[00:00] <mornfall> So what are the priorities?
[00:00] <nosrednaekim> .45 between the eyes...
[00:00] <cheguevara> apachelogger, yeah, i get you, its just that bug tracker is huge :P
[00:00] <Riddell> port the existing bits to kde 4 is the priority (not super priority, we havn't been expecting anything for hardy, but it'll be needed for hardy+1)
[00:01]  * Nightrose is good at searching stuff
[00:01] <apachelogger> cheguevara: you just need to know how to search, really ;-)
[00:01] <Nightrose> +for
[00:01] <cheguevara> :P
[00:01] <cheguevara> am I right that the kde 4 packages are not yet auto assigned to kubuntu team
[00:01] <cheguevara> as in https://launchpad.net/~kubuntu-team/+packagebugs
[00:01] <mornfall> Riddell: Well, existing bits.
[00:02] <Riddell> cheguevara: right
[00:02] <mornfall> Riddell: The existing bits are beyond repair.
[00:02] <Riddell> mornfall: s/port/rewrite/ then
[00:02] <mornfall> We don't have yuriy around...
[00:02] <mornfall> Hm.
[00:03] <mornfall> I am fairly sure that I won't be able to do all the frontends we have now.
[00:03] <mornfall> For Hardy that is.
[00:03] <mornfall> But it shouldn't be too hard to do those.
[00:03] <mornfall> Notifier is trivial (guts-wise), but it should be a plasmoid or something I guess, so the UI bits are tricky.
[00:04] <Riddell> notifier has some tacked on bits these days, for apport and reboot notification
[00:04] <mornfall> For updater and installer, uh-uh. The .desktop infrastructure I can port over, but the UI needs to be done.
[00:05] <mornfall> Well, if I find time, I could do that, but. There is nontrivial amount of work on the common guts.
[00:05] <Riddell> but for hardy we'll be having kde 3 stuff on the kde 4 CD anyway, it's not a problem to resort back to kde 3 where there's gaps
[00:06] <mornfall> 1) *robust* dpkg handling (that's a number one, since that's the number one problem with old adept)
[00:06] <apachelogger> +1
[00:06] <mornfall> (Other robustness issues should be solved by now.)
[00:07] <mornfall> 1a) is the obvious under-the-hood coding
[00:07] <mornfall> 1b) is GUI conffile handling (wreaks havoc with current adept, somehow)
[00:07] <mornfall> 1c) is some debconf magic
[00:07] <mornfall> 1d) would be to get a controlling terminal, but I think that's optional
[00:08] <Riddell> I'd like to see terminals in GUI package apps die
[00:08] <Riddell> it's a nightmare with the dist-upgrade tool
[00:08] <mornfall> 2) would be download progress UI, which I am a total loss on how to implement
[00:09] <mornfall> As in, how to visualise the download, since there can be some parallelism with APT.
[00:09] <mornfall> I am not too fond of the current widget.
[00:09] <Riddell> doesn't it know the total amount to download and the amount currently downloaded?  a simple progress bar would be clearest
[00:09] <mornfall> Riddell: It's always been a nightmare.
[00:10] <apachelogger> mornfall: I dunno if it's just my personal perception, but adept always seemed kinda slow to me, updater for example (compared to the ubuntu counterpart)
[00:10] <mornfall> apachelogger: Not anymore.
[00:10] <apachelogger> very nice :D
[00:10] <mornfall> apachelogger: https://launchpad.net/~me-mornfall/+archive and go install it for homework.
[00:10] <Riddell> adept 3 is much faster
[00:11] <mornfall> There's still the xapian index update issue (that's somewhere around point 3)
[00:11] <mornfall> Which will make it slow to start from time to time. Although, a possible fix would be:
[00:11] <Riddell> mornfall: daily cron?
[00:11] <mornfall> build index in postinst and fork off a background job to update it when exiting
[00:11] <Riddell> along with the apt update
[00:12] <mornfall> Could do, but that won't work for everyone, I suspect.
[00:12] <mornfall> The xapian index is not required to be absolutely up to date.
[00:12] <pygi> but is suggested to be
[00:13] <mornfall> Why?
[00:13] <mornfall> Anyway, that's a technical issue.
[00:13] <mornfall> Anything else about priorities?
[00:13] <pygi> true
[00:14] <mornfall> With those 3 sorted out, we can have a decent package manager in KDE 4.
[00:14] <mornfall> It won't be able to edit sources.
[00:14] <mornfall> (For the time being, it can suggest to run software-properties-kde in the Sources tab.)
[00:14] <mornfall> Maybe even have a button for it.
[00:17] <Riddell> conffile handling always seems messy to me, would be nicer if it used a debconf interface
[00:17] <Riddell> but I expect there's a reason it can't
[00:17] <mornfall> Riddell: It's actually better if it doesn't use debconf.
[00:17] <mornfall> Riddell: But some packages use UCF which is debconf-based.
[00:17] <mornfall> But, dpkg has an interface for GUIs to handle the conffiles.
[00:18] <Riddell> oh, ok
[00:18] <mornfall> (Same as for the progress reporting.)
[00:19] <Riddell> I would think just caring about manager until it works would be sensible, worrying about the otherrontends might be a distraction
[00:20] <mornfall> Ok. I also think that with the current interface, it is more graspable for newbies.
[00:20] <mornfall> Some filtering options will appear, but it should stay fairly clean.
[00:21] <Riddell> yes, although I'm no totallyt convinced at the expanding list items
[00:21] <mornfall> Hm. I still don't have better solution for that...
[00:21] <Riddell> it would need another panel to hte side or bottom, which takes up screen space
[00:22] <mornfall> The split-view has a different set of problems. It's pick your poison kind of choice.
[00:22] <Riddell> yes
[00:23] <Riddell> well, it's late, has that helped?  any other questions?
[00:23] <mornfall> Me? Probably no. Thanks.
[00:24] <Riddell> my roommate has gone to sleep so it's probably time for me to do so too
[00:24] <apachelogger> :)
[00:24] <mornfall> (I just needed to make sure I have priorities roughly matched with expectations...)
[00:25] <apachelogger> Riddell: btw, we have to patch KDE for the desktop files
[00:25] <mornfall> Goodnight then, I should probably sleep, too.
[00:26] <apachelogger> Riddell: because setting the XDG var in env won't solve the issue really - gnome doesn't use env and everything else would result in the same issue
[00:26] <mhb> goodnight Riddell
[00:26] <mhb> and everyone
[00:27] <mhb> thanks for being here
[00:27] <mornfall> apachelogger: (Try the profile files in /etc maybe, they may be sourced upon login.)
[00:27] <cheguevara> good night everyone
[00:27] <apachelogger> mornfall: well it will always have the same issues
[00:27] <apachelogger> either the configuration is too global
[00:27] <apachelogger> as the stuff in etc
[00:27] <apachelogger> which would also apply to KDE 4
[00:27] <apachelogger> hence not improve the situation at all
[00:28] <apachelogger> or it is too specific like env which is only used by kde really
[00:28] <mornfall> apachelogger: You can combine them: apply it in /etc and undo in kde4-env.
[00:28] <apachelogger> uhh, I think a patch is easier then :P
[00:44] <bmk789> @schedule
[02:16] <blizzzek> gn8
[03:37]  * emgent night.
[04:10] <Datalanche> Zzz..
[09:12] <juliux> hi doko
[14:19] <gcleric> exit
[15:39] <juliux> @schedule berlin
[15:39] <ubotu> Schedule for Europe/Berlin: 30 Jan 13:00: Edubuntu meeting | 01 Feb 21:00: MOTU | 13 Feb 23:30: Forum Council