/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2008/01/24/#ubuntu-mobile.txt

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smagounlool: I posted a debdiff for the hildon glade file in cheese yesterday; did you get a chance to look at it? people.ubuntu.com/~smagoun/cheese-2.21.5-update-hildon-glade.debdiff15:38
smagountry again: http://people.ubuntu.com/~smagoun/cheese-2.21.5-update-hildon-glade.debdiff 15:39
loolsmagoun: I got it, yes15:39
loolsmagoun: But you weren't on IRC when I wanted to reply15:39
loolsmagoun: I didn't try it out though15:39
smagounlool: sorry, wife and kid to attend to :)15:39
loolsmagoun: Oh sure, I don't expect you to be around all the time15:40
loolsmagoun: So one option is that I go pester my sponsor to sponsor this additional update, but I think it would be simpler if you could simply request sponsoring for this debdiff15:40
loolsmagoun: There's no reason it shouldn't go to hardy right now :)15:41
smagounlool: I'd be happy to. I assume I need to fix the version in the changelog (from ubuntu1um1 to ubuntu2)?15:41
loolsmagoun: I guess either one of StevenK or Mithrandir could sponsor it; I asked seb128 to sponsor my upload; you can request sponsoring for main via bug reports to launchpad15:41
loolsmagoun: Correct15:41
loolsmagoun: I would mention that the changes are in the 40_hildon patch15:42
loolsmagoun: If you get access to the cheese.hildon.glade file, it would be nice to send the updated file to Matthew15:42
loolsmagoun: Matthew Garrett <mjg59@srcf.ucam.org>15:43
smagounalright, I'll file a bug. Am I correct that I need to attach the debdiff to the bug, assign the bug to myself, mark it as confirmed, then subscribe ubuntu-main-sponsors to the bug?15:43
loolsmagoun: That sounds about right15:43
smagounlool: I'll sent it to him, thanks15:43
loolsmagoun: You can also pester Mithrandir and StevenK I guess :-P15:43
loolsmagoun: The bug is nice though as it will allow you to present your work for MOTU candidacy15:44
smagoun:)15:44
loolYou do want to become MOTU _right_?  :)15:44
smagounlool: absolument!15:46
agoliveirasmagoun: ... and may God have mercy upon your soul...15:57
Hobbseehah15:58
Hobbseeagoliveira: said by a non-MOTU :)15:58
agoliveiraHobbsee: That's exactly my point :)15:58
Hobbseeagoliveira: then again, that could be said for many things15:59
davidmHello15:59
Mithrandirpackaging is hard, let's go shopping.15:59
* Hobbsee waves to davidm15:59
Mithrandirhiya David16:00
agoliveiraHobbsee: Mithrandir, I wish...16:00
agoliveiradavidm: Hi again16:00
agoliveiraMithrandir: not particulary hard I guess, just freaking boring.16:00
Hobbseeagoliveira: not enough problem solving?16:01
agoliveiraHobbsee: No, far from it. Just not the kind I like. To me it's like go to the dentist. I know I have to and I do it from time to time but it does not mean I have to like it.16:03
Hobbseemmm16:04
Hobbseeagoliveira: so get rid of it, and get dumped with all the incredibly difficult problems instead?16:04
agoliveiraHobbsee: Maybe :) but I don't have a choice, it's part of my job.16:05
agoliveiraI mean, if I want to keep my job, of course :)16:06
* Hobbsee would have thought there would be other people happy to do more packaging, and shelve some of their more complicated stuff that they didn't like doing.16:07
Hobbsee(ie, and swap)16:07
Hobbseeunless the aim is to get you skilled in every section, of course16:07
agoliveiraHobbsee: Yeah, maybe I can get a raise after all :P16:08
Hobbseeagoliveira: a raise would be required?  i would have thought it was worth it from the job satisfaction POV16:09
agoliveiraHobbsee: Not required but aways nice nonetheless. But don't get me wrong, I really like my job as a whole and specially the company I'm working for (or I rather leave, I'm not shy in that department) just there's some things I "dislike" to do more than others, that's all.16:12
loolagoliveira: Are you going to the Bossa Conference on open source and mobile devices?16:13
Hobbseeagoliveira: eparse - the bit in the brackets16:13
ian_brasillool: yes i think so16:14
loolWould be nice to represent UME there and meet the maemo folks I'd guess16:14
agoliveiralool: Well, I really want to be there, just need davidm's ok ;)16:15
ian_brasilyou seen the place in Recife..very chic16:15
looldavidm: http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS8375523931.html16:16
loolfunded by ian_brasil's company IIUC?16:16
ian_brasili wish it were my company...you see the first quarter results?16:16
ian_brasilNokia on Thursday reported fourth quarter 2007 net sales of EUR 15.7 billion16:17
agoliveiralool: Actually, I added that to the conferenceattendence wiki a few weeks ago.16:17
ian_brasiland debconf in argentina too16:19
loolNokia is too rich16:22
loolThey should give money away16:22
Mithrandirthey give out hardware instead.16:23
ian_brasilit is a drop in the ocean fir sure but have a look at http://shareideas.org/index.php/Main_Page 16:24
loolMithrandir: By *cough* mirror16:24
lool*error16:27
loolDamn16:27
loolHow could I write mirror instead of error16:27
suihkulokkilool: they do give money away. buy shares and they'll give you too :)16:50
loolsuihkulokki: haha16:51
HappyCamp_laptopagoliveira: Did you get a coat for the trip?16:57
agoliveiraHappyCamp_laptop: Yeah, bought a good one in a sports store. The kind one uses for trekking, warm and waterproof.16:58
HappyCamp_laptopGood to hear :)  I'm sure you will survive16:58
HappyCamp_laptopWe do keep the buildings fairly warm ;)16:58
agoliveiraHappyCamp_laptop: I lived in NJ/NY for some time during winter so I have a good idea :)16:59
HappyCamp_laptopWell we don't get that cold here!16:59
agoliveiraHappyCamp_laptop: I tought it was actually colder but below a certain point it's all the same to me :)17:00
davidm#startmeeting17:00
MootBotMeeting started at 17:00. The chair is davidm.17:00
MootBotCommands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]17:00
davidmIt's that time again17:00
davidmI'm thinking this will be failry short since the sprint is next week and we only have two prior items and no current items yet.17:01
* bspencer__ quickly updates agenda...17:02
alek_desk:)17:02
davidm[topic] Michael Frey (ChickenCutlass) to produce boot charts for squashfs vs ext317:02
MootBotNew Topic:  Michael Frey (ChickenCutlass) to produce boot charts for squashfs vs ext3 17:02
ChickenCutlassThere is a boot chart uploaded to http://people.ubuntu.com/~smagoun/mfrey-bootchart-20080117-1.png17:02
ChickenCutlassThis is for ext3 since agoliveira already did charts for squashfs17:02
davidmvery good17:03
loolStill quite CPU bound it seems17:03
MithrandirChickenCutlass: agoliveira doesn't have a menlow system, though.17:03
ChickenCutlassIf anyone sees anything that jumps out please shout17:03
smagounChickenCutlass: that's on the C0 CB, right?17:03
agoliveiraIndeed, I tried on my Q1.17:03
davidm[link] http://people.ubuntu.com/~smagoun/mfrey-bootchart-20080117-1.png17:03
MootBotLINK received:  http://people.ubuntu.com/~smagoun/mfrey-bootchart-20080117-1.png 17:03
ChickenCutlasssmagoun, yes C0 CB17:03
ChickenCutlassah did  not know that agoliveira was on Q117:04
ChickenCutlassnot CB17:04
Mithrandirsmagoun: weren't you going to talk to cjwatson about getting ckbcomp and such to not be run on each boot?17:04
agoliveiraLooks even more cpu-bound than on Q1.17:04
Mithrandiralso, have you tested with the hardy image?17:04
smagounMithrandir: once upon a time, yes. Other things have gotten in the way17:04
ChickenCutlassno -- have not done any Hardy testing17:04
davidmsmagoun, can you take an action to talk to cjwatson about getting ckbcomp and such to not be run on each boot?17:05
Mithrandirsmagoun: can we give you an action to get that done?  It should shave off 2s on the boot time, which is good (and basically free)17:05
smagoundavidm: yes17:05
davidm[action] smagoun, to talk to cjwatson about getting ckbcomp and such to not be run on each boot?17:06
MootBotACTION received:  smagoun, to talk to cjwatson about getting ckbcomp and such to not be run on each boot? 17:06
davidmsmagoun, thanks17:06
Mithrandirit'd be interesting to see if hardy is any better as well.17:06
bspencer__I'm not certain what we've discovered (excuse my naivety)17:06
Mithrandirany chance you could be convinced to take on that?17:06
bspencer__is ext3 much faster?17:06
davidmChickenCutlass, what would it take to run the same test on Hardy?17:07
ChickenCutlassdavidm, I could run the test -- do we have a Hardy image ready?17:07
agoliveirabspencer__: It's not a very fair way to compare as we used 2 different platforms but the answer would be no.17:07
ToddBrandthere17:08
davidmChickenCutlass, we do 17:08
ChickenCutlassdavidm, ok -- give me URL and I will test it17:08
bspencer__agoliveira: sure.  so we are going to do a valid test on Menlow.. or even one on Q1 with both ?17:08
davidmWe actually need to do three tests ext3 since the prior test was not on CB and then both on hardy17:08
agoliveirabspencer__: That kind of answers I guess ;)17:09
davidm[action] ChickenCutlass to to produce boot charts for squashfs vs ext3 for hardy and boot charts for gutsy ext3 on CB17:09
MootBotACTION received:  ChickenCutlass to to produce boot charts for squashfs vs ext3 for hardy and boot charts for gutsy ext3 on CB 17:09
davidmMithrandir, can you provide URL to ChickenCutlass for hardy image please?17:09
amitkis udev or related scripts maxing out the cpu between 12 and 20s?17:10
bspencer__smagoun: in your chart, does it show the time of loading Hildon/mozembed/home screen ?  I'm trying to find related info.  When does the timing measurement end during boot process?17:10
davidm[action] Mithrandir to provide ChickenCutlass URL to hardy images17:10
MootBotACTION received:  Mithrandir to provide ChickenCutlass URL to hardy images 17:10
MithrandirChickenCutlass: http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/moblin/hardy/ has hardy images17:10
ChickenCutlassMithrandir, thanks17:10
Mithrandiramitk: it's called "kernel is in modprobe land", I think.17:11
Mithrandiramitk: but udev is spinning waiting for the kernel to return.17:11
amitkMithrandir: i thought that was done between 2 and 7s17:11
amitkbut you are probably right, there are calls to modprobe from udev too17:12
Mithrandiramitk: the first one is initramfs, the second one is the normal system17:12
smagounbspencer__: the chart ends before mozembed starts17:12
bspencer__smagoun: so it is really >35s before the user sees a UI he can interact with17:12
bspencer__perhaps >40s17:12
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smagounbspencer__: yes. the chart doesn't include the bios (10sec) or bootloader (2sec) either17:13
alek_deskbspencer__, that's why Martin is working on fast boot17:13
bspenceralek_desk: we are interested in fast boot but normal boot is also very important to reduce17:13
alek_deskof course17:13
davidmOK can we look at this further next week at the sprint?17:15
davidmChickenCutlass, is it possible to get the tests run before the sprint?17:15
ChickenCutlassdavidm, I can do the gutsy ext3 no problem but I need a saved MIC project for Hardy to do the ext3 test17:16
davidmChickenCutlass, OK thanks that will help17:16
davidmMithrandir, can we get ChickenCutlass a saved MIC project for Hardy?17:16
Mithrandirbspencer: mjg59 at least is not very comfortable with shipping anything based on hibernate, since it mostly works by accident and he believes the error rate will be too high.17:16
Mithrandirdavidm: I'll see if I can get him one.17:17
bspencerMithrandir: I hear ya.17:17
bspencerI would really like to focus on reducing normal boot.17:17
Mithrandirbspencer: (I'm just the messenger here; I don't know the details, so please don't ask for them. :-)17:17
davidm[action] Mithrandir to try to get ChickenCutlass  a saved MIC project for Hardy quickly17:18
MootBotACTION received:  Mithrandir to try to get ChickenCutlass  a saved MIC project for Hardy quickly 17:18
davidmOK can we pick this up at the sprint?17:19
Mithrandirsounds good to me17:19
Mithrandirspeaking of which, will we have some C0 (or D0) systems available for hacking on?17:19
davidmYes Mauri said we will have some17:19
HappyCamp_laptopMithrandir: I think so, mawhalen was going to make sure we have some.17:19
Mithrandirexcellent17:20
davidm4 I think17:20
davidm[topic] Bob Spencer (bspencer) to continue checking that projects are tagged when they release and report back on whether this is the case.17:20
MootBotNew Topic:  Bob Spencer (bspencer) to continue checking that projects are tagged when they release and report back on whether this is the case. 17:20
bspencerI have not completed my action item.  Very sorry.  Will discuss it with the team before the sprint.  I've been out of the office Friday to Wednesday (yesterday)17:20
mawhalenYes, we will have at least 3 D0 systems to use during the Spring17:20
mawhalenSprint17:20
davidmbspencer, I'll carry the action17:20
davidmmawhalen, thanks for update17:20
davidm[action] Bob Spencer (bspencer) to continue checking that projects are tagged when they release and report back on whether this is the case.17:20
MootBotACTION received:  Bob Spencer (bspencer) to continue checking that projects are tagged when they release and report back on whether this is the case. 17:20
davidmNew business17:21
davidm[topic] Hildon 2.0 release discussion (bspencer)17:21
MootBotNew Topic:  Hildon 2.0 release discussion (bspencer) 17:21
bspencerHildon 2.0 has been officially released.  I would like to propose that we update to it.  Horace and I can do the work.  Here's the plan:17:21
bspencer  - Update to Hildon 2.0 in Ubuntu PPA17:21
bspencer  - Add new patches to make Hildon freedesktop.org compliant (small things)17:21
bspencer  - Add other patches already part of Ubuntu version of Hildon.17:21
bspencer(suggestions welcome)17:21
bspencerI'd like to clearly identify everything that is different from upstream and keep these separate as patches17:22
bspencerI also plan to add a webpage to moblin.org detailing the latest status of MID use of Hildon for pepole to see.17:22
loolbspencer: Did you discuss the XDG patches with upstream?17:22
bspencerI think this work will be small because we updated just 6weeks ago.  The diffs should be minor.17:23
bspencerlool, no because I didn't know if we had patches yet.17:23
loolOh ok17:23
bspencerbut we will do that.17:23
loolbfiller was also interested in participating, and naturally I am17:23
bspenceryes -- ok.  Will keep you two on all chatter I hear about it.17:23
bfillerbspencer: I have recently merged some of Horace's changes into Launchpad as well as a bunch of my own changes17:23
bfillerbspencer: we should make sure these all get included..17:24
bspencerbfiller: changes to Hildon in particular?17:24
bfillerbspencer: yes17:24
bspencerbfiller: agree  (all patches get included)17:24
bspencerbfiller: I'll take a look at your patches.  I'm interested to know what you updated.17:24
bspencer(but can do that offline)17:24
bspencerthat's all I have about Hildon 2.0 from my end.17:25
bfillerbspencer: maybe we could work on testing/debugging hildon 2.0 next week at sprint?17:25
loolbspencer: One thing which might be a bit hard if we want patches as patch files is to extract our current changes as patches17:25
bspencerbfiller: great idea.  Let's set that as a goal of the sprint.17:25
bspencerlool, agree.  I like the idea though if it is possible without killing us17:25
bspencerI'd like to separate upstream with our additions.  Not sure if that is feasible.17:26
loolWe can discuss this with more depth later on, but people have expressed disagreement with the usage of patches along with bzr: bzr branches should be used instead17:26
loolI personally don't mind one or the other; mixing bzr changes and patch files sounds bad though17:26
bspencerlool: true -- I recall such a discussion.  Let's chat at the sprint. 17:26
lool(I never managed a collection of patches as bzr branches so I find patch files easier for me at the moment ;)17:27
loolbspencer: *cough*17:27
loolbspencer: I wont be at the sprint17:27
loolbspencer: I'm moving to my new house after all17:27
lool(Date only slipped by 3 days)17:27
bspencerlool: ok.  new house (woo)17:27
bspencerthey must pay good at canonical ;)17:27
loolWill miss you all, folks!17:27
loolbspencer: Pffff :)17:28
davidmlool, will you have time Monday to talk further?17:28
loolbspencer: Yeah, 1 house in 3 months is pretty decent pay17:28
agoliveirabspencer: They have 50 years mortgages there...17:28
looldavidm: Certainly17:28
bspenceragoliveira:  lol 17:28
davidmOK can I suggest we take this up first thing Monday then?17:28
agoliveirabspencer: I'm not joking, ask Lool!17:28
looldavidm: I guess up to wednesday included, I should be able to clear anything outstanding17:28
bspencerdavidm: yes.  sounds good.  Thanks.17:28
davidmlool, great, thanks17:29
looldavidm: Absolutely, but with the TZ issue naturally17:29
davidm[action] further review of Hildon 2.0 release discussion at sprint Monday morning 17:29
MootBotACTION received:  further review of Hildon 2.0 release discussion at sprint Monday morning  17:29
lool(And while I'm at it: I wont be around from thursday next week for about 10 days)17:29
davidmOK that concludes new business17:30
bspencerlool:  so we need to settle on maintainership of the Hildon stuff too so we can make sure changes are doable while you are away17:30
bspencer(at the sprint)17:30
loolbspencer: Yep; albeit other people in the team can sort anything I suppose17:30
davidmAny other new business?17:31
amitkIntel was to provide us with a list of folks who should have logins on kernel.ubuntu.com for joint integration efforts. I haven't received those names yet.17:31
davidmbspencer, can you look into this for next week?17:31
alek_deskamitk, i know the name list17:31
bspencerdavidm: yes.17:31
davidm[topic] Intel was to provide Canonical with a list of folks who should have logins on kernel.ubuntu.com17:31
MootBotNew Topic:  Intel was to provide Canonical with a list of folks who should have logins on kernel.ubuntu.com 17:32
bspenceroh... spoke too soon.17:32
bspenceralek_desk: can do it :)17:32
amitkalek_desk: send me the names and preferred login ids in email17:32
davidmplease CC me too17:32
alek_deskamitk, sure17:32
alek_deskdavidm, ok17:32
davidm[action] alek_desk: to send Amitk and Davidm the names and preferred login ids in email for kernel.ubuntu.com logins17:33
MootBotACTION received:  alek_desk: to send Amitk and Davidm the names and preferred login ids in email for kernel.ubuntu.com logins 17:33
davidmOK any other new business?17:33
davidmamitk, please edit the wiki page with the item17:33
davidmgoing once............17:33
amitkdavidm: sure17:34
davidmgoing twice............17:34
davidm#endmeeting17:34
MootBotMeeting finished at 17:34.17:34
davidmlool, can you join me now in the conference room near where I am sitting please?17:35
looldavidm: Absolutely17:35
asac_the_2ndraji: network manager 0.7 bits are avail my ppa ... if you wanna give it a try: https://edge.launchpad.net/~asac/+archive17:35
cjwatsonMithrandir,smagoun,davidm: pretty sure I fixed that console-setup issue already in hardy; I think I mailed some subset of you about it17:51
cjwatson  * Backport from trunk:17:51
cjwatson    - Run setupcon with --save in the postinst to ensure that required data17:51
cjwatson      is copied to /etc.17:51
cjwatson    - Load the saved keymap in /etc/console-setup/boottime.kmap.gz if17:51
cjwatson      available rather than running ckbcomp (which is slow), unless we're17:51
cjwatson      being called with --save or --save-only.17:51
cjwatsonconsole-setup 1.19ubuntu117:51
Mithrandircjwatson: oh, of course.  That image is based off gutsy which explains it.17:52
Mithrandirsmagoun: ^ ; you probably want to put that into the gutsy ppa.17:52
cjwatsoncan give you the isolated diff if you want17:56
loolIf you have it available, that'd be nice17:56
cjwatsonyou want http://codebrowse.launchpad.net/~vcs-imports/console-setup/trunk/revision/19 and http://codebrowse.launchpad.net/~vcs-imports/console-setup/trunk/revision/2017:58
loolThanks!17:58
smagouncjwatson: Mithrandir thanks. I'll look at that today.17:59
loolsmagoun: I have an upload for the above ready; mind if I push to the gutsy ppa for you to have a look?18:55
smagounlool: that would be great18:57
mawhalendavidm: ping19:19
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smagounlool: the console-setup you added to the gutsy ppa seems to work. I'll try to get performance numbers tomorrow. Thanks!22:20
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