[07:05] <dholbach> good morning
[09:39] <guardian> morning
[09:59] <lool> Morning
[10:08] <lool> StevenK: As your might have noticed, tinymail now needs to be built with libxul-embedding instead of -1.9
[10:08] <lool> StevenK: (With suitable bump in xulrunner-dev build-dep)
[10:10] <lool> StevenK: Also, I confirm you can drop -fPIC from CFLAGS now
[11:11] <StevenK> lool: Huzzah!
[12:38] <TeTeT> does anyone know if standard Ubuntu Desktop version does run on the Menlow with Poulsbo graphics out of the box?
[14:07] <InSearchOf> agoliveira, You around?
[14:07] <agoliveira> InSearchOf: Yes. What's up?
[14:08] <InSearchOf> is there anyway I can talk to you outside of IRC?
[14:09] <agoliveira> InSearchOf: is ICQ or Gtalk ok? I can give you my contact.
[14:09] <agoliveira> or email...
[14:09] <InSearchOf> 477584655
[14:09] <InSearchOf> ICQ
[14:09] <agoliveira> InSearchOf: Hold on...
[14:10] <agoliveira> InSearchOf: Added, waiting for your authorization
[14:11] <InSearchOf> done
[14:12] <agoliveira> InSearchOf: Call me if you need but bare in mind that I'm extrely busy this week as my vacations start saturday.
[14:12] <InSearchOf> ahhh...
[14:22] <InSearchOf> dholbach, you around?
[14:22] <dholbach> InSearchOf: yes
[14:23] <InSearchOf> is there anyway I can talk to you outside of IRC
[14:23] <InSearchOf> if you would rather talk in here that is fine
[14:24] <dholbach> InSearchOf: what can I help you with?
[14:24] <InSearchOf> I'm from pdaXrom... We run an OS made primarily for Sharp Zaurus, X11 based OS
[14:25] <InSearchOf> We were looking at making a change in our roadmap and someone from the team brought up UME
[14:26] <InSearchOf> and I'm seeing would would need to be done to combined our efforts and get the arm platform supported under UME
[14:26] <dholbach> InSearchOf: I'm not sure I'm the right person to talk to
[14:26] <dholbach> Mithrandir and davidm: can you reply to this? ^
[14:27] <InSearchOf> and when I say what would need to be done.... I mean I dont want to announce to the community that we are merging unless I get someones good graces to do so
[14:30] <agoliveira> dholbach: This is not actually a technical issue but community, that's why I asked him to talk to you.
[14:31] <dholbach> agoliveira: I can't setup arm buildds - that's an effort somebody in the mobile team should be driving
[14:31] <InSearchOf> well my team would handle the arm builds
[14:32] <InSearchOf> brb
[14:36] <agoliveira> dholbach: Ok, it's been some crossed lines here :) We can handle the tech problems, of course, I just asked him to join in the talk because he wants to know what's the currect aproach to start a comunnity project related to Ubuntu. He wants to make this "official" if there is such a thing.
[14:37] <dholbach> agoliveira: maybe it's a good idea to present this to the technical board as a community effort and go from there?
[14:37] <agoliveira> dholbach: That's what he wanted to know, how to proceed :) I'll talk to David first and go over from there, thanks.
[14:38] <dholbach> agoliveira: great
[15:30] <davidm> dholbach, agoliveira I'll grab this, just back from getting a flat tire fixed.
[15:31] <davidm> InSearchOf, at the moment we are focused on the Intel MID chipset at least until our initial release.
[15:31] <dholbach> davidm: I have deep sympathies with you :-/
[15:32] <davidm> dholbach, on which the tire or the initial release? ;-)
[15:33] <dholbach> davidm: both... :)
[15:33] <dholbach> davidm: http://daniel.holba.ch/greece/14-Patras/005-IMG_4644.JPG - that's what happened during my holidays :)
[15:34] <davidm> no fun, last night the coldest night of the year, I walk out to the flat, and an urgent task from my wife to get accomplished with a tight deadline.... No fun at all
[15:54] <InSearchOf> davidm, so merging projects isnt an option? or not yet since the primary focus is on the MID chipset
[15:57] <davidm> At the moment the mobile team is focused on getting the first release out the door, and that is on the Intel MID for the moment, but most all of our work is public so you can work with it if you want to.
[15:58] <davidm> But for the moment I have a small team and I have to keep my eye on MID for the moment.
[16:02] <InSearchOf> well currently our dev team can focus on the hardware and core development... it would be the gui components that would merge
[16:03] <guardian> i have a quick question
[16:03] <guardian> should i stick with my current image (gutsy) or should i change the repos ?
[16:14] <agoliveira> InSearchOf: My sugestion would be that you get a working kernel and create an arm-based crosscompilation enviroment (maybe something based on Maemo's sandbox?) and see what happens.
[16:15] <InSearchOf> alright.. well I mean our current crosscomplitation env. works...  will it have to be Maemo?
[16:16] <agoliveira> InSearchOf: Not at all, I just suggested as something to look at as our base GUI is hildon that came from Maemo.
[16:17] <InSearchOf> and the reason I'm asking so many questions is because I put our development on hold... 
[16:17] <InSearchOf> waiting for an answer back... 
[16:20] <agoliveira> InSearchOf: we will try to help but, as I said, you got us in a very bad time as we are all entering on vacations in 2 weeks and myslef in 1 so we are very busy right now.
[16:22] <InSearchOf> agoliveira, well... I will just keep things on hold. which isnt a problem... I will look into how we would approach the getting things to work.
[16:23] <agoliveira> InSearchOf: Your idea will be proposed to the technical board and I don't see w areason to not be aproved but that will have to wait until January unfortunately.
[16:25] <InSearchOf> agoliveira, that is 100% fine. We aren't looking to move fast... but communication was what I was looking for and I got it.
[16:25] <agoliveira> InSearchOf: Whatever we can do, just come in and ask. We will try to help, that's for sure.
[16:26] <wasabi> So curiously, what makes this inappropiate for the N810?
[16:27] <wasabi> Just size, aka nonwillingness to strip out stuff like perl, etc?
[16:27] <wasabi> And/or lack of packages for the binary crap in Maemo?
[16:28] <mjg59`> And also the hassle of getting kernel support into our tree
[16:28] <agoliveira> wasabi: The lack of openness regarding parts of Nokia tablets, for one.
[16:28] <wasabi> Yeah. Pretty much what I guessed.
[16:28] <wasabi> Alas!
[16:29] <agoliveira> mjg59`: Hey Mathew. I thought that you would be away for some time.
[16:29] <wasabi> Would be nice if Nokia were to work on rebasing to Ubuntu. ;)   Their hacked up Debian cannot be a joy to maintain.
[16:29] <mjg59`> agoliveira: Yeah, on a train right now
[16:29] <mjg59`> THough just arriving
[16:29] <mjg59`> I have just over a week to get this finished, then I'm taking a holiday
[17:11] <lool> InSearchOf: So what would you be providing for an ARM port?  I guess the basic things are buildd hardware, not sure whether these need to be hosted and maintained by Canonical staff (could be a requirement), porting and bootstrapping work (bootstrapping the toolchain, updating dpkg, kernel configs etc., goind through build-dep loops etv/)
[17:11] <lool> And then there's day to day buildd admin, and actual porting of the build failures I guess
[17:20] <InSearchOf> lool,  all builds current run under our own env.  we use ptxdist.. as our builder. 
[17:22] <InSearchOf> we have an x86 based live cd that contains all the binaries required to run a full successful build... from building to initial cross compiler...
[17:23] <InSearchOf> from there you can build the image you desire containing all selected apps you want in the build
[17:25] <InSearchOf> I also have sashz (another dev form the pdaxrom team) in the room if you have any questions he is here to respond
[17:31] <lool> InSearchOf: ptxdist is another story; of course you can package ptxdist for Ubuntu and run it under Ubuntu if you like, but the current UME builds are not using this particular build system / rootstrap generation system
[17:31] <lool> InSearchOf: You seemed to be looking at whether Ubuntu would be having ARM support because you target arm; my natural followup question is: what would you be providing for this to happen
[17:33] <lool> ATM, my understanding is that Ubuntu buildds are bought by Canonical and run by Canonical; which is why I wonder what an ARM port would actually need to happen: hardware for sure, but some buildd admins, hosting etc.
[17:33] <lool> And if it's an ubuntu.com or canonical.com port, then this might imply that Canonical runs and owns the buildds
[17:47] <InSearchOf> lool, well when you say hardware do you mean for hosting? or for building?
[17:49] <InSearchOf> we can move our build system over to the standard build system used by Ubuntu, there will be a bit of a learning curve... but it can be done
[17:50] <InSearchOf> but we would initially be able to host our own developement server for the initial configuration (till we get the bugs worked out in the merger)
[17:52] <InSearchOf> and over time we would mesh into UME and our team would focus on getting the underlying OS (kernel/hotplug/apm/etc) functioning and the top lay be UME
[17:52] <InSearchOf> layer* being*
[17:54] <lool> InSearchOf: I mean hardware for building
[17:55] <lool> InSearchOf: Not sure you know about it, but Ubuntu has buildds for many arches already; all are run by Canonical people I think
[17:55]  * lool goes for dinner
[17:57] <InSearchOf> lool,  we can merge our data into your system, that is not a problem at all.