| Annirak | What do I need to do in order to get Ubuntu 7.1 installed on a partitioned RAID alongside Vista? Hardware is Intel P965 with ICH8, Core 2 Q6600. | 00:58 |
|---|---|---|
| Annirak | The installer doesn't see the raid array, it sees 4 drives. | 00:58 |
| twb | cjwatson: ping | 01:15 |
| twb | Both Ubuntu and Debian d-i use the vendor class "d-i" when DHCPREQUESTing. | 01:16 |
| twb | Is there a way I can differentiate between the two (e.g. using user-class)? | 01:17 |
| === cjwatson_ is now known as cjwatson | ||
| soren | Can you think of any reason why putting "tasksel tasksel/first multiselect edubuntu-desktop" in a preseed file wouldn't cause edubuntu-desktop to get installed? | 17:42 |
| bdmurray | evand, cjwatson: ubiquity is a prime candidate for the next Hug Day and I'd like to discuss possible tasks | 17:44 |
| evand | ok | 17:48 |
| bdmurray | I have a good idea about to move bugs from New to Incomplete | 17:50 |
| evand | getting logs on bug reports where they don't already exist would be helpful. I'm weary of people marking duplicates as they see something like "UserSetupApply exited with code X" and assume everything with that same string is the same bug, and imho, it's not so easy to figure out which bugs are actually duplicates. | 17:50 |
| bdmurray | And Incomplete to Confirmed but what about Incomplete to Invalid | 17:50 |
| evand | ah | 17:50 |
| evand | I don't really follow. Are you asking if we have any objections to marking bugs as invalid that have no response from when they were put in the incomplete status? | 17:52 |
| bdmurray | Yes. | 17:53 |
| evand | I don't, provided a reasonable amount of time has passed, but I cannot speak for Colin. | 17:53 |
| cjwatson | I'd be pretty cautious about doing it mechanically | 17:54 |
| cjwatson | if you're willing to read over it and apply judgement, that's a different matter | 17:54 |
| bdmurray | right, for the bug day reading it over would happen | 17:54 |
| bdmurray | What criteria should we use in the judgement call though? | 17:55 |
| cjwatson | I think you need to distinguish between the cases of "we have no idea at all about this and need information" and "this is definitely a bug, but we need a bit more help to track it down" | 17:55 |
| cjwatson | in the latter case, if you mark it invalid it's probably just going to come back later | 17:55 |
| cjwatson | there should be plenty of the former case though | 17:55 |
| bdmurray | Right, that makes sense. | 17:55 |
| cjwatson | another thing I'd say is that if the bug submitter took the time to provide a literate, well-explained description of their bug, then it should be left up to a developer to mark it invalid | 17:56 |
| cjwatson | (if at all) | 17:56 |
| cjwatson | those are the people who tend to get annoyed if you slam-dunk their bug | 17:56 |
| cjwatson | at the other end of the scale there's the crash report with no supplementary information, or the "it broke, please help" type thing | 17:57 |
| cjwatson | I've noticed some cases where triagers marked a literate, thoughtful bug as invalid though, and those tend to be the cases where they have the lowest hit rate | 17:57 |
| cjwatson | so I think somehow encouraging people to apply different criteria depending on the effort the submitter put in would be appropriate | 17:58 |
| bdmurray | Okay. Have you reviewed the Invalid bugs at all? That might be an interesting idea too. I should be able to craft a query where they are Invalid and you or evan didn't invalidate them | 18:01 |
| cjwatson | sporadically but not for a while | 18:02 |
| cjwatson | seems to sort of defeat the purpose if we have to review them in detail though | 18:02 |
| bdmurray | Fair enough. Another thing we have tried to do is tag bugs. Are there any ubiquity specific tags that would be useful? | 18:06 |
| bdmurray | Perhaps the installer version? | 18:06 |
| evand | tbh, I haven't really been using tags. I'm not sure looking up bugs by version would be helpful to me, but pehaps I'm missing the use case. | 18:10 |
| bdmurray | Okay, I was just trying to figure out how to subdivide the bugs. | 18:16 |
| evand | cjwatson: have you had a different experience? | 18:16 |
| bdmurray | Are there many bugs where people are using the automated version of ubiquity | 18:19 |
| evand | perhaps by the component of the installer in which the bug occurs? partman, user-setup, migration-assistant, and so on. Just an idea, I'm not sure how useful that would be to others. | 18:19 |
| evand | I've only seen the ones reported by Dell a while back. I doubt it's getting much use yet. | 18:19 |
| bdmurray | evand: okay, I'll take a look and some and see how hard it is to determine which tag to add | 18:28 |
| bdmurray | will you be available Wednesday? | 18:28 |
| evand | ok, thank you | 18:28 |
| evand | bdmurray: yes | 18:28 |
| Goosemoose | hi guys | 18:28 |
| Goosemoose | working on a preseed file to install over network to 250 machines | 18:28 |
| Goosemoose | i want it to ask for the computer name but no matter what i put the computer just grabs a name from dhcp | 18:29 |
| evand | bdmurray: though wednesday at 1600 UTC is our usual platform team meeting. | 18:29 |
| rgl | hi | 18:31 |
| rgl | I want to install ubuntu over an existing raid1 (software) and lvm2 volumes, I'm using the alternate install cd, but still, I can't find the RAID stuff, can you guys help me out finding it? | 18:32 |
| Goosemoose | damn, doesn't want to install the gui either | 18:40 |
| Goosemoose | this is nuts | 18:40 |
| cjwatson | bdmurray,evand: I've not used much in the way of tags for ubiquity either | 18:43 |
| cjwatson | Goosemoose: what preseeding are you using right now? | 18:43 |
| evand | I could be very wrong, but netcfg/get_hostname "" ? | 18:43 |
| cjwatson | that's what I'd expect | 18:44 |
| Goosemoose | gone through multiple items, right now I'm using | 18:44 |
| Goosemoose | tasksel tasksel/first multiselect ubuntu-minimal,ubuntu-standard,ubuntu-desktop | 18:44 |
| Goosemoose | d-i mirror/suite string gusty | 18:44 |
| cjwatson | oh, but DHCP does clobber that I think, that's kind of annoying | 18:44 |
| cjwatson | Goosemoose: either leave mirror/suite unpreseeded (which would work) or spell gutsy right | 18:44 |
| Goosemoose | i commented out the get_hostname, yeah no matter what i did it uses dhcp | 18:45 |
| Goosemoose | cjwatson, oh damn | 18:45 |
| Goosemoose | :) | 18:45 |
| Goosemoose | that's one problem | 18:45 |
| Goosemoose | hmm, that might explain why i couldnt use | 18:46 |
| Goosemoose | tasksel tasksel/first multiselect edubuntu-desktop either | 18:46 |
| Goosemoose | ok, so any ideas with the hostname? | 18:46 |
| cjwatson | working on it | 18:47 |
| Goosemoose | thanks | 18:47 |
| Goosemoose | it's the only prompt i want during the install | 18:47 |
| cjwatson | oh, you want to prompt, not just to set something different? | 18:47 |
| cjwatson | guess you would | 18:48 |
| Goosemoose | yeah, there is going to be 6 computers per classroom | 18:49 |
| Goosemoose | so i need a way to name them | 18:49 |
| cjwatson | I think, unfortunately, you might have to rebuild the initrd | 18:49 |
| cjwatson | http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=343269 | 18:50 |
| Ubotwo | Debian bug 343269 in netcfg "hostname/domain name preseeding is quite broken" [Normal,Open] | 18:50 |
| rgl | oh, the installer with raid stuff will recreate the array... is there a way to make it use the existing array? or I should really debootstrap instead of using the install cd? | 18:51 |
| cjwatson | Goosemoose: if you unpack the initrd (make a fresh directory, cd into it, and zcat /path/to/initrd.gz | sudo cpio -id) then edit etc/dhclient-script and comment out the call to set_network, then repack the initrd (find . | sudo cpio --quiet -o -H newc | gzip -9c > /path/to/initrd.gz), then that should do it ... | 18:52 |
| cjwatson | I appreciate this isn't nice though | 18:52 |
| cjwatson | rgl: you should be able to use the existing array by using "Configure software RAID" and then backing out, I think | 18:53 |
| rgl | cjwatson, too late, it started sync :-( | 18:54 |
| rgl | another 2 hours to the drain :| | 18:54 |
| rgl | cjwatson, you mean just canceling that dialog? | 18:55 |
| cjwatson | yeah, I think so | 18:55 |
| cjwatson | my attention is sort of elsewhere right now though, urgent dapper.2 stuff to do and I have to go offline in 4 minutes | 18:56 |
| cjwatson | sorry ... | 18:56 |
| rgl | ok. I'll use debootstrap instead. | 18:56 |
| cjwatson | that ought to work, certainly | 18:56 |
| Goosemoose | cjwatson, ouch, ok, i'll have to go try that | 18:58 |
| Goosemoose | cjwatson, where did you find that fix so i can print it out? | 19:00 |
| cjwatson | Goosemoose: I made it up | 19:05 |
| cjwatson | I haven't tested it at all, I've just been hacking on the installer for rather a long time ... | 19:05 |
| Goosemoose | i see | 19:06 |
| Goosemoose | im new to deploying desktops on linux, done it on windows for years. worked with linux servers for awhile | 19:07 |
| cjwatson | it's not a fix as such, but a workaround | 19:09 |
| cjwatson | i.e. it's not something we could include in the mainline installer - we need to fix netcfg's crazy preseeding scheme | 19:09 |
| Goosemoose | sure | 19:13 |
| Goosemoose | im waiting for the last test I ran to finish then i can do it | 19:14 |
| Goosemoose | it seems the longest part of the install is the darn partitioning | 19:14 |
| Goosemoose | im considering just making it one large parition, should go a lot faster | 19:14 |
| Goosemoose | cjwatson, still don't end up with a gui, even after spelling gutsy correctly | 19:17 |
| Goosemoose | install goes through, doesn't ask any questions and i end up with a login prompt | 19:17 |
| Goosemoose | cjwatson, did you mean comment out the call to set_network or set_hostname? | 19:22 |
| cjwatson | Goosemoose: err, whoops, set_hostname | 19:23 |
| cjwatson | i.e. stop the DHCP client script from physically setting the hostname | 19:23 |
| Goosemoose | ok thats what i though | 19:23 |
| Goosemoose | couldn't find a set_network :) | 19:23 |
| cjwatson | I'd have to see the installer syslog to debug | 19:23 |
| Goosemoose | i found a single line : set_hostname | 19:23 |
| Goosemoose | # in front of it, anything else? | 19:23 |
| cjwatson | but I also have to go out, I'm afraid - my wife and I are off to the cinema | 19:24 |
| cjwatson | # in front was what I meant | 19:24 |
| Goosemoose | ahh have fun | 19:24 |
| Goosemoose | thanks for the help | 19:24 |
| cjwatson | if that doesn't work, we'll need to debug in more detail | 19:24 |
| Goosemoose | ok | 19:24 |
| Goosemoose | hopefully someone else here can help with me not getting a gui | 19:24 |
| cjwatson | putting the syslog on a pastebin or something should help | 19:25 |
| cjwatson | /var/log/syslog pre-reboot, /var/log/installer/syslog if you're past the first reboot | 19:25 |
| Goosemoose | ok | 19:25 |
| cjwatson | if you stick around, I'll probably drop back in in four hours or so | 19:25 |
| cjwatson | though only briefly - I'm in England so that'll be kinda late | 19:25 |
| Goosemoose | ok | 19:26 |
| Goosemoose | cjwatson, just so you know whyen you get back, commenting that out didnt work | 20:34 |
| rgl | humm, what replaces base-config? I just debootstraped, that command is not available anymore, is it needed? | 20:37 |
| evand | base-config as in the second stage of the installer? That's long dead. | 21:48 |
| evand | cjwatson: Seveas asked if we wanted new ubiquity bug report announcements via ubotu in here. I enjoy the relatively low traffic of this channel and email works fine for me, but is this something you think would benefit you or others? | 21:51 |
| rgl | evand, we have to manually configure the system then? or there is no need? | 22:02 |
| Goosemoose | evand, cj isn't around | 22:41 |
| Goosemoose | he went to the movies he said | 22:41 |
| Goosemoose | anyone see something wrong with this line: tasksel tasksel/first multiselect ubuntu-minimal,ubuntu-standard,ubuntu-desktop | 22:43 |
| cjwatson | evand: I'm not hugely fussed, and also enjoy the low traffic | 23:23 |
| cjwatson | Goosemoose: that looks fine, but the syslog should make it very clear if something's gone wrong with it | 23:23 |
| cjwatson | Goosemoose: well, actually | 23:23 |
| Goosemoose | hi cj | 23:23 |
| cjwatson | Goosemoose: minimal isn't necessary (already installed by the time tasksel runs) | 23:23 |
| cjwatson | and ubuntu-standard might need to be just standard instead | 23:23 |
| Goosemoose | hmm | 23:24 |
| Goosemoose | ok | 23:24 |
| cjwatson | (the task name isn't the same as the metapackage) | 23:24 |
| Goosemoose | im pretty sure i tried standard,ubuntu-desktop | 23:24 |
| Goosemoose | as well as edubuntu-desktop | 23:24 |
| Goosemoose | also the commenting out didn't work | 23:24 |
| cjwatson | yeah, you said. syslog? | 23:24 |
| Goosemoose | let me get it | 23:24 |
| cjwatson | it's possible that it needs to be | 23:25 |
| cjwatson | tasksel tasksel/first multiselect standard, ubuntu-desktop | 23:25 |
| cjwatson | I forget exactly how strict debconf is about the space there | 23:25 |
| Goosemoose | hmm, maybe the space is the issue | 23:25 |
| cjwatson | return grep { defined } map { $desc_to_task{$_} } split ", ", $list; | 23:27 |
| cjwatson | so it definitely has to be separated with ", " | 23:27 |
| cjwatson | (it's actually tasksel's strictness, not debconf's) | 23:27 |
| Goosemoose | cj, damn, ive rebooted so the sys log doesn't have it | 23:27 |
| Goosemoose | have to install again | 23:28 |
| cjwatson | hold | 23:28 |
| Goosemoose | ok | 23:28 |
| cjwatson | did you reboot after a completed install? | 23:28 |
| Goosemoose | yeah | 23:28 |
| Goosemoose | well | 23:28 |
| Goosemoose | wait | 23:28 |
| cjwatson | then /var/log/installer/syslog should be the thing I need | 23:28 |
| Goosemoose | ok, i think im a dir off | 23:28 |
| Goosemoose | just a sec | 23:28 |
| Goosemoose | wont let me ssh into the darn machine, hold on | 23:31 |
| cjwatson | I've filed bug 174557 about this | 23:31 |
| ubotu | Launchpad bug 174557 in tasksel "tasksel/first preseed syntax is inconvenient" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/174557 | 23:31 |
| Goosemoose | thanks | 23:32 |
| Goosemoose | install ssh on the machine | 23:32 |
| Goosemoose | how was the movie? | 23:35 |
| cjwatson | excellent | 23:35 |
| cjwatson | American Gangster | 23:35 |
| Goosemoose | http://pastebin.com/dbfa97aa | 23:35 |
| Goosemoose | ahh | 23:35 |
| Goosemoose | i want to go see that | 23:35 |
| cjwatson | well worth it | 23:35 |
| Goosemoose | good to hear | 23:35 |
| cjwatson | sudo cat syslog> heh, sorry about that - paranoia due to past installer security vulnerabilities | 23:36 |
| Goosemoose | yeah it's a bit of a pain to use sudo even on cat! | 23:36 |
| Goosemoose | especially a log | 23:36 |
| cjwatson | there was a vulnerability in 5.10 where, due to two safety checks failing, the user's password was exposed in the installer logs | 23:37 |
| Goosemoose | ahh wow | 23:37 |
| cjwatson | so I battened down the hatches to make damn sure that could never happen again | 23:37 |
| cjwatson | ok, so you're doing netcfg/get_hostname= on the kernel command line | 23:37 |
| cjwatson | don't do that - that makes that question be marked as seen so it never gets shown | 23:38 |
| cjwatson | just leave that bit out | 23:38 |
| Goosemoose | i had commented it out | 23:38 |
| Goosemoose | let me check my pressed | 23:38 |
| cjwatson | # | 23:38 |
| cjwatson | Dec 6 13:07:55 base-installer: 500 Can't connect to ubuntu:80 (Bad hostname 'ubuntu') | 23:38 |
| cjwatson | that's a bit odd, check why that's trying to connect to a host called 'ubuntu' | 23:39 |
| Goosemoose | #d-i netcfg/get_hostname string unassigned-hostname | 23:39 |
| Goosemoose | #d-i netcfg/get_domain string unassigned-domain | 23:39 |
| Goosemoose | that's in my preseed file | 23:39 |
| cjwatson | Goosemoose: it's not in your preseed file (and wouldn't have any effect if it were, since network preseeding runs after netcfg); it's on the kernel command line | 23:39 |
| cjwatson | you said mirror/suite gutsy earlier, but this is a log from the feisty installer; note that Ubuntu netboot installers don't really support installing releases other than the one they were built for, so you should get the gutsy netboot installer if that's what you want | 23:40 |
| Goosemoose | oh, yes i do | 23:41 |
| Goosemoose | probably because im following the docs from the ubuntu site | 23:41 |
| Goosemoose | which were made for 6.10 | 23:41 |
| cjwatson | which docs? | 23:41 |
| cjwatson | it's not as clear as it might be what tasksel is doing, but I'm pretty sure it's the comma-space thing I mentioned above, so fix that | 23:41 |
| Goosemoose | http://www.debuntu.org/book/export/html/193 is one of them | 23:41 |
| Goosemoose | also have a doc on setting up apt-cacher im using | 23:42 |
| cjwatson | hmm, not our site | 23:42 |
| Goosemoose | closest doc i could find on how to do unattended ubuntu deplyment over a network | 23:43 |
| cjwatson | urgh, it points to the default Debian preseed file | 23:43 |
| cjwatson | its console-setup/layoutcode example is wrong | 23:43 |
| cjwatson | though it does get tasksel/first right :-0 | 23:43 |
| cjwatson | :-) | 23:43 |
| Goosemoose | it points to it, which i used as a startup , but then i changed it based on the doc itself | 23:43 |
| Goosemoose | hmm maybe that's part of the problem | 23:44 |
| Goosemoose | here's my preseed | 23:44 |
| Goosemoose | http://pastebin.com/d13e8fd76 | 23:44 |
| cjwatson | I do need to hit the help.ubuntu.com guys until they publish the 7.10 manual, but: https://help.ubuntu.com/7.04/installation-guide/i386/ | 23:44 |
| cjwatson | that has advice on netbooting, preseeding, etc. | 23:44 |
| cjwatson | ok, I can do a quick nitpick pass before bed | 23:45 |
| Goosemoose | cool, im looking at that link right now | 23:45 |
| Goosemoose | basically it runs through the whole thing | 23:45 |
| Goosemoose | doesn't ask for a hostname | 23:45 |
| Goosemoose | and doesn't give me a gui | 23:45 |
| Goosemoose | they need to make this: https://help.ubuntu.com/7.04/installation-guide/i386/preseed-contents.html into one file you can copy instead of a bunch of parts | 23:46 |
| cjwatson | ditch everything up through netcfg (at least). All of that is handled by the installer before it reads the preseed file, so there's no point putting it in the preseed file as it won't be used. | 23:46 |
| Goosemoose | ok | 23:46 |
| cjwatson | there are other formats in the installation-guide-i386 package in the distro | 23:46 |
| cjwatson | plain text and PDF | 23:47 |
| Goosemoose | ok, looking | 23:47 |
| cjwatson | ok, on your kernel command line you have 'console-setup/layoutcode=en_GB', which isn't a correct layout code; if you want a British keyboard, that's =gb, if you want a US keyboard, that's =us | 23:48 |
| cjwatson | (debuntu.org advises =en_US which is wrong. They map onto X keyboard layout names from /usr/share/X11/xkb/symbols/) | 23:48 |
| Goosemoose | i wanted us be couldn't find us on the system | 23:49 |
| cjwatson | # | 23:49 |
| cjwatson | # You can choose to install non-free and contrib software. | 23:49 |
| cjwatson | # | 23:49 |
| cjwatson | d-i apt-setup/non-free boolean true | 23:49 |
| Goosemoose | i don't see the example file on the ubuntu server, know where it is? just did a locate as well | 23:49 |
| cjwatson | # | 23:49 |
| cjwatson | d-i apt-setup/contrib boolean true | 23:49 |
| cjwatson | that comes from the Debian preseed file and is meaningless on Ubuntu | 23:49 |
| cjwatson | ok, use console-setup/layoutcode=us then | 23:49 |
| Goosemoose | might be better if i start from an ubuntu if most of it doesn't apply | 23:49 |
| Goosemoose | ok | 23:49 |
| cjwatson | the link is dead, sorry - it's https://help.ubuntu.com/7.04/installation-guide/example-preseed.txt | 23:50 |
| Goosemoose | perfect | 23:50 |
| cjwatson | most of it does apply, but console setup and apt configuration are two areas that differ a fair bit | 23:50 |
| Goosemoose | gotcha | 23:50 |
| Goosemoose | ok | 23:50 |
| Goosemoose | so im commenting out the hostname line, correct? | 23:51 |
| cjwatson | I think so | 23:51 |
| Goosemoose | ok | 23:51 |
| cjwatson | I still haven't tried it, sorry | 23:51 |
| Goosemoose | np | 23:51 |
| cjwatson | the tasksel thing as I said above | 23:51 |
| cjwatson | I checked the feisty Packages file, and the correct task name is 'standard' not 'ubuntu-standard' | 23:52 |
| cjwatson | (the guide is wrong there, sorry; I fixed that bug for the 7.10 guide) | 23:52 |
| Goosemoose | ok | 23:52 |
| Goosemoose | tasksel --list-tasks says there is a edubuntu-desktop as well | 23:53 |
| Goosemoose | is that correct? | 23:53 |
| cjwatson | the rest of your preseeding is fine, with the exception of stuff in comments that isn't quite right, but I'll spare you that | 23:53 |
| cjwatson | yes, edubuntu-desktop should work fine | 23:53 |
| Goosemoose | hmm | 23:53 |
| cjwatson | though you said it didn't earlier - I'd need a syslog again of that I'm afraid | 23:53 |
| Goosemoose | i'd have to rerun trying that | 23:53 |
| Goosemoose | been trying different combo's on the same machine | 23:53 |
| Goosemoose | tried tasksel tasksel/first multiselect ubuntu-standard, ubuntu-desktop last time | 23:54 |
| Goosemoose | tasksel tasksel/first multiselect standard, edubuntu-desktop | 23:54 |
| cjwatson | the latter should definitely work | 23:54 |
| Goosemoose | ill try that ^^^ this time, though I'm sure I have | 23:54 |
| cjwatson | if the space is there | 23:54 |
| Goosemoose | yeah, i had it there | 23:54 |
| cjwatson | but if it doesn't, let me know - if you can't stay on IRC, mail ubuntu-installer@lists.ubuntu.com | 23:55 |
| Goosemoose | could the problem be in my prelinux.cfg/default file? | 23:55 |
| === cjwatson changed the topic of #ubuntu-installer to: Development of d-i and ubiquity in Ubuntu | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/InstallerDevelopment | If nobody answers, try ubuntu-installer@lists.ubuntu.com | ||
| Goosemoose | working off the example you just gave me now | 23:56 |
| cjwatson | I don't think so, I can see basically what that's doing by the kernel command line in the log | 23:56 |
| Goosemoose | changed to | 23:56 |
| Goosemoose | d-i mirror/udeb/suite string gutsy | 23:56 |
| Goosemoose | ok | 23:56 |
| cjwatson | well, as I said, trying to install gutsy using feisty will probably fail in funny ways | 23:56 |
| Goosemoose | sure, so i need to get gutsy | 23:56 |
| cjwatson | it could be related to the mirror problem I mentioned above | 23:56 |
| Goosemoose | i missed that, what mirror problem? | 23:57 |
| cjwatson | # | 23:57 |
| cjwatson | Dec 6 13:07:55 base-installer: 500 Can't connect to ubuntu:80 (Bad hostname 'ubuntu') | 23:57 |
| Goosemoose | oh ok | 23:57 |
| cjwatson | not clear why that's happening | 23:58 |
| cjwatson | I don't see where you're telling it to connect to 'ubuntu' | 23:58 |
| Goosemoose | so http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/gutsy/main/installer-i386/current/images/netboot/netboot.tar.gz | 23:58 |
| Goosemoose | me either | 23:58 |
| cjwatson | that's the right URL | 23:59 |
| Goosemoose | ok so i'm removing my old ubuntu-installer and ill extract that one and try it, wish me luck :) | 23:59 |
| cjwatson | anyway, you should have enough to iterate on | 23:59 |
| cjwatson | good luck :) | 23:59 |
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