[00:06] <nixternal> w00t, a new plasma theme already, and I must say, it rocks
[00:09] <nosrednaekim> nixternal: screenshot?
[00:09] <nixternal> ivan put it on kde-look.org already
[07:17] <freeflying> http://linuxfire.com.cn/~freeflying/pic/kdecn.png wallpaper for Chinese Spring Festival
[07:34] <mornfall> Okey, alpha2 built. Get it at https://launchpad.net/~me-mornfall/+archive and give it a go, if you've got time. Mind the instructions. Off to Brno, see ya later.
[08:37] <stdin> wowzers, http://trolltech.com/company/newsroom/announcements/press.2008-01-28.4605718236
[08:37] <Lure> Riddell, Hobbsee: new kdepim enterprise snapshot is in my ppa, ready for upload - would be great to have this for next alpha
[08:38] <Lure> no obvious regression here (just bug fixes) and this is what is planned to be released in 3.5.9
[08:38] <Lure> merge between 3.5.9 and enterprise is now complete
[09:02] <stdin> in ~13 mins there will be a live audiocast from Nokia on their proposed acquisition of Trollteck http://www.nokia.com/press
[09:07] <Lure> stdin: that is interesting!
[09:07] <stdin> Lure: thought I'd mention it ;)
[09:07] <Jucato> you want intersting? hang out in #qt and watch the sparks fly :)
[09:08] <stdin> I've already had more than a few highlights from #qt :p
[09:08] <_StefanS_> stdin, Lure: what are they discussing ?
[09:08]  * Lure joined #qt
[09:08] <Lure> _StefanS_: http://www.nokia.com/A4136001?newsid=1185531
[09:09] <Jucato> http://trolltech.com/28012008/28012008-letter <-- open letter. webpage: http://trolltech.com/28012008/28012008
[09:09] <_StefanS_> argh.
[09:10] <blizzzek> hi
[09:10] <_StefanS_> continue to honor kde open source blahblah.. yeah and for how long.
[09:14] <Lure> it might be interesting what does this means for gnome-embedded/maemo
[09:14] <Lure> I suspect they will still support both (qtopia and maemo)
[09:15] <_StefanS_> I think they will go qtopia since they own it by then... and can take it in any direction they want
[09:15] <Jucato> any "open source" direction I hope :)
[09:16] <_StefanS_> Jucato: well.. when you start having trouble finding the free downloads on qt side, its time to switch to another gui toolkit ;)
[09:16] <_StefanS_> side/site
[09:16] <Jucato> that's the scary part :(
[09:16] <_StefanS_> yup.
[09:17] <_StefanS_> its something that got increasingly hard on mysql.com for instance in the past years.
[09:17] <Lure> _StefanS_: I doubt they will close it
[09:17] <Lure> they have opened maemo
[09:17] <stdin> even if Qt went proprietary, this is a clause in the license that lets KDE take control of the latest open source version (as I understand it)
[09:18] <Lure> stdin: correct
[09:18] <Jucato> there's a loophole.. or something
[09:18] <_StefanS_> yep. for now.
[09:18] <_StefanS_> but lets see, we might be surprised.
[09:19] <_StefanS_> not meaning to be all negative :)
[09:19] <_StefanS_> btw., shouldn't we make knetworkmanager load automatically in kde4?
[09:19] <_StefanS_> even if its the knm from kde 3.x
[09:19] <Jucato> The agreement only takes effect if Trolltech (or Nokia) stops releasing Qt with an open source license
[09:20] <Jucato> what if Qt is still released as GPL.. but no longer really for X11?
[09:21] <_StefanS_> donno, we'll have to see...
[09:21] <Jucato> in that case, the FreeQt agreement won't take effect I think
[09:34] <Lure> Jucato: they will continue GPL version (from audicast)
[09:35] <Lure> Jucato: Qt will be used on phones, while Maemo/GNOME will stay where it is
[09:35] <Jucato> Lure: it's not really the license that bothers me... it's the focus of development... they can keep Qt and Qtopia GPL but let the X11 part decay
[09:35] <Lure> Jucato: with 5000 customers paying subscription I do not thin they can afford this
[09:36] <Lure> yes, they are not that many interested in X11, but still it is money coming in
[09:36] <Lure> now there is question about linux
[09:36] <Jucato> that's what I'm worried about.. I guess it's no secret that Nokia is really more focused on mobile platforms
[09:37] <stdin> heh "lineux"
[09:37] <Lure> stdin: ;-)
[09:37] <Jucato> lie-nuks
[09:39] <stdin> kubunt-oh :p
[09:39] <Lure> kde/kubutnu question!
[09:39] <Lure> shit, I lost audio... :-(
[09:39] <Jucato> that's my question!!
[09:39] <Lure> Jucato: great
[09:39] <stdin> Lure: I opened it in mplayer
[09:39] <stdin> "rtsp://rms1.netvision.de/encoder/ca4d16f0646f29c1122f3d6a46717166_c69f08af042cc8d89142792771ffd1c5.rm?timestamp=0124d399f20868211d56af4bc601d840&xtnd=.rm"
[09:40] <stdin> seems more stable than in a browser
[09:40] <Jucato> wow audio just died after my question got answered :)
[09:40] <Jucato> hahah ok
[09:40] <Lure> Jucato: what was the answer?
[09:41] <Jucato> I think it was Eirik or Haavard who answered. they'll still continue developing Qt/X11 in full force
[09:41] <stdin> the audio seems to die every now and then, I think it somehow actually crashes mplayer
[09:42] <Jucato> haven't had a crash. I think the silence was more from the phone line being dropped
[09:42] <Jucato> :)
[09:42] <Jucato> although using firefox :P
[09:43] <stdin> FF crashed twice, and I think mozilla-mplayer crashed a couple times
[09:44] <Jucato> Nokia "promises" to continue TT's current development efforts...
[09:45]  * stdin feels reassured by a "promise" from Nokia...
[09:45] <Jucato> it all boils down to how much you like/hate Nokia
[09:45]  * blizzzek as well...
[09:45] <Jucato> the feedback/outlook in #qt isn't really that good :)
[09:46] <stdin> Nokia = big company, a "promise" that isn't a legal contract is worth "NULL"
[09:47] <blizzzek> nokia closes a factury in germany despite clear profit >7 billion € → they do everything to maximize profit
[09:48] <Jucato> well, you it's no secret that it's a for-profit company :)
[09:48] <Jucato> -you
[09:49] <blizzzek> Jucato: one can go over the top...
[09:50] <Jucato> now to monitor planet gnome to see how the feet people react :)
[09:52] <stdin> http://www.opensource.nokia.com/contributions.html sure has a lot of gnome bits on it
[09:53] <Jucato> stdin: well, they did say they're still going to support (probably even focus) on Maemo for their IT's
[09:53] <Jucato> (internet tablets)
[09:57] <stdin> well, I think I'll go get some breakfast while I digest the news
[09:59]  * blizzzek munches carrots
[10:10] <_StefanS_> Lure: have you looked at the volume up/down keys on the thinkpads in hardy ?
[10:10] <_StefanS_> Lure: Mine doesn't work, so I dont know if we need another dcop-xmodmap-kmilo kind of thing.
[10:25] <jpetso> good: Qt will be used on a lot of mobile phones and will continue to be developed
[10:26] <jpetso> bad: probably no more or little "revolutions" to expect from Trolltech/Nokia which would further the cause of free software
[10:26] <jpetso> neutral: existing advantages are being kept
[10:27] <jpetso> overall, worst KDE news in a long time imho
[10:27] <Jucato> that depends on how much Nokia will try to control TT's development processes... which they said they won't touch much..
[10:27] <Jucato> jpetso: depends on who you ask :)
[10:28] <jpetso> Jucato: myself, of course. personal judgement, not intended to extend to other people
[10:51] <Tonio_> hey
[10:52] <Jucato> hey :)
[11:06] <_StefanS_> hey Tonio_
[11:06] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: does the volume up/down work on your macbook in hardy?
[11:06] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: yes
[11:07] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: not here ;( - stuck at 0%-3%.
[11:07] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: I just have to change for pcm to be the default channel
[11:07] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: ah..
[11:07] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: :/
[11:07] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: in an alsa config somewhere?
[11:07] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: what about the battery ?
[11:07] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: do you see 2 batteries in guidance power manager ?
[11:07] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: 2 .. although I only have one
[11:07] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: yes.
[11:07] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: that has to be fixed
[11:07] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: I believe it was fixed in the final kernel 2.6.24
[11:08] <Tonio_> the first one is good, the second one value is completly stupid
[11:08] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: ah oki
[11:09] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: well, ofcourse I hope that the ubuntu-kernel team is expecting to put in the final 2.6.24 kernel in hardy
[11:09] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: then it should be fixed..
[11:12] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: no doubt it will
[11:12] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: I'm just asking benc to be sure
[11:12] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: oki :)
[11:14] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: yep, its going to be fixed in the kernel before release.
[11:14] <blizzzek> cya
[11:14] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: super
[11:15] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: well. now someone doesn't think it will be the case.. :-/
[11:15] <crimsun> _StefanS_: if it's present for some, it still isn't fixed for all.
[11:16] <crimsun> e.g., my hp pavilion
[11:16] <crimsun> also my thinkpad x41
[11:16] <_StefanS_> oh.. I just wrote you in #ubuntu-devel..
[11:16] <_StefanS_> crimsun: dont you just think the userspace apps need a change ?
[11:17] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: how did you change that default channel in kmix/alsa?
[11:17] <crimsun> _StefanS_: I don't know the ramifications of just changing such apps.
[11:17] <_StefanS_> crimsun: oh ok.. I just saw the details of the patch, and it would return an empty list for one of the batteries
[11:17] <_StefanS_> crimsun: (which wasn't actually a battery)
[11:19] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: found it... the hotkey still doesn't work btw..
[11:19] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: 0-3% :)
[11:20] <crimsun> if you have one of the newer santa rosa macbooks, a lot of things are still only partially functioning
[11:20] <_StefanS_> crimsun: well I have...
[11:20] <_StefanS_> crimsun: led backlight works like a charm though.
[11:23] <Tonio_> crimsun: I have the old macbook ati version
[11:24] <Tonio_> crimsun: talking about that, what about the sound support
[11:24] <crimsun> _StefanS_: what's `lspci -nv|grep -A1 0403` ?
[11:24] <Tonio_> crimsun: I remember we had a specific patch for feisty that worked much better
[11:24] <Tonio_> crimsun: the current sound support is a bit strange, as for example the switch to headphone doesn't work correctly...
[11:25] <Tonio_> crimsun: also left is mapped on 3D etc....
[11:25] <Tonio_> crimsun: isn't there a way to go back the feisty way ? I mean doing differently depending the macbook version
[11:25] <Tonio_> crimsun: that was really better at least for my macbook...
[11:26] <_StefanS_> crimsun: 00:1b.0 0403: 8086:284b (rev 03) \n Subsystem: 17aa:20ac
[11:26]  * _StefanS_ wonders why mute isn't mapped either..
[11:27] <crimsun> Tonio_: please follow up with the kernel team, as I no longer care for it.
[11:28] <Tonio_> crimsun: sure, I will. thanks
[11:28] <Lure> _StefanS_: no, not checked multimedia keys in hardy yet - but reports from gutsy are not all positive... :-(
[11:28] <crimsun> Tonio_: my personal opinion is that you can simply revert to the feisty way
[11:28] <Lure> Tonio_:
[11:28] <Lure> [09:37] <Lure> Riddell, Hobbsee: new kdepim enterprise snapshot is in my ppa, ready for upload - would be great to have this for next alpha
[11:28] <Lure> [
[11:28] <crimsun> _StefanS_: is this on Hardy?
[11:28] <Tonio_> crimsun: yeah, but I don't want to maintain my kernel locally :)
[11:28] <_StefanS_> crimsun: yes
[11:28] <Tonio_> crimsun: I'll submit the feisty patch eventually, to the kernel team
[11:28] <Lure> Tonio_: ^^^ if you have time for upload
[11:28] <Tonio_> Lure: url please ? I don't have your ppa configured :)
[11:29] <Tonio_> Lure: then I'll submit
[11:29] <Tonio_> or your ppa url btw :)
[11:29] <Lure> Tonio_: https://launchpad.net/~lure/+archive
[11:29] <Lure> Tonio_: it just needs ~ppa~lureX to be removed from version
[11:30] <Lure> Tonio_, _StefanS_: I though that 2.5.24-5 is final (includes released version)
[11:30] <_StefanS_> Lure: uhm, I didn't notice that.. I thought we were still on rcX..
[11:31] <Lure> double battery is actual HAL issue
[11:31] <_StefanS_> Lure: well, I still get info for both /proc and /sysfs concerning batteries through hal
[11:31] <_StefanS_> Lure: probably.. can't we just patch it then ?
[11:31] <Lure> kernel exposes now /proc and /sysfs interfaces and HAL uses both
[11:32] <Lure> _StefanS_: kylem is on it afair, at least he was discussing proper solutioon on HAL mailing list
[11:32] <crimsun> Lure: 5.9 is final (and FTBFS).
[11:32] <_StefanS_> uhm ok, works is in progress then..
[11:32] <_StefanS_> works/work
[11:32] <Lure> problem is  that /sysfs is future, but it is currently lacking some features of /proc interface
[11:33] <Lure> _StefanS_: bug   	177570
[11:33] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 177570 in hal "[hardy] two batteries display when left clicking on g-p-m" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/177570
[11:34] <_StefanS_> Lure: look who commented the last entry :)
[11:34] <_StefanS_> Lure: I just wanted to hear if anything was really being done to it
[11:37] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: got some sort of overview of what needs be done on hardy?
[11:41] <Tonio_> _StefanS_: not yet
[11:41] <Tonio_> Lure: uploading kdepim once built here :)
[11:41] <Lure> Tonio_: thanks!
[11:42] <Riddell> Lure: is that new kdepim from 3.5 branch or still from enterprise branch?
[11:47]  * Hobbsee waves
[11:47] <mhb> the epsilon was small... but my delta beats them all.
[11:47] <mhb> hi
[11:48] <iRon> Riddell: Hi! I'm almost done with BulletproofX.. But I couldn't fully test it, because failsafeDexconf script from GDM produces broken xorg.conf script.. (bproofx from Ubuntu/GDM doesn't work for me in Hardy)
[11:48] <mhb> hello Hobbsee, Tonio_ , our dear Riddell and all the other friends
[11:50]  * Nightrose waves :)
[11:50] <mhb> I've passed the hardest exam of this semester today, so if anyone wants anything from me, I'm available
[11:50] <Hobbsee> woot!
[11:50] <Nightrose> wohooo
[11:50] <Lure> Riddell: it is from enterprise, but till said that they are practically the same
[11:51] <Lure> Riddell: I did not want to change to 3.5.9 branch to not cause confusion even more
[11:51] <Lure> Riddell: but woudl be great to get wider testing before 3.5.9 release (we should put it into announcement)
[11:52] <Lure> Riddell: btw, kdab will still maintain enterprise branch after 3.5.9 release, but they plan to have diff to minimum level
[11:52] <_StefanS_> can we make 3.5.9 for hardy?
[11:53] <sebas> Enterprise branch only has features for kolab companies different, it'd make all the sense in the world to ship 3.5.9 (which has all the fixes from enterprise in kdepim)
[11:55] <mhb> wow, nokia buys TT?
[11:55] <mhb> that should be in the topic at least :o)
[11:55] <stdin> it is in #kde and #qt :p
[11:55] <mhb> you community people have it easy :o)
[11:57] <cheguevara> wow
[12:08] <Tonio_> mhb: toma has fixed kdesudo
[12:09] <Tonio_> mhb: unfortunatelly I don't have access to his patch actually, so we have to wait a bit
[12:12] <mhb> Tonio_: okies.
[12:12] <mhb> Tonio_: do you know what was it?
[12:13] <Tonio_> mhb: not yet, I'm waiting for the patch ;)
[12:14] <mhb> Tonio_: okay, let's wait for him
[12:21] <Riddell> tonio: toma is online
[12:26] <Tonio_> Riddell: ah ?
[12:26] <Tonio_> Riddell: I'll ping him
[12:26] <Tonio_> Riddell: any idea what is the process that automounts devices in /media ?
[12:29] <Serega> hey
[12:31] <Riddell> Tonio_: kde 3 or 4?
[12:31] <Riddell> it's kded in either case I'm pretty sure
[12:31] <Tonio_> Riddell: 3 of course
[12:31] <Tonio_> Riddell: I'm fighting with a super strange bug with ntfs-3g
[12:32] <Tonio_> Riddell: automount process seems to miss the locale, while manual mount works
[12:32] <Tonio_> Riddell: I just miss the process to look at....
[12:32] <Tonio_> Riddell: I suspect dbus, no ?
[12:32] <Tonio_> Riddell: kded would miss the system locale ?
[12:33] <Riddell> what does locale have to do with mounting?
[12:34] <Tonio_> Riddell: ntfs-3g has a specific option so that it can deal with the system locale
[12:34] <Tonio_> Riddell: http://209.85.135.104/search?q=cache:rjiUdxmKBUQJ:www.ntfs-3g.org/support.html+ntfs-3g+%22skipping+unrepresentable+filename%22&hl=fr&ct=clnk&cd=6&gl=fr&client=firefox-a
[12:34] <Tonio_> Riddell: the point is that mounting manually works in any case
[12:35] <Tonio_> Riddell: but with the automount process, on feisty I miss the words including specific caracters
[12:35] <Riddell> it's hal that does the actual mounting
[12:35] <Tonio_> Riddell: no issue while mounting manually of course, that's why I suspect an environment problem
[12:35] <Tonio_> Riddell: let's looks at hal then ;) thanks for the help btw
[12:36] <Riddell> Tonio_: this one I think /usr/lib/hal/hal-storage-mount
[12:36] <mhb> _("I'm afraid I can't do that, Dave.")
[12:37] <Tonio_> Riddell: super thanks !
[12:40] <mhb> kwwii: hmm, your last mail in the -artwork sounds ... unradical
[12:41] <mhb> kwwii: I thought the artwork is going to change dramatically...
[12:41] <mhb> at least everyone reading the blueprints thought so
[12:42] <Riddell> that got moved to hardy+1
[12:43] <mhb> hmm, too bad.
[12:43] <mhb> well... kubuntu will be great regardless of some gnomey artwork :o)
[12:45] <mhb> Riddell: any news on the hardy KDE4 CDs?
[12:46] <mhb> or ETA?
[12:49] <mhb> hmm, a lot of people is concerned about Qt now
[12:50] <mhb> judging by the dot.kde.org comments.
[12:50] <iRon> Tonio_: i've fixed already locale issue with ntfs partitions mounting
[12:50] <iRon> Tonio_: are you on hardy?
[12:50] <Tonio_> iRon: yeah but I need the fix for feisty ;)
[12:50] <Tonio_> iRon: one of our clients reports the issue
[12:51] <Tonio_> iRon: any help concerning the fix ?
[12:51] <iRon> Tonio_ : sure.. sec
[12:51] <Tonio_> iRon: that would be super :)
[12:55] <iRon> Tonio_: look at this http://launchpadlibrarian.net/11045065/kdebase-superfix.debdiff
[12:56] <iRon> Tonio_: if (medium->fsType() == "ntfs") {
[12:57] <Riddell> mhb: colin was working hard on the seeds last week, since we can't edit the seeds at all in the mean time it'll be blocking alpha 3
[12:58] <Riddell> iRon: great!
[12:58] <Lure> sebas: we will switch back with 3.5.9 release (keeping enterprise up-to-date until then)
[12:58] <Riddell> iRon: if bullet proof X is broken generally I guess we just wait for further testing until it gets fixed, but we can still patch kdm
[12:59] <sebas> Lure: Cool.
[13:00] <iRon> Riddell: kdm and x11-commons
[13:00] <iRon> *x11-common
[13:07] <Tonio_> iRon: super, thank you !
[13:07] <iRon> Tonio_: already patched and tested? :)
[13:08] <Tonio_> iRon: no of course, currently building :)
[13:08] <vorian> morning :)
[13:08] <Tonio_> iRon: I'll ping you if that doesn't work, but hopefully that'll not be needed
[13:08] <iRon> Tonio_ : ok
[13:20] <doc__> hi there
[13:20] <Tonio_> hi doc__
[13:22] <Riddell> "Debhelper 6 in Ubuntu Hardy" time for compat updating
[13:22]  * Jucato resists the urge to say "eh.... wazzup doc__!"
[13:22] <doc__> jussi01: hehehe
[13:23] <stdin> jussi01 != Jucato ;)
[13:23] <Jucato> :)
[13:23] <Jucato> Hobbsee is dancing
[13:30] <jussi01> rrrrr
[13:33] <mornfall> Hi.
[13:49] <kwwii> mhb: it will change more radically for hardy+1
[13:49] <Tonio_> Riddell: it looks according to debian that the latest patches for flash support do work
[13:49] <Tonio_> Riddell: I'll take them and reupload
[13:53] <nixternal> oh wow, I get to wake up to Nokia buying Trolltech
[13:53] <ScottK2> nixternal: Go back to bed.  Maybe it's a dream.
[13:59] <nixternal> nope, it isn't a dream, it is reality!
[13:59] <nixternal> w00t Trolltech!
[13:59] <nixternal> better Nokia than Motorola
[14:02] <mhb> well, not everyone is optimistic about it
[14:02] <mhb> top brass is, but privates aren't
[14:02] <nixternal> no one ever is when a company is acquired
[14:02] <nixternal> I have been involved in business deals like this numerous times, and only once did we get screwed
[14:03] <nixternal> I believe Nokia has good intentions
[14:03] <mhb> I'm sure they are going to try and sell Qt before they dispose of it
[14:03] <mhb> to be honest, the Qt of today has not got a good pricing strategy
[14:04] <nixternal> next to MFC though, they have got to be a close 2nd
[14:04] <nixternal> Qt is used in a ton of large named software nowadays
[14:04] <mhb> nixternal: not sure what you mean
[14:04] <nixternal> GUI toolkits
[14:04] <mhb> my point is that their site doesn't really state how much Qt costs
[14:05] <mhb> and I'm sure they have concentrated on private deals, where price was high ... but those deals won't boost adoption much
[14:05] <nixternal> that's because they charge their enterprise/corporate stuff according tot he size of the job I believe
[14:05] <nixternal> all of Adobe is Qt, so that was a big adoption there
[14:06] <mhb> is it?
[14:06] <nixternal> yup
[14:06] <nixternal> Nero
[14:06] <mhb> hmm, not that I've seen those apps recently.
[14:06] <nixternal> Motorola actually uses it too
[14:06] <nixternal> onceo f the Ubuntu Chicago guys, his dad programs Qt stuff for cell phones
[14:06] <nixternal> s/onceo f/ one of
[14:07] <mhb> ah
[14:07] <nixternal> which will be interesting now
[14:07] <nixternal> Nokia owns Qt, and Motorola uses it
[14:07] <nixternal> hrmm
[14:07] <mhb> still, if I were to do a small-scale software app, I'd go for the cheapest product available that gets the job done.
[14:08] <nixternal> NASA uses Qt, I didn't know that...
[14:08] <mhb> I'd like to see those people adopting Qt... but I guess that Microsoft thing I've never worked with gets the job done for them.
[14:09] <blizzzek> google earth uses qt as well
[14:10] <nixternal> Walt Disney
[14:10] <nixternal> Samsung
[14:10] <nixternal> see, that will be interesting too
[14:10]  * mhb feels small
[14:10] <mhb> compared to those mammoths
[14:11] <nixternal> nice, Siemens uses Qt for their HMIs
[14:11] <nixternal> I wish we would have been cool like that at Rockwell Automations/Allen Bradley
[14:12] <nixternal> We used VB and nasty clipart for our HMIs
[14:12] <Riddell> "all of Adobe is Qt" only one of their apps is
[14:13] <nixternal> I thought they switched to all of them now?
[14:13] <nixternal> I swore I read that somewhere
[14:13] <nixternal> I knew Photoshop was, and they were going to use it everywhere else
[14:13] <Riddell> ok, maybe I'm wrong then
[14:14] <mhb> hmm, is Photoshop really Qt?
[14:14] <xRaich[o]2x> hmm photoshop is qt? are there any plans on porting it to linux?
[14:14] <nixternal> ya, when you install photoshop you can see it install the qt libs
[14:14] <nixternal> same with nero..that is how I originally found out about it
[14:14] <mhb> because photoshop has real trouble with wine, and I wouldn't expect Qt to cause much trouble there.
[14:14] <nixternal> I was like, I know I just saw it installing Qt libraries
[14:15] <stdin> so you saw "Qt" and did a double take?
[14:15] <nixternal> hehe ya
[14:15] <iRon> QT = QickTime ;)
[14:16] <nixternal> oh man, Archbishop Christodoulos died...I bet my x-wife and her mom are upset
[14:16] <ScottK2> Riddell: I'm taking a stab at the python-qt3 merge (New upstream), unless you'd rather I didn't.
[14:16] <Riddell> ScottK2: cool, go ahead
[14:19] <nixternal> hey, one good thing about Nokia/Trolltech, they are talking about it on TV
[14:21] <hunger> nixternal: I read one gnome blog where the guy got upset because he thinks that nokia might stop work on the gnome based maenon platform.
[14:21] <nixternal> would be interesting to say the least
[14:21] <stdin> nixternal: I bet they never mention "KDE" or "Open Source" once on the TV though
[14:21] <mhb> open source? what's that?
[14:21] <nixternal> I have only heard Ubuntu or Open Source with the Dell deal on CNBC or Bloomberg
[14:22] <mhb> but they say "KDE" all the time in our tv
[14:22] <hunger> nixternal: I bet they will be talking about freeware instead:-(
[14:22] <nixternal> heh
[14:22] <mhb> perhaps because it's an actual Czech word
[14:22] <nixternal> they are talking about Skype, Google Earth, and Adobe Photoshop
[14:23] <stdin> "KDE: freeware on kubunt-oh, for line-ux"
[14:24] <nixternal> wow, they bought Trolltech pretty cheap
[14:24] <nixternal> $153 million USD
[14:24] <jjesse> i thought that was 153 milliion EUROS
[14:24] <nixternal> 105 million euros
[14:24] <jjesse> oh
[14:25] <nixternal> 16 kroner per share, or $2.91 per share, or 2 euros per share
[14:25] <Riddell> what's the current trading price?
[14:25] <nixternal> 15.70 kroner/$2.85/1.96 euros
[14:26] <nixternal> they are up while nokia is down
[14:26] <nixternal> that always happens too...when you sell your shares blow up..that happened to use at TAVA Technologies when Real Automations from Belgium bought us out
[14:27] <nixternal> w00t!!!!
[14:27] <nixternal> they said KDE!!!
[14:28] <txwikinger> \o/
[14:28] <nixternal> KDE 4 to be exact as the big news out of Trolltech this year for the success of KDE 4
[14:28] <nixternal> and they said Linux correctly :p
[14:29] <nixternal> but the guy who is doing the interviewing though is a tech analyst and was a Red Hat guy back when them and VA Linux blew up back in the day
[14:29] <nixternal> CNBC rocks! I think I will stop watching bloomberg now
[14:30]  * txwikinger only gets the boring EU Version
[14:30] <nixternal> heh, they said GNU/Linux, BSD, and Free Software
[14:30] <xRaich[o]2x> wow
[14:30] <nixternal> you know the guy doing the talking is a geek
[14:30] <nixternal> bah, commercial
[14:31] <Tonio_> iRon: your patch doesn't seem to work for me :/
[14:31] <xRaich[o]2x> obviously. only a geek would say "GNU/Linux" ^^
[14:31] <nixternal> they will talk more at about noon when they do the technology sector again...this is nice, first time it isn't microsoft this and apple that
[14:31] <Tonio_> iRon: I just installed the required patched kdebase packages, but it fails.... strange......
[14:31] <iRon> Tonio_: fails? or doesn't works?
[14:32] <Tonio_> iRon: no change, I still can't see the french specific chars....
[14:32] <Tonio_> iRon: any idea how to debug this ?
[14:32] <iRon> Tonio_: have you restarted kded and konqueror?
[14:32] <Tonio_> iRon: I rebooted
[14:32] <Tonio_> iRon: manual mount still works, so I don't understand....
[14:33] <Tonio_> I must say I don't understand
[14:33] <iRon> Tonio_: ok.. there could be another problem. on hardy there is only ntfs-3g.. but in feisty as i remember there are ntfs and ntfs-3g ?
[14:34] <Tonio_> iRon: I only have ntfs-3g installed
[14:34] <Tonio_> iRon: and a simple manual mount command works
[14:34] <Tonio_> iRon: I suspect there is still something wrong with kmediamanager, but what ?
[14:34] <Tonio_> iRon: is there a way to trace what kded does on that point ?
[14:34] <iRon> Tonio_: i know that simple mount works.. :)
[14:35] <iRon> Tonio_: and this patch has fixed locale issue for me..
[14:35] <iRon> Tonio_: i'm thinking...
[14:35] <Tonio_> iRon: hum could LC_ALL be empty ?
[14:35] <iRon> yep
[14:36] <Tonio_> iRon: fsLocale += setlocale(LC_ALL, "");
[14:36] <Tonio_> iRon: that I don't understand, you push an empty value ?
[14:38] <iRon> Tonio_: so, LC_ALL must be not empty :)
[14:39] <Tonio_> iRon: bah on my hardy system LC_ALL seems to be empty btw, and it works :)
[14:39] <iRon> Tonio_: i'm not on my working kubuntu now..
[14:39] <Tonio_> okay I'll try to chck by myself
[14:39] <Tonio_> iRon: thanks for the help in any case
[14:39] <mhb> Tonio_: got the patch yet?
[14:40] <Tonio_> mhb: toonight :)
[14:40] <mhb> sure
[14:40] <mhb> I'll be away for an hour, but then again available
[14:40] <mhb> feel free to ping me once you have it
[14:41] <mhb> I can have another hacking session this evening
[14:41] <nixternal> OK, who here has the ultimate "I feel like crap" remedy?
[14:41] <nixternal> one thing I learned from being in the military and traveling all over Europe, if I ever felt like crap, Europeans had a remedy that knocked it out
[14:42] <Riddell> Irn Bru!
[14:42] <nixternal> hehe
[14:42] <mhb> well that's not european
[14:43] <nixternal> I should have seen that one coming
[14:43] <ScottK2> nixternal: With enough coffee, you can get through anything.
[14:43] <mhb> those isles think they can be a part of USA on Monday and part of Europe on Tuesday :o)
[14:43] <nixternal> I am double fisting
[14:43] <nixternal> coffee and tea
[14:43] <nixternal> tea and honey to be exact
[14:43] <nixternal> lol
[14:44] <nixternal> ScottK2: you watching the State of the Union tonight?
[14:44] <nixternal> for once, I would love to see Bushie go, "I am reporting on the state of the union tonight, and it sucks!"
[14:44] <ScottK2> nixternal: Hadn't planned on it.  Watching politicians on TV raises my blood pressure.  Doesn't matter much whice party it is.
[14:45] <nixternal> lol
[14:47] <mhb> so who do you want for president? Klaus or Švejnar? :o)
[14:48] <mhb> (two czech candidates for presidency, by the way)
[14:48] <mhb> (czech presidency)
[14:48]  * ScottK2 guessed.
[14:48] <ScottK2> Does it matter (from your perspective) - Often all the politicians are the same.
[14:48] <mhb> yeah, they're both white and male, booring
[14:48] <mhb> and straight
[14:48] <nixternal> hahahahah
[14:48] <nixternal> gahahahahhaha
[14:48] <jjesse> gerald ford was the only president who said the state of union is no good
[14:48] <nixternal> holy smokes, that was classic right there
[14:49] <nixternal> jjesse: ya, I remember that
[14:49] <nixternal> well not personally, but you get the point :)
[14:50] <jjesse> quote "I must say to you that the statoe of the union is not good"
[14:50] <Riddell> has that ever happened?
[14:50] <jjesse> has what ever happend?
[14:51] <txwikinger> what did Carter ever say?
[14:51] <Riddell> in the state of the union speach the US president says "well, it's not good"
[14:51] <jjesse> Riddell: yes Gerald Ford, 1975
[14:52] <jjesse> http://www.fordlibrarymuseum.gov/library/speeches/750028.htm
[14:52]  * txwikinger remembers Carter never noticed all those lines at the pumps
[14:53]  * txwikinger also remember Sundays for which nobody was allowed to drive cars
[14:53]  * Hobbsee declares victory
[14:53] <ScottK2> Riddell: I've got a python-qt question for you...  Both qt3 and qt4 ship a pyqtconfig.  Neither seems to be available in $PYTHONPATH.  The new eric FTBFS as a result.  Debian exposes one (haven't checked which), so it builds.  Any thoughts on how to go forward on fixing this? (Note: I've not checked with the new upstream I'm merging yet - just looking if this is a known Kubuntu design decision)
[14:55] <Riddell> ScottK2: it's not a known Kubuntu design decision
[14:55] <ScottK2> Riddell: Thanks.
[14:55]  * ScottK2 will dig into it then.
[14:56]  * nixternal goes and lays down...this feeling like crap thing sucks
[14:56] <Hobbsee> nixternal: heh.  i could have told you that long ago!
[14:57] <ScottK2> nixternal: More coffee
[14:57] <ScottK2> Speak of which... brb.
[15:01] <iRon> Tonio_: could you mount your ntfs partition with mount command and with kmediamanager, and check if realy ntfs-3g used in both cases?
[15:02] <Tonio_> sure
[15:03] <Tonio_> iRon: yep ntfs-3g is used.....
[15:04] <Tonio_> iRon: I looked at the environment kded is working, LANG is set....
[15:04] <Tonio_> iRon: I'm rebuilding with some debug in your patch to check what happens
[15:04] <Tonio_> iRon: I wonder if the no-media-ioslave patches can cause the issue
[15:05] <iRon> Tonio_: then please try to change  QString fsLocale("locale="); with  QString fsLocale("nls=");
[15:05] <Tonio_> iRon: what would be the difference ?
[15:05] <iRon> Tonio_: http://ubuntuguide.org/wiki/Ubuntu:Feisty#How_to_Mount_NTFS_Partitions
[15:06] <Tonio_> iRon: reading
[15:09] <Tonio_> iRon: I see no reason that this would be different between feisty and hardy/gutsy btw
[15:09] <Tonio_> iRon: locale is a ntfs-3g specific option while nls is for mount right ?
[15:10] <iRon> Tonio_: ntfs-3g is the same on feisty and hardy?
[15:10] <Tonio_> iRon: I backported
[15:11] <Tonio_> iRon: bah I'm going to test with the debug and see what happened.... I don't want to waste your time :)
[15:12] <iRon> Tonio_: you don't need to debug.. you could play with dbus-send command first to figure out correct parameters
[15:13] <Tonio_> iRon: I wonder if the fstype shouldn't be ntfs-3g ?
[15:14] <Tonio_> iRon: how to check this ?
[15:15] <iRon> Tonio_: oh.. yeah.. on feisty it could be ntfs and ntfs-3g
[15:15] <Tonio_> iRon: I'll try to add a double if then
[15:16] <Tonio_> iRon: what defines the name of the fs ? the kernel directly ?
[15:16] <Tonio_> dbus ?
[15:16] <Tonio_> iRon: with a backported ntfs-3g I suspected the fs to have the same name....
[15:16] <Tonio_> iRon: and last but not least, is there a way to request hal for the fs of a device ?
[15:17]  * Tonio_ knows not much about hal
[15:17] <Tonio_> hal-device -> it is ntfs-3g
[15:18] <iRon> Tonio_: "medium" variable in code is initialized from HAL settings
[15:19] <Tonio_> iRon: I know how to fix now ;)
[15:19] <iRon> Tonio_: you could override fs type setting when calling org.freedesktop.Hal.Device.Volume.Mount
[15:19] <Tonio_> thanks a lot, I'll just check for ntfs and ntfs-3g
[15:20] <Tonio_> iRon: hum oki
[15:20] <Tonio_> iRon: then the string value for the fs type is set by dbus ?
[15:21] <iRon> Tonio_: with dbus you could override it
[15:21] <Tonio_> iRon: yeah, that seems to be my problem
[15:21] <Tonio_> iRon: I'll fix that, and MANY thanks for your help ;)
[15:21] <iRon> Tonio_: yw!
[15:25] <mornfall> Afternoon.
[15:32] <Riddell> mornfall: sorry I havn't got to testing the new adept today, it's on my (lengthy) todo
[15:33] <mornfall> No problem. I won't have much adept time till friday, so if I have feedback near the end of the week, that should be fine.
[16:06] <apachelogger_> Riddell: hey, can you please drop latest dragonplayer in gutsy-backports? https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dragonplayer
[16:06] <Riddell> apachelogger_: have you tested it?  does it work?
[16:07] <apachelogger_> Riddell: yep, testbuilt on my in-kde4-drowning laptop ;-)
[16:09] <Riddell> "I: Building backport of dragonplayer-1.99~beta1 as 1.99~beta1-0ubuntu1~gutsy1 ... E: execution of 'dpkg-genchanges -S -sa -v1.99~beta1-0ubuntu1~gutsy1' failed with return code 255."
[16:09] <Riddell> apachelogger_: something broke in the backport script
[16:15] <apachelogger_> d'oh!
[16:15] <apachelogger_> Riddell: well, it's in the ppa for now
[16:23] <ScottK2> Riddell: Bug #186668 is ready for review/upload.
[16:23] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 186668 in python-qt3 "Please merge python-qt3 3.17.4-1  (main) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/186668
[16:26] <Riddell> apachelogger_: suse has these interesting patches to fix the kde3/4 launching issue http://muse.19inch.net/~jr/tmp/kde4-applications.diff
[16:26] <Riddell> http://muse.19inch.net/~jr/tmp/kde3-applications.diff
[16:26] <Riddell> first patch is for KDE 3, second for KDE 4
[16:28] <apachelogger_> Riddell: will have a look later on
[16:29]  * apachelogger_ is kinda busy with a school project :S
[16:29] <ScottK2> Riddell: The new python-qt3 solves my pyqtconfig problem, so I'll be able to sync the new eric in once that's uploaded.
[16:37] <Riddell> ScottK2: do we still need to move that pyqtconfig.py bit in debian/rules?
[16:46] <ScottK> Riddell: Not sure.  It works as is.
[16:47] <ScottK> I can look into it some more, but I'm not very familiar with why kde-guidance needed it moved.
[16:47] <Riddell> ScottK: oh, it's because it's in python-qt3 not python-qt3-dev
[16:47] <Riddell> no I don't remember either now, but it did break without it
[16:48] <ScottK> OK.  I vote we don't break it again. ;-)
[16:48] <Riddell> "it is needed for mountconfig from kde-guidance" apparantly
[16:49] <ScottK2> Maybe the best answer (not today) is to fix kde-guidance not to need it.
[16:52] <mhb> evening my dears
[16:59] <mhb> Tonio_: hacking time yet?
[17:03] <Tonio_> mhb: nope I'm at work, unfortunatelly :)
[17:03] <mhb> Tonio_: but I can work on it, if you have the patch
[17:09] <Tonio_> mhb: I'll do what's needed as soon as I have the patch, don't worry :)
[17:12] <Tonio_> mhb: I don't :/
[17:12] <mhb> Tonio_: okay.
[17:12] <mhb> Tonio_: looking forward to it
[17:13] <Tonio_> mhb: ;)
[17:53] <Tonio_> iRon: your patch worked with a s/ntfs/ntfs-3g
[17:53] <Tonio_> iRon: once again thanks
[17:53] <toma> ah Tonio_!
[17:53] <Tonio_> hey !
[17:53] <toma> let me get that patch
[17:53] <Tonio_> toma: super, thanks !
[17:53] <Tonio_> mhb: ping ? :)
[17:53] <Riddell> ScottK2: pyqt3 uploaded, thanks
[17:54] <mhb> Tonio_: here
[17:54] <mhb> Tonio_: can you commit it?
[17:54] <Tonio_> mhb: sure
[17:54] <Tonio_> mhb: I'll be at home very late all the week so don't expect me to work on kdesudo-kde4 except between 12 h and 14 h...
[17:55] <Tonio_> mhb: and on friday of course
[17:55] <toma> Tonio_: i couldn't manage to get tabs in my vi, but you will manage; here it is: http://rafb.net/p/t41Xvi31.html
[17:57] <iRon> Tonio_: once again yw :)
[17:57] <Tonio_> toma: commiting the patch, many thanks !
[17:58] <toma> yw
[17:59] <nixternal> OK, I have been studying this whole Trolltech/Nokia deal and now I am asking myself, Why? Was it to make money off of Motorola, Panasonic, and others? Very fishy
[18:00] <yuriy> what deal?
[18:00] <nixternal> Nokia purchased trolltech today
[18:00] <yuriy> whoa
[18:00] <yuriy> whaaat
[18:00] <yuriy> that can't be good
[18:01] <Tonio_> mhb: commited
[18:01] <nixternal> at first I thought "yes", but after reading up on mobile development, and Nokias lack of use for Qt, it got me wondering the same
[18:01] <yuriy> why would it be good?
[18:01] <yuriy> also $150m sounds pretty cheap
[18:01] <Tonio_> toma: I'm really surprised cause I'm pretty sure I tested that solution
[18:02] <Tonio_> toma: maybe I did it the wrong way....
[18:02] <nixternal> Motorola, Panasonic, and other big cell manufacturers use Qt, so by Nokia purchasing it, they now have a ground to attack these other companies with
[18:02] <Tonio_> toma: if you say it works, for sure I didn't do it correctly ;)
[18:02] <Riddell> nixternal: nobody knows but I'd expect Qtopia is more interesting to them than Qt
[18:02] <Tonio_> mhb: concerning the writestdin missing, according to toma a prinf should do the trick..... simply :)
[18:03] <Tonio_> Riddell: yeah I was thinking the same
[18:03] <nixternal> Riddell: ya, I meant Qtopia and not Qt
[18:03] <ScottK> Riddell: Thanks for the python-qt3 upload.
[18:03] <Riddell> ScottK: thanks for the merge :)
[18:03] <Tonio_> Riddell: they want to stop with symbian as they maintain it alone mostly, and with google and linux coming on cellphones, qtopia is probably their new target :)
[18:03] <nixternal> the good thing is the financial backing though
[18:03] <nixternal> marketing as well
[18:07] <toma> Tonio_: i worked with the api before, so I had some advantage
[18:07] <Tonio_> toma: hehe
[18:08] <toma> Tonio_: adding debug statements helps to determine what's going though
[18:14] <Tonio_> toma: sure :)
[18:26] <toma> Tonio_: oh, and i don't know if sudo is localised, but you might want to prepend the call with something like LC_ALL=C
[18:27] <Tonio_> toma: it isn't, but yeah that might not be bad btw :)
[18:31] <mhb> Tonio_: yes, that's a good suggestion
[18:31] <mhb> Tonio_: I've filed a bug in the sudo bugzilla about l10n, they are going to fix that sometime
[19:11] <fdoving> hi.
[19:16] <nixternal> howdy fdoving
[19:17] <nixternal> anyone else having problems with the daily cd images?
[19:17] <nixternal> they are dying on drive partitioning for me
[19:18] <nixternal> something about not being able to remove 2 files or something
[19:27] <ScottK2> nixternal: Obviously you don't want it bad enough.
[19:27] <nixternal> lol
[19:29] <nixternal> trying to install Ubuntu and Kubuntu, and neither are liking me right now
[19:29] <nixternal> guess I will just go with the alpha
[19:33] <toma> Riddell: what was that mail client's name you are using?
[19:34] <nixternal> Alpine
[19:34] <toma> ah.
[19:39] <toma> not available for angstrom
[19:42] <nixternal> toma: what version is Mailody going to be for KDE 4? I forgot all about the website update and want to put it up right now
[19:42] <nixternal> and you are still planning on it being completed by KDE 4.1 correct?
[19:43] <toma> yes
[19:43] <toma> we are now at 0.5.0
[19:43] <toma> so, 0.7.0 ?
[19:43] <nixternal> OK
[19:43] <toma> fdoving: ^ ?
[19:44] <nixternal> new features besides adaptation of Akonadi?
[19:45] <ScottK> Is Kubuntu doing anything with policykit or is that just Ubuntu?
[19:47] <Riddell> ScottK: it's an upstream issue, KDE badly needs someone to implement it
[19:48] <Riddell> ScottK: since right now you can't use root in kcontrol modules at all
[19:48] <ScottK> Ah.  OK.
[19:49] <Lure> Riddell: is this issue for kde4 only or also for kde3?
[19:49] <Riddell> Lure: kde 4 only
[19:49] <Lure> Riddell: kde3 will stay with kdesudo?
[19:49] <Riddell> Lure: yes
[19:51] <mhb> Lure: why not?
[19:51] <mhb> do you have anything against it?
[19:51] <Lure> mhb: no, just want to understand what is planned to be done
[19:51] <mhb> KDE4 may go with kdesudo, too
[19:51] <mhb> depends on how fast can we package it
[19:51] <Lure> Riddell: can we just not patch system settings with kdesudo (after kde4 port)?
[19:52] <Lure> mhb: exactly
[19:52] <Riddell> Lure: I think you misunderstand, the kcontrol library has had any ability to have root UIs taken out of it
[19:52] <Riddell> it's not a kdesu vs kdesudo issue
[19:52] <Riddell> they got taken out so someone could implement policykit
[19:52] <Lure> Riddell: oh, they ripped that out in kde4?
[19:52] <Riddell> which nobody has
[19:57] <Lure> Riddell: do you have any plans when kde4 cd's will be built on regular basis (daily)?
[19:58] <iRon> Riddell: may be we should start at least with policykit integration? i could research on this... and try to implement policykit stuff for "users disk mounting" in kde4..
[19:58] <Riddell> Lure: asap, it's still blocked on colin changing the seed layouts (but so is alpha 3)
[19:59] <Riddell> iRon: it can't be done for just one module, it needs to be added to the kcontrol classes in kdelibs (then add it for each module that needs it)
[19:59] <Riddell> iRon: I doubt it'll be easy, but if you want to get into elite kdelibs hacking, that's a feature that's badly needed
[20:00] <iRon> Riddell: i've already played with policykit api..
[20:00] <Riddell> hmm, hadn't thought about "users disk mounting", that's not kcontrol but it would benefit from policykit, although it should probably be hal using it
[20:01] <Riddell> iRon: that's more than I have :)
[20:02]  * ScottK designates iRon the Kubuntu lead developer for policykit integration due to his superior experience and knowledge.
[20:02] <iRon> :)
[20:02] <ScottK> You think I'm kidding, right?
[20:02] <iRon> i'm even not a member of any kubuntu-* team :(
[20:03] <ScottK> You're here.  You've got a ticket to the ball.
[20:03]  * ScottK cares more about running code than paperwork.
[20:04] <Riddell> iRon: turn up to the next meeting and ask
[20:04] <iRon> Riddell: ok
[20:04] <Riddell> iRon: well, write a wiki page first of course
[20:05] <iRon> Riddell: yep.. what about policykit wiki page?
[20:05] <iRon> Riddell: we could create it too..
[20:06] <cheguevara> doesn't policykit needs to be implemented in kdm
[20:07] <Riddell> iRon: I ment make yourself a wiki page before applying for membership
[20:07] <Riddell> cheguevara: that's consolekit, and we have a patch for it
[20:07] <cheguevara> thats consolekit actually
[20:07] <cheguevara> yeah just realised that myself
[20:07] <cheguevara> but what about kdm-kde4?
[20:08] <Riddell> I don't think we've added it but it's available
[20:23] <mornfall> Yo.
[20:25] <jussi01> Riddell: nalioth is about now.
[20:26] <Nightrose> nixternal: owwwww :(   /me sends a nice hot cup of tea over to Chicago
[20:27] <nixternal> I have drank so much tea today
[20:27] <nixternal> I am half way through a bottle of honey too
[20:27] <Nightrose> :/
[20:28] <Nightrose> then you should probably go to bed and sleep
[20:30] <cheguevara> and dream of nokia pouring loads of money in QT
[20:30] <cheguevara> like thats gonna happen
[20:33] <nixternal> no more sleep
[20:33] <nixternal> I am wrapped up like a burrito trying to sweat this out
[20:37]  * ryanakca cheers at being off all week :)
[20:37] <ryanakca> nixternal: sick?
[20:38] <nixternal> just a bit
[20:39] <ryanakca> heh
[20:42] <mhb> hey ryanakca
[20:42] <mhb> how was your exam?
[20:43] <ryanakca> mhb: not too bad... I ran out of time, so my conclusion is basically a big long line with bumps for 'm' and 'n' and 'r' and random breaks :)
[20:44] <ryanakca> mhb: yours? pass?
[20:44] <mornfall> What now.
[20:44] <mhb> ryanakca: sure, had a 2 (second best grade, second worst grade)
[20:44] <mhb> ryanakca: we've got 1(best),2,3 and bye bye.
[20:46] <nixternal> haha, and bye bye
[20:48] <ryanakca> lol
[20:48] <ryanakca> mhb: grats :D
[20:49] <ryanakca> mhb: its the oposite here... 4,3,2,1,R1,R2,R3...
[20:50] <ryanakca> the R1-3 are just to let you know how much you fail... all of them are < 50%
[20:50] <ryanakca> s/oposite/opposite/
[20:51] <ryanakca> but they're fail none the less
[20:51]  * ryanakca considers packaging BASIC-256
[20:53] <nixternal> who asked the question in the Nokia/Trolltech audiocast?
[20:54] <nixternal> the 2nd question was for Kubuntu/KDE :)
[20:54] <ryanakca> what was it?
[20:54] <nixternal> just asking if they are planning on continuing with KDE and what not, which of course is yes
[20:54] <ryanakca> lol :)
[20:55] <nixternal> but they are planning on bringing Qt, not Qtopia to their cell phones
[20:55] <nixternal> r40, s60, and the n8xx will eventually be Qt :)
[20:56] <nixternal> Kubuntu on a n810? :)
[20:56] <ryanakca> eh?
[20:57]  * ryanakca tries to compress 'Easy to use version of BASIC designed to teach young children the basics of programming.' into 60 characters
[20:57] <nixternal> KTurtle!
[20:58] <mhb> ryanakca: what type of exam was it?
[20:58] <mhb> ryanakca: m,n,r ... are those variables?
[20:58] <ryanakca> mhb: french exam
[20:58] <ryanakca> m,n,r ?
[20:59] <ryanakca> answer questions about a "fable" (english equivalent = ?) for half an hour, and then write an essay on a random subject for the rest of the time
[20:59] <mhb> ah, lovely
[21:01] <ryanakca> nixternal: KTurtle uses LOGO, right? And LOGO is simillar to what language?
[21:01] <mhb> it's unique
[21:02] <hads> LOGO is LOGO; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logo_(programming_language)
[21:05] <ryanakca> wow
[21:05]  * ryanakca is having fun moving his turtle around in circles :)
[21:05] <ryanakca> wow, its ancient... 1967...
[21:18] <mhb> C is 1972, Lisp 1958
[21:18]  * ryanakca wonders if http://mitpress.mit.edu/sicp/ is any good... theory behind the programming.
[21:19] <mhb> sure is
[21:20] <jdong> ryanakca: it's one of the best
[21:20] <jdong> ryanakca: but then again, I am biased :)
[21:20] <jdong> ryanakca: Hal cuts me paychecks ;-)
[21:20] <ryanakca> lol
[21:20] <ryanakca> Hal? MIT person?
[21:21] <jdong> ryanakca: yeah, founder of the MIT EECS dept :)
[21:21] <ryanakca> lol
[21:21] <jdong> been on the FSF chair before, I believe
[21:21]  * ryanakca wonders if the local bookstore has a printed copy... I hate reading huge amounts of text on the computer
[21:23] <ryanakca> wow, not too bad... 34% off (53.79 vs 81.50)... might go in and look at it
[21:24] <mhb> ryanakca: get used to it
[21:24] <ryanakca> used to what?
[21:24] <ryanakca> incredibly high book prices for anything non-fiction?
[21:24] <mhb> ryanakca: it's the best way to pass a computer science uni
[21:25] <ryanakca> ah :)
[21:25] <mhb> especially if your uni has less books than students
[21:25] <ryanakca> heh, this side of the pond, students have to buy their own books
[21:27] <mhb> well we should do it, too
[21:28] <ryanakca> Hmm... class of 1922? if he was 20 at the time, he's what? 106?
[21:34] <jpatrick> ryanakca: we also do...
[21:39]  * ryanakca grumbles at KMail-kde3 not working under KDE4
[21:40] <jpatrick> ryanakca: usa alpine!
[21:40] <jpatrick> use*
[21:40] <yuriy> ryanakca: really? i haven't had any trouble yet
[21:41] <yuriy> probably a hardy thing
[21:41]  * yuriy reconsiders upgrading
[21:41] <toma> ryanakca: using the same $KDEDIR ?
[21:41] <ryanakca> toma: it complains that kwallet isn't running, and then that it can't connect to dcop, and then that it can't start the pop3 process
[21:41]  * ryanakca checks
[21:43] <ryanakca> Could not start process pop3s.
[21:43] <toma> no idea then
[21:43] <ryanakca> toma: in krunner, "sh -c 'KDEDIR=/usr/lib/kde && export $KDEDIR && kmail'" ?
[21:44] <ScottK2> IIRC we'll have a whole 'nother kdepim after 3.5.9 gets released, so no need to get to excited about kdepim right now.
[21:44]  * ryanakca decides to use alpine to check his backlogged email
[21:45] <toma> ryanakca: i meant kdehome
[21:48] <ryanakca> toma: don't see anything about kdehome in 'env | grep -i home'
[21:48] <toma> good
[21:49] <toma> as i said, no idea what that problem is, should work
[21:51] <ryanakca> heh, oh well, I've almost got alpine set up :)
[21:52] <jpatrick> ryanakca: whatever you do; do NOT use it's filters
[21:55] <ryanakca> jpatrick: okies :)
[21:56] <jpatrick> ryanakca: basically speaking... they suck
[21:57]  * jpatrick does it all though gmail