/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2008/01/31/#ubuntu-devel.txt

slangasekcrimsun: AFAICS you're not currently subscribed to bugs for pulseaudio; but perhaps you could take a look at bug #187469 since you're the last uploader?01:16
ubotuLaunchpad bug 187469 in pulseaudio "pulseaudio should have versioned dependency on sysv-rc for use of update-rc.d multiuser" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/18746901:16
* TheMuso checks whether he is on the audio team, but doesn't think so.01:17
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TheMusoOk, the kernel team is a member of the audio team, but crimsun deactivated himself a while ago.01:19
slangasekright; that didn't stop him from uploading the package 5 days ago ;)01:19
TheMusoI know, I think he just tracks debian and upstream.01:20
TheMusoAnd has a look at the buglist from time to time.01:20
TheMusoBut I'm only guessing here.01:20
slangasekif you're saying you'd rather take care of the bug yourself, be my guest :-)01:20
TheMusoNo, I'm just saying that unless he's around now, he may not get to it for another day or so, so I'll take a peak, since I intend to get more involved with audio work in Ubuntu anyway.01:21
TheMusoslangasek: I'd do it, however it may be quicker for a core-dev to do it, as I don't yet have core-dev membership.01:23
TheMusoSince its only a small change.01:23
* ScottK2 wonders when the Tech Board will get to processing applications....01:24
TheMusoScottK: I was supposed to be on Tuesday, but only mdz was around, so it was a no go.01:24
ScottK2So it's in two weeks then ...01:25
* ScottK2 hopes more people get added to the agenda.01:25
TheMusoDOn't know. mdz said he'd contact the others and see what could be sorted.01:25
TheMusoScottK: Have you been emailed to ask if you can attend a meeting?01:26
TheMusoI don't remember seeing one.01:26
TheMusoIf it was CCd to the mc list.01:26
ScottK2TheMuso: No.  I haven't.  I'm waiting on that still.01:26
ScottK2IIRC I was the next applicant after you, so I was expecting to hear something maybe after your meeting.01:26
IntuitiveNippleIs there a way to remove unnecessary binary files from a source package?01:29
IntuitiveNippleThe diff doesn't cover it; seems like it'd need a new source archive.01:30
MithrandirIntuitiveNipple: rm it in the rules file01:30
IntuitiveNippleMithrandir: but how would that change what's in the original tgz ?01:31
MithrandirIntuitiveNipple: it wouldn't01:31
Mithrandirbut why is that important?01:31
ScottK2For that you need to repack the tarball.01:31
IntuitiveNippleI discovered in fixing these bugs in the mysql-query-browser package that it has been shipped with the .lo and .o 32-bit binaries in the gtksourceview sub-package01:32
IntuitiveNippleWell, it's a lot of space for one, not good practice for two, and the 32-bit static stuff was causing various SIGSEGVs for amd64 and once those were fixed, causing failed 32-bit builds!01:32
IntuitiveNippleI'll push the debdiff for now but it'd make sense to clean it up, although I'm not sure how to go about and I've wasted a day on this already01:33
Mithrandirsure, tell upstream to fix it01:33
crimsunslangasek: / TheMuso: on it, I'll upload a new one with a couple other bug fixes.01:33
TheMusocrimsun: Ok.01:34
IntuitiveNippleupstream would be... debian, or mysql?01:34
* TheMuso needs to get onto pulse's lists and bug tracker. :)01:34
MithrandirIntuitiveNipple: mysql, I'd say.01:34
IntuitiveNippleHmmm, that'll be fun :)01:34
IntuitiveNippleI've built 32 & 64 bit here now, I'm just confirming it on my PPA before I publish the debdiff01:35
* TheMuso -> getting lunch.02:12
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dholbachgood morning07:15
stgrabermoin07:19
dholbachhi stgraber07:19
pittiGood morning07:20
TheMusoMorning pitti.07:24
pittihey TheMuso07:26
pittisoren: oh, oops; libvirt is in main, but needs xen; xen-3.1 is in universe, and the newer xen-3.2, too07:30
pittisoren: since I understood that we only want to support kvm in hardy07:30
pittisoren: any idea what to do about this?07:31
pittisoren: (and libvirt still uses xen 3.1)07:31
stgraberpitti: When will the first Alpha4 candidates be released ?07:35
pittistgraber: I don't know, that's slangasek's now07:36
pittistgraber: the current live images are out of date07:36
pittimaybe because of the gnome-control-center and gnome-settings-daemon file conflict, I haven't checked yet07:36
warp10Good morning07:37
sorenpitti: libxen3.1 at least used to be in main?07:45
pittisoren: yes, it was07:45
pittihi warp1007:45
sorenpitti: It was needed for libvirt which in turn was needed by redhat-cluster-suite.07:45
warp10hey pitti!07:46
dholbachbdmurray: do you plan to get new versions of py-lp-bugs and bughelper uploaded soon?07:46
sorenpitti: What changed?07:46
pittisoren: if the server team is really ready to support and endorse xen-3.2, I can promote it again07:46
pittisoren: changed> first, we got xen-3.2, and second I was told by mdz that we should have never really had xen in main in the first place07:46
sorenpitti: Well, afaik, we were never ready to support and endorse xen-3.1, which is why most of it stayed in universe. Only libxen was in main.07:46
pittisoren: and thirdly someone told me that 'kvm it is!' for hardy07:46
pittisoren: ok, I see07:47
sorenpitti: I see.07:47
sorenpitti: Erm..07:47
pittisoren: so, is it possible to build libvirt against xen-3.2?07:47
pittisoren: then I'll promote the client libs to main and leave the rest in universe07:47
sorenpitti: I'll try.07:47
sorenpitti: Er... It's still stuck in NEW.07:52
sorenmvo: What CPU do you have in that KVM-able AMD machine?08:47
pittisoren: what exactly?08:51
sorenpitti: xen 3.208:51
pittisoren: hm, it only built on i386 so far08:53
sorenpitti: Yeah. I'll poke zul about it this afternoon, when he shows up.08:53
sorenpitti: It seems to fail because the binary-arch target assumes latex is present, but texlive is int b-d-i.08:54
peciskgnome-settings-daemon broken in last updates08:54
mvosoren: a am2 X2 (model 107, stepping 2) - let me know if you need the full /proc/cpuinfo output08:57
sorenmvo: Hm... I'm looking at a AMD Athlon 64 X2 5600+08:58
sorenmvo: That wouldn't happen to be the same, would it?08:59
mvosoren: no, mine is just a 4400+ :)09:01
mvosoren: are you looking into buying one?09:01
sorenmvo: I'm strongly considering renting one.09:01
coyctecmIs Jono Bacon here?09:02
mvoI'm very happy with mine, upgrade testing runs nice and smooth now09:03
sorenAwesome.09:05
sorenThere. Ordered.09:07
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cjwatsoncoyctecm: sometimes, though not right now09:11
coyctecmcjwatson, ok09:15
cjwatsonpitti: FYI, I edited Bugs/HowToFilter to add locking to the rules that deliver mail to actual folders rather than /dev/null, as otherwise you can corrupt folders if you're unlucky09:15
pitticjwatson: oh, is that the final : in :0: ?09:16
pitticjwatson: thanks, I wasn't aware of that actually09:17
cjwatsonyeah, it is09:17
pitticjwatson: wow, I hadn't expected procmail to be dangerous by default09:18
* pitti fixes his local .procmailrc then09:19
TheMusopitti: What exactly needs fixing? Mine seems to work fine.09:20
pittiso does mine; TBH I'm not sure what can go wrong09:20
cjwatsonif two procmails try to deliver to the same folder concurrently and you haven't specified a lockfile (just putting ':' at the end of the rule header uses a default folder-specific lockfile) then you can get the usual corruption you might expect from two programs trying to write the same file at the same time09:23
cjwatsonprobably lost mail, but if you're really unlucky I suppose interleaved mail is just about possible09:24
sorenMaildir ftw!09:24
cjwatson(I'm not sure exactly how procmail opens files)09:24
cjwatsonsoren: a lockfile's hardly rocket science :)09:24
sorencjwatson: True that.09:25
sorenNevertheles.... Maildir ftw!09:25
pittiI prefer maildir on my desktop/laptop, too, but on the server mbox is nicer for backup09:26
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* TheMuso never runs more than one procmail at a time here, well at least doesn't think so, with using fethcmail.09:27
sorenpitti: You think?09:27
pittisoren: ten files, one for each folder, is much easier to handle/check/move around than a million subdirectories09:28
sorenpitti: I found that having to back up a multi-GB mbox just because one mail was edited was quite annoying.09:28
pittisoren: yeah, huge mboxes are painful; I don't have them, though09:28
sorenpitti: Well, I used to host mail for quite a few people. I couldn't just tell them to "please don't use large folders" :)09:29
sorenWEll, I could, but they wouldn't listen.09:29
pittiheh09:29
TheMusosoren: lol09:29
dholbachpitti: thanks for checking the apport mail (attachments being patches)09:34
pittidholbach: gern geschehen09:34
SlimGWill Alpha 4 be released today?09:43
stgraberSlimG: yep09:51
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cjwatsonTheMuso: on my system, fetchmail delivers to exim, which can process multiple mails concurrently09:52
cjwatson(sorry, pinged out, you may have got that twice)09:52
TheMusocjwatson: No I didn't, and I understand what you're getting at.09:53
SlimGstgraber: Any knowhow on when? 1 hour? 5 hours or 11 hours from now? :)09:53
stgraberSlimG: well, the release manager is in the US timezone + we haven't really done any important testing yet (ISO aren't even on the tracker)09:55
stgraberSlimG: so it'll likely be late today09:55
SlimGmkay, thanks for the info stgraber, I apprechiate it09:56
pittiway cool. fully noninteractive self tests of the jockey GTK interface10:09
TheMusoIs synaptic ever likely to use policykit for hardy?10:12
mvoTheMuso: no, very unlikely10:14
mvopitti: with dogtail?10:14
pittimvo: no, just with using .response() for dialogs and .emit('clicked') etc. for buttons10:14
pittimvo: it's not 100% functionality coverage, but it runs through all widgets and dialogs at least10:15
pittimvo: since the GTK UI implementation does not have any logic, just an implementation of AbstractUI (which does have the logic and has its own full test suite), that's enough for my purposes10:15
* mvo nods10:16
TheMusomvo: Ok thanks. What about gnome-app-install?10:17
mvoTheMuso: it uses synaptic as its backend (for all the operations that require root)10:18
TheMusomvo: Oh ok then.,10:18
mvoTheMuso: any specific reason that you ask? I haven't looked what it would take yet10:19
TheMusomvo: Just wanting to know so that I can 1) recommend a tool for people to use for package installation who use assistive technology, and 2) be able to target testing for gnome-app-install to find any accessibliity bugs relating to the use of assistive technology.10:20
cjwatsonooh, I nearly have vim omnicompletion for Launchpad bugs working10:29
pittiseb128: did you notice the gnome-settings-daemon vs. gnome-control-center file conflict for /usr/bin/gnome-settings-daemon?10:32
seb128pitti: yes, I'll upload a fixed version10:32
pittiseb128: awesome, thanks; so I won't report it10:32
seb128pitti: that's just an upgrade issue, new g-c-c doesn't contain this one10:33
seb128apt or dpkg could handle that better10:33
cjwatsonhttp://people.ubuntu.com/~cjwatson/tmp/lp-omnicomplete.png10:41
pitticjwatson: cool!10:41
sorencjwatson: Awesome!10:47
* soren drools uncontrollably10:47
Hobbseehi soren10:48
sorenHello.10:48
soren'zup?10:48
Hobbseesoren: taking over the world.  pondering what to do, if anything, about MOTU.10:49
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warp10Hi all!11:53
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cjwatsonRiddell: fancy some support for non-ASCII manual pages in konqueror?12:42
Riddellcjwatson: in the man:/ ioslave?12:43
cjwatsonyeah12:43
Riddellcjwatson: could do, what needs changed?12:43
cjwatsonabout to attach a patch to bug 44548, just wanted to know if you cared :)12:43
ubotuLaunchpad bug 44548 in kdebase "Problems with accentuated characters in man pages" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/4454812:43
Riddellcool12:46
jwendellHi, seb128. Did pidgin crashed today with you? (I guess it's glib related)13:03
seb128jwendell: it does crash on one of my boxes but not on the one I'm using right now13:04
ograseb128, is g-s-d wanting to overwrite /usr/bin/gnome-settings-daemon in g-c-c known ?13:04
ogra(upgrade error here)13:05
jwendellseb128, I've got a trace, gonna fill a bug13:05
seb128ogra: yes and the fix has been uploaded some hours ago13:05
seb128jwendell: where?13:05
jwendellseb128, launchpad? :)13:05
seb128jwendell: I doubt anybody reads piding bugs on launchpad, in case you want to file there13:05
ograseb128, thanks13:05
jwendell:(13:05
seb128jwendell: k, feel free, don't expect a quick reply though13:05
seb128jwendell: and I doubt it's a pidgin issue, it didn't change for weeks now13:06
jwendellseb128, my guess is glib13:06
jwendellseb128, look at the crash line:13:07
jwendellIA__g_logv (log_domain=0x0, log_level=G_LOG_LEVEL_CRITICAL, format=0xb77b0cd4 "%s: assertion `%s' failed", args1=0xbfe9cd8c "?G\216·\nÃ\215·PÜô·\027") at /build/buildd/glib2.0-2.15.4/glib/gmessages.c:50313:07
jwendell503/build/buildd/glib2.0-2.15.4/glib/gmessages.c: No such file or directory.13:07
jwendellin /build/buildd/glib2.0-2.15.4/glib/gmessages.c13:07
seb128that usually means it hits an assert13:07
jwendellseb128, maybe that define in glib being deprecated?13:08
seb128what do you mean?13:08
jwendellseb128, G_GNUC_[PRETTY_]FUNCTION ?13:09
seb128why would that create a crash?13:10
seb128that's a build time thing13:10
jwendellseb128, ok, I'm sorry13:10
seb128no need to be sorry13:10
seb128but I don't think it's due to that ;-)13:10
seb128jwendell: looks like there is no bug on launchpad about that yet, maybe use apport to send it?13:14
jwendellseb128, apport is ignoring the pidgin crash13:15
seb128what do you mean?13:15
jwendellseb128, does it ignore a crash after three times hitting 'don't send the bug' button?13:15
seb128yes13:15
jwendellhehe13:15
jwendellseb128, anyway I got a backtrace with gdb13:16
jwendellseb128, just filled the bug upstream13:16
seb128you can still send the crash using apport13:16
seb128ok13:16
seb128just go to /var/crash13:16
seb128and double click in nautilus on the crash you want to report13:17
jwendellnice13:17
seb128or use apport-cli or apport-gtk13:17
jwendellseb128, the backtrace contains my password. Is there any way to hide it after the bug is filled?13:18
seb128apport bugs are marked private by default13:19
seb128and you can edit the description after sending it13:19
seb128the coredump is removed when the bug is retraced13:19
jwendellseb128, but can't edit an attachment :(13:19
seb128hum, right13:20
seb128did you send it already?13:20
jwendellseb128, nope13:20
seb128you can remove an attachment though13:20
seb128don't send it if you don't like that13:20
jwendellseb128, sent *edited" backtrace to upstream13:20
seb128ok13:20
sorenWow... a debhelper-less package. That's something you don't see every day.13:21
seb128soren: I've plenty of cdbs packages ;-)13:22
sorenseb128: cdbs uses debhelper, too. This one is *actually* debhelper-less.13:22
Seveassoren, which one?13:23
seb128heh, is that something still maintained?13:23
sorenSeveas: dnsmasq13:23
sorenSeveas: Oh, yes.13:23
sorenEr..13:23
seb128soren: I wrote a debian/rules without debhelper once, not again ;-)13:23
sorenseb128: Oh, yes.13:23
Riddellpitti: I've uploaded the konqueror flash SRUs ready for your next archive day13:24
Riddellpitti: I can't work out what the status of the flashplugin-nonfree SRUs is13:25
jwendellohhhh13:26
jwendelli just did a 'rm *' on my $HOME. is there an 'undelete'?13:27
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persiajwendell: Restore from backups13:30
cjwatsonjwendell: no, sorry13:30
cjwatsonthere are some low-level methods for doing it on some filesystems but they are much less likely to work on ext313:30
* persia notes that there are data recovery tools, but they are not easy to use, and installing them can cause data corruption13:30
cjwatsonif you want to try, you should remount the filesystem read-only immediately13:31
ograif you want to use them though i'd suggest hitting the power button immediately13:31
ograoh, right13:31
jwendellfortunately I have a backup, from last week. And, for my luck, I didn't '-rf'13:31
ogracolins suggestion is better :)13:31
* ogra did that recovery thing once ... massively painful13:32
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Riddellasac: I think we should just do a quick SRU for13:48
Riddellflashplugin-nonfree now13:48
persiaRiddell: Even if it breaks konqueror (or did that get fixed)?13:50
Riddellpersia: that's been fixed noew13:52
asacRiddell: how?13:52
Riddellnow13:52
* persia agrees with Riddell that's it's time for the SRU13:52
Riddellasac: update the md5sum and whatever else needs done13:52
asacwhere? by adobe or konqueror?13:52
Riddellasac: konqueror has a workaround for adobe's changes13:53
asacRiddell: could you do it this time? ... i am completely swamped because moz has changed sec release date from "in two weeks" to "now"13:55
asaci could do it tonight ... or tomorrow13:56
Riddellasac: I can probably do it, but is it just the md5sum that needs changed?13:56
Riddellbrandon did an upload previously but I can't see any debdiffs from him13:57
Riddellimbrando1: alive?13:57
asacok lets wait a bit ... if he isn't avail we can talk about plan B :)14:00
asachave to go for lunch anyway now14:01
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cjwatsonseb128: do you know the internals of yelp much?14:27
seb128cjwatson: no, why?14:27
cjwatsonseb128: I'm trying to make it support UTF-8 manual pages by calling out to 'man --recode UTF-8'14:27
cjwatsonerr, support any non-ASCII manual pages that is14:27
cjwatsonseb128: but weirdly, with my patch it says it can't find the file and then displays it anyway :)14:28
seb128cjwatson: maybe attach the patch upstream and mention the issue? they are usually quite responsive14:28
cjwatsonit's not an upstreamable patch unfortunately14:29
cjwatsonas in it depends on man-db which is distro-specific14:29
seb128ah, ok14:29
cjwatsonwhom would I be best off talking to?14:30
mitsuhikohi all14:30
mitsuhikocompletely offtopic question but hopefully answers :)14:30
seb128cjwatson: maybe ask mdke when he's around, he's often in contact with DonS who is upstream14:30
mitsuhikosay you want to develop a gpl application which uses tango icons which are licenses under the cc-sa14:30
mitsuhikoand the application is a web application and the icons used as part of the theme14:30
mitsuhikois that possible?14:31
seb128cjwatson: open a bug in launchpad with the patch so it's easy to point upstream to it14:31
cjwatsonI'll attach it to bug 154829, which is the relevant one14:34
ubotuLaunchpad bug 154829 in yelp "Yelp uses wrong encoding for localized manpages" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/15482914:34
cjwatsonthanks14:34
seb128thank you14:35
jwendellseb128, definately it' a glib bug. I got exactly same backtrace for a crash in evolution14:40
seb128jwendell: do you have the backtrace online somewhere?14:41
seb128jwendell: what do you do to crash evolution?14:41
jwendellseb128, I was about to create a filter based on mailing list14:42
jwendellseb128, wow, there are similar bugs14:42
jwendellbug #18760314:43
ubotuBug 187603 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/187603 is private14:43
jwendellbug #18763714:43
ubotuBug 187637 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/187637 is private14:43
seb128jwendell: those are totally different backtraces14:45
jwendellseb128, but the title is the same :)14:45
jwendellseb128, Bug #18766714:46
ubotuBug 187667 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/187667 is private14:46
jwendellseb128,  this is mine14:46
seb128jwendell: right, which means that a g_return_if_fail_warning() condition has been hit14:46
jwendellseb128, exactly14:46
seb128jwendell: but any program or library can use g_return_if_fail_warning() on any condition14:46
seb128that doesn't mean it's a glib bug or that they are similar14:46
jwendellseb128, indeed, but it's a bit weird to have various programs crashing *today* with this same assert14:47
seb128dholbach: is pidgin crashing on your hardy box where evolution doesn't work?14:48
pochujwendell: and your liferea crash too, bug 18762214:53
ubotuLaunchpad bug 187622 in liferea "liferea-bin crashed with signal 5 in IA__g_return_if_fail_warning()" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/18762214:53
seb128jwendell: can you try if downgrading glib fix your issue?14:53
jwendellpochu, yes14:54
seb128ah14:54
jwendellseb128, sure, if you tell me how :)14:54
seb128let me try something14:54
* jwendell thinks seb128 found the problem :)14:54
seb128jwendell: how to trigger the evolution crash?14:55
seb128jwendell: not really14:55
jwendellseb128, right click on a message, create an rule->based on mailing list14:56
seb128jwendell: does opening the properties dialog work correctly?14:56
jwendellseb128, what properties? you mean preferences window?14:57
seb128jwendell: yes14:57
jwendellseb128, oops, crash again14:57
Lutinpitti: can you give-back rtfm please ?14:58
pittiLutin: done14:58
Lutinpitti: thanks14:59
\shhmmm15:00
\shpitti, did you have any problems with gtk+2.0 sources fetching with ia32-libs/fetch-and-build?15:01
pitti\sh: if source/binaries are out of sync, that happens15:01
\shpitti, hmm..let me update my local system...apt-get source gtk+2.0 works for me until now ;)15:02
* jwendell wonders if seb128 has 2 machines, one for daily use and other for tests and crashes :015:02
jwendell:)15:02
\shpitti, na, it will fetch a nwe version, yes but works15:02
\shah i38615:02
seb128jwendell: no, not due to the new gtk15:03
seb128jwendell: what architecture do you use?15:03
jwendellseb128, i38615:03
ion_Btw, has anyone considered making dpkg use a faster database than plaintext sequential files?15:04
Riddellasac, pitti: flashplugin-nonfree updates uploaded for gutsy and feisty, edgy and dapper are harder to do15:04
\shnope i386 works as well15:05
seb128jwendell: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/glib2.0/2.15.3-0ubuntu1/+build/49625415:05
seb128jwendell: you can get binaries from there, download those you need and sudo dpkg -i *.deb15:05
Lutinpitti: why don't the buildds install the build-depends-indep (or at least seem not to) ?15:10
jwendellseb128, same thing. (must i reboot?)15:10
seb128jwendell: no need to reboot, just restart the application15:11
seb128jwendell: or try to start pidgin15:11
pittiLutin: the i386 one does; other arches don't (they just do dpkg-buildpackage -B)15:11
jwendellseb128, same crashes in pidgin and evolution15:11
seb128jwendell: ok, so that's not glib15:11
seb128jwendell: want to try downgrading gtk? https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+2.0/2.12.5-1/+build/49513315:12
Lutinpitti: what's the reason for this ?15:15
pittiLutin: Arch: all should be built just once, not 5 times in vain15:16
pittiLutin: so in Ubuntu, the i386 buildds build Arch: all packages, and the other arches do -B15:16
pittiLutin: that's why we have one more i386 buildd15:16
jwendellseb128, I quit, same crashes15:19
seb128jwendell: that is weird15:19
cjwatsonpitti: is anyone working on adding consolekit support to login?15:20
Lutinpitti: eek, I was looking at the wrong build log. got it, thanks15:20
cjwatsonI'm a bit surprised that isn't there15:20
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pitticjwatson: not to my knowledge ATM; there is a PAM integration package for CK, but I never tested it; do we need it?15:23
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jdongare there any archive admins online that can shove transmission 1.00-1~gutsy1 through binary NEW?15:28
jdongit's causing repo breakage for backports users (bug 187526)15:28
ubotuLaunchpad bug 187526 in transmission "can't install/upgrade package in gusty if gusty-backports is enabled" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/18752615:28
asacRiddell: why?15:28
asacRiddell: konqueror not updated yet? (thanks btw)15:29
mptdholbach, remind me, how do you tell whether a bug is in the sponsoring queue?15:39
dholbachseb128: yes :)15:39
dholbachmpt: if ubuntu-{universe,main}-sponsors is subscribed15:39
jdongdholbach: can you handle the archive issue I mentioned above?15:39
mptdholbach, excellent, thanks15:39
dholbachjdong: no, I'm afraid I'm not an archive admin15:40
dholbach(which is probably a good thing)15:40
jdongdholbach: oh, I could've sworn you were! oops :)15:40
seb128jdong: I'm one, what do you need?15:40
jdongseb128: it seems like i386 gutsy-backports transmission is stuck in binary NEW while everything else went through15:40
jdongbug 18752615:41
ubotuLaunchpad bug 187526 in transmission "can't install/upgrade package in gusty if gusty-backports is enabled" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/18752615:41
seb128jdong: everything else had no need binaries likely?15:42
Riddellasac: edgy and dapper are harder to do because they need updating from flash 7 and there's debconf stuff.  it didn't work when I tried at any rate, probably I just missed somehting15:43
jdongseb128: yeah, that's what I'm guessing. the transmission metapackage seems new15:43
jdongseb128: though it's really odd it seems like only i386 had the problem?15:43
seb128jdong: no, what is new is the transmission-common15:43
jdongah15:43
mptdholbach, would it make sense for the sponsoring queue to be handled more explicitly by Launchpad, rather than by subscribing/unsubscribing a particular team?15:43
seb128jdong: only i386 build arch all15:43
jdongwell that explains that too :)15:44
dholbachmpt: how do you think that should happen?15:44
seb128jdong: accepted15:44
mptdholbach, I don't know -- I'm sure you or someone has explained to me how the queue works at some stage, but I've forgotten15:45
mptbut Launchpad should make easy the process of getting stuff fixed15:45
dholbachmpt: in the perfect world we'd have NoMoreSourcePackages and everything would be in one or the other bzr branch :-)15:45
jdongseb128: thanks :)15:45
seb128you are welcome15:45
mptdholbach, ah, so sponsoring would be replaced by merging?15:46
dholbachmpt: yes15:46
mptok15:46
mptIs NoMoreSourcePackages likely to happen in the next, say, 3 years?15:46
* jdong gives mpt the optimism award of the day15:47
cjwatsonmpt: maaaaaybe15:47
mptjdong, no no, I'm being pessimistic, that's about how long it would take to implement anything sponsorship-queue-specific in LP ;-)15:48
\shpitti, requestsync is broken ;) There is no project named 'distros' registered in Launchpad. ;)15:48
ograif we all work towards it it should be achievable ...15:49
\shpitti, forget it, I'm using an old one15:49
jdongit's a lot of infrastructure change, but I can't wait for it to happen :)15:49
pitti\sh: it's in ubuntu-dev-tools nowadays15:49
\shpitti, yepp..I just had the old one still in my all the time in svn ~/bin/ dir ;)15:50
sistpoty|workmvo: can you sponsor me nvidia-settings again? bug #178255 (though I must admit, that I didn't test-build it since I added the debdiff)15:52
ubotuLaunchpad bug 178255 in nvidia-settings "NVCtrl.h and NVCtrlLib.h should be installed in /usr/include/NVCtrl not /usr/include" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/17825515:52
* ogra kicks evo in the guts .... with run-up 15:53
ograevil thing ...15:53
Hobbseempt: ah yes, but how long for it to be fixed, after it being *broken* in LP?15:54
Hobbsee:)15:54
mpteh?15:54
Hobbseempt: first implementations are often wrong :)15:55
seb128ogra: what did it do?15:55
* ogra cries ... why does my mailer have to be so mean to me *sniff*15:55
ograseb128, it decided to collapse all threads after the last crash15:56
mptbecause no-one's implemented a good one yet? :-)15:56
ograand obviously the 2exapnd all threads" function always only expands one level15:56
seb128ogra: ctrl-T15:56
ograi'm clicking my ass off to get to the last (new) message in a thread here15:56
ograseb128, yay, now all collapsed again15:57
ogractrl-t wasnt such a good idea15:57
seb128do it again15:57
ograit switches threading off/on but doesnt expand the threads15:57
Hobbseedoes * do anything?15:58
ograactually if i expand one it collapses it again15:58
ograi'll just click my way through15:58
ograoh, another restart helped :)15:59
\shogra, use claws ,-)16:00
ogra\sh, or balsa :)16:01
seb128evolution is good16:02
\shogra, hmm..balsa...tested it only once....I like claws now ;) it works ;)16:02
ograbalsa doesnt have much overhead ... thats what i like about it16:03
ograclaws ... to many options i'll never need ...16:04
* ogra remembers times where mail clients were 300k big :)16:05
\shcjwatson, how do I tell your new "show LP bugs" addon to sort for importance e.g.? :)16:05
ograwhich gui mail client comes with less than a meg nowadays .... ?16:05
\shogra, these days all mail clients were named mail, elm, pine (or mutt) ;)16:06
stgraberogra: telnet is 90k here :)16:06
ograstgraber, gui :)16:06
\shogra, gnome-terminal -e telnet <your mailserver> 110|143 is gui ,-)16:07
ogra:P16:07
cjwatson\sh: you edit it16:07
pochu\sh: gnome-terminal -e is broken :P16:08
cjwatsonit ought to be possible to make the sorting cleverer; I didn't because I had already spent too much time on it16:08
\shcjwatson, and when I'm on it, I could add a "stop adding bugnumbers when hitting ESC"16:09
\shcjwatson, but cool stuff, I have to say...thx for that :)16:09
bdmurraydholbach: today or tomorrow16:09
dholbachbdmurray: rock and roll16:09
\shpochu, gnome-terminal -e "telnet whereever 143" works for me :)16:10
cjwatson\sh: yeah, it's not interruptible at the moment16:10
cjwatsonI'd be entirely happy for somebody to take it on and improve it16:11
cjwatson':help complete-functions' has some advice on making completion functions interruptible16:11
\shcjwatson, I'll have a look :)16:11
cjwatsoncheers16:12
jwendellseb128, can it be possible that glib or similar package was built with fatal asserts flag on?16:15
jwendellseb128, so, instead of just a warning, it crashs?16:15
pedro_jwendell: may you check the G_DEBUG environment variable?16:16
pittiseb128: hm, did you notice that nautilus recently started to create icons for internal drives/mounts? that can also be seen on the live CD16:17
jwendellpedro_, fatal_criticals16:17
jwendellpedro_, is that?????16:17
pedro_aham!!16:17
pedro_tha's the guilty!16:17
jwendellputz16:17
pittiseb128: I've got it on my desktop, too, and ogra had a similar problem on edubuntu last week16:17
jwendellpedro_, where the hell did I put this???16:17
pedro_yeah that's it16:17
pedro_i don't know!16:17
pedro_just found that a few minutes ago16:17
pittiseb128: I'll have a look into this next week, but I might have some questions16:17
pedro_got the same crashes and i just looked in case of16:17
pedro_but don't know what package defined it recently16:18
pedro_it shouldn't be16:18
pedro_i mean not for normal users16:18
jwendellpedro_, yeah16:18
pedro_gotta run now, my food is waiting me16:19
jwendellpedro_, thanks16:20
seb128pitti: right, nautilus started using gvfs instead of gnome-vfs16:24
seb128pitti: and I didn't port the patch to ignore mnt mounts for example16:24
pittiseb128: ah, so I guess our previous patches to adopt the showd mounts doesn't work any more16:25
jwendellseb128, found the problem16:25
jwendellG_DEBUG variable16:25
seb128jwendell: ah?16:25
jwendellseb128, where is it being set?16:25
seb128jwendell: ah, gnome-session16:25
jwendellseb128, hard-coded?16:26
seb128jwendell: they set it during unstable branch to get bugs about critical warning, we usually patch it out but I didn't look at that when I did the update16:26
jwendellseb128, hehe16:26
\shcjwatson, CTRL+E is just that what it needs to end completion :) I wonder how to map it to esc in this case16:26
pochujwendell: will you close your liferea bug or shall I?16:26
jwendellpochu, let me do it16:27
pochujwendell: thanks16:27
=== luisbg is now known as LoL
seb128jwendell: unset G_DEBUG16:27
seb128jwendell: then run your application16:27
seb128dholbach: ^16:27
cjwatson\sh: I think the completion function needs to call complete_check occasionally16:27
jwendellseb128, yes, I did this ;)16:27
seb128jwendell: I'll fix it now16:27
jwendellseb128, thanks16:27
seb128jwendell: thank you for the work there16:28
dholbachseb128: all "good" again16:28
dholbach:-)16:28
seb128so those are not new bug16:28
seb128but what GNOME looks like when warning are crashers ;-)16:28
seb128and that's why I do patch this out usually16:28
jwendellseb128, I've got a headache, really :)16:28
=== LoL is now known as luisbg
jwendellseb128, I'm going to open a bug against gnome-session and mark all these kind of bugs as dupe16:32
seb128jwendell: they are not, they are valid bugs16:32
seb128jwendell: they are just warning, not crashers16:32
jwendellseb128, well, those kind of bugs should be forwarded upstream btw16:33
seb128jwendell: that's just that nobody bother about those usually, that's why GNOME guys make gnome-session set G_DEBUG during unstable cycle16:33
cjwatsonogra: sigh, I see what mccann means about privsep causing issues - PAM is just called too early16:36
slangasekstgraber: hardy alpha 4 candidates for ubuntu are up, finally; sorry for the delays16:36
cjwatsonno way am I changing that though16:37
stgraberslangasek: ok, how long do we have for testing ?16:38
slangasekstgraber: uh, as long as necessary; if the milestone release has to be pushed back until tomorrow, then that's what it'll be16:38
seb128ok everybody, gnome-session was setting G_DEBUG to make application crash on warnings since yesterday, that's something upstream do during unstable serie and that we don't usually16:41
seb128so if you received crashers in g_return_if_fail_warning(), those are warnings16:42
slangasekseb128: er. that means this is on the CDs, I guess?  Will that cause problems in practice?16:42
slangaseki.e., how much is crashing with this?16:42
dholbachevolution and pidgin are for me16:42
seb128slangasek: well, pidgin and evolution were crashing for some people here16:42
slangaseksigh16:43
seb128slangasek: but that doesn't seem to happen to everybody, might be config dependent16:43
slangaseksee, /now/ you're in trouble for uploading this during the alpha freeze ;)16:43
* seb128 hides16:43
slangasekwell, it is what it is.  I guess the fixed gnome-session will be available from the archive soon after?16:43
seb128slangasek: yeah, sorry about that, fixed version has just been uploaded, that should not be too bad for the CD16:44
slangasekok16:44
slangasekrelease notes then16:44
pittievand: btw, any idea why ubiquity's icon on the live CD is broken?16:44
seb128slangasek: thanks16:44
evandpitti: off the top of my head, no.  It and the installation method for it haven't changed, so I imagine I need to update it with respect to changes in GNOME.16:45
pittisoren: virt-manager just offers me xen and qemu as hypervisors; do I choose qemu for kvm?16:48
sorenpitti: Yeah, libvirt consider them sort of the same.16:48
* pitti sees it complain about a missing virtd and scratches head16:49
sorenpitti: Eh?16:54
sorenpitti: What's the exact error message?16:54
pittisoren: "Unable to open connection to hypervisor URI 'qemu:///session':16:56
pittisoren: then some backtrace16:56
dokoseb128: are gnome-terminal / gnome-vfs build failures known to you?16:57
pittithen 'libvirtError: virConnectOpenReadOnly() failed'16:57
dokognome-vfs-mime-handlers.c: In function 'gnome_vfs_mime_application_get_desktop_id':16:57
dokognome-vfs-mime-handlers.c:1601: error: 'G_GNUC_FUNCTION' undeclared (first use in this function)16:57
seb128doko: yes, there is new tarballs available upstream16:57
seb128doko: G_GNUC_* have been deprecated16:57
dokook, not filing any reports about those16:57
sorenpitti: If you're connecting to qemu:///session, libvirt is supposed to start a libvirtd for you. I'm not sure what could cause that to fail.16:58
pittisoren: do I need to start virt-manager as root? (the .desktop file doesn't)16:58
sorenpitti: No, not at all.16:58
sorenpitti: I recommend you connect to the system-wide libvirtd, though.16:58
sorenIt allows you to set up all the interesting networking options.16:59
sorenNamely brigded and virtual networks rather than just usermode networking.16:59
pittiit doesn't seem to ask me which virtd to connect to16:59
sorenThat's what you tell it with the uri.16:59
sorenqemu:///system is the system wide one.17:00
pittiah, -c qemu:///system ?17:00
sorenYes.17:00
pittisame error message, though17:00
shayadoes anyone know what broke pidgin in hardy?17:00
sorenAre you a member of libvirtd?17:00
pittisoren: no, I'm not17:01
sorenpitti: Then you won't be allowed to connect to qemu:///system17:01
* pitti sings "KVM is not enough" ♪17:01
sorenqemu:///session should still be fine, though.17:01
pittisoren: that group doesn't exist17:01
sorenThen you don't have libvirt-bin installed.17:01
soren...and that explains the other problems as well.17:02
pitti. o O { dependency? }17:02
sorenI'm considering iit.17:02
pittisoren: ok, thanks a lot for your support17:02
pittiah, there goes the daemon17:02
sorenIt's perfectly reasonable to use virt-manager to only connect to xen or remote qemu instances.17:02
pittitrue17:02
sorenSo a hard dependency seems wrong.17:03
sorenI'd like to add a meta package for this, though.17:03
sorenSo there'd be an ubuntu-virtualisation-node and ubuntu-virtualisation-admin or -manager or something.17:04
sorenThe former depending on libvirt-bin and kvm, the latter depending on virt-manager, openssh-client, etc.17:05
elmohow big is libvirt-bin?17:05
pittisoren: for 80 kB?17:05
elmoyeah, what pitti said17:06
sorenIt's 380 kb installed.17:06
elmojust add the dep17:06
sorenI didn't think the appropriateness of hard dependencies had much to do with the size of the dependencies.17:06
elmosure it does17:07
elmoadding new packages isn't free17:07
elmowhich seems to be your proposed solution17:07
elmotrying to avoid adding a dep on an 80Kb package with nothing but binaries isn't overly sane17:07
sorenIt could also just be a task.17:08
elmo(given the other context)17:08
elmosoren: apt-get install should DTRT17:08
sorenapt-get install my-task-name^  :P17:08
cjwatsonlibvirt-bin actually ships an init script and such, but I would be inclined to agree that it'd be a lot more straightforward to just depend on it17:09
cjwatsononce apt installs recommends by default, it could reasonably be downgraded to a recommends17:09
elmocjwatson: oh, ok - I assumed from the name that it wouldn't do such things, my bad17:09
cjwatsonit's rather unconventional naming17:09
cjwatsonstruct _CkConnecter;17:11
cjwatsontypedef struct _CkConnector CkConnector;17:11
cjwatsongo consolekit17:11
sorenWell, I'll probably be adding those tasks anyway. We want at least the stuff that's needed to function as a virtualisation node to be selectable in the server installer.17:11
jdongcjwatson: it's an abstraction layer ;-)17:11
slangasekcjwatson: xubuntu dailies seem to have failed today; germinate issue?17:12
cjwatsonjdong: complete with misspelling?17:12
cjwatsonslangasek: which daily?17:12
slangasekcjwatson: 20080131, daily and daily-live, both archs17:13
cjwatsonFailed to fetch file:/srv/cdimage.ubuntu.com/ftp-universe/dists/hardy/main/binary-amd64/Packages.bz2  MD5Sum mismatch17:13
cjwatsonodd ...17:13
slangasekI can retry it shortly if you think it's likely transient17:14
pittisoren: virt-manager looks great!17:14
cjwatsonthe universe mirror seems rather out of date, and none of the rsync logs mention it17:15
sorenelmo, cjwatson: libvirt-bin contains a daemon and a single cli tool (virsh) that exposes most of libvirt's functionality. What would be the conventional way to name it? "libvirtd" and keep the virsh in there even though it's essentially unrelated to the daemon? "libvirtd" and move virsh to a new package called libvirt-bin (yay, new binary)? Or "libvirtd" and move virsh to libvirt0 (erk)?17:16
cjwatsonout of date> except for the way I apparently don't know what date it is. er.17:16
cjwatsonslangasek: hard to say, but I think there's a decent chance it's transient; give it another try?17:17
sorenpitti: Yeah, once it gets going, it's pretty neat. :)17:17
cjwatsonI updated germinate for good measure, but I don't think that'll matter17:17
mr_pouitthere's something weird on http://people.ubuntu.com/~ubuntu-archive/livefs-build-logs/hardy/xubuntu/latest/livecd-20080131-i386.out: the seeds have been updated to libgoffice-gtk-0-517:17
mr_pouit*g*17:17
mr_pouitthe seeds have been updated to libgoffice-gtk-0-6 long ago17:17
cjwatsonmr_pouit: as we told you guys last time this happened, you need to update livecd-rootfs too17:17
cjwatsonI'll go and do that now17:18
Hobbseemr_pouit: did you upgrade the other one?17:18
Hobbseebah.  too slow17:18
cjwatsonit has a special hardcoded bit for libgoffice due to apt craziness of some kind that we should probably revisit17:18
cjwatsonmr_pouit: fixed livecd-rootfs uploaded; may take up to a day to propagate without admin help though17:20
cjwatsonmr_pouit: it's even in a comment in the seed17:21
cjwatson * (libgoffice-gtk-0-6)   # explicitely seed this for abiword and gnumeric gnomeless variants17:21
cjwatson                          # any changes here need to be done in the livefs build script, too, ping infinity about this/send an RT17:21
cjwatsonthough the action described is wrong now and I'll update it17:22
shayais there a way to get gdb to tell you what lib an unresolved symbol (in a backtrace) is coming from?17:22
seb128shaya: look at the address and what lib is using it, not sure if gdb can do the matching for you though17:23
seb128shaya: apport crashes have those informations17:23
shayaseb128: apport isn't catching pidgin crash17:24
seb128why not?17:24
shayaanyway I can run pidgin under apport?17:24
shayahave no clue17:24
shayait catches many other things17:24
seb128are you sure?17:24
shayapretty17:24
seb128ls /var/crash17:24
seb128shaya: does piding crash on startup on hardy for you?17:24
shayayes17:24
shayajust started today17:24
seb128shaya: try to unset G_DEBUG and run it17:24
shayano crash17:25
Kanohi, why is stil no casper update online?17:25
seb128good17:25
shayawhat happened?17:25
mr_pouitcjwatson: thanks (never heard of livecd-rootfs before, but that'll be ok now)17:25
seb128shaya: gnome-session set warning to crasher in unstable series17:25
shayahmph17:25
seb128shaya: we disable that in ubuntu usually but the patch was not listed in the series17:26
shayaah17:26
seb128shaya: I've uploaded a new version fixing that some time ago17:26
shayaok, thanks17:26
seb128you are welcome17:26
Kanohttps://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/casper/+bug/18725917:29
ubotuLaunchpad bug 187259 in casper "Add support for Aufs" [Undecided,New]17:29
Kanomaybe it is not needed to change the default to aufs17:32
Kanoas you can use it like unionfs=aufs too17:32
Kanodiffernt to that patch17:33
Kanohmm that patch sees a bit wrong, not the one i wrote17:35
Kanothat fallback is at a stupid position17:36
slangasekcjwatson: xubuntu daily looks good this time17:36
Kanojuliank: you may not add the fallback in the unionfs=... case, thats stupid17:37
Kanojuliank: as it would require a unionfs option!17:37
slangasekand xubuntu daily-live failing for the reason just identified, so17:37
Kanolook at my patch17:37
slangasekcjwatson: how many pulses does it take before the livecd-rootfs changes will be visible to xubuntu daily-live?17:37
Kanojuliank: it has to be outside of case17:37
\shpitti, libfaad (faad2) when was it moved from multiverse to universe?17:42
=== ryu2 is now known as ryu
berto-hi everyone, no one in #ubuntu seems to know, so i hope you don't mind me asking here.  after booting into a Xen kernel, my Quantum DLT-V4 SATA tape drive stopped working.  the kernel has the st and sg modules, but dmesg doesn't show it.  any idea what module i'm missing _or_ if ubuntu adds patches to get SATA tape working?17:48
berto-i compiled the 3.0.4 xen kernel, btw.17:48
geser\sh: according to LP on 2007-11-16 18:33:22 CET17:53
\shgeser, oh wow17:54
sorenpitti: I'd love to hear more about your kvm+ISO testing woes. It works fine for me.17:57
cjwatsonslangasek: if you want it guaranteed, I'd get #is on irc.c.c to update it18:09
cjwatsonslangasek: I think it's a (real) daily cron job but I don't know for sure18:09
slangasekcjwatson: ok18:14
berto-anyone know where to get linux kernel support ?  the kernel not recognizing my tape drive is getting to me.18:30
slangasekstgraber: all ISOs should be posted now for testing, with the exception of xubuntu live which is waiting for livecd-rootfs propagation18:40
stgraberslangasek: cool, thanks18:41
_MMA_slangasek: I see nothing for Ubuntu Studio. Is it still in-process?18:44
slangasek_MMA_: http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/build/ubuntustudio/all ?18:47
slangasekhmm, download link seems broken.  stgraber?18:48
_MMA_Hmm... http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntustudio/releases/hardy18:48
slangasek_MMA_: the images are built, in any case, and available for download directly via http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntustudio/daily/18:49
slangasek_MMA_: releases/hardy is only updated when the alpha is released, not during the ISO vetting18:49
_MMA_Sure. Wasnt that today?18:49
stgraberslangasek: yes, it's broken for UbuntuStudio, known issue ...18:50
slangasek_MMA_: not unless you've seen a u-d-a mail and a topic update ;)18:50
_MMA_I have not.18:50
_MMA_stgraber: Can you link me to something showing its broken?18:50
slangasekit may still be today if the ISO testing goes well (and quickly), otherwise the alpha will be pushed tomorrow18:51
stgraberslangasek: I'm waiting on bug #148944 to have a working download info page18:51
ubotuLaunchpad bug 148944 in ubuntu-cdimage "File list on cdimage for the Ubuntu QA Tracker" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/14894418:51
Riddellsiretart: any plans for xine 1.1.10?18:52
geserhas an archive admin time to move aspectwerkz2 from universe to multiverse as it build-depends on sun-java6-jdk?18:52
_MMA_stgraber: Can you link me to something showing its broken?18:53
Mithrandirgeser: done18:54
stgraber_MMA_: http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/info/125918:54
slangasekstgraber: ah. :)  Ok, I have some plans in that area; ultimately, I want a manifest that declares the current set of testing candidates, that I can also use as input to the release publishing18:54
geserMithrandir: thanks.18:55
slangasekstgraber: so then not only would you not have to poll for images, we wouldn't have to update the list of test targets by hand through the website either :)18:55
stgraberslangasek: having a manifest file on cdimage.u.c would make possible to have a well working download info page + builds automatically added on the tracker18:55
_MMA_stgraber: That doesnt really tell me anything. :( cjwatson: Can you shed some light on the Ubuntu Studio disks being broken?18:55
stgraber_MMA_: what's broken is the info page pointing on your ISOs, because I haven't hardcoded the path to those (I was waiting on a full rewrite of that part of the tracker)18:56
slangasek_MMA_: that's not about the disks being broken.  we don't know if the disks are broken, y'all need to test them and tell us. >;)18:57
_MMA_stgraber: No, no. Im talking about why theres no: http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntustudio/releases/hardy/alpha-418:57
_MMA_Yeah18:57
cjwatson_MMA_: err - I wouldn't expect there to be a releases/hardy/alpha-4 for anything yet!18:58
slangasek_MMA_: um, I just said that alpha4 hasn't happened yet18:58
cjwatson_MMA_: as I read stgraber's comment, the thing which is broken is the ISO test tracker, not the disks18:59
stgraber_MMA_: read slangasek comment above18:59
_MMA_Damn. I misread the page. Man, I gotta stop looking at these screens. Gonna make my vision worse.18:59
cjwatsonslangasek: assigning 148944 to you, since you seem most on top of it18:59
slangasekcjwatson: cheers18:59
_MMA_slangasek: Yeah. I saw the testing page was miffed. I got that. I misread the releases webpage for Ubuntu. Figured if there was one there I shoulda.19:02
_MMA_Though I swear I saw it with so odd "Updating" message at the top of the page. :P19:03
_MMA_s/so/some19:03
slangasekhmm, ok :)19:04
Riddelltjaalton, bryce: I'm still being hit by bug 133192 testing alpha 4 candidates20:03
ubotuLaunchpad bug 133192 in xserver-xorg-video-ati "Blank screen or distorted image because of wrong default AGPMode value" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/13319220:03
Riddellreading your last comment thought there might not be a fix for everyone, nasty20:03
bryceRiddell: I'll put it on my todo list, but I'm completely swamped so may be a while before I can look into it20:04
tjaaltonRiddell: that's because upstream tried to be clever, but seems that they reverted the behaviour back to what it was20:14
tjaalton..two days ago20:14
tjaaltonunfortunately it went unnoticed, so alpha4 still has that bug20:15
paranwhy are the repositories for -dbgsym packages on ddebs.ubuntu.com not gpg-signed?20:18
seb128because nobody created the key, etc yet20:18
Riddelltjaalton: that sounds like there's hope on the horizon20:19
paranseb128: ok. what is wrong with the normal archive key? the debug packages would have to be built at the same time as the normal ones.20:19
slangasekparan: the normal archive key sits on a different server in a different security context20:20
tjaaltonRiddell: well, then those who benefited from the current version are going to be pissed :P20:24
tjaaltonbut they just need to play with bios settings20:24
Riddellhmm, "just"20:25
tjaaltonyes.. there's no way to do this work automatically for all users20:26
tjaalton*make it work20:26
brycetjaalton: should the bug be closed as won't fix then?20:32
tjaaltonbryce: no, that bug will get fixed, but others probably reopened :)20:36
tjaalton..which then could be marked as won't fix20:37
bryceok20:38
brycelet me know if there's anything I should look at with any of it... de-todo'ing it for now20:39
tjaaltonwe'll get the fix when a new release is out20:39
tjaaltonalthough I have no idea when that'll be20:40
paranslangasek: couldn't the "master version" of the dbgsym-packages repository be created on that same server and context, then synced to ddebs.ubuntu.com?20:45
slangasekparan: many things "could" be; I don't think that's the right way to do it though, and I don't think that's the solution the archive admins are going to work on20:46
Mithrandirparan: no, since the master mirror doesn't have the space for it.20:46
slangasek(having it signed on the master archive server is the wrong answer because the master archive has no other reason to see the ddebs at all)20:47
paranslangasek: well, I find it quite strange that the dbgsym packages are not in the normal archive to begin with... but I guess that is because of disk space issues on mirrors? :)20:49
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seb128paran: package index pollution, not interesting for most users, the mirror usage, etc20:52
paranseb128: you could put them in components like main-dbgsym for main which solves the first two points20:55
seb128that's not much different than having a different source20:56
luisbghey ompaul20:58
ompaulluisbg, hi there20:59
luisbg:)20:59
paranseb128: maybe not, but it would at least be easier to find. had to search a while to find ddebs.ubuntu.com20:59
slangasekstgraber: how does one map reporter names on iso.qa.ubuntu.com to launchpad IDs (or something else that would let me request more info)?  http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/result/1258/54 is reporting a bug that is marked fix released, and I want to confirm that the tester was using the current image21:15
berto-are there any ubuntu kernel channels on IRC?21:20
kylemyes. #ubuntu-kernel.21:20
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stgraberslangasek: this user hasn't filed his profile and we don't have the LP integration (yet)21:33
stgraberslangasek: let me see if I can get you an email21:33
slangasekok, thanks21:34
stgraberslangasek: https://edge.launchpad.net/~svenboden21:34
stgraber(same e-mail addi)21:35
slangasekaha21:35
slangaseksorry, same email as what?21:35
stgraberLP account and tracker account21:35
slangasekI don't see any email addresses listed for him under LP?21:36
stgraberno, but you the search function seems to work if you enter the e-mail addi21:36
slangasekuhm, I don't understand. what e-mail address am I to enter where?21:38
stgraberslangasek: I entered the e-mail address I found in his profile on the tracker in the search field. Do you have access to the admin part of the QA Tracker ? (You should have an Admin link next to the Welcome ... in the top-right corner)21:42
slangasekstgraber: oh, no, I don't have any admin link there21:43
musther_Hello,  I'm hoping to discuss the fsck problem (periodic boot checks), and possibly find a dev willing to help me implement a solution.21:47
stgraberslangasek: you should now have the right to access user profiles21:48
slangasekstgraber: I still don't see any 'admin' links; could you /msg me the email address in question, for the immediate issue?21:51
stgraberslangasek: sent21:53
slangasekstgraber: received, thanks21:55
stgraberslangasek: Access rights to user profiles seem to be a difficult thing to set on Drupal, it'll be better once we'll have our own implementation of user profiles (ideally linked to LP and containing some usefull information for the RM/admins)21:57
* slangasek nods21:57
TheMusostgraber: Have you looked at all the various user access modules that are available?22:01
bdmurrayAnybody running an alpha 4 Live CD at the moment?22:10
siretartRiddell: sure. c.f. bug #18194922:10
ubotuLaunchpad bug 181949 in xine-lib "Please sync xine-lib (main) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/18194922:10
slangasekbdmurray: I have one to hand that I can test with?22:11
* TheMuso is burning images now for testing.22:12
bdmurrayI was trying to "unlock" the gnome network settings and the application just quit on me22:12
bdmurrayI haven't seen anything like this before - it ends with "Trace/breakpoint trap" and I'm uncertain how to track it down22:17
FrankQbdmurray, a lot of people are reporting bugs like that today22:18
FrankQhttps://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-discuss/2008-January/003193.html22:18
slangasekbdmurray: oh, that sounds like the gnome-session G_DEBUG bug, then22:21
slangasekbdmurray: can you upgrade gnome-session in the liveCD, log out and log back in, and see if it goes away?22:21
seb128or just unset G_DEBUG on a command line and run the software22:22
bdmurrayslangasek: okay, upgrading the package fixed it22:25
FrankQI'm not on LiveCD but I'm on the latest versions and it's still there22:26
bdmurrayFrankQ: and which version of gnome-session do you have installed?22:27
slangasekFrankQ: have you logged out and logged in since upgrading gnome-session?22:27
slangasekgnome-session sets the environment variable for your *whole* session, so upgrading the package is not enough to clear it22:27
bdmurrayslangasek: is there a master bug for that issue?22:28
slangasekbdmurray: none that I'm aware of, seb128 handled the bug + upload via IRC22:29
seb128bdmurray: that's technically not a bug ;-)22:30
bdmurrayseb128: How is that?22:31
seb128the G_DEBUG things make the software crash on warning to get those reported as bug22:31
slangasekehm, I would certainly say that causing the desktop environment to suddenly treat all warnings as fatal errors is a bug22:31
seb128so technically all the crash are applications bug, they just don't usually lead to a crash22:31
slangasekhence, "warning"22:32
seb128anyway no there is no bug about that, it has been handled by IRC22:32
seb128and closing those crashers are duplicates would be wrong22:32
seb128they are bug on the concerned applications22:32
slangasekif gcc suddenly enabled -Wall -Werror by default, I would call that a toolchain bug. :)22:33
cjwatsonsomebody might need to add comments on those bugs to indicate that even though the applications no longer crash the bug is that they emit a critical warning22:33
cjwatsons/the bug/the real bug/22:33
cjwatsonotherwise somebody will probably come along and close them sooner or later ...22:34
seb128cjwatson: I did comment on some this afternoon22:34
cjwatsongood stuff22:34
FrankQsorry, back. 2.21.90-0ubuntu122:34
seb128FrankQ: that's not the new version22:34
FrankQhmm, weird.22:35
bdmurrayslangasek: will edubuntu be rebuilt?22:36
FrankQYeah, getting a new one now. Wasn't when I asked. apologies22:36
slangasekbdmurray: for this issue, you mean? I wasn't planning to, I intended to release note it22:36
bdmurrayWouldn't apport automatically submit them though?22:37
seb128automatically submit what?22:38
seb128the crashers due to G_DEBUG?22:38
slangasekI didn't think apport ever submitted anything automatically?  Also, these processes are dying with the wrong signal so apport doesn't trap them22:38
seb128slangasek: I think it does22:39
bdmurrayOkay, perhaps I'm not understanding the issue22:39
seb128the issue is that gnome-session set G_DEBUG which makes applications crash when they usually display a critical warning22:40
bdmurrayThere seem to be a lot of apport reported bugs with crashed with signal 5 though22:40
seb128how much is a lot?22:40
slangasekseb128: apport handles SIGSEGV, SIGFPE, SIGABRT, SIGPIPE, SIGBUS, SIGILL; according to the email just cited, G_DEBUG is triggering a SIGTRAP22:41
slangasekhrm, no; that's apport's own signal handler, ignore me22:41
seb128slangasek: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/synaptic/+bug/18787522:41
seb128one example22:42
bdmurrayseb128: 79 by querying on return_if_fail_warning22:43
FrankQApport definitely didn't fire up with these crashes, for me.22:43
seb128looking at launchpad there has been one every hour or so today22:43
seb128and I expect most people run hardy and not CDs and will get the update gnome-session22:44
slangasekok, I can see that having everyone filing automatic crash reports between now and alpha5 would be a bad thing...22:44
seb128bdmurray: you count duplicates?22:44
seb128I really think that's not an issue22:44
bdmurrayseb128: maybe my launchpad query isn't the best22:44
seb128there is not so many people using alpha for something else than testing22:44
seb128and installation will be updated22:44
seb128installations22:45
bdmurraybut if somebody has a statically configured network what will happen?22:45
seb128what do you mean?22:45
seb128you mean if somebody uses the alpha CD to do an install?22:46
bdmurrayRight22:46
seb128and needs to configure the network then?22:46
bdmurrayyep22:46
seb128well, I don't think many people rely on alpha CDs22:46
seb128and you can unset G_DEBUG and run the software22:46
seb128which will be in the notes22:46
seb128and an easy enough workaround22:47
seb128I think that's really a corner case and users running alpha CD should be able to understand how to unset an environment variable22:47
cjwatsonmy worry is just that we'll get less good feedback, really22:47
slangasekbdmurray: do you have a feeling for how effective the release notes are at preventing duplicate bug reports, particularly where apport is involved?22:47
bdmurrayI see your point but personally I would rather err on the side of less bug reports22:47
cjwatsondepends on the amount of work involved in respinning really22:47
seb128cjwatson: feedback from who?22:48
seb128bdmurray: I really doubt we will get that many bugs which will not be autoduped22:48
seb128there is not so many critical warnings around22:49
slangasekthere's at least enough to take out evolution, pidgin, and gnome network settings22:50
FrankQ and gnome-settings-daemon, I think22:51
slangasekanyway, we're already pushed back to Friday for the alpha release at this point, so I'd also rather err on the side of caution22:51
bdmurrayslangasek: I'm of the opinion that the release notes are not widely read but don't recall the specifc bug that makes me think this22:51
bdmurrayslangasek: actually it's bug 145382 from gutsy development22:53
ubotuLaunchpad bug 145382 in busybox "[Gutsy] broken 70-persistent-net.rules" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/14538222:53
slangasekah, that bug looks familiar :)22:53
bdmurrayI seem to recall it getting a lot of dups even after the bug was mentioned in the release notes22:54
stgraberindeed :)22:54
TheMusoDo the release notes get announced anywhere besides -devel-announce?22:54
slangaseknot by me; where else should they be released?22:54
slangasek(are the alphas announced somewhere else?)22:54
TheMusoI don't know. bdmurray's point about people not reading them could have something to do with that though.22:55
mathiaz /bye bbl22:55
TheMusoI believe they are announced on the fridge, but can't remember whether the release notes are linked to or not.22:55
bdmurrayMaybe if we reorganize http://www.ubuntu.com/testing/hardy/alpha322:55
bdmurrayso Caveats comes before download22:55
FrankQif you look at the forums/#hardy+1 not much people read anything at all, even alpha testers22:55
bdmurrayIt is probably wishful thinking but isn't much work22:56
cjwatsonseb128: the purpose of the alpha releases is to get feedback from testers on how we're doing22:57
cjwatsonseb128: if the testers all just say "well, lots of GNOME applications crash" and give up at that point, that could be a net loss22:57
* Gnine nods22:58
seb128cjwatson: right, without the crashs would be nicer23:01

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