5.1?
[22:21] <crimsun> xine-lib, GSt, mplayer are all intelligent enough to set the appropriate parameters via alsa-lib for "genuine" 6-channel or 8-channel files
[22:21] <crimsun> essentially, yes
[22:22] <underwatercow> crimsun: so are things like web browsers, playing in two channel then?
[22:22] <crimsun> err, well, it depends what format the files are
[22:22] <crimsun> there's nothing preventing a Web browser from sending a genuine 8-channel file to alsa-lib
[22:23] <crimsun> it would be foolhardy, but well, it's certainly possible
[22:23] <underwatercow> crimsun: gotcha, so it's possible, but not likely
[22:23] <crimsun> correct.
[22:23] <underwatercow> crimsun: why doesn't it dupe by default?
[22:23] <crimsun> because it can't, as you've discovered.
[22:23] <crimsun> there are far too many variations on codecs, many of them broken by the manufacturers.
[22:24] <underwatercow> crimsun: ah... well in windows, do the manufacturers set it up to do that by default then?
[22:25] <crimsun> depends
[22:25] <crimsun> I can't speak of the ones under NDA
[22:26] <underwatercow> crimsun: Can I ask you a windows related sound question?
[22:26] <underwatercow> another that is
[22:26] <underwatercow> lol
[22:26] <underwatercow> it might not be windows specifically
[22:27] <underwatercow> but that's where I noticed it
[22:27] <crimsun> I probably won't have the tech-fu to answer a Windows audio question, but sure.
[22:27] <underwatercow> lol
[22:28] <underwatercow> when I set up my card for surround sound in windows, the game I am playing will play all of the sounds except certain dialog
[22:28] <underwatercow> I have to put it to stereo to hear the dialog
[22:28] <crimsun> report the bug to your manufacturer :-]
[22:28] <underwatercow> lol
[22:29] <underwatercow> I didn't know if it was me, the game, the manufacturer...
[22:30] <crimsun> difficult to say
[22:30] <crimsun> I would surmise it's the driver
[22:30] <underwatercow> I haven't tested it on any other games in windows yet
[22:30] <underwatercow> maybe I'll try that first
[22:30] <crimsun> OTOH, it could be in the game, too, in the way it sets DX params
[22:30] <underwatercow> it's a vista driver, so who can say
[22:30] <underwatercow> I hate vista
[22:31] <crimsun> I love Vista, works great here
[22:31] <crimsun> I also have not used Vista.
[22:31] <crimsun> thus the vacuous statement
[22:31] <underwatercow> lol
[22:31] <underwatercow> I only installed it because it cost me nothing
[22:31] <underwatercow> and it will have more support than xp
[22:31] <underwatercow> if only wine could run all my games
[22:32] <underwatercow> oh joyous day
[22:35] <underwatercow> crimsun: thanks for your help
[22:35] <crimsun> np
[23:05] <pvandewyngaerde> crap crap crap, i'll never learn i lost my amarok database after upgrading to hardy
[23:11] <mcscruff> lo all
[23:12] <mcscruff> im running hardy :P on a second laptop, just wondered where the xorg.conf (or replacement) is, as i need to add my touchpad
[23:14] <PriceChild> mcscruff, /etc/X11
[23:15] <mcscruff> what file tho
[23:15] <torben> hi! i upgraded to hardy but still have kernel 2.6.22-14..is that normal?
[23:15] <mcscruff> yes
[23:15] <mcscruff> 2.6.22-14-generic is default
[23:17] <mcscruff> why was the "about ubuntu" not updated
[23:17] <choudesh> the new kernel isn't in hardy yet
[23:18] <torben> hmm, i wanted to check out a more recent kernel :/ can i get rid of that "amd testing uso only unsupported hardware" sign in the bottom right corner?
[23:20] <cafuego> You can always bake a vanilla 2.6.23-whatever-is-current kernel.
[23:20] <mcscruff> torbon, ati?
[23:20] <mcscruff> i was just reading a fix for that
[23:20] <mcscruff> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=623882&highlight=hardy
[23:21] <h3sp4wn> torben: You could build the current ubuntu git
[23:22] <mcscruff> i really dont have an xorg.conf
[23:23] <h3sp4wn> mcscruff: Is that a problem ?
[23:23] <mcscruff> when i need to add touchpad it is
[23:23] <mcscruff> /usr/share/xresprobe/xorg.conf  <<does it use that?
[23:24] <h3sp4wn> You can still have one if you need to (but for common cases its unnecessary)
[23:24] <torben> h3sp4wn: how can i do that?
[23:24] <h3sp4wn> torben: Just write one
[23:24] <mcscruff> do you need it all or can i just add the lines i need?
[23:25] <torben> h3sp4wn: sounds like too much work, i'm not really into this..
[23:26] <h3sp4wn> torben: actually I just got confused - there is a page on the wiki about git kernels
[23:26] <h3sp4wn> mcscruff: Should just be able to add what you need
[23:26] <BlackDiamonds> is there anything major in the new alpha ?
[23:26] <torben> ah ok
[23:27] <BlackDiamonds> or was it just the package sync ?
[23:27] <Trewas> torben: or just wait some time, I guess 2.6.24 kernel is coming soonish
[23:27] <mcscruff> BlackDiamonds, no xorg.conf :)
[23:27] <BlackDiamonds> wait wut
[23:27] <BlackDiamonds> is everything automated now ?
[23:27] <mcscruff> im not sure if its just me but something has been tweaked and my system seems to be running very fast
[23:28] <h3sp4wn> mcscruff: Its always fast the further away from the release it is
[23:28] <mcscruff> the restricted driver thing is missing (good move)
[23:29] <BlackDiamonds> Does anyone know when that hardware detection spec will be implemented ?
[23:29] <h3sp4wn> mcscruff: No doubt that will be back
[23:29] <mcscruff> time to try a nice ati driver
[23:29] <magnetron> BlackDiamonds: try asking in #ubuntu+1
[23:29] <h3sp4wn> mcscruff: What ati card are you using ?
[23:30] <mcscruff> h3sp4wn, radion 200M
[23:30] <BlackDiamonds> magnetron this is ubuntu+1
[23:30] <magnetron> BlackDiamonds: eh... oopss
[23:30] <mcscruff> lol
[23:30] <h3sp4wn> Think that is a bit new for XiG but my radeon mobility absolutely fly's with the XiG non-free X server
[23:31]  * magnetron facepalms
[23:33] <Trewas> h3sp4wn: XiG is still alive? I somehow would have expected a commercial X server to die with the previous millennium (when I last heard of it) :)
[23:33] <h3sp4wn> Trewas: Still alive and well
[23:34] <h3sp4wn> and still tons better than xorg for the supported ati cards
[23:35] <h3sp4wn> (If amd does release the specs I would expect XiG to produce better drivers than the xorg people)
[23:35] <h3sp4wn> Just for comparison - ut2004 is totally unplayable on this laptop with xorg and perfect with XiG
[23:36] <h3sp4wn> (and its a 16MB radeon mobility where all parties had access to the specs)
[23:36] <mcscruff> Xig , ooo i want it
[23:37] <Trewas> unsurprisingly they don't have support for nvidia chips where the company itself is making decent drivers... but I wonder how good their intel drivers are
[23:38] <h3sp4wn> Trewas: I don't think much to the nvidia drivers
[23:40] <Trewas> well, I haven't found anything to complain (stability or feature-wise) yet about nvidia drivers, granted that I have used them only on desktops
[23:40] <torben> is it possible to get a framebuffer at native resolution (1440x900) on a macbook pro using that new ati-driver?
[23:40] <h3sp4wn> Or perhaps its just the nvidia hardware - perhaps a quadro is better I dunno if I want to give nvidia more money
[23:40] <h3sp4wn> *But I dunno ...
[23:41] <h3sp4wn> I would be interested to compare similarly prices Matrox and Nvidia cards (Matrox with the XiG drivers)
[23:43] <Trewas> g550 at least has some hardware limitations, like supporting xvideo only up to 1024x1024, maybe parhelia cards are better bug afaik they don't have any support in xorg
[23:44] <h3sp4wn> Trewas: exactly - the XiG xserver supports them (I don't mind paying) I have to use so much non-free stuff for my course anyway I am no longer really bothered
[23:44] <Trewas> hrr, and now that I checked nvidia 8600gt I have in this computer costs the same as new g550
[23:46] <Trewas> h3sp4wn: I don't care about closed source that much either, but for graphics cards I have not been impressed with matrox and nvidia has good free (as in beer) drivers
[23:46] <h3sp4wn> I have an nvidia 7950GT and a 7300GT and the picture quality is not nice on either
[23:48] <Trewas> well, that doesn't matter much with lcd monitors with dvi-inputs
[23:48] <h3sp4wn> That is what I am using
[23:49] <h3sp4wn> Maybe I should try a quadro but its an expensive gamble
[23:49] <mcscruff> brb
[23:49] <Trewas> hrm, using dvi and the right resolution there is not much room for quality, bad or good
[23:51] <h3sp4wn> Dunno its perfect with an ati 9250 or an ati 9800pro (I have messed around with it for ages)
[23:51] <Trewas> I haven't seen any problems with 6600gt or 8600gt cards
[23:53] <h3sp4wn> I dunno the others are just easier on my eyes
[23:54] <Trewas> with dvi the picture quality should be either perfect or very bad, the digital connection does now allow very subtle differences
[23:55] <h3sp4wn> Trewas: *should* being the operative word
[23:56] <Trewas> h3sp4wn: yeah, pixel-perfect is pixel-perfect no matter what card :)
[23:57] <h3sp4wn> Trewas: That is how its supposed to be however in reality it isn't
[23:58] <Trewas> h3sp4wn: maybe, but the differences are somewhere else than in the dvi connection
[23:59] <Trewas> maybe some card/monitor combinations have problems or something...