=== tritium_ is now known as tritium [00:46] python-glade2 has just got broken [00:46] i'm asked to do apt-get install -f, but it will remove almost everything [00:46] including ubuntu-desktop and so on [00:54] hit: use aptitude [00:54] see what it suggests [00:55] also my tab isnt working anymore in terminal [00:56] aptitude seemd work [00:57] but this tab-thing [00:57] works with folders, but that's all [01:07] there is no folders [01:17] ah what the hell [01:18] *compiling supertux* [01:50] anyone know why the terminal is now attempting to transliterate unicode characters when they are input? [03:29] yo, any idea when all these kde4 packages are going to be un-broken? [03:35] "when they're done" [04:19] anyone here use usenet? === tritium_ is now known as tritium [05:15] hi guys [05:15] ello [05:17] i use 8.04 now [05:17] it always shutdown [05:18] What do you mean? === Vorian_ is now known as vorian [05:22] Anyone notice some breakage in the terminal in Hardy, particularly with respect to unicode character input and output? [05:53] nope, no breakage here [05:53] well, dnno about input [05:53] but output seems fine [05:53] i think [05:53] same here [05:54] just seems that man pages do not appear right (lots of unicode ? markings of missing glyphs). On entering unicode char 2122, I get a transliterated (TM) instead of ™. [05:54] Same for the copyright, reg trademark, æ and œ symbols and ligatures. [05:55] well it is alpha 2 :} [05:55] hrmmm [05:55] using http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~mgk25/ucs/examples/UTF-8-demo.txt i get lots of boxen [05:56] Egads. Same here. I had not thought to try that file. [05:56] but i have no idea how it compares to gutsy [05:56] oh wait i have a gutsy box, hold on a sec [05:57] I am using the settings from my Gutsy box---unicode in gnome-terminal was working great for me there. [05:57] oh wait, the terminal is the same, duh [05:57] "man ls" has issues for me, too [05:58] seems similar in gutsy [05:58] I thought maybe something was up, but when I rebooted back to Gutsy it all works correctly, no transliterating and such [05:58] actually seems better in hardy [05:58] hrm... well seems different in hardy, anyway [05:58] I noticed the transliterating only because I use an international keyboard, and now résumé appears as "r?sum?" on the terminal [06:00] seems odd [06:00] i'm using konsole [06:01] seems like some glyphs were added, some were lost [06:01] Does Konsole/KDE let you enter arbitrary unicode characters with the keyboard? [06:05] probably, using SKIM or whatever, but i dunno how [06:06] arbitrary as in other language? [06:06] Alrighty. Well, I think I am going to file a bug---it is frustrating to be seemingly limited once again to a subset of American English characters. [06:07] As in GNOME, where you can press Left Control+Left Shift+u, then type the unicode code point followed by a space. e.g., C-S-u, then 2122 , gets ™ [06:07] You can do that with any valid Unicode character, and if there is a glyph in the font for it, it should show up. [06:07] mbt: learned something new... thanks [06:08] spr0k3t: NP. I have a page with more info on that, actually, and some common characters: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Fd0man/Information/GNOME-Unicode [06:10] I have a friend of mine who was looking for this just the other day. They couldn't find the | on a finish keyboard using the en_us layout. [06:11] ASCII pipe, solid bar, or split bar? (there are three distinct code points that I know of for them) [06:11] ASCII pipe [06:11] Should be Shift+\ [06:11] On an American layout. [06:12] the \ didn't exist on the finish keyboard since the enter key is the full L the the backspace isn't split [06:12] at least, using the en_us layout on the finish keyboard. seemed weird [06:13] Ahh. Not entirely sure then, lol. It is http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vertical_bar [06:13] Character 0x7c === m1ke is now known as m1ke_away === ajmorris is now known as ajmorris|AFCLI === ajmorris|AFCLI is now known as ajmorris === Dannilionz is now known as Dannilion === Tomcat_` is now known as Tomcat_ [12:35] hey all...I have added a forum thread about fixing the 100% fan problems on nvidia drivers that is in hardy at the moment === Hobbsee_ is now known as Hobbsee [13:21] does language packs break for everyone in alpha 2? === Infecto_ is now known as Infecto === bmk789_ is now known as bmk789 === nanonyme_ is now known as nanonyme === lakin_ is now known as lakin [17:37] Is updating broken atm? I'm getting "E: Internal Error, Could not perform immediate configuration (2) on libstdc++6" [17:37] you have to install it first -- [17:37] sudo apt-get install libstdc++6 [17:37] then you should be able to update [17:37] don't know why that worked, but that is what got it going for me. [17:37] so why is it forcing me to install it when im doing update + upgrade ... [17:37] i found that solution on the forums [17:38] ok [17:38] i don't know---i don't understand (yet) the internals of APT [17:38] i think its a mistake [17:38] well, yeah, it is a bug somewhere === macd_ is now known as macd [18:22] I read that kubuntu hardy won't be officially supported. Will it have kde 4? [18:22] kde 4 is a long, long away from being usable generally and stable [18:22] it will probably have it as an unsupported option [18:23] if I have ati and I want to use compiz, will I have to do it over xgl, or with AIGLX? [18:23] if you use the very latest ati driver, it supports aiglx, but it is kinda buggy [18:24] Do you know when the new and improved open driver will be released? what is the progress? [18:25] (I'm referring to ATI of course) [18:28] not sure [18:29] i know that there is supposed to be one, and personally, i cannot wait for it, but it will probably be at least another year or two [18:39] 7.11/7.12 are good,. [18:39] But Compiz is fuxxed [18:39] It checks for GLX_EXT_texture_from_pixmap and claims that the ATI driver doesn't have it. [18:39] However, if I do exactly what it does to check for it, it exists. [18:39] oh? [18:39] Yeah. [18:39] i was wondering about that [18:40] i had compiz working under gutsy, but it flat out told me "no" on hardy [18:40] The glxinfo output on my ATI system (Catalyst 7.11) says that GLX_EXT_texture_from_pixmap is present. [18:40] Yeah, same for me. [18:40] But, when compiz runs the check, it fails. [18:40] And then it fails with indirect rendering too. [18:40] I think it's a Compiz bug and not an ATI driver issue, because it worked on Gutsy. [18:40] * SeveredCross smells a regression, [18:41] well, someone who knows a thing about graphics and gl will have to look into that one... i can't. i am working on another (very old) annoyance atm [18:41] bojan@sirius:~$ glxinfo | grep -c GLX_EXT_texture_from_pixmap [18:41] 2 [18:41] Now, the problem is, Compiz looks for gt 2. [18:42] Theres a bug logged for that. [18:42] Yeah, I found it. [18:42] I've been subscribed for a while, but havent seen any activity recently on it [18:42] Has anyone figured out what the regression was from Gutsy to Hardy that broke that? [18:43] what is the bug # [18:43] I'm guessing new fglrx. [18:43] No, because it worked in Gutsy. [18:43] What bug number? [18:43] But there were new fglrx drivers in hardy... [18:43] Bug 173663 [18:43] Launchpad bug 173663 in linux-restricted-modules-2.6.22 "compiz will not launch with fglrx driver - falls back to metacity" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/173663 [18:43] Pici: I did it in Gutsy with the same fglrx driver that's in Hardy--catalyst 7.11 [18:44] SeveredCross: Pastebin glxinfo and the output when you run compiz [18:44] It jumped into Indirect Rendering mode because that grep count wasn't >2, it is exactly 2, but it worked. [18:44] Dude we don't check > 2 [18:45] oh, we do, someone changed that :P [18:45] But what that means is that while both the server and the client support it they're not talking to each other so it's not a supported extension [18:45] Which means: your driver is broken [18:45] http://pastebin.com/m6bef129e [18:46] Hmm. That's really odd, because it worked on Gutsy. [18:46] same here [18:46] Amaranth: Can you suggest and/or change that bug so that someone looks at it? [18:46] And are you sure that they don't check >2? [18:46] if [ $($GLXINFO 2>/dev/null | grep GLX_EXT_texture_from_pixmap -c) -gt 2 ] ; then [18:46] Line 155 [18:46] Er, 159. [18:46] /usr/bin/compiz [18:46] yes, i see, someone changed it :) [18:46] but it is a correct check [18:46] # [18:46] GLX extensions: [18:46] # [18:46] GLX_ARB_get_proc_address, GLX_ARB_multisample, GLX_EXT_import_context, [18:46] # [18:47] GLX_EXT_visual_info, GLX_EXT_visual_rating, GLX_OML_swap_method, [18:47] # [18:47] It wont work even if its changed. [18:47] GLX_SGIS_multisample, GLX_SGIX_fbconfig, GLX_SGIX_visual_select_group [18:47] err, that pasted wrong [18:47] I know it won't work if it's changed, I'm just pointing out the fact. [18:47] Yes. [18:47] Yes it did. [18:47] do you see GLX_EXT_texture_from_pixmap in there? that's where it needed to be [18:47] Which means...your driver is broken [18:47] Again, that doesn't answer the question of why it worked on Gutsy. [18:47] Because your driver worked with xserver 1.3 [18:47] hardy is xserver 1.4 [18:48] <_> [18:48] The indirect rendering stuff changed. [18:48] That would explain it. I didn't check that. [18:48] The ddx (driver) API/ABI changed [18:49] Not a compiz bug, that's all I know or care about :) [18:49] So just gotta wait for ATI to catch up on the xserver API/ABI. [18:50] SeveredCross: Try 7.12 [18:51] Has resolution issues, no good. [18:51] Drops me to 1280xsomething rather than my full 1440x900. [18:52] I'll wait for 7.13 [18:52] That's ATI for you [18:52] Fix one thing, break another [18:52] They're getting better though. ^_^ [18:52] nvidia is almost just as bad [18:52] so wait, the fix is new driver or roll back xserver, is that right? [18:52] You do not want to roll back the xserver [18:52] Yeah. [18:53] catalyst 7.12 might help [18:53] well, of course not lol i don't mess with modular X at all [18:54] too many interoperability issues are possible [18:55] meh, i will just wait. dreamy windows are not that important to me personally, they are just cool [18:55] "In addition, AMD will be open-sourcing part of their new proprietary OpenGL driver and will be in a state so that it can be patched into the existing R300+ Mesa driver." [18:55] that's cool [18:55] Thats neat [18:56] it will be very nice when ati drivers perform as good as or better than nvidia ones... this is the only ati system i have, and it has been one frustrating thing after another with that proprietary blob [18:57] I'm hoping nouveau gets 3d support soon [18:57] that's probably ~6 months away though [19:02] If the specs are freely available - my money would be on XiG having the best drivers (they have for years now) [19:02] XiG? [19:03] Is anyone in here particularly knowledgeable or familiar with the alternate (text-based) installer? [19:03] any idea if there is a nouveau like project publicly available for ati cards? [19:04] I thought Avivo was the ATI card equivalent? [19:04] Or at least a project named Avivo [19:04] Unrelated to the ATI video technology. [19:04] mbt: 'radeon' is the only comparable driver in that case, I think [19:04] i might have to try that one out, then... the only two that i have tried thus far are ati and fglrx [19:05] ati == radeon, as far as xorg is concerned [19:05] it's only really decent on older cards [19:05] ahh alrighty [19:08] SeveredCross: http://www.xig.com/Pages/Edu/OpenSourceATI.pdf (dunno what makes this time any different to last time both parties had the specs) === dmb_ is now known as dmb [22:00] Hmm, when I try to update my Hardy box (it's Hardy currently), it tells me I need to do a full distribution update (with update-manager). It can't authenticate my packages and errors on it. [22:00] it should prompt you to continue, not error out [22:00] where is it erroring out? [22:01] nevermind me; I'm an idiot. an aptitude update fixed it. [22:01] It just says it can't authenticate packages and lists a ton of packages, from cups to compiz and so on [22:01] right, and the gui should let you continue [22:01] It prompts me first, but then it gives me an error. [22:01] It doesn't. [22:01] basically saying "okay, they are unauthenticated, so what" [22:01] lol [22:02] Nope, just says it can't upgrade because it can't authenticate them [22:02] hrm. what was the error text? [22:02] meh, updating my sources fixed it [22:02] I don't recall [22:02] :p [22:02] k [22:02] well if you come across it again, i would file that as a bug [22:02] I will [22:02] * MenZa is still happy with how stable Hardy is, compared to its development stage [22:03] then again, all Ubuntu dev releases I've used since Dapper were quite good [22:03] The only release I had issues with during the Alpha was Gutsy [22:03] I put this on my laptop to test it, though, and I have actually not booted back into Gutsy yet. [22:03] lol [22:03] I just use Hardy on my laptop because Gutsy is really annoying when it comes to ALSA [22:04] badly-compiled module or something [22:04] works fine on Hardy [22:04] * MenZa shrugs. [22:04] Though it seems that there is some breakage in APT [22:05] Looking at bug reports? [22:05] * MenZa checks launchpad. [22:05] No, I think I am about to file one though as soon as I can figure out what is causing my own issue [22:05] aha [22:05] Theres always apt dependency breakage in hardy [22:05] I pinned my coreutils to that which came with Hardy, and it keeps wanting to upgrade to the one in my PPA, even though it is pinned [22:05] lol [22:06] Pici: I can imagine. [22:06] And it then did in fact upgrade, but every time I run apt-get upgrade, it says "We need to upgrade again." [22:06] I just find it weird why this insists on running a "Distribution" upgrade [22:06] hmm [22:06] And so it unpacks it and sets it up [22:06] Well, that is because core packages changed [22:06] I see [22:06] I always full-upgrade [22:07] Pici: I just use update-manager [22:07] easier [22:07] hmm [22:07] I'm scared to reboot now ._. [22:07] :p [22:07] eh, you have the installer on CD, right? [22:07] I have an alias that does sudo aptitude update ; sudo aptitude full-upgrade [22:07] * MenZa does it nonetheless. [22:07] mbt: The installer on CD? [22:07] MenZa: Yeah. [22:07] MenZa: If you do, then don't be scurred, you can bring the Alpha back from the dead if it kills itself. :) [22:08] hehehe [22:08] I don't think I do [22:08] I'll download it on my desktop if I need it [22:08] Works fine after a reboot. [22:08] :) [22:08] * MenZa crosses fingers, hoping it will log in [22:09] Ah, logs in fine [22:09] Thank God [22:09] oh yeah [22:09] I need to re-compile my wifi driver [22:09] typical [22:09] * MenZa growls [22:10] Pici: what is this alias, out of curiosity? [22:10] MenZa: hmm? I made it myself. [22:10] full-upgrade runs that ^ [22:10] ahh [22:11] yes, it was the title of the alias I wanted. .D [22:11] :D* [22:11] I have had cron-apt - running safe-upgrade [22:11] for a few months (to prove to myself that aptitude never messes up whilst apt-get does all the time) [22:11] hehehe [22:11] mm, this emerald theme makes me happy [22:13] whee [22:13] I have working intertubes [22:13] <3 madwifi [22:13] using custom patches ? [22:14] just a madwifi kernel module; I have to use an svn version for it to support my card [22:14] revision 2756 to be exact [22:14] with a patch applied [22:14] for the eepc ? [22:14] nope [22:14] Toshiba Satellite L40-10Q [22:14] it's an atheros network [22:14] + card [22:15] Is it the patch atheros sent that breaks all other targets except i386 [22:16] yup [22:16] :D [22:16] thank God for i386. <3 [22:24] 7w 55 [22:36] wow [22:36] how do you break everything but ia32 [22:38] use ia32 specific code in code that should be arch-independent [22:38] not too hard [22:39] well, we aren't using assembly language, and shouldn't c code be abstracted in some way to isolate from ia32isms? [22:40] is there nothing in the kernel-space that does that, like providing some sort of small runtime for drivers that abstract away the platform differences? === ajmorris is now known as ajmorris|AFCLI [23:25] is there a good place to follow changes that are happening in the alpha's? I'm running it and just curious whats being done on it :) [23:40] my /var/www has permissions of: ?--------- ? ? ? ? ? www, and i can't delete it as root, anyone know whats up with that?