[00:03] <Riddell> CheGuevara: milk with tea or coffee is an English thing
[00:03] <Riddell> not done where I come from
[00:03] <Riddell> I hear they put ice in their whisky too
[00:03] <CheGuevara> nah milk with coffee is everywhere
[00:03] <Riddell> goodness no, defeats the point to dilute the taste
[00:04] <Riddell> although in the Canary islands they use condensed milk which is quite nice
[00:04] <CheGuevara> coffee and cream may be
[00:04] <Riddell> talking of English curiosities..
[00:04] <CheGuevara> i wouldn't know i hate coffee in any form
[00:04] <CheGuevara> heh
[02:30] <Hobbsee> firefox had a qt port
[02:30] <Hobbsee> it was just unfinished
[02:30] <CheGuevara> hmm really?
[02:30] <CheGuevara> when was this
[02:31] <Hobbsee> ages ago
[02:31] <Hobbsee> firefox 1.x
[02:31] <CheGuevara> ah
[02:32] <CheGuevara> http://ubuntuforums.org/archive/index.php/t-627979.html
[02:33] <CheGuevara> looks like trolltech started working in it, but stoped
[02:41] <jas01>  
[02:47] <jas01> lol i was cleaning my keyboard
[02:48] <CheGuevara> :P
[03:45] <DaSkreech> Hobbsee: !
[03:45] <DaSkreech> Jucato: !
[03:46] <DaSkreech> ni*!
[03:46] <Hobbsee> heya!
[03:47] <DaSkreech> How are you?
[03:47] <Hobbsee> good :)
[03:47] <CheGuevara> hey DaSkreech
[03:48] <DaSkreech> great!
[03:48] <DaSkreech> hi CheGuevara
[03:51] <rouzic> Hi all! :-*
[03:52] <DaSkreech> :-*
[03:52] <DaSkreech> Hobbsee: makes no sense to pester Ubuntu-devel about LTS does it ?
[03:53] <Hobbsee> DaSkreech: no
[03:54]  * DaSkreech waits to pounce sabdfl
[04:01] <DaSkreech> Hobbsee: how is Alpha 2 looking?
[04:01] <CheGuevara> no point of looking at it, until kde 4 is there :P
[04:01] <Hobbsee> DaSkreech: of?
[04:01] <Hobbsee> DaSkreech: oh, hardy?
[04:01] <Hobbsee> works reasonably well
[04:02] <Hobbsee> exa on intel drivers is still slow
[04:02] <DaSkreech> well Hobbsee  is on Gnome a lot these days
[04:02] <DaSkreech> so I was asking impressions of that
[04:02] <CheGuevara> thats because the new drm is not gonna enter official kernel tree any time soon
[04:02] <CheGuevara> the new memory manager branch that is
[04:03] <DaSkreech> IBM has TPM in linux now?
[04:09] <CheGuevara> no TTM until .25
[04:09] <CheGuevara> which means not until ubuntu 8.10
[04:09] <CheGuevara> *sigh*
[05:36] <santiago-ve> what an injustice... here... a cinema line says that they will show AVP-r on the 28th... and the other one (my favorite) say that they wont... until next year >.<
[05:59] <ardchoille> When I type "about:konqueror" into konqueror, a nice webpage comes up. Where is that page located? I'd like to use it as a template for a bookmarks page on my box.
[06:00] <Jucato>  /usr/share/apps/konqueror/about
[06:01] <ardchoille> Jucato: Ah, I was looking in the wrong place.
[06:01] <ardchoille> Jucato: ty
[06:01] <Jucato> it seems to also make use of stylesheets that aren't located in that directory
[06:01] <Jucato> generic KDE stylesheets (like those used in the KDE Handbooks/Help pages)
[06:02] <ardchoille> That's too bad, I was hoping to use that
[06:02] <Jucato> you can. just have to figure out where to get them and how to piece them all together ;P
[06:02] <ardchoille> Will do :)
[06:07] <Jucato> wb Hobbsee
[06:08] <Hobbsee> ty
[06:09] <santiago-ve> Guys im soffy for the offtopic... do you know any took for data recovery? just deleted an important text file on my pc
[06:09] <santiago-ve> >.<
[06:10] <Hobbsee> i'ts not ni the recycle bin, etc?
[06:10] <santiago-ve> nope
[06:10] <Hobbsee> darn
[06:11] <santiago-ve> i usually delete with shift + delete...
[06:11] <santiago-ve> but accidentally selected another file... (which was the one that i wasnt supposed to delete)
[06:11] <Hobbsee> oh dear
[06:12] <teKnofreak> santiago-ve, from now, have important files under version control ;)
[06:13] <DaSkreech> santiago-ve: Which Filesystem?
[06:13] <santiago-ve> ext3
[06:14] <DaSkreech> no
[06:14] <DaSkreech> can't get it back
[06:14] <santiago-ve> ...
[06:14] <santiago-ve> wieeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee means i have to start over...
[06:15] <DaSkreech> uSe Version Control :)
[06:16] <santiago-ve> this might sound funny
[06:16] <santiago-ve> but i didnt saw the "need" for using version control for this stuff... until now..
[06:16] <santiago-ve> (its just a doc plain text file)
[06:17] <teKnofreak> IIRC, version control started with plain text files ;)
[06:19] <santiago-ve> oh well... just 305 functions to document
[06:20] <santiago-ve> i still cant get why some PHP programmers (Specially in Venezuela) know anything about Documentation techs~
[06:29] <uga> santiago-ve: DaSkreech: it _is_ possible to recover ext3 fs deleted files
[06:29] <DaSkreech> Teach me o great one
[06:29] <uga> lol
[06:30] <uga> there's both tutorials based on fs-recovery on the net and even commercial tools to do so
[06:30] <santiago-ve> ye comercial tools... but which one of it works
[06:30] <uga> some that attempt recovering whole trees on the disk
[06:30] <santiago-ve> :p
[06:30] <santiago-ve> tested 2 before coming here
[06:30] <santiago-ve> xD
[06:30] <uga> I haven't used commercial ones, but recovered reiser-fs files using the first method
[06:31] <uga> santiago-ve: ah
[06:32] <uga> santiago-ve: http://www.cyberciti.biz/tips/repairing-reiserfs-file-system-with-reiserfsck.html
[06:33] <uga> I recovered the reiserfs files using that method
[06:33] <uga> just do as if you were recovering a broken partition
[06:33] <uga> and you recover lots of lost crap
[06:33] <santiago-ve> lol
[06:33] <santiago-ve> im not that desesperated xD
[06:34] <uga> well, it worked. I recovered the whole of my /home =)
[06:34] <santiago-ve> im already going again with the work
[06:34] <santiago-ve> :O
[06:34] <santiago-ve> anyways (puts that on his delicious)
[06:37]  * santiago-ve wants to sleep
[06:37] <santiago-ve> :(
[07:10] <santiago-ve> bwahahha almost done
[07:10] <santiago-ve> >:D
[07:14] <ardchoille> I wonder if krusader is safe enough to make as the default file manager
[07:15] <ardchoille> s/make/set/
[07:20] <Jucato> safe enough?
[07:20] <Jucato> and whose default file manager? yours or Kubuntu's?
[07:20] <ardchoille> Well, it's a file manager, but I don't know the software well enough to say it's safe to use as the default.
[07:20] <ardchoille> Mine in kubuntu
[07:21] <ardchoille> I've never had a problem in kubuntu so I don't wanna go doing something that will end that trend
[07:21] <Jucato> it's safe as in stable. it's older and more polished than d3lphin (note d3lphin)
[07:22] <ardchoille> Yeah
[07:22] <Jucato> but it sort of does require that you know how to use a twin-panel file manager or at least willing to learn how to use one
[07:22] <ardchoille> Oh, I love krusader, been using it a while
[07:23] <Jucato> hm.. ok... I don't understand your question then :)
[07:23] <ardchoille> Safe, as in safe to set as the default on file associations (inade/directory)
[07:23] <ardchoille> *inode
[07:23]  * Jucato doesn't see why not.
[07:24]  * Jucato finds "but I don't know the software well enough to say it's safe to use as the default." and "Oh, I love krusader, been using it a while" a bit conflicting :)
[07:24] <ardchoille> I'll switch it then
[07:24] <ardchoille> I don't know what all is required to be "default file manager" by the system.
[07:26] <santiago-ve> hmmm Jucato so D3lphin isnt a "mispelled" name?
[07:26] <santiago-ve> or it is?
[07:27] <ardchoille> Jucato: When I set krusader as the default fm in File Associations, and then click on System > Home Folder, krusader doesn't launch. <-- that's what I was talking about.
[07:27] <ardchoille> santiago-ve: dolphin is a symlink to d3lphin
[07:27] <ardchoille> santiago-ve: file /usr/bin/dolphin
[07:29] <Jucato> !d3lphin | santiago-ve
[07:29] <ubotu> santiago-ve: Dolphin, or more properly D3lphin, is the new default file manager for Kubuntu 7.10 Gutsy Gibbon. If you would like to make Konqueror your default file manager again, go to Konqueror - Settings menu - Configure Konqueror - File Associations and change the association for inode/directory and inode/system_directory to Konqueror at the top rather than Dolphin.
[07:29] <Jucato> it isn't misspelled ;)
[07:29] <santiago-ve> ew
[07:29] <santiago-ve> xD
[07:30] <Jucato> dolphin and d3lphin are 2 different things
[07:30] <santiago-ve> good thing im still with feisty :p
[07:30] <santiago-ve> Jucato, enlighten me
[07:30] <santiago-ve> :d
[07:30] <ardchoille> d3lpjin is an ld fork of dolphin and no longer developed
[07:30] <ardchoille> the dolphin in kde4 is much beter than d3lphin
[07:30] <santiago-ve> just dont tellme dolphin is MDM (Mysql desktop manager)
[07:31] <Jucato> santiago-ve: http://enzosworld.gmxhome.de/download.html
[07:31] <Jucato> see the note there
[07:32] <santiago-ve> seen read and understood
[07:32] <santiago-ve> :d
[07:32] <santiago-ve> ty for the info
[07:34] <santiago-ve> well
[07:34] <santiago-ve> have fun guys
[07:34] <santiago-ve> im off to slee
[07:34] <santiago-ve> sleep
[09:23] <apachelogger> good morning my currently most favorite dev team :P
[09:25] <teKnofreak> :p
[11:00] <Che> morning
[11:01] <jpatrick> moin
[11:19] <Che> alsamixer: function snd_ctl_open failed for default: No such device
[11:19] <Che> *sigh*
[11:23] <Che> brb
[11:43] <apachelogger_> bah
[11:43] <apachelogger_> pokerth 0.6 has been released -.-
[11:43]  * apachelogger_ now has to start all over again
[12:37] <jpatrick> Vorian: I see you've applied for kubuntu member thingy, prehaps you should add yourself to the meeting page?
[12:56] <ardchoille> I have an idea for the next Kubuntu Tutorials Day
[12:57] <ardchoille> "How to make a proper patch"
[12:57] <ardchoille> I"ll be honest, I don't even know what exactly a patch is.
[12:58] <jpatrick> diff -Nurp origfile.diff file.diff
[12:58] <ardchoille> I assume it's a small piece of code that the devs can integrate into an app.
[12:58] <ardchoille> Well, that was a short class :)
[12:59] <jpatrick> ardchoille: I'm going to have to give lines..
[13:09] <CheGuevara> better class would be applying patches in deb packages
[13:12] <ardchoille> CheGuevara: I agree
[13:12] <ardchoille> "How to make a patch and then apply it"
[13:14] <CheGuevara> yep
[13:39] <jpatrick> CheGuevara ardchoille: same thing
[13:40] <jpatrick> just do debian/rules apply-patches
[13:42] <CheGuevara> could use cdbs's system
[13:43] <jpatrick> it does
[13:43] <ardchoille> jpatrick: Ah, ok
[13:43] <Jucato> the arcane art of packaging...
[13:44] <Jucato> 2 years into Kubuntu (about 1 or more into trying development) and I still haven't gotten even the basics right :D
[13:44] <jpatrick> the patch just needs to be in debian/patches/
[13:44] <jpatrick> Jucato: http://people.ubuntuwire.com/~jpatrick/tutorials/kubuntu-tutorials-day-packaging.pdf
[13:44] <Jucato> jpatrick: downloaded it laredy :P
[13:44] <Jucato> already*
[13:45] <jpatrick> ah, ok
[13:45] <ardchoille> That ,ust have been the fastest wget I've ever done
[13:46] <Jucato> jpatrick: it's just that I don't really do packaging as my main activity (I'm sort of a bit more inclined towards coding, so manually applying patches, not relying on package management systems, etc.)
[13:47] <Jucato> so everytime I try to fix or add something in Kubuntu (that's really the only reason why I try to learn packaging) i have to relearn everything :)
[13:47] <Jucato> because it only happens every 6 months :P
[13:47] <CheGuevara> lol
[13:48] <jpatrick> change is the only constant
[13:48] <ardchoille> jpatrick: This tutorial is very well done. I had problems following the irc logs due to too much activity in the channel. This pdf is awesome :)
[13:48] <jpatrick> ardchoille: you're welcome
[13:49] <Jucato> jpatrick: what's worse is that I keep on losing the notes/reminders to myself that I've made about packaging everytime :/
[13:50] <ardchoille> Jucato: sudo apt-get install basket  :)
[13:50] <jpatrick> Jucato: knotes > *
[13:50] <Jucato> basket isn't really helpful if you've rm'ed your /home :)
[13:50] <jpatrick> well, that isn't helping in any case
[13:50] <Jucato> (the first time... the 2nd time I just rm'ed the file accidentally :P)
[13:50] <ardchoille> Jucato: ouch!
[13:51] <Jucato> ardchoille: you can say that again (but please don't)
[13:53] <ardchoille> Jucato: There are a couple of realy neat apps, cron and tar, that you can use to tar up $HOME and put on a 2nd drive
[13:53]  * ardchoille ducks
[13:53]  * Jucato reaches for the gShotgun :)
[13:53] <jpatrick> Jucato: use zsh, it warns you if you're about to rm something important
[13:54] <Jucato> the most cruel death/torture you can inflict on someone... kill/hurt them with a gnome/gtk tool/weapon :)
[13:54] <ardchoille> hehe
[13:54] <Jucato> jpatrick: will it work even in a chroot? (which is how I accidentally rm'ed my home)
[13:55] <jpatrick> Jucato: if you use it as shell, yeah
[13:55] <CheGuevara> why can't it be kShotgun :P
[13:55] <Jucato> CheGuevara: [21:54] <Jucato> the most cruel death/torture you can inflict on someone... kill/hurt them with a gnome/gtk tool/weapon :)
[13:55] <CheGuevara> ah
[13:55] <CheGuevara> missed that lol
[13:55] <Jucato> :D
[13:55] <Jucato> I guessed so :)
[13:56] <CheGuevara> +1 then lol
[13:57] <Jucato> +1 gnome-shotgun of pain... what a deadly weapon to inflict cruel and unusual punishment :)
[13:58] <CheGuevara> lol
[16:26] <kenkku> where am I supposed to put the application icon when packaging?
[16:29] <jpatrick> kenkku: does the programs build system not do that itself?
[16:29] <kenkku> jpatrick: nope
[16:29] <jpatrick> what package?
[16:30] <kenkku> jpatrick: the program doesn't actually even install itself
[16:30] <kenkku> jpatrick: nothing you would know, it's just a program I'm packaging for a small audience
[16:31] <jpatrick> aha, and it's not make, make install stuff?
[16:31] <kenkku> only make to compile one binary
[16:31] <kenkku> no make install
[16:31] <kenkku> it would be possible to make one, though
[16:33] <jpatrick> kenkku: icons should go to /usr/share/icons/hicolor/
[16:33] <kenkku> jpatrick: thanks. I'll have to ask the developer about this, he's doing it mainly for mac, but it's qt so it works on linux too
[16:34] <kenkku> so I guess he doesn't really know how the practices go on linux. it's such a small program, too, so it's not very important yet
[16:45] <kenkku> this might be a weird question but.. why does debuild run make clean? :S
[16:45] <jpatrick> you using cdbs?
[16:46] <kenkku> nope
[16:46] <kenkku> debhelper
[16:46] <jpatrick> is "make clean" mentioned in debian/rules?
[16:47] <kenkku> I mean it runs the clean in debian/rules
[16:47] <kenkku> which includes make clean
[16:47] <jpatrick> kenkku: never make clean from rules, if you do not wish to run it
[16:48] <kenkku> hmm, so it is supposed to run at that point?
[16:48] <jpatrick> it is to make sure the package is free of binaries before upload
[16:48] <kenkku> ooh. I see.
[16:48] <kenkku> i got a bit distracted since it says "# Add here commands to clean up after the build process."
[16:48] <jpatrick> ah
[16:49] <jpatrick> you wouldn't happen to be reading my tutorial? :)
[16:49] <kenkku> I don't know, which one is it :P
[16:49] <jpatrick> nm then
[16:49] <kenkku> I'm reading the PackagingGuide in the wiki
[16:49] <jpatrick> aha
[16:49] <Jucato> jpatrick: would you be so kind as to add the link to your tutorial in the channel topic? :)
[16:49] <jpatrick> lo effie_jayx
[16:49] <kenkku> jpatrick: do you have a better tutorial then? ;)
[16:50] <jpatrick> Jucato: which channel? it's not that good ;)
[16:50] <Jucato> here :)
[16:50] <Jucato> it's good enough to have been the material for the tutorials day :)
[16:50]  * jpatrick dunno
[16:51] <Jucato> pfft :P
[16:52] <jpatrick> kenkku: http://people.ubuntuwire.com/~jpatrick/tutorials/
[16:52] <kenkku> that looks better
[16:53] <jpatrick> I could be a writer one day :o)
[16:54] <effie_jayx> jpatrick: lo!!?
[16:54] <jpatrick> effie_jayx: hello -> 'lo -> lo
[17:00] <kenkku> "warning: Version number suggests Ubuntu changes, but Maintainer: does not have Ubuntu address"
[17:00] <kenkku> how should I name the package? I'm only probably distributing it through PPA
[17:01] <jpatrick> you can ignore that if you want
[17:02] <kenkku> ok, I thought that would be the case
[17:02] <CheGuevara> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/FAQ#head-8c0f73c5468e3df4abfafb4cf121ed1d226e5a92
[17:03] <jpatrick> CheGuevara: yeah, but if it's personal, and not for Ubuntu: ignore
[17:03] <CheGuevara> yeah i am just saying for educational puposes :P
[17:03] <jpatrick> education? what's that o.O
[17:03] <jpatrick> ;)
[17:03] <CheGuevara> lol
[17:14] <kenkku> argh.
[17:14] <kenkku> well, pbuilder does everything nicely and then says "dpkg-deb: building package `qutescoop' in `../qutescoop_0.1.8-0ubuntu1~ppa1_i386.deb'." and does some stuff.. but the package is nowhere to be found
[17:15] <jpatrick> is it in the directory above?
[17:15] <kenkku> well, I wouldn't be saying this if it wasn't there :)
[17:15] <stdin> kenkku: pbuilder puts them in /var/cache/pbuilder/result
[17:16] <kenkku> weird, I tried packaging a few times before and it did appear where I though it would be
[17:16] <ScottK2> Or in ~/pbuilder if you're using the pbuilder script in ubunt-dev-tools
[17:17] <kenkku> well, I found the package now
[17:17] <ScottK2> Where?
[17:17] <jpatrick> no you can 'lintian' it for errors or just install :)
[17:17] <kenkku> in /var/cache/pbuilder/result
[17:18] <kenkku> hmm or is it.. the time is too old, so it's not the one
[17:19] <kenkku> it appeared in the directory below the sources (where the original tarball is) before, but not now
[17:25] <jpatrick> ok, looks like we lost Riddell
[17:26] <Jucato> noooooooo
[17:26] <kenkku> ok, NOW I got the deb
[17:26]  * Jucato runs around like crazy, like a chicken with its head cut off
[17:26] <jpatrick> kenkku: yaya
[17:27] <kenkku> it was indeed in the /var/cache/pbuilder/result dir
[17:31] <nosrednaekim> he's over in #kubuntu still
[17:31] <jpatrick> lol
[17:33] <jpatrick> invite: "You need to be a channel operator to do that"
[17:33] <Jucato> :D
[17:33] <Jucato> he'll notice... eventually... :)
[17:34] <jpatrick> !ops
[17:34] <ubotu> Help! Riddell, haggai, amu, imbrandon, Hobbsee or Mez
[17:34] <imbrandon> ...
[17:34] <imbrandon> jpatrick: ?
[17:35] <jpatrick> imbrandon: /invite Riddell ;)
[17:35] <Jucato> lol
[17:36] <imbrandon> done, he must not have autojoin on
[17:36] <imbrandon> why would i need to invite him ?
[17:36] <jpatrick> remind him
[17:36] <jpatrick> since he's everywhere else ;)
[17:37] <imbrandon> :)
[17:48]  * Tm_T hugs Jucato 
[17:48] <jpatrick> ?
[17:49] <Tm_T> jpatrick: yes?
[17:50] <jpatrick> nm
[17:50] <Tm_T> jpatrick: just joking :)
[17:50] <jpatrick> ah right
[17:50]  * Tm_T hufs jpatrick 
[17:50] <Tm_T> hugs even
[19:07] <kenkku> what is the best way to install the desktop file?
[19:07] <kenkku> *.desktop
[19:09] <jpatrick> kenkku: put it in /usr/share/applications/
[19:11] <kenkku> hmm, what's the preferred way to install files? :P
[19:11] <apachelogger> with a package :P
[19:11] <kenkku> dh_install?
[19:18] <jpatrick> kenkku: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/3023/
[19:18] <jpatrick> for example
[19:20] <jpatrick> erm, that's for cdbs
[19:31] <_StefanS_> Jucato: always online, eh ? :)
[19:43] <kenkku> hmm, another weird question, where in the source package should I put the .desktop file? is it ok if I put it in debian/?
[19:43] <mhb> good evening
[20:06] <kenkku> I just noticed that I'm an idiot.
[20:09] <manchicken> So I wonder how Swedish these Swedish Fish candies are.
[20:09] <manchicken> kenkku: Don't take it so hard.  It's a common ailment.  The trick is to just use really big words so that people don't ever notice.
[20:11] <jpatrick> _StefanS_: does kdmtheme work on hardy?
[20:12] <jpatrick> kenkku: don't worry, we're all learning :)
[20:12] <kenkku> yeah, I just stated that :) even though I'm CURRENTLY an idiot, my idiotness is decreasing - rapidly
[20:41] <mhb> what's up, docs?
[20:41] <jpatrick> I thought you didn't like docs
[20:42] <mhb> :o)
[20:42] <mhb> ooh, you remember! :o)
[20:42] <mhb> how nice of you.
[20:42] <jpatrick> hmm, we're still Riddell down
[20:42] <jpatrick> that's up :)
[20:43] <mhb> hmm, he's still sleeping off the Christmas&birthday celebration?
[20:43] <jpatrick> no idea
[20:48] <apachelogger> all this alcohol -.-
[20:48] <apachelogger> oh how awesome it could have been...
[20:51] <kenkku> hey, can you version a package as a date instead of the normal x.y.z?
[20:51] <kenkku> I have a data package that's periodically updated
[20:52] <jpatrick> kenkku: what version does it have now?
[20:53] <jpatrick> what revision control system does it use?
[20:54] <kenkku> jpatrick: well, basically svn. in the original form it's in a directory in the source archive, but I'd like to make it a separate package so that the application itself doesn't have to be updated every time the data is (which might be monthly)
[20:54] <kenkku> jpatrick: the data itself doesn't change *radically*, it's just something that recieves some corrections over time
[20:54] <kenkku> so it's kind of funny to use the conventional version system for it
[20:54] <jpatrick> kenkku: I recommend: 0.0+svn20071226 - as in svnYYYYMMDD
[20:55] <kenkku> jpatrick: is there any guide/guideline on these?
[20:57] <jpatrick> not that I know of
[20:58] <jpatrick> but with that^ in the next release users will easily upgrade
[20:58] <kenkku> yeah, that sounds like an ok solution
[20:58] <jpatrick> 0.0 -> 0.1, 1 etc
[20:59] <jpatrick> 20071231 is greater than 20071226
[20:59] <jpatrick> for example
[20:59] <jpatrick> new year: 20080102 > 20071216: true
[21:00] <kenkku> this is actually a fairly nice solution
[21:01] <crimsun> I recommend ~, actually
[21:01] <mhb> apachelogger: ya, too bad we were not invited :o(
[21:01] <kenkku> since it's possible (yet unlikely) that the data format changes over time in the core application, so maybe I'll use the core app version plus the date
[21:01] <crimsun> dpkg --compare-versions 0.0 gt 0.0~svn20071226 ;echo $?
[21:01] <crimsun> 0
[21:01] <crimsun> just in the very, very off chance that some upstream actually wants to release a "0.0"
[21:04] <kenkku> what does the ~ mean in the version, then?
[21:05] <jpatrick> not much, it's just a seperator
[21:05] <jpatrick> backports uses it
[21:05] <crimsun> it's a specific "lesser than" separator
[21:06] <jpatrick> aha
[21:43] <iRon> is there anyone who has installed hardy on laptop?
[21:44] <crimsun> yes.
[21:44] <iRon> dunno why, but my Alt key works like Enter, and Left key works like Alt
[21:44] <apachelogger> Oo
[21:45] <iRon> :)
[21:45] <iRon> i've installed hardy with aptidute safe-upgrade.. not from cd :)
[21:48] <iRon> installation from cd failed for me because of buggy `release candidate' linux kernel 2.6.24 :(
[21:51] <crimsun> 2.6.24-rc6-git2 and newer are better
[21:52] <iRon> crimsun: you've compiled it by yourself?
[21:53] <crimsun> Linux Box 2.6.24-rc6-git2 #1 SMP PREEMPT Mon Dec 24 07:49:37 EST 2007 i686 GNU/Linux
[21:53] <mhb> is anyone using kde4 here?
[21:54] <mhb> it seems to me that everything is insanely huge, especially the font sizes.
[21:54] <iRon> crimsun: vanilla linux? whithout ubuntu patches?
[21:54] <crimsun> iRon: correct.
[21:54] <crimsun> I'm attempting to git-bisect a resume-from-* bug
[21:55] <iRon> mhb: i'm on kde4 from daily svn build
[21:55] <mhb> iRon: is everything so huge as well?
[21:56] <iRon> mhb: no.. only taskbar fonts..
[22:02] <mhb> iRon: is the taskbar blinking when windows ask for attention?
[22:02] <mhb> iRon: such as new kopete message in a chat window or so
[22:03] <mhb> nixternal: chixternal my friend, how are the KDE4 builds?
[22:03] <mhb> nixternal: I wonder whether they'll be some new stuff soon.
[22:03] <mhb> there
[22:04] <nixternal> just got back today...can't build them on the buildd's until the buildd's are fixed
[22:04] <nixternal> and they are just rebuilds of rc2
[22:05] <iRon> mhb: hm.. no.. everything else looks fine.. but i've yesterday build.
[22:06] <mhb> hmm.
[22:06] <mhb> I'd like to test something new, but I'm either too lazy to build it myself, or I'd like to see new Kubuntu packages.
[22:06] <mhb> :o)
[22:07] <iRon> :)
[22:07] <fdoving> kde4 from svn works nicely for me. it's nice to just svn up and do a recompile, it's faster than installing all those packages :)
[22:08] <mhb> the plasma widgets never worked well for me that way ... the files always ended up overwriting the older versions and it was a huge mess
[22:08] <fdoving> it is improving every day.
[22:09] <iRon> i've never used any plasma widgets on desktop..
[22:09] <mhb> somehow, OS X is making a much better impression when it comes to the amount of space on the desktop.
[22:09] <fdoving> I have the battery thing, and my kde3 desktop icons (4 .desktop files, launchers) got merged somehow.
[22:10] <mhb> just two rxvt windows can fill it all
[22:13] <mhb> nixternal: wow, someone's in for a wave of rebuttals.
[22:14] <fdoving> the new kmahjongg is amazing.
[22:14] <iRon> mhb: when i first installed kde4 -- i was thought i'm working on OS X.. don't know why :)
[22:15] <crimsun> I like Boost for some things.
[22:15] <crimsun> I like EA's STL for some things.
[22:15] <crimsun> Mostly I like pie.
[22:15] <mhb> iRon: unfortunately KDE4 keeps reminding me it's not OS X.
[22:16] <iRon> mhb: try etoile (etoile-project.org) :)
[22:16] <mhb> iRon: at least until we drop the kickoff menu, finally get rid of the tray metaphor etc :o)
[22:17] <fdoving> mhb: you can use the older meny style. i do.
[22:17] <mhb> fdoving: I'm fine with krunner or what's it called.
[22:18] <mhb> kickoff is really silly; for some reason, it doesn't know I have a "rxvt" installed and it insists I look up "rxvt" via Google when I write it into the search bar.
[22:18] <fdoving> you need the 'menu' package :)
[22:19] <nixternal> mhb: wave of rebuttals?
[22:19] <mhb> nixternal: yes, you're one of the unlucky guys that like boost and say it in public :o)
[22:21] <nixternal> boost is groovy...show me a date function/class that can do what I asked in a) less lines or equal lines of code, and b) faster
[22:22] <nixternal> plus, some KDE 4 apps now use boost, so no better time than now to learn it
[22:23] <iRon> i heard that some boost classes 'll be in next с++ standard library
[22:23] <nixternal> yup
[22:23] <nixternal> I think Google announced it in a C++ tech talk
[22:23] <nixternal> I heard some might make its way into Python 3000 or whatever the hell they are calling it
[22:24] <fdoving> stdlib needs some love, really.
[22:25] <crimsun> it does.
[22:25] <crimsun> it's very nice, but...
[22:25] <mhb> C++ should eat my shorts. Get me a Python compiler!
[22:25] <iRon> i like objective-с :)
[22:25] <crimsun> well, I think I said above with EA's STL.
[22:26] <iRon> objective-c + cocoa :)
[22:26] <mhb> ( give me a language as beautiful as Python that can be both interpreted and compiled and I'll be happy.)
[22:27] <fdoving> i like one-letter languages only.
[22:27] <fdoving> :þ
[22:27] <iRon> fdoving: `c' ??
[22:28] <nixternal> hahahaha
[22:28] <fdoving> yeah, i don't count ++ as letters :)
[22:28] <nixternal> fdoving likes A, B, C, D, and J
[22:28] <fdoving> yeah, rename python to P and i'll think about it :)
[22:28] <nixternal> I have been going through these Project Euler problems, and once you solve them, you can go into the forums for the ones you solved and see other people's code....some languanges look nuts
[22:28] <nixternal> ie. Haskell
[22:28] <nixternal> x86 of course
[22:29] <manchicken> How is a package on us.archive.ubuntu.com not trusted?
[22:29] <mhb> if P were both compiled and interpreted, I'm game.
[22:29] <nixternal> like J
[22:30] <mayeco> I'm trying to build trunk/extragear/multimedia
[22:30] <mayeco> but I get this error
[22:30] <mayeco> CMake Error: kcddb was not found. Need to install from kdemultimedia
[22:30] <nixternal> mayeco: I have no clue, unless they upgraded the key maybe, but I find that one hard to believe
[22:30] <mhb> nixternal: hmm, J? of course, interpreter must not eat 2 GB
[22:30] <mhb> nixternal: that leaves J out.
[22:30] <nixternal> ya it does
[22:30] <mhb> nixternal: and what is that compiled code?
[22:30] <mhb> nixternal: you mean what gcj does?
[22:30] <fdoving> mayeco: you need to compile trunk/KDE/kdemultimedia/libkcddb first i guess.
[22:30] <nixternal> I have no clue, I just seen the source of it
[22:31]  * mhb has never tested it ... are you able to compile the byte-codey hell into true binaries, not just some parodies with the interpreter packed in?
[22:31] <nixternal> extragear/multimedia was broken the other day, and has been broken for a bit, so you will probably have to cmakekde the apps separately
[22:31] <mayeco> let me try fdoving
[22:31] <fdoving> k3b ftbfs here.
[22:32] <fdoving> amarok builds.. those are the two items i've checked out from multimedia.
[22:32] <nixternal> g++ -O0 -g3 -Wall -c -fmessage-length=0 -MMD -MP -MF"src/main.d" -MT"src/main.d" -o"src/main.o" "../src/main.cpp"
[22:32] <nixternal> that's all I need
[22:32] <nixternal> there are still a few problems I need to work out that are slow on getting the answer(s)
[22:33] <nixternal> though about 15 of the 22 I have completed this far, provide answers in about 1 second
[22:34] <nixternal> iRon must be a Mac fan
[22:34] <nixternal> isn't object-c and cocoa mac things?
[22:34] <nixternal> there is a guy in the lug who gives talks about them every now and then
[22:36] <fdoving> plasma is macish.
[22:37] <fdoving> the super-nice "present windows" effect, dashboard and all.
[22:37] <mayeco> thanks fdoving that was the problem
[22:37] <fdoving> mayeco: you're welcome.
[22:37] <mayeco> :D
[22:40]  * mhb looks forward to the new window decorations for KDE4.
[22:41] <fdoving> mhb: seen any mockups?
[22:42] <mhb> no
[22:42] <mhb> but Oxygen windeco is too big for me, I'd like to see something really minimal.