[00:07] hello [00:07] gtt: Hello, how can we help you today? [00:08] just wanted to make sure it was ok for me to be back in #kubuntu... [00:08] I dont know... /me looks [00:08] i'm in there now.... i'll be good. [00:09] gtt: The ban has not been lifted. iirc, you were asked to come back in here to discuss the ban before it would be removed. [00:09] ok [00:09] i left it [00:09] that [00:09] s why i was coming back. [00:09] konversation autojoins... i was just not getting kicked out i guess. [00:10] jpatrick, jussi01: ping [00:11] hrm. [00:11] Jucato perhaps? ^ #kubuntu ban removal request. [00:12] hm lemme see [00:13] what did jussi01 say about this? [00:13] Jucato: jussi01 had asked that he come back in 24 hours to be discussed further. [00:13] I can dig up a log... [00:15] hm... I'm not really comfortable removing other people's bans w/o their knowledge/permission... [00:17] Jucato: er, okay: http://pastebin.com/fad94be5 [00:17] is the ban specific to #kubuntu (just want to make sure i dont have any other 'infractions') [00:18] Pici: ah ok... well if you say so, I can remove his ban. just give the word. :) [00:19] Jucato: err. I'm not telling you to remove the ban if you don't want to. [00:19] * PriceChild looks in [00:20] Pici: heheh it's not that I don't want to. just not sure about the policy of removing other op's bans.... but if you were there and it was jussi01's intention that it would be removed... etc etc etc :) [00:21] Jucato: I believe it was jussi01's intetion that the ban would be reviewed after a day, not necessarily removed. [00:21] oh ok :) [00:21] gtt, What is #kubuntu for? [00:21] it's for discussions about #kubuntu [00:21] and people are pretty picky if ya mention anything else. [00:22] so i dont [00:22] No it isn't. [00:22] it's actually for asking help about Kubuntu.. not general talk about Kubuntu [00:23] * Topic for #kubuntu is: Official Kubuntu support | yadayadayada [00:23] gtt, what made you post such a malicious command in there? [00:23] i dont know any other way of uninstalling...and without sudo it's not that malicious [00:24] aha, I see 2008-01-28T19:31:04 what is the uninstall command? [00:24] right [00:24] gtt, what if the user meant "what is the uninstall command to uninstall packages?" [00:24] But that question is vauge, he could have been asking to uninstall x?... bah, too slow. [00:25] my answer wouldn't have been helpful. [00:25] gtt, Rather than the entire OS. Do you believe that this is a valid interpretation? [00:25] "Wouldn't have been helpful"?! Dude you would have lost *all their data* [00:25] including any mounted volumes such as ipods etc. [00:26] gtt: if asked "what's a good strategy for getting out of my parent's house?" a good answer is not "murder everyone and burn the house down." [00:26] you're right. [00:27] * Jucato is now scared of mneptok... [00:27] Jucato, only now? [00:27] only just now? [00:27] * mneptok polishes his halo and eats another kitten [00:27] hehehe :) [00:27] nooo!! not the kitties!!! [00:27] gtt, so what happens next time you misunderstand a question in #kubuntu? [00:28] BLAME MNEPTOK! [00:28] uhhh ... strike that. [00:29] ok, it was bad manners. i'll ask for more information and not give an answer that can delete anything unintentionally. [00:30] (and careless) [00:30] !guideline | gtt [00:30] Sorry, I don't know anything about guideline - try searching on http://ubotu.ubuntu-nl.org/factoids.cgi [00:30] grr [00:30] !guidelines | gtt [00:30] gtt: The people here are volunteers, your attitude should reflect that. Answers are not always available. See http://wiki.ubuntu.com/IrcGuidelines [00:30] and also if it was in the official support channel it'd be bad for canonical too. [00:30] gtt, go and read those please & ping me when you're done. [00:31] gtt, ¢anonical has no direct connection to the irc support channels. All they do is host logs. [00:33] guess i misunderstood the "official" (still reading) [00:33] gtt, ¢anonical isn't ubuntu. They just happen to pay the wages of a lot of developers, as well as provide paid support. [00:34] hmmm that autoreplace isn't appropriate here. [00:35] heh.. ok, i read it...again [00:36] PriceChild: ping [00:38] gtt, Ok so we've covered the "don't post dangerous commands in #kubuntu"? [00:38] i hope so [00:38] You've promise its not going to happen again? [00:38] promise [00:39] So the other little issue. gtt what is with the ban evasion? [00:39] that's not really a ban evasion... [00:39] what's not? [00:39] during the day, i use my laptop on my cell phone, and the connection is kind of crappy. [00:39] it's slow reconnecting, and when i reconnected, konversation autojoined on the kubuntu [00:40] i know it seems like it could be. [00:40] Ok [00:41] gtt, you may rejoin #kubuntu. Please abide by the IRC guidelines when participating in the channel. [00:41] i'm more of a user of irc, and i'm a pretty advanced OS user... but i don't think i know enough about irc to attempt to effectively evade a ban.. it's not worth my effort. [00:42] you got it. i'll try to stay out of your hair. [00:42] I'll believe you :) [00:43] gtt, anything else we can help with? [00:43] gtt: and help yourself to the fried chicken before you leave. it's awesome. [00:43] no, thanks for listening to me and all that good gunk tho. [00:43] seeya [00:43] have fun [00:44] * gtt takes the chicken thigh [00:44] *bawk bawk* [00:45] wait ... is there really fried chicken?! [00:46] jussi01, please ping me when you're around. [03:05] i banned m0nk from #ubuntu-offtopic for posting a malicious link [03:05] people there went a tad too far really [03:06] Quite reasonable, LjL [03:07] i'm going to bed though so i'm not taking complains until tomorrow. look at the log, a while before the actual ban, if he comes here [03:08] Sleep well, LjL [03:34] can I get an explaination as to why I am banned in #Ubuntu ? [03:34] wolferine: sure, for your attitude [03:35] tritium ? [03:35] mneptok: if you are trying to make a point, you are being very childish about it [03:35] SNuxoll: i was talking to YOU. what gets said to others is not a concern. [03:35] SNuxoll: i asked you very politely to dial the language back. [03:36] mneptok: no, it IS a concern, I'm tired of unequal enforcment of the rules [03:36] SNuxoll: it's EXACTLY the same as L j L asking [03:36] SNuxoll: get used to it. not everyone can see everything all the time. [03:37] no, they can't, but you seem to have a personal grudge against me, because you seem to find every tedious little thing you can to yell at me for, please tell me if I'm jumping the ship here [03:37] SNuxoll: i saw you saying things "suck" and that you're "pissed" and other language that is borderline. i asked you, quite nicely, to stop. you refused. [03:37] SNuxoll: i can't remember the last time i addressed you. [03:38] SNuxoll: no, it's not personal. We all enforce the policy on foul language, so as to keep the channels family-friendly. [03:38] is there any more ops around ? [03:38] tritium: please read the #ubuntu-offtopic log for the past hour [03:38] and I wasn't aware that 'sucks' was considered language [03:39] SNuxoll: you were banned not for language, but for outright *refusing* the request of an op. [03:39] SNuxoll: what matters is that you were asked nicely to tone it down [03:39] mneptok: I was not outright refusing the request of a op! [03:39] 22:32 < SNuxoll> mneptok: last I checked that wasn't language, and if it was LjL would have yelled at me [03:39] 22:33 < SNuxoll> mneptok: ok, then you should be yelling at the other 20 regulars in this room for using that language regularly too [03:40] that's not refusing the request of a op! [03:40] oh please. [03:40] refusing would be something like "mneptok: so what, I don't care" [03:41] telling me what the rules are, and saying that "this other op would have done something" is hardly the same as "OK, i'll tone it down." [03:41] if tritium has replied to me, can someone let me know, as I have set him/her on /ignore ? [03:41] wolferine: we have a code of conduct that involved treating people with respect. [03:41] DEFINE WHAT THE RULES ARE, and how was I not treating people with respect? [03:42] !ohmy > SNuxoll [03:42] I'm sorry, but I take family friendly as not using the dreaded 'four letter words' [03:42] F, S, D, C, etc [03:42] SNuxoll: you are entitled to that opinion. we are entitled to ours. [03:43] mneptok: that's the problem, there is no clear rule so it's up to your opinion [03:43] SNuxoll: i didn;t ban you without telling you exactly what i wanted. [03:43] SNuxoll: you chose, as an adult, to make an issue out of it. now, like an adult, you need to live with the consequences of your actions. [03:44] please define what you consider 'language' [03:44] i already did. [03:44] why are you making me repeat myself? [03:45] but i'll go get a copy/paste from the channel prior to your ban where i answered that question [03:45] because no other op I've seen has such a extremist view on it, not LjL, not Seveas, or any others I've seen in #u-o [03:45] what does that matter? [03:45] SNuxoll: it's not an extremist view. [03:45] YES, it is! [03:45] 22:31 < mneptok> SNuxoll: my backscroll is filled with "sucks" and "pissed" and assorted crap. [03:45] your reply.... [03:45] 22:32 < SNuxoll> mneptok: last I checked that wasn't language, and if it was LjL would have yelled at me [03:45] SNuxoll: no, it really isn't [03:46] I don't know where mneptok lives, but here it is pretty much everyday usage for well, sucks, and pissed [03:46] Ubuntu is a popular distribution, with many younger users (especially those who use edubuntu). It is important to keep foul language out of the channel. [03:47] are you *really* going to make an issue of my place of residence? [03:47] really? [03:47] think about it. be sure you know what you're doing. [03:47] tritium: and hopefully no one under 13 is using #u-o, because there has been more fowl things than 'sucks' and 'pissed' in there today [03:47] SNuxoll: and if i had seen them .... [03:48] SNuxoll: no, that's the wrong hope. Hopefully we keep it clean specifically so they CAN be in that channel. [03:48] mneptok: oh, LjL did, and he took care of them, at the same time I was saying 'sucks' and 'pissed' [03:48] SNuxoll: so there it is. [03:48] there's your answer. [03:48] SNuxoll: as a member of the community, if your words offended even one person (including an op, mind you), you should kindly refrain. [03:49] I'm not asking much, I just want consistent enforcement and definitions of the ruls [03:49] SNuxoll: that won't happen with language, as it's subjective. [03:49] SNuxoll: it would be nice, but in no way possible. [03:49] mneptok: EXACTLY [03:50] You're actually asking for the opposite. You want _your_ measure of foul to be what applies to you, rather than a consistent one. [03:50] If we aren't going to enforce the rules equally, why have them at all, same with flexible definitions [03:50] tritium: no, I'm not [03:50] Indeed, you are. [03:50] tritium: I'm happy to fit someone's definition of 'fowl' if I know what it is [03:50] mneptok: has told you [03:51] SNuxoll: "fowl" means "an edible bird" [03:51] but no one has a consistent one in that channel! [03:51] SNuxoll: what about 繁體中文版 [03:51] is that offensive? [03:51] probably not to you. [03:51] but to a Mandarin speaker? highly offensive. [03:51] language. is. subjective. by. nature. [03:51] it's unfair to the users in there to have varying degrees of what they consider 'fowl' [03:52] no one was taking offense to what I said [03:52] i did. [03:52] game over. [03:53] ah, so that's the magic definition there [03:53] it's the same definition LjL, Seveas, elky, tritium, or any other op. [03:53] no, it's not [03:53] why are you still arguing? [03:53] SNuxoll: nothing magic about considering mneptok, a live human being, to be someone. It's just a plain fact. [03:53] more importantly, why am i? [03:53] I have been using 'sucks' and 'pissed' the entire (almost} year in #u-o [03:54] tritium: no, there is something magic about him, he can get a +o [03:54] can I get an explaination as to why I am banned in #Ubuntu ? [03:54] wolferine: tritium told you. your attitude. [03:54] and because of that, he's like a law enforcement officer [03:54] mneptok, please dont take this out on me [03:55] one cop can't go 'ahh, he's only 20 over', while another says '20 over, I'm gonna pull this guy over' [03:55] that's exactly what is happening [03:55] as I said previously, I have him/her on /ignore [03:55] should I remove it ? [03:55] wolferine: and? [03:56] wolferine: if you want to discuss your ban, yes. [03:56] wolferine: it's tritium's ban. that means you have to talk to tritium. [03:56] SNuxoll: law enforcement is filled with judgement calls. [03:57] ok [03:57] removed [03:57] tritium, can we discuss this now ? [03:57] SNuxoll: and now my good judgement tells me this is going nowhere. you may part #u-ops on your own and come back in 24 hours to discuss this with me, or be permanently banned. your choice. [03:58] SNuxoll: and FYI, *anyone* giving Seveas this much cr*p would have been perm-banned by now. so you know. [03:58] mneptok: and FYI, seveas has never freaked out over 'sucks' [03:58] now, goodbye [03:59] seems s/he isnt here, can someone else help me please ? [03:59] wolferine: what? [04:00] tritium, can we discuss my ban in #ubuntu ? [04:00] You expect me to be at your attention, when you put me on /ignore? [04:00] Come back tomorrow. [04:00] is this not a good time? [04:00] Right, I'm going to bed now. [04:01] do you mind if I discuss this with another op ? [04:01] wolferine: what would you like to discuss? [04:01] well, the reason for my ban [04:02] i would like to ask someone to view our 'conversation' and what led up to the ban [04:02] As I tried to explain to you, your arrogant, unappreciative attitude, and your rude behavior. [04:02] arrogance is not a reason to ban me, is it ? [04:02] When someone offers you help in #ubuntu, or any other channel, you need to remember that we're volunteers. [04:03] wolferine: yes, it is, as per the code of conduct you need to treat people with respect. [04:03] tritium, I have been assisting in #ubuntu for just over a year, I understand you are a volunteer, as I am as well [04:03] To disrespect people who are trying to help you is quite contrary to that spirit. [04:03] i think you took my comments a bit too personal, maybe because your tired ? [04:03] wolferine: there are *nice* ways to ask for additional info, or to inform someone that the info they provided isn't what you're looking for [04:04] my tired? [04:04] I don't have a "tired" [04:04] im sorry, i guess you dont understand irc speak [04:04] wolferine: No, I didn't take them to personally. [04:04] but if you say the word out loud, im sure you will understand what I am saying [04:04] wolferine: I've been on op for 3 years in #ubuntu, I understand it just fine. [04:05] I also understand !properenglish [04:05] let me log the conversation we had [04:05] do you mind if I do that ? [04:05] wolferine: of course not [04:05] thank you [04:05] The channels are logged. [04:05] brb [04:10] wolferine: you want another op? [04:10] doesnt matter to me [04:10] u offering ? [04:10] depends if you accept whatever i say, or not. [04:11] * mneptok runs for the bunker [04:11] mneptok: can also review [04:11] Hobbsee: i'll trust tritium's judgment. [04:12] sure Hobbsee, I can do that [04:12] from what i have read in backscroll, i see no reason not to. [04:12] @btlogin [04:14] wolferine: it's your right to have Hobbsee or any other op review. [04:15] i saw enough to know i didn;t need to keep reading. [04:16] wolferine: what surprises me, if you knew so much, and knew how to use triggers, is why you didn't just google what you wanted to know to begin with. [04:17] sorry, I had a phone call [04:17] thanks for letting me know tritium, I just thought I would ask [04:18] Hobbsee, im not sure what you want me to say, but I did attempt to find a solution, but I find IRC much more of a tool than google in many cases [04:19] http://www.pastebin.ca/882940 [04:19] that is a post of both sides of the conversation [04:19] if I happen to have left a line out, im sorry [04:20] i felt tritium was becoming aggressive towards me, and added him to my /ignore [04:20] wolferine: all you really need to do is treat those trying to help you with a little more courtesy. [04:20] as I would any other user, who wasnt attempting to assist me, and carried the same attitude [04:20] After all, we're volunteers, and your hostility took me aback. [04:20] not realizing he was an op [04:21] wolferine: you do realize that the URL referenced in that factoid tritium triggered *does* answer your question, yes? [04:21] wolferine: you appear to think that it's OK to roast anyone who doesn't answer your question the way you want to, and to do your google search for you? [04:21] i.e. http://wiki.linuxquestions.org/wiki/CD_Image_Conversion#img2iso [04:22] tritium, i have learned with over 15 years of being on IRC, helping others for 10 of those years, that its not always the best to take other ppls comments personally [04:22] sorry, am I discussing this with all of you ? [04:22] yes, you aksed us to get involved. [04:22] as I thought that Hobbsee and I were going to discuss? [04:22] *asked [04:22] mneptok, i did not ask you to get involved [04:22] wolferine: mneptok is another operator. [04:22] im just asking for clarification [04:23] as the three of you are asking me questions/making points [04:23] what needs clarification? [04:23] i believe my questions I just asked [04:24] wolferine: so, you did not get the response you desired, although, as mneptok says, it's actually in the factoid. so you got snarky at the one who had given it to you. and then you complain about the fact that they acted on that. [04:24] wolferine: sure, that's fine. Don't take things personally. But, why not also treat people with some respect? [04:24] how about we just get to the point [04:24] why was I banned? [04:25] another point is that the Ubuntu Code Of Conduct basically forbids saying anything that someone *could* take personally. [04:25] Hobbsee, do you mind if we take this to pm ? [04:25] wolferine: I've explained [04:25] or tritium [04:26] I thought you wanted to discuss it here, wolferine. [04:26] wolferine: you were banned due to attacking and being disrespectful to those who had given you an answer. [04:26] apart from that, while doing your attacking, you were stopping others from receiving help, by increasing channel noise, with non-support material. [04:26] how was I attacking ? [04:27] Hobbsee, thats like a cop scanning your car for 'something' else that might be wrong in a situation [04:27] wolferine: in the future, why not try something like "Thanks, I appreciate that, but I didn't find what I was looking for there. Do you have another suggestion?" [04:27] i cannot defend the fact that for me to prove my point, I need to post chat to the channel [04:28] tritium, and possibly it might not be a good idea to provoke another user either ? [04:28] what point? that the URL given to you contained the answer you sought? [04:28] wolferine: yes, you should not have proved me, particularly since I was trying to help [04:28] wolferine: apart from telling him he's going insane... [04:28] provoked* [04:29] mneptok, im not trying to be rude, but I will just respond to Hobbsee and tritium right now [04:29] if you want clarification later, I dont mind talking to you later [04:30] Hobbsee, I felt he missed a post, yet answered it in the same response, which was a bit confusing [04:30] * mneptok tootles off for home [04:30] Good night, mneptok. [04:31] so can I ask this again [04:31] how was I attacking ? [04:31] i answered that. [04:31] [15:28] wolferine: apart from telling him he's going insane... [04:31] wolferine: do you not realize how inappreciative you were? [04:31] And how rude that is? [04:31] that being said, you still need to learn to be respectful. [04:31] 'losing it' [04:31] answers do not get served to you on a silver platter, and irc is not your personal google search. [04:32] Hobbsee, what is your point exactly? [04:32] i dont see having an hour long convo about all this is necessary [04:32] wolferine: I've asked you several questions. [04:32] getting irate because you didn't get the exact answer you wanted, when you chose not to google search, just puts you with a high sense of entitlement. [04:32] tritium, I have two ppl to answer, so if you dont mind, please be patient [04:32] particularly seeing as the answer actually *was* there, and you didn't appear to notice. [04:33] i was not 'irate' [04:33] wolferine: hey, you be patient. I delayed going to bed to be here. [04:33] I could have just as easily addressed this tomorrow, wolferine [04:33] wolferine: and if you think we're only all doing one thing at once, and listening to you, you're dreaming. [04:33] tritium, I asked you if I could discuss with someone else, so you could leave [04:33] i have been accomidating [04:33] what question did I not reply to, tritium? [04:33] wolferine: no, you have been inappreciative, rude, and condescending [04:33] wolferine: do you not realize how inappreciative you were? [04:33] That's one... [04:34] i dont feel I have been rude [04:34] wolferine: come back in 24 hours. [04:34] wolferine: sure, that's fine. Don't take things personally. But, why not also treat people with some respect? [04:34] you won't get any further today. [04:34] Hobbsee, why ? [04:34] That's another. [04:34] you're proving that you still don't treat people with respect. [04:34] what? [04:34] i have been considerate and respectful [04:34] I have attempted to answer both of your questions [04:34] Not to me, you haven't. [04:35] In what way is telling me I'm losing it, after offering you assistance, considerate or respectful? [04:35] tritium, and since im having to admit I am being disrespectful, can you admit you were provoking me as well then, which is in a sense, disrespectful as well [04:36] so we both were disrespecting each other [04:36] wolferine: you're "having" to admit? You do not recognize it to be so? [04:36] wolferine: i don't call giving you a factoid answer, which answered your question, being provoking. [04:36] and we both want to help in the channel [04:36] * Hobbsee doesn't think we're going to get any further with this anytime soon [04:36] so why not remove the ban, and we can move past all this? [04:36] Agreed. [06:28] The automatic test fails for #ubuntu-read-topic [06:28] I changed my port :\ [06:28] Can I get tested here? [07:15] bladezor: did you type "test me" in the channel? [07:15] yes [07:16] It just disconnects me and it makes me rejoin that channel [07:16] I'll try again, sec [07:17] Ok it didn't disconnect this time [07:17] I guess it worked [07:20] meh well it's not letting me join , floodbot keeps...flooding me with "Sorry, you'll have to wait a little longer still, we are experiencing problems... hold tight! You will be allowed back in shortly." [07:21] not sure why it's doing that, seems to be stuck somehow [07:22] you'll have to wait for an #ubuntu op to read this and unban you then [07:22] ok [07:24] bladezor: removed, thanks for your patience [07:24] Thanks [07:27] stdin: it'll be the same version as an already existing version in the ubuntu archive [07:27] Hobbsee: either that or the same version for another release [07:28] it would use the orig tarball if that were the case. [07:28] this is likely a repack, under the same name, as what's already there, or in the ubuntu archive [08:23] is there a way to see who keeps msging the bot and redirecting it to me in a pm ? [08:25] ikonia: the bot would say " wants you to know: ..." [08:28] oooh thats odd [08:28] I wonder if Seveas is playing a trick ;) [08:29] ubotu: !test > ikonia (it should have my nick in the message) [08:29] lets see [08:29] yup, got it from you [08:29] wish I still had the other window open, I may have missed the name [08:30] thank you stdin [09:40] woo, no0tic spam [10:53] Doh, pricey isnt around === nalioth__ is now known as nalioth [13:01] !test [13:01] Failed. [13:16] oi [13:16] o que é isso? [13:24] LjL, where's fb2? [13:26] good questions [13:26] PriceChild: ping [13:26] or even pong [13:27] * Pici thinks he knows what this is about. [13:27] Although I didnt realize it until yesterday eitehr. [13:27] Hey jussi01 [13:27] PriceChild: youasked me to ping you? [13:27] jussi01, come to #pricechild please :) [13:29] PriceChild: ahh, gotch [13:29] a [13:29] and all was well in the world :) [13:29] thank you :) [13:29] No problem. [13:31] * jussi01 now has to figure out this network problem with the new server... grrr [13:31] jussi01, are you sure its plugged in? [13:31] * PriceChild ducks [13:31] PriceChild: lol yeah [13:32] jussi01, have you tried turning it on and off again? [13:32] PriceChild: !!! [13:32] too much it crowd i can see [13:32] I don't know anything more sorry, that's all the IT Crowd gave me. [13:32] :P [13:32] its funny because its trueeeee! [13:32] so true [13:33] I've never seen the IT crowd, but it sounds just like when I was doing Windows support. [13:33] Pici: go watch, increadibly funny [13:33]