[00:02] <nixternal> Vorian: if you want to, you need to fix the kmldonkey package with the updated cdbs/ directory, change Maintainer to Kubuntu Developers <kubuntu-devel@lists.ubuntu.com>, add yourself as XSBC-Original-Maintainer, and then add export LDFLAGS+="-Wl,--as-needed" just above the kde.mk call in rules
[00:02] <Vorian> nixternal: ok
[00:03]  * nixternal goes and watches our tornadic weather in January in Chicago in sane :p
[00:03] <nixternal> you know it is messed up when it hits 66 in Chicago during Winter time
[00:03] <Vorian> yah
[00:03] <Vorian> it's hot here too
[00:04] <nixternal> and there go the tornado sirens again
[00:04] <nixternal> bbiaf
[00:04] <nixternal> gotta watch :p
[00:23] <jjesse> nixternal: still getting storms?
[00:23] <jjesse> wife mentioned she is under a tornado watch
[00:23]  * jjesse is frankfort ky so doesn't know what is going on
[01:21] <jjesse> anyone see the video from Bill G's keynote at CES? http://gizmodo.com/341472/this-video-makes-bill-gates-look-cooler-than-steve-jobs
[01:22] <jjesse> that's right he's Big Pimpin Bill G
[01:30] <jjesse> boo
[01:31]  * Jucato runs scared... yawning
[01:31] <jjesse> morning Jucato
[01:31] <Jucato> good evening jjesse :)
[01:32] <jjesse> how arey ou?
[01:33] <Jucato> I'm... umm.. ok :)
[01:33] <Jucato> and you? :)
[01:33] <jjesse> too early?
[01:33] <jjesse> i'm doing good, back on the road again
[01:33] <jjesse> btw i've been working on the adept docs a lot, lots of comits :)
[01:34] <Jucato> ooh! I haven't read yet... btw... is there a way I can read it as a plain text, w/o the XML tags? :D
[01:34] <Jucato> bah nvm.. I'm just being lazy lol
[01:34] <jjesse> i would need a valid makefile to build
[01:35] <jjesse> maybe nixternal can build me one?
[01:35] <jjesse> he understands the process
[01:35] <Jucato> nah nvm... I'll just read it... but um... what's the link to your branch again? :D
[01:36]  * Jucato seems to be losing his touch....
[01:37] <Jucato> bah, have to go... gotta stash away the christmas tree and stuff
[01:37] <jjesse> code.launchpad.net/~jjesse/adept/documentation
[01:38] <Jucato> thanks
[01:41]  * Jucato wonders what the c/ directories mean
[01:43] <jjesse> c is for the language
[01:43] <jjesse> i think
[02:13] <Jucato> whooops, jjesse, our adept guide instructs users to use "sudo adept" :D
[02:14] <jjesse> hrm kdesudo?
[02:14] <Jucato> (of course there's no "adept" executable now, but "sudo" is equally wrong :D)
[02:14] <Jucato> kdesu would be ok :)
[02:15] <Jucato> jjesse: hmm wait... we have to be clear, is this handbook for Adept Manager? we might have to change &app and/or &appshort to reflect that,  right?
[02:15] <jjesse> correct
[02:15] <jjesse> it doesn't?
[02:16] <Jucato> ah &app is "Adept Package Manager" and &appshort is "Adept"... hm... ok I guess that would do :)
[02:16] <Jucato> because the command would have to be "kdesu adept_manager"
[02:16] <jjesse> ok will have to change it
[02:17]  * Jucato hugs jjesse
[02:17] <Jucato> I'll see if I can send patches too :P
[02:18] <nivek> Wow. That's a ... unique ... username.
 and get nothing during boot
[02:18] <nivek> :/
[02:18] <jjesse> ?
[02:19] <nivek> hey Hobbsee
[02:19] <jjesse> hello Hobbsee
[02:20] <Hobbsee> heya!
[02:20] <yuriy> shouldn't documentation tell people to launch it from the menu?
[02:20] <jjesse> yuriy: tell it from both
[02:20] <jjesse> the menu and from the command line
[02:21]  * Jucato seconds jjesse :)
[02:21] <Jucato> hi Hobbsee!!!
[02:21] <Hobbsee> heya Jucato!
[02:23] <nixternal> jjesse: meinproc index.docbook
[02:23] <jjesse> nixternal: thanks, survive the tornamdo?
[02:23] <nixternal> for adept handbook, that will build out the html with the kde settings
[02:23] <Jucato> hiya nixternal!! :)
[02:23] <nixternal> it was false alarms I think
[02:23] <nixternal> it all went a bit south
[02:23] <jjesse> ah bummer :)
[02:23] <nixternal> got windy though
[02:23] <Jucato> jjesse: the screenshots might now get linked properly though
[02:24] <Jucato> (a.k.a. there seems to be some wrong paths...)
[02:24] <jjesse> hrmm got lots off errors when i ran meinproc adeptdude.xml
[02:24] <jjesse> will need to fix them
[02:25]  * Jucato nods
[02:26] <Jucato> is it just me, or does Dolphin (KDE 4) launch 2 windows when I click on the K Menu entry, and it tries to open 2 non-existant directories, "KDE", and "4". (kubuntu-members-kde4 ppa)
[02:26] <jjesse> must be just you
[02:27]  * Jucato sobs
[02:28] <Hobbsee> do we have finished kde4 final packages yet?
[02:28] <jjesse> not until next week right?
[02:28] <Jucato> Hobbsee is excited :D
[02:28] <Jucato> this friday (Jan 11)
[02:28] <Hobbsee> i thought kubuntu had packages for it
[02:28]  * jjesse is looking to reload his laptop w/ kde4 final
[02:29]  * Jucato doesn't know what to do :)
[02:29]  * Hobbsee has unlimited connection here @ library, so...
[02:29] <Hobbsee> oh, i'll update the daily cds
[02:30] <Jucato> cheater :)
[02:33] <tlayton> jucato: i get those two windows with dolphin as well
[02:33]  * jjesse can't really test it as he's currently running windows
[02:33] <Hobbsee> so, which packages are we to install in hardy to get kde4?
[02:33] <Hobbsee> does it all "just work" from a packaging side yet?
[02:33] <jjesse> kubuntu-kde4-desktop
[02:34] <Jucato> oh we have a metapackage now? kool
[02:34] <jjesse> don't know for sure, but i thought i heard it that way?
[02:34] <Hobbsee> does that fix kdm4 into working?
[02:35] <Hobbsee> i thought we had it.
[02:35] <nixternal> let me guess, Vorian is glued to the TV right now watching those nuts
[02:35] <tlayton> jucato: plus, it looks for Home in the wrong dir. it is trying ~/KDE for Home, instead of the actual value in the bookmark
[02:35] <nixternal> GO LSU!
[02:35] <Vorian> nixternal: i had to take a break
[02:35] <nixternal> hahaha
[02:35] <Vorian> boo
[02:36] <jjesse> i hate OSU
[02:36] <Vorian> :'(
[02:36] <Vorian> jjesse: where are you from?
[02:36] <nixternal> I now know why they call it OS X, they obviously missed a letter or 2
[02:36] <nixternal> OSUX or OITSUX is more like it
[02:36] <jjesse> Vorian: guess
[02:36] <nixternal> GO BLUE!
[02:36] <Vorian> oh sheesh
[02:37] <nixternal> actually I think jjesse prefers Green
[02:37]  * Vorian vomits
[02:37]  * Hobbsee wonders if she forgot to new the binaries
[02:37] <Vorian> well, I can live with blue
[02:37] <Vorian> s/blue/green
[02:37] <Vorian> :)
[02:37] <jjesse> i actually hope OSU wins so the Big Ten doesn't look like a complete embarrasment
[02:37] <Jucato> tlayton: no, it still goes to my $HOME, but initially, when you start Dolphin, it will open 2 windows, one is at ~/KDE, and one is at ~/4... neither folders exist
[02:37] <nixternal> oh man, to late, I have you quoted, Ohio will throw you out of the their state now
[02:37] <Vorian> nooooo
[02:38] <Hobbsee> lots of kde4 langpacks
[02:38] <Vorian> nixternal: was kmldonky ok?
[02:39] <nixternal> umm, have to look...but tell me that you just zipped everything up into a .bz2 and didn't actually do a .orig.tar.bz2
[02:39] <Hobbsee> it apperas to be called kde4
[02:40] <Vorian> i did a mv tar.bz2 tro orig.tar.bz2
[02:40] <Vorian> damn rrrrrrrrrr key
[02:40] <Vorian> its too touchy
[02:40] <Hobbsee> oh, meh.
[02:41] <nixternal> nah, to create an orig tarball, it has to be orig.tar.gz
[02:41] <Vorian> late greeting Hobbsee :)
[02:41] <nixternal> to do that, extract the upstream tarball
[02:41] <Hobbsee> kde4 packages are extremely broken, dependancy wise
[02:41] <nixternal> rename the directory if needed
[02:41] <nixternal> ie. mv kmldonkey-4.0.0 kmldonkey-kde4-4.0.0
[02:41] <nixternal> cd cd into the new directory
[02:42] <nixternal> then do ->  dh_make -e your@email.address -f ../kmldonkey-4.0.0.tar.bz2
[02:42] <nixternal> that will create the debian/ directory and the .orig.tar.gz file for you
[02:42] <Vorian> weee
[02:42] <Vorian> ok
[02:42] <Jucato> jjesse: the Active filters section might need a major rewrite... (I'm still in the reading and reviewing part... I'll try to see what I can write up later :P)
[02:42] <jjesse> touchdown osu
[02:42] <Jucato> jjesse: unless of course, you beet me too it
[02:42] <Vorian> \o/
[02:42] <Jucato> er.. "beat me to it"*
[02:42] <jjesse> Jucato: i think that guide needs a whole rewrite
[02:42] <jjesse> also check out addremoveprograms
[02:42] <Jucato> haha well, some parts are ok :)
[02:43] <Jucato> eek I hate that :P
[02:43] <Jucato> heh ok I'll try :P
[02:43] <jjesse> the more i used to start documentating i the more istarted to like it
[02:43] <jjesse> note i started to like it
[02:43] <Jucato> :D
[02:44]  * Jucato just doesn't like the concept behind using a separate app-install database...
[02:44] <Jucato> (an incomplete one, at that)
[02:44] <jjesse> hrmm i didn't know there was a seperate database
[02:45] <Jucato> :P
[02:45] <jjesse> for add remove then adept/apt?
[02:45] <Jucato> yep
[02:45] <Jucato> !info app-install-data
[02:45] <jjesse> interesting
[02:45] <ubotu> app-install-data: Ubuntu applications (data files). In component main, is optional. Version 0.4.7 (gutsy), package size 5526 kB, installed size 17952 kB
[02:45] <Jucato> that's what Add/Remove (Ubuntu and Kubuntu) uses
[02:45] <jjesse> i like the optional part of it :)
[02:46] <Jucato> it doesn't list everything that's in the app database itself, just a select number, probably to give more description or metadata
[02:46] <Jucato> well, it's not entirely optional in the case of add/remove... :)
[02:46] <Jucato> it's a required dependency of adept-installer :P
[02:50]  * Hobbsee finally writes a .bz2 to .gz conversion script
[02:51] <Jucato> :D
[02:51] <Jucato> python? or bash? :)
[02:51] <Jucato> or perl? bwahah!
[02:51]  * Jucato keeps quiet now
[02:52] <Hobbsee> bash
[02:52] <Hobbsee> might convert it to python later
[02:57] <nixternal> Hobbsee: that is actually a good idea
[02:57] <nixternal> right now I copy and paste from knotes when I do it :p
[02:57] <nixternal> wtf, why didn't I ever think about tossing something in /usr/local/bin to do it...I am such a moron
[02:58] <Hobbsee> ooh, i win.
[02:59] <Hobbsee> i think
[02:59]  * Jucato pets nixternal... you have your days :)
[02:59] <Jucato> or nights :)
[02:59] <nixternal> ya, but everyday is my day
[02:59] <Jucato> every night is my day :)
[02:59] <nixternal> my enthusiasm has gone to crap recently
[02:59] <Vorian> ok nixternal , re-sent
[02:59] <nixternal> I don't feel innovative with any idea
[02:59] <nixternal> actually, I haven't even come with up an idea lately
[03:00] <nixternal> I think the hamster in my head died
[03:00] <Jucato> ouch... I was about to laud you on your renewed efforts on Kubuntu actually :)
[03:00]  * Jucato prepares the funeral rites then...
[03:00] <nixternal> lol
[03:00] <nixternal> I was just gonna have him creamated, then roll up his ashes and smoke um
[03:00] <Jucato> lol
[03:00] <n8k99> ew
[03:00]  * nixternal is watching Bill Gates keynote again
[03:01] <Jucato> n8k99!!!!!!
[03:01] <Jucato> happy new year! (I wasn't able to greet you)
[03:01]  * n8k99 waves at Jucato
[03:01] <Jucato> nixternal: linky? :)
[03:01] <nixternal> www.microsoft.com
[03:01] <nixternal> lol
[03:01] <nixternal> right on the front page
[03:01] <n8k99> i was on a six week sabbatical
[03:01] <Jucato> oh... needs silverlight right?
[03:01] <Jucato> n8k99: nice!
[03:02] <nixternal> you need silverass or whatever it is called to watch it in your browser, but there is a link right next to the window that you can grab the stream and watch it in a regular video player
[03:02] <Hobbsee> sarah@LongPointyStick:/devel/current% bunzip2gz                          2:02PM
[03:02] <Hobbsee> libkexiv2_0.1.6-1
[03:02] <n8k99> yup i was playing with compiz and gnome while out of school
[03:02]  * Hobbsee triumps over basename.
[03:02] <Jucato> n8k99: not nice
[03:02] <Jucato> :D
[03:02] <Jucato> n8k99: you have a tablet pc right?
[03:03] <n8k99> it was ok at first but then, well, i needed my productivity back
[03:03] <n8k99> yes, and i got the touchscreen working with the help of someone in malaysia
[03:03]  * Hobbsee wins properly!
[03:03] <Jucato> oh kool!
[03:03] <Jucato> grats Hobbsee!
[03:04] <Jucato> n8k99: so there really are some compatibility problems when it comes to Linux/Ubuntu + Touchscreens?
[03:04] <n8k99> yes
[03:04] <n8k99> no and depends
[03:05] <Jucato> oh...
[03:05] <Jucato> ok :)
[03:05] <n8k99> my solution was ultimately enabling 'touch panel' instead of 'tablet' in BIOS
[03:05] <Jucato> coz I might (if my dreams come true) get a UMPC... of course it runs Vista... so... :/
[03:05] <n8k99> which one are you looking at?
[03:06] <Jucato> a Gigabyte U60...
[03:06] <n8k99> who makes that?
[03:06] <Jucato> there are only 2 locally available UMPC's... Gigabyte U60 and Sony VAIO UX...
[03:06] <Jucato> Gigabyte :)
[03:06] <n8k99> oh duh!
[03:07] <Jucato> http://www.buyqube.com/U60Notebook.htm da speks
[03:07] <Jucato> it costs around half the price of a Sony VAIO... so...
[03:07] <Jucato> but still 2x as much as a Nokia tablet.. :(
[03:09] <n8k99> yup a paid double a new Nokia tablet
[03:10] <n8k99> s/I/a
[03:10] <n8k99> that looks like it may have the same screen in it that I have
[03:10] <Jucato> I want an N810!!! (or even just a N800 please?) :(
[03:11] <n8k99> the real pain is once you get the evtouch driver to cooperate you have to guesswork the xorg settings
[03:11] <Jucato> oh... I would hate that :(
[03:11] <nixternal> shh, but I really one :p
[03:11] <nixternal> damn video keeps locking up
[03:11] <Jucato> n8k99: what's the model/brand of your tablet pc btw?
[03:12] <Jucato> nixternal:  you really one?
[03:12] <n8k99> fujitsu u810
[03:12] <nixternal> the Bill Gates video is freakin' great on what his life will be like when he leaves Microsoft
[03:12] <n8k99> it's the u1010 in asia
[03:12] <nixternal> no I don't have one
 shh, but I really one :p
[03:12] <nixternal> s/one/won
[03:12] <nixternal> damn, spelling made me lose
[03:12] <Jucato> lol :P
[03:12] <Jucato> n8k99: oh I see...
[03:12]  * Jucato looks
[03:12]  * nixternal grabs the long pointy stick of doom really really quick
[03:13]  * nixternal runs like a dart
[03:13] <nixternal> RUN FOREST RUN!
[03:13] <Jucato> Hobbsee didn't notice yet...
[03:13] <Jucato> ooops
[03:13] <n8k99> nixternal:  is that a dodge dart?
[03:13] <Hobbsee> hehe
[03:13] <Jucato> n8k99: oh wow!! this one? http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20080107-fujtisu-ultramobile-marries-eee-form-factor-with-tablet-pc.html
[03:14] <Vorian> i'm getting this error with ligature
[03:14] <Vorian> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/51172/  Blitz_DIR
[03:14] <n8k99> Jucato: yes that's teh one
[03:14] <Jucato> ouch....
[03:15] <Vorian> i read something about creating a BlitzConfig.mk file
[03:15] <Vorian> any ideas?
[03:15] <Vorian> :)
[03:17] <n8k99> Jucato this is actually mine http://so.nacreo.us/2007/11/on-video_28.html
[03:27]  * Jucato heads for lunch
[03:27] <Jucato> n8k99: nice :)
[03:27] <n8k99> enjoy lunch
[03:29] <Vorian> finally a break!
[03:31] <nixternal> Vorian: OK, 2 things left with kmldonkey and you should be golden:
[03:31] <Vorian> roger
[03:31] <nixternal> 1) debian/cdbs/ directory needs these 2 files only -> http://www.nixternal.com/~rj/cdbs/
[03:31] <Vorian> 1st
[03:32] <Vorian> so - utils
[03:32] <Vorian> ok
[03:32] <nixternal> 2) break up your lines in debian/control to 80 columns wide, add a full description
[03:32] <Vorian> alrighty
[03:33] <nixternal> break the line after kdelibs5-dev, so right after that comma hit enter and then add a space before the libplasma-dev
[03:33] <nixternal> then it should be damn close to golden
[03:34] <nixternal> I made myself sick looking at your copyright file, so that usually means it has to be correct :p
[03:34] <nixternal> I hate copyright files when they have anything other than GPL
[03:34] <nixternal> Hobbsee: does CC licenses meet DFSG?
[03:34] <Hobbsee> i think so
[03:34]  * Hobbsee runs off
[03:35] <nixternal> plugins/infowidget/geoip/*.png
[03:35] <nixternal>     Flag images found at http://www.hahn-hotel.com/flags/
[03:35] <nixternal>     "All sets provided by us are free to use to anyone, for commercial or
[03:35] <nixternal>      non-commercial websites."
[03:35] <nixternal>     However, the author has confirmed that they can be used under this Creative
[03:35] <nixternal>     Commons License:
[03:35] <nixternal>         http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/2.0/de/
[03:35] <nixternal> shiznit
[03:35] <nixternal> notice the quote, just says you are free to use, not free to modify
[03:36] <nixternal> that right there won't pass DFSG
[03:38] <Vorian> nixternal: this app has poo for descriptions
[03:38] <nixternal> Vorian: how come I don't see plugins/infowidget/geoip? anywhere in this archive?
[03:39] <Vorian> there wern't any in the tarball
[03:40] <nixternal> where did you get that line from then in the copyright file?
[03:40] <Vorian> nixternal: oops
[03:40] <Vorian> :)
[03:40]  * Vorian edits
[03:41] <nixternal> ok, ya so all of that CC stuff needs to go, and I just deleted the damn directory ;P
[03:41] <Vorian> look at the source copyright
[03:41] <nixternal> COPYING is GPL v2
[03:42] <Vorian> yeah
[03:43] <nixternal> everything in that entire package is GPL v2
[03:43] <Vorian> those nutters put a crazy trailer at the end of their copyright
[03:45] <nixternal> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/51175/
[03:45] <nixternal> that is the copyright header info for every file in that package
[03:46] <nixternal> the word 'creativecommons' is not found anywhere in there though
[03:47] <Vorian> nixternal: how did you extract those?
[03:48] <nixternal> licensecheck
[03:48] <nixternal> I think that is in debscripts
[03:49] <nixternal> licensecheck --copyright *
[03:49] <nixternal> in root directory of the application
[03:51]  * nixternal goes to play some call of duty 4
[04:22] <Vorian> ok nixternal, you should have some mail
[07:45] <apache|mobile> Riddell, imbrandon: can one of you please upload http://codebrowse.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-members/amarok/debian/revision/173
[07:46] <apache|mobile> ...when the free is lifted ;-)
[09:41] <_StefanS_> hey Tonio_
[09:41] <Tonio_> yo _StefanS_ !
[09:41] <Tonio_> brb, just a moment
[09:49] <\sh> moins ton
[09:49] <\sh> tonio
[10:15] <Riddell> nixternal: those flags are CC (of some acceptable sort)
[10:15] <Riddell> CC is not DFSG free but it is fine in ubuntu
[10:16] <Tonio_> re
[10:16] <Tonio_> hi Riddell
[10:16] <Riddell> salut Tonio_
[10:19] <Tonio_> Riddell: I was discussing with some collegues about fosdem
[10:19] <Tonio_> Riddell: will you be there this year ? I might
[10:19] <Riddell> Tonio_: yes, should be
[10:19] <Tonio_> ho that would be super !
[10:22] <Tonio_> Riddell: you'll be at the kubuntu booth I guess ?
[10:22] <Tonio_> Riddell: if so may I be at the booth with you ?
[10:24] <Riddell> Tonio_: there is no Kubuntu stall
[10:25] <Tonio_> Riddell: sad :/
[10:26] <Tonio_> Riddell: well in any case I might see you and a couple of other guys there, which is good :)
[10:34] <\sh> Tonio_: did you see that pykdeextensions re-implemented kdepyuic in the correct ways?
[10:46] <Tonio_> \sh: yeah
[10:47] <Tonio_> \sh: you mean the package ? it has been built and kdepyuic is correct now
[10:47] <Tonio_> \sh_away: guidance has been built with it
[10:47] <Tonio_> \sh_away: or are you talking about upstream that previously fixed it ?
[10:51] <Riddell> apache|mobile: amarok uploaded
[10:52] <apache|mobile> Riddell: thanks
[11:00] <Hobbsee> Riddell: where is 4.0 (the rest of it?)
[11:02] <Riddell> Hobbsee: on my hard disk
[11:02] <Hobbsee> Riddell: when can we have it?
[11:02] <Hobbsee> and does it Just Work (tm) now?
[11:04] <Riddell> should just work, it's not that different from the upload in currently
[11:04] <Riddell> I'll upload closer to release time
[11:05] <Hobbsee> ah right
[11:25] <manchicken> Man, what a week... and it's only Tuesday.
[11:27] <manchicken> I had someone ask me if I was interested in a contract position at Boeing working with Python and Qt.  I hate turning down neat opportunities like that.  Anybody interested in moving to Washington state?  heh
[11:29] <manchicken> Riddell: Are you near the country?
[11:30] <apache|mobile> Riddell: can you please also backport to ubuntu2~gutsy1?
[11:31] <sebas> Riddell: Release time is Friday, before noon it seems, btw. :)
[11:31] <sebas> UTC-ish
[11:31] <Riddell> manchicken: not until next week
[11:32] <Riddell> apache|mobile: amarok? ok
[11:32] <sebas> Riddell: You're in Mountain View?
[11:32] <Riddell> sebas: will be
[11:32] <apache|mobile> Riddell: yep
[11:32] <sebas> Riddell: Cool :)
[11:33] <apache|mobile> initial bug report actually was for the backport ;-)
[11:33] <manchicken> Riddell: Do you know about how much hotels are in the Scottish country-side?  My folks are gonna be having their 30th wedding anniversary next year and I thought that a trip to the picturesque Scottish country-side would be a nice gift.
[11:34] <Riddell> manchicken: as much as you want to pay really :)
[11:34] <manchicken> Riddell: Well if you're anywhere near Mahomet, IL, let me know.  You're more than welcome to come visit :)
[11:34] <Riddell> manchicken: plenty of cheapish bed and breakfasts about, plenty of expensive places too
[11:34] <manchicken> Riddell: What if I want a fantastic room but I'm not looking to pay anything?
[11:34] <Riddell> manchicken: visitscotland.com is the main website
[11:34] <manchicken> Is it?  Thanks, I'll look there.
[11:34] <Riddell> manchicken: they can stay in the spare room in my flat
[11:34] <manchicken> heh
[11:35] <manchicken> I don't know if you'd be keen on having my dad in your place.  He's a great guy, but I don't recommend living with him.
[11:35] <manchicken> But then again, I never was much for living with other people.  Dacia's the only person I've ever really been able to live with well.
[11:36] <Tm_T> heh
[11:36] <Riddell> manchicken: what about that bairn you live with?
[11:36]  * Tm_T is totally family person
[11:36] <manchicken> Bairn?
[11:36] <Riddell> wean
[11:36]  * manchicken doesn't know what a Bairn is...
[11:37] <Riddell> wee ane
[11:37] <manchicken> The baby?
[11:37] <Riddell> aye
[11:37] <manchicken> It's easy to live with the baby before it's born.  Ask again once it's come out.
[11:38] <manchicken> It should really be here any day now.
[11:38] <Tm_T> babies <3
[11:38] <manchicken> We're 39 weeks, and pregnancies go up to 40 weeks on average from what I understand.
[11:38] <Tm_T> manchicken: it will be exhausting, but sooo rewarding
[11:38] <manchicken> We're due on Monday the 14th.
[11:38] <manchicken> Tm_T: Sounds like the rest of life.
[11:38] <manchicken> :)
[11:38] <Tm_T> manchicken: aye
[11:39] <Riddell> manchicken: ooh ooh, lets have him come out on friday morning, then you can name him kde 4.0
[11:39] <manchicken> But at least the baby won't be as boring as some other parts of life.
[11:39] <Tm_T> Riddell: awww
[11:39] <manchicken> Riddell: heh
[11:39] <Tm_T> manchicken: boring, no, noisy in some cases, definately
[11:39] <manchicken> Riddell: We're nick-naming him "Badger," after that one badger song by weebls-stuff.co.uk
[11:40]  * Tm_T is feeling older every day
[11:40] <manchicken> Riddell: My first brown ale is going to be called "Badger Brown"
[11:40] <manchicken> Tm_T: Noisy is okay.  I'm just not interested in boring.
[11:40] <manchicken> Enough of life is already boring.
[11:40] <Tm_T> manchicken: hehe
[11:40] <manchicken> I still can't believe I got up at 4:30 this morning.
[11:40] <manchicken> It's gotta be this stupid thunder storm.
[11:41] <Tm_T> manchicken: oh, get used to it
[11:41] <Tm_T> manchicken: and 2 hour sleeps tops
[11:41] <manchicken> Something wrong with a thunderstorm in January.
[11:41] <manchicken> Tm_T: That doesn't sound too bad.
[11:41] <manchicken> I'll just sleep like the baby.
[11:41] <manchicken> Lots of naps :)
[11:41] <Tm_T> unless babies have changed dramatically since 20's
[11:41] <manchicken> 20s?
[11:42] <Tm_T> yes
[11:42] <manchicken> 1920s?
[11:42] <Tm_T> yes
[11:42] <manchicken> You had a baby in the 1920s?
[11:42] <Tm_T> yes
[11:42] <manchicken> Wow.
[11:42] <manchicken> I didn't know that about you.
[11:42] <manchicken> Doesn't that put you in your 90s?
[11:42] <Tm_T> more like 110
[11:43] <manchicken> Nice.
[11:43] <manchicken> Are you serious?
[11:43] <Tm_T> I'm very serious about this, in some weird way
[11:43] <Tm_T> to be honest, no, I don't have kids on my own, yet
[11:44] <Tm_T> manchicken: I just often feel like I did born 1895
[11:44] <Tm_T> and why not
[11:45] <Tm_T> nothing wrong in that year, really
[11:45] <manchicken> heh
[11:45] <Tm_T> half-rotten body and all, so, why not
[11:46] <Tm_T> Emmett Chapman - Lotus on Irish Streams
[11:47] <manchicken> And I'm sure that by 1895 you mean 1983 :)
[11:47] <Tm_T> actually no
[11:47] <Tm_T> by 1895 I mean 1895
[11:47] <manchicken> heh
[11:48] <manchicken> I've gotta find some interesting beer recipes.
[11:49] <Tm_T> manchicken: oh, I know some "interesting" indeed
[11:49] <manchicken> Okay, interesting and good.
[11:49] <Tm_T> =)
[11:50] <manchicken> My first batch is going to be an English brown ale.
[11:50] <Tm_T> :)
[11:50] <Tm_T> mmmmh, I have to go, will catch you later ->
[11:51] <manchicken> But I can't brew until after the baby comes or I might not get it into bottles on time.
[12:05] <mhb> Tm_T: well hello to the 21st century, where all backends are Qt- or GTK- dependent and everythin is connected via DBUS.
[12:33] <apachelogger__> Riddell: thanks for the backport :)
[13:31]  * stdin pokes someone to look at https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kdeutils/+bug/181106
[13:31] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 181106 in kdeutils "KGPG requires Konsole" [Undecided,Confirmed]
[13:45] <jjesse> morning :)
[13:50] <DaSkreech> stdin: What's the point?
[13:50] <stdin> DaSkreech: because it will need konqueror on gnome too
[13:51] <DaSkreech> stdin: Oh sorry I was asking what's the benefit of installin kgpg on Gnome
[13:51] <stdin> did i say konqueror, I meant konsole
[13:52] <stdin> maybe because whatever gnome uses isn't as good? I don't know
[13:52] <DaSkreech> And KGPG doesn't really need Konsole I'll assume
[13:54] <stdin> it doesn't need it, but it does on gnome...
[13:54] <DaSkreech> So if you remove Konsole on KDE and install KGPG it doesn't ask for it?
[13:55] <stdin> it looks in the kde settings for which terminal emulator to use and falls back to konsole, but gnome users don't have kde settings
[13:55]  * Hobbsee notes it should look in /etc/alternatives then
[13:56] <stdin> all kgpg depends on is kdelibs (and so Qt3) and gnupg
[13:58] <DaSkreech> Hobbsee: Question. Since we are shipping Dolphin will we still need to patch Konqueror?
[13:58] <Hobbsee> erm...good questoin
[13:58] <Hobbsee> i suspect we can if we wish
[13:59] <Jucato> patch how/why?
[13:59] <Jucato> btw, hi! :)
[13:59]  * DaSkreech hugs Jucato
[14:00] <Jucato> stdin: my kde4 goto guy, does clicking on Dolphin from the K Menu or kickoff launch 2 Dolphin windows, one opening to ~/KDE and one to ~/4.. neither of which exists?
[14:00]  * DaSkreech ponders having a konqueror-virgin package
[14:01] <Jucato> the correct (politically correct) term would be "vanilla" :)
[14:01]  * stdin starts kde4 and checks
[14:01] <Jucato> stdin: even in kde3
[14:01] <Jucato> I mean, launching Dolphin 4 from KDE 3 K Menu
[14:02] <DaSkreech> Jucato: how is your wizardry ?
[14:02] <Jucato> in what? (but the answer will always be "poor")
[14:02] <stdin> Jucato: confirmed in kde3
[14:03] <DaSkreech> Jucato: Sourcemage
[14:03] <Jucato> ah magery...
[14:03] <Jucato> er.. magecraft :P
[14:03] <stdin> and now kde4 too
[14:03] <Jucato> doing fine... still finding a way to strike a harmonious balance between it and Kubuntu :)
[14:04] <Jucato> stdin: wonder what happens :/
[14:04] <DaSkreech> Jucato: They are source based right?
[14:04] <stdin> I have no clue :p
[14:05] <Jucato> DaSkreech: yep
[14:05] <DaSkreech> Ah so getting KDE4 isn't an issue?
[14:05] <Jucato> stdin: perhaps a hardcoded $HOME setting for Dolphin
[14:06] <Jucato> DaSkreech: well that depends.. it still uses some form of packaging system (like portage)... but so far until last week, I've always built from svn
[14:06] <stdin> I'll have to have a look, but running dolphin from krunner works fine
[14:06] <Jucato> ah then more hm....
[14:06] <DaSkreech> Maybe they pass an argument to it from the menu?
[14:07] <jjesse> awesome everyone i'm supposed to be training at tthis client has called in sick
[14:07] <jjesse> going to be a fun day
[14:07] <Jucato> I tried to check the menu entry.. nothing suspicious...
[14:08] <DaSkreech> jjesse: Wear a sars mask
[14:10] <Jucato> well, if they've called in sick, they're probably absent.. :)
[14:10] <Jucato> still, prevention is the best cure..
[14:10] <Jucato> or some shyte like that :D
[14:15] <jjesse> they are absent
[14:15] <jjesse> which makes my day even better
[14:15] <stdin> Jucato: I see why it's opening 2 windows now :)
[14:16] <Jucato> oh why? :)
[14:16] <stdin> Exec=dolphin-kde4 %i -caption "%c"  where %c = "Dolphin KDE 4", but the wrapper scripts doesn't preserve the quotes
[14:17] <Jucato> oh...
[14:17] <stdin> at least, I think ;)
[14:17] <DaSkreech> jjesse: are you paid to lecture or paid to teach?
[14:17] <jjesse> paid to teach, software trainer
[14:17] <Jucato> so the caption becomes Dolphin, and KDE and 4 become arguments...
[14:17] <stdin> seems that way to me
[14:20] <jjesse> DaSkreech: so when the students aren't here, the client is still paying for the whole week of training
[14:20] <jjesse> DaSkreech: so i get paid to do nothing all day :)
[14:21] <Jucato> perfect chance to do some Kubuntu love :)
[14:21] <Jucato> loving*
[14:21] <DaSkreech> jjesse: You get paid to lecture then :)
[14:21] <jjesse> DaSkreech: yeah i guess you could say i get paid to lecture
[14:22] <DaSkreech> jjesse: I used to know a lecturer who would turn up for class and just start. Empty classroom didn't matter. He was paid to lecture during a certain time. Not to teach
[14:22] <jjesse> Jucato: hopefully i can get some kubuntu love :)
[14:24] <stdin> Jucato: actually it seems dolphin totally ignores -caption all together, then just takes everything but the 1st word as an argument, even when in quotes
[14:24] <DaSkreech> stdin: bug?
[14:24] <stdin> seems like it
[14:24] <stdin> and removing "-caption %c" from the .desktop fixes the multiple opens
[14:25] <Jucato> stdin: try --caption?
[14:25] <stdin> same result
[14:26] <Jucato> must really be a bug :/
[14:32] <stdin> hmm, other kde4 apps seem only to take the 1st word as the caption too, eg: kwrite-kde4 -caption "KKwrite KDE 4"    set's the caption to "KKwrite" and tries to open "KDE" and "4"
[14:33]  * DaSkreech pushes stdin into #kde4-devel
[14:34] <stdin> DaSkreech: I'm just collecting some info to do just that :)
[14:34] <Jucato> stdin: does using single quotes make a diff?
[14:34] <stdin> Jucato: nope
[14:41] <Jucato> stdin: hm.. my -caption doesn't seem to work at all...
[14:42] <stdin> not on dolphin, but it works (for me) on konqueror
[14:42] <Jucato> oh wait, using the wrong binaries :P
[14:43] <Jucato> hm.. why do I have a dolphin in /usr/lib/kde4 and a dolphin-kde4... hm...
[14:45] <stdin> because dolphin-kde4 is a wrapper script?
[14:45] <Jucato> oh...
[14:45]  * Jucato didn't know
[14:46] <Jucato> I'm confused about $KDEHOME in there...
[14:46] <stdin> why?
[14:46] <Jucato> doesn't the patch to kdelibs4 take care of setting the $KDEHOME for kde4 apps?
[14:46] <Jucato> (patch from Debian)
[14:47] <stdin> doesn't hurt to set it anyway
[14:47] <Jucato> anyway, the script does set the other env vars...
[14:59] <Jucato> stdin: that was.. um.. :/
[14:59] <stdin> I sooo wanted it to be their fault for once :p
[14:59] <Jucato> too bad :)
[14:59] <Jucato> me too :)
[14:59] <Jucato> just for once...just for once!!!
[15:21] <stdin> "sed -i 's/\\\$\$\@/\\"\\$$@\\"/g' debian/rules" should fix it: \$$@ -> \"\$$@\"
[15:21]  * stdin makes debdiffs
[15:21] <Jucato> aaah! gotta love sed :)
[15:21] <stdin> my \ is beginning to get worn out :p
[15:29] <DaSkreech> Jucato, stdin: they have been doing this a lot longer than we have. Learn from them while you can!
[15:29]  * Jucato doesn't want to learn anymore... :(
[15:30]  * stdin is too busy making debdiffs to learn anything
[15:31]  * Jucato is too busy procrastinating to type anyth
[15:33]  * DaSkreech is too busy typing to typ.. umm think
[15:35] <stdin> and now I have another bug: kfmclient-kde4, kfmclient-kde4, oh where for art thou kfmclient-kde4?
[15:35] <Jucato> deprecated?
[15:35] <Jucato> ah perhaps no wrapper script?
[15:35] <stdin> should be a wrapper script in /usr/bin, but it's not being created and so breaking url handling in kde3
[15:36] <yuriy> same problem here
[16:31]  * stdin pokes Riddell with some debdiffs http://www.stdin.me.uk/diffs/
[16:31] <stdin> or anyone who can upload them
[16:32] <DaSkreech> Jucato: No sleep for you?
[16:32] <Jucato> still typing a year end review :)
[16:34] <Riddell> stdin: I'll add those to the 4.0 uploads
[16:35] <DaSkreech> Riddell: Do we still need to patch Konqueror since we are shipping dolphin ?
[16:36] <Riddell> DaSkreech: patch for what?
[16:36] <Jucato> (same question I asked earlier :P)
[16:36] <DaSkreech> Menus etc to Kubuntuize it
[16:36] <Riddell> we still use konqueror
[16:36] <DaSkreech> Right
[16:37] <DaSkreech> but do we need to patch it
[16:37] <Riddell> and most of the changes we make are in 4.0 anyway
[16:37] <Riddell> yes, default konqueror is horrific
[16:37] <DaSkreech> Riddell: Is it possible to have a konqueror-vanilla package for those who like horror shows ?
[16:37] <Jucato> default konqueror 4 as a file manager is terrible... :(
[16:38] <stdin> konqueror in kde4 uses the dolphin kpart
[16:38] <DaSkreech> Yes I know
[16:38]  * DaSkreech sighs
[16:39] <Jucato> stdin: yes... but annoyingly, you have to use Dolphin to configure settings for Konqueror too... in some cases
[16:39] <stdin> you have to use konqueror in kde3 to configure some d3lphin settings, like if it opens directories or not ;)
[16:41] <Jucato> that's a system settings problem :)
[16:42] <Jucato> besides, we all know how d3lphin is :P
[16:42] <nosrednaekim> <_<
[16:43] <DaSkreech> >_>
[16:43] <Jucato> -_-
[16:43] <stdin> I wonder if I can find out why kfmclient-kde4 wasn't made now...
[16:47] <Riddell> DaSkreech: remove kubuntu-default-settings
[16:47] <DaSkreech> Riddell: how many apps does that affect?
[16:47]  * DaSkreech will go find out
[16:47] <DaSkreech> Right after this meeting ;0
[16:47] <DaSkreech> :0)
[17:21] <stdin> Riddell: if you could also add "usr/bin/kfmclient-kde4" to debian/konqueror-kde4.install in kdebase-kde4 what would fix some breakage
[17:22] <Riddell> stdin: ok
[17:35] <yuriy> stdin: gonna apply that fix to ppa?
[17:37] <stdin> yuriy: thinking about it ;)
[17:39] <Riddell> yuriy: which fix?
[17:40] <stdin> the small fix the debdiffs provided, I'm wondering if it's worth it
[17:40] <Riddell> stdin: I'd just wait for the 4.0 packages
[17:40] <stdin> that's what I'm thinking too
[17:41] <stdin> seems like a lot of work, and bandwidth would be wasted, if I did
[17:43] <yuriy> i meant the kfmclient fix
[17:44] <Riddell> same thing
[17:44] <Riddell> who wants fame and fortune by submitting a paragraph to dot.kde.org pointing at this? http://drowstar.blogspot.com/2008/01/first-look-at-unreleased-kde400-with.html
[17:45] <DaSkreech> Riddell: Digg beat you to it :)
[17:45] <stdin> that's
[17:46] <Riddell> nobody reads digg (well I've tried and never found it remotely useful), dot news on the other hand is always popular
[17:46] <stdin> ignore me
[17:46] <DaSkreech> :-)
[17:46] <DaSkreech> They have been having slobbering wars over KDE 4 in the past three weeks
[18:08] <jjesse> is that article really "first look"  i mean lots of people have been using kde4 from svn for a while
[18:08] <Riddell> jjesse: first look at 4.0
[18:08] <Riddell> 4.0.0 rather
[18:09] <jjesse> well can't you just compile from branches/4.0 and it will be "first look"
[18:10] <Riddell> well yes, that's what he did
[18:10] <Riddell> and now I need someone to submit the story to the dot
[18:14] <jjesse> how do you do that?
[18:15] <Riddell> ah hah, a volunteer!
[18:15] <Riddell> jjesse: http://dot.kde.org/addPostingForm
[18:15] <toma> ;-)
[18:15] <jjesse> bored at work
[18:15] <Riddell> http://dot.kde.org/1199623673/ is the general format to follow
[18:16] <jjesse> hrm what subject?
[18:17] <Riddell> jjesse: well the blog link I gave above
[18:17] <coreymon> Riddell: hey! im back!
[18:17]  * Riddell high fives coreymon 
[18:17] <jjesse> quick everyone leave
[18:17] <coreymon> :P
[18:18] <coreymon> anyone here miss me while i was gone?
[18:18] <Riddell> we can stop wearing black now
[18:18] <coreymon> lol
[18:21] <jjesse> ok posted
[18:28] <jjesse> why are Jucato's post so stinking long to read
[18:32] <DaSkreech> jjesse: power of the blont!
[18:33] <jjesse> my eyese glaze over halfway through
[18:38] <Riddell> jjesse: this read ok? http://dot.kde.org/1199816659/
[18:38] <jjesse> yeah it does
[18:39] <jjesse> bett ther what i wrote :)
[18:39] <Riddell> well it is what you wrote, just edited
[18:40] <Riddell> I wonder if anyone will join that irc channel
[18:40] <jjesse> which irc hcannel?
[18:40] <Riddell> the one in the story :)
[18:40] <stdin> #kde4-release-party
[18:43] <ScottK> Do I get tabs in Dolphin in KDE4?
[18:43] <jjesse> if you want?
[18:43] <ScottK> But not by default then?
[18:43] <jjesse> don't listen to me :)  i don't know anything
[18:43] <DaSkreech> ScottK: Sure. It's an easy recode and recompile away
[18:44] <ScottK> That's a no then.
[18:45] <DaSkreech> :-)
[18:45] <DaSkreech> wise man
[18:45] <DaSkreech> seele: ping
[18:47] <seele> DaSkreech: pong
[18:47] <DaSkreech> seele: are you familiar with the KDE HIG?
[18:47] <seele> DaSkreech: yes
[18:47] <DaSkreech> or PIG
[18:47] <bigon> is it normal that I get -DDATA_INSTALL_DIR=/usr/share/kde4/apps when building decibel?
[18:47] <DaSkreech> or HUG
[18:47] <seele> i wrote part of it
[18:47] <DaSkreech>  :)
[18:48] <seele> what is HUG?
[18:48] <DaSkreech> seele: is there anything in there about accelarator keys ?
[18:48] <DaSkreech> HUman User Guidelines ?
[18:48] <DaSkreech> Or you know ...
[18:48] <seele> DaSkreech: maybe.. is the wiki up?
[18:48]  * DaSkreech hugs seele
[18:48] <DaSkreech> Dunno it was down the other day
[18:49] <seele> http://wiki.openusability.org/guidelines/index.php/Design_and_Layout:Controls:Shortcuts
[18:49] <seele> only looks like some of it though
[18:50] <DaSkreech> ok
[18:51] <DaSkreech> So nothing about tabs?
[18:51] <stdin> bigon: how are you building it?
[18:51] <bigon> in a pbuilder
[18:51] <seele> DaSkreech: might be in the tabs section
[18:51] <bigon> so dbus .service files get installed in /usr/share/kde4/apps
[18:51] <bigon> ..dbus/
[18:52] <DaSkreech> seele: Nope looked there
[18:52] <seele> DaSkreech: are you looking for something in particular?
[18:52] <stdin> if it's a kde4 app built with our kde.mk
[18:52] <DaSkreech> Yeah I'm kinda annoyed by apps having multiple ways of switching tabs
[18:52] <bigon> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/11216622/buildlog_ubuntu-hardy-i386.decibel_0.5.0%2Bsvn737972-2_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
[18:52] <Riddell> bigon: it's specific in debian/cdbs/kde.mk, so yes
[18:52] <seele> ah
[18:52] <DaSkreech> I don't mind being able to change them but have some consistency at least
[18:53] <DaSkreech> And Konqueror's bug where it hops between two sets of keys for tabs is just as bad
[18:53] <DaSkreech> I'm going to file a bug against Kopete4 but I wanted a reference
[18:53] <DaSkreech> seele: is there a #kde-usabilty ?
[18:54] <seele> DaSkreech: yes, but i dont know who all is in it
[18:54] <seele> i guess i should be in there, lol
[18:54] <bigon> Riddell: oh yes I see, but thats odd because when build on debian buildd the files get installed in the correct location
[18:54] <seele> there are people in #openusability but it's pretty quiet unfortunately
[18:54] <seele> ellen and i both got busy around the same time and the project kind of fluttered
[18:55]  * DaSkreech pictures fluttering usabilty parks
[18:56] <Riddell> bigon: mm, this is odd indeed
[18:56] <Riddell> hunger_t_: don't suppose you know why that might be?
[18:57] <Riddell> oh, decibel uses kdelibs
[18:57] <DaSkreech> It's a pillar isn't it?
[18:58] <DaSkreech> seele: So don't count on a consistent interface for dealing with tabs?
[18:58] <seele> DaSkreech: the problem is no one's fully looked in to it
[18:58] <DaSkreech> that's fine
[18:58] <seele> DaSkreech: i imagine tabs are used in all kinds of different contexts, so i cant immediately say there should be a single way of handling them, that's all
[18:59] <DaSkreech> who should I poke to start it rolling
[18:59] <seele> sigh, probably me
[18:59] <seele> ellen maybe, if she is not too busy anymore
[18:59] <seele> but i doubt that because she manages the season of usability which is coming up
[19:00] <DaSkreech> Yeah I saw that. Great idea
[19:00] <seele> maybe you could propose some parts of the HIG to research and complete for the season of usability
[19:01] <seele> she will probably make an announcement when projects can submit ideas
[19:01] <DaSkreech> Hmm ok
[19:01] <DaSkreech> I'll try make some notes
[19:01] <seele> cool
[19:01] <seele> sorry i couldnt be more help
[19:01] <DaSkreech> no that's helpful enough
[19:02] <DaSkreech> To the blontmobile!!!
[19:02] <bigon> Riddell: what that mean?
[19:07] <Riddell> bigon: our kdelibs is installed to a different location than in debian, but I don't see why that should change anything
[19:07] <Riddell> since it's changing the data dir
[19:12] <jackcy> Well, I'm trying to create a config dialog for a pykde4 application. after reading through the docs and api pages the syntax must be something like this after creating a KConfigSkeleton
[19:13] <Riddell> bigon: lets wait and see if hunger_t_ has any ideas, he's into decibel
[19:14] <jackcy> but when i create the dialog with dlg = KConfigDialog(self, "Settings", self.config) and dlg.addPage(???, i18n("General") ) it does not work because I do not know how to create a new item as described in the original documentation: dialog->addPage(new General(0, "General"), i18n("General") );
[19:15] <Riddell> jackcy: got some sample code we can run?
[19:20] <jackcy> I uploaded the current snapshot to  wget www.liedler.at/klxdvdrip/tmp/klxdvdrip-0.02.tar.gz
[19:25] <ScottK> Riddell: http://drowstar.blogspot.com/2008/01/first-look-at-unreleased-kde400-with.html is linked in Groklaw's news section.
[19:31] <jackcy> sorry, forgot: working on pykde4 executable klxdvdrip.py - not the old test version.
[19:33] <Riddell> jackcy: I get *** glibc detected *** python: malloc(): memory corruption
[19:33] <Riddell> caused by the self.config.readConfig() line
[19:36] <Riddell> jackcy: why are you creating your own kconfig anyway?
[19:37] <jackcy> ok, when I delete it, the app is executable. Are config dialogs generated automatically as I interpete it out of the api docs?
[19:38] <jackcy> i wanted to autocreate one, but do not know how to call this dialog.
[19:38] <jackcy>  dialog->addPage(new General(0, "General"), i18n("General") );
[19:39] <jackcy> this is all info i have but how to translate it into python
[19:39] <jackcy> In the python-kde4-doc there is talk about pykdedocs but they are not installed out of "deb http://ppa.launchpad.net/kubuntu-members-kde4/ubuntu/ gutsy main". I think this would help me learning how to code. Anybody an idea where to find pykdedocs?
[19:40] <Riddell> jackcy: they're in python-kde4-doc
[19:44] <jackcy> Then I'll digg there. Yesterday it was either too late or i digged to deep 'cause i landed in the c++ class references.
[19:44] <jackcy> Thanks anyway and sorry to bother you.
[19:56] <alleeHardy> Hmm, fonts of  hardy ubiquity are much worser compared to KDE fonts: http://www.mpe.mpg.de/~ach/tmp/snapshot1.png
[20:00] <Riddell> jackcy: does klxdvdrip.kcfg_ compile for you?
[20:02] <jackcy> that file was a try to autogenerate the config dialog after i read the tutorials. but i could not get it to work with it, so i renamed it.
[20:03] <Riddell> jackcy: I think it needs a .kcfg file
[20:03] <Riddell> jackcy: but in a c++ app that gets compiled to c++, I don't know if it would work at all in pykde
[20:04] <Riddell> \sh_away: ping, any ideas?
[20:05] <jackcy> ok, so i think i will make the dialog by hand. at the moment there will only be about 10 options.
[20:06] <Riddell> jackcy: as I remember we added kconfig XT support to pykde for python-kde3 in kubuntu
[20:06] <Riddell> so I don't know if it'll work in python-kde4
[20:08] <Riddell> jackcy: the place to ask would be on the kdebindings list https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-bindings
[20:10] <_StefanS_> Jucato: oh my gawd your blog posts are long :)
[20:10] <Riddell> jackcy: or maybe this one better http://www.riverbankcomputing.com/mailman/listinfo/pyqt
[20:10] <jpatrick> _StefanS_: philosophy uni sudent thoughts ;)
[20:11] <jackcy> And there I will go - thanks a lot!
[20:11] <_StefanS_> probably ;)
[20:11] <yuriy> ubuntu email still not working.. am i missing something?
[20:12] <Riddell> yuriy: ask on #canonical-sysadmin
[20:14] <yuriy> also mornfall hasn't been around again for a few days and darcs is hanging on me :-\
[20:16] <Riddell> yuriy: he's on #kde-devel
[20:24] <_StefanS_> Riddell: is there a list of agreed changes due for kubuntu hardy ? (on wiki.ubuntu.org or something?)
[20:29] <Riddell> _StefanS_: https://wiki.kubuntu.org/KubuntuHardyCatchup
[20:29] <_StefanS_> Riddell: thanks
[20:32] <mornfall> yuriy: What's up?
[20:32] <mornfall> I have been quite busy this week, two exams yesterday, one tomorrow and a fair bit of job stuff today...
[20:33] <mornfall> have been and will be, anyway
[20:33] <mornfall> And need to do some administrative over the weekend.
[20:33] <mornfall> But ask away : - ).
[20:33] <DaSkreech> Hi mornfall
[20:34] <yuriy> mornfall: well, good luck with  your exams!
[20:34] <yuriy> have you had a chance to look at/apply my patches?
[20:34] <yuriy> i was trying to pull your latest change and merge it myself, but darcs hangs on "diffing dir"
[20:35] <mornfall> yuriy: Yes, we are having a conflict fight. I will resolve and re-record the changes myself, you should then unpull your patches and pull mine.
[20:35] <mornfall> (darcs 2 fixes that, but it's not stable yet)
[20:36] <yuriy> hmm ok so i'll wait
[20:36] <mornfall> Anyhow, conflict fight is bad regardless of darcs crashing.
[20:36] <mornfall> or spinning or whatever
[20:36] <mornfall> Probably 1 thing though...
[20:37] <mornfall> The comments you have added, I am not sure I see their value over what is already in the method name and parameters.
[20:37] <mornfall> I dislike redundant comments, because they *will* get out of date and they will be more confusing than useful. Or at least that is what tends to happen to me...
[20:39] <mornfall> /** Returns the string to be displayed for the given status */
[20:39] <mornfall>      QString statusString( PackageState s ) const {
[20:40] <mornfall> If I read the declaration, I already know everything that the comment says... Or am I wrong on that account?
[20:40] <yuriy> ok i might delete the overly obvious ones later. i find that any kind of description to make code faster to understand
[20:40] <yuriy> s/to make/makes
[20:43] <mornfall> I am not sure. But I usually get frustrated when reading comments that just duplicate what is plainly written in code, since they slow me down understanding code...
[20:43] <yuriy> kk, i'll refrain from those
[20:44] <DaSkreech> yuriy: self documentating coode is good
[20:44] <mornfall> Inside code: explain *why* something is done the way it is, not what is done (that is what code says).
[20:45] <mornfall> In declarations: explain what the method does, if it is not obvious. However, think about fixing a method that does something that is not obvious.
[20:45] <mornfall> (Rename, split, ...)
[20:45] <mornfall> That is what I am trying to do.
[20:46] <yuriy> ok
[20:46] <mornfall> Near classes, explanation makes oftentimes more sense, since they tend to be more complex than individual methods.
[20:47] <mornfall> Say MultiEditorBuddy could use a comment, however it could also use fixing to work better (eg. handling some keyboard shortcuts).
[20:48] <mornfall> I used to use left/right cursor arrows to expand/retract current item.
[20:48] <mornfall> It would also make sense to document how ExtendingEditorBuddy works and how is the constructor supposed to work. (Those are things that are probably not-so-obvious).
[20:49] <mornfall> (Ie. that you pass a view and delegate, and that the constructor will tell the view to use the delegate, so you don't call setItemDelegate on the view manually, and that you don't need to delete the Buddy, since it will be destroyed with the view automatically).
[20:50] <mornfall> These are also things that are fairly unlikely to change very soon.
[20:50] <mornfall> (Well, just an inspiration if you are in a mood to add comments).
[20:51] <yuriy> ok. i'll probably wait for you to merge stuff before further work though
[20:52] <mornfall> Ok, I'll better do that right away.
[20:52] <yuriy> well, exams first : )
[20:56] <yuriy> oh i think the motivation behind the "return string to be displayed" comment was that i didn't think it was obvious that it was the string used to display on screen, esp. since they weren't i18n'ed at the time
[20:57] <mornfall> True, but the i18n stuff should be fixed and it should be clear now. Hopefully, anyway.
[20:58] <mornfall> Exams can wait a little ; - ).
[21:16] <nixternal> howdy all
[21:16] <nixternal> just a couple more extragear packages to go
[21:32] <mornfall> yuriy: Hm. With setCurrentIndex( 1 ), did the view work as expected? Since for me, it selects the right item but does not display the widget...
[21:33] <mornfall> Ah, you did a fix in there as well.
[21:37] <iRon> Wow! My keyboard layout fixed at last on Hardy. Problem was solved by removing xserver-xorg-input-evdev..
[21:42] <DaSkreech> hi nixternal
[21:43] <nixternal> hiya DaSkreech
[21:43] <nixternal> so are you flying through chicago in a couple of weeks?
[21:43] <DaSkreech> nixternal: We will have  hardy packages in three days?
[21:43] <nixternal> we should have them sooner
[21:43] <DaSkreech> nixternal: If I can get another 50 dollars :)
[21:43] <DaSkreech> Is there a kubuntu4-desktop ?
[21:44] <DaSkreech>  Or kde4 ?
[21:44] <nixternal> oh man, if you haven't ordered your tickets yet, the price has more than likely gone up already
[21:44] <nixternal> dunno, Riddell would know better on that than I would
[21:45] <mornfall> yuriy: Now, can you try: mv adept-3 adept-3_bak, darcs get adept-3_bak adept-3, cd adept-3, darcs unpull --match '(author yuriy)' [answer y to all changes]; darcs pull http://anna.fi.muni.cz/~xrockai/adept-3
[21:45] <mornfall> yuriy: ?
[21:45] <yuriy> ok i'll try
[21:45] <mornfall> yuriy: I have tried to reconstruct most of your changes, sans the comments (although it may bee worth reinstating some of them).
[21:46] <mornfall> yuriy: I have also omitted disabling the unimplemented tabs. No idea what is best, but I guess I want to keep them like this for now. When we think out the interaction, it can be implemented...
[21:47] <DaSkreech> I'm off
[21:47] <mornfall> (I probably prefer to put helpful hints there (what the user should do to make them useful) instead of disabling them.)
[21:47] <yuriy> ah ok
[21:49] <nixternal> libqt4-sql covers what used to be libqt3-mt-sqlite correct?
[21:49] <yuriy> ok unpulling with verbose and it's on diffing dir again. let's see if it works
[21:49] <mornfall> It may take a little while, but should work.
[21:51] <yuriy> yep, there it goes
[21:53] <mornfall> Ahum.
[21:53] <yuriy> oh most of those patches weren't even showing up before
[21:54] <yuriy> ok thanks
[21:55] <mornfall> Pull again.
[21:55] <mornfall> Well, they should be what I have done in the last ~hour.
[21:56] <mornfall> You can check with the timestamps (whether they are the new ones or some older ones).
[21:56] <allee> Riddell: can you sync libkdcraw_0.1.3-1 from debian unstable?   (uses dcraw-8.81)    Or do I have to use a formal SYNC request on launchpad already?
[21:56] <mornfall> (say darcs changes --last 10)
[21:58] <Lure> allee: you need formal sync req, as it is used for track record
[21:58] <Lure> allee: but can be short
[21:58] <Lure> ;-)
[21:58] <Lure> allee: and Riddell can do both approval as well as sync it (great to have archive powers here) ;-)
[21:59] <allee> Lure:  I know :)
[22:00] <jpatrick> Lure: ah, I thought you meant you were part of ubuntu-archive now ;)
[22:16] <Riddell> allee: a quick bug report is appreciated
[22:18] <nixternal> Riddell: do you still want an extragear-plasma debdiff or should I just upload?
[22:19] <Riddell> nixternal: give me a debdiff and I can upload at the appropriate time
[22:19] <nixternal> http://www.nixternal.com/~rj/plasma.debdiff
[22:19] <nixternal> there you go
[22:19] <Riddell> thanks
[22:19] <nixternal> no prob
[22:19] <nixternal> one more to go and then do vorian's packages if they are good to go
[22:20] <jpatrick> massive source changes (?)
[22:21] <nixternal> between 3.98 and 4.0 with plasma? oh ya
[22:22] <allee> Lure: what's a quick report.    upstream and debian changelog + reason why to sync?
[22:22] <Riddell> nixternal: hmm, a diff -urN of the debian dirs would be better
[22:26] <nixternal> Riddell: roger
[22:27] <nixternal> Riddell: honestly, just uupdate -u the new tarball because there aren't any debian changes except for changelog
[22:28] <Riddell> nixternal: ok, thanks
[22:29] <Riddell> (not that I've ever used uupdate, but I get the idea :)
[22:29] <nixternal> hehe
[22:29] <nixternal> uupdate -u is much easier at updating packages imho and typically works every time
[22:30] <Riddell> what's the advantage compared to just copying the debian directory over and dch -i ?
[22:30] <nixternal> it will test the patches and what not, which is what I like
[22:30] <nixternal> if a patch doesn't work correctly it will let you know
[22:31] <nixternal> plus it was a couple commands shorter :p
[22:31] <nixternal> cd dir_of_old_pkg/ && uupdate -u ../new_pkg_tarball
[22:35] <Riddell> ah hah, a sensible posting on kubuntu-users (moaning about stupid K names)
[22:35] <nixternal> lol
[22:36] <Riddell> allee: synced
[22:36] <allee> Riddell: thx
[22:37] <nixternal> was it ever an inside joke to name apps with a K? I always thought that developers of each application just did it for ammusement back then? wonder what he will say when he realises that KDE 4 doesn't follow the old school way
[22:37] <allee> Riddell: as eventually my hardy laptop is now ready:   Any quick job/test for the next hour?
[22:37] <nixternal> I can't ever remember the mailing lists in 1996/1997 that said "hey, name your apps with a K in them"
[22:38]  * hunger thinks that stupid-k rule is pretty konvenient.
[22:38] <nixternal> guess what I am trying to say is that it was never a KDE decision, it was something people just started doing
[22:38] <Riddell> yes lazyness
[22:38] <nixternal> I like it honestly
[22:38] <Riddell> ah hunger, we were wondering if you knew why decibel breaks in kubuntu
[22:38] <nixternal> and it isn't like KDE is the only one to do it, there are Gnome apps that hint with the *g* just the same
[22:39] <hunger> Riddell: The name was decided on by the kde marketing team.
[22:39] <Riddell> hunger: and a very good name it is too, but it's the compile I was worried about
[22:40] <hunger> Riddell: Oh, dunno. Got the report, but was under the impression that it was due to some dependency?
[22:40] <Riddell> allee: work out why decibel compile breaks in kubuntu :)
[22:40] <hunger> Riddell: It did not build in a kde4 env for a while, but I did fix that several weeks ago.
[22:41] <Riddell> de.basyskom.simpleclient.textchannel.component installs to a different place
[22:41] <hunger> So I hope that is not the problem you are seeing:-)
[22:41] <Riddell> hunger: do you know what decides where that gets installed?
[22:41] <Riddell> DESTINATION ${COMPONENT_SEARCH_DIR}
[22:41] <Riddell> something different about that destination
[22:42] <hunger> Hmm... let me check...
[22:43] <Riddell> it's DATA_INSTALL_DIR in the top level CMakeLists.txt
[22:43] <Riddell> and that is set to "share" with FORCE in the line above in that CMakeLists.txt
[22:43] <Riddell> but presumably it doesn't get forced
[22:43] <hunger> It should go into share/Decibel/componets.
[22:44] <Riddell> SET(MAYOR_VERSION "0")  that looks like a typo
[22:44] <allee> Riddell: URL for the sources?
[22:44] <hunger> Are the other component files installed properly?
[22:44] <Riddell> allee: deb:decibel
[22:45] <Riddell> hunger: no, same issue
[22:46] <hunger> Let me check...
[22:46] <hunger> They do get installed properly for me.
[22:46] <Riddell> hunger: everything gets installed to usr/share/kde4/apps/ when it should be usr/share/
[22:47] <Riddell> and we do set -DDATA_INSTALL_DIR=/usr/share/kde4/apps so fair enough
[22:47] <Riddell> but why is it different between us and debian??
[22:49] <hunger> Riddell: Just fixed MAYOR:-)
[22:49] <hunger> Riddell: Thanks for the hint. My spelling sucks!
[22:50] <hunger> I am mostly working without KDE4 when developing decibel. Maybe the KDE stuff breaks things.
[22:50]  * hunger checks.
[22:51]  * hunger wonders whether there is a CMake debugger somewhere.
[22:54] <blizzzek> bye
[23:10] <hunger> Riddell: I removed all the FORCE from the main CMakeLists.txt. That seems to fix your issue.
[23:10] <hunger> I'll commit that change after making sure stuff still installs fine for me with it;-)
[23:11] <Riddell> hunger: hmm, really, even if -DDATA_INSTALL_DIR=/usr/share/kde4/apps is still used?
[23:12] <hunger> Riddell: If that is used the component stuff gets installed beneath that directory (in Decibel/componets iirc). Is that what you want?
[23:12] <Riddell> hunger: I don't think so, I think we just want it in /usr/share
[23:13] <Riddell> hunger: but the issue is that both debian and kubuntu use -DDATA_INSTALL_DIR=/usr/share/kde4/apps but it only takes effect in Kubuntu
[23:13] <Riddell> which is crazy
[23:14] <hunger> Can you add -DCOMPONENT_SEARCH_DIR=/usr/share/Decibel/componets? That should work after the force is removed.
[23:15] <bigon> there is another odd thing with decibel on debian de.basyskom.minigui.service is installed not on ubuntu
[23:15] <bigon> (according to http://launchpadlibrarian.net/11216622/buildlog_ubuntu-hardy-i386.decibel_0.5.0%2Bsvn737972-2_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz and http://experimental.debian.net/fetch.php?&pkg=decibel&ver=0.5.0%2Bsvn737972-2&arch=powerpc&stamp=1195781792&file=log&as=raw)
[23:15] <hunger> Maybe I should just rename DATA_INSTALL_DIR...
[23:15] <hunger> That might conflict with something used by KDE.
[23:16] <hunger> bigon: The minigui is build only if KDE4 is found.
[23:16] <bigon> same thing for the .desktop file btw
[23:16] <bigon> couldn't be a missing dependency that cause this path issue?
[23:17] <Riddell> ok, that makes sense, KDE 4 won't be found since it's hidden in /usr/lib/kde4/
[23:17] <Riddell> hunger: should we just install decibel to the same place as kde 4?
[23:18] <hunger> decibel does not require kde4, so the build system will not error out when it is not there. It will just skip some of the gui stuff.
[23:18] <hunger> s/some/all/;-)
[23:19] <bigon> doesn't some install path redefined in kde specific files? (/me know nothing about kde and cmake) :o
[23:20] <hunger> bigon: I think that is exactly what is happening.
[23:20] <Riddell> bigon: yes they will be, and we install kde 4 to a different location from debian (/usr/lib/kde4/) but it seems strange that /usr/share/kde4/apps is used since it's not where we put kde 4
[23:20] <Riddell> but it must be something to do with that
[23:23] <hunger> My guess is that one of the kde4 cmake magic files interferes. I try not to use anything not defined in my CMakeLists.txt files since I want decibel to build without kde4, but maybe some of my vars are getting overwritten.
[23:25]  * hunger has to log out soon. KDE3 in hardy is not the most stable here:-(
[23:25] <hunger> kded keeps running amok and I end up having to kill it occassionally. Unfortunately some apps no longer work properly afterwards,
[23:25] <allee_> Riddell: why is /usr/share/kde4/apps strange?  It´s in debian/cdbs/kde.mk of decibel
[23:26] <bigon> so how to tell decibel to look for kde4 in the ubuntu kde path?
[23:27] <hunger> bigou: Feed it a FindKDE4 that knows what to do:-) It should get installed along with KDE4 afaik.
[23:28] <Riddell> allee_: yes, but it doesn't affect Debian
[23:28] <hunger> BRB
[23:31] <hunger> kmail just blocks here... is that a known problem in hardy?
[23:32] <hunger> kded eats 99% of my CPU right after logging in. I guess that is what blocks kmail.
[23:33] <hunger> It asks for the kwallet passphrase and then nothing happens any more. kwalletmanager will not start either.
[23:33] <hunger> Any ideas?
[23:34] <bigon> there is a /usr/share/cmake-2.4/Modules/FindKDE4.cmake
[23:34] <bigon> so it should be found by cmake
[23:35] <Riddell> bigon: it probably still needs to know about the funny location we put kde 4 into
[23:36] <yuriy> bigon: for cmake you need -DCMAKE_INSTALL_DIR=/usr/lib/kde4
[23:36] <bigon> ok there is a #DEB_CMAKE_PREFIX = /usr/lib/kde4 I will try with commenting it out
[23:36] <yuriy> i don't know how that translates to packaging stuff
[23:36] <yuriy> s/DIR/PREFIX
[23:38] <hunger> kdewalletmanager starts after killing kded (with SIGKILL), but it does not find any wallet anymore.
[23:41] <allee_> i´m a bit confused about the CMakeLists.txt.  It looks like it tries to mimic configure --prefix=/usr  but does everything itself.  There must be a cmake template that has done this
[23:41]  * allee_ shudders  SO_VERSION = VERSION
[23:44] <bigon> great it even worse
[23:46] <bigon> in fact no, it find kde4 now
[23:46] <bigon> -- Installing /tmp/buildd/decibel-0.5.0+svn737972/debian/tmp/usr/lib/kde4/share/dbus-1/services/de.basyskom.decibel.log.service
[23:47] <hunger> Is kwallet currently broken?
[23:47] <hunger> I removed ~/.kde/share/apps/kwallet and kded does not run wild.
[23:48] <hunger> I grabbed a copy from backups from a month ago (where stuff worked fine) and kded runs amok again.
[23:49]  * hunger reboots.
[23:55] <mornfall> allee_: -DCMAKE_INSTALL_PREFIX
[23:55] <hunger> kded works fine till I enter my kwallet passwd. Then it eats all CPU cycles and nothing happens anymore.
[23:55] <allee_> mornfall: sounds reasonable ;)
[23:56] <allee_> mornfall: show do I get a list of variable?  I´ve found the command and modules lists, but not the variables :(
[23:57] <mornfall> allee_: Dunno. Try running ccmake instead of cmake.
[23:57] <mornfall> allee_: or cmake -L -N
[23:57] <bigon> :'(
[23:58]  * hunger goes to bed. Maybe kded will finish whatever it does till tomorrow morning... and maybe kwallet will work again then.
[23:58] <bigon> when setting -DCMAKE_INSTALL_PREFIX=/usr/lib/kde4 -- Installing /tmp/buildd/decibel-0.5.0+svn737972/debian/tmp/usr/lib/kde4/share/dbus-1/services/de.basyskom.decibel.log.service