[00:29] <xivulon> https://code.launchpad.net/~ago/partman-auto-loop/lupin-support
[01:15] <Torgoton> Hey all. I managed to get Ubuntu to start to install on my ancient laptop. Gutsy kernel crashed every time, but Dapper started the process ok, if VERY slow.
[01:16] <Torgoton> Would that be an installer issue, or a kernel issue?
[01:19] <CarlFK> Torgoton: "start to install" = installing stuff to HD or just booting the installer ?
[01:19] <Torgoton> just booting the installer, CarlFK.
[01:21] <Torgoton> that is, starting the installer crashes with Gutsy Mini ISO/netboot files (linux and initrd.gz) but the Dapper version starts fine.
[01:21] <CarlFK> what about the 'check cd" ?  (which also boots a kernel
[01:21] <CarlFK> ah, that kinda boot
[01:22] <Torgoton> Yeah. This is a very old 33MHz 486 with 36MB RAM. No CD, no USB.
[01:22] <CarlFK> sounding like an installer
[01:22] <CarlFK> wow
[01:22] <Torgoton> yeah!
[01:22] <CarlFK> pretty sure 48 is the minimum
[01:23] <Torgoton> wow is an understatement. "Installing the base system" has been going for something like 5 hours.
[01:23] <Torgoton> There's a page that says 32MB is the minimum... looking for it....
[01:23] <CarlFK> im surprised the HD is big enough :)
[01:24] <Torgoton> heh. The drive that came with the machine is 170MB, but it now has a 5GB drive.
[01:24] <Torgoton> Here it is: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/SystemRequirements
[01:25] <Torgoton> The end has Absolute minimum requirements: 486, 32MB RAM, 300MB disk.
[01:25] <CarlFK> um, thats not what I see...
[01:25] <CarlFK> oh wait.. that end
[01:25] <Torgoton> yea.
[01:26] <CarlFK> Whats a "graphical installation" ?
[01:26] <Torgoton> I imagine that's one including the X Window System.
[01:26] <Torgoton> or maybe... graphical installation.
[01:27] <CarlFK> 300 isn't enough, cuz 350 gets used during the install
[01:27] <Torgoton> Yeah. That must be it. I'm doing a text install. Over a serial port, actually.
[01:27] <CarlFK> I have a feeling the 32m is out of date too
[01:27] <Torgoton> Would you like to see the debug dump from my attempt with Gutsy?
[01:28] <CarlFK> heh - I have a 32m stick I have been using to debug a cpu speed problem... just a sec
[01:28] <CarlFK> sure
[01:28] <Torgoton> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/48887/
[01:33] <cjwatson> kernel crash => kernel issue
[01:34] <cjwatson> you're still using the generic kernel though
[01:34] <CarlFK> will now that you put it that way :)
[01:34] <cjwatson> you sure you're using the 386 build I pointed you to? that should be built against the -386 kernel, not -generic
[01:34] <Torgoton> That is using the two files from the Gutsy Mini ISO.
[01:34] <cjwatson> there are multiple gutsy mini.iso builds
[01:35] <Torgoton> aha!
[01:35] <cjwatson> in /msg, I pointed you to http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/gutsy/main/installer-i386/current/images/netboot/386/mini.iso
[01:35] <cjwatson> the /386 in there is significant - you may have missed it
[01:35] <Torgoton> yes you did. I thought I tried that one as well, but will try again to be triply sure. <sigh> Time to stop the current install... five hours into it. :)
[01:36] <cjwatson> you're definitely using something built with the -generic kernel - either netboot/386/mini.iso is misbuilt, or you picked the wrong one :)
[01:36] <cjwatson> (not saying the former ain't possible)
[01:37] <cjwatson> for the record, I think 36MB RAM should work fine in gutsy, though you may get kicked into lowmem mode
[01:37] <cjwatson> should actually be rather faster than dapper, at least the installer side of things
[01:37] <cjwatson> we did some serious memory work in d-i over the summer, which shaved off 16MB+
[01:37] <CarlFK> Torgoton: what media are you booting from?
[01:38] <Torgoton> booting from hard drive, using Lilo to load the image. Woody is installed on the machine.
[01:38] <CarlFK> neat :)
[01:39] <Torgoton> thanks.
[01:39] <Torgoton> ok it's going to take a few minutes to set up.
[01:39] <CarlFK> you might want to try kexec
[01:40] <CarlFK> wget linux/initrd.gz, use kexec to boot them
[01:40] <cjwatson> kexec from a woody kernel?
[01:40] <cjwatson> probably won't work so well
[01:40] <CarlFK> why would it matter?
[01:41] <Torgoton> I've never heard of kexec before.
[01:41] <CarlFK> assuming it works at all..
[01:42] <Torgoton> holy crap! X started!
[01:42] <Torgoton> it never worked before, and it's not pretty. 320x200x1.
[01:43] <cjwatson> CarlFK: the kexec syscalls didn't exist in the woody kernel
[01:43] <cjwatson> kexec is a relatively recent thing
[01:43] <CarlFK> http://dpaste.com/28713/
[01:43] <cjwatson> as regards disk space, a debootstrap of gutsy takes up 210MB or so
[01:43] <CarlFK> ah, so much for that idea
[01:44] <cjwatson> the standard task is another 51MB
[01:45] <Torgoton> getting the *386* mini iso...
[01:46] <cjwatson> kexec was merged into Linux in 2.6.13
[01:46] <cjwatson> woody had, er ...
[01:46] <Torgoton> 2.2.20
[01:47] <cjwatson> or 2.4.18
[01:47] <cjwatson> but either way, certainly no dice
[01:48] <Torgoton> so should I use lilo or try kexec?
[01:48] <cjwatson> don't bother with kexec, it won't work
[01:48] <Torgoton> ok. booting...
[01:50] <Torgoton> crash
[01:51] <Torgoton> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/49098/
[01:51] <cjwatson> ok, it's at least the right kernel this time
[01:52] <Torgoton> baby steps...
[01:52] <cjwatson> it's having trouble trying to set up the right MMU bits for your machine
[01:52] <cjwatson> alternative_instructions is pretty fundamental
[01:52] <Torgoton> The CPU is a 486SL, if it matters.
[01:52] <Torgoton> I think... :)
[01:53] <cjwatson> this is way out of my field, and squarely in the kernel team's turf
[01:53] <Torgoton> Yep, 33MHz 486SL
[01:53] <Torgoton> Hm. Would it still be an Ubuntu issue?
[01:53] <cjwatson> could be, since it seems to be in the paravirt_ops stuff
[01:54] <cjwatson> which IIRC is something we took as an external patch, though I may misremember and it could be it's mainline now
[01:54] <cjwatson> subject to timezone and holiday vagaries, #ubuntu-kernel should be able to help more
[01:54] <cjwatson> and speaking of timezones, I have to go to bed now
[01:54] <cjwatson> good luck :)
[01:55] <Torgoton> Thanks so much, cj and carl.
[01:57] <CarlFK> qemu with 32m says it isn't enough
[02:00] <CarlFK> 38 is ok, but low mem mode
[06:57] <banyao> hello
[06:58] <banyao> I am new
[06:58] <banyao>   8-)
[11:04] <xivulon> cjwatson, I have added a banch to partman-auto-loop, I hope that simplifies handling of a couple of patches
[11:06] <xivulon> I also need to patch partman/commit.d/*format_* since in case of loopfiles they format the containing device as opposed of the loopfile
[11:07] <xivulon> that though seems scattered around
[11:08] <cjwatson> yeah
[11:09] <cjwatson> thanks for the branch
[11:10] <xivulon> what is a good place to submit such patch(es)?
[11:11] <xivulon> commit.d/50format_ext3 for instance
[11:12] <xivulon> in partman_auto_loop I still have not figured out a good way to skip disk-free-space checks, it's left as TBD
[11:13] <cjwatson> branches intended to be merged should usually have an associated bug that refers to the branch
[11:14] <xivulon> Is that "propose for merging"?
[11:16] <xivulon> and/or  link to bug report?
[11:16] <xivulon> I'll use both
[11:17] <xivulon> done
[11:25] <xivulon> cjwatson where should I add a branch for patches against update_grub and /lib/partman/commit.d/50format_*
[11:26]  * xivulon likes LP
[11:27] <cjwatson> update-grub is in the grub package
[11:27] <cjwatson> it is not in bzr so you cannot add a branch
[11:27] <cjwatson> use diff -u and attach the output
[11:28] <cjwatson> there is no one branch you can use for commit.d/50format_*
[11:28] <cjwatson> several different packages are involved
[11:28] <xivulon> I have diff at the moment plus patched file to be diffed (forgot to do diff -u yesterday)
[11:28] <cjwatson> you don't really need to show patches for all of them though, they're all the same and I can just duplicate it across
[11:28] <xivulon> what's a good place to submit such patches?
[11:29] <cjwatson> pick one of the packages
[11:29] <xivulon> ok
[11:32] <xivulon> I can add a branch in https://code.launchpad.net/partman-ext3/
[11:43] <xivulon> bug 177868
[11:43] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 177868 in partman-ext3 "When loopfiles are used mkfs has to target the file and not the containing device" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/177868
[12:07] <xivulon> cjwatson can you please remind evand to follow up with https://bugs.launchpad.net/wubi/+bugs?field.tag=wubi ?
[12:10] <cjwatson> no, because he's on holiday until the new year
[12:10] <xivulon> aha I tried to contact him yesterday night
[12:10] <xivulon> np
[12:10] <xivulon> ps yesterday I had this error in grub-installer, did not have time to dig further, does the syslog ring any bell?
[12:11] <xivulon> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/49146/
[12:13] <cjwatson> no, sorry, there doesn't seem to be a lot to go on there
[12:14] <xivulon> np, I'll do new runs in more verbose mode, that happened late yesterday and had a hard time keeping the eyelids up
[12:15] <xivulon> have to go now, have a nice holiday everyone!
[14:24] <CarlFK> how can I pass this as a kernel parameter? tasksel tasksel/first multiselect ubuntu-standard, ubuntu-desktop
[14:25] <cjwatson> I'm not convinced you can
[14:25] <CarlFK> is this worth trying: tasksel/first=ubuntu-standard,ubuntu-desktop
[14:25] <cjwatson> not without bug 174557 being fixed
[14:25] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 174557 in tasksel "tasksel/first preseed syntax is inconvenient" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/174557
[14:25] <cjwatson> no, that won't work unfortunately
[14:26] <cjwatson> can't you use a preseed file?
[14:26] <CarlFK> yes, but I was trying to only have 1 file
[14:26] <cjwatson> (it would have to be tasksel:tasksel/first=blah anyway, but still won't work due to tasksel splitting the value on ", "
[14:26] <cjwatson> )
[15:17] <CarlFK> i think this worked: tasksel:tasksel/first="ubuntu-standard, ubuntu-desktop"
[15:17] <CarlFK> Dec 21 14:33:26 frontend: --> SET tasksel/first ubuntu-standard, ubuntu-desktop
[15:54] <CIA-22> netcfg: cjwatson * r618 ubuntu/ (base-installer debian/changelog netcfg-common.c):
[15:54] <CIA-22> netcfg: * Add an /etc/network/interfaces stanza for lo even if the netcfg menu
[15:54] <CIA-22> netcfg:  item wasn't run (LP: #9532).
[15:56] <CIA-22> netcfg: cjwatson * r619 ubuntu/debian/changelog: releasing version 1.40ubuntu3