[02:58] <Debolaz> Are there any ways for multiple people to access repos on my machine through a single ssh account, but not let everyone have access to every repository?
[03:55] <minghua> When I am in the commit log editor after running "bzr commit", "bzr diff" gives an error message about some locks and can't produce a diff.  Is this expected?  Is it possible to change this?  Should I report a bug?
[09:10] <snod> hi, one question, can't bzr handle umlauts in filenames?
[09:11] <snod> if have a bzr repo pushed to a sftp location and branched it via http and the umlaut is replace by two ##
[09:12] <snod> i created the repo on a linux machine with utf8 and branched it on a mac os box
[09:12] <lifeless> the mac file system does unicode NFD normalisation
[09:13] <lifeless> bzr will preserve the umlaut happily - branch it onto e.g. a iso-8859-1 locale, or windows, or even utf16 and it should all work fine, but mac's give us grief
[09:14] <snod> ah ok :) damn mac filesystem
[09:14] <snod> ah i just found the unicode page on bazaar-vcs.org
[09:16] <snod> so it doesn't work right now?
[09:20] <lifeless> well, it should preserve the filenam when you go back to unix IIRC, it will depend on what bzr st shows
[09:20] <lifeless> but yeah, expect some glitches I think :(
[09:20] <lifeless> gotta run, ciao
[09:22] <snod> cu and thanks for the help
[17:22] <schierbeck> ping
[17:25] <arne^> pong
[17:35] <ubotu> New bug: #186194 in bzr "option to follow symlinks" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/186194
[17:56] <scorpioxy> Hey guys, i have a problem with the launchpad plugin it seems. On the launchpad page, it says that i can push using the lp:~username.... string, but doing that bzr errors out with a "cannot lock" error because it redirects to an http location. Is this is a bzr thing or is the launchpad page wrong?
[18:45] <iKs> Hey !
[18:45] <iKs> I'd like to know if it is possible to specify a port when you commit on bzr+ssh :)
[18:46] <iKs> cause I'm behind a proxy and one of the only open port is 443
[18:46] <iKs> so I have to commit through that :D
[18:46] <iKs> I made my sshd listen on both port 443 and 22 but I need to specify it on the command line
[18:53] <jelmer> afaik bzr+ssh://host:port/ should work
[18:57] <iKs> hum OK
[18:57] <iKs> thx
[19:09] <Stavros> hello
[19:09] <Stavros> is there a visual studio bzr plugin available?
[21:21] <schierbeck> jelmer: ping
[21:22] <jelmer> schierbeck, pong
[21:22] <schierbeck> | *
[21:22] <schierbeck>     *
[21:22] <schierbeck>      *
[21:22] <schierbeck>       | *
[21:22] <schierbeck> hah!
[21:23] <schierbeck> jelmer: do you have 2 minutes to talk about the viz?
[21:23] <jelmer> :-)
[21:23] <jelmer> sure
[21:24] <schierbeck> i'm thinking about adding in the About window again
[21:25] <schierbeck> i think it's important that it's there
[21:25] <schierbeck> but should Olive and the viz share the same window?
[21:25] <schierbeck> i kind of consider them different applications, which happen to reuse some of the same widgets
[21:26] <jelmer> yeah, same here
[21:26] <jelmer> Adding an about dialog would be a good idea
[21:28] <schierbeck> the thing is, i consider the viz to be part of the core bzr-gtk, while Olive is more peripheral to me
[21:28] <schierbeck> but then again, i'm not an Olive user myself
[21:28] <schierbeck> i think they should have different About dialogues
[21:30] <jelmer> I think there already is a bzr-gtk About dialog
[21:30] <jelmer> we could just use that
[21:32] <schierbeck> okay
[21:32] <schierbeck> i'll hook up the menu to it
[21:39] <schierbeck> jelmer: the current about dialog shows info on bazaar, not bzr-gtk
[21:40] <jelmer> it should be adapted then
[21:44] <schierbeck> done
[21:44] <schierbeck> i'll push it to lp, 30 sec
[21:45] <schierbeck> this version also reads in COPYING instead of just displaying "GPL v2" in the license window
[21:46] <schierbeck> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~dasch/bzr-gtk/viz-about-dialog
[21:50] <schierbeck> jelmer: do i need to send in a merge request? after all, we're the only two active devs atm
[21:50] <fullermd> Ooh, people are touching viz?
[21:51] <jelmer> schierbeck: well, a patch to the list would be useful in any case
[21:51] <schierbeck> fullermd: :)
[21:51] <schierbeck> jelmer: okay, i'll send it in
[21:51]  * fullermd pimps for bug 183627.
[21:51] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 183627 in bzr-gtk "viz crams revid onto your clipboard" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/183627
[21:53] <schierbeck> jelmer: sent
[21:55] <schierbeck> fullermd: i'm not sure how to get around it
[21:55] <schierbeck> the fields ought to be selectable
[22:00] <fullermd> Selectable is great; it's the autoselecting part that's...   well, kinda offensive.
[22:06] <schierbeck> fullermd: i know, i'm looking into having it not do it
[22:07]  * fullermd nods.
[22:07] <fullermd> It's not like it's a big thing.
[22:07] <schierbeck> it's puzzling me atm
[22:07] <fullermd> Just a rather irritating small thing.
[22:07] <schierbeck> yup
[22:08] <schierbeck> jelmer: at some point we need to talk about the Changes page
[22:08] <schierbeck> i still think it's a good idea
[22:09] <jelmer> schierbeck: ok, will have a look at your merge request later today
[22:10] <schierbeck> thanks :)
[22:10] <jelmer> schierbeck: I still don't, for various reasons
[22:11] <schierbeck> fair enough, just as long as we can discuss it
[22:12] <jelmer> Perhaps we can come to a compromise or something
[22:13] <schierbeck> yup
[22:14] <schierbeck> i'm thinking about perhaps getting rid of the Relations page, to cut down on complexity
[22:14] <jelmer> It's not as much the complexity that I have problems with
[22:14] <jelmer> It's the fact that it mixes metadata with contents in the same widget
[22:14] <jelmer> a widget which is meant to be relatively small (sufficient to display that metadata)
[22:15] <jelmer> and doesn't allow diffing against multiple parents
[22:15] <schierbeck> the current version does allow diffing against multiple parents
[22:15] <schierbeck> still haven't implemented the file list
[22:15] <schierbeck> but it's coming
[22:16] <jelmer> The file list is going to take up a fair chunk of space
[22:16] <jelmer> more even than the metadata usually needs
[22:16] <schierbeck> i'm thinking about using a toggle button to show and hide it
[22:16] <jelmer> I would rather just have an optional diff widget below the metadata
[22:17] <schierbeck> i don't think it'll be a real issue
[22:17] <schierbeck> i think another widget *would* add to the complexity
[22:17] <jelmer> It's separate of the metadata
[22:17] <jelmer> The size is really going to be an issue
[22:17] <schierbeck> would still introduce more content on the ui at the same time
[22:18] <schierbeck> i think we should try it out before deciding on that; i really get a lot of requests for this feature
[22:19] <schierbeck> besides, in the viz, the revisionview widget is as wide as the diff window itself is
[22:19] <jelmer> I've tried your branch, and it really doesn't work well for large commits
[22:20] <schierbeck> yeah, it needs the file selector widget
[22:20] <jelmer> yes it would be as wide, but the metadata bit is supposed to be quite small
[22:20] <jelmer> (in height, that is)
[22:21] <schierbeck> the user can freely change the height if it becomes necessary
[22:21] <schierbeck> i just think it's important to show the diff in a relevant context
[22:22] <schierbeck> otherwise, changing parents would be confusing
[22:22] <schierbeck> and besides, it doesn't harm; the extra tab takes up minimal space
[22:22] <schierbeck> the diff is only loaded when the page has focus
[22:23] <schierbeck> i think we should include it in a release -- if it gets a bad reception, we'll take it out again.
[22:38] <jelmer> re
[22:39] <jelmer> schierbeck: how would showing the diff below not be in the relevant context?
[22:39] <jelmer> schierbeck: I think metadata and contents are conceptually different and should be displayed in a different area
[22:39] <schierbeck> it would, but i just don't see how adding another main widget to the window will help
[22:39] <jelmer> that also makes it possible to view the revision metadata and contets at the same time
[22:39] <schierbeck> jelmer: i don't think our users think about it that way
[22:40] <schierbeck> i just don't see the need
[22:40] <schierbeck> and if we needed to display both metadata *and* content, we *would* run in to size problems
[22:42] <jelmer> schierbeck: I doubt that, see giggle's layout for example
[22:43] <schierbeck> jelmer: i hate giggle's layout :)
[22:43] <schierbeck> way too crowded
[22:43] <schierbeck> we should only display the absolutely necessary to the user
[22:43] <jelmer> Well, giggle has more than this
[22:43] <schierbeck> yup
[22:43] <schierbeck> too much more
[22:43] <jelmer> schierbeck: Just putting everything in tabs is confusing as well imho
[22:44] <schierbeck> it's incremental complexity; the user chooses to see more
[22:45] <jelmer> We could make the widget with the diff on the bottom of the screen detachable
[22:45] <jelmer> so you get the same effect you have now
[22:45] <jelmer> if you want to
[22:46] <schierbeck> i think that would introduce a *lot* of complexity -- think the detachable menus in the GIMP
[22:46] <schierbeck> it's just confusing
[22:46] <schierbeck> but if the users want it, sure
[22:46] <jelmer> yes, a lot of detachable things is confusing, but a couple doesn't hurt
[22:46] <schierbeck> i think we should start out simple, and see how the user base reacts
[22:46] <schierbeck> if they want a detachable widget, we'll create one
[22:47] <schierbeck> but we need to start somewhere
[22:47] <jelmer> ok, so let's leave that out of the picture for now then
[22:47] <schierbeck> ok
[22:48] <jelmer> in any case, the diff bit could be hideable
[22:48] <schierbeck> yup
[22:49] <schierbeck> but i still think we should go for minimal intrusion
[22:49] <jelmer> That's not an argument for using a tab though..
[22:50] <jelmer> we could just make the bottom widget hidden by default and add a button to enable showing it
[22:50] <schierbeck> well, it's the solution that adds the least complexity to the startup view
[22:50] <ubotu> New bug: #186238 in bzr "TB when cloning an SVN trunk into repo in "subversion" format" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/186238
[22:51] <schierbeck> i'd like the advanced users to be able to have an inline diff view, but not to bother newbies
[22:51] <jelmer> schierbeck: if we hide the widget by default but add a toggle button to allow showing it, that's equilly intrusive as a tab
[22:52] <schierbeck> jelmer: but when it's shown, it takes up much more vertical space
[22:52] <schierbeck> making it hard to see the contents
[22:52] <jelmer> schierbeck: Yes, but you could resize it any way you want
[22:52] <schierbeck> perhaps we could add a toggle that switched between the two layouts
[22:52] <schierbeck> jelmer: still, treeview + revisionsview + diffview
[22:53] <schierbeck> "Show changes beneath revision info"
[22:53] <schierbeck> if it's on, the tab disappears, and the diff view is shown at the bottom
[22:53] <schierbeck> ?
[22:54] <schierbeck> compromise?
[22:55] <jelmer> schierbeck: Having more than one way to show it in this case doesn't make sense imho
[22:56] <schierbeck> we'll, then we're in disagreement :)
[22:56] <schierbeck> i like the tab approach the best, you the separate widget approach
[22:56] <schierbeck> we really could use some more opinions
[22:57] <jelmer> Conceptually the contents just aren't part of the metadata nor do they have the same size constraints
[22:57] <schierbeck> jelmer: i really don't think that's going to be an issue
[22:58] <schierbeck> in the context of the viz, it won't matter at all
[22:58] <schierbeck> and we can just disable it anywhere else
[23:00] <jelmer> fullmermd: ping
[23:00] <bronger> My plan is to clone an SVN trunk as a local Bazaar branch.  This works, however, I cannot use it within a Bazaar repo.  Moreover, I cannot setup a Bazaar repo and clone a secondary branch of that SVN branch into this repo.  So, is it completely impossible to use shared repositories if subversion is involved?
[23:00] <jelmer> bronger: what error do you get?
[23:00] <bronger> It complains that the formats don't fit together.
[23:01] <jelmer> bronger: see the FAQ, use bzr init-repo --rich-root-pack
[23:01] <bronger> bzr: ERROR: Repository KnitPackRepository('file:///home/bronger/src/bobcat/.bzr/repository/') is not compatible with repository SvnRepository('https://svn.origo.ethz.ch/bobcat')
[23:01] <bronger>  -- OR --
[23:01] <bronger> bzr: ERROR: Repository KnitPackRepository('file:///home/bronger/src/bobcat/.bzr/repository/') is not compatible with repository KnitRepository('file:///home/bronger/src/bobcat-svn-mirror/.bzr/repository/')
[23:01] <bronger> Depending on what I do exactly.
[23:03] <jelmer> schierbeck: There's no reason for the other tabs to be that large though
[23:03] <jelmer> schierbeck: and it doesn't allow the metadata to be visible at the same time as the contents
[23:04] <schierbeck> jelmer: i don't think we really need to show the metadata at the same time, and having the widgets next to each other will take up an unreasonable amount of space
[23:04] <schierbeck> i just don't think it'll fit
[23:05]  * jelmer tries
[23:06]  * schierbeck waits :)
[23:09] <schierbeck> jelmer: let's pick it up again tomorrow, i have to go
[23:09] <schierbeck> see ya!
[23:30] <ubotu> New bug: #127945 in bzr-svn "Integrate creating new branch functionality into standard push/branch" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/127945