[00:01] Kmos: do you know how that's pulled from then in general packages? [00:02] rick_h_: They're pulled from changelogs.ubuntu.com [00:02] so if I were to submit a LP bug for the PPAs what would I be saying it should be reading/doing that is getting done with main packages? [00:02] RAOF: ok, and hten changelogs.ub... is pulling the changelogs from the package? [00:03] I'm not sure; that'd be internal launchpad/soyuz craziness, probably. [00:03] I would imagine that the buildprocess pushes changelogs to c.u.c, rather than c.u.c trying to pull new changelogs periodically. [00:04] ic [00:04] c.u.c is only updated twice a day [00:04] However, that is uninformed speculation. that's just how I'd (naievely) do it. [00:04] yea, just seems strange that it doesn't just use the packages changelog === Ubulette_ is now known as Ubulette [00:29] how does the ubuntu livecd package the filesystem (such as /etc /usr, etc)? [00:29] for instance is it put into an archive or is it directly copied to the cd? [00:29] cd/iso [00:32] LordKow, why don't just grab and extract the deb ? [00:32] good idea :p [00:34] the fonts in qt apps right now are almost unreadable as of the latest fontconfig update (which i am trying to confirm as the cause of the font probs) [00:34] LordKow: see casper. [00:35] im guessing the specific package will be fontconfig-config [00:35] LordKow: It's called squashfs I think. [00:36] https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/gutsy/i386/fontconfig-config/2.4.2-1.2ubuntu4 [00:36] grab the deb and extract it (ar x foo.deb) [00:40] hey look i think i found the reason the new fontconfig-config package screwed up font rendering. bbiab [00:58] Good night folks! === tonyy is now known as tonyyarusso [01:54] Heya gang [01:59] hmm, packaging jams [02:00] or is that packages of jam [02:01] raspberry [02:01] ...or jamming packages... down our throats. [02:02] TheMuso: lol [02:04] I wonder where these experienced discussion leaders are gonna come from [02:04] * LaserJock votes to have ajmitch teach them all [02:06] * bddebian seconds that Mr. Chairman [02:07] LaserJock: please note that these are to be done in person [02:07] therefore you're by far the best candidate === tonyy is now known as tonyyarusso [02:11] ajmitch: I know they are in person [02:11] you need to see the world some more ;-) [02:11] * Hobbsee waves [02:11] hi Hobbsee [02:11] * DarkMageZ votes to send Hobbsee to teach. [02:12] ? [02:12] DarkMageZ: I don't know, we don't want to see the DOOM Stick in person ;-) [02:12] hah [02:13] Hobbsee: I nominated ajmitch to teach all the Packaging Jams [02:13] ahhhh [02:13] sounds good. [02:15] so [02:16] today I was helping a labmate move his desk [02:16] and since I'm responsible for all the computers I was making sure everything got moved over alright [02:17] hello Hobbsee [02:17] so after navigating the cable jungle I got his computer moved over [02:17] hi ajmitch [02:17] and so he got it running [02:17] and then I gave him a power strip/surge protector [02:17] he looked at it like he had no idea what it was for [02:18] so I told him to plug his computer into it to keep from getting fried during one of our power outages [02:18] and so before I could say anything he just rips the power cord out of the wall (his computer was running) and plugged it into the power strip === vorian is now known as LadiesMan217 [02:18] heh [02:18] luckily it's a Windows computer or I would have been more upset [02:18] haha [02:19] * ajmitch wonders if LadiesMan217 has been watching transformers lately... [02:19] lol [02:19] but he just said "that was easy" [02:20] some people... [02:21] LaserJock: Since it was Windows you weren't worried because you knew it would come right back up? [02:21] * bddebian hides [02:22] bddebian: I wasn't worried because for Windows "it's not my problem" [02:22] hehe [02:22] I just have them call the help desk === valles_ is now known as effie_jayx [02:27] Hobbsee: Is the debian-games channel a black hole or what? :) [02:27] unsure [02:28] it's quiet today [02:28] bddebian: are they ignoring you? [02:33] Hobbsee: It's always quiet :) [02:34] ajmitch: Everyone ignores me :) [02:38] * LaserJock wonders how long we can go ignoring bddebian [02:39] bddebian: it's been what .. almost 3 years now? ;-) [02:41] longer for some [02:42] * bddebian runs to the corner and cries :'-( [02:55] bug #174239 [02:55] Launchpad bug 174239 in dhelp "Please merge dhelp 0.6.0 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/174239 [02:59] * Hobbsee sighs [02:59] * Hobbsee hits kmos with the cluebat. [03:02] 82% probability of crack [03:03] can we just make a LP bot to follow kmos and close bugs [03:04] would that be evil [03:04] imbrandon: i wish. [03:04] imbrandon: fortunately, it's not hard to find his bugs. it would be possible with debhelper [03:04] * Hobbsee rather likes the absolute idiocy in the bug. [03:04] new net connection installed today, no more comcast, yay \0/ [03:05] you're not supposed ot add random recommends, with no indication as to why this might be a good idea [03:05] if the random recommends change has a bug listed next to it, the bug should say at least *something* about why the random recommends change should be done! === bmk789 is now known as bmk789_sleep [03:09] :) [03:09] seems i get a flickr *pro* account with my isp account too [03:09] hehe [03:09] * imbrandon goes to try flickrfs [03:11] nixternal: you have a kdiff3 merge outstanding, which has been kmos'd. [03:11] nixternal: that will teach you to leave merges laying arround :) [03:12] nixternal: you may want to upload, before someone uploads his changes [03:12] imbrandon: it wouldn't matter - he still has no respect for stuff belonging to other people - even if it's a lp bug assigned to them. *shrug* [03:13] actually, this is already uplaoded, he just hasn't closed the bug. [03:14] * Hobbsee throws out a kmos'd bug. [03:15] * Hobbsee throws out another one [03:16] * Fujitsu looks at the lonely Kmos email on the MC ML. [03:16] id' reply, but a lot of what i think is already on there :) [03:18] * Nafallo mumbles about gajim having 2500 packages to be built before it's built. [03:19] Fujitsu: are people supposed to respond? [03:20] A response from the MC would b enice. [03:20] a [03:20] LaserJock: I would presume the email was sent for reasons other than to sit around. [03:20] LaserJock: yes, Kmos is meant to [03:21] * StevenK waits for him to reply "I don't get it" [03:21] Haha. [03:21] bloody kmos. [03:22] now, who synced this without seeing the request was WRONG? [03:22] Worse, who ACKed it? [03:22] Kmos! [03:22] no one ack'd it. [03:23] If no one ACK'd it, they shouldn't have sync'd it. [03:23] well, exactly [03:23] does anyone actually keep their hardy-changes mail? [03:23] yes [03:23] Hobbsee: I do. [03:24] * Fujitsu doesn't delete mail. [03:24] Fujitsu: can you find otu when it was synced, and who synced it please? [03:24] `it' [03:24] What's `it'? [03:24] stunnel4, sorry [03:24] * ajmitch doesn't know what package Hobbsee is talking about [03:24] * Fujitsu can't see anything. [03:24] * ajmitch has no stunnel4 mail [03:24] Must have been an autosync. [03:24] https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/stunnel4/+bug/157095 [03:24] Launchpad bug 157095 in stunnel4 "Please sync stunnel4 3:4.20-5 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Incomplete] [03:25] Kms uploaded it in Gutsy. [03:25] but it had ubuntu changes.... [03:25] yeah, after i explained it to him a few times [03:26] OTOH, by the time the package has been kmos'd, do we actually care? [03:26] The archive admin must have had the mail turned off when they synced it... Damn. [03:26] slangasek: wow, i thought you were core already heh [03:27] kmos'd, a new action [03:27] lol [03:27] * Fujitsu registers violent objections to slangasek's core-dev application, just to be different. [03:27] Hobbsee: The autosync somehow caught it... please talk to an archive admin: something is broken. [03:27] * Hobbsee sets another one to invalid [03:27] slangasek: FIX IT, kthxbye. [03:27] :) [03:27] er, incomplete [03:28] * Hobbsee sees another crack-filled bug, which dholbach has already dealt with [03:28] * Fujitsu smokes said bug. [03:29] https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/python-coverage/+bug/173529 [03:29] Launchpad bug 173529 in python-coverage "Please sync python-coverage 2.6-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Incomplete] [03:29] ...yay. [03:29] Hahaha. [03:29] Ok. With the exception of 4 packages that FTBFS, the libglib1.2ldbl transition is complete. [03:29] All Ubuntu changes merged... into the null? [03:29] TheMuso: Nice. [03:29] And FTBFS as in don't build for me. [03:29] Fujitsu: i think so, yeah. [03:29] "The Ubuntu changes can be dropped because the package is now at Debian" [03:30] StevenK: i prefer "the ubuntu changes can be dropped, because debian has a new maintainer" [03:30] lol [03:30] * StevenK sharpens his ICBM. [03:30] hhahaha [03:30] Haha. [03:30] Hobbsee: Where have you seen that? [03:30] took him a long while to get the explanation thru his thick skull as to why that wasn't correct. [03:31] Fujitsu: i don't remember what the package was now. it went from debian QA group to a maintainer [03:31] * Fujitsu invokes the CoC. [03:31] It can't be against the CoC if it's truthful. [03:31] StevenK: Can't it? [03:31] Wait, did I say that out loud? [03:32] Fujitsu: It can, I was poking fun. === effie_jayx is now known as effie-jayx [03:33] perhaps one could invoke the "resign appropriately" clause on this fellow [03:34] pwnguin: until they nuke the ubuntu section of his LP account, that's impossible. [03:34] * pwnguin is still unsure how someone without write access to ubuntu causes so much trouble [03:35] pwnguin: untill now none of us was sure [03:35] lol [03:35] filing masses of crap bug requests. [03:35] flooding the queues. [03:35] bonus points for closing bugs at random [03:36] i can't find it [03:36] my lp-searching-foo isn't good neough [03:36] could probably grep the logs if i wished [03:36] pwnguin: whens the next time you will likely be in KC, I thought about org one of those pacakge jams here ( seperate from the LUG meetings ) and it would be cool if you were in town too [03:36] january-ish [03:36] well, i dont really make plans to come into town [03:37] im not sure if i'll be in for christmas [03:37] * Fujitsu has 1000 bug mails from Kmos at the moment.. [03:37] pwnguin: yea i dont think there would be good attendance arround xmas [03:37] thus thinking jan-ish [03:37] Fujitsu: poor bastard. just delete tehm. [03:38] Hobbsee: They now get their own special folder. [03:38] hah! [03:38] if you make an announcement, i might be able to show. but I hope you don't expect me to colead such an endevor [03:38] (no, not /dev/null) [03:38] "Junk" ? [03:38] pwnguin: no not at all, just thought you might like to attend too [03:39] maybe field a question or two, but nothing along the lines of co-* [03:39] Searching Launchpad for all bugs related to Kmos returns 1,152. [03:39] holy jebus StevenK [03:39] That's impressive [03:40] * Fujitsu wonders how many the average MOTU has. [03:40] yes, but how many of them were marked "invalid" or "won't fix"? [03:40] Heh. [03:40] O_o [03:40] I have 2450 to my name. [03:40] well, if we're going to legislate good QA behavior, can we also institute a "don't triage driver bugs if you dont have the hardware" policy? [03:41] Hobbsee: 336 [03:41] StevenK: yeah, *odd* that. [03:41] StevenK: and how many bugs were related to ubuntu? [03:41] StevenK: Haha. [03:41] StevenK: got to remember that getdeb uses LP as well [03:41] so he can have crack-filled bugs there that will increase his count. [03:41] Even better. [03:42] I don't want to read through every page, but there is only one GetDeb bug on the first page [03:42] you can search for ubuntu bugs [03:42] * Hobbsee has a look [03:42] * Fujitsu notes that the Invalid/Won't Fix metric isn't particularly valid, as he might have been doing valid triage. [03:42] StevenK: was the total count for all states, including closed? [03:42] Fujitsu: yeah, but the chance of that is... [03:43] Hobbsee: Yes, the >1,000 number was every state [03:43] Hobbsee: True, but I was looking at counts from others, and found a quite high proportion of each was negatively closed. [03:44] Fujitsu: oh, indeed. but i'd say most of kmos' were closed due to a) kmos incompetence b) kmos was wrong c) kmos closed teh bug at random [03:44] Right. [03:44] only 245 total, reported by kmos. [03:44] ... then what the heck were the rest he ate!? [03:44] outside of ubuntu [03:45] there appears to be 771 that he's commented on [03:45] and...159 that he's both the reporter, and commented on [03:45] I'm outa here. GOing out for a couple of hours, but we have a storm coming, so offline my gear oges. [03:45] therefore, 857, assuming LP's search is not screwed. [03:45] Bye TheMuso. [03:46] Hobbsee: And what are the chances of it not being screwed? I'm thinking of searches for bugs within distroseries, for example. [03:46] They give completely bogus results, most of the time. [03:47] I have a buddy who replaced some hardware for an ubuntu install but now he can't get the right sata driver loaded (data_via) it still loads the old one sata_sis (he even supposedly rebuilt the initrd image)... [03:47] sata_via [03:47] Fujitsu: indeed, it would count bugs affecting multiple packages, multiple times, as well as multiple distroseries bugs [03:47] Fujitsu: however, seeing as it does it for everyone [03:47] That's not the sort of bogusness I was talking about, but right. [03:48] i haven't seen launchpad search *really* screw up for a while [03:48] That's because you don't do SRUs or security things. [03:48] no, tha'ts not what i meant [03:50] it appears to be fixed now [03:50] Fujitsu: i was searching for the busybox issues, iirc, so used a string that's common. [03:50] i got a whole heap of results that did not contain the words of the search string. [03:50] only a few of them, separately. [03:50] Haha. [03:51] like, only a few of the words, not all of them. [03:51] If you want to search by textual content, you're much better off using Google. [03:52] s/by textual content// [03:52] Google doens't handle much of the meta-data well. [03:54] Hobbsee: too if you use the UW search and then click "launchpad" in the results at the top, it limits it to LP only results [03:54] hmmm... [03:57] OR just search for "more:launchpad " like "more:launchpad busybox" on search.uw.c or in the Firefox add-in [03:57] ive got a couple ignorant questions about program memory usage =/ [03:57] which is the best way to measure a program's memory usage in GNOME? [03:58] there's Resident memory, and "Memory" [03:58] (and also x server memory, which firefox uses considerable amounts of) [03:59] Hobbsee: and if you would find it usefull it would only take me meer minutes to whip one up that only searches bugs.launchpad.net by default without the need for extra strings [03:59] just lemme know' [03:59] pwnguin: no idea [03:59] imbrandon: hmm. searching for something quite broad is something i don't tend to do much [04:00] true [04:01] the more:launchpad then is probably the way to go [04:03] ( fyi more:forums and more:wiki also work, but thats the only 3 i implmented, more upon request ) [04:07] hmm, I've reported a whopping 62 bugs :/ [04:08] LaserJock: the idea is that you fix / close more than you report. [04:08] LaserJock: sustainable bugs. [04:08] pwnguin: It depends on what sort of memory usage you're after (although this is not helpful) :) [04:08] Hobbsee: well, I've commented on 344 [04:08] pwnguin: But I think you're probably after either "resident memory" or "writable memory" [04:09] I'm still waaaay behind Kmos though :( [04:09] * LaserJock write a random bug filing script [04:09] RAOF: does shared count stuff thats only shared in one program? [04:09] LaserJock! [04:10] pwnguin: See, here's where it gets difficult :( [04:10] heh [04:10] do we get golden ponies for christmass ? [04:10] im just impressed that gnome's tool is keeping track of X [04:10] imbrandon: I sure hope so [04:10] its possible it also accounts for shared libs with a count of 1 [04:10] :) === DarkMageZ_ is now known as DarkMageZ [04:14] wtf http://www.boingboing.net/2007/12/06/western-digital-netw.html [04:16] imbrandon: wow, that's ... interesting [04:17] kinda dumb, a hdd should do whats its told [04:17] looks like i wont buy any wd's [04:17] ( even though i have one sitting here with my OS on it lol ) [04:18] I don't quite understand what they are preventing, can you put media files on it? [04:18] yea [04:18] here is a better link [04:18] http://wdc.custhelp.com/cgi-bin/wdc.cfg/php/enduser/std_adp.php?p_faqid=1495&p_created=1168641440&p_sid=bLTfVJLi&p_accessibility=0&p_redirect=&p_lva=&p_sp=cF9zcmNoPTEmcF9zb3J0X2J5PSZwX2dyaWRzb3J0PSZwX3Jvd19jbnQ9NSw1JnBfcHJvZHM9MCZwX2NhdHM9MCZwX3B2PSZwX2N2PSZwX3NlYXJjaF90eXBlPWFuc3dlcnMuc2VhcmNoX2ZubCZwX3BhZ2U9MSZwX3NlYXJjaF90ZXh0PS5hdmk*&p_li=&p_topview=1 [04:18] ( longer but explains more )\ [04:18] shesh, with a URL like that it's gotta be good ;-) [04:18] lol [04:19] imbrandon: even oggs :( [04:19] yea [04:20] well, i don't think it'd mess me up, but what the heck [04:20] imbrandon, it's partly deceptive. the full story is that you can't share those files with OTHER users. [04:21] right, but my dvr frontend certainly dont run as the same user as my pc account [04:21] :) [04:22] LaserJock: I'm confident your random bug filing script would produce higher quality bugs than Kmos does on average. [04:22] ScottK: I really don't get it === DarkMageZ_ is now known as DarkMageZ [04:23] I don't understand how he can do this so much [04:23] LaserJock: boredom? [04:23] not knowign the processes or caring about them [04:23] well, I mean like how can he be wrong so much [04:23] imbrandon: lack of care. he does know. [04:24] i doubt he knows them all, hell i dont know them all :) [04:24] what is he doing wrong so much? [04:25] LaserJock: the biggest problems seem to be sync bugs, where he doesn't feel it's appropriate to say why ubuntu changes can be dropped, sometimes adds more, for random, unknown reasons [04:25] as in, that's what he's working on at the moment [04:25] doesn't take enough care with his work, to see if it's right or wrong [04:26] it's kind of like a monkey has glanced at the changelog, seen one bug is fixed in debian, so we can sync the entire thing. [04:26] or the version is the same in debian, so we can throw out ubuntu changes. [04:26] it's just utter stupidity like that, which he continues to do, even though he's told over and over again why things don't work that way [04:26] hmm, odd [04:26] LaserJock: other problems are just lack of care, including filing removal bugs for packages not actually in the archive anyway. === asac_ is now known as asac [04:28] Hobbsee: Has he really filed removal bugs for non-existant packages? How do you even do that? === DarkMageZ_ is now known as DarkMageZ [04:28] RAOF: oh yes. i gave him a good larting over it. [04:28] RAOF: by looking at the debian removal lists, then filing removal requests for everything, or almost everything, in ubuntu from it. [04:29] But surely you'd file a removal request on the source package you want to remove, right? If that's not in ubuntu... [04:29] then he filed it under ubuntu, i think. [04:30] * RAOF blinks. [04:30] it may have been a binary that w [04:30] actually, no [04:30] iirc, it was filed under a similar source package name [04:31] I don't think a smiley exists for my current expression. [04:31] hehe [04:31] lol [04:31] LaserJock: of particular brilliance was a sync request of adept, which was up to ubuntu23 at the time. [04:31] wow [04:31] interesting [04:31] that was a while ago...but... [04:32] LaserJock: now, he's not doing as spectacularly large errors as that, but multiple smaller errors [04:32] same base problems, etc. [04:37] hmm, he's not even an Ubuntu Member === DarkMageZ__ is now known as DarkMageZ [04:39] LaserJock: no, they stopped him. [04:39] LaserJock: some people got together some objections about it [04:39] oh doh, I was there [04:44] DarkMageZ__: ping [04:46] DarkMageZ__: that diff.gz looks good, but umm you need to also provide me with a dsc if you want me to be able to do anything usefull with it [04:47] Hobbsee: I uploaded the kdiff3 merge earlier this week === ghostingmyself is now known as DarkMageZ [04:48] imbrandon, sry. my isp's provider is being lame. [04:51] Hobbsee: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kdiff3 [04:52] DarkMageZ: no worries, i just applied it manualy, ummm i'm gonna make quite a few changes to this prior to upload, me and you seem to have very diffrent package techniuqes [04:52] nixternal: yeah, i saw eventually [04:52] heh [04:52] hi folks! [04:52] DarkMageZ: also autotool-dev ftw :) [04:52] which are the priority bugs on this proces? the merges? [04:52] heya nxvl hows it been going [04:53] imbrandon: nice, with lots of work [04:53] merges are pretty important yes [04:53] and some hard days, cause my girlfriend has gone yesterday to USA for all summer [04:53] to work on vail [04:54] ouch [04:54] so the last days i was very busy [04:54] were at in the US ? [04:54] imbrandon: no, it's nice to have some more free time now that i'm on my MOTU process [04:54] :) [04:54] imbrandon: vail, corolado [04:54] ahh cool [04:54] Nice [04:55] colrado is nice, cold this time of year, but nice [04:55] yes and he has got a nice work, he will be lift oparator, so she will be snowboarding all day [04:55] :) [04:55] sounds like fun [04:56] yes, i'm kind of sad, but is an experience she must have [04:56] so i'm happy on the other hand [04:56] * imbrandon hates snow and we have about 2 inches on the ground right now here [04:56] i love board sports [04:56] i'd break me neck :) [04:56] i surf, skate, i have wakeboard, sandboard (which i want to do more), skinboard ... [04:57] i haven't only, skyboard and snowboard [04:57] and kniteboard [04:57] :D [04:58] i haven't been on the snow [04:58] Hobbsee: don't scare me like that again...I had to search for my .upload file :) [04:59] if he would have created a debdiff, I would have set as "will not fix" and uploaded it myself anyways...cuz I am a jerk like that :p [04:59] ok [04:59] now i need to work to fix the lost days [04:59] so lets merge :D [05:00] imbrandon: are you planning to go to debconf 8? [05:00] not sure yet, i will have to see what the $work scedule is like [05:00] i'd like to but who knows [05:01] where is debconf8? [05:01] they only decided on a region iirc, not a place [05:01] somewhere in EU [05:01] bah [05:01] EU gets *all* the good ones [05:02] It will be held in Mar del Plata, Argentina, from August 10th to August 16th, 2008 [05:02] i was wrong [05:02] * tritium can't wait for a UDS in the southwestern states of the U.S. [05:02] heck yea! [05:03] tritium: hehe it was in socal not long ago :) [05:03] * RAOF thinks it's time for UDS - Hobart [05:03] imbrandon: yeah, missed that one :) [05:03] imbrandon: socal? [05:03] LaserJock: souther california [05:03] imbrandon: Mountain View is not southern cali [05:03] Wow, email from a google recruiter! :) [05:04] LaserJock: close nuff :) [05:04] imbrandon: pfftt [05:04] tell that to somebody from LA [05:04] mt. view is middle cali :) [05:04] middle/northern cali [05:04] wine country cali [05:04] LaserJock: http://debconf8.debconf.org/ [05:04] I heard somebody from LA say anything above Bakersfield is norcal [05:05] it is for someone from LA [05:05] people in LA have their heads in the clouds anyways [05:05] that smog has to be getting to them [05:05] s/clouds/smog/ [05:05] s/smog/pot/ [05:05] lol [05:05] coke :) [05:05] I think they have surpassed Newark in pollution [05:06] acid! [05:06] imbrandon: nop, debconf 8 will be on Auguston Mar de Plata argentina [05:06] here we go, imbrandon you know as soon as you name another drug, your x-girlfriend cutiecoder will be in here correcting you with the technical crap [05:06] imbrandon: they have just decide where it will be debconf 9, but i don't remember well, i have it somewhere [05:06] I ... I ... cant feel ... my face ! -- Blow, best quote evar [05:07] sooo true [05:07] nxvl: Extremadura [05:07] I need a LaserRockConf [05:08] everybody comes to my house [05:08] works for me! [05:08] heh we'd all be broke from the casinos and brothels ;) [05:08] driving distance for me [05:08] Extremadura gets everything [05:09] tritium: how about UDS-LANL? [05:09] That would be interesting... [05:09] call me when Mark wants to have UDS-KC [05:09] UDS Chicago! [05:09] although, the Ubuntu fans are shrinking here [05:09] imbrandon: you're in KC? I travel there on business _all the time_ [05:10]