[00:01] <articpenguin3800> will ext4 ever be in ubuntu
[00:01] <RAOF> Yes.  Your actual question is "will ext4 be in Ubuntu before it's in the mainline kernel".
[00:02] <RAOF> To that question I don't have an answer.
[00:02] <articpenguin3800> it got merged in 2.6.19
[00:03] <articpenguin3800> and ty tso said the stable version will be in 2.6.25
[00:03] <RAOF> Well, that suggests that Hardy+1 should have ext4 enabled, at least.
[00:05] <articpenguin3800> prob wont be default though
[00:05] <RAOF> Indeed.
[00:05] <RAOF> I'm personally very happy for not-hugely-tested-for-many-years filesystems to not be default.
[00:06] <articpenguin3800> to me its just ext3 with extents
[00:07] <RAOF> So it'll need a few less years testing before it's well tested.
[03:16] <BlackDiamonds> is there a dev roadmap somewhere so once can see the features planned for hardy ?
[03:17] <RAOF> blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu is about it.
[03:20] <BlackDiamonds> thanks again RAOF
[03:20] <BlackDiamonds> also, while you are here, how do I find out which packages are in main and which ones are in restricted ?
[03:21] <RAOF> apt-cache policy <pkgname> is a good tool
[03:21] <BlackDiamonds> thank you once again
[03:37]  * emgent night.
[07:51] <\sh> moins
[08:50] <\sh> pitti, ping seahorse, did you ever try it with a gpg smartcard reader?
[08:54] <\sh> pitti, seahorse can't cache the keys passphrase...so it can't be used with a smartcard reader, or you set e.g. your keyid explicitly with (debuild syntax) -k'0x<yourkeyid>!' <- the exclamation mark is important
[08:56] <\sh> pitti, the set keyid is not the keyid of the signing key on the card FYI
[09:03] <pitti> \sh: smartcard> no, I don't have such a thing
[09:04] <\sh> pitti, see :) and I'm hitted by this phenomenon...actually "don't cache passphrase" helps or setting -k'0xC098EFA8!' in my case..this will override gpgs default checking for a signature key
[09:25] <slangasek> lamont: yes, it was too late then because I had left for dinner; it's not too late now because I'm in the office
[09:27] <ogra> canonical, the company with the time shifting office ....
[09:27] <StevenK> It's a feature
[09:27] <ion_> I want a controllable time dilation field generator.
[09:28] <RAOF> ion_: I'll go you halves!
[09:29] <ion_> -EPARSE
[09:30] <ion_> sh: Thanks for the information!
[09:31] <\sh> pitti, I debugged a bit further...
[09:31] <slangasek> tjaalton: can you clarify for me why linux-restricted-modules has introduced a new "dummy package for easy transition" that has never existed in Ubuntu before? (fglrx-amdcccle)
[09:31] <\sh> pitti, it looks like that you need restart the pcscd (the daemon for accessing at least this reader)
[09:32] <\sh> pitti, after that you get this output http://paste.ubuntu.com/3825/
[09:32] <ion_> slangasek: IIRC the changelog said it’s for transition from the AMD debs.
[09:32] <\sh> pitti, and then it works...but with pinentry and with no seahorse dialog
[09:32] <tjaalton> slangasek: people are using the ATI installer generated debs, and upgrading to a new release fails
[09:32] <tjaalton> slangasek: and debian does it too
[09:33] <tjaalton> slangasek: I mean they have that package as well
[09:33] <tjaalton> for the same purpose
[09:35] <\sh> restarting session
[09:35] <ion_> Away nicks ftw.
[09:36] <tjaalton> slangasek: actually, I haven't checked what version numbers the ati debs use..
[09:38] <tjaalton> but we have an epoch now, so it should upgrade nicely
[09:40] <slangasek> tjaalton: ok; that was the speculation, but I wanted to confirm since the changelog/package description seemed ambiguous to me, thanks
[09:41] <tjaalton> slangasek: yeah, mostly copied from debian :/
[09:41] <\sh> pitti, it looks like that only gpg-agent works together with the pcscd nicely including caching of the smartcard pins
[09:41] <\sh> pitti, with only seahorse-agent in this session it doesn't work
[09:41] <davmor2> just wanted to say gvfs buggy but much better nice work :)
[10:01] <soren> cjwatson_: Would you object in any way if I changed openssh to generate the host keys from the init script, if they don't exist instead of doing it at postinst time?
[10:14] <coolbhavi> not able to change USB mouse to ps/2 mouse.. system is not recognising the mouse
[10:14] <coolbhavi> please help
[10:15] <TheMuso> coolbhavi: #ubuntu for support.
[11:28] <\sh> cjwatson, ping console-data, you added with the last merge the decision-tree* targets in debian/rules right?
[12:26]  * pitti defeats grub and does the hardy dance
[12:27] <lool> doko: I think you were proposing using -Bsymbolic by default; a blog post on today's planet gnome might interest you: http://www.gnome.org/~michael/activity.html#2008-01-23
[12:27] <lool> Hmm was mentionned yesterday as well
[12:34] <slangasek> pitti: is the hardy dance less or more embarrassing than the warty dance? :)
[12:35]  * Hobbsee waves to pitti.  finally caught up, have you?
[12:35] <pitti> slangasek: I think it gets worse with every release
[12:35] <pitti> hey Hobbsee
[12:45] <\sh> infinity2, bug #183495 please share the crack pipe you smoked to realise your idea ;)
[12:45] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 183495 in openbios-sparc "[FTBFS] openbios-sparc (1.0~alpha2+20070816-1) fails to build in hardy" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/183495
[12:46] <doko> lool: yes, but it is -Bsymbolic-functions
[13:04] <lamont> \sh: the only "workable" idea I've seen for something like 183495 is what palo does... and it's broken-ish
[13:05] <\sh> lamont, for me it looks like that every idea we had to deal with those packages, is somehow broken-ish...and imho involves all the time a buildd admin to install/remove/or whatever it needs
[13:06] <lamont> palo builds the offensive binary bit in the clean targetr.
[13:06] <\sh> lamont, well this doesn't help when you don't have <insert your arch here you need to build <arch>-bios>
[13:08] <\sh> lamont, well, adams idea would work if I would knew how to fetch an alien build-dep, e.g. i386 would build an Arch: all package, and the source pkg depends on the _sparc.deb...who do you do this in an automated environment?
[13:09] <\sh> s/who/how/
[13:10] <lamont> \sh: you have the requisite pieces of said alien-arch deb in the source package (since fetching the deb isn't reliably doable)
[13:12] <\sh> lamont, so you upload first the source-package which builds the e.g. bios-sparc.deb on the sparc buildd and then you fetch it from sparc archive and push it into a new source package which build Arch: all packages...
[13:13] <lamont> binary builds can't create source packages.
[13:14] <\sh> lamont, the other way around...
[13:14] <\sh> you need to create a new source package first, which uses the already available alien arch .deb to produce an Arch:all package
[13:26] <StevenK> bryce:
[13:26] <StevenK> Ooops
[13:39] <ScottK> I would appreciate it if whoever is arvchive admin for today would please have a look at libetpan in binary New for dapper-backports.  It's the last manual step needed in the clamav backport to Dapper.  It's holding up the sylpheed-claws-gtk2 backport (depwait) and so the currently available dapper sylpheed-claws-gtk2 is not compatible with the current dapper-backports clamav.
[13:39] <ScottK> Thanks.
[14:02]  * lamont notes that (at least in gutsy) pciutils depends on a lib in oldlibs
[14:05] <\sh> seb128, mr. ubuntu-gnome :) what can I say to gnome not always opening a window when an LVM device is generated by sbuild ?
[14:06] <\sh> seb128, I just deselected all hotplug and other media to be appearing on my desktop...but LVM devices are just popping up like mad
[14:12] <seb128> \sh: no idea, might be a gvfs thing
[14:13] <\sh> seb128, any idea where I can plug my brain in and find a solution to stop this annoyance? in some hidden gconf settings eventually?
[14:20] <\sh> seb128, it's the gvfs mounttracker who receives the dbus messages..and act on it...where can I adjust those settings?
[14:56] <seb128> \sh: not sure you can, gvfs is really new
[14:57] <seb128> \sh: can you describe how to trigger the bug?
[14:58] <\sh> seb128, well, use sbuild with LVM and start building a package...sbuild will create a snapshot lvm mount it and voila...you have a window with the contents of this mount
[14:58] <ion_> Yeah, Nautilus seems to open a new window for everything that is mounted now.
[14:59] <ion_> If i go to sftp://foo and gvfs mounts it, in addition to the active Nautilus opening it, a new window is opened as well.
[14:59] <\sh> seb128, which is in fact a normal behaviour for normal mounted devices, but using snapshots this can be annoying
[15:00] <\sh> seb128, forget my statement about "normal behaviour" Re: ion_
[15:00]  * lamont stabs at cdbs
[15:00] <pitti> mmmm cdbs :)
[15:01]  * Hobbsee stabs at lamont
[15:01]  * ion_ stabs at Hobbsee’s knife
[15:01] <\sh> pitti, saw my comment about seahorse? (filed a bug btw) I removed seahorse from Xsession.d now and back to gpg-agent
[15:02] <pitti> \sh: no, I didn't saw it
[15:02] <pitti> and I'm not really a seahorse expert unfortunately
[15:02] <lamont> pitti: I mean, what's so hard about writing an actual makefile that people find the need to bury everything under magic callback hooks that are burried 4 levels of included-makefiles away?
[15:03] <pitti> lamont: because we rather change build policy at one place rather than in 500 source packages
[15:03] <Hobbsee> ion_: i don't have a knife.  i don't *need* a knife.
[15:03] <\sh> pitti, well, this regression will hit everybody who is using a gpg smartcard (e.g. some of FSF people do) (bug #185563)
[15:03] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 185563 in seahorse "[hardy] seahorse agent doesn't work with gnupg smartcard readers" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/185563
[15:03] <lamont> pitti: never mind reviewing those packages to make sure it's the right change, etc. :-)
[15:03] <pitti> lamont: stuff like fixing translation domains, producing .pot files, symlinking gnome help files, etc.
[15:04] <pitti> lamont: with your argument you can also argue that using debhelper is bad because you don't see the raw commands that are executed
[15:06] <pitti> also, what's the point of writing 50 lines of boilerplate every time?
[15:07] <lamont> pitti: the best thing I can say about cdbs is "it's not DBS"
[15:08] <lamont> or rather, "It's a vast improvement  over DBS"
[15:08] <slangasek> gar, is there any way at all to remove an update-alternatives slave without removing the master?
[15:08] <lamont> slangasek: vi?
[15:08] <lamont> or were you meaning in a postinst?
[15:08] <slangasek> lamont: you mean /usr/share/cdbs/1/class/vi.mk?
[15:08] <slangasek> yes, in a postinst
[15:09] <lamont> hrm.. that would tend to lead one to really wanting to use update-alternatives, wouldn't it.
[15:09] <lamont> sed would be bad. :-)
[15:09] <slangasek> don't tempt me
[15:09] <slangasek> sed is my weakness
[15:10] <pitti> use perl then :-P
[15:10] <lamont> or patch update-alternatives?
[15:11] <Mithrandir> lamont: cdbs solves a completely different problem than DBS does.
[15:11] <Mithrandir> slangasek: remove both, reinstate the master?
[15:11] <slangasek> pitti: "it's my weakness" as in "I can't resist it"
[15:11] <slangasek> Mithrandir: that would kill the user's selections
[15:12] <Mithrandir> slangasek: you could save it..
[15:13] <pitti> soren: hm, building kvm-source now changed kvm from hanging in X to immediately segfaulting
[15:24] <slangasek> Mithrandir: apparently I can get away without doing that, I can just take over the slave name with a new path and it DWIM
[15:29] <soren> pitti: Ping me when you're back at your seat.
[15:48] <seb128> \sh: you can unactivated the new mounts window opening in the media tab in the preferences dialog
[15:48] <\sh> seb128, I did already...doesn't help
[15:48] <seb128> weird
[15:49] <\sh> seb128, yepp
[15:51] <\sh> seb128, I can see some hal rules which are triggering that...
[15:52] <\sh> seb128, and I don't know if they are handled like removable or hotplug media
[15:52] <seb128> no idea
[15:52] <asac_the_2nd> ANNOUCE: network manager 0.7 for hardy in my ppa ... it could deserve some moderate testing. remember to get the packages it would upgrade to your cache so you can downgrade without network in case it breaks :)
[15:52] <asac_the_2nd> https://edge.launchpad.net/~asac/+archive
[15:52] <seb128> require debugging and I've no similar setup nor willing to configure sbuild only to look at that we have a lot of other issue which impact on normal desktop use
[15:52] <Hobbsee> asac_the_2nd: are they working for at least 1 user already?
[15:52] <seb128> asac_the_2nd: that one has the dbus configuration?
[15:53] <seb128> Hobbsee: I'm running it since this morning without issue
[15:53] <Hobbsee> cool, OK
[15:59] <tjaalton> sweet, fedora will use upstart
[16:12] <asac_the_2nd> seb128: yes ... it should be fine by now
[16:13] <asac_the_2nd> Hobbsee: sure :) ... i guess a single person can live without network :)
[16:13] <Hobbsee> hehe :P
[16:14] <asac_the_2nd> soren: ready?
[16:15] <soren> asac_the_2nd: I just finished the un-cancellable stuff,yes.
[16:18] <soren> asac_the_2nd: And you want me to make sure that I have packages for my current existing network-manager, libnm-util, and wpasupplicant around?
[16:20] <soren> asac_the_2nd: Ok, here goes nothing.
[16:45] <tjaalton> asac_the_2nd: the new n-m failed on my laptop, doesn't recognize the devices at all
[16:53] <emgent> keescook, ping
[16:54] <emgent> hard idle :°
[17:03] <keescook> emgent: pong, hi!
[17:04] <emgent> heya :)
[17:04] <emgent> all good? :)
[17:05] <emgent> malone 173153
[17:05] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 173153 in audacity "[CVE-2007-6061] Denial of service and deletion of an arbitrary directory tree via symlink attack" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/173153
[17:05] <emgent> gutsy feisty e dapper ready, when you have time to upload, rembmer :P
[17:16] <ion_> sh: Yay for ruby1.9! Thanks for merging. :-)
[17:17] <\sh> ion_, hope it works
[17:58] <lool> slomo: Do you have the libsoup2.4 2.3.0~r1050 tarball around?  I'd like to push it to hardy
[18:03] <simon360> anyone here able to give me some help? I want to replace grub with gfxboot on the live CD, so the installer won't install grub, but will install gfxboot instead
[18:03] <simon360> I also need a bit of help making a gfxboot theme :\
[18:04] <simon360> and am somewhat noobish at developing :P , although I've been a Linux user for a few years
[18:05] <_MMA_> simon360: Reconstructor is the easiest way to do this.
[18:30] <pitti> soren: almost, but not quite...
[18:31] <soren> pitti: Erm... I'm sorry to hear that.
[18:31] <soren> No biscuit?
[18:31] <pitti> soren: I see the desktop, but no panel, etc.
[18:31] <simon360> _MMA_: I'm using reconstructor, but it doesn't replace grub with gfxboot afaik
[18:31] <soren> pitti: -ESOMEBODYELSESPROBLEM
[18:32] <soren> pitti: I blame seb :)
[18:32] <pitti> soren: I don't think so; the screen is cut off at the top
[18:32] <pitti> soren: the window is too small to see the entire screen, and I can't scroll
[18:33] <simon360> I have a simple gfxboot theme already, but I had something fancier in mind...
[18:33] <simon360> just a sec
[18:37] <simon360> http://img.skitch.com/20080124-g184as8q142wb4b82kq66jnhag.png
[18:37] <simon360> would something like that be easy/possible?
[18:38] <simon360> I know how to change the text, colors, backgtround, etc.
[18:38] <simon360> but moving the menu to the right is something I haven't figured out
[18:39] <_MMA_> simon360: The Ubuntu Forums #ubuntu-derivative or maybe #ubuntu-installer might be better places for this.
[18:39] <simon360> alright, thanks
[18:40] <calc> _MMA_: pitti said that we can demote ooo language-support-* depends once apt autoinstalls recommends
[18:40] <calc> _MMA_: so not yet but soon hopefully
[18:41] <_MMA_> calc: Awesome. Should shave a bit off Xubuntu and Ubuntu Studio disks. :)
[18:42] <somerville32> calc: Moving to Universe is not a demotion :P
[18:42]  * somerville32 makes posters to help spread the new paradigm.
[18:43] <_MMA_> somerville32: He's just talking about moving deps. Not actual packages.
[18:44] <somerville32> haha, sorry, hair trigger ;]
[18:45] <_MMA_> Yeah. Holster that thing. ;)
[18:52] <\sh> seb128_, this is really annoying...we need to fix that behaviour...
[18:53] <seb128_> you are welcome to send a patch, nobody else ran into the issue yet
[18:53] <seb128_> need to go to dinner now
[18:58] <Kano> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-ati/+bug/151974
[18:58] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 151974 in xserver-xorg-video-ati "[RV410] X700SE [1002:5e4f] - DRI images corrupted" [Undecided,Confirmed]
[18:58] <Kano> does anybody like to compile a new mesa for gutsy?
[19:06] <\sh> pitti, can you check this: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/3838/ (this is send out from dbus when a snapshot lvm device comes up, and I don't find anything in lshal about it)
[19:22] <calc> somerville32: not moving to universe, moving from Depends to Recommends
[19:25] <slomo> lool: sure... one moment
[19:26] <slomo> lool: http://slomosnail.de/~slomo/temp/libsoup2.4_2.3.0~r1050.orig.tar.gz
[19:28] <slomo> lool: i hope it gets accepted in debian soonish
[20:53] <\sh> I wonder if it's a sane setting for nautilus to set preferences->media_automount_open to false or to fix nautilus not to open local mounted devices, especially lvm snapshots
[23:58] <keisangi> hi there
[23:58] <keisangi> i have a problem with ubuntu 7.10 on my lenovo thinkpad x60,
[23:59] <Seveas> keisangi, support in #ubuntu
[23:59] <keisangi> inside eclipse, i have choppy sound and no keyboard responses
[23:59] <keisangi> i'm developping a game in java using lwjgl/slick2d