/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2008/01/08/#ubuntu-motu.txt

joejaxxLaserJock: why? :\ that violates debian packaging policy does it not?00:00
ScottKminghua: I would imagine so, but I haven't looked to see if stuff if failing to build there or not.00:01
ScottKminghua: Situation should be identical.00:01
joejaxxhello ScottK minghua00:01
ScottKIn particular, their version of mime-tools doesn't have the same dependency as the newer one that just FTBFS for me.00:01
minghuajoejaxx: Not necessarily.  What is your kde4base-data version?00:01
* ScottK runs off to dinner.00:01
minghuaScottK: Let me have a look.00:01
minghuaScottK: Do you have another example (that builds arch:any packages)?  Mime-tools is arch:all.00:03
=== bigon is now known as bigon`
LaserJockjoejaxx: has that stopped people before? ;-)00:03
joejaxxLaserJock: transitional packages and conflicts are nice :)00:04
joejaxxminghua:   Installed: 3.94.0-0ubuntu100:05
TheMusojdong, nenolod, first tests with a basic headset and a jazz trio track reveal some mushiness. I need to encode a track with iTunes, faac, and have an uncompressed version as well to do some real testing with my good headphones.00:05
joejaxxLaserJock: yeah but it werid to me to see that lol :P00:06
joejaxxLaserJock: weird*00:06
joejaxxthat is one of the reasons i have not uploaded a -settings package00:07
minghuajoejaxx: I wonder if there is any versioned conflicts/replaces between kde4base-data and other packages.00:07
joejaxxbecause packages are not supposed to do that00:07
joejaxxminghua: i wish there was00:07
joejaxxbut it would want to remove those packages if it did00:07
minghuajoejaxx: So you checked there wasn't?00:08
joejaxxReplaces: kdelibs5-data (<< 3.93.0-0ubuntu1~ppa1), kde4multimedia-data (<< 3.93.0-0ubuntu1~ppa1)00:08
joejaxxConflicts: kde4multimedia-data (<< 3.93.0-0ubuntu1~ppa1)00:08
joejaxxwth is ppa doing in there?00:08
minghuajoejaxx: You are installing an auto-backported package, versioned relations may well be broken.00:08
minghuaWell...00:09
joejaxxstuff in -backports is automatically backported?00:09
joejaxxlol wth?00:09
* minghua checks the hardy version.00:09
* LaserJock hands joejaxx some wth pills ;-)00:09
minghuajoejaxx: auto-backported after manual checking/confirming.00:09
joejaxxit seems hacky for us to be doing that lol00:09
joejaxxminghua: sure :)00:10
LaserJockjoejaxx: umm, that's backports00:10
=== Pici` is now known as Pici
joejaxxLaserJock: that stinks :\00:10
minghuaHah.  There is *no* hardy version of kde4base.  It must have been backported from PPA. :-)00:10
joejaxx:(00:11
joejaxxi thought that was the whole point of the debian packaging policy00:11
joejaxxto stop things like this from happening00:11
joejaxxlol00:11
joejaxxnot to go around it :\00:11
LaserJockI get kde4 from ~kubuntu-members-kde4 PPA00:11
joejaxxyeah00:11
LaserJockbut it's got some issues still presently00:11
joejaxxthe archive should be in a more stable state than a ppa :P00:12
joejaxxpackage wise00:12
joejaxxsince it is official :D00:12
LaserJockwell, it's -backports00:12
LaserJockthere's only like a couple people that work on it00:12
minghuajoejaxx: I think you need the 3.95.0-0ubuntu1~gutsy1 version of kde4base-data in -backports for everything to work properly.00:12
minghuajoejaxx: However it currently FTFBS.00:12
joejaxxLaserJock: i do not know what to say :(00:14
=== Spec is now known as x-spec-t
minghuaIf you don't like the status of -backports, join the team to work on it. :-)00:14
joejaxxlol i am not motu :(00:14
* minghua personally won't touch -backports without a pole.00:14
LaserJockjoejaxx: it doesn't take being a motu00:15
minghuaYou don't need to be an MOTU to work on -backports.00:15
minghuaJust ask jdong. :-P00:15
joejaxxminghua: i am more worried about the DPP and the state of the archive's integrity00:15
joejaxx:\00:15
minghuaDPP?00:15
LaserJockhehe00:15
joejaxxdebian packaging policy00:16
LaserJockthere are way bigger issues than a FTBFS and a slightly broken package to worry about00:16
minghuaOh.  It's usually called just "Debian Policy".00:16
joejaxxoh ok00:16
LaserJockit just needs to get fixed, that's all00:17
LaserJockhappens all the time00:17
joejaxxlol00:17
minghuaWe still get "can't install, broken dependencies" bugs against gutsy once in a while, and don't have enough manpower to fix them, let alone gutsy-backcports.00:18
LaserJockjoejaxx: check out http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/debcheck/ for instance00:21
HobbseeTheMuso: ping00:22
TheMusoHobbsee: pong00:22
joejaxxLaserJock: :(00:23
* Hobbsee wishes they wouldn't automatically crackport kde4.00:23
joejaxxHobbsee: :)00:25
Hobbseeheya joejaxx!00:25
LaserJockwell, there's KDE4 packages flying everywhere00:25
joejaxxhi00:25
LaserJockit's hard to know what to use00:25
joejaxxofficial repos! :D00:25
joejaxxlol00:25
HobbseeLaserJock: not crackports.00:26
joejaxxlolol00:26
HobbseeLaserJock: kde4 ppa is better, iirc00:26
joejaxxwill it fix my broken package system ? :D00:26
joejaxxlol00:26
azeemhuh, I've been reading `crackpot' all the way00:26
joejaxxazeem: LOL00:26
joejaxxah interesting00:26
LaserJockjoejaxx: well, kinda00:27
joejaxxthe launchpad buildds remove packages00:27
joejaxxwhere is this magically package fixing ppa?00:27
joejaxx:(00:27
* joejaxx is not going to use his ppa until the remove package option is implemented :D00:29
joejaxx:P00:29
* joejaxx is bored00:29
joejaxx:(00:29
LaserJockjoejaxx: what the heck are you talking about?00:30
joejaxxthe kde4 ppa00:30
joejaxxthat everyone is talking about00:30
LaserJockshould be https://launchpad.net/~kubuntu-members-kde4/+archive00:31
LaserJockbut it's not all the way updated yet, but it does seem to work a bit better00:31
joejaxxgah00:34
LaserJockjoejaxx: what are you wanting to install?00:36
joejaxxkde400:36
LaserJockwell, how much of it?00:36
joejaxxjust the DE00:36
LaserJockwell, you can probably just do kdebase then00:37
joejaxxyeah i really do not know what to install package wise i just followed the instructions on the kubuntu website00:38
LaserJockhttp://kubuntu.org/announcements/kde4-rc2.php ?00:38
joejaxxi have not used kde since version 1.000:39
joejaxxno not that one there was another one00:39
LaserJockI think the link I gave is the latest and probably best to go on00:40
joejaxxyeah00:40
joejaxxbah00:40
joejaxxi need to for apt to remove these packages now00:41
joejaxxforce*00:41
joejaxxfun00:44
joejaxxhello minghua00:44
joejaxxMatthewV: *00:44
MatthewVhi joejaxx00:44
ScottKminghua: How about libmail-box-perl00:45
joejaxxoh perl00:45
joejaxx:)00:45
joejaxxperl is fun00:45
ScottKminghua: Oops.  That's arch all too00:45
ScottKjoejaxx: You got the first two letters right.00:45
joejaxxLOL00:46
joejaxxbah00:49
joejaxxthis is hacky00:49
jscinoz_persia are you here?00:54
minghuaScottK: Right. So there were never built in sbuild for Debian.00:55
ScottKOK.  So it won't hit Debian until it hits an arch:any package?00:56
slangasekin terms of sbuild, yes00:58
jscinoz_hmm00:59
jscinoz_are any of you guys familiar with the licensing on the quake3 SDK?01:00
DarkMageZdidn't the quake 3 engine get gpl'ed?01:01
joejaxxthat is what i thought01:01
joejaxxyeap01:02
joejaxxthe source for quake 3 is gpl01:02
joejaxxjoejaxx@venus:~/Desktop$ head -n 2 quake3-1.32b/COPYING.txt01:04
joejaxx                    GNU GENERAL PUBLIC LICENSE01:04
joejaxx                       Version 2, June 199101:04
joejaxx:)01:04
jscinoz_hmm01:04
jscinoz_im packaging a supposedly gpl game, UrbanTerror that is based on the quake 3 engine, however it includes a very non-GPL license of the "Quake3 SDK"01:05
joejaxxinteresting01:05
jscinoz_this is what persia said about it01:06
jscinoz_"Given that ID licenses this with an explicit prohibition to not "disassemble, reverse engineer, decompile, modify or alter the Software including, without limitation, creating or developing extra or add-on levels for the Software;", I’m not convinced FrozenSand LLC has the right to distribute this."01:06
joejaxxoh ok01:06
joejaxxkde4 is installing :)01:08
jscinoz_hmm01:09
* minghua agrees with persia.01:09
joejaxxi wonder where they got that from01:09
joejaxxjscinoz_: how old is this game?01:10
jscinoz_im packaging the release from 20th of dec 200701:10
jscinoz_so not old at all01:10
joejaxxbbl going use kde for the first time since 199801:10
joejaxx:)01:10
jscinoz_argh01:10
jscinoz_what should my preinst script be called to have it automatically executed before installation?01:11
minghuapreinst is the correct name.01:11
jscinoz_thanks01:13
joejaxxuh oh01:14
joejaxxall i see is a background lol01:15
zulheylo01:18
joejaxxhello01:18
* joejaxx is having fun with trying to get the kde4 de to run correctly :)01:18
bddebianHeya01:26
joejaxxhi01:28
joejaxxi got kwin to run :)01:28
bddebianHi joejaxx, congrats :)01:28
joejaxxand i used xterm -display :001:28
joejaxxso now i have a terminal01:28
joejaxxlol01:28
joejaxxand that is it01:28
joejaxxX Error: BadDrawable (invalid Pixmap or Window parameter)01:29
ScottKBut it's a KDE4 terminal, so that makes it totally cool.01:29
joejaxxScottK: :)01:29
nenolodjscinoz_, that license is outdated, cause urbanterror runs on ioquake3 now01:43
jscinoz_hmm01:44
jscinoz_thats what i though01:44
jscinoz_do any sections of the game remain under ID softwares copyright?01:44
jscinoz_because persia also mentions "9) debian/copyright is fairly comprehensive, but still fails to mention that portions of the code are copyright Id Software. Might also be nice to have explicit licensing for the packaging."01:45
slangaseknenolod: why does upse-audiacious only Recommend: audacious instead of depending on it?  Is it somehow useful without the application?02:02
=== Ibalon is now known as zakame
jscinoz_what exit code would need to be in my preinst screen to make it cancel the package installation02:05
slangasekany non-zero exit code02:05
jscinoz_i tried that02:05
jscinoz_1 and 2 both continued installation02:05
slangasekthen your preinst isn't reaching that exit statement02:06
jscinoz_can i pastebin it, its only 16lins02:06
jscinoz_lines*02:06
slangaseksure02:06
slangasek(I don't think there's a line limit on pastebin, anyway?)02:07
jscinoz_no, but i wouldnt want someoen to go over a huge amount of script :P02:07
jscinoz_http://pastebin.ubuntu-nl.org/51167/02:07
slangasekjscinoz_: well, the comparison with "$RET" is going to be case-sensitive; I think it's supposed to be lower case02:08
slangasek(I had a doubt about this last time you showed this script, but neglected to comment)02:08
jscinoz_hmm02:08
jscinoz_one second02:09
jscinoz_yep that works02:10
jscinoz_one other thing02:10
jscinoz_see how it echoes that the user didnt accept the license, if the package is installed via a graphical tool (ie synaptic or gdebi-gtk) is that still going to show up?02:11
slangasekit's going to show up wherever the rest of the console output goes02:11
jscinoz_would it be better to call an info template?02:11
slangasekI don't think so02:11
slangasekI think the license prompt, with a clear explanation that refusing the license will abort the installation, is all you should need02:12
jscinoz_ok thanks02:12
Romney08Launch A New Type Of Marshall Plan Unifying Nonmilitary Sources Of Power To Support Moderate Muslims. As President, Governor Romney will call together our Middle East allies and the major nations of the developed world to establish a "Partnership for Progress and Prosperity."02:12
Romney08This Partnership will assemble the resources of all developed nations to assure that threatened Islamic states have public schools, micro-credit and banking, the rule of law, human rights, basic health care, and competitive economic policies. Resources would be drawn from public and private institutions, and from volunteers and NGOs.02:12
slangasek!ops | Romney0802:12
ubotuRomney08: Help! Hobbsee, Riddell, sladen, fbond, mneptok, gnomefreak, Seveas, dholbach, elkbuntu or PriceChild!02:12
jscinoz_in the changelog, is (LP: #179646) the correct format for saying which bug the package closes?02:14
ScottKYes02:15
Romney08GOVERNOR ROMNEY: "Are we going to stay ahead of the world, are we going to lead the world, or are we going to instead pull up the drawbridge and try to hang on to everything we've got and say we can't compete with the world?" (Ryan J. Halliday, "Romney Defends His Health-Care Plan," Nashua Telegraph, 6/7/07)02:15
Romney08GOVERNOR ROMNEY: "[W]e face a much tougher competitor or group of competitors coming from Asia than we've ever faced before. Asia is tough. There are a lot of Asians. They are hard working people. And they’re going to give us a run for our money in terms of our economic vitality." (Governor Mitt Romney, Remarks At The Club For Growth, 3/29/07)02:15
jscinoz_go away kthn02:17
=== jscinoz_ is now known as jscinoz
jscinozslangasek, when i make the install end via the exit status 1 in preinst, do i need to do anything to clean up after that?02:18
slangasekjscinoz: nope - if the preinst fails, there's nothing to clean up because that's the first step of installing a package02:18
slangasekHobbsee: hi, you may want to summarily execute Romney08's connection02:20
* Fujitsu would agree with slangasek.02:20
* ScottK too02:20
elkbuntucs kb Romney0802:20
elkbuntustupid / key :(02:20
FujitsuThanks elkbuntu.02:20
ScottKelkbuntu: Thanks02:20
Hobbseeslangasek: right, sorry.02:20
slangasekheh, no worries02:21
minghuaelkbuntu: Maybe -devel too.  He appeared there as well.02:21
slangasekTBH, that's the weirdest bit of political spam I've ever seen02:21
Hobbseenuked02:21
jscinozlol02:21
slangasekhum, cheers, whoever that was02:22
azeemRomney08 is still in #u, btw02:22
Hobbseeyou're welcome02:22
Hobbseetoo slow, apparently02:23
Hobbseeelkbuntu: did you get him in there?02:23
joejaxxelkbuntu: ! :D02:23
elkbuntuhi joejaxx! :)02:24
joejaxx:)02:24
joejaxxi just wiped my install02:24
joejaxxgiving kde4 another chance :)02:24
elkbuntuheh02:25
elkbuntui'm not even going to bother until at least one point release02:25
joejaxx:)02:25
joejaxxelkbuntu: i have not used kde since version 1.002:26
joejaxxlol02:26
elkbuntujoejaxx, every time i go to use kde, i want to make it work like gnome, so i just give up and go back to the devil i know ;)02:26
ScottKjoejaxx: KDE 4.0 is not even feature complete.  If you really want to try KDE, either try KDE 3.5 or wait for 4.1.02:26
joejaxxlol :)02:26
joejaxxScottK: i do not like 3.5 :\02:27
ScottKThen I'd wait unless you just want to play around.02:27
joejaxxoh ok02:27
ScottKA lot of apps aren't ported or the ports aren't complete.02:27
FujitsuScottK: What was the rationale for leaving the completeness to a point-release? Just so they could say they got KDE4 out the door early?02:27
joejaxxit is installing already so i might as well02:28
joejaxxFujitsu: is it not late? i thought it was supposed to be released in december02:28
imbrandonFujitsu: 4.0 wasent supose to ever be feature complete02:28
ScottKFujitsu: I think it was that the KDE APIs are stable enough to reliably develop on, so call it 4.0 for API stability, but dunno.02:28
Fujitsuimbrandon: Well that's silly.02:28
imbrandon( and its late not early )02:28
imbrandonFujitsu: no, api stability for porting apps02:28
Fujitsujoejaxx: Well, not *too* late, then.02:28
minghuaThere was a long blog post from a KDE dev talking about this.02:29
imbrandonsame happened with kde 3 and kde 202:29
imbrandon:)02:29
minghuahttp://aseigo.blogspot.com/2008/01/talking-bluntly.html02:29
ScottKWhich is why I think this "we have to focus on KDE4 so no Kubuntu LTS" seems really odd to me.02:29
joejaxxis that why some of the versioning is still 3.9x?02:29
ScottKSince the final isn't released yet02:29
wolfgerCan somebody help me figure where I went wrong with debhelper?02:29
minghuaWorth reading, though I'm not sure I agree with their rationale, at least you know what they think about it.02:29
ScottKDefinitely worth reading.02:30
ScottKwolfger: Probably, but we'll need some details.02:30
FujitsuScottK: It sounds strange that we're dropping LTS because of some incomplete preview.02:30
wolfgerScottK: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/51169/02:30
ScottKFujitsu: Absolutely.02:30
* Hobbsee sets a ban on *!*@*!#ubuntu-ops02:31
joejaxxyay02:31
joejaxxall ban02:31
FujitsuBetter to do that in #ubuntu, I think. That would make #ubuntu-ops happy.02:31
Hobbseehehe02:33
ScottKwolfger: I'm in the middle of stuff, so don't really have time to look.  I'd suggest also pastebinning your debian/rules02:33
wolfgerok, I'll do that, and probably pick back up tomorrow...02:34
joejaxxhmm02:48
joejaxxkde4 is not dual screen aware02:48
joejaxxfun02:48
StevenKjoejaxx: That's a "feature"02:52
DarkMageZjoejaxx, file a bug in the kde bug tracker =D this soon to release would trip them out =D02:52
joejaxxlol02:53
StevenK"We have spent so long writing KDE 4 all of us lost our jobs and can't afford dual screen setups any more."02:54
* StevenK hides02:54
joejaxxLol02:54
ion_Typical to KDE, somewhere among the thousands of checkboxes there’s one labeled “disable multiscreen support” and it’s checked by default. ;-)02:54
joejaxxthe system config for kde4 is not launching  for me02:54
joejaxxand plasma looks like it is in 8bit mode02:55
DarkMageZyou can launch it from the command line02:55
StevenKThe system is not configurable in KDE 4.02:55
DarkMageZ/usr/lib/kde4/bin/systemsettings02:55
joejaxxDarkMageZ: command??02:55
joejaxxok02:55
* StevenK waits for ScottK to snap.02:55
joejaxxwow02:55
joejaxxthat worked02:55
DarkMageZkde4's rc2 reminds me of microsoft's alpha's.02:56
* RAOF boggles quietly02:56
joejaxxDarkMageZ: it worked when i logged out03:00
joejaxxand logged back in03:00
DarkMageZsounds like "restart your computer" as far as i'm concerned.03:01
joejaxxyeah03:02
joejaxxalso when i hit log out on the menu03:03
joejaxxit brings up the log out dialog03:03
joejaxxwhich makes no sense to me since the other options are available right under log out on the menu03:03
joejaxxi need to find out what resolution this is running in03:04
joejaxxxrandr is broken because of Xinerama03:04
joejaxxanyone have any suggestions? :)03:08
joejaxx:P03:08
joejaxxhello Toadstool :D03:08
joejaxxhey LaserJock03:14
LaserJockhmm03:14
LaserJockI can't seem to get pbuilder-dist to work03:15
LaserJockhas anybody used it lately?03:16
joejaxxis packages.debian.org down for anyone else?03:23
LaserJockdown for me03:25
nenolodslangasek, there are other programs which can load audacious plugins and use them03:32
minghuapackages.d.o is up here, FWIW.03:32
nenolodslangasek, however, you are indeed correct, upse-audacious should probably be a Depends:03:34
nenolodslangasek, i'll fix it when i upload 0.503:34
nenolod:D03:34
ion_Could i get a second advocation for http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=hardware-connected (a program that checks whether given hardware is connected to the system, useful for scripting)? Thanks.03:38
jscinozcan anyone see any references to GPLv3 on either of these manpages (http://pastebin.ubuntu-nl.org/51174/) (http://pastebin.ubuntu-nl.org/51173/), persia says there is one that i need to change, but i cant see it anywhere in them03:43
nenolodion_, package looks fine. if debian import freeze wasn't in effect, i'd say it might be easier just to submit it to debian03:43
nenolodion_, at any rate, not a motu, so can't advocate ;p03:44
LaserJocknenolod: I don't think that DIF should dissuade people from getting packages into Debian03:44
nenolodLaserJock, well i mean putting it in debian as a way to put it in ubuntu03:45
nenolodLaserJock, although he could do a sync bug03:45
LaserJockyep03:45
nenolodnobody answered my question though about collateral examples of work when applying to be a MOTU though03:45
ion_To submit it to Debian, do i need to get someone to sign up as its maintainer? I’m not running Debian anywhere.03:45
nenolode.g. does stuff in Debian that is in Ubuntu count as collateral examples of work? ;p03:46
nenolodion_, not really03:47
nenolodion_, it's fully possible to maintain packages in debian and use ubuntu -- all you need to do is make sure they build on sid03:47
nenolodion_, you can make a pbuilder to accomplish that ;)03:48
ion_True...03:48
minghuanenolod: I would disagree.  I think it's quite irresponsible if the maintainer doesn't use the package (in the intended system) him/herself.03:49
nenolodminghua, well, i run a debian desktop on alpha and ubuntu on amd64 for multilib03:49
nenolodminghua, it's a pretty nice alpha, and i do test my packages, but the amd64 is much faster ;)03:49
minghuanenolod: I am talking about "all you need to do is make sure they build on sid".03:50
minghuanenolod: I think it's bad advice.03:50
nenolodminghua, hmm, thinking about it, i agree03:50
nenolodminghua, i would think testing it somehow is implied though (e.g. pbuilder --login, vmware, etc)03:51
minghuanenolod: Yeah, brief testing is good enough for me, as long as you also use it in some similar system (Ubuntu, or Debian stable/testing).03:52
nenolodminghua, yeah. of course, i don't use the upse package (i build the upse package using an hg snapshot for local use)03:52
nenolod:P03:52
nenolodminghua, but i do test the package before i send it off03:53
minghuanenolod: Running a newer version can be excused. :-)03:54
nenolodonce i start packaging my playstation emulator, it'll be the same thing. ;)03:54
minghuaBy "use it", I mean the package, not necessarily the same version.03:54
wasabiHiya! Looking for the help on how to request a merge in this day and age.03:55
nenolodminghua, at any rate, i'm still wondering if work in debian counts as evidence of packaging quality in MOTU. ;)03:55
LaserJocknenolod: it definitely can be taken into consideration03:55
nenolodok, groovy.03:56
nenolodbecause i maintain some amount of packages (13 at the moment) in debian, and 8 of them are in ubuntu03:56
nenolod;)03:56
minghuanenolod: It is.  Debian work was an big part of the reasons in my application to MOTU.03:57
nenolod  + pulseaudio support patches for audacious (my only major work in Ubuntu only atm)03:57
minghuanenolod: Though the application procedure then was pretty different than what it is now...03:57
nenolodminghua, yes, that's why i am wondering03:57
nenolodoh well, i'll apply in a couple of months then, as i get more ubuntu-specific work done03:59
nenolodi should probably poke somebody to look at fixing ia32-libs again :D04:00
guest22I'd like to request a review of http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=photoml  It's already been advocated once (the previous upload, at least), so it should be very close to being acceptable.04:22
=== ember_ is now known as ember
=== boomer` is now known as boomer
ScottKStevenK: You've missed it by years.05:01
* StevenK whistles innocently.05:02
Hobbseewha'ts he missed?05:03
ScottK[21:55] * StevenK waits for ScottK to snap.05:03
* ScottK goes to be now.05:04
ScottKbe/bed05:04
ScottKUrgh.05:04
FujitsuThere was some nice KDE4 criticisum above.05:04
Fujitsu*criticism05:04
Hobbseeah right05:04
HobbseeFujitsu: well, yeah, tha'ts known05:04
ScottKI would say Kubuntu criticism.  I understand why KDE is doing what it's doing.05:04
* Fujitsu shoots people who still use .htm in this day and age, thus causing the world to explode when one drops index.htm from DirectoryIndex declarations.05:04
* Hobbsee is looking forward to the final packages being done soon, so that they can actually be fixed to not die when attempting to install.05:05
ScottKI don't understand why Kubuntu going out of it's way to hang out a sign that says "For 'enthusiasts' only"05:05
ScottKGood night.05:05
FujitsuScottK: This looked like more general KDE.05:05
FujitsuNight ScottK.05:05
ion_fujitsu: A bunch of packages ubuntu-desktop depends on install .jpg files. :-P05:08
joejaxxi am back :)05:59
joejaxxis anyone else? :D05:59
parthanjoejaxx, doesn't fluxbuntu support non-free drivers?06:09
joejaxxparthan: ?06:12
joejaxxsure06:13
joejaxxwhy?06:13
joejaxx:)06:17
joejaxx:(06:20
joejaxx!monologue06:20
ubotuSorry, I don't know anything about monologue - try searching on http://ubotu.ubuntu-nl.org/factoids.cgi06:20
parthanjoejaxx, because if i have to use it here, i need help of some non-free divers ;)06:27
parthanjoejaxx, and also because the website reads "Fluxbuntu is 100% Free Software" ;)06:32
dholbachgood morning06:58
FujitsuHi dholbach.06:59
FujitsuOops.06:59
FujitsuWrong button.06:59
dholbachFujitsu: you have a "Hi dholbach" button somewhere? :)07:00
Hobbseeno, of course not07:00
FujitsuNo, I haven't cut my nails in a while, and hit the up button or something similar :P07:00
Hobbseehe has a "Hi $last_person_that_entered"07:00
dholbachHobbsee: a "Hi dholbach" button would be much cooler :)07:01
FujitsuHobbsee: That's a good idea, actually.07:01
Hobbseedholbach: not scalable, though07:01
wallyweekg'morning all07:11
=== asac_ is now known as asac
ChrisGibbsgday all07:27
wallyweekg'morning all!07:36
=== Sp4rKy_ is now known as Sp4rKy
wallyweekanyone wishing to review online?07:57
AnAntpersia: hello08:11
AnAntpersia: thanks for reviewing the ubuntume artwork packages, I need to ask you some questions though08:12
AnAntcan anyone help me with gconf ?08:21
AnAntI am doing a gconf-defaults file in debian package, one of the keys I want to modify is of type list08:33
AnAnthow do I write it's entry in gconf-defaults ?08:33
AnAnt<keyname> ["value"] ?08:33
huatsmorning everyone08:33
dholbachAnAnt:08:34
dholbachoops08:34
dholbach /desktop/gnome/interface/gtk_theme      Human08:34
dholbach /desktop/gnome/interface/icon_theme     Human08:34
dholbach /desktop/gnome/peripherals/mouse/cursor_theme   Human08:34
AnAntdholbach: thanks for reviewing the packages08:34
dholbachfrom /usr/share/gconf/defaults/16_ubuntu-artwork08:34
dholbachheya huats08:34
dholbachAnAnt: no problem08:34
huatshey dholbach08:35
AnAntdholbach: yes, but all those keys are of string type, not list08:35
dholbachah, hang on08:35
AnAntdholbach: oh, I found it in update-gconf-defaults man page, thanks08:35
dholbach /apps/compiz/plugins/scale/allscreens/options/initiate_edge             []08:35
dholbachis the best I found :)08:35
AnAntyeah it's: <key> [value1,value2]08:36
AnAntdholbach: how should I indicated the GPL version for package license ?08:43
dholbachAnAnt: You need to refer to whatever license the upstream tarball contains08:44
dholbachAnAnt: or do you mean a license for the packaging?08:44
AnAntdholbach: license for packaging indeed08:45
dholbachI'm not sure the archive admins want a copy of the GPL shipped just because your packaging is under the GPL08:45
dholbachI normally don't license my packaging separately08:45
AnAnt?08:47
AnAntI don't understand08:47
dholbachbest to ask in #ubuntu-devel (the archive admins will be around there) if you need to ship a copy of $license for your packaging08:48
dholbachI never added the "Packaging is licensed under $license" note08:48
AnAntdholbach: GPL is already existing in /usr/share/common-licenses/08:48
dholbachnormally the archive admins want the upstream tarball to contain a copy of whatever license it is under08:49
AnAntdholbach: I think you got me wrong08:50
dholbachok... maybe you can re-phrase your question08:50
AnAntdholbach: you said in your review "Please specify which version of the GPL applies to the packaging"08:50
dholbachAnAnt: do you have the link somewhere?08:52
AnAntdholbach: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=ubuntume-gdm-themes (point #3)08:52
dholbachoh http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=usplash-theme-ubuntume - I'm not Emmet :)08:52
dholbachpersia is Emmet Hikory :)08:52
dholbachin http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/usplash-theme-ubuntume-0801071011/usplash-theme-ubuntume-1.1/debian/copyright you say: "The Debian packaging is (C) 2007, أحمد المحمودي (Ahmed El-Mahmoudy)08:53
dholbach<aelmahmoudy@users.sourceforge.net> and is licensed under the GPL, see08:53
dholbach`/usr/share/common-licenses/GPL'."08:53
AnAntoh ok08:53
dholbachpersia wants to know which version of the GPL you are talking about08:53
AnAnt-2 or -3 ?08:54
dholbachright08:54
AnAntI don't know the difference08:54
AnAntwell, I'll ask him about that later08:54
AnAntdholbach: as for your comment on UbuntuME-v0.1, actually the package has several themes08:55
dholbachI can't spare you the pain of reading up on those license08:56
AnAntdholbach: 3 themes08:56
dholbachAnAnt: what happens if I choose v0.1 and you decide to ship v0.2 in the next release?08:56
AnAntdholbach: in the next release I'm supposed to keep v0.1 too08:57
dholbachok08:57
AnAntdholbach: actually UbuntuME-v0.1 is an old GDM theme indeed08:57
AnAntdholbach: I prefer that the upstream would give them names indeed08:57
dholbachok... I just wanted to know what your thoughts are08:57
AnAntdholbach: but he got a new life (job & marriage), so he's pretty tied up those days08:58
AnAntdholbach: ok, thanks a lot for your help08:58
AnAntI'll be working on the points mentioned08:59
dholbachok great - thanks :)08:59
* dholbach -> dogwalk08:59
AnAntbye08:59
=== \sh_away is now known as \sh
\shmoins09:18
BugMaNhi \sh!09:18
Ngin relation to the hardy schedule, when is the last realistic point for getting a new little package into universe?09:32
slangasekyou should plan to have it done prior to feature freeze09:33
DaveMorriswhich is when?09:33
Ngslangasek: k, thanks :)09:33
NgDaveMorris: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardyReleaseSchedule09:34
DaveMorristhanks09:34
DaveMorrissince it revu day, my package still require revu.  All previous comments have been addressed - http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=libserial09:34
Ngah and it's February 14th, so that means hardy stops getting new love on valentine's day ;)09:34
astharotgood morning :)09:37
liriin an attempt to recover the revu password I get "gpg -d <<EOT ; echo Now paste the text below, and enter EOT<return>" and nothing else, any ideas?09:38
gesergood morning09:39
wallyweekanyone to review http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=sdlmame before revu day ends? thank you! :)09:43
wallyweekwe should be near advocation, please help me upload it before featurefreeze09:44
* rzr advertises for this snd app : http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=jaaa10:02
=== astharot is now known as astharot_
=== astharot_ is now known as astharot
* wallyweek knows is quite annoying but calls once again for reviews on his package http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=sdlmame10:36
=== \sh is now known as \sh_away
slangasekpochu: hmm, how does installing liboobs-1-4 break gnome-system-tools << 2.21.4, when that version of gnome-system-tools depends on liboobs-1-3?10:58
=== persia changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: Masters of the Universe: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | Want to get involved with the MOTUs? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | Unmet Deps time! http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/debcheck/ | QA resources from http://qa.ubuntuwire.com
* persia thanks slangasek for the comprehensive announcement11:00
Hobbseeyay, it's not revu day now!11:00
slangasekpersia: I am occasionally capable of learning from past mistakes11:00
pochuslangasek: g-s-t 2.21.3-0ubuntu1 depends on liboobs-1-4 (>= 2.21.2.1) here.11:04
pochuslangasek: and there's a typo in the changelog, shold read << 2.6.23:11:05
pochuBreaks: gnome-system-tools (<< 2.21.3)11:06
geserpochu: Hi, are you going to merge mono-tools from Debian unstable? mono-tools doesn't build on hardy anymore (fixed in Debian)11:06
pochuerr, 2.21.3 :)11:06
pochugeser: I'll do it when I have some time if you don't do it first ;) so please do it yourself if you can11:06
slangasekpochu: but 2.21.3-0ubuntu1 is not << 2.21.3 which is what the breaks is; so this appears to force deconfiguration of the old version of gnome-system-tools, which doesn't depend on liboobs-1-4 at all...11:21
persiaStevenK: Given the imminent promotion to main, does bug #180624 interest you?11:31
ubotuLaunchpad bug 180624 in cheese "cheese new upstream version 0.3.0" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/18062411:31
StevenKHrm, not really.11:33
jscinozRAWR11:34
jscinozhey everyone11:34
persiaOK.  Kicking for standard reasons then :)11:34
persiajscinoz: /usr/share/common-licenses/GPL is GPL 3.11:34
jscinozoh? on gutsy it shows gpl211:34
persiajscinoz: In gutsy is it GPL 2.11:34
jscinozah11:35
jscinozso i should ref /usr/share/common-licenses/GPL-2 then :P11:35
StevenKpersia: I'll leave it to lool.11:35
jscinozpersia have you had a chance to redownload the package?11:36
persiaStevenK: Makes sense, just as matter of highlighting it to your attention given the list in your MIR.11:36
liripersia: I'm having some troubles recovering the revu website password for my account.11:36
jscinozbecause im not sure if the ftp server was down when you tried to uscan, because it seems to be working now11:36
persiajscinoz: Err..  I was avoiding that :)  I'll grab again and test the watch files.11:36
jscinoz:P11:36
persialiri: Have you uploaded something to REVU yet?11:36
jscinozi could just pastebin you the watch file itself11:36
jscinozwouldnt that be enough to test the uscan?11:36
liripersia: yes I have.11:37
persiajscinoz: Actually, I can just grab it from REVU, which means I only have to download it once.  Thanks for reminding me :)11:37
liripersia: when recovering the revu password I get "gpg -d <<EOT ; echo Now paste the text below, and enter EOT<return>" and nothing else, any ideas?11:37
jscinozok :P11:37
jscinoz"4) debian/copyright fails to mention files copyright Id software" are you wanting me to state specifically which files are copyright ID?11:37
persialiri: There is no text?  Hrm.  That bug has appeared before, but I don't happen to remember the cause.  When did you join ubuntu-universe-sponsors?11:37
liriuhm, let me check on that11:38
persiajscinoz: At least indicate somewhere that they are a copyright holder.  The current debian/copyright isn't an accurate summary of the files in the package.11:38
liripersia: I'm a member of                Contributors of packages for ubuntu universe      or is it not enough?11:39
persiajscinoz: If you haven't already reviewed http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2006/03/msg00023.html, it is definitely worth a read.11:39
persialiri: That is supposed to be enough, and that you can upload makes me think it really should be.  It's just that I vaguely remember that another resync helped some people to recover their password, so I wonder when you joined the team, and when you first uploaded.11:40
liripersia: well the upload date is there on the packages page, as for the contributors groupI joined on 2007-12-2511:43
persiajscinoz: Fails for me right now.11:43
persialiri: Which package?11:43
liripersia: daloradius11:43
persialiri: Well, that's recent.  I'll try syncing again, but no guarantees: you might need a REVU-hacker to sort this out.11:44
jscinozstrange.11:44
persiajscinoz: What do you get for output?11:44
liripersia: ok thanks, tell me after the resync is over I'll give it another shot11:44
jscinozNewest version on remote site is 4.1, local version is 4.111:44
persiajscinoz: OK.  How about with --force-download?  Does it download?11:45
jscinozone sec11:45
jscinozyes11:46
persiajscinoz: You'd do best to get someone else to test then.  I have no explanation as to why it might work for you and not for me.11:46
jscinozhmm11:46
jscinozalso11:46
jscinozi could have sworn the quake3 sdk is GPL nowadays11:47
persiajscinoz: Maybe.  http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/revu1-incoming/urbanterror-data-0801012251/urbanterror-data-4.1/debian/copyright doesn't look like GPL to me.11:47
jscinozi know it isnt stated in the orig or anything...11:48
persiaI'm not even certain we can distribute that in Ubuntu11:48
jscinozwait11:48
jscinozi think the engine is gpl in the urbanterror package11:48
jscinozits the data that isnt.11:48
persiaThat sounds like what I've heard before about quake311:48
jscinozbrb going to go ask UrT devs in #urbanterror on quakenet11:49
pochuslangasek: I'm not sure what is wrong here. liboobs breaks g-s-t << 2.21.3, since g-s-t 2.21.2.1 won't work with liboobs < 2.21.3 IIRC11:49
pochuslangasek: and g-s-t 2.21.2.1 depends on liboobs-1-4, see https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/i386/gnome-system-tools/2.21.2.1-0ubuntu211:50
frenchyHow long does it normally take for a source package to get through the build queue ATM?11:53
persiafrenchy: A few hours to a day (depending on who uploaded a heap of things recently, or whether an archive admin just approved all the sync requests).  me-tv was available for my last aptitude check.11:54
frenchypersia: Thanks for info, have I been that much of a pain-in-the-ass that you remember me and my little package :).  It's only available as a source package though right, when does it get built?11:56
persiafrenchy: It's a binary package for me, and it was more your plight of working on a package that required special hardware to test that remembers you to me.11:57
frenchypersia: Ohhh, I've been checking packages.ubuntu.com ... not the authoritative source obviously.11:58
persiafrenchy: Not at all.  You want https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/me-tv12:00
persialiri: Done.  Try again.12:01
frenchypersia: Thanks dude, you rock.12:02
liripersia: unfortunately this is the same12:04
persialiri: Yep.  You need a REVU Hacker then.12:04
persialiri: Why were you logging in anyway: was there a specific note you needed to add to your package?12:06
Hobbseeliri: which address is on your package?12:06
liripersia: not really, not for now.12:06
liriHobbsee: I believe liran@enginx.com12:06
* Hobbsee thinks it's broken.12:07
persiaWell, yes, but the question is "How?".  We've seen this bug before, but it usually goes away after a while.12:07
* Fujitsu pokes a bit.12:08
FujitsuThere's no GPG key set on the account...12:09
Hobbseethe email is set, and there's a p/w set12:09
Hobbseebut the lack fo gpg key is...interesting12:10
* persia greps sync logs12:10
FujitsuHobbsee: Did you set the password on it? That looks... decidedly non-random.12:10
HobbseeFujitsu: yes, i reset it, then set it back12:11
Hobbsee:)12:11
Hobbseeholy flipping potatoes12:11
* Hobbsee gets her lart bat.12:11
Hobbseestdin: please don't use dcut on revu.  it doesn't work.12:12
stdinHobbsee: I did once, last year...12:12
Hobbseejohan_kiviniemi, pavel_madman2k_net, same thing12:12
* persia notes that the correct keyID is DB2E67D1, which was just sync'd12:12
FujitsuVery, very few people seem to have OpenPGP keys assigned...12:12
Hobbseestdin: no one's looked on here for a while12:12
liriyep12:12
* Fujitsu adds that to the DB.12:12
HobbseeFujitsu: dat not good.  those in ~ubuntu-dev, perhpas?12:13
FujitsuHobbsee: No, only less than a dozen, I think12:13
* Fujitsu checks.12:13
HobbseeJohan Kiviniemi also gets larted with the cluebat.12:13
Fujitsuliri: Can you please try again?12:13
liriFujitsu: the recovery thing?12:13
persiaHobbsee: ion_?12:13
Fujitsuliri: Correct.12:13
liriFujitsu: still the same.12:14
Fujitsuprocess-upload should be assigning the key when it creates the account, no?12:14
Hobbseeion_: for the love of the green spaghetti monster, please *don't* use dcut, and please *don't* upload binary packages.12:14
Fujitsuliri: Completely blank? /me tries.12:14
Hobbseeion_: i don't know where you're finding info about uploading binary packages12:14
persiaFujitsu: No.  It assigns the email address, and the key is supposed to be assigned by the key sync.12:14
Hobbseepersia: did you just resync?12:14
Fujitsupersia: Hm, that's odd.12:15
persiaHobbsee: minutes ago.12:15
Fujitsuliri: Is that address on your key?12:15
Hobbseecool12:15
liriFujitsu: yeap12:15
* persia did reverse lookup in the keysync log to pull the keyid12:15
FujitsuIf that key is on the keyring, and the address matches...12:17
Hobbseepersia: more stuff for you to review :)12:17
* Hobbsee continues to clean up12:17
persiaHobbsee: It's not REVU day anymore :)12:17
Hobbseeheh12:17
Hobbseepersia: yes, but there's enough of it that ithad better be, for you12:18
* persia took this one (mostly) off to give others a fair chance, but will look at the packages again next week.12:18
Hobbseesure sure12:18
persiaHobbsee: Why?  I did 5 this week.  How many have you done since gutsy opened?12:18
Hobbseei accepted 2.12:18
persiaSee.  We're almost even (as accepting counts double)12:19
liriHobbsee: if you accept mine that will be 3 :-)12:19
* persia only rejects packages on REVU anyway12:19
Hobbseehehe12:19
Hobbseepersia: oh, since gutsy?  lots - but most were translations12:19
persialiri: You need to get someone to upload it before Hobbsee can accept it.12:19
liripersia: upload it where?12:20
liripersia: to universe?12:20
FujitsuHobbsee: What happens if you run `revu-key encrypt <email>' manually? I don't have privs to do it.12:20
persialiri: To the archives (the process is that the second advocate usually uploads, and you can complain here if they don't)12:20
Hobbseehobbsee@sparky:~/incoming% sudo -u revu1 -H ~/revu/bin/revu-key encrypt liran@enginx.com                                            1:22PM12:22
Hobbseegpg: WARNING: unsafe permissions on homedir `/srv/revu-production'12:22
Hobbseegpg: liran@enginx.com: skipped: unusable public key12:22
Hobbseegpg: [stdin]: encryption failed: unusable public key12:22
HobbseeFujitsu: ^12:22
liripersia: can you elaborate on "the second advocate usually uploads" ?12:22
Hobbseerevu1@sparky:/home/hobbsee/incoming$ ls12:22
* Hobbsee wins!12:23
FujitsuHobbsee: Right, let me try something locally.12:23
persialiri: Your key is unusable :(12:23
FujitsuNo encrypting part?12:23
liriuhm, I wonder how that happens12:23
liriis that the key used to sign the package or on the launchpad account?12:23
FujitsuThey must be identical.12:23
persialiri: The REVU process consists of Ubuntu developers reviewing your package, and either commenting requesting more work, or advocating for upload.  The second person to advocate will typically upload to the archive and mail ubuntu-motu@l.u.c to announce they have done so.12:24
liriFujitsu: how would that happen?12:24
FujitsuHmm...12:24
FujitsuI don't see any subkeys on that key.12:24
FujitsuIt is indeed unusable.12:24
persialiri: Rather they must be the same key: LP should have the public key, and you should sign the package with the private key.12:24
* Hobbsee wonders who is Thomas Butter12:24
* Hobbsee ponders removing this stuff whcih has multiple errors, and which people haven't asked about12:25
liripersia: yeah just wondering if something could have went wrong in the copy&paste on the launchpad website12:25
persiaHobbsee: No registered IRC nick reported in LP.12:25
StevenKHobbsee: Thomas Margarine's less spreadable brother12:25
* StevenK hides12:25
Hobbseehaha12:25
geserFujitsu: that key has no encryption capability12:25
Fujitsugeser: Exactly. No encrypting bits, so no subkeys.12:26
HobbseeMichael Lamothe here?12:26
persiaHobbsee: Removing packages pending review?  Just comment explaining why it's crack.  For random stuff that couldn't get past uploads/, just delete.12:26
liriI'll double check12:26
Hobbseepersia: it doesn't even make it to the web UI12:27
* Hobbsee wonders what the heck this guy was on12:27
persiaHobbsee: Anything that can't get to the web UI, and didn't get a complaint here may be considered cruft.12:27
Hobbseeheh12:27
Hobbseegood12:27
persiafrenchy: Hobbsee seeks you (or I'm confused)12:28
persiafrenchy: Also, if I'm correct, please add your IRC nick to LP.12:28
frenchypersia: Ok.12:29
geserFujitsu: does a RSA key need a sub-key for encryption?12:29
Fujitsugeser: I thought all OpenPGP keys did, but I couldn't be quite sure about RSA. I rarely see them in the wild.12:29
mruizhi all12:29
frenchyHobbsee: Here!12:30
Hobbseefrenchy: you're michael?12:30
geserFujitsu: DSA/ElGamal keys have a ElGamal encryption subkey as DSA is only for signing12:30
Hobbseefrenchy: any reason why me-tv_0.4.8-0ubuntu1_source.changes was an empty file?12:30
geserbut RSA keys can have SCE12:30
Fujitsugeser: Ah, right.12:31
frenchyHobbsee: Yes, that's me ... Ummm none that I can think off.  Where was this?12:31
Hobbseefrenchy: to revu12:31
Hobbseefrenchy: as in, did you upload it empty, or did revu manage to delete the contents?12:32
frenchyHobbsee: I would not have intentially removed the contents of the changes file.12:32
frenchyintentionally12:32
Hobbseefrenchy: well, tha't swhat i thought.12:32
Hobbseestrange.12:32
* Hobbsee nuked the upload, anyway12:32
* persia notes that me-tv is in the archives now, so all is good12:33
Hobbseeoh, even better12:33
frenchyHobbsee: I'm still a noob to packaging but I see no reason why I wouldv'e done that ... unless I had a connection dropout.  My wireless sometimes does funny things.  I believe that you're familiar with this.12:34
Hobbseeyeah, true12:34
Hobbseei mean, dput wouldn't have even taken that12:34
frenchyHobbsee: Good point.12:35
Hobbseeso you'd have to use some form of ftp12:36
Hobbseewhich makes me wonder why revu is losing data12:36
frenchyOnly ever used dput.12:38
Hobbseestrange.  oh well12:38
broonieI've had that happen to me due to a connectivity issue before.12:40
frenchypersia: LP updated.12:40
persiafrenchy: Thanks.12:41
AnAntpersia: hello12:48
persiaAnAnt: Hello.12:49
AnAntpersia: thanks for reviewing ubuntume artwork packages12:49
persiaAnAnt: Thanks for bringing them into Ubuntu.  I like it best why we all work on the same codebase.12:49
AnAntpersia: erm, I don't understand what you mean by "I like it best why we all work on the same codebase."12:50
AnAntpersia: anyways I got some questions12:50
AnAntpersia: you say, GPL cannot be relicensed to CC12:51
persiaAnAnt: All the different groups making different flavours of Ubuntu all working on the same packages in the same repositories, rather than trying to maintain separate changes, which are hard to keep up-to-date.12:51
AnAntpersia: well, that Human Ultra theme is actually based on Human theme that is CC licensed12:52
persiaAnAnt: As far as I understand it.  That statement does not constitute legal advice, and may not apply in any given jurisdiction.12:52
AnAntpersia: huh ?12:52
persiaAnAnt: Maybe that package has a bug :)  Anyway, some of the code / data was GPL, so I complained.  Better to reference the GPL in debian/copyright, as the GPL tends to require relicensing as GPL (if the work was received under the GPL).12:53
=== ember_ is now known as ember
AnAntpersia: erm, I don't get it, btw, for the packaging license, what difference does it make between GPL-2 & GPL-3 ?12:55
persiaAnAnt: http://www.fsf.org/licensing/licenses/rms-why-gplv3.html has a basic overview of the differences.  For a true understanding, you should read and compare the licenses.12:56
AnAntpersia: oh, about modifying gdm.conf, I am working on a ubuntume-artwork package, that does modify /etc/gdm/gdm.conf-custom ,it asks the user (using debconf) if he wants the gdm.conf-custom to be modified in order to use the themes, if he/she accepts, then the postinst modifies (not replaces) the gdm.conf-custom (using sed)12:57
persiaHowever, my issue with the package was that you referenced /usr/share/common-licenses/GPL (which is GPL3), didn't specify a version, and the only GPL code I found was GPLv2.12:57
persiaAnAnt: You may or may not be permitted to do that.  Check to see if gdm defines gdm.conf as a conffile.  It is considered bad to modify another packages conffile.  There may be a workaround (or maybe someone will grant a policy violation exception).12:58
AnAntpersia: oh12:59
AnAntpersia: it is a conffile12:59
AnAntpersia: but I'm not replacing the file, just made a script that modifies it13:00
persiaAnAnt: Then you need to either work with gdm people to figure out how to work around that, or someone needs to grant a policy exception to allow you to do that.13:00
AnAntpersia: even if it is done after user is asked wether to do it or not ?13:01
=== _nuu is now known as nuu
persiaAnAnt: I don't think you.  You can check the policy from the debian-policy package.  Hardy currently has 3.7.3.0 (and while not everything complies, that is the standard against which new entrants are judged).13:03
persias/you/so/113:03
AnAntok13:05
AnAntpersia: in the usplash, can the C file be CC licensed ?13:06
persiaAnAnt: Sure, but only the copyright holder can relicense it.  If you received it (or significant portions of it) under GPL, it needs to stay GPL.13:07
AnAntok thanks13:08
ScottKSignificant defined as not very much at all for copyright purposes.13:09
persiaScottK: Depends on the jurisdiction, really.  Where you are, having glanced once at a similar source that had part of one line in common might be considered infringement, but not everywhere is that draconian.13:10
persiaBut even there, one cannot copyright "int main(argc, *argv)"13:11
ScottKTrue, but if someone has claimed copyright on something (at least here) the burden is to prove it's not copyrightable.13:12
persiaFrustratingly true :(  Especially so with automatic grant of copyright.13:13
ScottKSo assuming something isn't copyrightable is risky at best.13:13
ScottKSpeaking of which I just had a scam mail land in my inbox that claimed I was due a tax refund and said: "© Copyright 2008, Internal Revenue Service U.S.A."13:15
ScottKThe one entity (in the US) that you know didn't copyright something is the US Government.  They're prohibited from doing it.13:15
StevenKInteresting13:15
* persia notes that under that copyright regime, that government cannot copyright anything at all.13:15
StevenKScottK: How do they protect their forms, then?13:16
ScottKIf one modifies their form to perpetrate a fraud, there are other laws to deal with that.13:16
persiaStevenK: Used to be special paper sizes.  Now open (PDF downloads).13:16
ScottKOtherwise, why would they care?13:16
ScottKThe tricky bit is the under some circumstances when they hire a contractor to develop a work, the contractor can retain copyright if the US Government doesn't actually buy the rights.13:17
broonieOften some forms are controlled in various ways (for example, blanks some of the more important tax forms in the UK are only allowed to be held by employers)13:18
persiaVorian: Would you mind updating bug #179606?  I'm not able to unsubscribe the sponsors team, and it just needs a bit of editorial work.13:18
ubotuLaunchpad bug 179606 in xdg-utils "xdg-util new upstream needs packaging" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/17960613:18
broonieIt's crude security, not worth too much these days.13:18
Vorianpersia: sure thing13:18
persiabroonie: Seems odd.  How does that help Inland Revenue? (disclaimer: I live in a tax jurisdiction where the laws have been adjusted for ease of computer programs)13:19
=== bluekuja__ is now known as bluekuja
persiaVorian: Thanks.13:19
brooniepersia: It makes it a bit easier for employers to pass over tax data when they need to (for a new job, say). It also makes it easier for them to LART anyone doing anything stupid.13:20
Voriannot a problem at all13:20
Vorian:)13:20
broonieI suspect they wouldn't bother if writing the rules today.13:21
persiabroonie: Hmm.  I guess.  Here there are special red stamps, registered with the government, and if you don't have the appropriate red stamp from your last employer on your handover documentation, it gets rejected.  The forms are available to anyone, but the stamps are hand-constructed to be difficult to duplicate.13:21
persiaember: Are you still working on deskscribe?13:22
brooniepersia: Yes, that's the same sort of idea (the forms are relatively difficult to reproduce).13:22
persiabroonie: The difference being that they are mass-produced, so it leaves open a gap for unscrupulous HR.  Here if the fancy red stamp is missing, the company has a problem, and reports it within the day.  Anyway, subverting non-computer systems is a far cry from Ubuntu development :)13:24
liriFujitsu: should I upload my key to subkeys.pgp.net for it to be valid on revu?13:25
bluekujaliri, nope, use keyserver.ubuntu.com13:26
bluekujaliri, the key-sync script updates the keyring using keyserver.u.c atm13:27
* persia notes that most keyservers (including ks.u.c) sync to each other several times daily13:27
bluekujapersia, yes, and does ks.u.c sync from subkeys.pgp.net as well?13:28
liribluekuja: I'm not sure if that would solve the error from gpg: skipped: unusable public key13:28
emberpersia: yes.13:28
persiabluekuja: I believe so.13:28
bluekujapersia, ah ok so liri nvm my comment13:28
bluekuja:)13:28
persiaember: Please upload a new revision soon.  It's been a few weeks, there are only about three weeks left before the deadline.13:28
emberwill do13:29
persiaember: Thanks.13:29
liribluekuja: I sent my key to subkeys.pgp.net13:29
bluekujaliri, today?13:30
bluekujaliri, key ID?13:31
liribluekuja: a few minutes ago, DB2E67D1, revu rejected with a "skipped: unusable public key" message, actually locally I get the same results for some reason13:32
=== bigon` is now known as bigon
bluekujaliri, it should'nt be available on ks.u.c then13:33
bluekujaliri, I don't know how often keys gets synced from other keyrings13:34
bluekujaliri, what do you mean with locally?13:34
bluekujaliri, e.g signing your package with debsign?13:34
liribluekuja: encrypting a file, like gpg --encrypt --recipient liran@enginx.com <file>13:35
liribluekuja: I think the package signing was successful but I can't remember now (although I can verify it quite easily)13:35
* persia notes that signing and encrypting are different13:36
liribluekuja: yeah signing asks for passphrase and completes just fine.13:36
liritrue.13:36
bluekujaliri, are you trying to *upload* or to *decrypt* to get your pwd?13:36
liribluekuja: well I'm currently trying to encrypt a file locally on my computer to test my key13:37
bluekujaliri, and what's the problem with REVU?13:38
bluekujaliri, actually as persia stated signing and encrypting is different...maybe you're doing something wrong? :)13:38
liribluekuja: well no idea then :)13:38
liriwhile before gesser and fujitsu noted: geser: Fujitsu: that key has no encryption capability Fujitsu: geser: Exactly. No encrypting bits, so no subkeys.13:39
persiabluekuja: Nothing being done wrong, just that the key is RSA rather than DSA.  Needs more subkeys, or if they were recently added, needs to wait for the keyservers to sync.13:39
bluekujapersia, I wasnt sure he was trying to upload to REVU or not13:39
bluekujapersia, and I guess liri didnt upload anything to revu yet13:40
persialiri: Unless you've lots of signatures you wish to preserve, consider creating a DSA key, and signing it with your RSA key to indicate you know you are you.13:40
bluekujaliri, did you upload something to revu yet?13:40
persiabluekuja: Uploading works, just not password retrieval (signing works, but not encryption)13:40
* Hobbsee is not me, just someone else pretending to be me.13:40
bluekujapersia, got it13:40
bluekujaHobbsee, heya :D13:41
Hobbseegreets!13:41
* persia sees LongPointyStick and is suspicious of that claim13:41
Hobbseethat's on another machine13:41
liripersia: I'll just get over with it by creating a new dsa key and that's it.13:41
bluekujaHobbsee, happy new year, sarah!13:42
Hobbsee:)13:42
bluekujaHobbsee, everything went fine with your holidays?13:42
Hobbseeyeah, mostly :)13:42
bluekujagreat :)13:43
bluekujapersia, someone should promote you to Keys master13:44
bluekujapersia, it seems you have a good knowledge about keys13:45
bluekuja;)13:45
persiabluekuja: I learned most of it here, or in links posted here.13:45
bluekujacool :)13:46
* persia found the issue with rhythmbox. Somehow the "変換" key happens to send the same scancode as the "Media" key on some random internet keyboard. Bad hardware designers!13:50
StevenKI don't have one of those keys13:50
persiaStevenK: It's people like you who thought it would be a good idea to double-map the keysym :p13:51
* Hobbsee mutters somethign about how people should all speak english13:51
persia(for those unfamiliar with jp106, 変換 is right next to a very small spacebar)13:52
StevenKHobbsee: Personally, I dislike that attitude.13:52
Hobbseeor, all speak some chosen language13:53
persiaHobbsee: Even if everyone spoke a common language, why shouldn't they use others too?  Also, it's fun to have nifty characters be easy to type.13:53
Hobbseepersia: because they expect me to understand them, when they're speaking in mangled $language_of_country, and getting increasingly pissed off when i can't undersatnd them.13:53
Hobbsees/speaking/mumbling/13:53
* persia especially likes 全角/半角 for extra wide characters :)13:54
Hobbseehehe13:54
rzrpersia: hi13:54
rzrpersia: just got your email13:54
persiarzr: Hello.  Wasn't actually mail :)13:54
rzrpersia: I'd like to make it enter ubuntu 1st13:55
persiarzr: makes sense.13:55
rzrpersia: just to test the process13:55
rzrpersia: i have pending ITP in debian13:55
rzri wanted to compare13:55
rzrpersia: well u're right i'll have to ITP it too13:56
Hobbseedholbach: so what is hte date of doom?13:57
persiarzr: Even while you're getting it into Ubuntu, it's best to ITP.  It's frustrating when someone uploads a different tarball the day before it goes into Ubuntu (happened to me once), and you have a very annoying merge later.13:57
rzryea I know that it happended to me once13:57
persiarzr: Anyway, your package was selected by the review assigner, so you've just received a special, non-REVU day review.  Please upload a new candidate addressing the points raised in the REVU comment.13:59
rzrgreat13:59
rzrthx persia13:59
=== bigon is now known as bigon`
=== bigon` is now known as bigon
dholbachHobbsee: what are you referring to?14:09
Hobbseedholbach: mid jan, MC was going to make a decision, yes?14:09
dholbachHobbsee: the MC will wait for the report that is due mid January14:11
Hobbsee...right14:11
persiaVorian: Please update the Bug Description with the contents of your last comment.  Makes life easier for the archive-admins.14:11
Hobbseedholbach: which is written by the MC?14:12
Vorianpersia: will do, thanks again for the tip14:12
dholbachHobbsee: no, norsetto and I will write it14:12
persiaHobbsee: Only accidentially.  Written by the supervisors (50% of whom coincidentally are also MC members)14:12
dholbach?14:13
persiaHobbsee: Please, keep your pitchforks and torches sharp and dry if you like, but wait, and don't mix things.  There's too much tension already :)14:13
Hobbseeright.14:14
ScottKWell so far everything I've dealt with that he messed up was in Main.14:15
* Hobbsee just wants a date to see everything done by, as a vote of confidence that the MC can, and will do what it says, in this matter.14:15
=== \sh_away is now known as \sh
ion_hobbsee: Never heard of pavel_madman2k_net. I accidentally uploaded a binary package to REVU ages ago, and immediately reuploaded the source-only package.14:21
zulmorning14:23
ion_hobbsee: I just assumed the cron job there would just remove it. Had i known it’s left lurking there, i’d have requested it to be removed back then.14:24
ion_hobbsee: 2007-12-28 05:16:22 < ion_> Oh, i accidentally uploaded a .changes file with both source and binary files. I wonder how REVU handles it?  2007-12-28 05:16:48 < Fujitsu> It won't even see it.  2007-12-28 05:16:59 < Fujitsu> It globs for *_source.changes14:30
ion_hobbsee: And that was about it.14:30
martosshi all, i have a ppa repo related questions.14:31
ion_...and now would be a good time to realize she’s not online. :-P14:31
martossif i upload via dput a ".changes" file, i get an error message that it contains binary parts since the debs are uploaded as well.14:32
ion_Build with -S14:32
martosshow can i create a changes file without the binary deb files just for the .tar.gz and the desc?14:32
bluekujamartoss, debuild -S -sa14:32
bluekujamartoss, for revu upload14:32
=== cprov is now known as cprov-lunch
bluekujamartoss, you did something like dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot with no other options...so you get the binaries in the .changes as well14:33
bluekujamartoss, just use the command above and that's fixed14:33
martossyepp, revu would be the next test, i think my key should be in keychain since resync should be done at least once per day14:33
persiamartoss: When did you join the group?14:34
martossthink it was sunday14:34
persiamartoss: It's definitely sync'd then.14:35
persia(resync doesn't happen every day, just most days)14:35
mok0Perlit Rendehest14:36
martossok, is uploaded14:36
martossrevu login is the same as the launchpad account?14:37
sorenmok0: ?14:38
amarillionmartoss, fill out your email address and let the login fail, then you can request a new one14:38
persiamartoss: Not at all.  If you've uploaded to revu, you can recover your password from REVU.14:38
martossok14:38
martosshow long must i wait for the "Recover"  not giving me a message like "No REVU account for martin.hoefling@gmx.de exists yet." :-)14:40
martosskk, got it14:41
martossgreat, login works now...14:42
DarkSun88Hi all14:45
martossok, first thing would be to fix lintian stuff in eric14:45
DarkSun88persia: Ping14:48
martosscan someone look at my lintian report of eric? I do not fully understand it's meaning.14:48
persiamartoss: Pastebin it (with lintian -iIv)14:49
martosshttp://www.pastebin.org/1454914:56
Ngpersia: in your review of Terminator you mentioned using DEB_CHANGELOGS_INSTALL_ALL - I'm a little confused in that the package seems to include the upstream and debian changelogs already anyway15:01
=== \sh is now known as \sh_away
bddebianHeya gang15:18
martosshi bddebian15:21
bddebianHello martoss15:21
DarkSun88Hi bddebian :)15:23
bddebianHi DarkSun8815:25
=== LifeHacker is now known as tuxmaniac
DarkSun88bddebian: Thanks :)15:28
martosscan sb look through http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=eric and give me comments about the standards error?15:33
=== bigon is now known as bigon`
brooniemartoss: It means that your package says that it complies with a newer version of Debian policy than the lintian that is being used supports.15:37
brooniePresumably because you are syncing a Debian package more current with policy than the Ubuntu lintian.15:38
martosshmm ok, should i decrease the version then?15:38
=== cprov-lunch is now known as cprov
broonieI'd just ignore it myself unless the policy changes broke something in Ubuntu (which is unlikely)15:40
martossok, so this is not a problem for accepting a package15:42
amarillionI get that problem as well in my package. I think that means lintian on revu needs to be updated15:46
amarillionLocally I'm using the latest version of lintian in gutsy backports and it gives the reverse error: if you use standards version 3.7.2 it suggests upgrading to 3.7.315:47
=== bigon` is now known as bigon
geserHi bddebian15:50
bddebianHeya geser15:50
ScottKmartoss: 3.7.3 is what you should be using now.15:51
martossyepp, its 3.7.3 in mine as well15:53
Peakerhi, how do I skip unit tests when building the python2.5 package?16:14
tuxmaniacwill tiber ever be back?16:36
tuxmaniachow long does it take to get ones revu account activated after first revu upload?16:48
Ngtuxmaniac: I did that recently and it didn't email me the password, so I used the revu website's password recovery feature and it worked fine :)16:48
tuxmaniacNg, Neither does the password recovery works for me16:49
Ngah16:49
martosstuxmaniac, several minutes16:58
martosscu later16:58
=== LifeHacker is now known as tuxmaniac
saivannHi everybody, I worked on bug #131530 and I would need a MOTU to approve and upload my debdiff for package bluez-gnome17:03
ubotuLaunchpad bug 131530 in bluez-gnome "'Browse device...' in the bluetooth applet is useless without gnome-vfs-obexftp" [Unknown,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/13153017:03
saivann( for hardy )17:03
saivannThis debdiff only adds dependency for gnome-vfs-obexftp which is in main since yesterday, approved by Martin Pitt17:06
DarkSun88See you later17:06
saivannI will be busy for the next minutes but if someone want to take care of this, here's the debdiff :17:07
saivannhttp://upload.leservicetechnique.com/bugs/bluez-gnome.debdiff17:07
gesersaivann: you need a core-dev for bluez-gnome, subscribe the ubuntu-main-sponsors team to the bug17:22
jdongLucidFox: ok I'm gonna have a look at gtkpod-aac17:25
=== apachelogger__ is now known as apachelogger
jdongis dh_iconcache now gone for good and dh_icons should be used instead?17:46
saivanngeser : thanks17:46
pochujdong: yup17:47
jdongpochu: ok, thanks.17:48
slangasekpochu: no, liboobs-1-4 does not break g-s-t << 2.21.3, because there is no g-s-t << 2.21.3 that will *look* for liboobs-1-417:48
slangasekpochu: so it's a spurious breaks:17:48
pochuslangasek: what about g-s-t 2.21.2.1?17:50
LucidFoxjdong> yes17:50
LucidFoxin fact, I have an updated version of gtkpod-aac17:51
pochuslangasek: it depends on liboobs-1-417:51
LucidFoxI'll upload it17:51
slangasekpochu: hrm, well, that package doesn't seem to exist anymore :)17:55
pochuslangasek: it did before seb128 sponsored g-s-t 2.21.3 ;)17:55
slangasekpochu: so if it did exist and had a wrong dep, ok, that would explain it17:56
pochuI think it was: we had liboobs-1-4 2.21.2.1 and g-s-t 2.21.2.1 depending on liboobs-1-4. Then with the liboobs 2.21.3 update which broke the api without bumping the soname because it was already bumped and this was an unstable release, we needed to bump the liboobs-1-4's Breaks for g-s-t17:58
pochuOtherwise g-s-t 2.21.2.1 would use liboobs-1-4 2.21.3 and would break17:59
DarkSun88Hi18:02
=== \sh_away is now known as \sh
=== neversfelde_ is now known as neversfelde
EtienneGhey gang18:08
mneptokeverybody look busy! here comes ... oh shit. too late.18:09
LucidFoxjdong> I have uploaded updated gtkpod-aac interdiffs for the libmp4v2 transition18:09
EtienneGany chance a fix for the flashplugin-nonfree ever get an official update through the repo ?18:09
EtienneGjust wondering if it is only a matter of time ...18:09
EtienneGmneptok, dude!18:10
mneptokEtienneG: i think the change has been uploaded, but returns 1 even though it actually works.18:10
mneptok>:)18:10
amarillionWhere can I find docs on writing .desktop files?18:15
amarillionGoogling for "desktop files" gives a lot of false positives18:16
tuxmaniacHello. request a motu to review the package http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=alliance and comment/advocate if found ok.18:16
ScottKamarillion: I believer that freedesktop.org is the place to look18:17
amarillionthx I'll look into it18:18
\shgrmpf..does anyone has a clue how to edit a patch from afterstep, which is not applying correctly...well it's the first one..I can't see anything wrong with dbs-edit-patch18:33
mneptokamarillion: probably the best way to educate yourself is to take an example of a properly crafted .desktop (gedit may be a good bet) and dissect it.18:39
=== _czessi is now known as Czessi
amarillionHow do I add binary files to a source package? I've got an icon for my app, and I put it in the debian dir.18:55
amarillionBut when I try to build the source package, I get18:56
amarilliondpkg-source: cannot represent change to debian/alex.png: binary file contents changed18:56
\shamarillion: you should use uuencode/uudecode to push binary stuff inside a source package18:56
bddebianamarillion: You cannot add a binary file that way.  You either have to use uuencode or some such, or better yet, use an xpm icon18:57
amarillionok, in this case xpm is easiest I guess18:57
amarillionSo you can't add binary files at all? I didn't know that18:57
\shamarillion: source package == binary stuff in debian/ dir18:57
LucidFoxIs it allowed to have a package that's a simple collection of themes under different licenses?18:57
=== Ubulette_ is now known as Ubulette
\shhey bddebian btw :)18:58
bddebianHi \sh18:58
=== blueyed__ is now known as blueyed
=== \sh is now known as \sh_away
=== cassidy_ is now known as cassidy
=== davro is now known as davromaniak
mok0Suggestion: All MOTUs should have a special character in their nick, for example "@"19:32
LaserJockheh19:33
LaserJockthat would make it more difficult for us to hide ;-)19:33
mok0If  that is the first character, ppl can immediately see MOTUs online19:33
mok0LaserJock: :-)19:33
=== x-spec-t is now known as Spec
mok0It took me a while to figure out who in this channel are MOTUs -- there are probably still a lot I don't know...19:35
amarillionnot a bad suggestion19:37
mok0Perhaps I should send a note to u-m19:39
LaserJockif you think it'd be a good idea19:39
LaserJockI'm not sure many MOTU would like the idea or if it's even possible to do only in #ubuntu-motu, but it may be worth looking at19:40
mok0People may not want it, but I will suggest it anyway :-)19:40
stdinLaserJock: just give them all an access level of 5 and set the channel AUTOVOICE level to 5 (like how it's done in -ops)19:41
LaserJockstdin: yes, but I'm not sure that is a desired thing19:42
stdinwell you could set CMDVOICE to 5 instead, then they could choose when to be +v and when not19:42
stdin(if I understand chanserv that is)19:43
mok0stdin: that is also a possibility, but can it be seen in a /who listing?19:43
zulits kind of like having a target on your back which alot of people probably dont want19:43
stdinmok0: yeah, shows as H+19:44
mok0But if you don't want to do MOTU stuff, you just use the ordinary nick19:44
stdinyou just devoice yourself19:44
mok0(or don't set the + option)19:44
stdinkind of like how it's done in #freenode19:44
mok0stdin: exactly19:44
jdongLucidFox: grumble I kinda did that while offline too19:45
jdongLucidFox: lol lemme take a look at the new interdiff19:45
jdongLucidFox: can you (1) version libmp4v2-dev (>= 1:1.6-0.1) (2) dh_iconcache -> dh_icons in debian/rules (3) put LP: #180406 in the changelog and repost the interdiff?19:47
LucidFoxjdong> it already has dh_icons19:48
ScottKmok0: Back when I needed to know I just looked up the team on LP to see who was in it.19:48
LucidFoxas for the other two, sure19:48
jdongLucidFox: ok you're right, I was looking at the wrong interdiff19:49
jdongthanks19:49
* ScottK wouldn't want to be any more of a target.19:49
mok0ScottK: OK, but it doesn't quickly show you who is online19:49
ScottKTrue.19:49
LucidFoxshould I also update Standards-Version to 3.7.3?19:49
ScottKLucidFox: Yes19:49
mok0Like stdin said, if MOTUs are made IRCops, then you can set the +H option to hide19:50
ScottKSounds like more work then to be in the same place I am now.19:51
ScottKI'm not in favor.19:51
stdinthey don't need to have OP access to just have voice19:51
mok0stdin: ok? I've never really used irc modes19:52
ScottKMy solution would probably be to just be grumpier so people would bother someone else.19:52
stdinChanServ will give them +v if they have access to CMDVOICE on the channel19:52
mok0ScottK: You? Grumpy? Naaa19:52
LucidFoxjdong> reuploaded19:53
jdongLucidFox: thanks19:54
mok0ScottK: My concern is to make it easier for people to communicate efficiently on IRC.19:56
ScottKI understand.  My concern is to be able to idle on the channel and jump in where I care to without getting pinged on to much.19:57
ScottKIf I can't, I probably won't.19:57
ScottKSo there may be unintended consequences to your proposal.19:57
mok0ScottK: Perhaps there could be a watch schedule19:57
ScottKIf we were paid to be here, sure.19:58
mok0he19:58
nxvl_workmok0: what are we talking about?19:59
stdinyou could set +v when you're "available to help" and leave yourself unvoiced when you're just popping in, up to you19:59
mok0stdin: +119:59
slangaseknxvl_work: he's talking about painting targets on the MOTUs19:59
nxvl_workwhy?20:00
bddebianeasier to hit :-)20:00
nxvl_workand its needed because...20:00
jpatrickpoor us... :(20:00
nxvl_worki don't see in which case that would be useful20:01
jpatricknxvl_work: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2008-January/002994.html20:01
stdinif you need a mentor or someone to look in revu20:01
mok0easier for newbies to become involved & effective20:01
nxvl_workbecause then we are going to need a paint for the MOTUs, one for the u-u-s, one for the main developers, and so one20:01
jdongLucidFox: gtkpod-aac uploaded20:02
nxvl_workstdin: a MOTU, isn't necessary working on revu20:02
ScottKmok0: I'd say easier for motus to get bugged.20:02
ScottKGenerally I think it's better to ask questions of the channel and let whoever answer.20:02
nxvl_workand any contributor with experience will be able to mentor any other, not only a MOTU20:02
stdinnxvl_work: I just said look at it, not approve it ;)20:02
nxvl_workstdin: i'm just saying what i think :D20:03
mok0nxvl_work: true20:03
stdinI think what I say, I think... :p20:03
nxvl_workScottK: right20:03
jpatrickI don't think a ubuntu/motu/* cloak is possible20:03
nxvl_workit isn't a good practice to look for someone to help without a good reason to look for him/her20:04
mok0jpatrick: I think there is a mode where you can hide (?)20:04
* LaserJock suggests we give the new people a target instead ;-)20:04
nxvl_workit's better to ask on the channel and the one who can help does it20:04
LucidFoxjdong> Thanks!20:04
mok0nxvl_work: ... ppl can still do that20:05
nxvl_workmok0: newbies wont20:05
nxvl_worki have been a newbie 3 moths ago, and i'm still kind of it20:05
amarillionWhy is the ISC license preferred over BSD?20:06
* ScottK thinks jdong should be the designated target.20:06
mok0nxvl_work: I thought you were MOTU ;-)20:06
nxvl_workand newbies don't ask on the channels20:06
* ScottK did when I was new20:06
nxvl_workmok0: nop, still not, just contributos20:06
nxvl_workcontributor*20:06
LaserJockamarillion: what are you referring to?20:07
nxvl_worki have gone trough the mentor program and i'm not a mentee anymore, but still not a MOTU20:07
amarillionWell, a few days ago I was discussing the license of speed-game, the package I'm working on right now20:07
amarillionIt currently doesn't have a license at all20:07
nxvl_workScottK: did you take a look at the bug i ask?20:07
mok0amarillion: then it can't be distributed20:07
amarillionsomebody here mentioned the ISC licence20:07
nxvl_workwrong channel20:08
amarillionmok0, no worries20:08
ScottKYes20:08
amarillionI contacted the author and he said to go ahead with the ISC license20:08
ScottKamarillion: It was persia20:08
amarillionright20:08
amarillionso the package is in good shape, and I'm ready to put the appropriate licensing text there20:09
LaserJockaccording to wikipedia it's "It is functionally equivalent to the 2-clause BSD licence, with language "made unnecessary by the Berne convention" removed."20:09
amarillionand I'm googling for the actual text. It's not in /usr/share/common-licenses20:09
amarillionBSD is20:09
LaserJockyes, I've never heard of ISC20:09
amarillionLaserJock, right. So that made me wonder why persia suggested ISC and not simply BSD20:09
LaserJockwell, I suppose it's a bit free-er and simpler20:10
LaserJockit's not that BSD wouldn't work20:10
amarillionSo which text should I include in the package? Is it this: http://ictlab.tyict.vtc.edu.hk/pub/tarball/dhcp-3.0b2pl3/ISC-LICENSE?20:11
jdongoops some half-asleep idiot forgot to call debuild with -sa... :D20:11
LaserJockamarillion: whatever text the author uses20:13
amarillionLaserJock, yeah but I have to apply it. The original author told me to go ahead and not bother him :)20:14
LaserJockhah20:14
amarillionit's a little game that is finished, not some library or other ongoing project20:14
LaserJockyeah, well it's completely undistributable legally without a license20:15
=== Pricey is now known as PriceChild
amarillionWell, here is what he said: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/51254/20:17
jdonghmm why did I get two Accepted e-mails for the same sponsored pload?20:20
=== Skiessl is now known as Skiessi
joejaxxmok0: are you sure that is not going to become a ping list?20:22
amarillionI'll wait to see if persia can clarify20:24
mok0joejaxx: Not really20:26
mok0joejaxx: but some of the MOTUs seem to .-)20:26
joejaxxmok0: :)20:26
joejaxxi was just wondering how the symbol would help since we have the queue and revu system20:27
joejaxxand mostly everyone here answers questions if they {see it,know the answer}20:27
joejaxx:)20:27
mok0joejaxx: just so ppl can recognize what MOTUs are online20:28
joejaxxso you would only have the +v if you are not idle?20:28
mok0joejaxx: yes20:29
joejaxxah ok20:29
joejaxxthat clears up the confusion :)20:29
mok0joejaxx: it's probably better to use the mechanisms that are build into IRC20:29
mok0joejaxx: better than a special character in the nick20:29
joejaxxi thought you meant like #gentoo-dev where devs/contributors have a mode set all the time20:30
joejaxxwhich is the equivalient to a ping list20:30
joejaxxbut your suggestion is interesting20:30
mok0joejaxx: I guess you can set/unset it as you please20:30
joejaxxequivalent*20:30
mok0joejaxx: it should be discussed at a motu-meeting I guess20:31
mok0joejaxx: ... it could also be voluntary20:31
joejaxxoh ok20:31
mok0joejaxx: anything is possible :-)20:32
pochumok0: that should be discussed with the IRC council too I guess, since '@' is operator and '+' is voiced.20:32
mok0pochu: sure, those characters were just "random" ones20:33
pochuoh, is it possible to set others?20:33
mok0pochu: I think you can use any ascii character in a nick, right?20:34
mok0Another way of doing it is giving MOTUs CMDVOICE rights, stdin said that before20:36
* RainCT fully agrees with ScottK's reply to mok0's proposal20:36
mok0RainCT: no hard feelings :-)20:36
joejaxxi keep confusing ScottK and Steve.*K20:36
* joejaxx keeps forgeting who is who :\20:37
ion_They’re really the same person.20:37
mok0me too20:37
joejaxxToadstool: lol20:37
joejaxxgah20:37
joejaxxion_: *20:37
ScottKBetween the two of us we make up one person who never sleeps, but seems to know a lot less when it's daylight in North America.20:38
joejaxxlol :P20:38
* ion_ tries to figure out how someone could mistype ‘ion’ as ‘Toadstool’. :-)20:38
joejaxxion_: haha20:38
joejaxx:P20:38
joejaxxautotabwhileshiftingfingers ftl20:38
=== afflux is now known as afflux_
=== afflux_ is now known as afflux
=== awalton_1 is now known as awalton__
ScottKmok0: Just hurry up and get MOTU and then you can change your nick to MOTU-mok0.20:53
mok0ScottK: lol20:53
mok0ScottK: Still educating myself...20:54
mok0ScottK: Trying to get my packages from gutsy -> debian20:54
ScottKSure.  No problem.  By the time you think you are ready, you will have already have been ready for some time.20:55
mok0ScottK: You think I should apply now?20:55
nxvl_workmok0: you need much to became a MOTU, you only need to hug everyone20:55
* joejaxx has that problem as well20:55
* mok0 hugs nxvl_work 20:56
ScottKmok0: I haven't been paying close enough attention to what's going on here to have a strong opinion.20:56
joejaxxi do not know when i am going for it20:56
ScottKIt's possible you're ready.20:56
joejaxxmaybe next release cycle20:56
joejaxxlol20:56
Amaranthi've been at this since 2005 and only recently tried to become a motu :P20:56
joejaxxlol20:57
mok0Amaranth: so, either you are lazy or incompetent :-P20:57
nxvl_workAmaranth: define "at this"20:57
ScottKOr inconsistent.20:57
Amaranthpackaging and such20:57
* mok0 hugs Amaranth 20:57
Amaranthalthough since becoming MOTU i haven't uploaded a single thing...20:57
Amaranthprobably because the only thing i want to has to be uploaded in sync with stuff in main so mvo just does it too :)20:58
nxvl_worki plan to become a motu by hardy release20:58
ScottKmok0: So why is theseus FTBFS on everything but i386 it's tried so far?21:05
mok0ScottK: Beats me. I have looked at the logs and I can't see what's going on21:06
mok0ScottK: I have no problems building on amd64, but that fails too21:07
ScottKI suspect I know what it is.  Let me have a look at the package...21:07
mok0ScottK: Thanks!21:07
slangaseklooks clear to me, arch: any package and the binary-indep target is populated by mistake21:10
slangasekso it builds with dpkg-buildpackage -b and FTBFS with -B21:10
ScottKmok0: ^^^21:10
ScottKIs it meant to be arch all or arch any?21:11
* mok0 tries to understand slangasek21:11
slangasekit's compiling stuff, so it needs to be arch: any21:11
mok0slangasek: I will take a look21:12
mok0It's supposed to be "any"21:13
ScottKmok0: Look at Debian New Maintainer's Guide section 4.421:13
mok0there isn't even an "indep" target21:14
* mok0 looks at DNMG21:14
mok0ScottK: Still don't understand what you guys mean...21:15
ScottKYou don't define binary-arch21:16
mok0I thought only "install" was mandatory...21:17
ScottKSince it's arch:any then you need to define the per-archicture build requirements.21:17
ScottKi386 works because that's (by coincidence) where arch all packages get build21:18
mok0ScottK: OK...21:18
mok0I can introduce the install-arch and install-indep targets21:19
ScottKSo right now you have an arch:any package with nothing to build for the other archs.  I think, but I'm not an expert on this.21:19
mok0ScottK: However, I can't see that explained in DNMG21:19
ScottKI was more thinking of the example where on line 51 and on it shows how to set your rules files for arch dependent builds21:20
mok0ScottK: Got it. Thanks. I guess I should fix it and re-upload to REVU?21:21
ScottKNo.  Since it's just a new debian revision, file a bug and attach a debdiff.21:21
ScottKThen subscribe UUS21:22
mok0ScottK: I'll get right on it21:22
mok0ScottK: So, with every arch except i386, it is built with the -B flag?21:23
ScottKYes21:23
ScottKThat sounds right.21:23
* mok0 finally gets it21:23
amarillionI uploaded a new version of speed-game: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=speed-game21:24
amarillionAll issues have been addressed, it's ready for a review again21:24
ScottKmok0: Then you're one step closer to being ready.  FYI, I broke Spamassassin to learn this.21:26
mok0ScottK: yikes21:27
ScottKI fixed an arch:any problem in the indep part of debian/rules.  It worked for my on i386.  I uploaded and everything else broke.21:28
mok0ScottK: one of the more tricky packaging bugs...21:30
ScottKWell now I know.21:30
mok0So, in fact, binary-arch should be a mandatory target21:31
* rzr updated http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=jaaa21:42
ScottKmok0: It's mandatory for an arch:any package.  Not for an arch:all package21:43
jpatrickPerdente: welcome!21:44
* mok0 has to check up on his reading...21:44
Perdentehey!21:44
ScottKmok0: Here's an arch:all that's the other way around: http://www.openspf.org/svn/software/postfix-policyd-spf-perl/tags/2.005/debian/rules21:44
PerdenteI was looking to help programming any way I can, I have taken some classes and I've been running ubuntu for about a year now and I really want to help program any way I can21:45
mok0ScottK: thx21:45
mok0ScottK: ... and that only builds an "all" binary package. Makes sense to me21:46
ScottKYes.  And that's all there is for that package21:46
jpatrickPerdente: prehaps reading the packguide?21:46
mok0ScottK: What's XS-DM-Upload-Allowed: yes ?21:46
pochumok0: to allow Debian Maintainers to upload those specific packages if they are the Maintainers21:47
ScottKThat's a Debian specific thing for Debian Maintainer (which I'm not quite yet) uploading allowed21:47
mok0ScottK: ah21:47
Perdentejpatrick, I know this sounds really dumb, but I'm a quick learner, where' the packguide again?21:47
jpatrick!packguide > Perdente21:47
TheMuso!packguide21:54
ubotuThe packaging guide is at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide - See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages for information on getting a package integrated into Ubuntu - Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment - See also !backports21:54
TheMusoah right. Thought that didn't work.21:54
pochuTheMuso: heh, I /msg'ed ubotu too :)21:58
jpatrickI forwarded it to him ">"21:59
pochujpatrick: yeah but packguide vs packagingguide :)22:00
TheMusojpatrick: Yeah I saw. Didn't think that was possible either.22:00
jpatrickpochu: it's an alias now22:00
pochulooks easier to write :)22:01
RainCTwill Hardy ship with Firefox 2 or 3 by default?22:10
pochu322:11
RainCTnice :)22:12
* joejaxx is hoping Hardy is not an Edgy-ng :P22:12
Perdentejpatrick, well looks like this is a nice read how late will you be here today?22:14
jpatrickPerdente: woah, I should of been off ages ago.., but I'm sure someone would be able to help you out from here, and I'll be on later :)22:15
Perdenteok, thanks!  I'm just now trying the Debhelper packaging so it will take a little while anyway22:17
ScottKPerdente: Generally if you have questions it's better to ask the channel so whoever is here and know can answer.22:18
KmosRainCT: it will be default after alpha 322:18
PerdenteScottK, done and done. :)22:19
persiaJust for reference, in case anyone wants to answer amarillion next time, ISC is preferred to BSD if you are not the Regents of the University of California because /usr/share/common-licenses/BSD can only be used if the the Regents hold copyright on the source, and ISC is shorter, so wastes less archive space when duplicated.22:20
persiaNg: If you see a changelog in your binary package, ignore my complaint about it being missing.  I didn't see one.22:20
mok0ScottK: theseus package fixed. I set bug status to "confirmed" but I can't remember if that's the right thing to do.22:39
ScottKConfirmed or Triaged are fine.  Did you subscribe UUS?22:41
mok0ScottK: yep22:41
ScottKThen you should be done except maybe to answer questions.22:41
mok0Great22:41
ScottKWhat bug?22:42
mok0Bug #18135922:42
ubotuLaunchpad bug 181359 in theseus "FTBFS error on all archs but i386" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/18135922:42
ScottKMaybe persia will take pity on you and have a look at it ^^^.  I'm out of here in 2 minutes.22:43
* persia has very limited time now, and is expected to be deep idle in about 722:43
mok0No rush22:44
persiamok0: Looks sane,  I don't have time to build twice right now, but it ought get picked up soon.22:45
=== Spec is now known as x-spec-t
mok0persia: yeah I think so22:45
ScottKSee you all later.22:46
RainCTgood night22:46
mok0Goodnight22:46
Ngpersia: I'll check with a fresh build, but I seem to see changelog.gz and changelog.Debian.gz locally22:51
persiaNg: Sorry about that.  My missing-changelog comment was based entirely on linda's checking logic, but that may not be accurate.  Be sure to try a build against hardy.22:52
Ngah that's a good point, I've just been building on gutsy :)22:52
the_belgainhello - quick question: what's the version naming convention for packaging software which doesn't have fixed release numbers, but just SVN revisions and dates?23:15
mok0http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-binary.html#s-versions23:16
the_belgaingreat, thanks - so the SVN revision isn't appended to the version number23:18
=== WikiMan is now known as MatthewV
the_belgaindoes the SVN revision usually get mentioned anywhere in particular in the package?23:18
the_belgaindebian/changelog maybe?23:18
mok0the_belgain: doesn't harm to put it theer23:19
pochuIf it's a svn checkout and not an stable tarball, then yes, in the version string (which is both in the files and in debian/changelog)23:19
the_belgainso the directory name (when using dh_make) should be eg. "packagename_20071219-svn578" ? to get the version string picked up correctly23:21
the_belgainsorry, i mean packagename-20071219_svn57823:22
jscinozpersia you here?23:23
pochuthe_belgain: is it a new package?23:25
pochuor an update?23:25
the_belgainnew package23:25
persiajscinoz: No.  You'll do better to ask your questions generally, rather than asking me, as I'm really not around much right now (and no, this isn't a joking "no", I just happened to see that on my way out).23:25
pochuthe_belgain: I'd use packagename_0+svn578 then, just in case they release 0.x or 1.x so you don't need to add an epoch23:27
pochusome people23:27
pochualready get lots of useless pings23:27
pochupersia: s/some people/I/ ? ;-)23:28
* pochu runs23:28
the_belgainwill do, thanks (that doesn't seem to be inline with the debian policy manual, but I guess that's OK?)23:28
pochuthe_belgain: why not? If it's a pure svn checkout it does.23:31
the_belgainok, fair enough - thanks for all the quick replies23:32
pochuthe_belgain: Or does upstream release tarballs as 20071219?23:32
pochuIn that case it should be 20071219+svn57823:32
the_belgainhttp://fuppes.ulrich-voelkel.de/download/23:33
the_belgainthe tarballs aren't explicitly dated23:33
pochuthat's  fuppes-SVN-578.tar.gz, so I'd go with 0+svn57823:34
jscinoz:P23:45
jscinozhey guys23:49
jscinozif i have non-free components that cant be included in the source package and are small file size can these be downloaded via the preinst script?23:50
slangasekonly if the package is in multiverse23:54
slangasekif it's in universe, installing it shouldn't pull non-free bits onto the system23:54
the_belgaini have a package which has dependencies in multiverse (lame in this case) - does that mean the package should be in multiverse?23:55
the_belgainpresumably yes?23:55
ScottKYes23:55
the_belgainjust checking, thanks23:55

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